Cameron Roseman-Sinclair to UNC

Cameron Roseman-Sinclair, a top Virginia Tech 2020 target, committed to North Carolina. Up until now, recruitniks had considered the 4-star Myers Park HS product a Hokies lean. He visited Blacksburg multiple times and was teammates with 2019 Tech signee Elijah Bowick. Tech was well positioned to land him.

  1. It's only one recruit and won't make or break Tech's 2020 class.
  2. These are the recruits (high 3-star to low 4-star) that North Carolina is poised to keep in-state under Mack Brown; at a detriment to Virginia Tech.
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But the last line of his lyric doesn't rhyme. Must be 2-stars at best.

It would make more sense if the line was, 'I am committing to Virginia Tech, no doubt'

Dude isn't even 800% committed, he essentially just named a leader

no but it does explain the line above it.

For those who didn't think UNC and UMD hiring staffs full of proven recruiters would hurt us much take notice. We've been leaders for months and all it took was 1 for UNC to take him away.

One recruit doesnt make or break a class, and one recruit flipping isn't indicative of a larger trend on its own... but this is still concerning

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

Its not 1 recruit at this point

Danny is always open
23 can't read

My comment was in direct response to Joe's first point.

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

Bingo. Boom

*Checks calendar*

Come find me when the ink dries on his scholarship papers. Decommits happen.

This. I'm done getting hopeful, excited, or upset until signing day comes and goes. These kids change their minds and jump ship all the time throughout the process.

It's just another top 200 recruit choosing another program after Tech led. No big deal.

This just goes to show you how bad Fedora was as UNC's coach. They had numerous NFL talent because it's the easiest place to recruit. No other school can say that their lack of education has been endorsed by the NCAA. You still have to "play school" at Ohio State. But UNC can just give you grades. VT just can't compete with that for the recruits that don't care about a degree.

This. I don't think there's a great understanding on TKP at how bad Fedora did recruiting in state and how he was perceived by HS coaches.

It's looking like we *might* just have the VA version of that running our program currently

Good thing VA high school football recruiting is 4th tier at best (and may very well become flag football in our lifetime) and doesn't produce nearly the talent NC does then.

Bogus argument. Clellin Ferrell is twice as good as House Gaines. Josh Sweat is better than Tyjuan Garbutt... VT's inability to close on top Va. players is why we are 6-7 and mediocre since 2011. Our perception as the top program in the state is non-existent because the top players in the state don't come here. We would recruit much better with that perception and state relationships vs. oh well Ferrell went to Clemson but we got House Gaines... NC having "better players" than Va. is all fine and dandy, but the best players from either state are not coming here... so you can't brush off our lack of success in our home state by using the "NC players are better anyway" argument. Doesn't work.

Since both Sweat and Ferrell both were before Fuente became our HC, you can't hang them not playing for us on Fuente.

I'm not. What game changing player, elite player, has Fuente signed from either state? Devon Hunter?

Tre Turner

Let's Go

HOKIES

Dax Hollifield?

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

Let's Go

HOKIES

You're trying to put words in my mouth that arent mine.

My only argument is Va football recruiting is no longer as relevant as it used to be. And that recruiting other states is more important.

If there is a top player in Va we should recruit him too. But the success of the program is currently much more dependant on recruiting states like NC, Ga, and Florida than it is on Virginia (which doesnt produce like it used to).

Unfortunately we have problems there too.

If there is a top player in Va we should recruit him too.

The frustration stems from the inability to close when there are top players in the state. Devin Ford being the latest example and we could go on down the line (Sweat, Hand, Slade, Laborn, Ferrel, etc.). So yes while the state may not be strong across the board, Tech consistently trips over its dick when it comes to landing the kids in our backyard that would greatly improve the talent level of the team.

Come to Blacksburg and see what the Hokie Pokie is really all about

Damn right! Got sparks between my knees from my brass balls knocking together!

Come to Blacksburg and see what the Hokie Pokie is really all about

Mack did less with more at Texas. Hoping for some of the same at UNC because I'm not confident in our staff recruiting versus theirs.

Marshall University student.
Virginia Tech fanatic.

The issue isn't what he does on the field. The issue is that his high quality recruiting staff will do a much better job of landing these high 3 low 4 star players in NC that we have been picking up the last few cycles and lower the talent level on our roster.

And NC State has won the majority of those recruiting battles. VT goes up more against NC State then it does NC and Maryland. Need to win those battles.

He won a national title and played for another? I understand thinking he may be over the hill but the guy accomplished a lot in Austin.

I should have clarified that I meant at the end of his tenure at Texas, not as a whole.

Marshall University student.
Virginia Tech fanatic.

Mack did less with more at Texas.

Except for that national championship he won in epic fashion.

C'mon man. Please think for like 3 seconds before you post the opposite of reality.

The doll's trying to kill me and the toaster's been laughing at me.

People love to harp on coaches for rough ends to their tenure. Mack won a National championship in 05, had several great years with Colt McCoy where he narrowly missed a 2008 NCG appearance because of losing a 3 way tiebreaker to Oklahoma because those two and TxTech all finished 11-1 and each beat and lost to one of the other two. Made a 2nd national championship appearance in 09 and lost to Saban.

His last few years weren't great, but rarely do coaches go out on top. Bobby Bowden left FSU unceremoniously after many down years in a row, Beamer won 10+ games in 11 out of 13 seasons from 1999-2011 but finished his tenure with 7-6, 8-5, 7-6, 7-6. There are more examples but those two obviously will resonate with our fanbase.

Sure, great run at UNC and at Texas, but, would you hire Bowden or Beamer in the back end of their career to reserect your football program? That's why I'm not too worried about Mack Brown. They can get all the talent they want, who's going to coach them? I'm not impressed with that staff x and o wise

I agree with the premise that Mack might not be an ideal long term hire for making UNC a dominant player in the ACC.

However, I disagree that we shouldn't worry about them getting talent from us. Whether they waste it or not ultimately isn't the issue, it's the fact that we want those players so WE can be successful and try to utilize their talent to elevate our program. It does have a negative effect on us if UNC beats us for top priority recruits over the next few years. Let's say we lose even a small number of blue-chip battles to them over the next two cycles (5-7 players) those are 5-7 potential impact players we won't have on our roster. That can make a big difference if those 5-7 guys could have helped elevate our two deep and or add much needed star power at a position of need.

I clarified that I meant at the end of his tenure. If you took three seconds to read the rest of the thread before making subtle attacks for legs, you would have read this.

Marshall University student.
Virginia Tech fanatic.

You're right, my comment was overly snarky. Sometimes I let my sarcasm take over.

I apologize.

The doll's trying to kill me and the toaster's been laughing at me.

I don't know what to think. I can't see his battery level.

We put the K in Kwality

What he said is great for the ACC and VT.

This is going to be great for the ACC.

We've become what I used to think of duke and wake

Recruit Prosim

Are you kidding? Count the upper tier players in this class then compare to a Beamer year.

Wet stuff on the red stuff.

Join us in the Key Players Club

Rosters aren't assembled in a vacuum. Fuentes classes aren't putting us anywhere farther above the field than Beamer's

Your right and Beamers last two years have really hamstrung the team the last two years with lack of upperclassmen.

Wet stuff on the red stuff.

Join us in the Key Players Club

Enjoy this canard now... Come August 2019 it doesn't fly. This 2019 team is all Fuente's. Lets see what he can do.

Will it be? The 2015 class will be Seniors, which were recruited by Beamer. The 2016 class will be Juniors, which were also recruited by Beamer and held onto by Fuente.

It's the 2017, 2018 and 2019 recruiting classes that are all Fuente's recruits.

Yes it will be. Seniors that can't play at this level or are "problems" should have either been developed or weeded out by now by Fuente. 2019 is his 4th year as head coach. It's his team. If a Beamer player isn't cutting it by now, he should have been able to recruit over him or develop him. He makes nearly 4 mil per year. In fact the vast majority of his best players thus far have been "Beamer" players, so the argument doesn't hold water either way.

So your solution is to cut every upperclassman from the team who didn't perform or suddenly find underclassmen who will outperform the underperforming upperclassmen, all while saying the coaching staff can't perform at recruiting. You have a lot of performance issues there.

Sounds like a great plan.

Leonard. Duh.

Nope.... my solution is for the 4 mil per year coach at VT- 26 straight bowl games, best fans in the country school is to either DEVELOP these guys to the point that they are not a liability for the first losing season in 26 years OR recruit over them and have them play special teams or scout team. "too many Beamer guys in the program" is a lame excuse that will be very, very, very lame next year. That's my point. Develop these guys or recruit over them- to the point you can win more than 6 games in a terrible ACC.

Isn't that exactly what is happening? He has recruited over a lot of the Beamer guys. Fact is it takes more than one year to develop players but Fuente's recruits have been developed faster over Beamer recruits to the point majority of Beamer recruits weren't in the 2 deep.

That doesn't make this team capable of past team successes they are still the youngest team VT has fielded in 2 decades. I think it speaks more to what was actually left on the team after Beamer left....all of Fuente's freshman and sophomores are beating out Beamer's juniors and seniors. I'll be concerned if/when Fuentes guys are juniors and seniors and having sub-par results.

Yes it will be. Seniors that can't play at this level or are "problems" should have either been developed or weeded out by now by Fuente.

Doesn't the fact that our 2 deep this year only had six seniors (for 48 slots) indicate that this is in fact exactly what happened?

But complaining that off-season attrition is indicative of greater systematic issues is fun!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

It largely will be. There will only be about 7 or 8 Beamer holdovers in the 2-deep.

If you read my recent comment in the Jan. recruiting thread, they are actually putting us a little below Beamer's classes.

Only if you count the first class where the job was to just hold on the Beamer guys and find a QB.

Wet stuff on the red stuff.

Join us in the Key Players Club

But ignoring 2016, wouldn't that put Fuente even with Beamer? As in, no improvement

I mean by comparison, Mack Brown and staff are already doing an above average job in bringing in four star talent to UNC. In 2016 with several months to add onto the class before signing day, Fuente was losing recruits to Iowa State.

Yes because Bud Foster and Wiles (the two coaches with longest tenur on a VT staff) weren't willing to offer his below average brother.

Wet stuff on the red stuff.

Join us in the Key Players Club

No they haven't. They brought in Howell and he was going to go to NC no matter who was coach there. The safety Tennessee commit will never make it to UNC.

I forget what year we flipped Rivers from PSU, but I believe it was in the past 3 years.

I would just say this. Yes Mack has put some
recruiters in place and got some early wins. It's easier in the honeymoon period to get a few wins.

I'm not handing Mack the trophy until it is sustainable and produces some wins since he has had the job for about a month.

You are so caught up in that that it's blinding you. Fuente has signed 2 of our top 20 rated commitments, 1 of which may never see real playing time. You're comparing signing game changers like Michael Vick, Tyrod Taylor, Ryan Williams, David Wilson, Kevin Jones, Tim Settle, Logan Thomas against Devon Hunter and Dax.

Tell me 3 good players you think we land in 2020?

Recruit Prosim

Seems a little early to assess the 2020 class, or to throw in the towel on it.

And too early to assess the 2018 and 2019 classes and say that guys like QP, Turner, Dax, etc. won't be all time greats at Tech. A lot of these guys mentioned in the above post redshirted and/or had forgettable first years

I'm not assessing them, recruiting services are. Obviously the current players shouldn't be written off and should have the chance to develop. BUT, that's not what we were talking about. We were talking about recruit talent.

Recruit Prosim

You cherrypicked guys from about a 15 year timeframe and you're going to say Fuente's two classes can't stack up? Probably right but apples and oranges

Im not the one who claimed Fuentes classes were better than Beamers classes without specifying a time frame

Recruit Prosim

God I hope we don't throw the towel in, certainly not the coaches.... But taking a good look at 2020's targets and their current leanings, it's really not looking good man.

But I'll challenge you, too. Name 3 talented athletes you think we land next year.

Recruit Prosim

Disregard me; the village idiot.

He's from NC

Oh. Good catch. I just saw top VT recruit and assumed he was from our state. Thanks. Will edit accordingly.

2020 is a long way off. Plenty of time to change his mind.

If you don't want to recruit clowns, don't run a clown show.

"I want to punch people from UVA right in the neck." - Colin Cowherd

Couple of things:
1 maybe I'm wrong, but i don't see this as a four star guy

2. If you're going to commit a month after a staff was assembled, clearly he grew up a UNC basketball fan, So while VT looked like it was in a good position, I highly doubt they were the leader.

I'm not ready to light the outhouse on fire quiet yet.

-Just one recruit

-Lots of time left to flip

-Can't blame him for staying home

-Not actually a blue chip recruit

THAT'S A BINGO!!!!!!!

Brewster punks VT head to head before the ink is dry on his UNC contract.. yep nothing to see here.

He publicly named us his leader on several occasions.

That's all well and good, but I find it hard to believe a months worth of recruiting payed off for UNC if he wasn't already a UNC fan to begin with.

I've seen this kid play a couple of times, seems like a decent player but in my opinion he just doesn't have the consistency, motor, or tackling to be a highly ranked guy. His team has a lot of talent and he just doesn't wow you on the field. To me, he's a solid player that you can find in any number of high schools

PAYed, you say?

Not talking about his play. I honestly thought he was a little highly rated as a 4* and would be more accurate as a high 3* guy. But my point is that we were his leader about a month ago, and you better believe that he was convinced by Mack and Bly in that timeframe. You can find it hard to believe but it is 100% fact.

He's just saying that perhaps he liked UNC, but not the departing coaching staff.

Exactly. Everyone's in a panic about UNC, but all they've done is pick off low hanging fruit:

Howell - Was looking every reason possible not to go to FSU.

Harris - A 4* safety who probably won't qualify

Miller - Was the softest of soft NC State commits, grew up a UNC Fan, got a good excuse to decomit when Ledford left. Is not a 4*, has a lot of work to do to develop because he's still new to football

Brown - His brother is on the team, and there have been concerns about his drive and commitment to football

Lawless - Tennessee cut him loose for whatever reason. Pruitt is a defensive coach, read into that what you wish

There are all guys UNC should have gotten anyway if Fedora hadn't screwed up in State recruiting so much.

So, while I'm sure Mack will bring in some guys, I'm not going to lose sleep over it, nor am I afraid of a guy who went 15-30 at Minnesota, and tweets like a preteen twitter troll.

Look at that roster, look at that coaching staff and tell me they're going to be an instant success in the next two years? The momentum is going to be slow to build. Then you're Mack approaching 70 and you're finally ready to take the next step to 7-9 win seasons? Good luck!

Their success is relevant right now. It's the fact that we want the players and they are taking them. It doesn't even matter what happens to them afterwards.

Let's not play the "we lost a recruit so he's not that good" game, please.

I'm not playing that game, if he committed to VT i'd be happy, but I'm not going to act like he's Deion Sanders. He's a solid guy who will be a contributor to UNC and probably a starter in the back half of career. There's a lot of guys just like him in VTs recruiting area that they can get that would do the same thing.

Tech just signed a four star safety, JR Walker, they're also recruiting Malcolm Greene. There may be others. It's not ideal but not the end of the world. Really what they need is 2 top end DT.

Meh. `\_("/)_/`

I like how we're all just ignoring the "I took the millionaire route" in regards to UNC and Mack Brown

"Some days you’re a horse and some days you’re a horse’s ass. I’ve been a horse’s ass for a little while." - Roy Halladay

Yes! So UNC is paying their guys large sums of money to not take classes now, I'll bet the ncaa makes Alabama trade signing classes with UNC as an extra reward.

What does that even mean? Does anyone here know?

They see him rollin', they hatin', patrollin' and tryin' to catch him ridin' dirty?

You will see this game, this upset and this sign next on ESPN Sportscenter. Virginia Tech 31 Miami 7

no, that's the Chamillionaire route

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

I heard that song the other day and it has been stuck in my head. As soon as I saw that millionaire line, I just couldn't help myself.

You will see this game, this upset and this sign next on ESPN Sportscenter. Virginia Tech 31 Miami 7

;^)

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

I came here specifically to point that out. UNC pays recruits millions. Got it.

If a tree falls in Scott Stadium does it make a sound?

We really need to improve our recruiting. Maybe we'll flip this guy, but UNC convinced within a month or two of changing their staff.

Its shocking how common it still is to mention the high school a player attended without any context. As if we all know what city and state Myers Park High is in. I see it, hear it often.

Honestly, I thought Myers Park was in Florida based on the name.

If he was a 6-3 290 DT I'd be bummed. I'm not bummed

'Its easy to grin, when your ship comes in, and you've got the stock market beat,
but the man worthwhile, is the man who can smile, when his shorts are too tight in the seat'

We aren't exactly tearing it up in the secondary either.

DB is still a position of great need.

But I'm still not bummed. It's small potatoes in the grand scheme of things.

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

Yes, if you watched more than 5 minutes of VT football this season, DB is a HUGE position of need.

But was it talent or coaching putting them is poor position combined with serious DL issues (aka pass rush)?

Most on this board probably gave up on Stroman as a fr. Lets see what Farley, Watts, Nadir Thompson, Waller etc. do in 2019

'Its easy to grin, when your ship comes in, and you've got the stock market beat,
but the man worthwhile, is the man who can smile, when his shorts are too tight in the seat'

Thompson and Waller weren't ready- period, should not have been playing. A small bit of that is coaching yes.

Someone slept through this pass defense's performance this year

Lot's of someones. I think some of them were on the field at times, too.

I know Mack didn't coach at UNC when these players were kids, but he certainly was THE coach for their parents. I know if my kid was being recruited by a comparable out of state football school and then newly minted HC Bud Foster asked him to change his mind and commit to VT, I'd have a hard time not selling him hard on the switch.

Warning: this post occasionally contains strong language (which may be unsuitable for children), unusual humor (which may be unsuitable for adults), and advanced mathematics (which may be unsuitable for liberal-arts majors)..

I would knowing Mack won't be there for next 5 years especially for a kid not enrolling till 0 2020. He will be 71 when that kids first season happens.

I mean this is the guy who left a game early so he didn't miss a flight.

Wet stuff on the red stuff.

Join us in the Key Players Club

Our recruiters have never been able to compete with Tim Brewster, so get used to this.

Wait I thought this was Bly's and Mack's recruit? Now it's Brewster? (Who is a good recruiter) but does that mean Bly wasn't his lead recruiter?

Wet stuff on the red stuff.

Join us in the Key Players Club

When Brewster is on your staff... he is the lead recruiter. It's his process. Mack is window dressing. Not doubting or disagreeing that Bly "recruited" him too. But make no mistake on Brewster.

Mack Brown was hired 11/26. The dead period extends from 12/17 until 1/10. That means that Mack first contacted this kid in late november, only had 3 weeks to flip him, and then he decided to commit without even being able to talk to UNC coaches. It would take a huge leap of faith and violation of common sense to think the dead period rules weren't broken. And on top of that, in just a month this kid's mind was changed to such a degree that he felt compelled to commit a year before signing day? I don't see how you can call this anything other than blatant, Ole Miss level cheating. Hopefully it will come back to haunt them, I guess we'll see.

I believe it was stated on another thread that "dead period" just means that you can't talk face to face, phone calls, texts and conversations via social media are still allowed

VT '17

The most frustrating thing to me is seeing new coach come in at other schools and flip kids left and right, while it feels like VT always has to work harder than everyone else to land a top 25 class.

Now, I understand that this is just a 'feeling', and might not actually be the case - after all, the disappoint of losing Devyn Ford over shadowed the excitement of (and received more press than) landing any 4-star player did. Beyond that, I also recognize that Fuente is doing the most consistent recruiting we've ever seen at VT (There hasn't been a 3-year stretch in VT history where we've signed 5+ 4-stars three years in a row). I also understand that their are other factors at play here - Brand recognition, recruiting budget, accessibility to name a few. Doesn't change the level of frustrated we feel as fans.

Twitter me

Fuente is not doing anything in recruiting that hasn't been done at VT before. Composite ranking, cherry picked stats aside. He's not re-capturing the 757, he's not signing elite RBs or DL, he's not signing game changers at any number or accelerated pace than Beamer did. Yes, give him 2 more years, but the "recruiting at VT has really improved" talking point is a myth. Results on the field show it, the roster management shows it, attrition shows it, the lack of explosive plays shows it. The ONLY metric that might have credence is the "other P5 offers the kids have" but that is very flawed as well. Tennessee offered 450 kids last year. Is a P5 "offer" really an indication of quality?

Just counting stars doesn't count as 'improving recruiting' (and even if you do that, it's a stretch) Our DL is terrible. Our DBs aren't good and our coaches somehow can't sell DB at VT - a place where if you start 2 years, you're going to get drafted.

Signing a couple more .8900 4* athletes and totally ignoring DL isn't improving our recruiting. Jarrod Hewitt, regardless of how hard he works, should never be a starter. He's likely our best DL going into next year. That is not an improvement.

I couldn't agree more. Kid has heart and a great motor but as far as being the starting DT for the Virginia Tech Hokies he literally has no business.

Fair point - the second paragraph really hit home for me. Your and dcwilson's comments in this thread have started to sway my opinion.

Twitter me

Your and dcwilson's comments in this thread have started to sway my opinion.

/s

Similar things were once said about Stroman, Motu, and others.

"with all due respect, and remember I’m sayin’ it with all due respect, that idea ain’t worth a velvet painting of a whale and a dolphin gettin’ it on" - Ricky Bobby

Gonna ask a question...
Why is there such a push for #NC2VT? Why are we trying to go south to poach recruits? Why are we not focusing on good ol VA for talent? I'll show my work: In the 2018 draft, there were 15 kids from VA high schools drafted, 13 from NC high schools. Since 2006 VA high schools have 16 first round picks, while NC high schools have 13 first rounders. Curious.

To you from failing hands we throw
The torch; be yours to hold it high.
@BuryHokie #ThanksFrank

I think when you look at geographical distance, usual NC recruiting hot beds (i.e. Charlotte area and the Triad) are in closer proximity to VT then Nova and the 757, and therefore a logical area for VT to recruit a lot of talent from. The eastern half of the state is kind of like the 757 for VT in distance. The triangle area typically hasn't had a lot of depth in talent, but thats changed in the last 4 years or so. I think you'll see the talent pool shrink there in the next couple of years in the triangle though.

Because starting with Percy Harvin, our stoneage offense at the time, negative recruiting on Beamer's age, Jimbo Fisher hiring Tim Brewster to recruit the 757, London and the thoroughbreds, continuing with Shane's recruiting "style", etc. the bottom line is that Virginia kids don't want to play at Virginia Tech. They don't care about enter sandman or Mike Vick. They want to win, go to the NFL, play for the SEC or Penn State or OSU.. they could give a flip about the lunchpail, etc. They just don't care.

So, Fuente and staff should be focusing on changing that thought process and "standard" instead of tossing hands in the are and attempting to raid another state, don't ya think?

To you from failing hands we throw
The torch; be yours to hold it high.
@BuryHokie #ThanksFrank

Fuente and staff are not going to win the coastal until they get more, better players in here. Fact. IF the BEST players from NC were coming here, sure "ignore" Va. But they aren't, so why not try to be the flagship state program again? It's much easier and cheaper to get a Va. kid on campus for a visit. It's easier for their parents to see them play, and so long as you are not perceived as a top destination for in state kids, you are fighting an uphill battle signing those kids.

Why is it easier to to get a kid from the beach to campus than from Charlotte or Greensboro?

Wet stuff on the red stuff.

Join us in the Key Players Club

It's not. Driving from the Triad to Blacksburg is MUCH easier than driving there from NOVA, 757, or even Richmond.

Much, much easier. The VA proximity argument doesn't hold a drop of water when talking about most of the talent rich gardens of NC.

In-state vs Out of state tuition may be valid, but maybe not when talking about a scholarship. I don't have the knowledge on that.

Leonard. Duh.

The scholarship does cost more for out of state kid that's true.

Wet stuff on the red stuff.

Join us in the Key Players Club

So as a general followup, where is the talent in the 757 going? It ain't to ECU, or ODU, or Richmond, or loluva, but rather completely out of state...ND, anOSU, etc. Why?

To you from failing hands we throw
The torch; be yours to hold it high.
@BuryHokie #ThanksFrank

Aside from the perception that those programs have better coaches, facilities, and can better prepare them...

Status.

Kids these days are active participants in the prestige economy... even more so than when I was in college.

Can you say that a lil bit louder now?

To you from failing hands we throw
The torch; be yours to hold it high.
@BuryHokie #ThanksFrank

Fuente has the won the coastal. Fact.

It's pretty easy to know what he was saying here, without saying "again"

Fuente has had two classes ranked 26th or higher.

I think it's safe to say that with that level of recruiting he can win the Coastal, again.

okay. I wasn't making an argument for, or against dc's point, just to the previous comment that seemed to indicate dc didn't know that he had already won the Coastal.

Im getting pretty tired of the negativity. Yes we lost a guy we were in the lead for. Perhaps he always preferred to stay home but did not like the previous staff. That can be true and not mean VT failed in some way.

"with all due respect, and remember I’m sayin’ it with all due respect, that idea ain’t worth a velvet painting of a whale and a dolphin gettin’ it on" - Ricky Bobby

Reality should not be mistaken for negativity. We just went 6-7 and we had to find 3 last minute JUCO recruits to field a DT depth chart NEXT YEAR. That is where we are with roster management and recruiting right now. Reality.

Reality should not be mistaken for negativity.

Reality should not be mistaken for fantasy either. We've only signed one JUCO DT and are only in for possibly one more. Agree with most of what you've been saying but don't fact bend to support it

Do you want to win more than 6 games a year? If so, flipping someone from Temple, or trying to get guys to sign with us over Akron isn't going to cut it. That is our recruiting reality now.

I do want to recruit better and win more than 6 games. Hence me saying that I agree with most of the points that we should be recruiting better. My point was that an argument loses credibility when readily available facts are misrepresented. Fully agree that we have neglected the DT position for many years and now are scrambling for band-aids. But those band-aids are not 3 JUCO DTs, they're 3 HS and 1 JUCO (with the possibility of one more). Just state the facts as they are, that's all I was saying...(P.S. I like Fuga best out of our 3 HS DTs FWIW)

We are talking a 2020 recruit. There is no reality yet, only projection and fear and negativity.

The reality you speak of regarding this year's record and past misses on DL etc. Have nothing to do with this kid.

"with all due respect, and remember I’m sayin’ it with all due respect, that idea ain’t worth a velvet painting of a whale and a dolphin gettin’ it on" - Ricky Bobby

Negativity doesn't bother me nearly as much as losing does. That has gotten pretty old, pretty quick.

Prospects commit to teams and sign with others. We are over 10 months away from the early signing period.

You would think the sky is falling...

Has there been recruits that commit to us that we didn't expect or we got at last minute and all we see is "GREAT JOB BY (INSERT NAME) WITH STICKING WITH HIM!!!"

lol its January... people freaking out need to relax.

Bleeding burnt orange and chicago maroon

Honest question and don't mean it to sound sarcastic but it probably will: How long should we relax? We were told to relax all season long and that "we were going to turn the corner", and that "2020 recruiting will be different"... and maybe it will be... but when the ONE guy who had named us his clear favorite chooses a division rival, it's just one more unsettling thing and not a good start to the offseason. I don't care how you spin it, it is not good. And Hokie fans want some good news for a damn change.

This perpetual state of relaxing is called apathy. And here's just more evidence that it is hitting hard in Blacksburg.

I didn't take it sarcastic at all. And I can see where you questions come from and they are valid.

We just turned the corner from earlier signing period of 2019 and we are already worried about a 2020 prospect who was leaning towards us the whole way, committing to another team. I get it, easy to get worried about our recruiting efforts because of CRS' commitment.

To answer your question, I don't have a specific time to "worry". It's always going to be relative from on prospect to another. In this case, it sucks, but there is PLENTY of time to regain traction and flip him. It shouldn't be that hard compared to other if he was honestly that high on VT.

Bleeding burnt orange and chicago maroon

We were sitting better with more elite prospects last year at this time. So if we couldn't take advantage last year, why would we do any better starting in a worse position?

I hear what you are saying but not all recruiting efforts and processes are going to be the same. Some take more work and some don't. It's all relative from one player to the next.

Just because we didn't close with players we were sitting better with last year doesn't equate to us not having a chance to flip/close on prospects this year who may take more time/efforts to do so.

Bleeding burnt orange and chicago maroon

The problem is that it doesn't look like we will land a single top 10 player in our three most important states (VA, NC, MD). Last year at this time, we were either leading or in the top group for a fair amount of our high targets. Can't really blame people for being anxious about the outlook for 2020.

This would be a major cause for alarm and is probably the best way to analyze performance. Rather than making an excuse about in-state talent, look at Fuente's performance across VA, MD, and NC. We should be in contention for 30% of the top ten and pulling in 15% of them, which would equate to 5 players from the three states' Top 10.

Come to Blacksburg and see what the Hokie Pokie is really all about

So are we already pivoting to "2021 will be a special recruiting class!!!"? Is it too early to give up on 2020?

Next year is the year.

2020 is expected to be a small class anyway.

Winning cures all.

Everybody has to deal with injuries.

I know you're joking and I'm not pivoting to 2021 cuz I'm not giving up on 2020, but the 2021 class should be special based on some guys that we should have an advantage with (Tony Grimes, Katron Evans, Aaron Willis, Isaiah Johnson, Jack Hollifield, etc.) . If it's not *the* year, then there is no year.

I mean we sit well with Grimes... but it's 2 years out and I'd put $100 down on Clemson

Recruit Prosim

I'm not gonna disagree. My main point is that, given where we stand now with these kids. (and idk about Evans but he's from the 757 and a Tech fan, so we should do something with that) if 2021 ISN'T the year...there will not be *a year*.

I always value yours and BAG's inside info, so I appreciate your input.

I understand why people would be anxious. For me, there is A LOT of time left to be worried, and as we all know, the way a lot of these prospects think can change on a dime.

This news about CRS sucks, but nobody ever said recruiting was easy or easy to predict.

Bleeding burnt orange and chicago maroon

For me, there is A LOT of time left to be worried, and as we all know, the way a lot of these prospects think can change on a dime.

The concern is at the moment, we really dont' lead for a single 4* player this year. How many times did we hear 2019 would be the year? When that was 'a small class,' it was 'hey well we're in a good spot for 2020.' The 2020 class, while early, could be a disaster.

What is most concerning - to me at least - is that we're not seeing any movement on staff changes. Nix and Mitchell are bad coaches and bad recruiters. We've got other poor recruiters on staff. Our peers are improving themselves, so while the tide around us rises, we're stuck in the mud.

We saved $200k with letting Galen Scott go. Where is the expanded recruiting staff? Where are the analyst hires? Where are we improving our coaching staff? The fact that we're not, makes me feel like someone feels like they're good with what they've got - which is clearly not the case.

It could be a disaster or it could be great or maybe something in the middle, I don't know. All I know is that there is a lot of time to gain ground, flip a commitment, and/or solidify a decision.

IMO if this happened in middle of summer before the high school season started, then I would be a lot more worried than now... but again, that's just me.

Bleeding burnt orange and chicago maroon

Dude we have money budgeted for staff that we are not spending. The whole thing is mismanaged. People love to throw around money being the reason we are lagging, but we spend the 16th most on football in the country.

Recruit Prosim

Where are you getting that stat from?

Wet stuff on the red stuff.

Join us in the Key Players Club

I think he meant the claim that we have unused money allocated for staff.

The Orange and Maroon you see, that's fighting on to victory.

I'd like to see their sources since ND, Miami, PSU, Pitt USC and several other schools don't report all their monetary data.

Wet stuff on the red stuff.

Join us in the Key Players Club

According to google any school with FAFSA has to

Recruit Prosim

Are you talking about the 2020 class? Because it looks like we're in at least decent position with these prospects in VA:

#2 Tyree
#3 Lambert
#4 Greene
#5 Jenkins
#7 Meredith
#9 Barlow

I'd be surprised if we didn't close on at least a few of those guys.

I think Tyree and Meredith are significant stretches at this time

Irrespective of this kid's possibly fleeting decision, by now we all know how well Fuente can recruit given the resources he has. IIWII.

Only thing left is to see if he can ride Quincy Patterson and Bud Foster's questionable D-line to the ACC championship in the next two years to be sacrificial S.O.S. padding for Clemson or FSU.

I'm not holding my breath.

Prepare to be surprised. We aren't really pursing Meredith or Barlow, and the others are likely all headed elsewhere. We probably have the best shot at Lambert but I'd put that at under 50% right now.

Obviously there's always a possibility of someone popping up like Payoute, but even landing one or two of the VA top 10 without supplementing the class with talent from other states is not a recipe for success.

Genuine question LA, where do you think Tyree, Lambert, Greene, and Jenkins are going? I know Lambert and Greene are high on Clemson but hoping connections at HS and with Kam can help.

MSU, Clemson, Clemson, FSU or LSU

Thanks I appreciate it. Clemson is hard to argue with but hope we can land Lambert. Jenkins will be third string wheel career at LSU so FSU makes sense. I assume that MSU means Mississippi State and would be interested to hear why they lead.

Yeah Mississippi State. Apparently Tyree is very close with Joe Moorehead from his days as PSU offensive coordinator.

I want to die reading that Lambert and Greene are both likely going to Clemson. Isn't Lambert Kam Chancellor's cousin?

Yep. One of the posters on 247 who is a high school coach in the 757 and is very well connected recently said that Lambert is feeling Clemson right now and was very impressed with their offense on Monday. No inside info here but my feeling is that he wants to be known as something other than Kam's cousin

Broader question that may demand to be answered in a different place/venue/thread...

How do you see, based on the past 3 cycles and on the upcoming one, recruiting taking shape under the Fuente regime? I certainly have an opinion on how things seem to be going, and have heard some stuff over the years from some High School coaches (granted that was related to the old staff), but I'd love to get your read on the future of recruiting at VT under Fuente.

Is it basketball season yet?

Unless Fuente changes his emphasis on evaluation and development over recruiting (not saying this approach is right or wrong for VT), I don't see any reason why we can reasonably expect to consistently recruit much better than we have been throughout his tenure. I think we're just too limited from a resource standpoint to not prioritize recruiting and expect much of a step forward.

Now that's not to say we can't get a slight bump if we start winning consistently again. But anyone thinking we'll annually have classes ranked better than 20-30 as currently constructed is being unreasonable IMO.

That is a very sobering statement about the condition of our football recruiting efforts. Ouch, not good Bob.

VTCC '86 Delta Company, Hokie in Peru, TKPC#490, One of us!

So, is it a new thing here where a comment that doesn't violate community guidelines gets repeatedly deleted? Nothing derogatory, or discriminatory, but seems to be just hurting someone's feelings?

Respect the signal to noise ratio. It wasn't funny and didn't add to the discussion at hand. Also, take the hint next time. Thanks.

Gotcha, so it was similar to many many other comments in threads on the site?

1. I clean up plenty of other comments that violate the Community Guidelines. Everyone else takes the hint and moves along.

2. Bold strategy to edit your signature to said comment that was deleted. Let's see how that pays off for you.

In other words, dont post stuff solely intended to get people worked up

"with all due respect, and remember I’m sayin’ it with all due respect, that idea ain’t worth a velvet painting of a whale and a dolphin gettin’ it on" - Ricky Bobby

I too choose to support my team by using the same pejorative we usually save for our arch rival on ourselves.

The Orange and Maroon you see, that's fighting on to victory.

a comment that doesn't violate community guidelines

hmmmm... about that.....

  • Refrain from posts consisting entirely of: "FIRST!", any repetition of "LOL", "The Germans bombed Pearl Harbor", "!!!1!", etc... They're neither witty nor funny, and do not add to the discussion.
  • Respect the signal to noise ratio. In other words, don't post or comment or topic for the sake of it. Don't post comments that require further (missing) explanation. You don't have to be an essayist, but a few well-thought out sentences generally contributes to the discussion better. If you're referencing a Tweet, article or YouTube video, link or embed it. Ensure your comment is thorough to the point where everyone else contributing to the thread understands it. Don't deal in riddles or mystery. Brevity can be fine as long as there is context.

"Some days you’re a horse and some days you’re a horse’s ass. I’ve been a horse’s ass for a little while." - Roy Halladay

I'm gonna miss him. A real ray of sunshine that one.

"with all due respect, and remember I’m sayin’ it with all due respect, that idea ain’t worth a velvet painting of a whale and a dolphin gettin’ it on" - Ricky Bobby

Guess it wasn't a great idea to try and tell the site founder what does and doesn't violate community guidelines.

The Orange and Maroon you see, that's fighting on to victory.

To you from failing hands we throw
The torch; be yours to hold it high.
@BuryHokie #ThanksFrank

lol. From the way this board blew up you'd think this was Devyn Ford all over again or something.

It's somewhat similar. CRS was a 4* recruit at a position of need that we were long stated to be the favorite that we lost to another school we've been competing against on the recruiting trail. It's not as big of a deal as the Devyn Ford loss, but it's just another example of a trend that is understandably upsetting to the fanbase.

and UNC isn't even a Big Dog!

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

There's been a lot of angst in this thread about the timing of the commitment and what could have swayed him to UNC during the dead period. What I haven't seen so far is the fact that UNC hired his HS coach. That's probably a big factor in his commitment, and the timing of such.

Dre Bly was an assistant coach at Myers Park (2017 article)

I think we can safely say that the sky isn't falling on our recruiting because of this miss. This one is explainable, folks.

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

Ha. All the hand wringing seems pretty ridiculous given that information explains the situation very well.

Joffrey, Cersei, Ilyn Payne, the Hound, Jeff Jagodzinski, Paul Johnson, Pat Narduzzi.

+1 while you may be right I'm still gonna be pissed if Fu doesn't make some changes on the D coaching staff - e.g. sack Mitchell and/or Nix and hire some coaches that can recruit. I know it has been mentioned repeatedly but someone like Delo or Loren Johnson would be nice.

"Give me a fu¢king beer", Anonymous Genius

While panicking about VT recruiting is fun, the fact remains signing day is forever away.