November 2018 - Recruiting Thread

Discuss and share any Virginia Tech related recruiting topics from October 2018 [0] that don't warrant their own thread [1]. Please do some digging to share original content (e.g. embed the original tweet, not a link to another post/website with said tweet), add context / relevant information and respect the Community Guidelines.

[0] If someone would like to make this thread from month-to-month, let Joe know, he is apt to forget and pressed for time. Or simply copy the boilerplate and start a new thread.
[1] New offers, commitments, decommitments, etc... deserve their own thread. Please read the brief best-practice tips at the top of the recruiting forum
[2] Does anyone really ever read this?
[3] I don't want to catch anybody not drinking this semester.
[4] No Shaving!!

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Don't you love when fans take recruiting into their own hands

That was on October 6th. Lots has happened since then.

Pain is Temporary, Chicks Dig Scars
Glory is Forever, Let's Go Hokies!!

what was

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

My bad, your right, that was today, I was looking at another tweet. Nevermind...

Pain is Temporary, Chicks Dig Scars
Glory is Forever, Let's Go Hokies!!

In fairness to Virginia Tech Bills, being a PWO at VT is better than being on Scholarship at that Dumpster fire of a school in Maryland

So Virginia Tech Bills is in charge of handing out offers now?

Man, I hope not...

Pain is Temporary, Chicks Dig Scars
Glory is Forever, Let's Go Hokies!!

Pain is Temporary, Chicks Dig Scars
Glory is Forever, Let's Go Hokies!!

I mean, Tayvion did retweet this last night.

Outspoken team cake advocate. Hates terrapins. Resident Macho Man Gif Poster. Distant cousin to Dork Magic. Frequently misspells words.

I believe he would need a scholarship offer to accept first. Last I knew he doesn't have an offer from VT.

Come to Blacksburg and see what the Hokie Pokie is really all about

@espntankkk

maybe im just hypersensitive after all of our off field drama, or maybe "kkk" is better just avoided in your twitter handle.

he is a Murland commit

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

C'mon November, bring us some good news!!!

With (early) national signing day just around the corner, are we expecting pretty much everyone to sign early like last year?

Do we know who's planning to enroll in Jan.?

J.R. Walker is a early enrollee

That's wonderful news.

As we know, Fu is very much into loyalty and commitment. If someone doesn't plan on signing during the early period then the staff takes that as not being committed and they are not too fond of it. Artis played with the idea of dragging it out to NSD last year and Fu and the guys shut that idea down pretty quick.

We have offered a scholarship to JUCO DT and Minnesota commit Keonte Schad.

Keep them coming. We need 2-3 JUCO/Grad Transfers this offseason.

I'm sure there will be some attrition, too. Maybe we can get some more.

I like how our last offer to a DL Minnesota commit worked out

Warning: this post occasionally contains strong language (which may be unsuitable for children), unusual humor (which may be unsuitable for adults), and advanced mathematics (which may be unsuitable for liberal-arts majors)..

Wasn't that Kyshoen Jarrett?

'Its easy to grin, when your ship comes in, and you've got the stock market beat,
but the man worthwhile, is the man who can smile, when his shorts are too tight in the seat'

Kyshoen Jarrett was a DL commit?

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

He was so twitchy and undersized we turned him into a rover.

Was thinking Jarrett was the only Minnesota commit we've snagged. Not a DL of course

'Its easy to grin, when your ship comes in, and you've got the stock market beat,
but the man worthwhile, is the man who can smile, when his shorts are too tight in the seat'

Ah yes, you are correct... Thanks

'Its easy to grin, when your ship comes in, and you've got the stock market beat,
but the man worthwhile, is the man who can smile, when his shorts are too tight in the seat'

Jarrett was from Pennsylvania

WVU has a relatively high amount of JUCOs and transfers in their two deep on the defensive line, and their run defense improved vastly from last season. I'm glad we are going that route as well.

Marshall University student.
Virginia Tech fanatic.

We don't have a choice. Walker and Mihota are gone. We don't have too many options at DT. Hewitt, Porcher, and Burke will be the only guys (outside of incoming class) at DT? Those guys are likely backups. We need some big time DL transfers.

I mean, Hewitt has been a starter all year, and Porcher has been a nice surprise IMO - he put on some weight (& looks like he could put on more) and has played pretty well when you consider the move and the youth. Not saying they're killing it by any stretch, but you can only cook with what's in the fridge, right?

Unless Figueroa and/or Schad come in and blow doors, Hewitt and Porcher project as starters at DT in 2019

You're the only ones that I can talk to about this, you guys.

JUCO's and grad transfers are going to pick schools where they think there is room for them to play immediately. They will certainly have to beat out Porcher and Hewitt on the practice field, but when you are going all out for JUCO/Grad transfer players that signals that the coaching staff thinks there will be potential PT available in the near future at those positions. We recruited Webb to compete for a starting corner spot, we recruited Brewer to compete for the starting QB spot, etc.

Well, yeah. This all kind of goes without saying.

I'm just making sure we're all agreed that those are our best options as of now. And that we shouldn't assume we're gonna get either of these guys. Heck, lots of folks thought Deng was a drop in the bucket a month ago and now we're in a top-5 with LSU, aTm etc.

You're the only ones that I can talk to about this, you guys.

Speaking of, I know we like the predictions on Deng (100% VT cb's rn), but anyone got #sauce on whether we'd take both DT's?

Let me rephrase: can we take both DT's numbers-wise?

Because frankly if we only have room for 2 I'd rather use both spots on tackles. I like Deng a lot - incredible athletic potential. But we're in way better shape at DE than DT (which is sad)...

You're the only ones that I can talk to about this, you guys.

Lots of talk about Deng being a backer, so yes, they would take Deng and more DTs.

@CraigThompsonVT

Of course, but what I was saying is that these recruiting choices are signaling dissatisfaction with either depth, starting talent, or both at the DT position. JUCO's and grad transfers are going to be pitched on playing time and competing for starting positions. I agree that until the ink hits the paper on the LOI that Hewitt and Porcher are our projected starters, but I also believe that this recruiting emphasis suggests that we aren't excited about that being the case.

There can't be too much excitement about them starting. Nothing against the kids, but we need more talent at the position. I see Hewitt and Porcher as good depth players. They will continue to develop and may become starters, but we can't wait for that to happen.

Also, who are the backups at DT if they are the starters? The freshmen coming in?

True true... but don't forget that with good coaching and development (hello Mr. Foster, hello Mr. Wiles) players get better year to year. So while none of us are comfortable with Porcher starting / playing tons of reps this season, he very well could explode next year..He could also very well progress only incrementally.

I agree we need to get some JUCO/Grad transfers though... regardless of how Hewitt and Porcher turn out next year we need more than a pair of starters able to contribute quality snaps at DT. JUCO transfers or graduate transfers are about the only option for instant contributors on the DL.. that is a man's position that requires a couple of years of physical growth, even for most 5-star freshmen.

We all know that you recruit positions of need.
And that we have no depth at DT.
And the prospective '19 starters aren't optimal.
And how you sell Jucos on playing time.

I know why we want them.
We just better damn well close on them.

You're the only ones that I can talk to about this, you guys.

was i supposed to read this to the tune of a song?

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

The answer is yes. I read it to the tune of "if you're happy and you know it" since we've been so gloomy as of late.

Part of me thinks that Porcher eventually passes Hewitt as the top dog next year and starts along with whoever we (hopefully) pull from the JUCO/GT ranks. His playmaking potential far surpasses Hewitt's and he already has more tackles and TFL than Hewitt does despite playing far fewer snaps. There was a series against W&M that was highlighted by TSL where Porcher's potential as a puss rusher was really evident.

Hewitt is a solid player but seems to be far less effective as a penetrator when playing starter's snaps. He seemed far quicker off the snap against FSU and W&M and has seemed to disappear as the season has gone on.

Hopefully Porcher can continue to develop over the next 12 months or so and gets closer to his potential. I think a polished Porcher and Figueroa with Hewitt sparing them would be a capable trio.

Why isn't Porcher starting over Hewitt? Is Porcher younger and needs time to develop?

He's really only been playing DT since the summer. Needed to add a little bit of weight and get used to playing inside but he's getting there. He definitely has more playmaking ability but doesn't seem to be as sound in his gap assignments yet.

Hewitts TFL's (or lack thereof) are while playing next to a guy (Walker) who is double teamed all the time . Hope he can improve this offseason because we need him. I wonder if he's just worn down due to the lack of depth.

'Its easy to grin, when your ship comes in, and you've got the stock market beat,
but the man worthwhile, is the man who can smile, when his shorts are too tight in the seat'

I think that's exactly it. He's finally figured out his correct playing weight but it seems like now that he has lower mass he gets work down easier. Probably would be more effective playing 15-20 snaps.

Any thoughts on our chances of landing Figueroa? He has to see immediate playing time as a big plus.

"Give me a fu¢king beer", Anonymous Genius

Hard to say without him visiting but from what I've heard and seen in interviews, he's very interested in VT. Doesn't seem to mind going far away from home and has only set officials to VT and UCLA so far.

Porcher's potential as a puss rusher was really evident.

Say what again? Sounds like Porcher is following in the footsteps Seth Dooley.

Joffrey, Cersei, Ilyn Payne, the Hound, Jeff Jagodzinski, Paul Johnson, Pat Narduzzi.

? Not even remotely the same. They don't play the same position. Porcher actually had some good D1 schoolers after him. Dooley was an athlete that didn't know how to play football, Porcher has literally been around the game his entire life. Not to mention that Porcher is 7 games into his career, so I'm not really sure how you could already say that his career is going to turn out the same way as Dooley.

WHOOOOSH

Pour some Beer on it

:(

in my younger days I considered myself a pretty good puss rusher who would get great penetration as well.

gross

Outside it's night time, but inside it's LeDay

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

I walked out of my front door on my way to work this morning wearing a VT polo, and ran into my neighbor. Got to talking and found out that Brandon Dorlus is his nephew, and that their entire family is super excited for him to play at Tech. Sounds like it was almost an immediate commitment when he was offered, but wanted to sit on it and make sure, but they're all excited for him to get to learn under Bud. He's also apparently been working on putting on some weight and is hoping to get some play time next season as a True Freshman - I just revisited his offer list, and he now has 28 total offers, including Clemson, Florida, Auburn, NCST, Oregon, Pitt, Tenn, Utah, UVA, Kentucky, and Louisville. Hopefully he pans out well! God knows we will need some DLine help next year.

[2] Does anyone really ever read this?
[3] I don't want to catch anybody not drinking this semester.
[4] No Shaving!!

Only read this on about the 10th time I visited this thread. Happy Movember!

I added [3], and was planning on adding something random each month, HokieBen2010 just beat me to it this month. I'm just hoping to make the January thread, so I can add "[6] There is NNOOOO....rule #6."

https://youtu.be/bNBy1D1Y0h4

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

Anyone have a list of recruits coming up for the BC game?

Current Notable Recruit Rankings (247/Rivals/ESPN)

Unanimous 4*
OG Brian Hudson #12 OG (ESPN), #11 OG (247), #25 OL (Rivals)

Consensus 4*
ATH Jaden Payoute (247/ESPN) #19 ATH (ESPN), #13 ATH (247)
S/ATH JR Walker (247/ESPN) #27 S (ESPN), #17 ATH (247), #33 ATH (Rivals)

Other 4*
WR Jacoby Pinckney (ESPN) #38 WR (ESPN), #55 WR (247), #56 WR (Rivals)
RB Keshawn King (ESPN) #20 RB (ESPN), #29 RB (247), #48 RB (Rivals)
CB Nyquee Hawkins (ESPN) #32 CB (ESPN), #31 S (247), #36 CB (Rivals)
ATH Tayvion Robinson (Rivals) #60 ATH (ESPN), #23 ATH (247), #17 ATH (Rivals)

Never Forget #1 Overall Seed UVA 54, #64 UMBC 74

What's the story on Sampah? I see we have a cb for him.

Dear lord, now that's the kind of recruits we need!

I don't have inside sources but Antoine Sampah's 247 page looks like the page of someone who hasn't tipped his hat and nobody really knows who he is favoring yet. We might have a real shot, but I don't know if that CB is worth getting our hopes up.

Update: That lone crystal ball to us has turned into 2 CB's for Clemson. So yeah, pretty much exactly what I said earlier. Worst case scenario with it being Clemson as well...

Don't get your hopes up, he's not going to come here. We have a better shot at Grimes but still a long shot

Recruit Prosim

Whoever downvoted you over this needs to go for a walk outside.

VB born, class of '14

I don't make the news I just report it

Bleeding burnt orange and chicago maroon

Anyone know who the Trinity Christian kid(s) from Jacksonville was there at the game?

Wet stuff on the red stuff.

Join us in the Key Players Club

Miles Brooks was there.

He could be a stud early for us it sounds like. Hopefully Isaiah and Chamarri are in his ear.

Drew Gunther just tweeted a commitment, no offer per 247, so assume a PWO

TKPhi Damn Proud
BSME 2009

those offers tho

I'm guessing Brown and Georgetown don't offer full scholarships for football. Seems like a smart kid

I wonder if Johnny Moxon ever got any playing time at Brown?

"with all due respect, and remember I’m sayin’ it with all due respect, that idea ain’t worth a velvet painting of a whale and a dolphin gettin’ it on" - Ricky Bobby

It was cool that he got that full ride, but he really lost focus on the game on Fri night.

That's awesome he included the slam about the "unfortunate state of the program", is there any way I can give him a leg for that tweet?

Yes, deposit legs here, they'll be held in escrow and transferred to him upon the opening of his TKP account.

Nobody will say it so I'll say it: That is some 5* bullshit!

Come to Blacksburg and see what the Hokie Pokie is really all about

It's a shame these days that kids have to put in their comment to "Respect my decision". Why arent their decisions being "respected"?

because you have internet tough guys that have to rip into a kid for going against their school.

In this case, I 1110% respect his decision!

Because all the other recruits put that in their commitment tweet and high schoolers aren't that creative or unique

Recruit Prosim

Because so many change their minds if they get just the right tweet from a fan. /s

Wet stuff on the red stuff.

Join us in the Key Players Club

Thanks goodness!!! However, makes me feel old since I once lived in NUF...later known as Cochrane Hall. NUF was the New Undergraduate Facility built in the 80's and served as the student-athlete dorm back then. What was New then...sure is old now.

JP

Figueroa with two Cbs to UCLA

You put those words together, those are my favorite words, Popeyes and bahama
- Mike Burnup

There was an article on the front page of FB Rec on 247 today about him planning officials. I don't have any inside info, and I will remain confident in us having a chance until I hear otherwise, but I imagine its not the easiest sell to a Cali West Coast kid to come to rural SWVA.

They're probably the safer bet but means nothing until official visits in January. Right now he only has visits set to UCLA and VT and at most has one more open weekend prior to the early signing period, so it's very possible that those are the only two visits he takes.

I think if his decision were solely based on football then VT would be the choice, but obviously that isn't the reality. He is very intrigued by playing for Bud and Wiles.

I would watch out for Oregon as well if they come sniffing around.

Has anyone heard anything on Antoine Whitner???
3 star DT that has us warm on 247

originally from Richmond

You put those words together, those are my favorite words, Popeyes and bahama
- Mike Burnup

We were on him early but then seemed to really cool.

Because we are so loaded at DT? /s

'Its easy to grin, when your ship comes in, and you've got the stock market beat,
but the man worthwhile, is the man who can smile, when his shorts are too tight in the seat'

solid offer list

Bleeding burnt orange and chicago maroon

A Hokies offer would be life changing or JUCO DT Williams

Free article, looks like Jomaious Williams would pounce on a Hokies offer as soon as we gave him one. Probably the safety valve option after Figueroa. Also of note, this article claims he will have three seasons of eligibility at Tech, but I'm not sure if that's a typo or not.

Three seasons to play two.

I read the sentence too fast, oops.

Plays low and quick with great motor at around 6-2 300... why no offer?

'Its easy to grin, when your ship comes in, and you've got the stock market beat,
but the man worthwhile, is the man who can smile, when his shorts are too tight in the seat'

My only guess is that we are holding out to see what happens with Figueroa and Dorlus. We have limited spots so we probably want to know if Figueroa is a lost cause, and/or if Dorlus will flip to UF.

Thought I read something on here saying Dorlus was pretty solid commit for us even with a lot of new P5 offers. Have things changed?

No clue, I saw somewhere on TKP that his family was stoked for him to play for VT, so as far as I know he is solid, but with a recent UF offer and going on a visit there last weekend, I'm sure they are keeping their eyes on the situation with UF being a more prestigious program and closer to home.

Very unimpressed. Would be more of the same of what we have.

What we have? Sorry given the lack of even warm bodies after this year except undersized true freshman....

'Its easy to grin, when your ship comes in, and you've got the stock market beat,
but the man worthwhile, is the man who can smile, when his shorts are too tight in the seat'

Taking warm bodies does us no good. That's part of the reason why we have such roster imbalance as it is. If someone isn't going to help the team then save the scholarship for the next year.

I think people forget that we have 8 scholarship DT's this year (Walker, Mihota, Hewitt, Porcher, Burke, Fullwood, Taylor, Dean). Like LA said, they problem isn't numbers but guys who are talented enough to help win games. Hewitt and Porcher are close and Vinny really isn't a DT and is playing hurt.

I think Dean is a walk-on.

Next year, we need to have something like:
DE:{Deng}, Debose, Proctor
DT: {JUCO/Grad}, Hewitt, Dorlus/Pollard
DT: {Grad/JUCO}, Porcher, Kendricks
DE: Garbutt, Belmar , Adams

If we don't get Deng, I would strongly consider moving Dalton Keane to DE. He was a DE/TE coming in and we have more HBacks than we need. Keane is a physical player and can help the team more on defense.

Adding filler at DT is okay, but like you guys are saying, not really that helpful. We could Burke, Fullwood or Taylor play in those spots that allow Kendricks/Dorlus/Pollard to redshirt. What we need is a JUCO/Grad level guys who can start so Hewitt and Porcher can learn on the job.

If we don't get Deng, I would strongly consider moving Dalton Keane to DE. He was a DE/TE coming in and we have more HBacks than we need. Keane is a physical player and can help the team more on defense.

You mean, take one of the most promising spots of our offense and move him to one of the more promising spots on our defense? Our DEs are fine. It's tackle that we're really struggling with.

Always choose joy.

Well, then move Keene to DT. /s

Yeah. Time to consider all options.

I like Keane a lot and said when he was recruited I only wished we had two of him. I think we would be a better team with Cunningham, Mitchell, DeIulius manning the HB spot and Keane at DE with Garbutt and Debose.

Maybe Keane can't play DE. I'm not at practice, don't know that. But assuming he could since he was kinda recruited at both positions, I stand by my take that we would be a better team with him at DE.

I don't agree that DE isn't a problem. Gaines is effectively done for next year, we saw Mihota's path and should assume something similar with Gaines. If he comes back, great, but for planning purposes, he's not a factor in 2019. I like Garbutt a lot and am pleased to see him getting so much time now. He's got All-ACC potential. DeBose, I believe, has been hurt but he's shown at the top of the depth chart this week. Excited to see him play more. Proctor is a project and still looks it. Belmar is solid yet unspectacular, I would like to see him working with Garbutt to make him better. So I think we need one more DE. We are getting no pressure and that's killing our DB's. We can't blitz much and expose even more of our weaknesses. And our DE's are getting eaten up on pulls. These guys are young and will improve, but we need to at least be prepared that maybe they won't.

Proctor is a project and still looks it

I believe in HS he was an OLB so there is a transition, but I don't think "project" is the right thing to call a 4-star/UA All-American .

Proctor is a project at DE.

It's looking like Deng will be a backer for us, FWIW.

This may be a stupid question but I always get confused. When you say 'backer' do you mean any of the Mike/OLB/Whip positions, or just the OLB position?

Is whip even considered a backer, or are they still considered a DB (i.e. is Ladler a linebacker or a free safety?).

I always get so confused on who is considered what position in Bud's defense. I could be wrong, but it seems like linebacker is one of the positions we are set with quality depth, so unless Deng is a phenomenal LB talent (I haven't really watched or read much on him) he could be used better at DE?

Backer is our other inside LB (on video games it's usually labled as an OLB because 4-3), who plays to boundary side. It's sort of a combo of both ILB and OLB.

Notable Backer examples: Xavier Adibi, Tremaine Edmunds.

Gotcha, so he'd essentially be taking Dax's spot (assuming he can beat him out for the starting role)?

Possibly, depends on what we do with Dax long-term. Dax was originally believed to be a Mike, but his path to the field this season has been through the Backer position. As of right now, he would be competing with Dax and Dylan Rivers if the rumors of him projecting as a Backer are true.

Cool, thanks for clearing that up! I know the names and where they are on the field, but never know what their official positions are outside of the DLine and CBs.

I would be okay with Dax at Mike and Deng at Backer. But I don't mind Kearney/Ashby, both are solid.

Kearney is transferring

Hokies Defense:
Left Cornerback
Right Cornerback
Free Safety
Rover (Strong Safety)
Whip (Nickel / Field OLB)
Mike (Middle Linebacker)
Backer (Inside Linebacker/Boundary OLB)
Stud* (7-tech DE)
Nose* (1-tech DT)
Tackle* (3-tech DT)
End* (5-tech DE)

*not sure but I think we did away with the specifics regarding DT's and DE's recently, similar to how we got rid of Boundary CB and Field CB designations. Both DT's are expected to be able to play 1 or 3 depending on the call, both corners are expected to be able to play field techniques and boundary techniques. etc etc.

This flexibility helps against uptempo teams because our D doesn't have to re-align as often, but it hurts us because we can't dial players into the roles most suited to their abilities. For example Farley would be playing Field Corner due to his lack of physicality (but also because of his elite speed and ability to play the ball)

It's crazy that (under the current roster cumstances) we can attract a blue chip JUCO backer but have so much trouble finding a serviceable JUCO DT.

Using /s is for cowards.

My bad, when we were recruiting Dean it was for scholarship but then he didn't have a spot.

Deng is most likely going to play Backer for us. Gaines will be back but limited to start the season. Hewitt and Porcher will most like start (Hewitt will be a R-Jr. and started this year so doesn't need more time to learn, Porcher maybe a little but played alot fo meaningful snaps this year). We may find one Grad/JUCO good enough to start but definitely not two. I see either Fullwood or Taylor transferring, with a a rotation of Hewitt, Porcher, Grad/Juco and the best freshman. Maybe 2 Grad/JUCO can play right away but I expect Hewitt and Porcher to surprise people next year.

IMO, Hewitt's skills are best as a backup. He's not bad, but he's better in short bursts.

Porcher, IMO, will be a really good player but I would like to give him another year to learn on the job. But if he had to start, we would be okay.

Agreed. Have been saying that about Hewitt all year. He's twice as effective when he's rested and is able to use his explosiveness. Him trimming down was a double edged sword. He's much more explosive now but he has to expend too much energy holding his ground on gap assignments. Would be much more effective as a rotational piece.

Porcher will be a good player and I am pretty high on him. He needs to contribute to add mass and get used to the physicality of the interior, he has the ability to penetrate like none of the other DT's slated to be on the roster next year.

We can always tell Dax to "let himself go" and put on some extra pounds. He's only about 20 lbs away from being a D-tackle at this point and he's just a freshman that will inevitably get bigger and stronger. This might end up being his progression anyway, so maybe with our lack of depth at D-Tackle this is something to consider. His dad did play D-tackle for Wake Forest, so it is in his genes. If we land Deng then this should really be considered as that would give us more LB depth to replace Dax there. Just food for thought.

yeah I don't like this at all. I think Dax has all the physical makings to be an absolute monster at LB. I only wish he was a few inches taller.

Come to Blacksburg and see what the Hokie Pokie is really all about

Dax will never be anything but a LB.

Wouldn't be so sure

I would. People don't understand what Dax and Bud mean to each other. Bud wouldn't put Dax at a position that he didn't think would benefit his future the most.

I understand fully of that relationship, and agree with you 100% on him putting Dax at the position that would most benefit him. I don't agree long term that position is backer. I know he's a highly rated recruit and people hope/wish that be the case, but just use your own eyes. He's a pretty stout guy already 240-250lbs at 6'1. He's a freshman and will naturally get bigger, and going through hilgartification will get bigger still. How many linebackers here or anywhere that you have seen are 250-260-270lbs? Not many, and of those they are likely taller than 6'1". How many linebackers in the nfl do you even see at his current size (before he gets bigger)? I just scrolled through a dozen nfl rosters and found one comparison 6'0 240.....every other linebacker 6'2" or shorter was 215-235 lbs which is required in a pass happy league.

It's possible he is already struggling to maintain the weight he is playing at now. I doubt becoming a man and going through hilgart is gonna make that any easier. I've also seen many times on this thread alone and through other threads that Wiles likes twitchy 260-280 lbs dts......Dax is one offseason from being in that weight range if he wanted to be, and he'd be the most explosive DT we would have on the current roster even with the added weight.

There is literally a 0% chance that dax is going to play defensive tackle.

I'm using info that I've been told, not just using my eyes. They're also trying to get Dax to get leaner not gain weight. If you look at a picture of him now compared to FSU, you can tell he's lost some baby fat. If Dax ever gets moved to DL I will get a TKP tattoo on my ass.

I will get a TKP tattoo on my ass.

so many pictures/gifs I want to post in response to this, but not a damned one is SFW

Warning: this post occasionally contains strong language (which may be unsuitable for children), unusual humor (which may be unsuitable for adults), and advanced mathematics (which may be unsuitable for liberal-arts majors)..

Very few people will see that. You need a tat of Joe on the side of your neck. That would be special

Dax is losing weight and DeBose is gaining. Hmmmmm.......

Myron Warren (6'4 230) - Many, LA 2019 "3 * DE" was just offered. Raw but very explosive and twitchy like Wiles likes them. TCU decommit. Looks to have the frame that could move inside after some Hilgartification. Everyone in favor say leg!
Highlights

He likes to tackle, too.

"The world ain't all sunshine and rainbows. It's a very mean and nasty place and I don't care how tough you are it will beat you to your knees and keep you there permanently if you let it. " Rocky B.

This would be nice, tackling -what an asset for a defensive player. We need some dogs on defense, we are too small and look like boys against men. We need some heavy hitters, and people who want to tackle, not have to tackle.

I know he's only 240 now but I wonder if the SDE designation means he projects as a DT in the long run.

Using /s is for cowards.

This is most often the case with Hokie DL. Wiles likes the undersized, twitchy, penetrating DTs that usually play between 265-280. He certainly could fill out into that size. I love the violence with which he finishes tackles.

Players that 247 categorizes as SDE frequently wind up playing DT for us. Not always, but it's a solid bet

Piggybacking off your comment:

They are DT's or 3-4 Ends for most programs as well. There are certainly some base 4-3's that use DE's that large, but it's increasingly less common. Some B1G teams and Clemson tend to use DE's that big recently, but sometimes it's just a random occurrence where they are truly freakishly fast at that size.

A lot of base 4-3's use WDE's as ends. In contrast, a WDE is usually a pass rushing OLB in a base 3-4, such as Alabama.

The original idea of those designations was based on a base 4-3 usually having a 5 Tech SDE and a 7 or sometimes 9 tech (wide 9) as their pass rush specialist on the weak side. As Orion noted elsewhere in another comment. With the increase of spread offenses it became more and more common to have smaller, faster DE's so those designations aren't always as set in stone anymore.

For example, Miss State has a great DL. They play former 5* SDE recruit Jeffrey Simmons at DT and their ends are like 6'4 - 6'6 types who play between 230-250 lbs like Montez Sweat.

Tahj Gary suffered a broken Femur last night. Those can take years to fully recover from.

You have GOT to be fucking kidding me.

If I hadn't written anything I would have gotten mine submitted first

When it rains in pours. Rico Kearney is transferring, maybe we can get to a 25 man class after all

So uh how many LB's have we offered? Because the depth chart is only 3 scholarship guys now.

Counted wrong, my bad.

Wet stuff on the red stuff.

Join us in the Key Players Club

What? Maybe for the remainder of the year but recruits can't help us there anyway.

Next year we will have Dax, Ashby, Rivers, Artis, and Tisdale on scholarship off the top of my head.

Jaylen Griffin too. I think Deng will be a OLB unless we can develop Garbutt, Proctor, Debose, and Adams.

Forgot about him, so that's a clean 6.

Deng is heading to bburg?

Directions from Blacksburg to whoville, go north till you smell it then go east until you step in it

Hopefully, but I was counting current linebacker Jaylen Griffen as the 6th.

Let's Go

HOKIES

Who's tweet is that?

Pretty sure that is supposed to be a tweet from the Commonwealth Cup.

FIRST DOWN, HOKIES!

Commonwealth Cup needs to charge his phone's battery.

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

Well that's a downer

Outside it's night time, but inside it's LeDay

Deng it.

Saw his brother now lives in California.

Wet stuff on the red stuff.

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..and he lived in Virginia, has a mentor on the staff, we were a significant leader... Disappointing miss by the staff, no other ways about it. our staff has to get their shit together on the trail. Losing kids to Clemson is one thing, to programs like Cal sucks.

Who spent last year in Kansas and who felt being near his brother and his wife and kids was easier. What exactly did the staff not do that had this kid pick somewhere else?

Wet stuff on the red stuff.

Join us in the Key Players Club

Convince his brother to move to SWVA ...

Saw all the crystal balls switch earlier. Tbh, schools like Berkeley and Stanford I can completely understand a kid choosing over us. Hard to turn down a free education at schools of that caliber, if you qualify to attend schools like these then you probably have the smarts to understand the benefit while still having a shot at the nfl.

Fugazy

Offer more DT's, we're gonna need'em.

We need to hire some recruiting closers on this staff ASAP. This was a high-level prospect at a position of dire need. Yes, Cal is a great school but they are a football nobody and Deng had local ties.

We've been "close" on too many DL in recent years to not admit DL recruiting is a glaring problem here...(Sweat, Nnadi, KJ Henry) and we swung and missed on nearly all of our higher-level targets this year.

One of the major reasons the 2018 D was manhandled in almost every 2nd half is that the DL is undersized, has ZERO depth, and is worn down. If you are dominated upfront, you aren't going to win many games. A position coach in college is typically expected to be the major recruiter for guys at his position and Wiles isn't doing well enough, period.

Don't want to damper the mood tonight but this is a horrible miss by the staff. We basically had every advantage you could ever ask for in this recruitment, he basically committed on his visit, and we still lost him to a bad football program. Piss poor job IMO.

Edit: I misread his tweet but it seems something changed for him very recently, like maybe yesterday.

I didn't realize Cal passed out bags of $$$

He visited Cal over this past weekend

Any insight into what we could have done better? I honestly don't know, did we take him for granted after his visit? Just trying to figure out what a more competent recruiting staff could/would have done.

Honestly don't know specifics on this go around but in the past they have certainly taken some recruits for granted and taken their foot off the gas to a certain extent. Ford is a prime example, Urban Meyer was calling him twice a day and Franklin was talking to him very frequently and hammering the dream of being the first African American coach to win a championship, all while Zohn was reaching out every couple of days. Fu in particular really hurt us with his effort down the stretch for Ford and I wouldn't be surprised if the same happened after we sat extremely well with Deng after his visit.

I call bullshit. There are only so many ways to say "I want you to be a Hokie". If a coach calls me twice a day I'm gonna tell him to get a life. Why cant we just realize that nearly all these schools are offering the same thing and the player simply has to make a choice.

"with all due respect, and remember I’m sayin’ it with all due respect, that idea ain’t worth a velvet painting of a whale and a dolphin gettin’ it on" - Ricky Bobby

I call bullshit. There are only so many ways to say "I want you to be a Hokie". If a coach calls me twice a day I'm gonna tell him to get a life.

1. You're not a 16-17 yr old D1 football recruit
2. The results speak for themselves.

Just because there are only so many ways to say something doesn't mean Fu necessarily used them all. Franklin was able to find something unique that obviously resonated with Ford and in the end that was the difference. Why is it so hard to believe that these coaches are flawed? Fuente has said it publicly himself that he isn't particularly interested in the cut throat style of recruiting that happens at bigger schools, so do you not believe him either?

Well yeah that is the definition of unique...not replicated. Every player will make choices unique to themselves. We have to move on from the notion that any recruit is a guarantee if we just work harder. It isnt that simple.

Now if you tell me working harder spreads the VT brand to more high schools and living rooms, I absolutely believe it.

"with all due respect, and remember I’m sayin’ it with all due respect, that idea ain’t worth a velvet painting of a whale and a dolphin gettin’ it on" - Ricky Bobby

And we need to get rid of the idea that kids will just make whatever decision is best for them and can't be influenced by other people. Anyone with two eyes could see that Khalan Laborn was making the wrong choice by going to FSU. He still went there because he got sold by a superior program and a superior recruiter. Relationships make a huge difference and he had a better relationship with Franklin and Urban (until they recruited over him) than he did Fuente.

If you really think that a situation where 2 of the top 10 coaches in college football calling him everyday while one of our mid-level assistants was talking to him every couple of days didn't make a difference then you have your head in the sand and I'm not sure you'll ever be able to pull it out.

How does Fuente counter the Franklin sales of first black coach with a national championship?

Wet stuff on the red stuff.

Join us in the Key Players Club

Does every retailer just cut bait bc they're facing Walmart or Amazon?

It's the coach and staff's responsibility to build an effective relationship and message and execute for each recruit - especially the ones at the top of our board. The Franklin sales pitch of being a black head coach is something that resonated with Ford, but isn't some trump card we can't compete with.

Umm most of them go bankrupt.

Wet stuff on the red stuff.

Join us in the Key Players Club

Do you expect every retailer to be as successful as Wal-Mart or amazon? Your analogy does more to argue against your point than prove it.

"with all due respect, and remember I’m sayin’ it with all due respect, that idea ain’t worth a velvet painting of a whale and a dolphin gettin’ it on" - Ricky Bobby

Sure. because that is the point.

You and Fireman are right - we're just fucked if some school pitches 'play for a coach trying to win his first national championship.' No reason to expect any better recruiting out of this staff. They can't do better.

There are programs who will be more successful - hence the comparison. However, we don't just need to accept mediocrity because 'well there is nothing we can do.'

We should be expected to land guys like Deng, especially given the advantages we had. If you excuse that, then I guess everything is just going swimmingly, right?

First off we are recruiting above mediocrity. Second, all I ask is that when a recruit picks a school other than our beloved hokies, instead of trashing the coaches as if they have failed, consider the fact that maybe, just maybe the athlete just felt better about another school. It is the most rational thing in the world to expect people to have different tastes. It is irrational to assume coaches can just sway the opinion of those same people anytime they want.

The "big dogs" miss on recruits too. However, they have a bigger pool of candidates to fall back on. We need to make our pool bigger.

"with all due respect, and remember I’m sayin’ it with all due respect, that idea ain’t worth a velvet painting of a whale and a dolphin gettin’ it on" - Ricky Bobby

There are 130 schools in FBS that can offer a free ride. If you have genuine criticism based on first hand knowledge, by all means let's hear it. But if you're going to blame the coach for not sending enough texts every time we don't land a recruit, that's a whole lot of worthless temper-tantrums we can do without.

We extended 73 offers to blue chips in 2019 that ended up with a kid picking a school besides VT. Right now we have three. So in your "we should be expected to land guys like Deng" rant, that's touting a 2.7% chance of landing a blue chip recruit. If you think we had advantages that should have raised that number to even a coin flip; you're only fooling yourself. All our coaches can do is facilitate the kid's decision. They can't strong-arm him into signing with us.

Kuony Deng chose a different school. That's not on Fuente; that wasn't his decision to make. Kuony had an offer from us and he took a different one instead. Civil Engineer and Fireman are trying to reason with you why you don't get the shiny toy every time.

So if a car salesman doesn't hit his quota, does his boss just say "it's ok, this was the customer's decision to make and not yours"?

It's the exact same thing. Fuente is selling our program. There are hundreds of other car dealerships that a customer can choose from.

We literally employ Deng's football mentor. That's like saying a car customer has only ever known one car in his life and we can't still sell him on it.

Because the car dealership where his brother works instead made more sense to that kid.

Wet stuff on the red stuff.

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Serious question here. I've seen you make excuses for and defend the coaches no matter what they do. You antagonize anyone that offers even reasonable criticisms. What would it take for you to admit that they messed up, just once?

Any reasonable person acknowledges that even Nick Saban or Bill Belichick fuck up sometimes, but based on your constant defense of the coaches you must believe Fuente is perfect. It's possible to support the coaching staff without blindly worshipping them.

Nope I've critized Fuente, Hokie club and Corn even Foster and Wiles. What I don't do is place unreasonable expectations on them on lay the sole blame at their feet.

Wet stuff on the red stuff.

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I agree that it is not completely their fault. But can you agree that there is at least some blame on them for this? Other coaches (even at non-blue bloods) are able to recruit players away from their families all the time. The mere fact that Deng's brother is in San Francisco can't possibly fully absolve them for a recruiting miss like this.

Honestly I think it comes down like a lot of DL recruits the kind of defense Wiles and Foster play them in.

Wet stuff on the red stuff.

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Except Deng is an OLB, and people with insider info (LAHokie here and people at 247) have said he would slot in at backer.

Deng doesn't play DL.

If you're saying "this" as recruiting, specifically, VT has actually had a bit of an upswing in numbers since the end of the Beamer era. I wouldn't say they are performing "well", but they're certainly not doing any worse than I would have expected.

If you're saying "this" just because Kuony Deng didn't sign with us; yeah, that stinks. But you can't predict where any one kid will sign. It's okay to get upset if you guessed wrong, but the rationale that one FBS coach (ours) controls the outcome of all 2000 recruits in the nation is not rational. Even saying Fuente controls any one of those kids decisions is silly.

What I agree with is we're undermanned at several positions. How we got there isn't evident or clear- while some of the attrition is due to players not meeting the mark on performance, grades and behavior (or in Mook's case- getting arrested for something he may very well have done and may not even be prosecuted for); some of that attrition is kid's leaving early to enter the NFL draft, too. So we're pissed off at the coaches for being TOO good at player development? Hardly. But we can clearly see there is a downside to this.

I think we probably have too many WRs on scholarship. I'm actually pretty sure this is true.

But I think the primary reason people are upset right now is the results; which can be largely traced back to attrition. I don't personally know how most of that could have been anticipated. So I'm not terribly vocal on railing on the coaches.

We don't get a lot of blue chip recruits. Over the years, that can change. Slowly.

But right now we're averaging about 3 blue chips a year give or take- which are the kids that generally can show up and play against college kids their freshman year. The majority of VT's recruits are 3* recruits- generally speaking we're like most schools in the country. We have to find kids that can come in and become starters by the time they become upperclassmen. This season we're depending on a ton of underclassmen and the results have been... Sub-optimal. So people are pissed.

Do I know why the offense is awful? No? Could I criticize the coaches for this? Sure, but tons of other fans are all over this, and frankly, I didn't become a VT fan to worry about the offense. I mostly pay attention to the important two sides of the ball- Defense and Special Teams.

I don't think there's much any coach can do about a year like we've had- I certainly expect improvement. And maybe level off on the receiver numbers a bit.

I don't like the car salesmanship comparison; it really doesn't fit:

1. You can talk a customer into a REAAALLY bad decision at the first lot he shows up to, but a kid will typically plan a lot of visits and see a lot of schools. Plus, if the kid makes a really dumb call, he typically has a few months to go home, talk to his friends, coaches and parents, think it over and sloooooowly back out of it.

2. These cars are all free. Some kids are choosing between full rides at FCS schools and grayshirts/PFO spots at FBS schools; sure. But when we're talking about 3 or 4 star kids with a handful of offers, we're not asking them if they have $30K to put down on an Audi, or if they're on a budget. We're simply the Audi lot. We're asking them if they want to drive an Audi; beats the heck out of a lot of brands. But it's no supercar; and the schools' getting all of the 5* kids are probably the supercar lots or something.

3. The job title of a salesman is "salesman". That's all he does. He sells cars. That's it. He doesn't coach drivers, and his livelihood isn't affected by the results of the races.

4. Quotas are dependent on a large selection of data. If I worked for a car dealership, and my boss randomly stopped me and started giving me shit for not making the last one sale that came through, I'd tell him to fuck off and I'd walk across the street and get a job at the next dealership.

It's not the exact same thing.

The fact that we employ Deng's football mentor is a big disappointment for us; certainly.

But it's not as simple as salesmanship.

That their OC is leaving and they are not going to be the same without him. That he won't get to see the field because of superior talent in front of him for a long time if ever. That Laborn did the same thing and his brother is now tweeting about how dumb of a decision that was. That James Franklin is going to use the penn state job as a stepping stone to a truly elite program

Recruit Prosim

Laborns brother tweeted this?

That James Franklin is going to use the penn state job as a stepping stone to a truly elite program

Because that argument is a lot more effective against Pennsylvania native James Franklin whom is coaching at a resurgent blue blood program than Oklahoma native Justin Fuente whom many fans want to fire after a single tough season.

Joffrey, Cersei, Ilyn Payne, the Hound, Jeff Jagodzinski, Paul Johnson, Pat Narduzzi.

I'm not saying it's a better argument. I'm saying it's better than nothing to suggest that Franklin appears interested in the Ohio State job. A school with a lot more history and resources than Penn State. He might actually have a chance of becoming that first black national championship coach at Ohio State.

Recruit Prosim

Fuente would be the first VT coach to win a Natty. Our fans will remember the players on that team forever.

Sometimes we live no particular way but our own

Couldn't tell you, but that's not what I get paid to do. Fuente on the other hand...

He gets paid to coach.

He gets paid to be the head of a college football program, and talent acquisition is a critical part of that

He gets paid to win. Recruiting helps that.

He keeps his job if we win! He got hired as the coach because he's a good coach.

Cal is a very good school on the other side of the country. They play football badly and recruit a hair under our level. And we clearly have a need and a spot for a big defensive player to come in and play.

Recruiting is apart of the job, but Kuony Deng makes the decision where to accept a free ride. If you don't think we didn't have the outreach we should have had with him, I have no reason to doubt your insight. That is disappointing to hear.

With that said I can't be convinced that a major factor in that decision is who spammed his phone the most. There are a whole lot of things for him to consider with that decision. I don't believe at the top of a list like that would you see a unmarked check-box that asked if we "really, really, I mean REALLY" wanted him to come here.

I think Kuony's decision came down to the west coast over the east coast. His tweet where he calls out the VT staff for their class seems to show he felt comfortable with us. But he didn't choose us.

Sounds to me like if you were an athlete you wouldnt pick the hokies either. Obviously being a superior program and being coached by a top 10 coach is what is important to you.

"with all due respect, and remember I’m sayin’ it with all due respect, that idea ain’t worth a velvet painting of a whale and a dolphin gettin’ it on" - Ricky Bobby

Honestly probably wouldn't. All elite athletes want to win. The coaches' job is to convince them that VT sets them up for the best chance at both team and invidivual success. Can you really argue that for the most part, playing under an elite coach and for an elite program doesn't set those players up for that type of success more so than for VT?

Cant argue it all. It is why I don't assume the coaches failed in some way when they miss a top target. My belief is that recruiting is more about the macro view than the individual player. To some degree that goes hand in hand. We can definitely improve our recruiting (need to) but we will never win them all.

To play out the hypothetical, I would put a lot of stock in staying close to home, especially if I had any emotional attachment with a local team already. Secondly, I could probably be lured in by a nice year around climate.

"with all due respect, and remember I’m sayin’ it with all due respect, that idea ain’t worth a velvet painting of a whale and a dolphin gettin’ it on" - Ricky Bobby

If you're talking generic player and generic to program then sure. But VT has unique elements that put unique players in position to be uniquely successful.

PSU had recruits contacting Devyn often too, and the effect of that cant be understated. Franklin seems as sleezy as Urban, but he knows recruiting.

Yeah I figured Slade being in his ear and his high school teammate who played OL there played a big factor

Hmmm ok if he was a DE but the talk was LB.where there is depth of talent. Sign a JUCO DT and a grad transfer and roll with Ashby, Artis, River's, Dax, and Ferguson in this class

'Its easy to grin, when your ship comes in, and you've got the stock market beat,
but the man worthwhile, is the man who can smile, when his shorts are too tight in the seat'

Dax is playing out of position right now. Having Deng on the field would've maximized our talent at both backer and mike. Now we have a lower ceiling guy in Ashby (who I still like) at Mike and a lower ceiling guy at backer in Dax.

Where does rivers come in? I figured our three would be dax at Mike hunter at whip and rivers at backer

Taylor, looking desperately throws it deep..HAS A MAN OPEN DANNY COALE WITH A CATCH ALL THE WAY DOWN TO THE FIVE!!!!....hes still open

Not sure we see Devon on D ever again. His mind is supposedly so messed up from coverage that he's lost all of his attacking style that he had in the spring. Getting a shot at RB right now and wouldn't be surprised if he stayed there for the rest of his time in Blacksburg.

I'd be pretty surprised if we didn't see anything other than Ladler/Dax/Ashby next year. 247 has reported some interest in a few other OLB/DE types so we'll see if that has any effect on the situation. I think Bud realizes that while Dax can definitely be a good backer, his best position is still at Mike.

This is the first I'm hearing of Devon at RB as I assumed he would head back to Rover. That said, if he is a good RB he could have a lot of success there. That's a position where you can get the best out of big and fast without their head tying up their feet much. I'm a little disappointed to hear that we may not be able to utilize him on D after being such a big recruiting win, but if he turns out to be a great back for us then I'm all for that.

Same here im surprised by this move really

Directions from Blacksburg to whoville, go north till you smell it then go east until you step in it

And this is why I just roll my eyes to everyone who says we're fine in recruiting. Recruiting is why years like this year happen. Recruiting is why our DL is going to be a mess for a while. Recruiting is why we haven't beaten a ranked team at home in 10+ years.

We can have the best gameday coaches in the world, but if you set yourself behind the 8-ball in recruiting, you don't have a hope of competing. The backslide will continue until this fixes itself, and yet I never get the impression from anyone at VT that there is any worry about our ability to recruit.

"I regret nothing. The end." - Ron Swanson

You mean top 10 team at home right? We've beaten a decent number of ranked teams at home in the last 10 years

Haven't done it since the Miami game in '09.

In our defense, how many top 10 teams have we played at home since 2009? FSU '12, Ohio State '15, Clemson '17, and Notre Dame '18? We haven't been great against ranked teams period, but It's not like we're missing a ton of chances to knock off top 10 teams at home. Plus, unless Notre Dame is terrible against USC, 3 of those teams ended up making the CFP.

Edit: We're 0-8 versus ranked teams at home with 4 of those being to top 10 teams. Not great. For some reason we do our best work on the road against ranked teams.

15 Straight

No that stat was for ranked teams in Lane. Haven't won one since then I believe.

Wow, ok, my bad I didn't realize it had been that long, thought the Miami team in '11 was ranked and thought that we beat at least one or two ranked teams from 2012-2016 in Lane.

I honestly have the belief that a recruiting class ranking in the low 20's is the absolute ceiling at VT, averaged out. We simply don't have the institutional advantages of the schools above us, regardless of the coaches. They certainly can make it worse than that, and perhaps could hit a one-off class in the teens, but I really don't think that hiring or firing is gonna change that. What our coaches are selling is less attractive than what other coaches are selling, and better sellers can only help so much.

Get Angry, Bud!

I agree that our ceiling is probably averaging right around the 17/18 mark. I think with the right coach we may be able to get into the 15/16 area but that's really stretching it.

And honestly that will make for really enjoyable football. Under the current playoff structure, VT basically will never compete for a championship, and NY6 bowl will be our best seasons. Which is AMAZING, compared to my dads team, Illinois. We are really in the high end of CFB. It could be so much worse and I try to remember that when I start to complain about things we aren't doing.

Get Angry, Bud!

So then basically we will never win a national championship is what you are saying

If you don't want to recruit clowns, don't run a clown show.

"I want to punch people from UVA right in the neck." - Colin Cowherd

I don't think we ever will, which is fine. I'm of the belief that we missed our window. The sport is seeing a lot of changes, few of which actually benefit VT as a program.

I think the new tax code could actually help a program like VT. To at least even the playing field financially. Schools that have a ton of donors, doing it for the Tax benefits won't be so quick to donate. We are already bad at donor participation so we shouldn't be hurt by it.

Before Buzz, what would you have said 'the ceiling' for VT Basketball recruiting was? I'd bet not top 20.

Apples and Oranges but yes Buzz has exceeded expectations.

"with all due respect, and remember I’m sayin’ it with all due respect, that idea ain’t worth a velvet painting of a whale and a dolphin gettin’ it on" - Ricky Bobby

Basketball recruiting is a totally different animal. You can land a top 20 class simply by taking 5 players.

I get that the act of football recruiting and act of basketball recruiting are different. That isn't the point.

The point is having the preconceived notion that there is some 'ceiling' to our recruiting and just blindly stating 'well its a rural area' is an excuse to not have realistic recruiting expectations. In the James Johnson era, there were plenty of excuses flying around about how VT wouldn't be able to compete for players here, and clearly that isn't true.

I feel that I do have realistic recruiting expectations. And those expectations are being met. Not that I wouldn't like them to be better, but I think that the intrinsic nature of VT limits us to classes close to what we are getting now. So I see no reason to be unhappy. If you want your team to get all the best players and win every game, VT isn't gonna make you happy.

Get Angry, Bud!

"Woah, look at all these comments! There must be some really exciting recrui.... nevermind."

You'd think I would know better by now, lol.

Using /s is for cowards.

I was literally reading through the comments thinking this.

35 new comments, what happened? Oh, we missed on a 3* JUCO OLB who wants to be near his brother in California. This Staff can't recruit. Deng is the reason we won't be in the CFB next year. FIRE everyone!!!

You can summarize at that level to make everyone feel well and good, but this is ANOTHER case of VT coming in second for a talent we desperately needed, to a program that is far from a blue blood. Ask any recruiting insider - VT had every reason to get this guy (like others), but can't put it all together, and the coaches got outworked by a different staff. This isn't something we haven't seen before.

How do you compete with being close to family.....when you are literally on the other side of the country. It's not like hey we're still relatively close. We're about as far away as you can get.

If you don't want to recruit clowns, don't run a clown show.

"I want to punch people from UVA right in the neck." - Colin Cowherd

a talent we desperately needed

Really?

the coaches got outworked by a different staff.

Any source to say his reason was that the coaches just didn't work hard enough?

"with all due respect, and remember I’m sayin’ it with all due respect, that idea ain’t worth a velvet painting of a whale and a dolphin gettin’ it on" - Ricky Bobby

No. But nobody lets the absence of facts get in their way these days unfortunately.

The coaches are getting outworked for recruits. The coaches aren't coaching the current team because they aren't improving. The coaches aren't showing any leadership and have lost the locker room. According to some of the most vocal fans, this G5 amateur hour staff is in fact not doing a single thing related to their jobs and simply showed up with the intention of tanking this program.

Joffrey, Cersei, Ilyn Payne, the Hound, Jeff Jagodzinski, Paul Johnson, Pat Narduzzi.

"Wolf! Wolf! There is a wolf!"

- he said in every thread.

In a vacuum, this one particular recruiting loss isn't such a big deal. Even though Deng projected as a WDE or Backer, in either position he would have been in a position to help a Pass Rush that has been very subpar all year.

In the bigger picture, though, Deng is another guy that we couldn't close on, especially on D, even more especially as a Pass Rusher. Beyond the players listed above, we have also missed on guys like Alim McNeill, R. Sandidge, Brad Johnson, E. Crosby, J. Bailey, S. Jackson, V. Dimukuje, K. Wardlow. And those are just in the last 3 Recruting Cycles!!

Of all of those guys listed above, only Wardlow (who is buried on the Depth chart at ND) and Dimukeje signed at schools that would either be considered powerhouses in either Football or Academics. Anyone of those guys would have been major contributors this year...had we landed a combination of them, we might have had a competent Defense this year.

It just seems like when we continue to miss on Defensive players, many here already have the pre-made excuses ready..."they have more resources than us", "they have such strong academics", ect. At some point, our inability to bring in DL and Passrushers is more than simple bad luck and coincidence, and coaches should be held accountable when there is a clear trend of poor returns.

I'm sure there are various aspects that can be improved with regards to recruiting but what still isn't clear to me is which coaches should be held accountable. In the last 2 years, I've heard people claim Bud has placed a renewed emphasis on recruiting and that Wiles is the only one pulling his weight and bringing in top talent. Yet here are people complaining about all of our misses on pass rushers and the defensive line. So... who is responsible for that? Position coaches or various area recruiters? As far as I can tell, fans can't get their own narratives straight about what's wrong with the program. Why would I trust them more than the professionals whose livelihoods depend on it?

Joffrey, Cersei, Ilyn Payne, the Hound, Jeff Jagodzinski, Paul Johnson, Pat Narduzzi.

The position/area issue is something VT needs to get worked out. It seems like some guys (like Wiles) are stuck to geographical areas, but then you've got Vice recruiting OL, and Cornelsen only recruiting QB - there doesn't seem to be a unified approach, and that could be contributing to misses and holes in the roster.

More importantly, Bud and Wiles have never that great of recruiters to begin with. The fact that they're somehow now two of our best recruiters is pretty telling of the staff we've currently got.

Yes..calling our Recruiting strategy scattered would be quite accurate. Wiles seems to deal mostly in FL, which is okay, but in recent years there have been a great deal of high-rated DL in VA/DC, NC, and SC..its not clear to me what the plan is (if there is one) to recruit both.

If there is one change that I think could benefit us, adding a D coach who has a strong recruiting resume is a must. And guess what...Tommy Thigpen at UNC is suddenly looking for a job...he fits that mold nicely. Given the lack of development and improvement in our Secondary this year, losing either Nix or Mitchell wouldn't be a huge loss IMO.

Agreed on Tommy Thigpen. I think he'd improve our staff over either of those guys.

Wiles recruits NC and Florida. He was responsible for several NC2vT signees. I don't agree we are scattered at all. A recruiting strategy is not based on a rigid geography, but a combination of geography, needs, relationships, where the good players are as well as where they players will be which is influenced by everything from school districts, coaches, youth programs, demographics etc (ex. See the increasing good players in rDU, Greensboro etc vs central Virginia - see mid 90's). The success of our strategy is TBD as we can't judge a class' success based on their 1st year or two. I'm optimistic that the coaches strategy is working for the long term by building sustainable relationships and player development/treating people right vs following some used car salesman pitch that many coaches utilize.

I'd love for Thigpen or AAR to step in for Mitchell. The safety play has been atrocious this year, but I'm not ready to give up on Nix. He's barely had anytime coaching these guys and I love what he brings from a JUCO recruiting standpoint. A lot of the JUCO guys that we're connected with are due to his connections.

Thigpen is an LB coach.. we already have one of those...

He has 5-6 years of experience coaching DB's. No idea if he was successful from a coaching standpoint at that position though.

Yeah, I got here and started thinking
Scrolling scrolling scrolling,
Keep this page a scrolling,
Scrolling scrolling scrolling,
My eyes,,

Damn bruh, you beat me to it. I hadn't opened the recruiting thread in a while, so when I saw "103 new comments" I figured maybe a couple guys were enticed by our win over Uva.... nope, just one long chain about a guy we missed. lmao.

I'm always reading the recruiting thread like

Is it basketball season yet?

I know this is very fresh and unlikely to have immediate insight on, but with UNC firing their coach it'll be interesting to see what happens with their recruiting class. Are there any possible flip candidates?

Edit: probably not, I didn't realize they had such a weak class this year compared to previous cycles.

I don't want anybody in their recruiting class except Storm 🦆

All name team swag for sure

Can we recruit Thigpen for our defensive staff?

Is it basketball season yet?

Let's recruit Kliff Kingsbury! I've heard that he's a blue-chip recruit at the OC position in the 2019 class.

Fugazy

He will be a hot commodity as an OC.

...in the NFL. Don't see him dropping down to OC in college. He should be able to get a G5 HC job if he wants one. Or jump to the land of plenty.

Genuinely curious, but how often do head coaches in college get fired in college only to step right up to NFL OC? Usually, coaches move up to the NFL when they are seen as successful, not immediately after getting fired for a lack of success.

"Sooner or later, if man is ever to be worthy of his destiny, we must fill our heart with tolerance."
-Stan Lee

"Never half-ass two things. Whole-ass one thing."
-Ron Swanson

"11-0, bro"
-Hunter Carpenter (probably)

College coaching is so different from the NFL. You have guys who are Xs sand Os types who thrive in the NFL.

At the college level, head coaches got to meet with a donor group Monday, recruits Tuesday, academic counselors on Wednesday on top of game planning. There's a CEO esque value added in college football on top of winning. Some are great at both, like Saban. Most are not.

TKPhi Damn Proud
BSME 2009

After seeing what the Chiefs, Rams, and Saints are doing this year, some NFL teams are going to be scrambling to find people who can modernize their offense. Kliff probably would have been one of the best options available if he was still at Texas Tech, now that he's unemployeed he'll be an ever bigger commodity

Apparently Mack Brown wants Kingsbury as his OC at UNC.

FIRST DOWN, HOKIES!

He can keep wanting, I highly doubt Kliff ends up as an OC anywhere in the ACC

Tayvion Robinson just released his newest highlights. This kid is a super smooth athlete with short are quickness reminiscent of Cam Phillips. Also, he has a hell of an arm to run some trick plays for us on the jet sweet pass.

https://www.hudl.com/profile/5624113/Tayvion-Robinson

Absolute sin the guy isn't ranked higher. Total stud

Any idea how his hands are? I'm assuming he camped as a WR. His playmaking is undeniable but if we can't get the ball in his hands it's not gonna help much.

Played WR and RB early in high school! Also is a pretty good safety. He had at least 5 pick sixes last season.

Honestly no idea. I don't think he camped much, hence the lack of offers. Some big programs have reached out to him since his commitment but he politely declined them.

Kid is absolutely electric with the ball in his hands. The hardest part is figuring out how to effectively get him the ball and let him make plays. Having a Percy Harvin type talent on your hands is amazing when you get them the ball in ways that they can be most effective, but sometimes those talents can be squandered if you can't utilize them properly. I hope we figure that out.

I really don't mean to be a wet blanket but Percy Harvin was WAY faster than Robinson. Robinson has what appears to be elite vision/awareness, incredible acceleration and ability to change direction but he is about half a second slower than Harvin in a 40.

I agree. I was merely using him as a type reference as a playmaker without a real position, not suggesting they were the same caliber of athlete. Harvin was a much bigger deal and was bigger/faster.

I seriously doubt that it is a half a second difference. Robinson's football speed is absolutely upper level.

Yea I was basing the half a second off of the 4.87 40 time posted on his highlight tape... Harvin was about a 4.4 flat. I know 40's don't always translate on the field but 4.87 to 4.40 is a big difference.

4.8 is actually surprisingly slow for such an athletic person.

Recruit Prosim

No way this kid can be a 4.87. I ran that in 8-9th grade. He's running past and pulling away from most everyone in these clips. Either this is an error or he's playing against jv squads.

Watching the clips it seemed to me like pulled away in a few but more often he was using good angles and some change of direction to create separation and in a few it is obvious the person in pursuit is a good bit faster. I'm guessing that's why he is a high 3 low 4 start instead of a high 4 low 5.

Big helping of the Parris Campbell package for this kid.

Not really pursuing AFAIK. Tyree, Corum, and Black are the three right now for 2020

I've heard we are in a good spot for Corum, so hopefully we stay hot on that trail.

Not sure what the experts (LA and BAG) would say here regarding evaluations... But I like Corum better than Tyree, so if we are in a good spot with him color me excited!

Is it basketball season yet?

Oh, playing that mind game early on with yourself.

Yeah gonna disagree with you on that one haha. Tyree is awesome. Slightly behind Ford but ahead of Slade for me if you want to compare him to other VA running backs.

Yeah really hope we can land Tyree, would be a game changer to go along with the other playmakers we have on offense. Hoping having to share PT with Slade, Ford, and potentially fellow 5* Marshawn Lloyd will help Tyree see that he can be the feature back here. But that didn't work with Ford so what do I know...

It hurts my heart to see schools pick up multiple 5 stars at one position in the same recruiting cycle. Like, can we just get 1? Pls?

I don't think he's going to PSU.

All we need to do is beat PSU tonight in basketball and we're a lock for Tyree.

Nice...actual recruiting updates in the recruiting thread! Nice little birthday present for me, thanks guys!

Happy Birthday!
Which cape are you near?

Pain is Temporary, Chicks Dig Scars
Glory is Forever, Let's Go Hokies!!

I live on Cape Cod.

Nice. Stay warm!

Pain is Temporary, Chicks Dig Scars
Glory is Forever, Let's Go Hokies!!

Happy Birthday Dave- We're getting on up there!

Happy Birthday, CapeHokie. And many more.

Reel men fish on Wednesdays

TKPhi Damn Proud
BSME 2009

No he would mess up the order for QP.

Wet stuff on the red stuff.

Join us in the Key Players Club

Might need QP to move over to DT though...

No, TE is his "natural" position, right? I'm sure he played it once in middle school or something.

Reel men fish on Wednesdays

Eh I'd rather not throw qp3 to the wolves if hes not ready. If we can land tate go get him the rpo offense with him at the helm would be fantastic

Taylor, looking desperately throws it deep..HAS A MAN OPEN DANNY COALE WITH A CATCH ALL THE WAY DOWN TO THE FIVE!!!!....hes still open

Well we know he's not going to Georgia Tech or Navy.

15 Straight

We thought we knew.....

Sometimes we live no particular way but our own

Bryan Hudson's Scott County HS is playing for the 6A (top class) KY state championship this Friday night.

VT '10 #AllMaroonEverything

In case you were wondering

"I regret nothing. The end." - Ron Swanson

Did he get to take his Official?

In two weeks I think. Taking an official to South Carolina this weekend. Seems like he would prefer to be in Columbia if they'll take him.

Yeah I heard this from a USCe fan on reddit. He broke his leg the day before he was supposed to visit them or something. Kind of pisses me off that someone would want to go to Columbia, SC over VT as a South Carolina native, but it is the SEC and Muschamp is a solid recruiter from what I've heard.

So are we expecting him to decomit I'm assuming??

If you don't want to recruit clowns, don't run a clown show.

"I want to punch people from UVA right in the neck." - Colin Cowherd

Him breaking his femur probably complicated things, but before that the chatter was if he was a take for USCe he had a good chance to flip.

They can have him then.

Recruit Prosim

I think South Carolina picked up a targeted RB last week. I may be wrong but they may start playing the numbers game with him

"Welcome to the Terror Dome." -- Corey Moore

In other news Hokie wrestling landing the number 12 wrestler in the country

I feed off of nightmares

I'm convinced our best chance at a team NC is wrestling or track and field.

Recruit Prosim

Or girls lacrosse

I got kicked out of our girls lacrosse game one time so I'd be expecting my ring for helping build that program.

15 Straight

Do tell how...

Bleeding burnt orange and chicago maroon

Apparently tailgating/pregaming for a noon women's lacrosse game isn't as common as you'd think. Also their refs don't handle constructive criticism very well.

15 Straight

I mean I would think tailgating a womens lacrosse game would not be common at all.

I like to think you showed up at 6 AM with steak and eggs grilling and set up with 4 TVs all on different womens lacrosse game analysis channels because other games have not started yet. You go to the game with full body paint, a speedo, and one of those women's lacrosse masks.

Was I close?

Hopefully College Lacorsse Gameday was on one of those tv's

Bleeding burnt orange and chicago maroon

I wonder who the head gear pick was for that game

Also their ACC refs don't handle constructive criticism very well. [Fixed it for you.]

Ut Prosim Ad Dei Gloriam

Or soccer, especially at this level it's a super fluky sport and upsets can happen. Just like in hockey a goalie playing well with a good defense can make some weird stuff happen

Taylor, looking desperately throws it deep..HAS A MAN OPEN DANNY COALE WITH A CATCH ALL THE WAY DOWN TO THE FIVE!!!!....hes still open

The gap between the likes of Ohio St and Penn St and the rest of the field in wrestling is enormous. Unless we make some massive strides, there is absolutely a ceiling of around 3rd nationally for the near future.

"I regret nothing. The end." - Ron Swanson

That's a smaller gap that between us and Alabama in football

Recruit Prosim

No. I don't think that may even be true. There are weight classes on these two squads with second strings that would win the NCAAs if the first string wasn't in school. If I recall correctly an Ohio State third string wrestler beat the #2 wrestler in that weight class.

There may be years where we can compete in duals against these teams (See OSU win a few years back), but there is no way we will finish above them in the NCAAs in the foreseeable future. The talent is absurd from top down on those teams.

Ummm that sounds exactly like how Alabama football is right now.

The second string at Bama isn't any slouch. I'm sure they'd compete for the championship as well if they were playing. Their second string I'm sure would beat us pretty solidly right now.

However there have been years where we had the ability to make a run at them.

If you don't want to recruit clowns, don't run a clown show.

"I want to punch people from UVA right in the neck." - Colin Cowherd

Yeah realistically I'm really hoping McFadden can be our first 4 time AA and maybe be able to bring home an individual title or maybe Lewis down the line. Just keeping the team in the top 10 will be tough and you need finalists to really compete for a team title as they get a large number of points. We have had two in our history so just getting multiple in the same year would help tremendously, but is pretty hard to do unless you are one of the major squads PSU, OSU, OSU, Oranges, or Missouri currently.

Football school

Basketball school

Wrestling school!

Hokies United l Ut Prosim

Wrestling 0-2 to start the season though

Not in conference at least. Against two top 25 teams. Granted we should have whipped Northwestern.

It doesn't help that Tech didn't have McFadden or Miller for those 2 duals

I feed off of nightmares

Yup. I think we are still very good, just not as good as the last few years when you look at the whole starting roster.

I think some of our starters have been doing world tournaments and invitationals and crap like that, leading to incomplete lineups for some of these OOC meets.

McFadden was in like Belarus or something a couple weeks ago for a International Tournament.

One of the wrestler watched my puppy during the UVA game while recruits were in town. I am going to assume he is the reason the #12 recruit committed.

You're Welcome.

Pulling a Louisville and sending the bitches at 'em! You're not affiliated with Adidas in any way are you?

Come to Blacksburg and see what the Hokie Pokie is really all about

Flood of CBs coming in for Dorlus to Florida so it's looking like a flip is likely. Good thing DT isn't a major position of need...😑

Now, I know we aren't supposed to share information from behind a paywall, but if someone has received information from a different source that would be nice.

Probably Dorlus, I don't have 247 access but I know this was a possibility as soon as Florida offered, and if they made room for him to be a take he very likely would flip. So that's my info that is definitely not from behind a paywall, as I do not have any subscriptions outside of TKP.

Never mind I will just look at the comment above mine

CBs rolling in for Brandon Dorlus to Florida
At this point I'm numb, we could field a whole team this year from guys that were either a commit or a lock at some point-
Jordan Houston
Devyn Ford
Isaiah Hazel
Kyle Bilodeau
Donavan Beaver
Riley Simonds
Hakeem Beamon
Logan Cash
Brandon Dorlus
Nick Figueroa
D'Von Ellies
Ben Smiley
Adarious Jones
Kuony Deng
Tayvion Land
Mike Sainristl
Demarcco Hellams
Anthony Harris
Khalid Martin
Cam'ron Kelly

Missing anyone???

You put those words together, those are my favorite words, Popeyes and bahama
- Mike Burnup

I agree with your sentiment but I feel the need to point out a few things:

- We told Tank Land no, not the other way around.
- I don't remember anyone thinking Cam'Ron Kelly would stick and we didn't even make his shortlist, he is not remotely the kind of recruit that we led for all the way and then lost at the last minute. Yes, he fits your criteria because he was committed at some point, but that was a uniquely odd situation.
- Us leading at any point for DeMarco Hellams is news to me, my understanding was that he would always end up at an elite school.
- We didn't want Ben Smiley, by all accounts I have heard.

With Hellams, I remember the discussion being if Clemson didn't want him, he was a lock for VT. Clemson didn't want him- then Alabama offered
The criteria is Lock or Commit at any time, At some point in the process, Smiley and Land were locks to go to VT

You put those words together, those are my favorite words, Popeyes and bahama
- Mike Burnup

I've heard this a little bit, but with the current issues at safety Clemson has had since 2015, easily one of their worst recruited positions, I do not believe that top 100 composite safety Hellams was not a take for Clemson.

That would be the 17th ranked class national

At some point we should all stop whining about the OC and pray that Fuente hires some elite level recruiters.

Is it basketball season yet?

Maybe get an elite level OC that is also an elite level recruiter?

There are only a few of those that exist across the country and we can't afford them. Our best bet would be to hire assistants that have overachieved at lesser programs (AAR at Maryland, Jones at Duke) or up and coming support guys from top tier programs that are looking for a promotion.

What about anyone from the old Memphis staff....

If you don't want to recruit clowns, don't run a clown show.

"I want to punch people from UVA right in the neck." - Colin Cowherd