OT: Harper to the Phils

According to ESPN:

"...a 13-year, $330 million deal with the free-agent outfielder, league sources told ESPN's Jeff Passan on Thursday.

Harper's deal includes a no-trade clause and has no opt-outs, league sources told ESPN, indicating that he is committed to the Phillies for possibly the rest of his career."

Thought #1 - He will never finish that contract in Philly
Thought #2 - The Phillies better win now for their own sake, because they'll be paying for this bet for a long while
Thought #3 - Harper just became public enemy #1 in DC

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Comments

Seeing Nats fans in my timeline having a riot that he went to Philly.

As a Braves fan, my stance remains unchanged. F*** Bryce Harper

GO BRAVES!

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

If all above is true, I am shocked only in that Boras didn't get a couple of Opt outs. I would have expected Opt outs at years 3 and 6. Cant wait for the mock rage on the radio from 106.7 the Fan guys to rile up the fan base. Harper needs to send Nolan Arenado a big fat Thank You present because I think that drove the Phillies to up the value of this contract Scratch that, just saw that this is now 13 years. Not even sure what to think now with how Boras did this one.

My guess is Boras anticipates the market to bottom out in the future, making it more difficult for Harper to get a higher per year average in the future so they went the route of getting the maximum total value right now. It's either that, or Harper has no confidence to bet on himself 4ish years from now.

His annual average would have been higher with the original offer the Nats made him at the end of the season ($300m/10yr). If accurate this deal with the phils will pay less of a base salary.

I read that deal was more like $200m over 6 or 7 years, with the other $100m deferred that probably wouldn't get paid.

"I regret nothing. The end." - Ron Swanson

The $100M deferred is correct from my understanding as well but it would definitely get paid. It essentially was set up with the same language the Mets had when they deferred some of the Bobby Bonilla money. That has worked out splendidly for Bonilla long term. Believe he still gets like $1.2M per year until like 2035 from them. Nats already have the same kind of language in their contracts with Scherzer and Strasburg. My only question with it is how it impacts the salary numbers Luxury Tax wise in the deferred years.

Just saw this on Deadspin

And the Nationals' reported 10-year, $300 million offer made to Harper before the end of the regular season? It included so much deferred money (it would have paid Harper through the year 2053) that its present-day value wasn't in the same ballpark as the other offers. $184 million, according to Verducci, or $240 million, per the Post's Neil Greenberg. The math on deferred contracts is tricky, but since the former figure is coming via Boras and the latter via the Nats, you should feel safe pegging the true value as somewhere in between.

Wow. I mean, I would love for myself to have guaranteed payments coming to me for the next 35 years, but I mean I guess I understand why he passe on that offer. The same article also says the offer from the Dodgers was only for 5 years, but would have paid him an astronomical $45m AAV.

"I regret nothing. The end." - Ron Swanson

True story, Harper's contract with the Phillies will be up 3 years before the Mets stop paying Bobby Bonilla

Exactly. So since they took at 330 mil total, that tells me they don't anticipate being able to make up that extra 30 mil difference from the 300 mil offers by securing a higher per year payout with an option some time down the line.

Keep in mind there are some serious questions about another work stoppage in the next few years. Its hard to say what would come out of any potential renegotiated CBA at that time.

It's possible that when that happens this deal looks really good for Harper if the market bottoms out. Its equally as possible that this deal could look really good for the Phillies at that AAV if the opposite occurs.

Middleton walking into the clubhouse in Clearwater this afternoon:

So my thoughts, as a well known Philly fan on here.... Term is longer than I like, but the AAV ($25m) that will hold for a guy from age 26 through basically the end of his career who already has a MVP under his belt could end up being really cheap through the majority of the deal. Combine this with the trades for Realmuto and Segura and the fact that they already have Hoskins, and that lineup just became incredibly potent, which is only going to be further bolstered by playing in the bandbox of Citizens Bank Park. They have a good bullpen, but in my opinion they really need one more arm for the rotation and I would feel real good about a potential pennant run as early as this season.

I'm really more impressed they were able to keep the AAV down by that much. People were expecting him to get around $33m-$35m per year and this comes in way below that. Enough so that there is now a reasonable chance they will make a serious run at local boy Trout in a couple years.

And for those in Washington who are upset by this. I feel ya, the same happened with us with Werth about a decade ago. He signed there for what we thought was too much money, and it ended up being well worth it in the long run, not just because of what he brought on the field, but the mindset change he brought to the clubhouse. I have a feeling the same will happen with Harper in Philly. But yeah, it definitely sucks to see them in rivals colors.

"I regret nothing. The end." - Ron Swanson

Nats fans just have to hope that Soto continues to deliver like he did last year and that Robles is as good as advertised long term. Hopefully now that this saga is over, the Nats can manage to lock up Rendon and Turner long term since Ryan Zimmermann comes off the books here at the end of this season except for a $2M buyout.

Bingo. I don't think Bryce is worth that much, at all. (I am a Nats fan). If he could bottle up the month of April and some of May and do that all season he certainly could've garnered that and likely a hell of a lot more. But he falls into the same damn slump every single year. His waist starts falling out the back of the box and he doesn't stand a shottt of hitting anything. Pisses me off watching it. Pay Rendon, Soto, Turner, and Robles (if he pans out like people think he will).

Amateur superstar and idiot extraordinaire.

Just wait for when the Phillies get Mike Trout in a few years. #dynasty

I still think its a pipe dream and he signs a long term deal in LA sometime soon.

But if not... I mean how could he not be at least a little lured in by the prospects of batting alongside Harper, Hoskins, and Realmuto in his home town?

"I regret nothing. The end." - Ron Swanson

I agree ... sounds like the pipe dream that Cubs fans (of which I'm one) had of getting Harper in Wrigley since he's BFF with Kris Bryant.

You called it.

Looks like Trout is getting a 12 year/$430m deal from the Angels.

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

oof, Harper's historic deal was historic for 2 weeks.

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Man, good for him.

Reading some of the blogs around baseball, some Phils fans were getting a little annoying with the cocky 'he's signing here in 2 years, rawwwr'.

It was a fun thought, but the team would be better saving that money and spending on pitching from here on out. Lineup should be set for the long haul if they can keep the core together. Now just build up the rotation and pen.

"I regret nothing. The end." - Ron Swanson

I'm just glad he's not going to the Phillies in two years.

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

I can see Angel stadium from my seat in my office. As much as I love growing up on the east coast, I'm not leaving SoCal to go back. I'm guessing that's part of the reason Trout stays (besides the insane amount of money).

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If the Angels let Trout get to FA, that is ownership malpractice. If he somehow does, I would imagine the Phils will be mentioned quite frequently but I still don't see it happening.

The guy is from Millville, but I've still not heard of any athlete thats considered at the top of their sport taking a significant paycut just to play near home.

Although the rumor is that Trout is building a huge estate in Millville, so maybe he wants to get back that way.

I'm a Nats fan and have struggled to root for the guy. Perhaps he will melow with age but I wouldn't count on it. Werth was a team first guy, with a high baseball IQβ€”baserunning shows the contrast. Harper is fast but he runs into outs and fails to run out grounders.

So you're saying that Werth was a first in, last out kinda guy? ;^)

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

Get out of the East you hair flipping diva. This still the baby Braves division.

Vroom Vroom

I have not been more excited in a group of Braves for at least a decade than this current one

Most exciting Braves team since Chipper, Andruw and the 1-2 Glavine and Smoltz days.

Vroom Vroom

I feel personally attacked that you left out Maddux.

I always include Steve in there too.

Using /s is for cowards.

Greatest commercial ever?

Oh man. Those were great times in my life.

No, I *don't* want to go to the SEC. Why do you ask?

We don't love dem Hoos.

Never saw that before. Funny shit. Saw Smotz and Glavine play minor league for the Richmond Braves.

Starting pitching is the key to winning. Don't sleep on the Nats.

I feel personally attacked that you left out John Rocker.

Using /s is for cowards.

Vroom Vroom

AS a diehard Philadelphia sports fan, there have been a number of players where I have thought "God I hate that guy, but I would root for him if he played here."

Crosby is #1 on that list
There have been a few Cowboys here and there
Harper was definetely on that list as well. Guys that arn't scumbags or doing shady things, just something about them you love to hate when they play your team.

So I am excited to finally get the chance to see what its like. The Phillies are going to have a pretty nice lineup, but needed a left hander with pop. There was no one better out there than Harper to fill that need. You are going to have a guy like Herrera who is a .300 hitter batting like 7th in this lineup now.

Segura
Hoskins
Realmuto
Harper
McCutcheon

You can win a good number of games with that, especially at Citizens Bank Park.

I imagine the ticket office is going to go crazy the next few days, and it will be hard to get into those games to start the season. The Harper Phillies jersey will be up there on the merch list too. Good move by the Phillies. They have the money, this will generate more money, they already made several "we think we can win in this window" moves, and this is the icing on the cake.

They still have a lot of money to spend. Per a recent tweet by Stark, they were projected to be $74m under the luxury tax before Harper, so they still have about $50m to play with, which opens up a lot of room this year and beyond.

They really could go after a Gio or Keuchel and still have plenty of room to play.

"I regret nothing. The end." - Ron Swanson

Good luck with him... as a numbers guy myself, and having seen him regularly, this deal could financially wreck philly for a while with nothing to show for it. Harper had a bad year last year last year for avg and Ks - that could be an anomaly, but he's been generally underperforming to his potential since 2015, and that is without having to face the Nats pitching roster on a regular basis. Now he flips jerseys inside the division and has effectively made his own job harder by going up against opposing pitchers that already know him, and with heightened expectations from his new fan base... good luck with that...

Go Nats!

Except now he is going to hit in a ballpark that is known to be exceptionally kind to lefties. Its not Coors Field but just his hitting at home could massively pad his stats. As a team last year without all the power they added to their lineup, they scored 57 more runs at home, hit 22 more homeruns, and had a 49-32 home record. Imagine how much those numbers might improve with Harper, Realmuto, McCutchen, etc, etc.

Which year was the anomaly?

BTW, I'm in total agreement with you. Just putting up the numbers to show.

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I was originally looking at 2018 as the anomaly... but maybe 2015 was, and every other year has been the norm.

2015 is definitely the anomaly. But to be fair, his poor 2016 year was due to injury and 2018 was due to bad defense and batting average. I would imagine a rebound to about 5 WAR in 2019, maybe better as he has always performed well in CBP. Of course, Phillies pitching also contribute to the good numbers in CBP over his career.

Edit: Made a mistake in my post. Harper's poor year in 2014 was due to injury. His poor year in 2016 was due to Joe Maddon walking him for an entire series after Harper put up monstrous numbers in April.

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Here's my theory on that anomaly of a season: so...he and his wife (who by all accounts, seems like a lovely gal) were dating when he first broke into the majors. He put up decent numbers for a rookie, nothing crazy. They got engaged between 2013-2014 if I remember correctly. Those years were kinda "meh." Again, not bad numbers at all...but not $330mil numbers. They broke off the engagement prior to the 2015 season. What happened after that? An MVP. They got back together soon after and he's been back to Earth ever since.

Just my crazy, stupid, fan theory from afar.

Amateur superstar and idiot extraordinaire.

Is this her?

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

I don't know if I would say it could financially wreck the Phillies.

They are a large market team with a great TV deal, an ownership group with deep pockets, and a stadium that will be full every night if they play even halfway decent.

The fact that they were able to lock up their best pitcher earlier this spring to what I would consider a below market extension is very helpful as well.

DC fan here... I don't think he ever truly loved it in DC and that's quite alright. I didn't ever expect him back. I legitimately like how the Nats are constructed for this year except at manager.

I don't think this is particularly a great deal for him without an opt out but he wanted security and got it and he's certainly set for life.

Philly? Meh. No offense to the Philly fans here (I've already ruffled the feathers of those from Bmore) but I really figured he would go west or go to a city with a richer baseball history. Not a small market team, but if he wanted bigger star power, LA seemed like the perfect fit.

He'll get booed in DC. It will be weird seeing him in a Phils jersey and the NL East just got even more interesting.

You will see this game, this upset and this sign next on ESPN Sportscenter. Virginia Tech 31 Miami 7

Maybe those Nats home games will just go back to being mostly Philly fans driving down I-95 like they used to be before DC got just good enough to not win in the playoffs.

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I know they can have the seat I might have thought of sitting in. Wont want to be there when those said fans start slinging around the Harper chants and other garbage. Nats park is already a pain to deal with so that's one more reason not to be there.

What makes Nats Park a pain to deal with in your opinion? Just curious.

Where's the beef?

My 2 cents:
Getting around DC is awful more often than not anyway, but weeknight games around rush hour are abysmal to get to. Parking options are poor and have steadily gotten worse and the metro isn't much better unless you already live on the green line.

Joffrey, Cersei, Ilyn Payne, the Hound, Jeff Jagodzinski, Paul Johnson, Pat Narduzzi.

Metro is the #1 reason I don't attend more Nats games. The ballpark is nice but damn is it a cluster trying to figure out how you're reasonably going to get to and from the game.

@vtscottyb

Most of what I would have said has already been covered. Getting to and from that area from NoVa can take you almost as long as the game itself. The astronomical cost of parking if you find it is another part. Its better than Fedex Field but still has a ton of challenges, that seem to be getting worse the more developed that area around the stadium becomes.

Once in the park I dont have many complaints, as the Nats have done a pretty good job, although the two stores for gear could be better set up for game day crowds. Not fun to have to stand in line to get in the store because of fire codes. Then face the same size line to check out. They might benefit by looking into technology like what Amazon Go stores are using.

Agreed on getting to and from the game. As the area around the stadium has developed and metro has worsened, it has become harder to get to. Was just curious if anyone had any gripes about the actual park experience. I have been pleased with the experience inside the stadium. Food and beverage is very expensive but its not any different than the other pro sports venues in the city. I just mentally prepare myself to part ways with $9-10 each beer!

Where's the beef?

I've taken my girls to see the Braves there twice so far, and plan to at least once a year. The stadium is nice, and the experience is great. The only issue is that it's filled with Nats fans. ;^)

(And yes, I'm raising my girls to root for the home team. They just don't quite get why I'm rooting for the visitors.)

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

The only issue is that it's filled with Nats fans. ;^)

You think that's bad? You should have seen the place before 2012 when it was filled with Phillies fans! :)

Where's the beef?

Very well could be. I'll still not attend when they play the Phillies so I don't have to worry about having a poor gameday experience with the obnoxious Philly fans around, whether its a lot of them or a little of them.

You will see this game, this upset and this sign next on ESPN Sportscenter. Virginia Tech 31 Miami 7

The state of Pennsylvania develops class act sports fans just like Maryland produces great drivers.

Have you been to a game against the Phillies in Nats Park recently? Its not 2010 anymore. They are few and far between, and the ones that are there have been subdued by the down years.

Where's the beef?

Which is why with this surge of encouragement by investment of ownership in such a big way is likely to bring them raging back from the doldrums. See Eagles fans if you need to understand.....won a Super Bowl and instantly returned to raging against competition because they are spending less time raging against themselves

Yes, I am concerned it will encourage them to begin showing up in droves at Nats Park again. Which is why it's important for Nats fans to get to these games to prevent that from happening.

They're a pretty fickle bunch though. This was literally a few hours before he signed with the Phillies - https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2019/02/28/good-riddance-phillies-...

It'll be interesting to see the fan reaction come mid-May when pitchers stop throwing to him and he begins chasing junk.

Where's the beef?

No, I haven't. I was just responding to the snarky post above with my own snarkiness.

That said, one of my best friends is a huge Philly fan and he will openly admit to them all being assholes.

You will see this game, this upset and this sign next on ESPN Sportscenter. Virginia Tech 31 Miami 7

Both parties will regret this at some point. Just my prediction.

That's a heck of a deal for Justin Harper, especially this late in his professional career, and after coaching at Towson. Go Hokies!

Harper has 1 good year and he gets largest contract ever.

Phillies fans: Enjoy .250 batting average with 3-5 WAR Phillies and no humility for $25M per year.

Nats EXTEND Rendon please (the true MVP of the team).

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I don't think Nats fans in general are going to be THAT upset.

I'm probably not in the majority saying this, but I consider Harper to be one of the most overrated baseball players I've ever seen. He's a bit injury prone, and he's averaged only 74 RBIs per year in his career (with only one season with 100, last year).

Don't get me wrong, he's very good. But he's not a top-5, or maybe even top-10, player in the league. I wouldn't pay him $25 million per season, unless my franchise basically printed money like the Red Sox or Yankees.

The doll's trying to kill me and the toaster's been laughing at me.

The Phillies make a lot more money than people realize. And they've been banking a ton the last several seasons gearing up for this particular offseason.

The question of whether it will work out or not is up in the air, but coming from a Phillies fan this is a move that ownership had to make.

it's not a moneyball deal, that's for sure. he's essentially the equivalent of Jim Thome stat-wise, but comes with more hype. So, if Phils liked Thome, they should like Harper too.

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There's also a very good chance that the NL adopts the DH in the coming years, and he spends a majority of this contract being the Phillies DH.

"I regret nothing. The end." - Ron Swanson

I will never watch baseball again if it's all DH. NevereverNeverever.

Get. The. Fuck. Off. My. Lawn.

Leonard. Duh.

At this point, I all but expect it with the next CBA

"I regret nothing. The end." - Ron Swanson

It was already put forward approved by the competition committee but Manfred kiboshed it until 2022. I was fully expecting it to get put on slate for next season.

I agree with you on the history and principle, but watching pitchers flail away at the plate is starting to feel less important to me by the season. Its like the extra point in football, its when I head to the bathroom. To make the game more interesting, just let someone else take the AB.

Come to Blacksburg and see what the Hokie Pokie is really all about

When you put it that way, it almost seems even worse. That's a ludicrous amount of money for a player if you expect him to be a DH for most of the contract.

Joffrey, Cersei, Ilyn Payne, the Hound, Jeff Jagodzinski, Paul Johnson, Pat Narduzzi.

Philadelphia doesn't have fans either, they have bandwagoneers.

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

People forget the Phillies have the ability and willingness to go big on payroll. The only reason they haven't been a luxury tax team over the last 5 years or so is simply because they really didn't want to be one, and instead wanted to pretty much tank to fill out the farm and wait for the home grown talent to start to bubble up. From 2007 to 2012 they were a team that, as you said, printed money, and they showed it by having one of, if not the highest payroll during that period, but their core got real old real fast and they had to rebuild. Once they get going, they're a team that has the financial means and desire to operate like any of the other big spenders in the league.

"I regret nothing. The end." - Ron Swanson

Steve

Talent wise I agree with much of what you said. The appeal is how marketable he has made himself. As people were pointing out above, his Phils jersey is likely to spike dramatically and over the years the Phils likely recoup financially more from his ability to draw crowds than actually play the game especially with how much talent they have now put around him lineup wise. As for pitching, that remains to be seen.

Hopefully this pans out for the Phils the same way it did with Ryan Howard with his deal.

Vroom Vroom

Bryce Harper is currently the Vegas favorite to win NL MVP with the Phillies.

He has done it before. The only time he had a season over 5 WAR. Perhaps being on the Phillies was the change he needed to become elite.

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They laughed at Louis Armstrong when he said he was going to the moon. Now he's up there, laughing at them.

Lol he was the NL MVP favorite earlier in the week when he wasn't even on a team.

But yeah hitting in CBP is only going to help

"I regret nothing. The end." - Ron Swanson

Phillies went from 18-1 to 12-1 to win the WS as soon as this was announced. 6-1 to win the NL.

Phillie fans lining up at CBP right now buying tickets. People can say what they will, and I would be the last person to say that this signing is a guaranteed slam dunk. But if you understand our sports mentality, you will understand why this is a huge deal. Alum, you know what I mean. People keep saying that now he will get booed a bunch of times at Nats Park. Oh well, he can cry into his piles of money while he hits dingers at CBP.

Even as a Nats fan, while I wont bother booing, why would Harper getting booed at Nats Park be any different than any other away park? He gets booed just about everywhere he goes. The best has to be the Braves, especially this last season, the organist trolled Harper super hard with the songs he played every time Harper came up. One time is was playing Go Cubs Go, another was New York, New York, also used Imperial March for a second shot at the Evil Empire. Apparently the most appropriate one he intended to use but never got to would have been the Rocky theme song.

Oh hell yeah I know what you mean. This is a signal of the end of the rebuild in Philly and a signal that management just opened the contention window and they're going for it every year for... Hell, the next decade. That more than anything is exciting. And at a time when the Birds just won the Super Bowl, the Sixers are a legit contender (if GSW collapses), and the Flyers just found a goalie... It is starting to look like we are entering an extremely exciting period of sports in the city.

Sports center also just said that Harper has the best slugging % in CBP history. The guy with the second best is Rhys Hoskins.... And they are going to bat back to back in this lineup. Insane

"I regret nothing. The end." - Ron Swanson

Aka "Signal to the "lifelong Phillies fans" to start caring for the first time since 2011"

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

you phrased this like it's a dig but it's really not, those were some pretty awful Phillies teams getting put out there for the last 6 years or so. A lot of people still cared, they just did it passively.

21st century QBs Undefeated vs UVA:
MV7, MV5, LT3, Josh Jackson, Jerod Evans, Michael Brewer, Tyrod Taylor, Sean Glennon, and Grant Noel. That's right, UVA. You couldn't beat Grant Noel.

Following the Phils the last 7-8 years has been an endeavor in how much pain one is willing to accept before tapping out. The fanbase has always been there but man, it's been rough to follow a team that purposely didn't care to win. Now just sign another rotation arm and let's kick this thing into high gear.

"I regret nothing. The end." - Ron Swanson

Is this serious? Because the majority of MLB fan bases have endured far worse for far longer than the Phillies having a couple rebuilding years. Good grief.

Joffrey, Cersei, Ilyn Payne, the Hound, Jeff Jagodzinski, Paul Johnson, Pat Narduzzi.

Orioles fan since 1995 here to back this statement up. Couple of decent years recently, among mostly historically bad seasons for the better part of 25 years.

It's amazing what finally actually having a shot to win something does for a front-running sports city and how everyone rushes to one-up each other in demonstrating their love for their team when there's finally success. It's every fan base and sports city. I think too many people use the phrase "die hard" loosely.

Having said that, I particularly remember "lifelong die hards" come out of the woodwork in 2008 too...and in 2018 when the Eagles won. (Remember when Alum was a panthers fan? lol)

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

Whatever, I can't speak for anyone else. But I've been an Eagles fan since age 9 (2000 or so), and a Phillies/Flyers/Sixers fan since about the same time, and though my level of passion for each team has vacillated I've never switched to other squads, or been tempted to.

and yes, I 'member that.

21st century QBs Undefeated vs UVA:
MV7, MV5, LT3, Josh Jackson, Jerod Evans, Michael Brewer, Tyrod Taylor, Sean Glennon, and Grant Noel. That's right, UVA. You couldn't beat Grant Noel.

Speaking of the Birds, looks like they just extended Brandon Graham

"I regret nothing. The end." - Ron Swanson

I can understand why you dislike Philly fans. Its cool.

But to call Philly a frontrunning sports town shows a deep misunderstanding of the sports scene there on your part in my opinion. I would put up the passion of an Eagles fan against a Giants fan any day of the week

Sure every fan base is going to have its wagon jumpers. But if you look at some of the periods of futility that all 4 major sports teams have had there and think there arn't diehard fans, you are just wrong. I would agree that the Phillies have perhaps a higher percentage of "new fans" especially in 2008. but that has as much to do with the logistics of a baseball season than anything else. But the Eagles, Flyers, and Sixers have received a ton of support from the fan base even when they arn't any good (which has been long stretches of time for those teams, even though the Flyers did make the playoffs something like 19 out of the last 23 seasons). They just had the highest rated Stadium Series game in year for a team thats not even in the playoffs at this point.

I meant it as more of a general statement about fandom, but the shoe fits for Philadelphia as much as any city.

As a Philadelphia sports fan, you look at fan base, see the die hard fans and say "yup, they sure are die hard fans". I look at the fan base from the outside in (although having lived in that market for four years), and see a bunch of frontrunners who come out of the woodwork whenever the teams start doing really well and try telling everyone how much of a fan they've always been.

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

I don't think he'll get booed particularly badly when he comes to Nats Park. In fact I think he'll get a lot of cheers as well as boos. Most Nats fans like me have always assumed it was at least 80% that he'd sign his second contract somewhere else, we just assumed it would be with the Yankees.

I like Harper, but the reason he didn't re-sign with the Nats is not that they couldn't re-sign him, it's that they were never going to pay that kind of money to a player who, frankly, just isn't good enough and reliable enough to risk of a 10 (or 13!) year contract. Mike Rizzo is one of the best GMs in MLB, and I don't think he even gave any serious thought to giving Harper a contract like that.

I respect the Phillies and their fan base. I'm old enough to remember the great Mike Schmidt, and the heartbreak of my Astros losing to the eventual World Series champs in the 1980 NLCS. If Harper stays healthy, I think Philly has a decent chance to go to the World Series in 2019, since they are in the NL. If they were in the AL, though, I wouldn't give them much chance against the Yankees, Astros and Red Sox.

The doll's trying to kill me and the toaster's been laughing at me.

Pitching wins baseball games. It doesn't matter how short the fences are if you strike out.

Wrong thread

Smart move by Bryce team, he has so many injuries and was a catcher in lots of his prep years so who knows when his knees will fail him.

I can imagine no more rewarding a career. And any man who may be asked in this century what he did to make his life worthwhile, I think can respond with a good deal of pride and satisfaction:
β€œI served in the United States Navy"

KCCO

This is the worst kind of disaster. An American tragedy.

You make me sad, and should feel bad.

Wait this is baseball who cares

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Question for the Phils fans..... how are you going to treat Bryce when he wears a Cowboys jersey to an Eagles game and Golden Knights jersey to a Flyers game?

You will see this game, this upset and this sign next on ESPN Sportscenter. Virginia Tech 31 Miami 7

personally, I don't care. Others will boo him and hate on him for it, but it won't be the end of the world. Much like if I was an LA fan, I wouldn't really care that Trout is a huge Eagles fan when they're playing the Rams.

"I regret nothing. The end." - Ron Swanson

Much like if I was an LA fan, I wouldn't really care that Trout is a huge Eagles fan when they're playing the Rams.

Angels and Rams fans don't really intersect, so I understand what you're suggesting, but your example isn't great.

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The Cowboys jersey might get him a few boos, but I don't think anyone will care about the Knights. For starters, we all know he is from Vegas, and secondly there is zero animosity between Vegas and Philly in terms of hockey. Nothing wrong with supporting your home town. What Philly fans really don't like is when guys from PA and New Jersey go around wearing Cowboys gear.

Now if he wore a Penguins jersey...

What would happen if he wore a Santa Claus suit?

The doll's trying to kill me and the toaster's been laughing at me.

Well if he's falling down drunk, he'll get boo'd just like the last one!

"I regret nothing. The end." - Ron Swanson

Sorry I know that wasn't fair, I just couldn't resist. ;-)

The doll's trying to kill me and the toaster's been laughing at me.

now that he's moved to Philly he should be a Hokie fan, why isn't he getting a Kerry Blackshear jersey???

21st century QBs Undefeated vs UVA:
MV7, MV5, LT3, Josh Jackson, Jerod Evans, Michael Brewer, Tyrod Taylor, Sean Glennon, and Grant Noel. That's right, UVA. You couldn't beat Grant Noel.

At this point I expect everyone who lives in NJ to be a Duke fan.

"I regret nothing. The end." - Ron Swanson

And there's a lot of chatter going on right now that Harper and Trout have been talking behind the scenes throughout this process and that the wheels are in motion for Trout to join the Phils in a couple years. I'll believe it when I see it, but supposedly Trout also informed the Angels he isn't interested in negotiating an extension until the end of next season, pretty much signaling he's intending to enter free agency.

"I regret nothing. The end." - Ron Swanson

It wouldn't surprise me. I think a big part of Harper's deal, especially his own insistence what there is a no trade clause and no opt outs, is that he wants to make it clear to other big stars that he will be here for the long haul and he wants them to come play along with him.

At the current AAV, the Phillies will have more than enough money to sign Trout in the future and still stay below the luxury tax level.

Trout is building a huge home in Millville, and I don't think it's a stretch to say he would love to play close to home.

Trout and Harper in the same outfield and lineup would keep CBP full for a long time

That daily commute will really get after ya.

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

Millville, NJ

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

I think a big part of Harper's deal, especially his own insistence what there is a no trade clause and no opt outs, is that he wants to make it clear to other big stars that he will be here for the long haul and he wants them to come play along with him.

After following Harper as a Nats fan (even well before he was a Nat, as it was very apparent that the last place Nats were going to draft him), I don't think the thought of other big stars crossed his mind at all. He's too self-centered to worry about other big stars (which, arguably he should be given his talents).

My hypothesis, which is all conjecture, is that he was sold on the idea that he would have the largest contract ever in history. That's been one of his goals since he was drafted. Turns out, 29 teams didn't think he was worth of a contract of that stature. Only the Phillies did, and they likely didn't reach record numbers in their first few rounds of negotiations. The early contract proposals were likely under $325M , which also likely included the pretty standard opt out clauses for star players. Phillies bumped it up to $330 and removed the opt outs. Harper wants to make history, so he agrees.

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The early contract proposals were likely under $325M , which also likely included the pretty standard opt out clauses for star players. Phillies bumped it up to $330 and removed the opt outs.

I'm sure that the original wasn't for 13 years, either, and lengthening the contract to 13 years was what made the Phillies amenable to pushing it up to $330M.

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

also good point. By extending the contract, it's similar to deferring payments. It reduces the overall value of the contract. $25Mil in 2032 isn't the same as $25Mil in 2019.

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Phillies bumped it up to $330 and removed the opt outs. Harper wants to make history, so he agrees.

It's also worth noting that it took a 13 year deal to make that happen. Not sure anyone was expecting that kind of term (I think most of the rumors were 10). It definitely makes the annualized amount much easier to stomach if he really did just care about the total dollars. Curious what this ends up looking like a decade from now.

My understanding is the contract is heavily frontloaded, which is why Philly insisted on no opt outs. Bryce countered with no trade clause so that once the AAV falls, if Philly wants to ship him out for any reason, he can demand a renegotiated contract with the new team to lift his no trade clause

2019 - $10m plus $20m signing bonus
2020-28 - $26m per year
2029-31 - $22m per year

Spread out fairly evenly

"I regret nothing. The end." - Ron Swanson

Yes it's really not that front loaded. A signing bonus of that size makes sense

It is going to look like crap a decade from now. Almost every long-term contract looks OK for the first few years and then looks like a dumpster fire for the rest of the term. It isn't the mess of Albert Pujols but it will be up there. I keep expecting NHL and MLB GM's to wise up but there is always some guy who thinks his team is close.

*next CBA steps right in*

It's a multi-billion dollar industry. The players have to get paid their share somehow...there's gotta be a way they can come to an agreement on how to be compensated. Maybe it's the insane deal the Dodgers supposedly threw out? Maybe it's the $30m/yr the nats offered. Something's gotta be done...13 year deals into players' late 30s ain't it.

The way free agency has gone the past 2-3 years, expect a strike pretty damn soon.

Amateur superstar and idiot extraordinaire.

The Capitals long term deal with Ovechkin looks genius now considering where he ranks on current contracts. Its tied for 8th highest and gets passed every time a contract gets handed out. Harpers could eventually look the same, especially if it has the effect on the Phils that Jayson Werth's did on the Nationals. That or the National League gets the DH which could let Harper become just a hitting machine late in his career and pad stats so he hits career milestones that put attention back on the Phils. Regardless if short term it helps them recruit top talent then it will have paid for itself

A comment was made over the weekend by a former GM that it's already a lock that Trout is coming to Philly in a few years

Yeah, and that was right after the rumors that Trout informed the Angels he wouldn't discuss an extension until after next season, when he's ready to hit Free Agency.

Harper also made a not so subtle reference to the possibility of signing Trout when discussing why he went with
a long term at a lower AAV rather than a massive AAV on a short deal.

"I regret nothing. The end." - Ron Swanson

which were followed by rumors that the Angels are considering offering Trout 10 years 350M right now.

That still doesn't mean he's willing to listen, or willing to accept.

I still don't think he'll be in Philadelphia, and I think he'll end up extending in LA. But I also believe he's going to let himself get to FA to maximize his value. For him, there is zero sense in locking himself into anything now. He's set to obliterate all athlete contracts in AAV and term on the open market. If LAD was offering Harper $45m, its crazy to imagine what Trout will get.

"I regret nothing. The end." - Ron Swanson

If Trout has indicated to the Angels his intentions to hit FA, we may see him on a new team as soon as this year. The Angels don't want to find themselves in the same position as Washington ended up in with Harper. They may look to trade for high end value before it gets to that point.

He has a full No Trade Clause. If he's intent on riding this out to FA and making it known he isn't willing to negotiate until after the 2020 season, and he's able to control where he can be traded to, they might not be able to get anything close to fair market value for him. Especially if it becomes known he has desires to play in one specific market under a new deal.

Then again, not fair market value is still better than nothing.

"I regret nothing. The end." - Ron Swanson

It is funny to think about Ovechkin's contract now. From 2013-2017, people were crying to Ted to find a way to trade him as they believed his 9.538m AAV was hindering the Caps chances of signing the players needed to improve/get over the 2nd round/Pens hump.

Now they finally got the monkey off their backs, no one blinks an eye at his cap hit as like you said it gets passed every time a new contract gets handed out and of course as the salary cap goes up too.

Bleeding burnt orange and chicago maroon

Phillies box office reports that they have sold 4 millions tickets since yesterday

Are you sure it isn't 4 billion?

The doll's trying to kill me and the toaster's been laughing at me.

My kids have tennis each Saturday morning adjacent to where the Giants have their Spring Training fields. The kids love to go watch when we are done and usually get a ball from the players.

Today I may or may not have yelled "We got Harper!" to the team

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HAHAHAHA

You will see this game, this upset and this sign next on ESPN Sportscenter. Virginia Tech 31 Miami 7

Not terribly surprising. The city is buzzing about the kid. People want CBP to turn back into the place to be on a weeknight. Fans loved his intro press conference (I particularly liked his mention of Halliday and why he did not ask for #34 or #7).

As I said up above, there are those guys on other teams that we think are huge assholes.

But once they are here, well dammit they are our asshole.

But once they are here, well dammit they are our asshole.

Yeeeaaaaah. People keep asking about how Philly is going to treat him. Are you kidding me, Philly is going to LOVE him because of his attitude in the same way the city swoons over Embiid.

"I regret nothing. The end." - Ron Swanson

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

uhhh-AAAAAAAAHHHH-uuhhhh

"I regret nothing. The end." - Ron Swanson

You gotta pay the troll toll, to get in that boys oul

"I regret nothing. The end." - Ron Swanson

Gah!

"I regret nothing. The end." - Ron Swanson

Chase who?

I'm here for the memes, I just stay for the football.

....yeah, Philadelphia is really going to hate this guy....

"I regret nothing. The end." - Ron Swanson

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21st century QBs Undefeated vs UVA:
MV7, MV5, LT3, Josh Jackson, Jerod Evans, Michael Brewer, Tyrod Taylor, Sean Glennon, and Grant Noel. That's right, UVA. You couldn't beat Grant Noel.

The piece ESPN.com had on him yesterday was a great read. CBP is going to go nuts for this guy, and lost in all of it is the fact that the Phillies lineup should be really freakin good this year.

By all accounts out of Clearwater Realmuto looks like he is ready to have a monster year too

They just need another starter and I'll feel real confident about a potential run this year. Nola is already great, and I know Pivetta is expected to break out, but we just need one more and things should line up nicely.

The lineup is going to put up some huge numbers, especially in CBP. Add another big arm to that rotation, and they'll be a very tough out against anyone.

"I regret nothing. The end." - Ron Swanson

Apparently scouts are really liking what they are seeing out of Arrieta so far this spring. It took him awhile to figure out how to pitch without the same velocity he used to have, but now that he has figured it out a bit I wouldn't be surprised to see him round back in to a high end #2

So yall think Mike Trout is worth $430 million or....?

It all depends on how the Angels next television contract negotiation goes. If they continue to get paid enormous amounts of money it likely revolves around Trout so yes. If the contracts decline with cord cutting, etc, then likely no. Regardless, Arturo Moreno and his ownership group are going to be fine. They paid $183.5M for the Angels in 2003, the current Forbes valuation on the team is $1.8B. A nice 1000% return in 15 years. The team had roughly $350M in revenue in 2018, with payroll expenses of $188M, so even with the bump, I think they will still be fine.

He's worth what the market will pay him. Given that he likely secures the Angels at minimum another 10-12 years of their $150M a year TV deal, then he is clearly worth it.

Same with Harper. You don't pay a guy $330M if he isn't making back at least that much for you (and lets be real, the Phillies are going to make a LOT of money off Harper). Same with Trout. The Angels arn't even a good team, but they will recoup this money and then some easily.

He's absolutely worth every penny and probably more.

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

He is the most talented player in league. Angels fan love him. But, Angels continue to muck around in mediocrity while Trout continues to put up MVP numbers season after season.

Arguably, an outfielder in the MLB is like a RB in the NFL. Is the best outfielder really that much better than the next guy up?

Investing in pitching seems to get the most out of your dollars. Building a solid rotation around Ohtani would probably benefit the Angels the most. With that said, there aren't too many Kershaw-level pitchers to go around.

If you're going to invest in an outfielder, there isn't one better than Trout.

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