Virginia Tech announced Babcock will be available to the media at 1:00 PM ET tomorrow.
Virginia Tech Director of Athletics Whit Babcock will be available via Zoom on Tuesday. Mr. Babcock will be available to answer questions on topics pertaining to Tech Football and Tech Athletics following his opening statement.
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Where can I see a replay or at least a transcript of the presser today?
Yea this gif didnt age well.
does anyone have the link to the noon presser?
Not to be a debbie downer, but it sure sounds like Fuente is staying based on that statement...
On the flip side....no AD in their right mind schedules a presser and says "This is a presser to fire the head football coach"
I just find it strange that he would do it on the day that the buyout drops. I feel like if he was staying you'd want to announce that as soon as possible to stabilize recruiting this close to signing day.
Great point we're 2 days from ESD. With the state of the program if Fu is the guy going forward you would probably say that. On the other hand if that's the case the recruits have been reassured that.
On the other, other hand this conference could be completely unrelated and more related to participation in a bowl game.
Yep, I think a deal in principal has been worked out with someone. Fu fired tomorrow morning, as soon as the buyout drops. Deal is inked with new guy. Presser to introduce new coach and retain recruits.
No sauces, just my hunch
You would either have to do it this way or wait till after ESD and have a bad look on a bunch of recruits who just signed on early signing day.
That's my thing...if they are gonna make the move, it'll look real bad IMO to do it after ESD to retain 'croots. Besides, doing it after ESD wouldn't necessarily keep said croots, would it? Couldn't they just hit the portal?
via GIPHY
What if Whit tells FuMan that he needs to change his offensive coaching staff to stay and FuMan refuses and quits......does this change the buyout? Seems like it would.
I think Fuente's agent would fire him
I could see a need for a press conference if you are keeping Fuente but dramatically altering the coaches under him while also announcing HokieClub changes
You think he's having a press conference just to say Fuente isn't being let go?
Yes!
(Since everyone was saying "No" in the other thread 🤣)
If he's staying, what's the point of a presser?
There's no benefit at all to Whit standing out there and saying he's sticking with Fuente. If you're sticking with the guy, you pretend like all the rumors were just that and stay the hell away from the media. Then when someone asks you at a presser down the road if you were thinking of getting rid of Fuente, you dismiss it as nonsense and move on.
Actually, if he is staying, I would be disappointed if we didn't hear from whit before signing day.
Fuente's name isn't on that release. He gone.
Bitter has a point
The man gets paid to put words on
papera computer screen for a reason.Let's get to it..are you going to #MaketheMove?
The only thing I can confidently predict is that most of us are going to be mad no matter what he says tomorrow
Insert Morgan Freeman Gif
Can't wait until it's just a statement about the bowl game
So I'd say odds are it's announcing something with the bowl game? Versus firing Fuente.
Genuinely asking here, but did the Pitt, LOLUVa, and BC ADs have actual press conferences when they announced that they weren't going to bowl games, or did they just issue press releases?
UVA only did a press release
Would that need a schedule press conference? That seems like a simple release would due.
Perhaps the announcement is that we're taking advantage of the NCAA's recent announcement that schools can schedule a game if their conference had an affiliated bowl that got cancelled
Tech has the bowl streak none of them do. But who knows. Just feels like there would be a lot of major sources reporting he was gone if it was happening.
Outside of Tech fans, nobody cares about the bowl streak.
You say that, but I just googled "longest bowl streak." There was article after article about that. People may not (directly) care about ours, but they certainly care enough for lots of the sports sites to keep doing articles about it. And guess what, no matter who people are hoping to see on the list of active streaks - we're number 1. Would you rather not have us on that list, sitting at number 1? I know I'd rather have us there.
You say that, but nobody knew about Fuente being hired until it was announced. Whit definitely seems like can keep a lid on things.
99.9% it's about letting Fu go
That .01% will get after ya
what about the other 0.09%?
Everyone set speculation to maximum
Maybe he's already introducing the new HC
Let's face it, regardless of reason everybody is mad that it has come to this point. Fuente refusal to adapt his offensive personnel and/or scheme has a lot to bear on how we got to this point.
Fu was done in by excuses and recruiting. Flirting with Baylor shortened his leash- Whit was not the least bit happy about that - make no mistake. But the fu era at VT is marked with excuse after excuse and poor recruiting. that's what got him fired.
Sauces? So much speculating is going on in this thread, let's stick to facts.
/thread - since we don't actually know any.
If you don't want to speculate, maybe the internet isn't the place for you.
Yeah, if it was made, I wonder if Whit even came to him with two options, maybe not recently but possibly last year too. Option A: fire Corny Shibest and remake your O. Option B: If this doesn't go well again / get lost.
Generally from what I remember Whit was always fairly out there in support of Fu when things were dicey. It has been radio silence this year.
This.
Whit knows when to keep quiet or speak up. He's been full blown radio silent minus the Cassell upgrades.
It'll be interesting to hear Whit speak about the football team at all even if Fuente stays since Whit has been pretty silent recently. I'd like to read the body language when he talks about Fuente. Will he look confident speaking about him after a performance like this year? Let the speculation begin.
I hate to rain on anybody's parade, but this doesn't feel like a change is being made. No inside info, just a gut feeling.
Funny, see my comment above...i get the complete opposite feel
I agree, it costs $0 to endorse Fuente today but saves $2.5 million by waiting to fire him tomorrow. Although there's an increasing amount of smoke that Fuente is staying. Brett McMurphy just tweeted it out so there's a lot of confidence on it.
What does it feel like then? How often does whit do this sort of thing and what is the usual purpose? Feels like a BIG announcement.
Going to be a wild next two days between this presser and ESD Wednesday.
edit: If Fuente gets fired, or if his status is still undecided come Wednesday, I would expect a lot of our commits to suddenly delay their signing. They might make up a reason for doing so, but the real reason is to buy time and see what will happen with the job. I don't blame them if they do, and neither should you.
That's it...we need to go check all of our '21 recruits twitter feeds, see if we see any clues from new follows or retweets of coaches from other teams!
S/!
To be clear, the buyout drops Wednesday right? I wonder if that is something Whit and Fuente could collectively agree to cut a day short on in interest of recruits signing?
the contract language is "If the University terminates on or after December 15, 2020, and prior to December 15, 2021, the University will pay Fuente $10,000,000."
so it drops Tuesday... at least that's how the 2017 is worded (and I assume the 2018 is the same but I haven't seen a copy of it).
Fuente Contract 2017-2023
thanks, fixed it. yea, I'm not best transcriber....
Thank you for that. It wasn't how I remembered it.
EDIT: Also, who can livestream the presser?
Unless another release is made before 1pm Tuesday, I don't think Babcock telling a virtual room of reporters that Fuente is fired is going to happen.
Now I'm thinking it will be something like contract negotiation took place (changed buyout language) and that some other coaches will not be retained for the bowl and going forward.
why would buyout language be changed if he's retained? I don't see the logical connection or why that would ever be press worthy.
And why wait until the date the buyout drops to tell anybody that? Why not yesterday? Any news about keeping the HC, as others have pointed out, seems like it should be done as far ahead of signing day, not as close as possible to it without being on it (maybe because of a buyout dropping?).
Given that the season ended at 11 pm on Saturday night, negotiations wouldn't have started until Sunday at the earliest and those things typically take more than a couple of hours. I realize in internet time, its been forever since the end of the regular season, but its really only been 2 days (+ a half if you count today).
I guess that assumes you think there was negotiating. No negotiations would mean he could have done it yesterday. I'm not sure why people really think there would be negotiating - there were already large changes to the staff last year that had very little results in recruiting. Recruiting (specifically bad results on the recruiting trail) almost definitely aren't going to be fixed by replacing Cornelson. I've seen Shibest's name in there, but he's done good work with the TEs, punters and kickers, with the return game being the weak area. So 2 out of 3 areas haven't been good, and we seem to have recruited some good TEs. So iffy on Shibest, which leaves Cornelson and maybe Jafar Williams. Again, I think it's a bigger problem than replacing Cornelson. So toss out negotiations, and you're back to having the meeting yesterday. Throw in that there is noise about Whit meeting with potential HC candidates, (assuming names are noise because of Whit's secrecy), it sounds like Whit is trying to replace Fuente rather than keep him. And if the theory that he exhausted all his other HC replacement possibilities, announce yesterday that you're keeping Fuente because of the recruits, then you can negotiate with him over other staffing whenever, 2-3 weeks from now if he wants.
Not going to lie, looking at the latest rumblings, and now an actual press conference, I think Fu is staying. This is going to be god awful.
What rumblings?
247 insiders
are their insiders more reliable than our insiders?
Don't know. I don't normally keep up with either
many of the rumors come from the same place... inside of their backsides
this thread is absolutely fascinating to me. People are convinced that this press conference is designed to announce the firing of Fuente and the hiring of a new coach. People are convinced that this press conference is designed to announce that Fuente is here to stay. Like, how can the same news be that clear of an indicator of both outcomes?
Schrodinger's presser.
We're both screwed and not screwed at the same time?
No, we're screwed either way. The question is, does one particular screwing lead us to a less-screwed future?
People believe what they want to believe, or are trying to brace for the opposite. That's where the multiple things come from just based on rampant speculation at this point, and projections onto Whit.
I did not read any of the other comments yet. But the only thing that makes it very interesting to me is that the conference is with Whit only. Says nothing about Fuente. If he was staying why would Fuente not be involved in a press conference about Football?
Whit had to address the media after the Baylor fiasco and Fuente never said a word about it. I imagine this will be the same thing. You don't have a full blown press conference to announce you're firing someone. My guess is an endorsement of Fuente, talk about how Covid impacted the athletic budget tremendously, and maybe some assistant staff changes coming at most. Fuente will say nothing and just post an awkward picture on Twitter the next day like, "Ready to roll for 2021!"
Under normal circumstances, maybe. But not on the eve the buyout of your head coach drops 2 million and the fan base is already thirsting. That would be a bad move on Whit.
Welcome to the internet. You must be new here...
We live in a cocksure society. Everyone thinks they know everything about everything.
Maybe it's okay to say "I, for one, have no fucking idea what they are going to say tomorrow."
I for one have no idea what they are going to say tomorrow.
Man that felt good.
You left out the best word.
I've got no fucking clue what is going down tomorrow!
Kinkiest thing I've read today.
VT announces a newly expanded Hampton Roads campus to go with the Blacksburg and Nova campuses. The AD is doing the announcement to coincide with the launch of the Deep Sea Sport Fishing team (a spin-off of the Bass Fishing team) and Surfing Team. Absolutely nothing gets said about football.
It would actually be hilarious if you were right
You can't let facts get in the way of speculation.
The AD is doing the announcement to coincide with the launch of the Deep Sea Sport Fishing team
Under our head coach French, we are going to beat the shit out of UVA.
This would be a thing, man.
I heard that Corn is out and French is in.
Seems odd if there is going to be a change that they wouldn't have a meeting to tell the team first
Maybe it's different in sports programs but we just had a round of layoffs at work last week and the meeting to discuss wasn't even scheduled until after the finished letting everyone know they were done.
I'm not a lawyer, but can anyone legally say in any way, shape, or form that Fuente is being let go before tomorrow? So if the team is told today and Fuente is told tomorrow could Fu sue for the extra $2.5MM on grounds that the decision was made before the drop in the buyout?
I've worked a lot on contracts (not a lawyer, but a lot of training for my job), and I think Whit could give him something probably in writing, so no confusion, saying that, as of Dec. 15th, he was being let go, but would remain head coach until that time.
Hell, we do that all the time in construction as an emailed notice to proceed (NTP). Basically, "you are directed to do X work at Y price based on correspondence Z. Change order to contract forthcoming".
EDIT: Saw this issue addressed by CMM down below. Couldn't happen without possibly getting rolled into a potential lawsuit.
Telling the team is how you'd get a leak of a change. Not telling the team you're keeping Fuente despite all the rumors is an interesting take though. If Fuente knew he was staying, would he tell the team, or just keep on going like nothing else was going on?
No way you would hold a team meeting with 18-22 year olds that their coach is getting shitcanned.
Do you want a leak? Because that's how you get leaks.
I mean....
That is awkward if Fuente is getting canned tomorrow.
Agreed. That seems odd.
Insert comment about Greenberg with a recruit when news dropped....
Not really shocking, even if he is assuredly gone tomorrow. I mean, how many times have we seen a similar situation occur in pro-sports? Sometimes, like in the NBA, with guys actively on the court and warming up, or on the diamond in the MLB, as his teammates are all looking at their phones in the locker room learning news that he doesn't yet know about in regards to a release or trade.
If you wanna fire a guy on 12/15 and he has a job to do on 12/14 he's still gotta do that job. Otherwise you've fired him on 12/14 and owe him $12.5M instead of $10M.
There is a lot of truth to this legally. You can't tell someone that you're going to fire them on a future day, because as soon as you say that you have effectively fired them with the announcement. So, you almost have to act ho-hum, nothing to see hear, until the day of reckoning.
I thought you could give them something saying as of a certain date, maybe also including language that in the interim, they're still the coach. Like are lay-off notices given in advance or, "go ahead and go home?" Maybe something saying the expectation is to fulfill duties until the day of?
We just went through a round of corporate layoffs last week. Those impacted were told that it is effective Dec 31st, and they were still employed between now and then. Their termination is effective that time, even if they knew about it early.
Granted we are all At Will employees and not under contract. I'm sure there is different legal languages when you're a contracted employee.
You could, but I guess I should have said it this way. Telling a person they will be fired on a future day could be interpreted as being fired effective immediately. For instance, if Whit tells Fuente you will be fired tomorrow and dont do TTL tonight, Whit effectively relieved him from at least some aspects of his job that can be interpreted as an effective firing. If I was a lawyer for VT, and $2.5M was on the line, I would advise that Whit continue to act as if Fuente is 100% employed until the day that the buyout drops. Otherwise, Fuente would have an argument to sue for that $2.5M that would be a hassle for the University and likely ends up in some arbitration settlement (and prudent lawyers would help him get that money and take 30% off the top).
agreed
I will definitely be listening to see if I can glean anything from Fuente
He is going to settle the pie vs cake debate!
Whit is announcing the new head coach tomorrow. However, in a surprise twist, Whit will also announce that Fuente is also being retained. Whit explains that since we would have to pay Fuente $10,000,000 in order to fire him, we might as well keep him on the staff and get $10,000,000 of value out of him over his remaining contract period. Fuente will be allowed to assist in whatever manner he feels will be the most value to the team.
Fuente stays at HC, but Cornelson is fired and replaced by Tony Elliott as a $3mil OC. We're $3mil+ cheaper than a buyout and the next head coach has a year in the program before taking over.
Shibest gets a raise to $2M because all of a sudden he's nowhere close to the highest paid assistant on staff, and we just can't have that now can we?
would it really be more valuable to pay Fuente $4M to be head coach in name only and take up a coaching roster spot?
Appreciate the humor though.
Theoretically he could become special assistant to the AD for $4mil.
If this is to convince us it's a great idea to keep him around, they can spare us the bullshit. Just admit that we're throwing in the towel on being a competitive football program and leave it at that.
Tomorrow may be the day I just stop caring about VT football completely. If they throw in the towel, it's probably time for me to as well.
Hopefully it will be definitive one way or the other so that we can move forward (or move on).
If it's a meeting to sell fuente and why he should stay whit needs to start drinking right about 4 hours ago to be drunk enough to find good reasons to not make a change
This site is going to burn to the ground tomorrow isn't it?
One way or another. Godspeed Joe and mods
I expect some Beamer 404s tomorrow for sure, no matter how this presser shakes out.
this is nothing compared to the 247 board
That 247 board might need to be quarantined from the internet. The second the rumor started spreading the school was going to fund it and not the AD I had a feeling it might not happen.
I'm calling it
Fuente Fired coming soon. Presser to introduce Bud as interim until a replacement can be found. He goes on to win us a game at the Military Bowl.
/S unless it's true
I said it earlier on, I think CJF is staying around, no #sauces, but I think he'll have another year to prove himself. Because of this, we are all setting ourselves up for a major letdown. I'll eat crow if I'm wrong.
Edit: Thanks for confirming Hammer Time (see below)
2020 strikes again!!!
CZY and TCB, the Insiders on 247 (from the free side, not behind the paywall) have effectively confirmed Fuente is not being fired.
My nightmare:
Whit announces no changes except he's re-negotiated a home and home series with ECU until 2057.
And the VT official beer is 'Bud Light Chelada.'
aaannnd, the graphics dept has changed the logo yet again:
That logo still looks better than the stupid new academic logo
This definitely looks like Fuente is not getting fired. Whit is selling the program and whatever smaller changes are happening (different assistants, more money for recruiting staff, etc). He's stepping up to face the firing squad, just like he did after Fuente flirted with Baylor. You don't get the AD on Zoom the day he fires his coach.
He has likely kicked the tires on the better options and doesn't like what he sees.
Tough spot for us to be in because there's no way a big-time OC comes in with a lame-duck coach. And, that is the only other thing we could have done that would have inspired a hint of optimism.
Promise, I won't be mad if I am 100% wrong, so don't waste your time calling me out on it.
We actually have a big time OC on staff. Maybe he should own the offense next season.
I think this is what is happening as well
And quite frankly if it is, I really don't care what reasons are given, I'm out. And Whit will deservedly see his seat get scalding hot over the next few months
Can't wait to keep Fuente only to see him sign a shit class for the 3rd year in a row.
Exactly, this decision will seal Whit's fate and define his legacy. That is why I thought he would #makethemove.
If Whit knows what it would take for Fuente and staff can go from what we are NOW to what we all expect (competent offense, open and personable coach who is the face of a family-culture program and fan base, consistent top-30 recruiting), then indeed he is the smartest man in the room. Looking forward to hearing it, can't imagine I would be convinced.
So if fuente is staying can we still fire corny/shibest and let french take over?
So y'all saying French should take over...are you forgetting the valuable content that we'd be losing on TKP? Sorry, don't want.
Ultimate insider
This is more exciting than Christmas morning, when I don't know if I'm getting a new snowboard or a can of Jumex from my weird uncle.
Bowl game news? We opting out too?
What's the O/U on "Aged Like Milk" posts tomorrow?
This is the equivalent of VT literally telling the fan base we don't give a shit about football or you and your money. Going to be nice when donations plummet and Lane isn't even half full on Gameday.
Ugh. If we are getting trolled.....Make the pain stop.
Well, fall saturdays in 2021 just freed up.
Wow very original lol.
Going to go with Teel here the elder statesman of beat reporters in the state.
There sure as hell doesn't appear to be much for Fuente to report on for signing day. SMH.
Question - do we save any money by giving Fuente one more year?
In a normal year, the last regular season game is played thanksgiving weekend (presumably, teams playing in the conference championship games are not the ones replacing their coaches). So, by the time 12/15 rolls around, all the coaching changes are already made and announced.
So - are we essentially committing to TWO more years? Is that the only way the buyout drops below $10M?
In other words - is the reason that buyouts change on 12/15 because in a normal year, that essentially guarantees he will still be your head coach for the following season?
Not all of the coaching changes happen before then, because you still have the NFL ready to come in and take their pick of coaches.
It would depend on the salary of the new coach (and his staff). When I used the reported salary for Shane Beamer for comparison, VT only saved $1M by firing him next year (assuming our assistant coach wages are similar under the new regime).
Link to the comment and data graphic
Virginia Tech Football is officially dead. Very cool!
So either Whit believes in Fuente or whoever Whit reached out to said no.
Either way, Whitt's resume is now called heavily into question if it's true that Fu is staying for '21.
There is one option available that doesn't involve firing anyone.
Fuente comes down his mountain a little bit and takes a more active role in the offense, maybe even making Corny more of an OC in name only. In other words, we get the offensive mind that we paid for.
Right, but I like the firing Corny option better. It's at least a better optic for the fanbase, right?
That's the most ludicrous crap I've ever heard.
Started to type exactly this. Wish I had. Could use a drink. Even if it is 10:30am.
Is there any significance to this being a zoom call with reporters (only)?
If he were introducing a new top whistle, wouldn't it be a live press conference that all could watch?
Pretty sure that if we were changing coaches, the announcements would have to be separate, unless the new coach is already on staff.
This whole thing today has been a PR disaster. Don't call a press conference for the day your hot seat head coach's buyout drops a couple mil and the day before signing day for "questions on topics pertaining to Tech Football" and then go basically radio silent and have people play detective on adjacent press releases. If he ain't going anywhere, definitively say he's the coach next year. Jeez. Frickin shitshow rn.
It is also the day before signing day. I think a press conference was warranted one way or the other. Timing just sucks because of the calendar and contract.
Put out a statement before you announce the press conference. Saying there'll be a press conference created a storm of speculation and expectation that could've easily been avoided.
If this isn't an announcement on coaching changes under fuente I will completely tune out football for the foreseeable future. Shibest and cornelson do not belong on a p5 team and if they're held onto I'll have lost any hope.
What's your issues with Shibest? Other than too many drops by the punt returners, I feel the Special Teams unit has been solid.
Overpaid for the product that he puts out on the field. Too many drops is a huge reason.
In the UVA game alone we had
1. an NFL TE returning punts
2. an NFL TE dropping a punt
3. caught unaware by a fake punt that everyone should have seen coming
4. a special teamer on the kickoff unit drawing a personal foul by piggy backing on a guy for an unnecessary amount of time, which put UVA in good field position and eventually scoring a TD
I can agree with the first 2, and possibly the third, but if no. 4 is a reason to fire a coordinator, every coordinator in the country should be fired.
Of those things, I feel that only #3 is actually within Shibest's control.
1. You have to work with the guys on the roster and not injured or in the HC's doghouse (not saying anyone is, but it happens). Beamer himself said that punt returners are a special breed and guys that can and are willing to do it aren't very common.
2. Mental mistake by a player, could literally happen to anyone.
4. Stupid mistake by a player. I doubt Shibest taught him to do that.
Stroman aside who have they had in the kick return game that was a weapon? We have way too many muff punts and a tight end returning them now since they cant find anyone capable of returning kicks that isnt herbert and we dont need to have our starting RB returning kicks for injurys sake. I wont argue the kicking and punting game has been better but having zero return game makes it harder on everyone else, especially the offense which already gets in its own way everytime it can.
didn't our starting RB David Wilson return kicks? Sometimes even for a TD that turned a game around?
I seem to remember a night game that was tied late in the 4th and he must of had some homework to do or a test to study for and didn't have time to play OT.
Could they possibly be just announcing that Dwayne Lawson is transferring away from VT?
Don't get me wrong I'm no Fuente homer, but I wonder how much, if at all, the fan base trashing the head coach all the time hurts recruiting.
Not trying to be smart, but probably less than the things we're complaining about. Losing to bad teams, no signature wins, lack of perceived incoming talent (you could argue that we have a bunch of diamonds in the rough, but recruits probably just look at stars)
Edit: grammar
I'm not thinking it helps all that much.
Lol. Yay 5 wins and a loss to Liberty! Go Hokies!
Let me know how many recruits that brings in.
it's ok everyone, the press conference is just gonna be this
The folks in Merryman trying to do even the little things right
This looks like the next infomercial on ACCN
No kidding. The optics of this whole thing are just weird.
Perfect gif. What a complete shit show. As someone mentioned above, you scheduled a press conference to discuss VT Football on the day that Fuente's buyout drops and don't say a word? They should have had the press conference yesterday instead of waiting for 24 hrs.
There needs to be some kind of big announcement. Fuente deferring some of his salary to increase the budget for assistants, Corn/Claeys/Shibet gone, etc. etc.
What in the hell does Pete Moris do? Seriously. Public Affairs has been a complete mess under his watch.
There's a public affairs department?
Not since Galen Scott left
Ouch. Just Ouch! Well played.
Golf clap. Well played, sir.
I really hope they don't announce a new fundraising drive or revamp of the Hokie Club tomorrow. Because if they start begging for money the day after this fiasco, I may just disconnect my Internet for the next month to avoid the nuclear meltdown.
Where are TKP/247 servers located? Because if that happens we may very well see the first one turn into a nuclear bomb.
So CJF and his staff get a COVID mulligan, and all of the fans/donors get another off-season of descending hopes and deepening apathy. Whatever the reason might be for this decision, there are only two possible good outcomes.
1. CJF has a lightbulb moment and goes on a win streak to win the division destroying LOLuva in the process. (Unlikely, but hoped for). Or......
2. We get another year of maddening mediocrity and finish with 5-7 wins resulting in another 2.5 million saved and a new head whistle in time for Christmas 2021. (Depressing, but more likely)
No matter which happens, I'll still be cheering for the Hokies and reading the news and views on TKP.
FTFY
Thanks for the update. So did Whit just officially announce that we're a basketball school now? Yay for us. Thanks for the memories Frank, Bud and so many great players, you're all we fans have left to celebrate.
I am somewhat removed from #sauces in a very literal sense but I do have some good donor sauce now... so take the following all as unverified rumors of what is going down:
1) Money was made available, perhaps with some conditions. (this part has been confirmed by multiple #sauces)
2) Decision to move on was made by Whit
3) That decision was over-ruled. Financial position due to Covid being key factor.
4) Whit unhappy
5) Money now pissed off, pushing back. (No idea of the result of this pushback at the moment)
6) Fuente to retain all existing staff if remaining
Some say Fuente is locked in now, some are saying it's a communication shitshow because of the push pull going on behind the scenes and could be he's still gone. We'll see soon.
Argument for presser if retained: Everyone knows there is a loss of confidence. AD makes a presser to bolster that confidence
Argument for presser if removed, despite JF being listed on other pressers: Clear decisive announcement that VT is moving on without JF and actively searching, which should open the pool of candidates. Much like what Illinois did with Lovie Smith recently.
For those calling for Whit's head, at least from what I am being told, he made the right call
I think the following happened:
1) money made available through donors and school
2) decision made by Whit to move on and he was in advanced discussions with a candidate
3) calls a press conference
4) talks break down with candidate
5) Whit decides he isn't going to go past his number 1 and 2 choices
6) Meets with Fuente and decides to keep him
7) still have to have press conference and they're thinking what in the hell they're going to talk about
Has an AD ever actually announced a press conference about replacing a head coach prior to firing the head coach? I don't recall this happening but I'm bad at remembering things like that. Seems out of order though. I think it usually goes that you fire the coach in the morning and then immediately announce a press conference for the afternoon. You don't announce a press conference about a new coach if you haven't fired the current one. I have a hard time believing this press conference was ever intended to announce a coaching change.
At the same time, we all knew when the buyout dropped. Calling a press conference for that day to talk about the future of VT football and for it to be anything but firing him is a complete boneheaded move by the Athletic Department, and more specifically, Whit. Especially when the team just finished with its first regular season losing record in 28 years a few days ago.
If your sources are true, Whit will leave this job as soon as possible.
Not a good idea to overrule an AD like that after things have been put in motion. That's how you torch your school's reputation in the AD inner circle.
Yep. I said it in another thread a week ago or so, but Sands and the culture change throughout the university is a big part of the problem. Football isn't valued at all. If Whit was indeed overruled, then we can all say goodbye to him as well as any hope of ever being relevant again. Who'd want to come here to be an AD or coach after that shit show?
What a fuckin joke. I'm really glad I decided to not make VT football my life on fall weekends anymore. I look forward to the days when I'll actually care enough to follow games from the treestand, because this year I rarely even checked the score.
I just can't believe its true, because that would be such a horrendously bad decision by those in power of the school to override Whit like that, especially if he's already cleared it all with the donors who would be footing the bill.
But
It wouldn't be the first time this school has absolutely stomped on its own dick at the expense of one of our biggest sports. The way we bungled the firing of Seth Greenberg completely torched our reputation in the basketball inner circles, and it took replacing the AD and handing out one of the more expensive contracts in the sport to repair it. It wouldn't be out of character for us to bungle something like this as well.
There is a ton of conflicting information. A lot of people insinuating the ball was in Whit's court and he would have been supported in removing Fu, but he simply chose not to. The entire situation is either the most horribly botched process ever or there is a lot more going on behind the scenes.
another good point. right now it's all conflicting information. Maybe Whit really did make the decision and kept Fuente. It's not what I was told but seems others were told so.
Having watched the presser, I think we can rule this out. He looked defeated, deflated, and like he'd rather be anywhere else in the world. He was gaslighting, and making excuses left and right, with no details about how things will improve.
If it was his choice, and he chose to keep Fuente, he would have come out excited, confident.
A couple of things to try to clamp down on too much reactionary speculation.
Again, this is all sauce through the donor connect I have made. They seem to know some but not all of info, and have checked out a number of times. However, if there was an over-ruling that shouldn't necessarily mean a fuck you to Whit or anyone. 2020 has been a force majeure type of year and they recently announced a 15 million cutback. It's not beyond reason that money involved in the buyout demanded some participation from the school that they couldn't justify under these extraordinary circumstances having just announced said cutbacks and looking at a rough 2021. Or any number of other reasons related to the unique circumstances of today's world.
Secondly, Whit may be unhappy but that doesn't mean he isn't understanding of the decision. I manage staff and sometimes the timing just isn't right to do the things I want. Shit happens and this year has been the largest pile of shit in a very long time.
I've been thinking about this and the "rough 2021" is a factor that nobody has really brought up yet. There is no guarantee that things are back to normal next year, and if money is tight again we don't want to be on the hook for a buyout.
The other thing you could do is take the donor provided buyout, get rid of Fuente, then pay the next coach less, enabling you to save money you couldn't have under Fuente's existing contract. I would think that course, even if they paid 250-500k less would be worth it to the school. And if we were going the Tony Elliot route, where we didn't necessarily have to match a current salary, then maybe pay him less and maybe more in incentives or larger growth year over year or something. The other thing, as many have pointed out, is that keeping Fuente and corresponding downward trajectory of the program seems amazingly shortsighted from the perspective of likely decreasing revenue and decreasing donations (assuming those actually are likely - I mean given the talent returning next year (or rather likely going pro)), even without COVID, are we likely to win more than 5 games? How long do they think fans will continue to buy tickets to watch our team have 4-7 wins a season?
4) Whit unhappy
5) Money now pissed off, pushing back. (No idea of the result of this pushback at the moment)
6) Fuente to retain all existing staff if remaining
Hasn't learned a damn thing.
Can you expand on this. If the money was made available, then why would financial position be a problem? Was this an 'optics' issue, or was the athletic dept planning to rely on funds from the greater university?
Will a TKP staff member be on the Whit Q&A today?
Please do not allow only softball questions to be floated at Whit e.g. "How do you think 2020 went with so many immense challenges to overcome"
Here is the question I want asked: "Recruiting composites have ranked VT at or close to the bottom of the ACC for the last two years. How do you make sense of this for the success of the program and how important is recruiting?"
let's be more direct.
"Recruiting composites have VT ranked at or close to the bottom of the ACC. The past few recruiting drives, like TX2VT, have been abject failures, we have continually failed to recruit well in our own backyard and we are on a downward spiral. Will you require staff changes and a wholesale revamp of Fuente's closed door policy with fans and media, or are we going to allow current practices continue to drag us to the bottom?
Cmon guys, I mean just how bad can recruiting get with a cigar store Indian head coach managing it?
Ok, you are right, ask the question.
I like this Fernley
Ok don't all reved up! We all know the presser will be a 20 minute Spurtle infomercial.
If it gets us that sweet, sweet Spurtle money, I'm in.
This, to me, is why Fuente will never be the right fit at VT.
EDIT: Just want to be clear, this isn't some dated, out of context quote. This was right after Saturday's win against UVA.
Or a fit at any program where football is supposed to drive fundraising. If he doesn't consider the fans or donors to be a part of the process, you're set up for failure at the start.
Yeah, that quote hit me over the head too. And I had the same reaction unfortunately.
does Fuente know about the "This is Home" slogan VT is pushing? VT students and fans have always been part of the family (that was how it was with Beamer anyway) and this flies directly in the face of that. It is extremely disappointing that Fuente thinks it is appropriate to alienate and cut out a majority of the family. It's even more disappointing that Whit is seemingly okay with that. If we think the last 3 years have been tough you just wait. Dark, dark roads ahead.
My guess would be no. I debate even sharing this, but given the extent to which Fuente has walled off the program from the fans over the last few years, I thought it would be relevant in hindsight. Or to perhaps provide some insight into Fu's mindset. Anyway, a short story:
We were at a pretty big tailgate for the Battle at Bristol in 2016 (the setup was complimented by Vols fans and made it on TV IIRC). Some pretty big donors with close connections to the program (close friends with Foster, etc.) were present. Mrs. Fu stopped by and my sister told her "welcome to the family," as is typical when a new coach/player comes on board. She looked at my sis like she had 2 heads and high-tailed it out of there. It was one of the strangest encounters I've ever had with anyone. And while I've not met Fu, it sounds like he is similarly aloof at these kind of events. The sad reality is that the "family" atmosphere that existed under Beamer, Foster, Wiles, Jim Weaver, and even before him with Dave Braine is just not going to exist anymore with our football program. Perhaps the weirdest thing about it is that Mike Young totally gets it and is still as approachable as ever. The wins, losses, and all other things aside, Fuente is just not the right fit for VT. And its a shame that our administration apparently is okay with it.
Lol. I came on here several years back and said that Mrs. Fuente appeared "standoffish" when we saw her at a pregame event of some sort (Hokie Village maybe?). I was basically run out of that thread at the time. Only time I recall being down voted come to think of it. I wonder if in hindsight my observations were that far from reality. Who knows. I don't really care anymore and that's the sad part...
That is telling. That is the antithesis of VT's culture. That is UVA type shit
Unless she's just a very shy, introverted person who is scared of crowds but wants to support her husband at the game. I don't want to go casting UVA aspersions on anybody before I know more about it, because that's a pretty serious personality flaw lol
Reading the article on The Athletic, the rest of that quote isn't much better, talking about just how hard it was for them to even get ready for games this year.
Its like he expects us to believe that COVID is this magical get out of jail free card that absolves him of everything this year. Coach, COVID hit everyone. We're not a delicate flower that was overly impacted by it. Hell, we performed better when we were impacted the most by it, so I'm not sure that's a good excuse.
well to be fair, as I work on a campus...just getting every day tasks completed has been a challenge at times. I can't imagine wrangling a football team, Covid tests, virtual this and that and so on. Then again, my paycheck is missing a few 0's!
Reminds of this quote from Steve Alford
He was fired later that year
This is what stubborn and entrenched coaches say when they know they've lost the fan base.
Babcock just addressed this comment and admitted it was a bad thing to say.
Edit: also kept referring to Fuente as an introvert for his defense for Fuente. Very strange thing to say about a P5 head football coach
not if he's an introvert
Yep. Still not a good excuse for a P5 head coach. Andy Bitter tweeted about some conversations he had with Bronco about being an introvert.
OK - so who's going to host the TKP Zoom session for us to vent real-time?
So how's everyone's productivity today?
I just keep refreshing this, The Athletic, and Reddit. I'm completely useless at work.
i do 90% of my TKPing at work. i'm always almost completely useless.
but i had my annual performance review today and the ol' boss said "great job, just keep doing what you're doing", sooo........... don't mind if i do?
See gif above ^
Man, I got a promotion the year I took over the lead on the Big Board.
You hear that, everyone? The key to success in your career is to TKP Harder
So is there a way to listen or watch live? Sorry if this has been stated.
Doesn't look like it'll be live streamed. Hopefully a media member does some live tweeting for us.
This is the real value of ABitter and press credentials for a TKP staff member.
Won't be live streamed. Will be posted in video form after its been cleaned up and edited.
Fan engagement personified.
VT football has basically become communist Russia. Closed off from the outside. Control the narrative. Shit quality.
ffs i think we can tone down the histrionics a little bit
clearly you haven't been reading the rest of the thread
Edit: this is in reference to toning down the histrionics. The evidence indicates it is not possible.
in Soviet Russia, Football Coach fires you!!
You are looking live at the Whit Babcock football press conference:
Whit Plz
Has this ever worked in our favor?
via GIPHY
is there going to be a "Whit Presser Vent Thread"?
I thought this was already it?
Well, the moment is upon us
is thing accessible anywhere?
no, its closed to the media
Lame. Saw Pete Morris' Tweet that they'll post a video on HokiesFB sometime afterwards. More of the same...
Yeah I'm not sure that doubling down on the process of closing off the team from the fans is the right path to take right now. Especially given the current state of affairs.
Great start to the "Fuente is changing" era!!!
lol
I'm expecting the portal to light up soon...hearing Doug Nester and Bryan Hudson will be some of the first dominoes
i think you replaced ck with n by accident
Closing off this press conference to only the media is not a good look for a football program / athletic department that really needs to see some positive change. It shouldn't be a surprise, but we will continue to get more of the same.
Whit confirms Justin is coming back. Fuck.
son of a bitch!
Whit is tone deaf...
Wake me up when the nightmare is over.
@ByDavidTeel
Hey Whit, we finished with 6 points in the final 30 minutes.
If the scoring had happened in the reverse order...would you be more or less happy...or should we score a TD every possession?
IMO I'd be happier with points in the reverse order. It shows the ability to adapt game plans at halftime and execute in short order. See: Belk Bowl against Arkansas.
And we scored 0 second half points in the two games leading up to this past weekend.
But you'd be complaining that we didn't have a good game plan and need to make adjustments just to score.
Holy shit. The opinions of our opponents swayed them to keep Fuente
David Cutcliffe says nice things about everyone.
In Whit, Mack, and Bronco we trust!
Just like we all had nice things to say about Al Groh and
TimecopMike London I'm sure."Hey Mack, what's your take on Fuente?"
"The best, Whit! The best!"
Would loooove to play cards with Whit.
"What, nooo Whit I got nothing, but you should definitely go all in, I won't call, promise." :/
I saw that and just shook my head...what coach in the ACC wouldn't be aware of why Whit is asking and then sell Fuente to him to keep him right where he is? These coaches aren't dumb. They're going to go after every single advantage that they can...I wouldn't trust the scouting reports of opponents any further than I could throw Justin Fuente myself (and I'm not a huge dude, I'm not throwing JF very far)
That would explain a lot.
Our opponents are playing 4D chess while we figure out how to do a proper jet sweep
No shit, whit. The people you talked to beat the shit out of us all year. Of course they want things to stay the same. We run QB draws on frequent 3rd and longs and jet sweeps and double reverses on our own end of the field. Who the fuck wouldn't want to line up against that every week?
I honestly believe it's less of being competitive/manipulative and more of "what goes around comes around" so they don't want others to say bad things about them.
Idiotic to use this as a metric anyways.
O my lordy.....He was swayed by competitors?
Does Whit know that of course they want us to keep a lame duck?
I remember seeing tweets from Florida fans begging us to take Grantham as our HC.
President Grant: Crazy Horse, tell me what you think of Custer's leadership during this campaign?
Crazy Horse: Oh, he's a fierce fighter and cunning strategist. I would just hate to continue fighting him.
WH Presser (They had those in 1876, right?): President Grant has decided to stick with Custer and Maj Cornelson. The Lakota dread their offensive onslaught and the special company lead by Lt. Shibest.
This is so bad.
What does he expect opposing coaches to say about preparing for our offense? It is easy and predictable?
From @AndyBitter
Wtf? He went to opposing coaches for an opinion and this is what came back. Yeah, because opposing coaches are a great way to get an honest opinion.
I've lost all confidence in Whit. These comments are...wow I'm lost for words.
Lmao. I'm sure the opposition would love to see our offensive staff stay as well.
GG fam.
what does that even mean?
take away his civil liberties? strip him of any decency and humanity?
I'm guessing he didn't meant to say "dehumanize".
Nobody knows, but it's provocative.
It gets the people going.
https://www.facebook.com/wdbj7/videos/137125861348501/?vh=e&d=n
Live stream.
Thanks for the live stream link.
All I'm seeing is a lot of rationalization for not making a move despite poor results. Not a good look all of the way around.
My god, so we couldn't evaluate him until NOW
What the fuck are we even doing here.
The bell has tolled. Our football team is dead. The incompetence is astounding. What the actual fuck.
ha.... so we can assume he's going to get 2 more years regardless, since this is only year 1 and we need at least 3 of runtime to see results?
Jesus, this reads almost like something dcwilson would say mockingly.
Or something fireman or vtkey or fencer would say seriously. Love you patts
As I mentioned in another thread, I am thinking Whit is more of the problem of the further downturn VT Football, than we want to admit. Hearing exactly "what he wants to hear" vs. actual results doesn't cut it, and it doesn't continue to fuel the arm of the athletic program that supports all other sports.
This man is mocking us to our faces. The absolute nerve of these people.
Whit is not at all who we thought he was.
This is feeling less like a press conference and more like an intervention
and referring to us as a "mob" isnt going to build the relationship either
Whit referred to the fans as "the mob"?
And he expects us to donate our money to this program?
if the shoe fits...
"Fans don't understand a complete rebuild".....it's year 5 and we're the worst we've been in 30 years!
So everything before the past 5 years don't matter. Are they rebuilding the Beamer barn to be the Fuente Safe?
What fans do understand is that you need talent for a rebuild and ours is becoming inferior to that of our foes.
smart fans understand we need one
Post Beamer, my mindset was that we would have got a coach to 'stop the bleeding' and stabilize and energize for maybe 2-3 years, then find the longer term solution.
I hate to use them as a comparison, but I have always thought we could mimic on a lesser scale to what Penn State did post Paterno with coaching stints: they went with Bill O'Brien which was an obvious short term hire, and then pulled in Franklin for longer term trajectory (not that his results this year are great, but he has clearly done okay since he's been there).
Getting it right the first time after a long tenured coach is practically impossible, and Fuente has been here 3 years too long already.
lol...justifying that if you make a change and it doesn't work, it'll set us back...uh...yeah, look where we are.
To be fair to the statement, Whit didn't cut Beamer loose in order to hire Fuente (at least outwardly). He filled a vacancy that needed filling.
My point was the change didn't work, it was the wrong hire, and we're spiraling. But Whit is confident that it is a good spiral I guess
This is absolutely insane. Especially that line about Corny. What the fuck is even going on here???
Every quote I've seen from this presser has made me feel worse about the direction of the program
ditto... i was having a good day until 1:01 this afternoon
I doubt Whit believes anything he's actually saying.
What a joke?
It's apparently time to triple the funding to the music department because damn near everyone in Blacksburg is tone deaf!
LITERALLY NO ONE with 5 minutes of PR training looked at Babcock's remarks?????
Going to go out on a limb and guess the folks at Le. Sabre are celebrating now as if they won last weekend.
this warms my heart...Fu can hang that 4-1 over them...and we can all get behind that!
4-1 against UVA is unacceptable.
why would they be celebrating? at the chance to beat us once every 5 years?
To beat us repeatedly over the next few years given Fuente's recruiting. Remember, this year is his high water mark of returning talent for Fu. Just wait until last year's class and the current class about to come in are the key players on the field. And do you think next year's recruiting will be any better? Theoretically possible, but not buying it.
Hes right in this - the next hire had better be right, he can afford Justin Fuente another year, he can not afford his next hire to be wrong..
Can the NCAA start a transfer portal for coaches?
So now our fundraising strategy is to just tell donors they're part of the problem if they don't donate.
Cool. Cool cool cool
LOL...yeah you're asking me to spray my fountain into your drain? Not gonna happen. Anyone with even an ounce of financial literacy isn't going to like that answer
(Just trying to insert some levity in a shitty day)
😂😂😂
Sounded as if he was using this analogy in regards to the mindset and attitude of the fan base going forward. I didn't interpret that as a direct statement to the donors. Hopefully in an effort for a trend towards positivity rather than negativity. Just how I heard it...
He was talking about fans supporting the team vs tearing it down for the next 8 months. The answer did not specifically have to do with donors if you watched the stream
Is Whit Babcock just trolling us? He sounds completely ridiculous. We need to "dehumanize" Brad Cornelsen? What in the literal hell is happening here?
Corny is actually just a grad student with an old PS2 using Ask Madden. No human element to the play calling.
If that was the case we would probably have a much better offense. Madden AI can do better than what we have been watching the last few years.
I need Ativan.
Whit Babcock - "I don't get a chance to talk much" -- Huh? Isn't that his own doing?
I was more okay keeping Fuente until I heard the reasons.
Matches all the other former players we see calling out the program each week. Makes you believe Whit just totally made up that answer and he didn't talk to anyone
Yep, I'm officially done with Virginia Tech. You're going to sit on your soapbox and call out the fans as the problem? The people who buy tickets and donate money? Give me a fucking break. Whit, you are a moron.
I feel like I'm having a stroke. He can't possibly believe any of this bullshit he's saying, right...? Guys, am I crazy? Please tell me that Whit Babcock, our AD who we are relying on to guide this ship, can't possibly believe any of this and he's only saying it to save face after something fell through. Please.
Today made me realize that Whit Babcock has got to go.
The HokiesFB twitter should've just tweeted out a picture of the staff captioned "2021" and left it that
Whose gonna start the "Whit Babcock Vent Thread"?
In whit we trust
https://www.facebook.com/wdbj7/videos/137125861348501/?vh=e&d=n
Body language is horrible. Whit looks defeated and tired. I wonder if he is just taking one for the team b/c the money and support is not there. Excuses presser. Why the hell even have this; no changes made? Who told him this was a good idea?
I don't understand the necessity of this presser.
OK, maybe it was originally to fire Fuente but things changed. Cancel the presser and release a statement! It seems like every week teams around the nation are canceling actual football games (for good reasons of course) but we are afraid to click Cancel on a virtual meeting? This presser seems far more damaging than any cancellation and release could have been.
I'm having a hard time believing this presser was scheduled to announce Fu's firing before Fu's firing. That's not the order of things. You fire then schedule.
No, the presser was scheduled to introduce the new coach. Fu woulda been fired this morning, IMO if things had gone to plan
The purpose of this presser was to put out into the public sphere the fact that Fuente would be coaching next year, so that there is no uncertainty with respect to recruits signing their LOIs tomorrow.
Time will tell if it worked at all.
Also, to alienate and further divide the fanbase.
If that's the case you put out a statement prior to the announcement of a press conference, or just a statement and no press conference. You put it out as early as you know he's returning. Texas did that last week with Tom Herman.
So the donors raised over $12 Million to buy Fuente's ass out, then Whit is gonna turn around and give it to Fuente to use as he pleases?
I highly doubt it. I would imagine those donors have lawyers and the dollars have legally binding strings attached. At least I would if I was donating that level of money for a specific reason.
Edit: I see the tweet about the $12.5M and it is suggested that the money was earmarked to improve recruiting and football program infrastructure. That's quit generous of donors. I dont know why they would buy what Fuente is selling, but OK. (Generally speaking, the VT football does need the money though.)
https://twitter.com/AndyBitterVT/status/1338914583189327875?s=19
I'm pretty sure you're right. It sucks though because at that point it's not a donation, it's taking a program hostage until you get what you want.
If he did that, whoever gave the money for the buyout would never give another dime. He had better return it.
Whit just tied his career to Fuente turning this around next year. That's a bold strategy Cotton. Let's see if it pays off.
OMG, Whit said Justin is "private" and Whit "hadn't had the chance to get him out this year." LOL!!! Are we talking about a 2 year old?
In Whit's defense, he can't say in public that the only reason Fu is retained is because we didn't have the money to move on at this time. He has to somehow convey confidence in the coach regardless how he actually feels. His lame given reasons for retaining may be an indicator that he really wanted to move on to another coach and he's fishing for whatever reasons he can come up with to show some level of confidence. Keeping Corn though, even if we do dehumanize him seems a poor choice.
just don't even have the presser. this makes me want to barf.
You're not wrong.
Why even have the press conference then? Just do a press release and move forward.
Whit handcuffed VT to Fuente with an unsightly buyout in 2017 and now he has handcuffed himself to Fuente and driving this whole thing off a cliff.
Wow.
Joe's tweets right now read like one of our hatin' on threads.
My "give a fuck" meter just pinned over onto "not one bit" whereas my apathy meter has been set to 11. I can't stop shaking my head. Unreal.
This whole thing is just one massive eye roll.
just be glad you're not fired!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Please no that Brad gives Brads like me a bad name.
LOL at your badge change
I'm fucking dying at your badge change.
I had to cover myself Joe.
^Is this "the mysterious person Brad Cornelson"?
He definitely sounds too human. Need to dehumanize him a bit to be believable.
"Meet this mysterious person Brad Cornelson." LOL.
I didn't laugh you shmuck.
This is literally the most disappointing scenario I could have imagined.
Whit is literally saying, things obviously aren't working, but we're just going to keep going on anyways.
Literally, no significant changes to the staff, which is mind boggling.
This organization stinks from top down.
Also "dehumanizing" someone is the opposite of making them likeable...not to mention that the whole phrase is mindless and nonsensical.
I'm guessing he meant to say humanize. He looks really nervous and has nervous body language.
I think when Babcock said fans have done a "bad job dehumanizing" Corn, he really means the behavior of dehumanizing Corn is a negative. Not that fans have poorly executed their dehumanizing.
Ah gotcha. Thank you
Fans are generally very good at dehumanizing.
Part of this makes me think "what else is he supposed to say". Assuming rumors were at least somewhat true and Fuente was likely gone, I am going with the assumption that we couldn't get who we wanted so it makes more sense to stick with Fu than start a revolving door like Tennessee.
If that is true then this is a sort of awkward position for Whit. However, he is saying way too many specific and dumb things for me to stick to that. So, I'm sad.
...Calling this year 1 is nuts! He wanted to let Fuente crater the program over 4 years before he would start judging his performance?
Please let this just be Fuente going to Illinois and Whit is trying to avoid the buyout...
If I was a high school kid, I would be overflowing with confidence in this program (sarcasm).
Mentioned in the Corn thread....I think the straight gas-lighting is because this is not the presser Whit planned on giving when he scheduled it. Whit just looks defeated.
The more I think about it, the more I think Elliot, or whoever else it may have been, gave us the Beamer-UNC treatment
EDIT:
Just seeing Fernley's account about...and I'm even more furious if that is true.
So we're following our two worst seasons in 3 decades that include our two worst recruiting classes in who knows how long with......doing absolutely nothing. The talent gap will continue to widen and the beatings will continue to occur. We aren't just losing games, we are getting spanked. It is ridiculous.
I can't listen anymore. worse and worse...wow. he should have never done this. give the media an hour long session to ask negative questions about the program. what a dumb move.
This makes zero sense. The other team is watching FU's media sessions composed of nothing to prepare for future games against Tech? O, so this is a clandestine move. Saying nothing is more important to throw the opponents off than engaging a fan base. YES!!!!! I GET IT NOW! I was so dumb.
Tha fuq?
Babcock admits that both Fuente and and himself could have handled the Baylor situation better
Step back from the ledge for just one second. Whit is very smart. He did his homework, he weighed his options. And he made THIS choice. How crazy is it that he held a press conference to say "Despite the outpouring of fan displeasure, I have elected to stand pat with our coaching staff. I sincerely hope he is right, but boy Babcock just burned the ships. His career and his reputation ALL IN with Fuente. He just assumed responsibility for Fuente having success - and soon. He better get on it.
We're going to a bowl game in Tahiti!
I'm hearing that the account of events I was told is accurate. now donors are pissed and there is an expectation that Whit will resign over this as his decision was over-ruled and he was forced to captain this sinking boat of shit he didn't want.
lets see if that is accurate.
I think if Whit does leave we will know that Sands sandbagged Whit into taking the fall for this. If Whit stays on then ... wow... flabbergasted that he could be so out of touch.
Whit should resign for something like this. Essentially holding a national press conference to lambast the fan base and gaslight everyone. This is entirely unacceptable. I didn't think Whit was this out of touch. Could totally see Sands being behind this though.
if he got overruled then today's presser should have been him announcing his resignation. Probably more at play, but I wouldn't be risking my career on doing something i knew wasn't the right move simply because I was told to do it. I would just go on and say "difference in opinion in how the department should move forward with the long-term strategy" and call it a day. Whit doesn't have to steer a dumpster fire, and the school doesn't get thrown under the bus either.
No. The opposite is true. Universities want and AD that can manage shitshows calmly as much as they need someone that can make good hires and ingratiate themselves with donors. Whit falling on the sword here is going to be highly respected and, my belief because I do believe he is very smart, is that as much as he dislikes the position he is in he knows this to be true.
Yeah, and good on him for doing this.
I just don't understand what is going on with this presser. Pretty much everything that was said is just pouring gasoline on a fire. There's no way that he is as tone deaf as he came across today. Its almost like he was purposely trying to piss the entire fanbase off to send a message to someone.
I wonder if this is true - its the only thing that makes sense. Why must everything in our university be a game of PR chicken?
i understand that position and I'm sure it will, but at what cost to his reputation? Yes he can take the fall, but does this really demonstrate how he wants to operate as an AD? Is he really running the department, or is he just a figurehead?
That would be why he would resign I suppose.
If he stays then he's tied to this event. Will that stop him from getting the next job, most likely not. But it may stop him from getting the next better job and he has his own personal integrity to take in account.
If I recall correctly, Whit did say something to the effect of "Blacksburg is my home, I've lived here longer than any other place now, and I'll end it here if you'll have me" in his opening statement
Which means he's gone.
/ssssorta
woah woah woah, at no point did he mention he was 800% committed, so I think we're still good here
if this is accurate, this is much more concerning than keeping on Fuente or the current staff. A lot of the posts here have been crazy over-dramatic but a schism as described could really be hugely damaging
so Sands and the BoV over-ruled Whit and said no change?
read what fernley posted... i get item #3, i really do. Making an investment to get rid of someone in the face of this pandemic when the school has already had to cut back and the athletic department has trimmed job does not look good at all.....
However (and i said this somewhere else) - we can retain the head coach but we need to purge a lot of the other coaches, and at a significantly lower cost. Did not get the impression from today's presser that these changes are happening either.
Whit needs to resign, but not for our sake - he needs to resign for his own.
I can't help but believe a narrative like this one. Whit isn't a dumb or tone def guy. He knows whats up.
Sad days people.
I gotta ask, what account of events were you told?Edit. Sorry I somehow completely missed your post above.
Read above
Sweet! Thanks. I'll drink now.
https://www.thekeyplay.com/comment/1023710#comment-1023710
Completely missed that. Gonna drink now.
https://www.thekeyplay.com/comment/1023710#comment-1023710
Thanks. Wasn't trying to be dense or smart ass. I just completely missed it and now I need to drink to catch up!
It's a long thread. Easily missed. No worries!
Edit: cleared up.
Yeah that is exactly the opinion I got from reading all these quotes. Extremely disappointing.
Why does someone have to automatically quit when their boss overrules them?
I don't think that's what anyone is saying.
Not automatically, but it isn't fun being publicly responsible for a decision you were told to make
So Sands did it? Great. Even more reasons for me to not like him. I'm already not a fan at all of the direction he's taking the university in, making it more like a corporate firm than a educational institution that's part of the SWVA community fueling its growth. For years I've been hoping some other school would poach him. Now I'm hoping he's fired, kicked out, gets stuck in another country and just decides to live there, whatever
this is all unverified. I can't say 100% it was Sands in any way. I was told by my sauce Whit was overruled. that's as best I got and I am thousands of miles away from VT where it's now 3 am in the morning. But I am offering what I am being told by someone who should know.
Fair enough and appreciate all your info and efforts to make sense of all this. I just hope that the part you mentioned about the big time donors being upset is enough to make a course correction from whoever it is made this call.
Whit is not stupid, and has not done things half-assed before; and this appears to have been both stupid, and half-assed.
Jeez, this is pitiful and has become an intolerable train wreck to watch. Been living in Blacksburg and a ticket holder since '74. Gave up season tickets two years ago...cause we sucked. Quit going to games last year, all together...cause we sucked. Stopping my remaining donation this year...cause we sucked. This will be the way of many fine friends and donators over the next 12 months, as the future dims for VT Football. Whit just showed himself.
#Bring back Braine. LOL
It pissed me off when he spoke about the people who voiced they were going to stop giving money. It was pretty short sighted. Someone who is giving a $100 a year now could be in a place to give $1000 a year or more in the future. You can't just rely on the older donors.
Well good, glad we got that cleared up.
I'd like to ask Whit, when he reached out to Clemson to get feedback on redesigning the Hokie Club along the lines of IPTAY - where exactly in the process did they suggest that the right strategic move is to tell small-level donors to go fuck themselves?
Did Babcock say he hasn't had the chance to take Fuente out to meet donors? Hasn't Fuente been here 5 years? He must have misspoke
In essence, yes, but only in regards to the last 10 months. He said that due to COVID they have not been able to get him on 'caravans' and other booster meetings to get in front of donors face to face, but were able to do some Zoom calls.
Something doesn't add up here and I can't figure it out. Whit has been, for the most part, very shrewd and calculated and understands the value of "putting things out there" and "knowing when to not speak."
So why have a press release when literally nothing is changing? Why schedule an hour with reporters if the message isn't "Hey we hear you loud and clear so we're going to do X, Y, and Z and let's stay positive and Go Hokies!" ?
Literally nothing about this awkward-ass presser adds up to me.
Its almost like he was purposely gaslighting the fanbase to piss everyone off to send a message to someone that it really is in our best interests to take care of football down the line.
That's literally the only reason I can think of why we would have had this shit show of a presser today
I can only hope that what Fernley said is true and the large donors just completely pull funding. Can't pay the coach if there's no money. Let Sands find a way to pay the contract.
agreed. This is the head scratcher for me.
I get that people are upset because things didn't shake out like they hoped, but why schedule the press conference at all before all the T's were crossed and I's dotted? How far in advance is one required to announce such an event? And why not cancel/reschedule if things change unexpectedly?
It seems like someone had the rug pulled out from under them, but who did the pulling? and who was standing on the rug?
Educated guess: because he sees and hears the fans complaining about Fuente from friends, donors, and online/social media. He came to a different conclusion than them and about ~2/3's of the fanbase and wants to alleviate the anger going in to next season.
He basically said as much during press conference. He almost word for word said: he wants the people who are mad to still get on board and support the team next season and the best way he thinks to do that is explain the rationale behind his decision.
but his rationale is awful
This is the equivalent of Whit and Fuente giving us a pair of worn-out, moldy sweatsocks for Christmas and then snootily waiting for us to say, "Thank you".
Whit said 5-6 isn't good but it isn't awful either. Would like to know where exactly he thinks "awful" begins
Check out Florida State.
Yes exactly, they screwed up the follow up hire. And Willie Taggart reminds me a lot of one of the names being floated here as a replacement for Fu.
You don't have to look very far this year to see teams that usually have decent records with terrible records instead.
He also said 5-5 when answering a question about his performance meeting with Fuente. Obviously that is not including the nonconference game with liberty but... does he not think that nonconference game is important to the majority of Alumni who are VA based? That isn't important to bring up in the performance meeting with Fuente?
Literally every quote I've seen from this presser is enraging.
Fire Whit.
Did they not film the press conference?
Anybody got a link, or do we have to poke around on twitter for quotes out of context?
I think it is supposed to be posted to hokiesports later for us drains to watch.
you can watch it on the facebook video still.
https://fb.watch/2oP87YcpTm/
Part of me feels sorry for Whit...he is literally trying to reason with a pack of hungry and angry wolves. Then I remember I am hungry and angry. I really hope the silver lining here is we get J Ham one more year of experience so we can really see what we have with our DC who is a Hokie through and through.
For a school that routinely tells us that fundraising is a problem and that not enough people are giving back, this:
Is probably the dumbest fucking thing you could say in a press conference
that quote definitely has a LOLUVA "elite telling a joke to other elites before they all toss their heads back and laugh" vibe and I really don't like it
Yessir, that right there...when I walk away from VT financially...just list it as exhibit 1A.
Its one thing to kind of know that they really don't care about the average donor because the money isn't really going to sway things. Its a completely different thing altogether to actually hear someone outright say they don't matter for that reason.
Like, fuck the Drive for 25, right? The people who give there aren't really giving much, so why should their opinions or actions matter?
So completely tone deaf. As a fan, nothing says 'family' like, "you don't give enough to matter"
Bingo. And the fucked up thing is...the people that start at the bottom...if you keep them happy and their situation improves your situation improves because as they progress in life and take better jobs, get raises, what have you they could've grown their donations and enhanced your program as time goes on.
But if you kick them in the balls and tell them you don't need their pennies, you're also telling them you don't need their future quarters, their future dollars, their future C-notes...
My question to Whit if I'm not to "tear it down", How do I talk it up? I have no idea what the hell is going on with the football team other than what I get to watch when a game is played. I run out of things to talk up if that is all I'm given to work with.
Right, so go f yourselves you small-time, poor donors. We don't need you in the Hokie Club. Does he know anything about fundraising?
It is like someone stooged this whole thing to make it go off as poorly as possible. If you could write an SNL skit on worst case scenario for the presser, this would be it.
Going with the gaslighting narrative you mentioned above, someone probably said that to Whit word for word as he was overruled on this decision. Or Whit is suddenly an f-ing moron. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I like this take. He wrote down quotes while he was overruled and read them off at a press conference.
Lower level donations, like buying tickets, tend to get noticed when the stadium is half-empty during the game and the town is half empty on game days.
Good luck with that approach VT Athletics!
I wouldn't be surprised if Babcock requests this to be edited out of the Hokie sports youtube upload when it gets posted. Just so clearly not a good thing to say
That's true. I've always understood that my ~$500/year doesn't move the needle. Now I'll donate $0, since they clearly don't need any help from poors like me.
That is a massive yikes. Just cannot imagine anybody thinking that was a good idea.
Hey Whit,
This is why you need to fire Fuente:
1. No in-game progress made over the last 4 years (bad play calling, bad decisions, etc)
2. The losses and even some wins show lack of quality in the teams, in some cases just giving up
3. Team is not sound in fundamentals (Turnovers, punt catching errors, etc) - continued since 2016
4.Recruiting is way below expectations
5. There is lack of player development
6. The coaches (and Administration t a certain extent) is not marketing the team at all
7. The fans, alumni and former players are alienated by the coach
why should I even give a dime to you?
When he started talking about the transfer portal, it made me think he knows about a lot of player turnover and was getting the fan base ready for it.
Its- A - Fucking - Excuse... for players wanting to get the fuck out of here every year. "Oh, every team has multiple guys bounce" "It's the new normal", etc. It's the Fuente era in a nutshell- one big fucking excuse as to why we suck. file under:
Mook and Adonis surprisingly not eligible
Tim Settle leaving early for the draft
Tremaine leaving early
Bud Fosters pending retirement
"Small" signing class- thus it must suck
Guys "passed on the depth chart" so they leave
Facilities
One big fucking excuse as to why we can't compete on the field with a suck ass Pitt team or we can't beat online schools. That's the Fuente era.
Joke's on you, Whit. I was already dead inside.
Whit could've literally kicked me in the balls and it would've hurt less than that press conference
JFC this is an embarrassment
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any word on if the players voted to play (or not) in the Bowl game? (That is, if we get a bowl game)
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Whit wasn't satisfied embarrassing himself in a press conference, he decided to double down on Twitter:
i sense a lot of frustration in those responses. Whit is not the one pulling the strings here, he's only a messenger.
Doesn't matter, he's failing at a central part of his job.
And failing badly.
I mean both of those guys spun his comments negatively as possible. Of course he's gonna hit back. That's what he gets for trying to explain his decision in good faith I guess.
In hindsight instead of the conference he should've just tweeted a pic of Fu and 2021 as someone else on here suggested.
I'm betting we will see something to that effect in the future
If only the school was out in front of this and, I dunno, made the stream viewable to the average fan so that we didn't have to rely on whatever tweets came out to let us know how it was going.
Whit doesn't need to worry about me. I'm in my twenties, gave $100 to the program just last year to join the Hokie Club, but I won't be doing it again. He can focus on all those big money donors.
I feel sick. The guy started a fight with a reporter on Twitter. This is our athletic director. We are in big, big trouble, boys. Like the dinosaurs the day before the asteroid hit kind of trouble.
PR 101 pretty much says "don't get into a spot where your only defense is 'it was just a joke!'"
Arguing on social media never ends well. Not a good look for Whit.
I'm honestly really glad he clarified this. The second quote was not taken out of context, he literally said that and that was the completion of his answer. It needed to be further explained by Babcock. I think if Babcock had a second chance at this presser he would do better... hopefully.
Going after a member of the media and claiming they're spinning your narrative is not a good look.
If we had a second chance at ODU and Liberty we might've been able to beat them. But we only get one chance and our athletic department rewards people who squander their only chance.
Go Bama! Roll Tide!
Oops wrong site!
This presser was an unmitigated disaster.
I was not thrilled at all about Fuente being retained.
I was apoplectic when it was made clear that there would be no Staff changes.
I was confused by the bizarre language and tone of the entire event.
I was insulted that an AD would characterize ANY group of donors as "not giving that much."
VT Athletics is lost. Everyone needs to go---Whit included.
So I missed the presser but no one has mentioned...are we bowling?
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No decision made yet
Decision going to be made in the next 24hrs. Team meeting etc, etc. I except we will know before/during the ESD media availability with coaching staff.
i think what we heard is that the team is talking later today and will be making an official decision sometime tomorrow.
If this is the result of a President Sands overrule, it wreaks of a Danny Snyder like meddling that has been shown to result in perennial failure and dysfunction.
does that mean we're just a few years out from being named the Blacksburg Football Team?
No that would be the Bruins and they typically win more of their games than they lose...
Not that it'll change anything, or that I'll even get a response, but here's the email I just rattled off to Whit, copied Sands and Horatio Valeiras (rector on the BOV, his was the only email I could find quickly)
Ike Charlton, Todd Washington, DJ Parker, and Sergio Render chime in:
Ughh man just when I thought there was only one problem. Have we not hit rock bottom yet? This problem almost feels systemic. When did it start?
I interact with former players a little on twitter...and Sergio is just dying to get involved with the program, in any way. They definitely need to be reaching out to him...I think he even lives in Christianburg! Let him address recruits when we have a good number visiting. Would it be allowed to let him give campus tours to recruits? or join our recruiting staff when they give tours? He is a charismatic guy that LOVES VT, that's who we need interacting with recruits.
Yesterday, I asked DJ Parker about visiting VT, because I am always curious about what issues ex-players have when they visit, and he said ex-players don't want the red carpet rolled out for them, they just want to feel welcomed back and have access to the facilities, and not be treated like an outsider. Definitely not too much to ask. DJ's a great dude...if you are on twitter, definitely worth following him.
Split Zone Duo, a great podcast with Richard Johnson and Alex Kirshner (with special guest Steven Godfrey, who is very plugged into CFB and a big Whit Fan:
https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cHM6Ly9yc3MuYXJ0MTkuY29tL3NwbGl0LXp...
Hokies content starts at about the 40:16 mark
They were not buying it.
My absolute zero sauce theory is that the same donor that won't let the band play "Stick It In" also wouldn't let Whit fire Fuente.
Who is that?
I laughed. It's only kinda funny cause I do miss the chant.
But no, just about every donor involved is as shocked and pissed as we are. I don't know about the over rule, outside of fernleys post, but I doubt it came from a donor.
The conspiracy theory of it wasn't Whit's decision it was Sands' decision makes zero sense. If that was actually true then you don't schedule the press conference and instead fire off a tweet or issue a statement without having to answer media questions. This was Whit publicly backing Fuente and his staff for everyone to see. I think a lot of us want to believe Whit is smarter than this but after yesterdays performance I'm afraid we are headed down a dark road.
Credit where it's due, Whit is owning that yesterday was less than ideal and donating to the Hokie Club:
Honestly, you should make this a forum post so it gets all of TKP's eyes on it. This is a really good first step by Whit to admit he missed the mark and we all can literally make him pay for it.
I see your point, but also there's a lot of threads going on right now + he's already hit his 400 replies to get to $10K.
EDIT: And SevenLayersOfPlayers beat me to it :)