MLB 2022

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I hate Rob Manfred.

It's Time to go to Work

probably not as much as Rob Manfred hates baseball

Be cool, be cool, ice cold

It's okay, they're only playing for a hunk of metal

It's okay, they're only playing for a hunk of metal

Hey, that's OUR hunk of metal right now, and I want there to be a season so we can play as defending World Series Champions!




If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

It's just insane to me that they now have to adjust the calendar. Hey owners. You know how you make more money? YOU LET THE PLAYERS PLAY THE FUCKING GAME.

From top to bottom, baseball has as much talent as its had in a while. Pisses me off to no end that it's being interrupted.

/rant

Outside of the delay because of the labor dispute, there have been a couple things decided already. Namely, they will be introducing a draft lottery to hopefully discourage tanking, and, in my opinion most newsworthy, the Designated Hitter will become universal with the National League adopting it going forward.

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Two big points going into this anticipated season. I never minded the DH being in existence in only one league and felt it provided a great chance of pace whenever there were inter league games. But having it in both leagues (or not having it in both) takes that mixup away and just takes away that nuance, which I'm not happy about. It will be very interesting to see how the draft affects the trade deadline as well moving forward.

The Nats reportedly offered Juan Soto a 13yr/$350mil dollar deal prior to the lockout...annnd he turned it down. I was a-ok with the Lerners not really going "overboard" for Bryce or Rendon, but geeze. Is he worth that? Absolutely. But $26.9m/yr for a top shelf guy is chickenshit in this day and age. Certainly for an everyday player. And if their prior negotiations are any indication, half of that would have been paid out over the next 30yrs. I just keep telling myself, 'last time someone turned down a blockbuster offer from them, they won it all.' But I know this roster is 3 states away from what 2019's was.

Amateur superstar and idiot extraordinaire.

He's actually probably worth a lot more.

Soto has three years of arbitration, so the better way to look at the annual salary is to take out the those years and just look at the FA years. He's expected to make about $60M in arbitration from 2022 to 2024, resulting in annual salary of $29M in the final ten years (i.e., the years equivalent to FA signing).

For reference, here's the top 5 OF annual salaries:
M. Trout: $35.5
M. Betts: $30.4
C. Yelich: $26.9
B. Harper: $25.4
G. Stanton: $25

So, that offer makes him 3rd highest OF, just behind Betts. The offer is reasonable, but honestly probably low. If Soto continues to be as good as he has been the last two years, he'll get really close (if not more than) to Trout's salary. And of course, there's this:

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Until the MLB adopts a salary cap structure like the NFL, putting the smaller market teams on the same playing field as the large market teams, baseball will always be well behind football (both pro and college), basketball (both pro and college), and maybe even the NHL. You'd have thought by now they would have done more towards this after seeing the success of the other sports that have instituted it. The sorry "luxury tax" excuse just doesn't cut it, and the teams in the big markets can afford to pay it, so it's generally pointless. Then they pretty much eliminate much of the minor leagues, which are a nice, family-friendly alternative to the MLB. MLB won't be in a good place until they can figure out a way to give all teams a shot at the title, and create fan excitement across the board, not just in the larger market areas.

"That man was violating a city ordinance, and I was just doing my duty to enforce it." - Mike Curtis

Agreed, free agency is just a bidding war between 5 to 6 teams. The MLB can point to the every couple year runs by low payroll teams, but most years it's the biggest payrolls still playing in October.

I am not sure what to do with my hands now

The union will never go for that, and some of the owners are very happy to continue running tiny payrolls and bad teams just to cash a large CBT check. Union would never institute a salary cap without a salary floor, and some owners just don't want that.

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

The current luxury tax acts as a de facto salary cap. There are maybe five teams a year that go over, or even get close to the tax now. The problem competitive balance is that some teams don't care about winning. They can spend less than $100m on payroll a year, win if they happen to have a bunch of good young players who haven't gotten to arbitration or free agency yet, and rack up that revenue sharing money.

But popularity wise, I think the real difference is football is once a week, and in the playoffs every game matters. I don't know if you want to reduce the number of MLB games to recreate that, but I think it's just a structural thing that probably can't get fixed. There's just too many other forms of entertainment for people to pay attention to teams every day for six months.

I'm an O's fan unfortunately. Salary cap is so high on my list it is insane. By the same token, a salary floor would be great too. I understand rebuilding and having windows where you are competitive, but being a small market team competing against NYC, Boston, and the recently strong Tampa Bay and Toronto clubs is brutal.

Outspoken team cake advocate. Hates terrapins. Resident Macho Man Gif Poster. Distant cousin to Dork Magic. Frequently misspells words.

Jayson Stark writes an article on this every year before October begins and surprisingly baseball has one of the highest rates of "new" teams competing in postseason play compared to other sports. I'll try and find one of the old articles he wrote, but it totally breaks the notion that only the big market teams make the playoffs.

#38-0

To add to that, there hasn't been a repeat champion in over 20 years. Everyone knows it's terribly difficult to repeat in any sport, but to have zero since the 90s? Bananas.

Amateur superstar and idiot extraordinaire.

The only thing that matters is my Braves resigning Freddie... Would be a good start to their World Series defense.

Bleeding burnt orange and chicago maroon

Per rumors today, don't get your hopes up too much on that one.

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Wait, what is this?

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

Cancelled my MLB.tv subscription the other day... zero hope that we're getting a full season and i'm sure MLB was going to be happy to charge me full price for the year even without a known opening day.

I expect the Nats will be tanking bad this year, so I don't know how I feel about the lockout and the season yet. I also don't think most current Nats fans know what it's like to support a 70-win team, so that'll suck too.

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Speaking as a fan of the Nats and Twins I absolutely know what its like to support a 70-win (or worse) team.

It most likely means I get a lot more work done around the yard this year.

70 is my optimistic outlook for the Nats. It wasn't that long ago that the Nats were struggling to break 60 wins. I remember the days of John Lannan opening day starter. Sigh.

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Amateur superstar and idiot extraordinaire.

Ahh, those were the days. Natinals jerseys. Exploding sausages out of the cannon. Rob Dibble being, well Rob Dibble... Good times.

I do view that era with a certain bit of nostalgia. There were no expectations, like literally none, so it was easy to enjoy minor positives and then turn around and laugh at all the random inexplicable stuff. There was no shortage of the random inexplicable stuff back then.

What a savings

And there's a chance that things'll get weird
Yeah, that's a possibility

I honestly loved that era, but I'm one of those nerds that follows rosters, the draft, and prospect lists. We're reentering that era to a degree, but with way different expectations and a way different fanbase.

And yes, here's Zim with the most infamous jersey of the Nats history:

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In case you would like to take a trip down memory lane, here is a Deadspin timeline of the Nats 2009 season.:

The 2009 Washington Nationals: A Season Of Bigger Failure

There are tons of links to articles documenting all the ups and down (really just the downs) of the 2009 season, including the jersey above and the sausage cannon. There are a handful of occurrences in there that I had forgotten all about.

What a savings

And there's a chance that things'll get weird
Yeah, that's a possibility

And 2022 tops (or bottoms) that 2009 year as the worst in franchise history. And tonight they have gone 40 straight games without a starter getting a win. That's inconceivable. And on pace to win 54 games for the year. It's hard to feel good about this team right now, with very few exceptions (Meneses especially). No Soto, but at least the farm is now top 10 (up from upper 20s).

Yikes!

(OK, back to getting excited about the Pry era!)

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Wait, really? Is that just a trick of the folds on the jersey, or did they really play with a misspelled name on the front of their jersey?

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

The whole team really played with jerseys that were missing the O. It was quite something.

What a savings

And there's a chance that things'll get weird
Yeah, that's a possibility

A very, veryyy small part of me misses Ray Knight fumbling around trying to break down a game and ultimately saying "they just need to hit the ball!" And then Johnny just kinda shaking his head in disbelief "oook, moving on."

Amateur superstar and idiot extraordinaire.

What a savings

And there's a chance that things'll get weird
Yeah, that's a possibility

70 was way too optimistic. Worst team in baseball. Worst team in Nats history. Worst NL East record ever. Worst SP ERA in baseball.

One word to describe Nat's season: pain.

And next year is going to be bad. Their off-season hinges on the sale of the team and it's unclear if or when that sale happens. They are in purgatory.

It's going to be awhile until Nats are good again, I think 3 to 4 years and that's totally dependent on whether they can get some sort of SP rotation in place.

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Good news on the labor front. There's been a huge shift in the tenor of the negotiations, and the union and the league were talking up to 2am this morning. They're planning to continue discussions today, with a new 5pm deadline for a full season. Things are looking up!

https://www.cbssports.com/mlb/news/mlb-lockout-progress-made-league-exte...

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

Some of the deets:

https://theathletic.com/live-blogs/mlb-lockout-talks-continue-late-witho...

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

i might be in the minority here, but not a fan of expanding the post-season again (i wasn't a fan of the most recent one either). Its taking away the relative importance of the regular season and it used to be something that baseball put more emphasis on than other leagues where a >=.500 record is enough to get you in the playoffs. This definitely increases the odds that my team can get in, but this feels more like lowering the bar rather than earning it the traditional way.

Considering the owners/league were pushing hard for a 14-team playoff, I'm satisfied with it only going to 12. I was never a fan of the one-game play-in, because, well, baseball. Too much variability with only one game, because you can easily get a team like last year's Dodgers bounced before given a real chance. If the 12 game model includes an actual series with the wild card teams, then I'll actually consider it an improvement over 10.

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

I'm ok with expanding if they go with a best of 3 wild card round played in back to back days right after the end of the season. I loathe the single elimination game coming out of a 162 game season.

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so no travel days? or all in the Division winner's stadium?

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All in the higher seed's home venue (lowest division winner and highest WC team per league)

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Some more info:

Details about MLB's proposal/today's talks:

  • MLB still very much wants an international draft, and is proposing it. That would be a major PA give.
  • MLB is willing to drop direct draft pick compensation for free agents. Also major.
  • MLB is at 5 picks on amateur draft lottery

Evan Drellich, Senior Writer, MLB

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

Not happy with either side... not hopeful for avoiding an opening day delay, and the public image damage has already been done... very frustrated with the league owners and the players association equally.

Here's an idea for both sides - instead of putting these discussions off to once every 5 to ten years with significant adjustments to the CBA, why not make minor adjustments and pre-determined escalations every year???? Would save everyone, including the fans, a lot of headaches.

Please remember, it's always the owners fault. They were willing to create their own unwritten free agent rules in the 90s and have worse teams, to avoid player movement and increase in salaries.

Always remember, a million seconds is 12 days, a billion seconds is 31 years. It's not even close on the amount of money these people have. The players have very specialized skills that are good for a limited time. The owners just have money.

Part of what they're negotiating would include yearly increases (or not increases) to things like the minimum salary, or luxury tax threshold, but this is the nature of CBA agreements. You can only have the agreements locked in for so long, because of the risk one side will get things too far in their favor. And when things end up in the favor of one side anyway, like it is in the owners' favor now, you end up having to change, or trying to change more structural things, and can't just rubber stamp percentage those scheduled increases. Then the game of chicken begins.

What you highlighted is what I think needs to change. Instead of having a multi-year CBA with major structural changes that occur every 10+ years, have a general agreement with mandatory financial re-baselining every offseason. Dealing with minor changes frequently would likely save a lot of time compared to major changes irregularly.

The intention isn't to have to make these structural changes that often even. The last strike/lockout in MLB was '94, which is a good run. Things around the industry just change over time. And yes, you'd hope they'd be able to keep up with those changes, and address them every five years, some times it just doesn't work out.

And some of the changes aren't just related to the luxury tax, or minimum salaries that you wouldn't be able to say, "raise it x% every year", so you've got those to deal with as well.

It would be great to have that every year incremental change, but there's more to it than that. There's a reason every major league has had a lockout within the past 20 years.

... and there goes the hopes of a 162-game season. Now that the Major line has been crossed it gets a lot easier to keep cancelling games.

A reminder that they can still play a 162 game season if MLB wants to. The canceled games can be rescheduled. The owners just don't care.

The announcement indicated that the cancelled series (the first two) will NOT be rescheduled.

They also had a hard deadline for an agreement to be made on Monday before it got pushed to Tuesday. It's all a negotiating ploy. MLB and the owners can have the games played if they want.

Maybe, but there's logistical challenges to making up 5 games. They can't push the end of the regular season because the post season already extends to the end of October. That leaves double headers and neither the owners nor the PA like double headers or starting the season without enough training (and that ship may have sailed with the announcement as stadiums may start to book other events).

The players have actually come out in favor of double headers to make all 162 games get in.

They could play the games as previously schedule if they come to an agreement within the next week, or so. There is zero chance a team is going to be book an event for a month from now that is anywhere close to as profitable as an MLB game. They could also push back the season a week if they had to. And, as was previously said, the players are willing to play doubleheaders. They actually want to play.

......Aaaaaand we're back

12 team playoff
Universal DH
Infield shift is banned
Pitch clock introduced
9 inning doubleheaders
elimination of runner starting on 2nd in extra innings
Players can only be optioned 5 times per season
minimum salary increases to $700k
Luxury Tax to rise from $230m to $244m over the next few years
Top 6 picks in the draft will be a lottery
Draft is capped at 20 rounds
Helmet and jersey ads implemented

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Don't like 12 team playoff because there'll be teams with losing records in it and have the situation with the NFL putting 7 seeds and having terrible games.
Don't mind Universal Dh.
Don't like ban on infield shift.
I didn't mind 7 inning doubleheaders, so indifferent with 9 inning doubleheaders.
Runner on 2nd in extra innings was a dumb gimmick that should've never been a thing.
I need to look up players only optioned 5 times per season for my thoughts on it.
I thought minimum salary was increased to $780k, I might have read it wrong.
Meh.
Never cared for lottery draft, maybe it helps with blatant tanking it might not IDK.
Meh.
Big OOF.

"Oi! What's a Horkie"
"I am ya Grot!"

"Horkies were made for two fings foighten' and winnen'" - Horkie Warboss

"That Gritty git doesn't exactly look like a Horkie, but by Gork and Mork it acts like one!"-Random Horkie Boy

I haven't looked at the exact breakdown of playoff spots, but last year, the Blue Jays, Mariners, and A's all had winning records in the AL and the Phillies and Reds could have made it from the NL with winning records. The Jays were 91-71 and fourth in the AL East. The Mariners were 90-72 and second in the West. There are good teams out there who should get a shot to play.

EDIT: Players being optioned only 5 times is a big ish change. Optioning is sending a player up or down for the minors in simple terms. Once those 5 are done, they are exposed to waivers and can be claimed by other teams. Broadly means you won't see people pop up and down as much throughout the season. May see the most impact on pitchers who would pop up to spell a bullpen or rotation. Means poor performing teams could snipe an okay player or two for their system more often and gets more players *potentially* to teams that want them in the big league.

Outspoken team cake advocate. Hates terrapins. Resident Macho Man Gif Poster. Distant cousin to Dork Magic. Frequently misspells words.

Don't like.
Hate - It's what made a reason to have two leagues and made things unique. Now it's just the same thing all around.
Don't hate it. Hopefully it will help making games more interesting.
Pitch clock - I'll wait to see how it's enforced. Could be good, could be bad, could be neutral
Double headers should have never stopped being 9 innings
Runner on second should have never been introduced
Hope it's something the players wanted
Don't care
Don't care
Don't care about top 6 picks being lottery
Drafting 20 players is still a lot, even with guys that don't sign
H.A.T.E. and I'm pissed that American sports have gone in this direction.

12 team playoff - Fine with it.
Universal DH - Sure. I get the people who want the NL to stay traditional, but it is at odds with multimillion dollar pitchers getting thrown at for unwritten rules. I get why owners and players want it.
Infield shift is banned - Hate it. Learn how to hit the ball to both sides of the field.
Pitch clock introduced - Meh? I think it largely gets ignored.
9 inning doubleheaders - Okay.
elimination of runner starting on 2nd in extra innings - I like it.
Players can only be optioned 5 times per season - Sure.
minimum salary increases to $700k - Not surprised.
Luxury Tax to rise from $230m to $244m over the next few years - Don't think this makes too big an impact.
Top 6 picks in the draft will be a lottery - Sure.
Draft is capped at 20 rounds - Fine.
Helmet and jersey ads implemented - I hope the money gets used to fund MiLB player's well being but I know it will just go to the owners.

Outspoken team cake advocate. Hates terrapins. Resident Macho Man Gif Poster. Distant cousin to Dork Magic. Frequently misspells words.

Dodgers going out of their way to prove a salary cap is desperately needed in baseball

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Everyone knew this was coming when the Braves signed Matt Olson. Freeman turned down a 5 year, $150 million deal.

It's Time to go to Work

And the funny thing is that given the differing tax rates between GA and CA, he's going to be making less money by taking the 6/162 in CA than by taking the 5/150 in GA. And if he was still producing, he'd have gotten a decent 1 or 2 year deal after the 5. It's almost like he expects to decline significantly before the 5 years is out. *smh*

I heard the best description of the Braves' acquisition of Olson earlier this week:

"The Braves didn't trade for Olson because they didn't want Freeman.
They traded for Olson because they didn't want Rizzo."

Accurate AF.

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

That picture makes me ill.

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

OPENING DAY!

It's going to be a cold and wet one for a lot of games today. Minnesota and Seattle was already postponed early because of snow (yes, really) and NY/Boston got pushed to tomorrow as well. I'll be surprised if the Nats and Mets get theirs in tonight.

As far as season predictions - I can't speak for any team other than the Twins. IF (big huge IF) Byron Buxton stays healthy he's a likely MVP candidate, and if the Twins pitching is above average then this team could finally get passed the Yankees in the playoffs. Those are two huge IFs, but I'm optimistic.

I'm just give Philly prediction.

Phillies: "Hey look at a couple new players we and still have Harper for a lot of runs."

Me: "What about bullpen?"

Phillies: "What do you mean 'What about bullpen?', we got Castellanos and Schwarber with Segura and Gregorius still in the lineup. Lots of runs".

Me: "Buuuut... If they have a slump anytime, don't score as much, and/or trying to hold on to leads from 7th innings onward, the bullpen can hold right"?

Phillies: "We got Brad Hand, you happy now?"

Me: "Fuck, now instead of an 83 win season it's now an 85 win season and still miss the playoffs".

"Oi! What's a Horkie"
"I am ya Grot!"

"Horkies were made for two fings foighten' and winnen'" - Horkie Warboss

"That Gritty git doesn't exactly look like a Horkie, but by Gork and Mork it acts like one!"-Random Horkie Boy

you almost had it, man. I'm impressed.

21st century QBs Undefeated vs UVA:
MV7, MV5, LT3, Braxton Burmeister, Ryan Willis, Josh Jackson, Jerod Evans, Michael Brewer, Tyrod Taylor, Sean Glennon, and Grant Noel. That's right, UVA. You couldn't beat Grant Noel.

I kind of have to thank Sports Shitposting YouTubers (Urinatingtree and Five Point Vids) for some of my predictions.

But in all seriousness, remembering my grandmother talking about the Phillies when she was a child in the 1930s/40s, my mom when she watched in the 70s-90s, and me watching from mid 2000s-present expectation seems to be just power hitting and starting pitchers while the bullpen is mid to atrocious.
Bullpen actually got better so they finally made it back to the playoff after 11 years.

"Oi! What's a Horkie"
"I am ya Grot!"

"Horkies were made for two fings foighten' and winnen'" - Horkie Warboss

"That Gritty git doesn't exactly look like a Horkie, but by Gork and Mork it acts like one!"-Random Horkie Boy

Bullpen work showed what can happen when it goes wrong today. Phillies up 1. See what happens next.

dunk crying of how the fuck Phils made it to NLDs with that bullpen and facing against a hot Cards team. I want them to beat braves or mets, just please give it to me.

"Oi! What's a Horkie"
"I am ya Grot!"

"Horkies were made for two fings foighten' and winnen'" - Horkie Warboss

"That Gritty git doesn't exactly look like a Horkie, but by Gork and Mork it acts like one!"-Random Horkie Boy

The Phils are a team sneakily built for playoff success. 2 or 3 excellent starters in the rotation, a few excellent pieces in the bullpen, and an extremely potent offense that isn't as bad in the field as they have been in recent years.

I don't know if I pick them to beat the Braves, but it wouldn't shock me. They have the starting pitching to go deep, and that's dangerous.

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The Nats roster is pretty embarrassing and not much in the pipeline either other than Cade Cavalli. This year is all about how well the retreads (err, Veterans) play and their trade value come summertime to get in more young talent. 60-65 wins seems likely.

For Nats fan, what to watch and enjoy in 2022:
1. Juan Soto. He is so enjoyable to watch every at bat. And MVP is always possible.
2. Development of young stars: Keibert Ruiz, Josiah Gray, and Lane Thomas.
3. Call up of Cade Cavalli. Most anticipated call-up for Nats since Strasburg.
4. Trade value of veterans. There is a lot of trade potential of this team. Major players to watch for trade value: Nelson Cruz and Josh Bell.
5. Former National greats back again to revive their careers: Sean Doolittle, Tyler Clippard, and Anibal Sanchez. Will any succeed?
6. The enigma that is Patrick Corbin and the health of Stephen Strasburg. Competent seasons from both will be needed for this team to have any chance to get to 70+ wins.
7. Young players that were once the future, but now seem headed for AAAA: Victor Robles, Carter Keiboom (on 60-day IL), Erick Fedde, Austin Voth, and Luis Garcia. The time is now for these players to show they belong in the majors.

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Just saw that the Lerners are exploring the possibility of selling the Nats. Very interested to see if they do decide to sell and who potential buyers may be. I hope, if they sell, that whoever buys starts things off on the right foot and sign Soto to a long-term deal.

Link.

Former Hokie makes the All Star game. He's having a phenomenal year so far.

It's Time to go to Work

First Hokie to make the All Star game since Joe Saunders in 2008!

Hopefully we'll start to see a lot more Hokies in MLB with our recent success. Gavin Cross is still projected to be a first round pick in the draft later this month.

Gavin Cross is still projected to be a first round pick in the draft later this month.

Yep. Projected to go top 10. Which means the Braves can't draft him. =_^(

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

The Nats will be there. Probably drafting top 5. But too many holes on the mound and in the infield to select an OF, but they may draft who they think is the best player. Question is whether they can develop any of these drafted prospects when so many have flamed out the past decade.

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Packy Naughton and Chad Pinder are both in the Majors. I could see either of them making the All Star game, especially Packy Naughton since he is just in his second season in the Majors. The more Hokies in professional baseball the better!

It's Time to go to Work

Why, and how, is Albert Pujols an all-star?

The commissioner can now make "legacy selections" to the all-star game. I believe it's one per league. He chose Albert and Miguel Cabrera.

I don't think it takes up any normal slots. It's just adding on a spot to honor Pujols and his career in his final season.

It's Time to go to Work

Juan Soto turns down largest offer in MLB history, 15 years and $440 million. Love what he did during the World Series run, but see ya Juan, it's clear you don't want to be in DC. No longer a fan of his. Greedy bastard.

You will see this game, this upset and this sign next on ESPN Sportscenter. Virginia Tech 31 Miami 7

His decision was made after a phone call with longtime Virginia Tech assistant coach Bud Foster. All Foster told him was, "We win. They don't."

With nothing deferred, he would've been in DC until retirement. I guess he didn't want to be part of the rebuild, but it also is a slap in the face to the organization that drafted him and gave him his first paycheck.

I wonder if there is any agent play like there seems to have been in the Freddie Freeman ordeal.

It's Scott Boras. That's all you need to know.

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

It's also only a $29.6 AAV, which wouldn't be in the top 20 right now, there's going to be new ownership coming in, and the Nationals don't currently have a path back to contention. Why would he lock himself in for the rest of his career right now?

I mean I made sure to get out of the DC/NOVA area. I don't blame him

Implied /s

No longer a fan of his. Greedy bastard.

Be a fan of his or not, but learn the current baseball market. Take a deal for 15 years that isn't even in the current top 20 by AAV?

Any player that agrees to that would be excoriated internally by the players Union, for starters

Especially a player like Soto who is super young, popular and one of the best in the game. He easily deserves a top 5 AAV contract. Also, he probably is looking for a contract that allows him to get a second big contract.

Timing is a key issue. Nobody wants to be FA in the mid 30s and honestly early 30s isn't as ideal either. Boras is known to desire contracts that take their client into their late 30s, resulting in a contract that essentially take his client into retirement. In fact, with Harper, Boras turned down $40M+ AAV from the Dodgers for 5 years or so (until his early 30s) and instead went with the longer term contract he signed with the Phillies.

Soto is in a more unique spot than Harper, being a year or so younger than Harper when called up. Would Soto and Boras take top AAV for short amount of time, 3-5 years? Or are they only looking at that retirement contract? Based on Boras's history, more likely a retirement contract, but who knows.

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This. If the offer had been for 10 years with a top 5-10 AAV, he signs it.

But it wasn't, so he didn't. Given his age he is looking for a shorter duration to cash in again on a second deal.

I know people get fired up about what athletes make, but if I was literally one of the best in the world at what I do...I'd get every dollar the market would bear.

If the offer had been for 10 years with a top 5-10 AAV, he signs it.

I don't think he would. That contract would end at age 33, which isn't a great age to negotiate a contract. By many metrics, he's the most prolific 23-year old player ever. That demands both high AAV and long-term.

To sign him, I'm guessing it will take a contract until late 30s and top 3 AAV. And someone will pay it, because he is that good. There is an outside chance he takes highest ever AAV for a short duration, but I honestly don't see why he would take such a risk.

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WTOP had a decent article on the fallout with an organization-oriented perspective on it.

https://wtop.com/washington-nationals/2022/07/exploring-juan-soto-trades...

BLUF is that IF he gets traded, it would / could be a monumental shift if the Nats rebuild effort and they could essentially get a half-lineup full of talent and prospects. Granted these trades are very hypothetical, but there aren't many teams that can make that type of commitment to trade and a sign a deal with Soto for what he's valued at. Basically I think this comes down to the Yankees and the Dodgers, and if a trade cannot get worked then Soto runs through his rookie contract, signs a new deal 2 1/2 years from now, and the Nats get nothing (I think I have that timing correct).

I dont blame either side for how this is working out. Soto needs to lookout for himself, and the Nats need to protect the organization - both of those views are opposed to one another right now.

Basically I think this comes down to the Yankees and the Dodgers...

The Mets could do this, and that's what bothers me. If they do, I hope the Nats drive up the value for an intra-division trade.

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

Basically I think this comes down to the Yankees and the Dodgers, and if a trade cannot get worked then Soto runs through his rookie contract, signs a new deal 2 1/2 years from now, and the Nats get nothing (I think I have that timing correct).

It's not now or never. Soto could be traded next year or the year after. But, with the Nats essentially 3-5 years from contending again (maybe more), having Soto on this roster does nothing for them for the next 2 years. So, the Nats are looking at this with the perspective of either lock him up long-term or get max value. In order to get max value for Soto, you trade him now with two more years of arbitration, but his value will still be super high next year and the year after.

Honestly, I don't think any team will meet the needs to acquire Soto. A trade partner needs to be willing to unload crazy value for the next 2 years plus extra to have the solitary rights to negotiate with Soto long-term.

I think ultimately no trade happens this year and we have a summer and 2023 year of speculation of Soto trades. The Nats get new ownership and they offer him the deal he deserves, because Besos gets what he wants.

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100% agree - he's still under team control and there's no deadline to get a trade done before this year's deadline. I think the scenario you outlined is more probable - at his age and current value, we're talking about an organizational-shifting trade (not baseball, but think back to the Hershel Walker trade between the Vikes and Cowboys), and I dont know that any team has the pockets deep enough and the willingness to take that risk. I think Soto works his value up next year, waits out the org change, tries again for max value with a much smaller term (~5-7 years) and he'll be on the market again before the age of 30.

If anything, Soto's value will decrease next year. Not because his ability will decrease, but because the team trading for him will have him for less time. If a trade happens before the deadline, a team will be acquiring him for three postseasons; a trade this offseason will make him available for only two. And it's the postseason that's the reason a team will give up a big-time haul for him. They'll want him to put their team over the hump and win the World Series.

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

Gavin Cross goes to the Royals at number 9.

Twins select Tanner Schobel with 68th pick

โ€œI'm addicted to placebos. I could quit, but it wouldn't matterโ€~steven wright

What this does is allow most all of the pitchers to get into the game. Previously, teams had to hold back pitchers in case it went to extra innings, which sucks for the pitchers. Now managers can sub them all in without worrying about holding some back.

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

The Baltimore Orioles drafted Graham Firoved in the 16th round today.

https://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/orioles/bs-sp-2022-mlb-draft-orioles...

That means 5 total Hokies were drafted in the 2022 MLB Draft:
Gavin Cross - 1st round (9th overall) - Kansas City Royals
Tanner Schoebel - Competitive Balance B (68th overall) - Minnesota Twins
Nick Biddison - 4th round (135th overall) - Los Angeles Dodgers
Cade Hunter - 5th round (153rd overall) - Cincinnati Reds
Graham Firoved - 16th round (467th overall) - Baltimore Orioles

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Couldn't be happier for Joe!

It's Time to go to Work

Braves back in 1st place for NL East. At least they give me something happy to watch right now.

This didn't age well, but we're close again. 1/2 game back as of this morning!

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

Aged perfectly!

Vroom Vroom

At least one of my dreams came to fruition during the sports season. I get to at least see a playoff game at the Battery again. It was electric last year. Only time I've ever felt that type of energy was walking into big games at Lane.

Braves sweep the Mets, win the NL East. God is in his heaven, and all is right with the world right now.

Oh, and postseason picture is set. Games start Friday.

Wild Card Series start times and TV:

And HAHA METS! SUCK IT!

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

LETS GO BRAVES!!!

Bleeding burnt orange and chicago maroon

Very excited that they clinched the division (again) not just because they get a bye, but the chance of them playing Phillies in 2nd/NLDC round. Thinking about making drive up there since games 3 and 4 (if necessary) are Friday and Saturday night next week

Bleeding burnt orange and chicago maroon

That was my thought as well. If the Phillies win, I'll probably drive up there for one of the games.

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

Totally going to send that to my Mets fan coworker. LMAO!

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

The freeze was fun! We were in the stands that day. There was a solid ooh then a laugh in our section. Figures it would live in meme infamy now.

Even for his faults, he is a pretty cool guy. We lived close to him prior to his new move. Very nice property he has.

Orioles finish with a winning record and were actually in the hunt for a wild-card berth with 5 games remaining until the Seattle walk-off win. I definitely didn't see any of that coming. For those who have teams in the postseason, enjoy the ride! I'm still marveling at 83 wins...

Orioles made a great leap forward this year. They're going to be really good in a couple of years.

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

Yes. It's one thing to have back to back to back top5 picks. It's another to make them count, and the orioles have done that. They play in the toughest division in the sport though.

Orioles fans should expect some of their players get called up to the big leagues if the Yankees, Dodgers or Mets have any holes to fill.

Well those aren't the best teams money can buy for nothing.

The doll's trying to kill me and the toaster's been laughing at me.

Hoping my Yanks can finally get over the hump and get to the WS. The recent July/August slump lowered my expectations, but I'm still optimistic about a good playoff run.

โญโญโญโญโญโญ #YNWA

If they'd have won last night, that would have the first time ever there were five 100-game winners. As it is, this is only the second time there were four 100-game winners (along with 2019).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Major_League_Baseball_100_win_seasons

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

and so concludes another season for the Twins where one hot month kept them in the hunt while just about everything went wrong after that. They need to fire the entire medical staff and get a new bench coach that can talk some sense into Rocco... or just fire Rocco.

Let's go Mets! I don't understand why so many of my best friends are Braves fans, that was one brutal way to end the season. Nightmare scenario, really. Truist Park has become a House of Horrors over the years. Unbelievable. If DeGrom and Max can get some rest and come back like before, we'll make some October noise!
2X HR derby King
2 generational talents at pitcher
NL batting king
4th time in franchise history going over 100 wins

Get Starling Marte back from a broken finger, watch out. Putting the rest of MLB on noticeโ€”>

If it ain't orange, it better be maroon...and if it ain't maroon, it better be soon!

Getting through the National League playoff gauntlet is going to be brutal, whoever ends up making it through.

The Dodgers, Astros and Braves are probably better teams overall, but I sure as hell wouldn't want to have to face Scherzer and deGrom four times in a seven-game series.

The doll's trying to kill me and the toaster's been laughing at me.

Marte missing and Max not being 100 seemed to doom them in the Braves series. I was there for the DeGrom night. If they get hot in the playoffs they're a tough out. Everyone saw it to start the season.

Crazy how quickly the world turns upside down. One week ago, 1 win from division champs. Now, one game away from being eliminated in the WC.

Mad Max doesn't seem right; he was shelled tonight. $43 million contract, and he has allowed 5 HR's in his last 13 innings.

We'll see what tomorrow holds, but when you depend on your aces to deliver and they don't, paired with an anemic offense, the Mets aren't going anywhere but to the couchโ€”in a hurry.

If it ain't orange, it better be maroon...and if it ain't maroon, it better be soon!

I'm just happy the Phillies are there. Especially after they tried so hard not to be.

A bit depressing that Pujols, Molina, and Wainwright are STILL on the Cardinals 11 years later. Now if some of those big free agent bats would wake up...

21st century QBs Undefeated vs UVA:
MV7, MV5, LT3, Braxton Burmeister, Ryan Willis, Josh Jackson, Jerod Evans, Michael Brewer, Tyrod Taylor, Sean Glennon, and Grant Noel. That's right, UVA. You couldn't beat Grant Noel.

I was glad to hear the announcers calling out the fans leaving after the Cards gave up the initial runs. Maybe it is just me, but if I paid money for a seat I stay til the end.

Yeah I'd never leave a playoff game, no matter what happened. "best fans in baseball" my chinny chin chin

21st century QBs Undefeated vs UVA:
MV7, MV5, LT3, Braxton Burmeister, Ryan Willis, Josh Jackson, Jerod Evans, Michael Brewer, Tyrod Taylor, Sean Glennon, and Grant Noel. That's right, UVA. You couldn't beat Grant Noel.

I'm impressed how much people focus on cardinals fans more than just the cardinals.

People leave games when crazy things happen and it seems like their team is going to lose. Cardinals fans are not unique in this. I'm glad you, Beard, would not ever leave a playoff game. Good for you! Lots of fans of every team might leave though. Welcome to sports.

As far as the baseball goes, this is the Cardinals' downfall. Gotta score more than 2 runs if you expect to win. Also, weird use of the closer (Helsley), asking him to get five outs when his fingers are numb.

On to game 2.

edit: shouldn't have been rude like that, regardless of how I thought you were treating me.

21st century QBs Undefeated vs UVA:
MV7, MV5, LT3, Braxton Burmeister, Ryan Willis, Josh Jackson, Jerod Evans, Michael Brewer, Tyrod Taylor, Sean Glennon, and Grant Noel. That's right, UVA. You couldn't beat Grant Noel.

To be fair to beard, I mentioned it first so you can be upset at me if you want. Sure, every fan base has it, but you can still knock it. Just as we make fun of lolUVA.

Guess we will see how tonight unfolds.

Edit: 2 hall of famers went down as such. Played til the very end. End of an era there for sure. As Bears said, meant no disrespect.

Yup. After 11 years I'm just glad they're playing meaningful games in October again.

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Updated postseason bracket:

First two games of each series:

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

I like that all the intradivision teams are playing each other, ensuring that the NLCS and ALCS are teams of different divisions.

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Wow, I wonder if the yankees will beat cleveland in the post season? must see TV

Tough matchup. We did well against them in the regular season, but their starters have really come around late in the season. I think all three starters are sub 3.5 ERA, two of them are sub 3. It'll come down to whose offense will awaken finally.

โญโญโญโญโญโญ #YNWA

It's baseball, where almost any team can get hot for 5 or 6 games. Literally no postseason result shocks me in the MLB playoffs.

The doll's trying to kill me and the toaster's been laughing at me.

Exactly! There is no team that I take lightly in the playoffs. That team is there for a reason.

โญโญโญโญโญโญ #YNWA

Braves lock up another one. Spencer Strider gets 6 years, $75MM, with a club option for $22MM.

Surprised that Fried wasn't the first pitcher to get locked up long term, but I'm happy with this. #ChopOn

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

I have to past the link into Chrome, and then I can do it through there.

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Let's friggin go, Phils!

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As an Astros fan, I admit I'm not sorry at all to see the Phillies knock the Braves out.

Of course, I said that last year when the Braves eliminated the Dodgers and that didn't turn out so well, so...

The doll's trying to kill me and the toaster's been laughing at me.

Of course, I said that last year when the Braves eliminated the Dodgers and that didn't turn out so well, so...

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

Both the Padres and Phillies are hot right now. I don't think I would want either in the WS.

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The Padres are the only thing giving me hope in my world of sports right now.

Ring Design Chair

3rd base ump can be very thankful he didn't screw Phillie like he just screwed padres on that call in the 9th.

Directions from Blacksburg to whoville, go north till you smell it then go east until you step in it

That was a bad call. Benefited my boys, but that was rough

I mean, on replay he went. Broke the plane of the plate, bat was past the body, and tip of the bat past the wrists.

It was a very close play but the ump got it right

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A Schwarbomb after Schwarber caught the first pitch from Matt Stairs to start the game.

Segura with a brutal error and comes back with the winning 2 run single and some great diving plays.

Two wins away and the next 2 are at home.

Just some magic going on with this team.

If you told me in June the Phils were going to be 2 games away from the NL pennant I would ask you what year you were talking about, because no damn way that happens this season.

This run is something else. Completely out of nowhere. I'm trying to remain even keel and not let myself get hope, but they're making it REALLY hard right now.

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In the last 30 calendar days, the Phillies are 11-10.

It just so happens that includes 7-2 in the playoffs, lol. Baseball is a funny sport

Bryce Harper is pretty decent

Here lies It's a Stroman Jersey I Swear, surpassed in life by no one because he intercepted it.

He's earned his contract with this playoff run. And good for Harper and the Phils. Talent was never the question. Consistency and value was, and it took some maturation for him to get where he is today.

That Juan Soto guy isn't bad either.

It's kind of crazy that the two of the best RFs in the game came up through the Nats organization and now contributing playoff success somewhere else. With the Nats dismantled, it's definitely more fun to watch the playoff when former Nats succeed.

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I can't believe the Nats had Harper, Soto, and Turner and somehow pissed it all away. They should be a dynasty right now

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Well, first of all, they won a World Series. So that's not exactly pissing it all away. Second, there are at least a few teams in baseball that have 3+ hitters in their lineup just as good or better than those three, so I wouldn't say having Harper, Soto and Turner should necessarily result in a dynasty.

Harper is a very good hitter and is having a great postseason. But he's also arguably the most overrated player in MLB.

Congrats to the Phillies, though! They've certainly earned they WS berth.

The doll's trying to kill me and the toaster's been laughing at me.

Harper is a very good hitter and is having a great postseason. But he's also arguably the most overrated player in MLB.

Yeah, the 'he is soooo overrated' is a take that is proving to be worse and worse by the day at this point.

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They never were all on the same team. Each left under different circumstances.

But even if they were all on the team right now, they would've only won about 60 to 70 games this year. Their pitching core is a nightmare and they had too many holes in the lineup.

The only current dynasties are the Dodgers and Astros. Both dynasties are built on homegrown influx of young talent, elite pitching, and a spattering of high quality signings/trades. Ultimately, it's their scouting and development that's allowed both of those teams to maintain their elite status.

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PHILLIES!!!!!!!!

Oh my God I can't believe this run

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When the Braves lost to them I was wondering what happened. That darn team is hot right now. They've played out of their minds. Shows how hard the NL East was this year. Good luck in the WS even if I generally dislike Philly teams with a passion.

I can't believe it. We were so bad under Girardi. Our bullpen is supposed to suck out loud and we won 2 NLCS bullpen heavy games. This is insanity.

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backed into the playoffs, barged into everything since.

I can't believe this is real life.

21st century QBs Undefeated vs UVA:
MV7, MV5, LT3, Braxton Burmeister, Ryan Willis, Josh Jackson, Jerod Evans, Michael Brewer, Tyrod Taylor, Sean Glennon, and Grant Noel. That's right, UVA. You couldn't beat Grant Noel.

Not a Phillies phan, but rooting for you guys.

If you feel the leather in your hand let it rip.

How can you not be romantic about baseball? Dude blacked out the second the ball hit the bat

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If that home run was in a movie, it would seem way too cliched.

But as it went down, it feels like the baseball gods said "Nah, this is happening".

I love that Castellanos said that as he watched him round the bases, that Harper was the calmest guy in the stadium. He was made for that moment

I genuinely think we are watching him have an out of body experience during this video. When we watched the replay later last night, my wife made the comment that he looked stunned that he did it, you can see in the dugout afterwards they had the cameras on him and he was just muttering "I did that.... I did that... Oh my gosh, I did that"

I would not be shocked if he doesn't remember rounding the bases. His body went into auto pilot the moment the bat hit the ball.

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I believe it. He's the best baseball player on the planet at the moment (no offense to Verlander) but he's still just a guy like the rest of us too.

That's literally a moment every kid playing baseball in the backyard pretends they are having.

I can't believe that here is this dude that committed to Philly (on what looks like a team friendly deal now) to have this kind of moment, and he freakin did it.

I was about to say his first couple seasons were mediocre, but I think my memory was clouded by the fact that he continued to be average by his standards. And Bryce's standards are lofty. Looking at some of the other contracts that have been signed in recent history compared to the team's performance (e.g. Carlos Correa) then absolutely - he's under a super team friendly contract.

Machado - 10 years $300M with an opt out
Harper - 13 years $330M with no opt out

I know it seems weird to say a guy is underpaid when someone gives them a $330M check, but the way salaries are rising...

Machado will get some team to pay up after year 6 and overpay for his waning years.

Phillies got a superstar for life that will be way underpaid in his waning years. Guy became a legend last night, and if somehow this run continues for 4 more...forget it.

I also wouldn't be entirely shocked if the Phils are able to land some more big free agents this winter. The postseason crowd has been otherworldly during this run, and with the ownership absolutely not afraid to spend money to win, I could easily see a couple big names trying to get on board to be a part of it again. And that is all on the atmosphere that getting Bryce Harper created within the franchise.

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Where do they actually need to upgrade? I haven't really paid attention to the Phils at all but just a quick glance at the stats and maybe they need to look at the middle infield? Middle rotation pitching? A closer?

Bullpen is still a bit questionable. Right now its working because they are able to go to Eflin to come in every night, but he should be a starter. And there isn't a whole lot for them to use outside of Dominguez, Alvarado, and Robertson. I mean that's going to be good enough most nights in the playoffs, but they still need to get in, and probably need another arm or 2, and maybe another starter to really help push them over 162 games into a playoff spot next year.

And I am just laughing at the serial downvoter who is singling me out in this thread. Stay bitter.

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probably a Padres fan

I just think it's hilarious that I've somehow managed to piss off someone to that extent.

Feels like a badge of honor

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I imagine that it's an estranged child of Mike Schmidt who scours the internet downvoting all things Phillies.

The doll's trying to kill me and the toaster's been laughing at me.

My thought before this run was they go all out for Trea Turner. But Stott might be the answer for many years moving forward. The question becomes do they move Stott to 2nd, cut ties with Segura?

They could still use a center fielder, but just like the Eagles this roster got good in a hurry and they have some really good young arms in the farm system.

I mean, you can't cut ties with Segura, at least not yet. He definitely has his hiccups at times, but when he's on he's a guy you need in the lineup. As long as ownership is willing to pay, keep him around and maybe make that final determination in 2024 to see if Stott is ready.

And maybe you still go after Trea Turner, because if he's willing, why the hell not. At that point, Segura becomes expendable and maybe leverage this playoff run to get something good in a winter trade.

This roster is still pretty young, so they could be good for a while. Just need to have a bit more patience and don't completely mortgage the future for immediate success like Ruben did from 2009-2012.

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When it comes to salaries of these standards, my thought process is that they are only worth it if they perform in the playoffs. And honestly, it only takes one world series run that ends in a ring to be worth it. If the Phillies close, then it's worth it. It'll be debatable if it ends up being only one run that didn't turn into a ring.

Phillies got a superstar for life that will be way underpaid in his waning years

There is no way of knowing this now. Not that I wish anything on anyone, but he could get an injury or a string of injuries that prevent him from performing at a MLB level. Or, he could just lose his swing in the latter years. But again, if he gets a ring, then I don't think it matters how he plays 6/7 years from now. At least that's how I feel about Strasburg (and to a much lesser degree Corbin) with his albatross contract.

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Or, he could just lose his swing in the latter years.

Father Time is still undefeated. Just a matter of when he catches up.

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

My new question/metric in deciding if the Yankees are advancing in the playoffs. Are the Twins in?

Not sure exactly what the Phillies were picking up on McCullers, But my goodness.

That place was fire last night

I also read his leg kick height was different too. Wish more teams studied like this.

โญโญโญโญโญโญ #YNWA

I think it was both actually. Glove and leg were at different locations depending on the pitch. Listening to Pedro discuss this he was not surprised at all that Philly teed off. He almost went so far as to say he shouldn't be pitching in the big leagues if his tell was this bad.

Every team does this. It's just amplified in the post-season and especially the WS. In the 2019 WS between Astros and Nats, Strasburg was tipping his pitches and got shelled in the first inning and luckily only gave up 2 runs. The pitching coach told Strasburg he was tipping his pitches by the way he held is glove before going in motion, a bad habit he had done during bad stretch of outings in the regular season . Strasburg adjusted (he wiggled his glove prior to going into motion on each pitch), and proceeded to dominate the rest of the game.

The 2019 WS was also the year that Astros still had not yet been caught for stealing signs via video, but the teams around the league had caught on. The Yankees and Dodgers informed the Nats before the WS, and the Nats developed a super elaborate sequence of signs that was adjusted each inning to prevent the Astros from being able to cheat.

Teams study, scout, and do their due diligence. It's just not a regular part of the conversation as it's not generally not obvious and most teams are super good at self-scouting.

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Smoltz pointed out that he had only thrown 2 fastballs against lefties in the postseason so far. When guys like Harper and Schwarber are able to eliminate everything but a breaking pitch when at the plate, you're asking for trouble.

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Side note, the Fox broadcast has been fantastic. Joe Davis has made some great calls, and Smoltz just knows baseball. It's been a pleasure to listen to them.

And don't get me started on #RangerDanger

Between Smoltz and Romo, I'm not sure how to feel about guys I used to absolutely hate on the field being such good and insightful commentators in the box.

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I met Smoltz out here at the Waste Management Open years ago (he's a huge golfer and was promoting something). The guy could not have been nicer, he signed a cap for my son and since then I've been a fan.

He was calling the pitches last night, so no surprise the best baseball player on the planet figured it out immediately.

Dan Orlovsky (yeah that one) was a giddy fanboy listening to Smoltz's commentary leading up to Harper's first at bat. BLUF: Smoltz said Harper was going to sit on a breaking ball, and Harper got the breaking ball on the first pitch and it landed in the seats.

Ken Rosenthal of the Athletic doesn't think he was tipping his pitches (can't link, paywalled). It was a combination of good tendency scouting by the Phillies and McCullers missing the spot on some pitches. That, and he doesn't throw fastballs to lefties.

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

There were obvious conversations between the batters in the dugout. And they were super coy about those conversations during and after the game. They were picking up on something more than just tendency scouting. The glove height was also clearly different between his slider and curveball; the glove height on the sinker was more like the slider (just below), but as you mentioned, he doesn't throw that against lefties.

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I'll give McCullers credit for just saying that he got shelled.

But his glove position and leg kick were giving things away. As a fan I didn't notice it until seeing a full breakdown by multiple former professional pitchers.

But the hitters for the Phillies obviously picked it up almost right away. That's why you pay a lot of scouts

Whats up with the grass in the Philly outfield? Looks like a significant chunk was either damaged or replaced, like a concert was played on it last week.

LETS GOOOO. LET'S GO

I must have read a thousand faces
I must have robbed them of their cause
Sickened thirst, Sickened thirst
Keeps it together
Soft white glow in the cranium
A bullseye made sedated

I think is Braves doesn't resign Swanson that Trea Turner is gonna land him

I must have read a thousand faces
I must have robbed them of their cause
Sickened thirst, Sickened thirst
Keeps it together
Soft white glow in the cranium
A bullseye made sedated

I think is Braves doesn't resign Swanson that Trea Turner is gonna land him

Soooo.....you're shipping Swanson and Turner?

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

My bad I meant Braves get Trea๐Ÿ˜‚

I must have read a thousand faces
I must have robbed them of their cause
Sickened thirst, Sickened thirst
Keeps it together
Soft white glow in the cranium
A bullseye made sedated

I mean I'm bummed, but I didn't expect the Phils to advance past the NLDS, so a run to the World Series this year was a hell of a thing to witness.

I like the core the team has. Under Thompson they've been one of the 4 best teams in the league since June, record-wise, and with an owner willing to pay (they're already the 4th or 5th highest payroll), this won't be the last time this Phils team makes a run.

I'm gonna wear my Phillies World Series merch with pride going forward. We had no business being there. What a heck of a run, proud of the team and glad we could watch them play meaningful games in October again.

This is my school
This is home

Even tho I'm a Astros fan this Phillies team was fun to watch and I was legit scared of every Phillies hitter's in the lineup ๐Ÿ˜‚

I must have read a thousand faces
I must have robbed them of their cause
Sickened thirst, Sickened thirst
Keeps it together
Soft white glow in the cranium
A bullseye made sedated

Time to spend some Stupid Money(TM) and fill some of those holes in the batting order

21st century QBs Undefeated vs UVA:
MV7, MV5, LT3, Braxton Burmeister, Ryan Willis, Josh Jackson, Jerod Evans, Michael Brewer, Tyrod Taylor, Sean Glennon, and Grant Noel. That's right, UVA. You couldn't beat Grant Noel.

As an Astros fan, I have to say I gained a ton of respect for the Phillies the last week and a half. I watched a lot of Astros games this year, and I saw them just shut teams down a bunch of times. But Philly gave them all they could handle, and then some.

If someone didn't watch the games, they could think that it wasn't that close, because the Astros won the last 3 and it didn't go a full 7 games. But anyone who watched the games knows Philly absolutely could have won that series. There were about 2-3 plays that if they go a different way, I think Philly wins the series. The Trey Mancini play at first in the 8th inning and the Chas McCormick center field catch in the 9th in game 5 - if either of those guys don't make those outs, Philly wins game 5 and Houston is playing just to stay alive in game 6.

You should definitely wear your Phillies gear with pride, because that's a team that looks like it's going to be a WS contender for the next few years. And speaking of gear, those blue game 5 throwback unis might be the best looking baseball uniform I've ever seen.

The doll's trying to kill me and the toaster's been laughing at me.

You gonna get any championship gear? I went ahead and copped a sweatshirt

I must have read a thousand faces
I must have robbed them of their cause
Sickened thirst, Sickened thirst
Keeps it together
Soft white glow in the cranium
A bullseye made sedated

I still can't believe we got there at all. A month ago we were staring a 5th straight final-month collapse dead in the face. Then they bulldozed their way through everyone until the Astros. I'm still kind of flabbergasted at the contrast between the regular season Phils and the postseason Phils. Sucks that we lost of course, but the whole entire postseason was house money as far as I'm concerned.

And yes, the powder blues are straight fire.

21st century QBs Undefeated vs UVA:
MV7, MV5, LT3, Braxton Burmeister, Ryan Willis, Josh Jackson, Jerod Evans, Michael Brewer, Tyrod Taylor, Sean Glennon, and Grant Noel. That's right, UVA. You couldn't beat Grant Noel.

I'm not too surprised. The Phils have a great set of players at the top of the rotation and pen and their lineup can mash the ball. When you shorten the bullpen and only go 4 starters in the playoffs, that played right into our makeup. Unfortunately, I think they just got a bit gassed at the end, with Nola and Wheeler not able to bring it fully like you'd expect.

One more elite arm in the rotation and another 1 or 2 arms in the pen and you could have a 1-4 rotation of Wheeler-Nola-_____-Suarez and that would be filthy in the playoffs. Supposedly the best player in Japan wants to play for the Phils next year, and he's a guy with power who is elite at getting on base. Maybe you bring him in and move Schwarber to DH and just have a lineup that might be the most potent in all of baseball next year.

This is my school
This is home

I knew nothing about the Phillies going into this series, but I watched them closely for 6 games (minus the 2nd half of the "home run game" that I'd like to scrub from my memory). Here's my take:

Starting pitching is very good, the guy that seemed to handcuff the Astros the best was Suarez, but no doubt Nola and Wheeler are studs. You could probably use another couple of bullpen arms, but who couldn't? Even the Astros had a bunch of relievers inexplicably have career years this season. They aren't usually that deep.

The lineup scared me with hitters 1-4. And #4 literally terrified me, so I withdraw my overrated comment about Harper from a couple of weeks ago! He's not the best hitter in baseball, but when healthy he's top 5-10 (that's not an insult, Judge, Trout, Otani and 5-6 others are no slouches!). You need someone to hit behind him, though. If you had someone like Bregman or Tucker at 5, like the Astros have behind Alvarez, teams would have to think twice about throwing around Harper.

I'm confused why Schwarber leads off. He's a total masher, but his .323 OBP is terrible for a leadoff hitter. You guys could use a true leadoff hitter with speed who gets on base. Then you could move Schwarber back to the 3 or 5 slot, if you want to keep Harper at 4 (I'd consider Harper at 3 and Schwarber at cleanup). One more dangerous bat and the Phillies would be really scary.

I'd consider going after Carlos Correa, he'd be great at SS for you guys. And Verlander is a free agent, although I'm hoping the Astros offer him something like a 2-year/$50 million deal.

The doll's trying to kill me and the toaster's been laughing at me.

That World Series was fantastic.

I'm a Philly fan, and I'm down of course on the loss, but you have to make the World Series to lose the World Series. There will be an NL pennant going up over Citizens Bank and that means something. I got to watch a bunch of games with my 8 year old son and teach him more about baseball, and listen to him yell "Schwarbomb!". It was worth it, even without winning it all.

Hats off to the Astros. Your pitching was the difference. But I will head into next season excited to see what this team can do.

And yes, the powder blue uniforms are absolute fire.

"Schwarbomb!"

Schwarber is so easy to root for. I loved his half a season with the Nats and all his leadoff schwarbombs.

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Seriously. If you can't root for Kyle Schwarber, then sports might not be for you.

I think he might have been the most key signing the Phillies made in years. Obviously Bryce Harper is ridiculous (and a really good dude), but Schwarber seems like the "glue guy" that a locker room needs

I genuinely think the Phils powder blues are the best looking jerseys in all of sports. They are sublime, and they absolutely should be our full time look going forward. Maroon and that blue just work, it's beyond time to make that switch.

As for the team itself, it feels like it's the beginning of them taking that next step and learning how to win. I wouldn't be shocked to see them spend big this winter and come into next year with a dominant team. This run showed they are close, just need to build on it.

This is my school
This is home

I genuinely think the Phils powder blues are the best looking jerseys in all of sports.

I was thinking exactly the same thing during game 5. If I bought a baseball jersey that would be the one, and I'm not a Phillies fan at all.

The doll's trying to kill me and the toaster's been laughing at me.

I'm with you. The Phillies we're on my radar all year but I finally watched them closely in the playoff series where they beat the Cardinals.
They're just a well rounded team. Take pitchers deep in counts and have a good balance of power and OBP, pitching and defense. The NL East is the most fun division in baseball (NL Central of course being the worst... teams all suck and are boring... but I digress), and adding a good Phillies team to that for the next few years is gonna make it even better.

They were playing some amazing baseball the last month, but that's what it takes to get to the WS.

Well done, Phillies. I just wish y'all had triumphed over the cheaters.

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

Let me guess. A Yankees fan?

I must have read a thousand faces
I must have robbed them of their cause
Sickened thirst, Sickened thirst
Keeps it together
Soft white glow in the cranium
A bullseye made sedated

You can search this thread to see he is a fan of the Barves, I mean Braves. I think fans of baseball still generally have a high level of disdain for the Astros. I'm just glad that the Nats were able to overcome all that in 2019.

And I kid about the Braves and all the NL East rivals, but it's pretty clear the Nats are going to be the NL East's door mat for at least 2 more seasons (and likely longer).

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This makes me glad that the Astros won the 2nd championship. Maybe people will calm down with the whole aStRos CanT wIn WiThOUt CHeaTing Narrative

I must have read a thousand faces
I must have robbed them of their cause
Sickened thirst, Sickened thirst
Keeps it together
Soft white glow in the cranium
A bullseye made sedated

The Astros and Dodgers are the two best teams in baseball right now. Those two teams are able to (1) sign key players, (2) retain key players, (3) develop their MiLB talent, and (4) assess their needs to make the right decision. Letting Correa walk for incoming Pena is now clearly one of the best, if not the best, roster management moves last offseason.

I think fans get caught up in the retaining of key players and don't realize that to maintain elite status it's about identifying and developing the cheap and controllable talent such that you can build a complete roster. The Astros have now have an elite shortstop until 2028 that isn't even arbitration eligible until 2025.

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Letting Correa walk for incoming Pena is now clearly one of the best, if not the best, roster management moves last offseason.

Seriously underrated comment. While they tried to sign Correa to a mid-term deal (4-5 years IIRC), they had to know that he wasn't interested in that at all, either the long-term deal he was looking for, or a short-term deal that would allow him to opt out and try for the long-term deal again. That's some smart GMing, knowing what you have and what you can afford to let loose, and how to let them loose without looking like you're letting them loose.

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

Maybe people will calm down with the whole aStRos CanT wIn WiThOUt CHeaTing Narrative

I don't think anybody thinks the Astros are still cheating. The fact that they did and won a World Series that same year (that wasn't taken away) is what grates people.

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

This.

Nobody thinks the Astros are currently cheating. But they were definitely cheating during their first World Series run. If Altuve and Bregman are butt hurt about being called cheaters...tough shit.

The Eagles lost to the Patriots in the SB in 2004, and the Pats were definitely cheating then. We at least got to exorcise those demons.

As a diehard Phillie sports fan, the Astros were clearly the better team. But they still cheated for the one before this. We are allowed to call the guys that cheated cheaters.

Meh, they won road games in those playoffs. Were they cheating in Dodger stadium with the cameras and buzzers? No. It's not like the astros only won at home.

In their WS win in 2017, they were dominant at home in those playoffs, mediocre on the road:

ALDS: 2-0 at home; 1-1 in Boston
ALCS: 4-0 at home; 0-3 in NY
WS: 2-1 at home; 2-2 in LA

That's 8-1 when having the cheating advantage; 3-6 when no cheating advantage.

Further, in 2018:
ALDS: 2-0 at home; 1-0 in Cleveland
ALCS: 0-3 at home; 1-1 in Boston (Note: Boston were aware of Astros cheating; Boston was also cheating -- Manager Alex Cora was bench coach of Astros in 2017)

And In 2019:
ALDS: 3-0 at home; 0-2 at TB
ALCS: 2-1 at home; 2-1 at NY (Note: NYY were aware of their cheating)
WS: 0-4 at home: 3-0 at DC (Note: WAS were aware of their cheating)

In those 3 years in the series in which the opposing team didn't know of the cheating, the Astros were 13-1 with a cheating advantage and 4-8 without it.

Note: In the MLB playoffs, the home team wins about 54% of its games.

Edit: Fixed NLDS to ALDS, as noted by Alum below.

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*ALDS
*ALCS

This is my school
This is home

LOL. True, I'm too much a NL fan, I guess.

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The Astros' sign-stealing took place in 2017 and early 2018. Not the postseason of 2018 or at any time in 2019. Or at least I should say they weren't stealing signs any more in 2018 or 2019 than any of the other 29 MLB teams, ALL of whom steal signs when and if they can.

This doesn't make what happened in 2017 and part of 2018 any better. But MLB's investigation was pretty thorough, no need to make up additional instances that didn't happen.

The doll's trying to kill me and the toaster's been laughing at me.

There is still a lot of smoke in that 2019 playoff, especially with TB, but MLB didn't find definitive evidence. Others have reported to the contrary. It still stands that their playoff home record in 2018 and 2019 playoffs (excluding the 2018 ALCS and 2019 WS) is a ridiculous statistical anomaly that is consistent with their home record in 2017.

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Most people knew they could win without cheating, you don't go to that many World Series in a row without a lot of talented players and good situational coaching. They've had and will continue (most likely) to have a talented team for years.

I've been a Braves fan my entire life and I rooted for the Phillies this World Series because I will not root for an organization that cheated, showed little remorse when caught, and got a tap on the wrist as an organization with few if no players who cheated saw any sort of real punishment.

I don't have a problem with fans rooting against cheating (or cheaters) in any form, my only issue is with the hypocrisy of so many baseball fans in this case.

The Astros used video cameras to steal signs in 2017 and the early part of 2018, that's indisputable, and as an Astros fan that was really disappointing to me. Did they win because of that? That's impossible to know. I'd like to think that the subsequent 5 seasons after 2017 which includes 5 ALCS appearances, 3 WS appearances and a World Series title (all trash can free) makes me think that their sign-stealing in 2017 probably didn't actually make that much difference. But that's just my (admittedly biased) opinion, no one can say for sure.

But here are some other facts. In 2016 the Yankees got caught using cameras to steal signs, and after MLB determined that sign-stealing using technology was becoming rampant around the league, they warned teams that they would be cracking down hard on the practice. (The Yankees tried hard to have that report quashed, but it was publicly released earlier this year.)

Obviously the Astros completely ignored that warning and went over the top with their scheme in 2017 and early 2018. Of course, the Red Sox also did the exact same thing in 2018, the year they won the World Series - no trash cans, but they used video cameras and cell phones to steal signs. Red Sox sign stealing in 2018 They were essentially not punished at all.

Besides the Yankees and Red Sox, the Cardinals hacked the Astros scouting department's database in 2016. For that, the Cardinals lost their top 2 draft picks in 2017 and had to pay the Astros $2 million. The guy who hacked the database was sentenced to almost 4 years in jail. Cardinals' hacking scandal

Also, this year MLB also announced they would be cracking down on pitchers using foreign substances. That's why (if you didn't notice) at the end of each half-inning the pitchers now walk straight over to an umpire to have their hands checked. Like sign-stealing, this has always been illegal, but MLB just cracked down this year. Once they started checking it was found that the change had the biggest effect on Dodgers pitchers.

I don't like cheating, and I'm all for punishing people when they get caught. I wouldn't put any of the known steroid guys in the hall of fame, and despite being an Astros fan I would have liked to have seen the players involved get suspensions (I think 10 games per player would have been fair). Unfortunately, MLB decided the only way to get a full accounting was to give the players immunity. Was that the right call? I don't know.

If you want to hate the Astros because "they cheated," more power to you. But you probably should have a bunch of other teams on your list too. Otherwise, you probably really hate the Astros not because they cheated, but because they cheated AND WON.

The doll's trying to kill me and the toaster's been laughing at me.

Yeah I just hope Stros keep going and ignore the talk. I think this team still got a couple championships in them

I must have read a thousand faces
I must have robbed them of their cause
Sickened thirst, Sickened thirst
Keeps it together
Soft white glow in the cranium
A bullseye made sedated

Haha, fair enough!

I'm just saying there's a lot of mob mentality with the Astros scandal, and a lot of righteous indignation coming from teams that shouldn't be throwing stones from their glass houses, like the Dodgers and Yankees. And that's not even factoring in the competitive imbalance that a lack of an MLB salary cap benefits those teams.

There's literally no Northern American pro sports teams in their given sport that start every year with a bigger competitive advantage than the Dodgers and Yankees, simply due to the markets they play in. Meanwhile, there's at least 10 MLB teams that have next to no chance of winning a WS in the next 10 years.

The doll's trying to kill me and the toaster's been laughing at me.

But that's the thing about baseball. You just mentioned the two teams that spend the most. How many WS titles do they have in the last 13 years. One each?

There is definitely a $$$ advantage, but it's not showing up as a huge competitive advantage lately.

The Dodgers were an all star basically this year, and the Padres bounced em. The Yankees looked like clowns against the Astros, and Judge will be gone next year. You can spend whatever you want, but there isn't enough to replace that guy. Their lineup is not that good.

I say this as a Phillies fan with an owner who has made it clear that he will spend too. Next year Trea Turner will be leading off for them.

The financial advantage that some teams have don't guarantee wins, to be sure. But what they do is to protect against bad decisions. Take Chris Davis for an example. In its latter years, that contract (among other things) killed the Orioles' ability to compete. But the Dodgers could take on a David Price contract in order to improve themselves by acquiring Mookie Betts. That $$$ advantage keeps wealthier teams competitive year after year, as opposed to having to remake themselves completely after a swing and a miss on a big contract.

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

So much this. So much this. yeah it sucks that the yankees can give Aaron Judge 400 million.. but you saw what happened in the post season.. he was like 2-50..granted the 2 were bombs to the moon, but he did not win them a pennant. If judge starts to suck, they can juts cut bait and not be worried about the financial impact. The Padres are the converse of this... they are fucked with those contracts because they won't win AND they cant absorb them. The model is the Rays/Astros... hire the best scouts- they are much cheaper than players- and make the right draft pics. You will be good enough to get the post season. From there- keep the right guys, not the most expensive ones.

Good for Dusty Baker. He always got dogged for being in so many playoffs and not winning one. He never deserved that, so hopefully he doesn't have to hear that again.

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Happy for Dusty... but the 'stros are still tainted