OT - Former VT soccer player sues coach

Former VT soccer player sues coach

Former Virginia Tech women's soccer player Kiersten Hening has filed a federal lawsuit against Hokies women's soccer coach Chugger Adair, alleging that after she refused to join her teammates kneeling before games this season, the coach engaged in a "campaign of abuse and retaliation" that led her to leave the program.

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This might get dicey... Adair is a good guy and I don't know many details beyond those that are shared in this article but this is going to generate more attention than VT would like.

Well the story gets even more dicey. Speech First has sued Virginia Tech for infringement of free speech. They cite the 1st and 14th amendments to the Constitution.

https://speechfirst.org/featured-stories/speech-first-sues-virginia-tech...

Ouch ... I have read the four policies. Granted I was attending a long long time ago, this is not my Virginia Tech.

Ashburn Hokie

Yeah looking into that group, lets just say they aren't necessarily advocating for everyone's freedom of speech

"I have a PLAN. You just need to have a little goddamn faith, Whit. I just need. more. MONEY." - Justin van der Linde

Yes, well the Liberal voice is not being censured on college campuses, in the classroom, and on the playing field.

Ashburn Hokie

Well, let's see how this goes along the CGs.

For those that didn't read the articles, or choose not to, there's an interesting blurb about the team having a meeting with the coach because of her open racism. Against teammates. The media seems to be burying this detail.

TKPhi Damn Proud
BSME 2009

The articles I could find only alluded to "screenshots of private text messages", not "open racism" against teammates. There is a difference between open racism and private text messages (as if they are really private but still)... It will be interesting to see where this goes, because the coach's actions took place in front of the team, so it should be relatively straightforward to corroborate. Don't understand why she would want to be reinstated on the team tho, it sounds like that bridge has been burned to me, on both sides.

I think the assumption is that if it's true and she wins, Chugger would be fired and then she would want to be back on the team

VT '17

OK, I can see that. But the article mentioned Chugger's boss possibly being part of the equation, and then there is the issue of all her other teammates. I am guessing she was and is friends with some of them, but still, it sounds like it would be a fractured culture if she came back.

I did not read it that way.
According to the lawsuit, Adair was aware of Hening's political views prior to the start of the 2020 season, when he and a group of players were shown screenshots of private text messages she had sent to teammates. A group of players then demanded on Sept. 3 that Adair address what they viewed as the racism of some of their teammates.

I read this as a group of players were accusing one or more teammates of what they viewed as racism not that Hening was acting explicitly racist to a teammate. Since there was more than one teammate who didn't kneel, it could be as simple as those who agreed to kneel were upset that their teammates didn't. There was a lot of peer pressure amongst young people over the summer to signal their support for certain causes and that refusal to participate was a sign of racism. My guess is this is a drew brees situation.

That's the vibes I'm getting too, but without knowing the details we're all just speculating so it's kinda pointless

Removing features to get people to sign up for your service is something EA would would do.

Wow, the article did not say there was a team meeting, nor did it say anything about open raciest remarks. Do you work for CNN?

I did some research last summer, one co-founder of BLM brags about her Marxist training. BLM is a domestic terrorist organization. Oh my did I say something racist? Nope, just the truth.

Ashburn Hokie

This won't get political.

If whats she's alleging is true, she may not have to even graduate and be set for life.

You're kidding, right? Coaches in the US can rape and sexually assault women and get away with it. I can't imagine getting your feelings hurt is grounds for a big payday.

To be clear, anyone that rapes or sexually assaults someone should be punished. However based on the current system, I doubt Adair gets anything but a slap on the wrist for a few comments.

I'm not seeing the connection between this suit and sexual assault allegations. Did I miss something?

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

If there are rarely big paydays for students when a coach sexually assaults them, I don't know how there is a big payday for a few comments.

Look at it from a women's point of view. When going up against a dude, we rarely win. Historically a young female does not normally have a good case against a powerful man. Personally I wish she had kneeled so my argument is not political. It's a fact about our justice system.

It has nothing to do with this particular case even though your point is valid in different circumstances. If the coach was female, the burden of proof is the same.

"A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky dangerous animals and you know it." - K

And I'm saying as a female it does matter. I don't agree with her, but the decision to legally confront a powerful man is very hard for a woman and she will likely not be rewarded the same way a man would be if he went against another man. You don't have to agree, but please understand that unless you're a female, you're not really in a place to understand.

I'm not saying you're wrong as I honestly have no clue, but do you have a source for this?

Removing features to get people to sign up for your service is something EA would would do.

What? So let's say $5 million is "set for life." Let's say, hypothetically, the coach was a horrible racist and either dismissed her from the team or forced her to leave. What are her damages? A full scholarship to Virginia Tech? She indicates she wants to play for the school again, so claiming it emotional damage is minimal and difficult to prove. I'm not seeing a 7 figure settlement or law suit.

Assuming everything in her favor, maybe she gets awarded the cost of the scholarship.

Unfortunately, the level of stupidity on juries and the absurd levels of damages people are awarded for their own stupidity (pouring gasoline on a fire, climbing over a chain linked fence topped with barbed wire to get into a train yard and try and jump on a train ...) mean payouts are way beyond any reasonable damages.

NOTE: My statement above is a comment on personal injury lawsuits in the US in general. It has nothing to do specifically with her case or anything she did or he did whatnot. Her point may be valid. We do not know yet. Just saying actual damages and what juries award can - and often do - have nothing to do with each other.

Recovering scientist working in business consulting

I mean correct me if I'm wrong, but there aren't juries in civil cases, only criminal, so I'm not sure what you're going on about here.

"I have a PLAN. You just need to have a little goddamn faith, Whit. I just need. more. MONEY." - Justin van der Linde

Sorry to correct you, but there are juries in civil cases.

No apologies necessary, I asked to be corrected. Thanks!

"I have a PLAN. You just need to have a little goddamn faith, Whit. I just need. more. MONEY." - Justin van der Linde

But I'm saying there are no damages beyond the value of the scholarship. To have a lawsuit, you have to have damages. She self reports she wants to play soccer, and for Virginia Tech, so given that emotional damages are difficult to prove in the best case, this would be very improbable. Again, assuming everything is true, she can be awarded the value of the scholarship and made whole.

In your scenario, rightly or wrongly, the damages would be the individual injuries (counter sue for property damage). The numbers in those cases can get high because medical care is expensive.

In this case, say she sues for 4 years of tuition, meals, housing. In an exaggerated number say $500,000. That's hardly, set for life, doesn't need the degree. That's an amazing jumpstart to a life, but if she plans of living longer than 10 years in the US, I'd imagine she'd have to work.

Doesn't matter. Someone can claim emotional distress or whatever and get millions. Or their lawyer can get millions they can get something. Don't need to have any real concrete damages.

Please, I'm not disagreeing with your logic or saying I think it's good that people can sue (and sometimes win or settle for absurd sums) with little or no physical damage. I agree with you. Just saying that it happens.

Let's say for the sake of argument that the coach did everything alleged to have done and berated her constantly with a "hostile environment" that caused "extreme mental distress" or whatever else a personal injury lawyer could claim. Same thing if someone does not want to make a wedding cake for certain people. Little or no actual damages but they claim a similar thing. They can get millions. I totally agree with you. Even if everything is true, a real damage could be something like $250,000 (in state student) to $750,000 (out of state and really going overboard). But I could easily see a jury giving $2,000,000 to the student or hypothetical couple.

Recovering scientist working in business consulting

Do you have a specific case that you are pointing to with these numbers because I've never seen those numbers before? Awards are rarely given without actual damages.

The only other damages I can think that they may reach for is a loss of professional soccer career, but A) there is not much money for an average women's professional player (read: not a national team pool player) and B) that would be tough to prove that she would make it to the pro ranks if this did not happen.

Looking at the baker in CO case. Trying to find what the original award was but all I keep getting is that the case was overturned by the Supreme Court on appeal. Let me dig further into that and into some others. Would think many sexual harassments suits could only prove minimal concrete dollar amounts of losses but are still paid out a lot. Those may be perfectly justified to punish the behavior with high sums, but the actual objective physical $ costs would be low.

Recovering scientist working in business consulting

That was my point to begin with. People who have little legal experience, not saying you, can assume this is a 10+ million dollar case based on a headline. In reality, there isn't the case law to support that. There might be the rare case that grabs headlines, but those are usually overturned.

But there are. I'm just having problems finding individual cases. Did find aggregate values though here. It mixes up violent and non-violent things in places, but it does clearly specify amounts for non-violent workplace incidents.

https://careertrend.com/info-10052412-average-workplace-retribution-sett...

From the article:

Average settlements for non-violent workplace "hostile work environment" suits can approach those for retributive suits for on-the-job violence. One legal firm specializing in such suits cites retribution settlements of more than $1 million for non-violent behavior based on the victim's sex and race and another for $400,000 for workplace sexual molestation by a superior.

What we really need to get is a list of various cases as some of these might involve wrongful termination but you cannot tell. I'll try to dig some more after work. I agree that it may be rare, but it does happen or you could not get average suits like listed above.

EDIT: Like I found one for ~$6,500,000 but that involved termination so you can argue that there was significant economic damage, but it was way above the actual measurable damage. It too was reduced later on. So it may be rare, but it happens.

A jury in the Northern District of Illinois has awarded two plaintiffs $6.45 million in damages, $6 million of which was allocated to punitive damages, clearly signaling that, regardless of statutory caps, juries do not look favorably upon employers who ignore employee complaints of sexual harassment.

In Davis v. Packer Engineering, Inc., No. 1:11-cv-07923, Danya Davis, Bernessa Wilson, and Shannon Webb alleged, among other things, that their employers subjected them to a hostile work environment and retaliated against them for complaining about such environment by terminating their employment in violation of Title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, 42 U.S.C. ยง 2000 et seq. The plaintiffs complained that despite their repeated complaints, the defendants ignored them. The jury awarded Davis and Wilson each $3 million in punitive damages and $150,000 and $300,000, respectively, in compensatory damages.

Recovering scientist working in business consulting

I am not sure if playing on a collegiate sports team is analogous to "working." Were there any lawsuits for coaching issues that you could find? Bobby Knight might be a good one to look up (although I suspect that any that were filed were settled and sealed.)

Edit because it's gone on too long.

I asked for cases and you gave cases. I do think this wouldn't be the same as those due to not being employees and not being fired, but clearly some cases do exist. Love your Iditarod coverage.

She was a walk-on, so can't even really argue that feeling like she was forced to leave the team cost her the amount of the scholarship

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

no, but if she came to VT out of state to play, she could argue over the added OOS tuition she's paying to play at VT. It was her intention to play, if not for the coach's first-amendment-violating actions, and having nothing to do with athletic/academic performance.

At least that's what she could claim. I don't know. I'm speculating

The whole situation is rather bizarre.

Edited for added literacy.
Also, I'm not advocating for/against the suit, more just trying to speculate the grounds in which are being used.

did the coach violate her civil liberties if she chose to walk off the team? the argument is that he made it untenable to stay. the counter argument is that she made the choice.

bottom line is we don't know what was said between them, so we don't know enough of the details to even make rudimentary gut-reaction judgment call.

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

Agreed. One way or the other, those arguments will likely be made.

I'm not trying to judge the merits of the suit, just trying to think about what may or may not be argued.

She's in state from Chesterfield County.

she's from richmond

There is another lawsuit filed by Speech First against VT for violation of 1st and 14th amendment rights under the Constitution. Four policies that were implemented last year aiming to silence conservative voices on campus including using IT resources. This lawsuit was filed April 8th so hers falls a week after, perhaps the same judge will hear both lawsuits?

Ashburn Hokie

It's the part where she is demanding to be let back onto the team in the lawsuit that makes me think this is mainly pandering for the notoriety. Why would you even want that, and why would you try to force that on teammates who apparently don't want you around anymore. The fact that this is already being spun on conservative media outlets as being some validation of cancel culture run amok definitely seems... Interesting

"I have a PLAN. You just need to have a little goddamn faith, Whit. I just need. more. MONEY." - Justin van der Linde

I find it interesting her parents had called the coach before the first game and told him to not bother her over the issue. Seems like a weird way to handle that before anything has happened.

Wet stuff on the red stuff.

Join us in the Key Players Club

That was the other player that was on scholarship wasn't it?

"A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky dangerous animals and you know it." - K

I believe it was the parents of the other girl who allegedly did not kneel that called not hers

VT '17

I too find the teammate angle fascinating, even if the coach is fired and you want back on you would imagine that there would be a semi-substantial group in the locker room who passionately disliked you for playing a part in getting rid of their coach

VT '17

careful everyone

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

My reaction to reading the comments so far:

we're getting there

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

As in most cases, this is a one sided account until the defense is made. From what I have read, it was neither an offense worth being fired for or a situation that warranted quitting the team. I don't feel like we have all the info yet.

"A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky dangerous animals and you know it." - K

You are correct, there is also a lawsuit by Speech First against VT for violation of student rights under the 1st and 14th amendments to Constitution, i have another post above.

Ashburn Hokie

This is a civil case, not a criminal one. The burden of proof regarding the "campaign of abuse and retaliation" falls on the plaintiff, not the defendant. She will have to prove that Adair orchestrated such a campaign with malicious intent, and that such a campaign existed in the first place.

Bringing the First Amendment into the thing is dicey, because of interpretation and location. In most instances of First Amendment cases, they don't go too far, because the defendant is not a local, state, or Federal government. Free speech is protected, in so far as that speech is directed at the government or a government official. Virginia Tech may be an entity of the Commonwealth of Virginia, but Chugger Adair is not a member of the government: he is an employee of the athletic department, which receives separate funding from the Hokie Club, and is thus not the Commonwealth of Virginia as a legal entity.

Secondly, going off of the details of this case as they have been reported, the closest I can approximate is that she is very close to the definition of an employee. Federal law does not prohibit discrimination by employers on the basis of political affiliation. Virginia is an at-will State. You can be terminated from a position, legally, for voicing your political beliefs. That may suck. It does suck. But that is the way the laws have been applied, to this point.

I'm hoping this is post is neutral enough to conform to CGs. I hope everything I included are statements of fact and not opinion. If not, I am willing to edit or delete.

Never Forget #1 Overall Seed UVA 54, #64 UMBC 74

there's a difference between describing your interpretation of law and giving your opinion on politics, and this is the former. I think it's in bounds, but do appreciate the obvious caution with regards to tone and language

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

There is a bigger 1st amendment lawsuit brought against VT by Speech First. See my post above

Ashburn Hokie

I hope she wins. If you support players kneeling, you should support players standing.

there's a difference between describing your interpretation of law and giving your opinion on politics, and this is the latter.

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

On first read, I interpreted it as the former.

Twitter me

really? How? It's pretty clearly opinion.

It's always darkest before the dawn ~ Thomas Fuller

I didn't get the memo that political commentary was banned. Reading this thread doesn't give me that impression either. In terms of the law, can a coach cut someone because he doesn't like her attitude? I guess so. Are there "laws" around cutting players from soccer teams?

Don't discuss politics or religion.

Straight from the CGs and you've been around here long enough to know it

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

Yep, and how about consistent enforcement? That's all I ask

The way to ask for consistent enforcement is to ask for consistent enforcement, not to toe the line (or cross it!) and then say "well please enforce this consistently"

help me understand where you feel i've been inconsistent?

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

Not you... in general, there are always political posts popping up on this board

and Joe, GuitarMan, Chris, and I do our best to try and steer conversation away from matter of politics while still allowing community to engage on a topic.

it's a difficult needle to thread to allow the community to discuss, for instance, a specific lawsuit by a former VT soccer player against the VT soccer coach without venturing into whether or not it's meaningful to play the anthem.

It would make all of our jobs much easier if, instead of arguing politics, the community as a whole steered clear. Or simply identified a given post as a Whole Big Nope and brought it to our attention. We understand that some commenters just won't be able to help themselves, but that shouldn't be an invitation to anyone or everyone else to jump in. The next time you see one of those political posts that's always popping up on the board, do me a solid and simply reply with a "hey gobble gobble chumps, this is what i was talking about".

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

While I don't disagree with anything you've said, I'm starting to realize that its not actually politics that are causing red flags, but just controversial current events.

The anthem and pandemic aren't politics. While they may have been addressed by politicians, so are most things in life (that are worth talking about).

I'm fine with quashing discussions that the discussions are spiraling downward, but I don't think many of them necessarily constitute a CG violation.

I agree! The unfortunate thing is that most controversial events are immediately politicized and become talked about in highly political and polarizing ways elsewhere, and that extends to TKP. Look at the few dozen covid threads we had -- the pandemic is a matter of fact, but the arguing was about what the appropriate government response should be, and several folks got incredibly heated several times. And couldn't help themselves time and time again. We had people literally making statements about who to vote for, we had longtime power users banned because they just kept going on and on with it for months. Even recently with the matter of what should be grounds to constitute reopening for a full capacity Lane come fall had such a tense feel to it. At some point, we venture out of discussing the matter at hand, to talking about hypotheticals that become politically charged either because there's a political implication by the commenter or a political inference by people who read the comment.

(edited because words are hard today)

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

Don't discuss politics or religion.

It's in the CGs.

I think for most of us, we can make the distinction between politics and law, namely in differentiating between legal facts and political opinions.

Additionally, in terms of law, can a coach cut someone because they don't like their attitude? Yeah. All the time. At every amateur level. Professionally, they tend to work out trades or cut during the offseason when a contract expires.

Never Forget #1 Overall Seed UVA 54, #64 UMBC 74

Which is a valid opinion. However, in the current framework of the law, I cannot see her winning her case.

SCOTUS has ruled time and time again, that hate speech is protected under the First Amendment, but only with regards to government limitations thereof. Unless political beliefs are eventually included as a protected class, however, her case will lack standing, and I'm having a hard time finding precedent that would support her case.

Never Forget #1 Overall Seed UVA 54, #64 UMBC 74

Virginia Tech is an extension of the government

Removing features to get people to sign up for your service is something EA would would do.

Virginia Tech is not named in the lawsuit, per the article.

Did Virginia Tech as an entity restrict her First Amendment rights? I can't see how that could possibly be argued, which is why the suit itself doesn't attempt to make such an argument. The coach didn't either for that matter.

I don't know the full facts of this case, but in a scenario where you are playing a team sport, and your personal expression/opinions are problematic or disruptive to the team as a whole, and the coach has a problem with that and/or makes that known...that's still not a violation of your First Amendment rights.

Most people would agree that Kaepernick has no standing to sue the NFL because the owners got together and blacklisted him over his expression, so i'm not sure why this girl would have any more standing.

Kaepernick would have a collusion case via the CBA but the burden of proof would be on him to prove there was a coordinated effort by the owners. That's tangential though

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

Well if you read the article, you would have seen that another player chose to stand during the same game and faced no retaliation (according to Hening). The circumstances are clearly not as cut and dry as you make it out to be.

Also, even if it was that simple - being a hypocrite isn't exactly illegal.

Put in Donlon

It's certainly enough to give some people in the athletic department pause. I'd be interested to see if anything was mentioned to people in the athletic department before bringing the lawsuit. I assume that's something Virginia newspapers will try to figure out via FOIA requests.

It's Time to go to Work

it's funny that you support player's rights selectively

Forced protest is equally disgusting as forced patriotism. It should be everyone's choice whether to stand, sit, kneel, etc. for the anthem.

Now finish up them taters; I'm gonna go fondle my sweaters.

This seems like a case of peer pressure and not necessarily forced. To hear that others were standing and didn't face the kind of blowback she is describing definitely points to there being way more to this story than her allegations originally let on.

"I have a PLAN. You just need to have a little goddamn faith, Whit. I just need. more. MONEY." - Justin van der Linde

At this point, why play the anthem at all?

That's the real question

Now finish up them taters; I'm gonna go fondle my sweaters.

"Ladies and Gentleman, will you please rise and remove your caps to honor America with the playing of the Star Spangled Banner". Seems clear to me.

Why are we the only country (or at the very least one of the only countries) that does this patriotic song and dance before every sporting event between two domestic teams?

"I have a PLAN. You just need to have a little goddamn faith, Whit. I just need. more. MONEY." - Justin van der Linde

Don't care. We are also the only country that sends our soldiers to die on foreign soil on any scale, so that the world is not at nuclear war

We are also the only country that sends our soldiers to die on foreign soil on any scale

Well that's just not true

"I have a PLAN. You just need to have a little goddamn faith, Whit. I just need. more. MONEY." - Justin van der Linde

You want to see troop deployment numbers?

I think the point he is getting at is that your statement indicates the United States is the only nation to send troops abroad, which is patently false.

The UK has troops in the various NATO bases in Germany and western Europe, as well as stationed with other UN elements throughout Africa and Asia.

I believe France and Germany also maintain international troop deployments, as does Japan and Italy.

Russia does, although not officially (wink wink, nudge nudge)

Never Forget #1 Overall Seed UVA 54, #64 UMBC 74

You recently switch to a DoD contract or something there big guy? Gettin' fired up readin' the Early Bird every morning?

To think all that time I spent in Afghanistan was really to prevent nuclear war...

Mind. Blown.

you said "on any scale" which means if Canada sends 1 soldier to Syria, then your statement is false.

You probably meant "on scale with US" which would be true, as US sends more troops abroad.

๐Ÿฆƒ ๐Ÿฆƒ ๐Ÿฆƒ

I could care less if we're the only country that does it, and I'm not sure that plays into the issue at hand. It used to appear to be something that we could all stand in solidarity and support, as a show of not only love for country but also for one another. Some of my best memories as a child were being in Lane Stadium in dead silence, and hearing that song, watching a B2 buzz the stadium, and listening to Skipper go off as the fans went wild. Truly awesome and I get goose bumps thinking about it.

Now, it's something that continues to divide us. The reasons why are varied and don't adhere to the CG's, but they're there. Continuing to play the anthem and deepen whatever the divide is does not seem to be helping. I hope we can all work through our problems and coalesce as time goes on, but to continue and parade the controversy does not appear to be helping anyone.

The anthem is not the root cause. And since 99% of people - or more- stand for it and aren't offended by it, cancelling it will piss more people off- such a way to unite.

Because we have the greatest country in the history of the world. Why not celebrate that as often as possible?

so its a political statement of nationalistic intent?

"I have a PLAN. You just need to have a little goddamn faith, Whit. I just need. more. MONEY." - Justin van der Linde

yall really gotta stop going down this hole pls n thx

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

edit. On second thought....never mind

Now finish up them taters; I'm gonna go fondle my sweaters.

Also, not every school does this - ever been to a Mennonite sporting event before? I grew up in Harrisonburg, Virginia - where Eastern Mennonite High School and Eastern Mennonite University are located. My brother played basketball: if tip-off was at 7pm, they meant 7pm, cause there were hardly any pre-game festivities.

Was it that clear to you before 2009? Because that is the year that the "long tradition" of NFL players coming out to stand on the sidelines for the National Anthem actually began.

The United States and North Korea are two of the only countries that play their anthem so frequently. I wish I was saying that in a cheeky fashion, but I'm not. Most countries find it very odd that we play the anthem before domestic sporting events. It's usually reserved for when the country is being represented in international competition. (Olympics, World Cup, international rugby matches, etc).

If you go to an English Premier League match, they arn't blaring God Save the Queen beforehand. Games between clubs from two different countries don't play the anthems either. For example, England vs. Spain - both anthems. Man United vs Real Madrid - no anthems. Here in the States we need it for a 1:05 first pitch rubber match between the Marlins and Pirates or else people get all bent out of shape.

As American sports fans we are used to it because we hear it before every event. But most of the world finds it very strange.

Directions from Blacksburg to whoville, go north till you smell it then go east until you step in it

Did anyone on here watch women's soccer? Did her benching seem warranted based on her play? Seemingly from the article, she had a bad UVA game.

We all had a bad game. The final was 3-1. We had 6 substitutions on the game. UVA outshot us 21 (9) -3 (1).

From what I can gather she played the whole 90 minutes, and was a substitute in the Clemson and UNC games, leaving the team after the third game.

Never Forget #1 Overall Seed UVA 54, #64 UMBC 74

Anyone can sue anyone for anything in America. Whether they have a chance of success, or whether it is warranted, or whether it is a good idea, is a completely different story.

97% of all lawsuits never make it to trial (2004 numbers) and of those that do, plaintiffs win about 55% of the time, meaning that she has a 1.5% chance of it getting to trial and her winning, with similar numbers saying she loses.

Granted part of that 97% includes settled cases, and I can't find any data saying what percentage of cases are thrown out before being recorded.

Never Forget #1 Overall Seed UVA 54, #64 UMBC 74

live look in at GGC

Directions from Blacksburg to whoville, go north till you smell it then go east until you step in it

As long as he keeps on the amphetamines to keep up with the boards, I think he'll be ok

Never Forget #1 Overall Seed UVA 54, #64 UMBC 74

me in this thread after being awake for four and a half hours but still haven't had my morning coffee yet like

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

Have you tried sniffing glue yet?

Directions from Blacksburg to whoville, go north till you smell it then go east until you step in it

So does this mean Trevon Hill get to sue Fuente now? I personally don't see much of a difference. Both players weren't living up to the coaches expectations. It happens.

Te to qb

Excuse me what? She is required to mimic her coaches beliefs on standing or kneeling for the national anthem of the country she is a citizen of or she is kicked off?

Buzz making every player stand for the anthem if they were going to be on the team would have been a better analogy I suppose. However my overarching point is that there is a precedent of the coach setting the culture and if you don't conform you're off the team. Hill said something Fuente didn't like. This girl did something her coach didn't like. Difference is Hill actually seemed liked by his teammates and was kicked off instead of quitting. Her coach also didn't subtweet her in a national magazine.

Te to qb

lol....this thread tho

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It's always darkest before the dawn ~ Thomas Fuller

There's always a lighthouse. There's always a man. There's always a city.

Regardless of her Political Stance, the coach should not have berated her in front of everyone. That is absolutely degrading. He could have pulled her aside after the game and talked to her in Private. I'm sick to my stomach after reading the article. Adair should be fired for abusing a player.

Hokies, Local Soccer, AFC Ajax, Ravens

I'll stay away from the content of the argument itself until the details are flushed out but I doubt you would have many college coaches left if everyone was fired for yelling at players during practice or at games.

Do it behind closed doors tho not in front of everybody

So with miles and miles to go, you never left
To find your purpose
Get up, you can and you will
Life is a task and scary as hell

Kneeling issue aside I don't know that I had a coach from little league on up that did not yell and berate us. That used to be called motivation and helped us develop tough skin for the lovely and kind words opponents and their fans used towards us. Different generations I guess, also get off my lawn

I can imagine no more rewarding a career. And any man who may be asked in this century what he did to make his life worthwhile, I think can respond with a good deal of pride and satisfaction:
โ€œI served in the United States Navy"

She's arguing harassment based on viewpoint discrimination which is a little different.

It's Time to go to Work

Viewpoint discrimination?

That's when the government treats one speech act differently than another based on the viewpoint it expresses.

Thats not what happened here.

Chalk that one up to lazy language by me. Didn't realize that the term had an established jurisprudential meaning already.

It's Time to go to Work

She's deflecting.

She did some things that'll eventually come to light. I don't have have sympathy for her.

TKPhi Damn Proud
BSME 2009

Did she say that or did you just say she said that

So with miles and miles to go, you never left
To find your purpose
Get up, you can and you will
Life is a task and scary as hell

You can't just say this and leave. is it true or not๐Ÿ˜‚

So with miles and miles to go, you never left
To find your purpose
Get up, you can and you will
Life is a task and scary as hell

Where are you seeing that she did that? I know they mentioned screen shots of messages, but not the content of those messages.

Que the Well we're waiting gif๐Ÿ˜‚

So with miles and miles to go, you never left
To find your purpose
Get up, you can and you will
Life is a task and scary as hell

There are times where my connections make me very uncomfortable, and I get a, "well you're not black so why are you upset?".

TKPhi Damn Proud
BSME 2009

just to clarify, you made a claim in your previous comment that was much stronger than what the article in the OP shared. are you saying you have a source or firsthand knowledge that substantiates the claim, or are you speculating/making an educated guess?

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

I think when the person read the discrimination part with the teammates and the group chat they automatically thought she said the word

So with miles and miles to go, you never left
To find your purpose
Get up, you can and you will
Life is a task and scary as hell

Until we know what is in those messages. We can't assume she said the word until proven otherwise so if I was them I wouldn't have posted anything until the whole story comes out

So with miles and miles to go, you never left
To find your purpose
Get up, you can and you will
Life is a task and scary as hell

this blows...bye

Wait who you saying bye too๐Ÿ˜‚

So with miles and miles to go, you never left
To find your purpose
Get up, you can and you will
Life is a task and scary as hell