This ain't your daddy's ACC

| Read HokieV's blog | 23 comments

I did not see that one coming.  Nope, not even an inkling.  And I challenge anyone who reads this to look me square in the eye and tell me that they thought the ACC was going to be the conference that started the super-conference dominos falling.

I, like most Hokies following the realignment discussions and rumors, was worried that Virginia Tech would get left behind in some bastardized version of the ACC and Big East.  That once the Pac 12 went to 16, the SEC would feel compelled to do so, as well.  If the SEC was going to go to 16, there's no way they get there without poaching a few ACC schools, and there's no way I want to be apart of an ACC sans Clemson and Florida State.

Then, seemingly out of nowhere, the ACC fires a preemptive strike and snarfs Pittsburgh and Syracuse.

I was shocked, but I was happy to see the ACC being proactive.  Initially I was satisfied with Pitt, as we've had some memorable games with them on the gridiron, but Syracuse was a resounding meh.  Now that I've had a few days to digest it, as well as read about how it may have gone down, I've concluded that the ACC made a fairly shrewd move.  (Note: I have no idea of the truthfulness of that post, but it certainly seems genuine.)  Like it or not, the ACC is looking at more than just football for potential members.  If you're not happy with whom we grabbed, please tell me who else the ACC should have and could have brought in?  Pitt and 'Cuse fit the bill extremely well: both have football history (although the Orange have fallen off as of late, the Panthers are a solid program right now), have good basketball programs, and are academically solid universities.  Last, but not least, Pittsburgh and Syracuse fill in an ACC footprint that has a gaping hole in its north end.

Let's face it, the Atlantic Coast Conference is not a southern athletic conference anymore - it is now the collegiate athletic conference of the US Eastern seaboard.  In its infancy, the ACC stretched across 4 states: North and South Carolina, Virginia, and Maryland.  Now, with the two latest additions, you've got a contiguous geographical footprint from south Florida all the way up to New York & Massachusetts.  If you look back to the last round of expansion, you can't deny that this is exactly what the ACC wanted - a northward expansion, not westward.  In doing so, they also protect themselves from the possibility of the Big Ten getting a stranglehold on those markets.

So, what's next?  I think it's obvious that another 2 teams are a distinct possibility.  This is where things get dicey.  Remember how I was worried about getting stuck in the bastardized version of the ACC and Big East?  Unfortunately, I think that's essentially where we'd end up.  Let's just assume the ACC ends up with UConn and Rutgers as 15 and 16 (which is the popular rumor).  Here's a word of warning: be prepared for a North/South divisional split.  @Cvillehoops13 has made some very logical arguments in favor of such a split from a TV revenue standpoint.  For the league as a whole, it actually makes some sense.  The downside - we get stuck in the bastard division: Boston College, UConn, Maryland, Pittsburgh, Rutgers, Syracuse, Virginia, and Virginia Tech.  Not many of those road trips are that enticing to me.  Compare that to the theoretical South: Clemson, Duke, Florida State, George Tech, Miami, North Carolina, NC State, and Wake Forest.  With the exception of Duke and Wake, that is a pretty heavy duty football division.

I can only hope that should the ACC go to 16, that they implement 4-team pods.  The result isn't much better for us, but it at least means we'll play the other teams more often.  Theoretically the 4 pods would look something like this: BC/UConn/Rutgers/Syracuse, Maryland/Pitt/UVA/VT, Duke/UNC/NCState/Wake, and Clemson/FSU/GT/Miami.  You'd play everyone in your pod every year and rotate the 2 teams per remaining pod each year for a total of 9 conference games in football.  For basketball you'd play everyone in your pod twice a year and the other 12 teams once, for a total of 18 conference games.

That all said, I hope the ACC sits by and bides its time.  At this point it can be choosy with who will be left when the dust settles.  Barring a major restructuring of their revenue sharing and a complete makeover of their internal politics, I just don't see how the Big East and Big 12 survive for the long term.  The same universities that want into the ACC now will likely still be there when the Big East and Big 12 finally implode (be it now or later), and we can continue to work on Notre Dame as number 15.

The ACC did what it needed to solidify itself as one of the top-4 conferences.  In this evolving landscape of college football, I have to like the ACC didn't come apart at the seams.  Instead, they quietly formed this "444" committee (which is basically the ACC's expansion committee), and went to work on protecting the conference as a whole.  I still think this new-look ACC is a good fit for Tech, and it's clear to me that the member universities are working for the common good.

Stability is not something to be taken for granted.  Just turn your attention to the rest of the Big East schools and the Big 12 schools that don't have Texas or Oklahoma in their names.  How would you like to be in their shoes?

Tweet, Like, Send, 1-Up and Follow

Comments

VTJawo's picture

Divisions #

Somehow I doubt that Miami and FSU will be put in the same pod/division, geography be dammed. As the two "premiere" football schools will want both to succeed, not one or the other. I could be wrong, but I highly doubt a North/South or Blue/Grey divisions; I would expect to see "ACC origins" and "Big East origins" first.


Miami has bigger problems #

Like the possibility their program may get bombed into rubble by the NCAA.


vtnerf's picture

Soooooo.... #

With all of the shifting, changing, moving, adding, growing....
Does this make it easier for the NCAA to put stricter sanctions on the U?
With a mega-conference, it's easier to hurt one of 16 instead of 1 of 8 or 12.

With the buyout times, lead requests and everything changing over the next 2 years anyway, it wouldn't be a huge deal to see Miami hit with 30 less scholarships next year or something similar.


0-16 Hokie's picture

thanks for the inclusion of #

thanks for the inclusion of that article from pitt. don't know how much i believe them, as i highly doubt the current ACC has any care for who pitt or cuse want, but some good insight as to how this might have all gone down.

i don't think the ACC jumps at rutgers or uconn though. while i think uconn is the dream of duke/unc, i really don't see anyone else getting that excited over it. expect the acc to wait and see who else moves before going to 16, as there really isn't any long term effects to holding out hope for ND. if/when other big schools start getting snatched up, then watch us move. until then, i believe them when they say they're happy at 14.

...you know...
@j3ffress


joe's picture

Uconn Football #

They don't add much now, because they're young, but they went to a BCS game after playing in I-A for just 11 seasons. They're at least committed to football, and have invested a ton of money in their facilities. With more money, the right scheduling, and without the baggage of the basketball only schools I think Uconn could range from a 7-9 win program.

Geographically they'd help connect Boston College to the rest of the ACC. If Calhoun hadn't ripped into BC after they left for the ACC they'd be the school lobbying hardest for them.

David Wilson eats Chick-fil-A on Sundays.


I think it makes a lot of #

I think it makes a lot of sense for the ACC to ask Pitt and SU what other BE schools they would recommend. They've been in those board rooms and know the internal politics of the league. We've all heard how messed up things have been in BE politics. The last thing the ACC wants is to transplant a cancer from the BE to the ACC. I don't think the ACC will necessarily go with who Pitt and SU recommend, but why not ask the question and listen to their reasoning? Might learn something very useful.


jmichons's picture

Temporary moves? #

Is there a possiblility that some school(s) could still leave for other conferences? Could the SEC suck in an ACC school? I think the likelihood has gone down for the short term. With FSU's loss last Saturday it shows they are not really back. I think that would make them want to stay in the ACC. Basically the same arguments as VT, why become a middle of the pack SEC team when you could always be in the mix for a BCS bowl in the ACC? ACC would now have to lose more than two teams to dismantle. I think that reduces the risks to the conference going forward. A lot of people, including the media, did not see this coming. It was not in any prognosticator's vision of where conference realignment was headed. The shakeout over the next few months will be interesting. I think it raises the ACC's profile a lot. I think this is the year of the ACC for a football NC. It is all falling into place.


Don't think this is temporary. #

I admit, I may be wearing rose-colored glasses issued by the ACC, but I don't think that any league schools want to leave. I think it would a tremendous amount of money to lure away Florida State or Clemson - more than what the SEC would be willing to offer.

Just look at how this went down. The ACC circled the wagons and kept this very hush-hush. The fact that this wasn't leaked until the day before Pitt and Cuse were accepted is very telling. It shows a lot of trust within the ACC and very little within the Big East. I would argue that if an ACC member was interested in bolting, they would've let this story get out to possibly derail it. And the fact that Pittsburgh and Syracuse didn't tell a soul makes them look like 2 soldiers planning a daring escape from a POW camp.

Sure, the SEC is probably still interested in ACC schools. I would argue that we're still the most attractive university for #14. But the ACC schools have said, "Thanks, but no thanks" enough times to the SEC, and the surprise expansion shows them we're serious.

I yearn for a special teams TD.
@VTvince79


hoqiez's picture

they also wouldn't have #

they also wouldn't have unanimously voted to raise the exit fee $7 million...I think the cat would have come out of the bag then.

Of course, business is business and there are still plenty of scenarios where playing something close to your chest would be beneficial even if your costs go up. But I agree, this seems stable.


A few thoughts #

First of all, I definitely didn't see this coming, but the media should have. Yahoo! Sports certainly can't break every story and ESPN seems content to only report on the SEC, Dallas Cowboys, and Red Sox/Yankees happenings. I really like the move and I would like to see UCONN added because I think they are a similar fit (basketball, geographically, academically), but I think Rutgers would be a big mistake as they don't add anything athletically. I agree with VTJawo that FSU and Miami would throw a fit if they were in the same football divisions, even if it makes geographic sense. I wonder if the ACC would consider having two sets of divisions. One set of divisions for basketball and football, where you can afford to have teams flying from Boston to play in Miami every year. The other set would be for the non-revenue sport that would be broken up geographically. I know this is pretty unlikely, but I like it because then VT doesn't get stuck having a football schedule with UCONN, UVA, UMD, and the rest of the nobodies every year. Finally, I doubt any school would want to leave the ACC now that they have raised the exit fee to $20 million. Even the eventual riches of being an SEC contender year in and year out would sort of be negated by this initial loss. Also, something has to be said for the fact that both the increase in the exit fee and the voting to accept Pitt and UCONN were done unanimously.


hokiez2013's picture

ACC not the trendsetter #

I don't see that the ACC was the trendsetter or threw the first stone. The PAC 12 (Utah, Colorado), BIG 10 (Nebraska), BIG East (TCU) and SEC (A&M) all added teams within the past year before the ACC did. I feel like the trend was started last year and Texas A&M revived it this year going to the SEC. This was reactionary more than the ACC going out and being proactive in my mind. All the other conferences in a sense had already made their moves. The ACC if you look recent was the last to make a move and made the right move. The next smart move would be to add Texas and ND over UCONN and Rutgers. Texas and ND add prestige to a league that is craving some.


hoqiez's picture

question #

Football wise, is South Florida getting blackballed by Miami/FSU the same way FSU/Miami/Clemson were being allegedly done by South Carolina and Florida? I sure wouldn't mind them. Lack of value-added to market exposure is huge, but am I the only one who wonders why they aren't at least coming up in the conversation?


hokiez2013's picture

No Value #

They dont add much as far as value. You get a decent football team in the Big East but they would be on Wake Forest's level in the ACC. They get no attendance at games and don't travel well. Also they don't add any value in basketball.


jmichons's picture

They did beat #

They did beat Notre Dame at home and have upset some good teams in recent years. What I think is funny is that all the "Big" conferences are suddenly relatively small and shrinking.


USF's a commuter school and #

USF's a commuter school and so doesn't have as much student participation as a resident school like VT does. They also play in the Bucs stadium and don't have their own, IIRC. Personally I would love to add USF, but both my parents are alum so it would just be for the house-divided factor ^_^


InEnemyTerritory's picture

The law of diminishing returns... #

I think that after munching on the Big East several times, the ACC might tend to think..."do I really want more?" I don't know that we should be in a hurry for Rutgers or UConn as 15 & 16. I think the move to 14 was a nice preemptive strike (although the idea of playing in the dome @syracuse is not my favorite). I think we sit back, digest a bit, and if and when desert is available, we can be a bit more choosy. Perhaps an Irish coffee from indiana? Roasted cardinal from Kentucky? I doubt that bevo steak would be on the menu, but you never know. Would it be possible to poach another team from PA and the Big 10(ish)? Like the Chinese proverb says, "May you live in interesting times".

Take the shortest route to the ball and arrive in bad humor.


Completely agree. #

One quick note: there is no way we're grabbing any Big 10 school unless they're booted from the Big 10. I read somewhere that their exit fee is not only a lump sum, but forfeiture of TV revenue for so many years. I don't have the source, but it wouldn't shock me if it were true.

I yearn for a special teams TD.
@VTvince79


InEnemyTerritory's picture

This just heard on the Dan Patrick Show.... #

West Virginia has been rejected by the ACC.....I can only laugh!

Take the shortest route to the ball and arrive in bad humor.


Box's picture

Quick n dirty #


RiVAHokie's picture

wait wait wait #

Why are we so against Rutgers? look at this

http://thequad.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/09/19/the-geography-of-college-foo...

People just think Blah Football but people watch them. A LOT OF PEOPLE.

www.twitter.com/BeaunerJam

"To be the man, you gotta beat the man" - Rick Flair


duffmanhokie1568's picture

Firstly, great write up on #

Firstly, great write up on the expansion HokieV. As I said in an earlier post I didn't see this coming either: props to Swofford and the ACC think tank for getting ahead IN THIS ROUND of expansion (though the ACC wasn't the first it made the biggest splash thus far in 2011). In terms of the divisional alignment when Pitt and Syracuse come over I originally thought that the North/South breakdown would dominate; however, outside geography it really doesn't make any sense especially on a football competition level. Though the Atlantic isn't the greatest division of any conference in the world it is pretty damn competitive and breaking up the coastal would be insane- Virginia Tech, Georgia Tech, and Miami provide the best entertainment in the conference on a ratings level when playing one another and the ACC will definitely have to consider this fact when reviewing the divisional alignments. Also to be perfectly frank I think each institution enjoys playing each other yearly: the battle of the Techs is great and provides interesting bragging rights (and usually the Coastal Division Championship) and Virginia Tech/Miami have become each others most hated division rival and the most important game on the Conference slate (I would argue damn near the level of hatred with FSU on a conference level because of the past in the Big East and the ACC).

In terms of the next round of expansion the ACC needs to operate through a football-oriented lens. The whole reason the '03 expansion was touted was for football. Now complete the process. UConn brings only an up and coming football program and Rutgers lost its luster gained in 2005 two years later. Notre Dame would be the most immediately attractive though is incredibly unlikely for football. If you could alter the revenue sharing to a degree to get them in THEN DO IT. Unlike most I want nothing to do with Penn State. No real reason- let them stay in the BIG and be a mediocre program there. The most logical for me is Texas. Unlike Penn State they've been a NCG contender (minus this year) annually for damn near the last ten years and, most importantly, opens up Texas to ACC recruiting (ACC now has Pennsylvania foot print with Pitt and most ACC schools recruit in PA already anyways). Though the SEC will also sow its roots there with Texas A&M, most Texans either want to play for UT or for the teams that play UT every year in a sort of "revenge factor". If the revenue sharing needs to be altered for them to a degree for the Longhorn Network THEN DO IT!!! I love equal revenue as much as the next guy but if Duke football and GT Basketball have to suffer to bring in Texas and Notre Dame then let them suffer. Revenue sharing reflects a "sacrifice for the greater good" mentality....time to put that ideology to work.

Virginia Tech '08
Fordham University (NY) '11, '12

Twitter: @duffmanhokie
PSN Handle: duffmanhokie1568 (NCAAF '12, NHL '11, Battlefield)

Hokies, NY Rangers, NY Jets, NY Mets (sigh), USA Hockey, Richmond Renegades (R.I.P)


Helo_Hokie's picture

Let's now take our time... #

I just like our new found stability in the ACC. I think the idea of taking our time for the 14th/15th teams is spot on. There is now no reason to hurry up on this one. I think Pitt and Syracuse were the jab to feel out the playing field, but the next move(s) need to count. We made the basketball fans very happy with those 2 schools, very happy. So now the next should be all about football. There is no reason to take Rutgers here unless it's absolutely necessary for the 16th team. UConn i guess has upside, but not enough until several others are ruled out. We need to stay out of the Big East in my opinion, except for WVU. I don't think the ACC/Big East all stars is very impressive to people outside of these conferences. That is what we need to be thinking about. I think HS recruits want to be part of something impressive. That (right now) isn't the ACC as a whole like the SEC is, but just some of the individual schools (VT, Miami, FSU, GT). We need to bring in some excitement and that will take some negotiations and sweet talking. ND, Penn St, Texas are great examples. I think the traditions of these schools are a big part of that. I think this will take some time to see where some of the cards fall...


Agreed #

I agree on taking our time. It is looking like the odds of 4 "Super Conferences" are pretty likely, with the count probably being 16 teams apiece. I kind of like the idea of the 4 major conferences having 4 conference championships and then a +1 scenario to determine a Nat'l Championship.

That means that there are still plenty of chips to fall and existing conferences to fold, so we should have somewhat of our pick when it comes to adding a final two. Curious, what do you all think of Notre Dame? Obviously out of the geographic footprint (even the expanded one) but it would be a HUGE get for the ACC and I have heard that they prefer us over the Big Ten?? (could be posturing)

All things being equal, I would rather take 2 strong football/academic schools such as a Notre Dame and a ......??? than take rutgers and/or Uconn just to fill out to 16. Hopefully we will have the option.