Virginia Tech Athletics forges ahead in evolving NIL space.NIL collectives in marketplace align with Tech and #Hokies also set to financially reward academic progress.— HokieSports (@hokiesports) April 14, 2022
Virginia Tech Athletics continues to explore additional avenues for its student-athletes to monetize their visibility as representatives of the Hokies' brand. In March, Tech Athletics announced an enhanced partnership with INFLCR, launching the Hokies Exchange platform for student-athletes and businesses to interact and arrange a variety of Name, Image and Likeness (NIL) endorsement deals.
Once a business, collective or individual has registered and been approved for Hokies Exchange, it will be put into a database where student-athletes and the entity can connect for potential NIL deals. Businesses can filter through the index of student-athletes and narrow down selections using different criteria.
Additionally, director of athletics Whit Babcock, has confirmed that a trio of NIL collectives have offered their services to Virginia Tech student-athletes, businesses and donors. Babcock indicated the following three organizations have chosen to align with the Hokies:
- Commonwealth NIL
Commonwealth NIL is a New River Valley based company founded by former Virginia State Delegate Nick Rush and Tech alum Forrest Rush. Commonwealth NIL specializes in comprehensive, diverse, and innovative NIL solutions. Commonwealth NIL is raising resources for NIL contracts through events, activities and special sales with a unique focus in the Commonwealth of Virginia.- Hot Route Marketing, LLC
Hot Route Marketing has taken a different approach than other organizations in the NIL space. Under the leadership of Virginia Tech alum Kelly Woolwine, Hot Route Marketing, LLC represents a vehicle in which business, donors and fans can invest into a consolidated pool of resources from which NIL opportunities can be arranged for student-athletes.- Triumph NIL, LLC
Triumph NIL seeks to partner corporate clients with Tech student-athletes to build compelling campaigns that drive real results, in addition to offering platforms for donors and fans to support their favorite Hokies. This group is led by James Cowan, chairman at CowanPerry PC and also includes former Tech All-America running back, Kevin Jones.
Along with this, Tech also announced a financial rewards program for academic success for athletes:
Virginia Tech Athletics also announced on Thursday that it plans to make financial awards available to student-athletes as a result of the Supreme Court's decision last June in the Alston vs. NCAA case.
"We are pleased to be able to offer this financial incentive for our student-athletes to make the type of academic progress that will benefit them for years to come after graduation," Babcock said. "We are currently finalizing our criteria for this program and plan to roll out the details to student-athletes, their families and our coaching staffs this summer. We anticipate beginning this financial reward package beginning in Fall 2022. Thanks to the tremendous success of our Drive for 25 campaign and the generosity of our Hokie Club donors, we intend to be very competitive in this space to ensure Virginia Tech remains a very attractive destination for the nation's top student-athletes."
Comments
Love it. LETS GO!!
HOKIES!!!!
I'm really glad the kids can make money while they're in school, they really deserve it. That being said this had a lot of verbiage that didn't make much sense, it just sounds like fundraising platforms to then pay student athletes. I thought the whole purpose of NIL was to use their image not just get paid by an LLC for being on scholarship
IDK none of this makes much sense and seems like a really big balloon that will get messy when it pops. Someone explain it better to me please
Nick Saban was recently commenting on this and said the current system isn't sustainable and was not what the NCAA intended. Some of that may be sour grapes that he no longer has the advantage of rich boosters buying recruits that everyone knows was happening, but he's right. This was not the intent but is what has happened. There are legal limitations on schools just funneling money to students but I guess it is these partnerships that allow them to do it. Think of it as a marketplace to get endorsements by association. That is kind of what NIL was intended for but it's all a bit wild right now.
I agree that the current set up is not really what was intended. However, I am happy that we are out in front on this and getting the deals done. I think in another thread it was mentioned that Babcock had said that Pry was all over him on this issue to get out in front of it, and that to me is just another reason to love this hire. If they change the set up in the future then fine, but I am happy we are making sure we are out in front and capitalizing on it while we can.
While I agree with Saban, college football hasn't been on a sustainable path for 25 years. When the majority of P5 coaches, who coach amateur sports, make more than professional coaches in a sports league that has been printing their own money since the mid 90s you have something really broken.
The money in college football is insane, pro teams don't own their stadium (besides dallas/dc), colleges do, and they are bigger. College football has the 14 largest stadiums. Executives for bowl games maje millions. for a single game a year! VT's facilities look way nicer than the Washington Coma-somethings. The pro team practices in a bubble. The Beamer barn I was nicer than that.
So at some point something has to give when amateur sports are more profitable than professional sports.
Intent, yes. But in practice there was enough grey area left that this is immediately what it became. NIL is now effectively a salary that players can expect to earn when playing for various schools across the country, and if you aren't able to pay you very quickly won't be able to compete. There are some legalities you need to abide by that makes sure it isn't directly called a paycheck, but at the end of the day, that's what it is.
As for the balloon about to pop, its only a matter of time before there's a mass revolt against college tuition. I was recently talking with a financial advisor and was basically told that, if I wanted to send my kids to VT, expect to pay no less than $50k per kid per year, and it wouldn't be much cheaper if we sent them in state to UNC or NCSU. That's $200k per kid in debt just to get an undergrad that might pay a $40k per year salary after college. And now you have schools raking in money that already allow their athletes to graduate without paying tuition, but now these schools are setting up salaries for these players that actually earns them money in college while the regulars are getting screwed over like that?
Its only a matter of time before that the simmering anger over student debt becomes a rolling broil that the schools cannot control.
To follow up on this point, I had a son a little over a year ago and was looking at college cost projections when he graduates high school to set up his 529, some websites were projecting over $225k for in-state for four years...
Schools are in an amenities arm race and are raising costs to get the fanciest everything for their students because the loan money keeps coming in, I have to imagine it pops but its going to be a fascinating area over the next 10-15 years to watch
It's pretty crazy. I spent 5 years at Tech for about $60k total. Including four years of room and board. My kids will pay that much a year for an in state school.
And its all being financed through predatory loans with interest rates and payment schedules that make it nearly impossible to pay off in a lifetime. Right now it is financially irresponsible for anyone to go to college, and that entire industry is long overdue for a collapse.
Put it this way, if college is this expensive when my kids graduate high school, they will go to community college. 4 year schools are not worth the price they are projecting us to pay in 15 years. Its quickly becoming prohibitively expensive for even the upper middle class to go to college without saddling them with enough debt that it forces them and their children into poverty. Its just not worth it. I love Virginia Tech, but I don't love it $400k worth of debt over 2 kids.
I've heard some financial industry professionals compare increasing student loan debt to the housing market bubble of the early 2000's and make predictions that it will be a contributing factor to our next market collapse but I'm not convinced yet. It is absolutely out of control for sure. I graduated in 2008 with less than $18k in student loan debt. By comparison, my younger sister graduated in 2014 with double that. It's not sustainable.
I attended Tech from 1983-1988. Below is my income levels from beginning of my work life in 1982 through 1991
1982 832 jr year high school sep-dec avg 20-30 hrs/wk -bagging groceries Ukrops minimum wage (3.35/hr)
1983 4,277 sr yr high school/freshman quarter VT (full time 30-40 hr per week til September- zero after that bagging groceries Ukrops minimum wage (3.35/hr)
1984 2,243 only worked summer and school breaks 25-40 hrs/wk bagging groceries Ukrops minimum wage (3.35/hr)
1985 1,997 only worked summer and school breaks 25-40 hrs/wk bagging groceries Ukrops minimum wage (3.35/hr)
1986 3,012 only worked summer and school breaks 2 jobs 25-40 hrs/wk bagging groceries Ukrops minimum wage (3.35/hr) 40 hrs /wk O'briensteins utility dishwasher about $4/hr)
1987 2,223 only worked summer and school breaks 25-40 hrs/wk $4/hr
1988 8,011 full time July-Dec avg 40 hrs/week $4/hr
1989 15,399 full time 40 hrs/wk waiting tables and kitchen-O'Briensteins 40-50 hr/wk $2.15 +tis and 4.50/hr
1990 22,843 full time 40 hrs/wk asst mgr O'briensteins/ground round full time salary
1991 24,311 full time 40 hrs/wk asst mgr O'briensteins/ground round full time salary
First year full scholarship $4000 -total tuition fees room and board $3200 (I actually "made " almost 300/quarter from scholarship-lost scholarship cause GPA below 3.4(was a multi year scholarship for $4k/yr)-also got full year 15 credit hours) for 1st year engineering calculus from AP testing.
Second year approx $3700 tuition fees room and board-paid cash from my savings from job salaries for previous few years
Third year approx $4100 tuition fees +my share of apt rent at school- worked 2 jobs -total 70 hrs/wk during summer
Fourth year approx $4500 tuition fees plus my share of apt rent-40 hrs/wk summer and breaks- pd using savings plus student loan proceeds plus loan from parents sep-dec cause senior year y parents made too much for me to qualify for student loans.
Fifth year approx $5100 tuition fees plus my share of apt rent-40 hrs/wk summer and breaks- pd using savings plus loan from parents (Jan-June) then full time work
Never worked while at Blacksburg- lived free at home during summer and breaks. After graduation total debt was $3250 from student loans and $5000 to parents. Parents charged $100/mo room and board. Pd the entiire $3250 in outside loans within six month grace period so zero interest; loan from parents they asked me to pay $50/mo but I paid $300/mo and paid off in just over yr and a half(no interest charged.
So total cost of college for me (for 5 years) was just over 22k and I was able to be debt free within 2 years of graduating.
I know inflation in general was high since then and college costs grew exponentially faster.
In mid 80s VT had a building freeze where they couldn't add any new classroom space so it was very crowded. I had one class in the Lyric theater and several in what used to be large storage closets. The only gym for regular students was War Memorial and only the three dining halls-Dietrick. Owens and Schultz-no fancy options like you have now. The skyrocketing costs are due largely to two phenomena- the addition of many more student amenities(which may or may not be used by all students) and the largely unsecured and easy credit from student loans.
It's true that many students have no business attending college as they are not academically prepared (see the staggering # of 'remedial classes' needed at most schools). Plus many get degrees that have no chance of getting marketable skills. Trade schools or apprenticeships would be better for many. My daughter took dual ed classes-simultaneous high school/college credit-while still in high school then did community college. After 1 semester of community college she was an academic junior level and transferred to VCU. She worked almost full time waiting tables while attending college and graduated in less than 4 years. She now makes almost as much at 29 yrs old as I do at 57 (-upper middle class level).
Just an illustration of what used to be possible vs now and what the numbers have done since then.
The average 4 year state school in 1980 could be paid for (tuition, room and board) with 19 hours of minimum wage work (after taxes, assuming no deductions and used va state tax). In 2019-2020 college estimated to take 45 hours assuming the minimum wage is $11 (which is VAs minimum wage) or 68 hours a week using the federal minimum.
We went from a part time job at McDonald's to having multiple jobs just to pay for school.
We have a friend whose daughter spent two years in community college knocking out all the BS core curriculum stuff and then transferred to UVA. Now she can just focus on in-major classes and only has to pay for two years of expensive ass college.
I will highly encourage my kids to do the same. Except for the UVA part.
Smart way to do it these days. Saves a ton of money and easier to get through the wickets.
Requires a lot of discipline to see it through.
And yet, every Virginia Community College has had significant drops in enrollment over the last 3-4 years. Baffling
That's what I did. I went to community college for the core class and then to VT for last two years. Graduated with zero student loan debt, thanks to my amazing parents. The amount of debt students have now incredible.
We have four kids and this has been our plan since day one. First one in 3rd year at local community College (took time off for Covid), and second in second year. The last two set to go next year. Their employer (part time after school jobs) offers scholarships that cover half the cost of the tuition. We will be paying out of pocket less than $20,000 for a total of 8 years of education. The value of Community Colleges for first two years is immeasurable.
seems you've just measured it, though :P
I was Maryland resident that attended VT from 2008-2013. Total cost at VT was cheaper UMD due to housing costs in college park. Always blew my mind
To me, these are two separate and unrelated things. The college loan industry is humming along regardless and independent of college athletics getting/not getting paid. College Athletes are some of the few who add immediate value to the university. Most other students won't add value for some period of time. Doesn't mean that non-athletes should have to go into 6-figure debt, but also doesn't mean that it's "unfair" for athletes to maximize their value (which, after all, is far greater than that of the average student).
Somewhat unrelated: Planet Money did a podcast on how Purdue has found a new way for students to fund their education: they can sell equity instead of taking on debt.
I'd love to see VT start inventing the future again, and placing bets on the success of their graduates, like Purdue is.
You say that this is two conversations, and I say that its one. Students are paying the price for schools to give over the top facilities to recruit. They're paying to build these lavish dorms and flashy classrooms that attract better talent but don't provide a better education. And now, instead of helping those students out, schools are working with NIL firms that totally aren't shadow companies of the universities themselves to effectively pay those people the students' funds are recruiting a salary.
At the end of the day, that is why it costs $50k a year to send a kid to Virginia Tech. That is why kids are graduating with $200k in debt with predatory interest that makes paying down the principle nearly impossible, especially with entry level salaries.
Its an industry wide arms race that is benefitting the few while screwing over the rest, and if you don't think that this is going to eventually pit students against athletes, I don't know what to tell you.
Tech campus side pays very little to athletics side that isn't a loan paid back. What's driving up cost the fastest is cutting of state and no increase in federal funding of education. State funding sits about 6 BILLION lower in todays dollars than in did in 2008.
The notion that tuition is going up because state and federal funding has not gone up is a myth perpetuated by The Education Industrial Complex. Let's assume that $6 billion dollar figure is correct. I don't know, but have no reason to doubt you. From the National Center for Education Statistics, there were about 19.4 million college students in the US in fall 2020. Another link I just checked had it as 19.6 million. Divide $6,000,000,000 by 19,400,000 and you get about $309 per student. Tuition has gone up a lot more than $309 since 2008.
Also, private school tuition, which should not be impacted by state funding, had been going up even faster than public last I checked. Maybe that has changed the last couple of years. If grant/research money doubles or investment income doubles (which they have) at places like Yale, tuition does not go down. You could double state funding for public schools and - having spent more time inside the Education Industrial Complex than I care to admit - I'll gladly take a bet that tuition does not drop. Might slow or have a short-term dip for a year, but not sustained. Although I do admit we have no way to prove that theory short of finding a state willing to double funding, so I could be wrong.
Also, states increased funding at different rates. Those that increased more than others had not seen tuition go down.
The reason universities are raising tuition is because they can. Guaranteed government-backed (i.e., taxpayer-backed) loans mean the school is paid no matter what happens to the student. Raise tuition 20% and the loans go up to match. Student cannot get a job to cover, it is the government-backed loan (that is, the taxpayer) that pays. School gets everything even if 40% of freshmen drop out.
Simple solution: get the US Federal Government stop backing loans. Grandfather in everyone in college now as well as 12th graders going in so the rug is not pulled out from under them. After that, all loans must come from the private sector. Will need to pass a law so that anyone who gives a student loan has to keep it on their books and service the loan. No ability to resell so we avoid another mortgage-backed securities debacle. They get the benefit if it is paid back and suffer if it is not. Allow at least partial default on loans. If a regular lending agency or bank is on the hook if the loan defaults, how many of them are going to loan an 18 year old $40,000 a year in tuition alone to study something like philosophy or art appreciation? Then watch how fast tuition comes down. Will be real severe short-term pain, but as others have pointed out, the bubble has to burst and the system is unsustainable.
Why are you using a US number, 19.6 million? Fireman is talking about the state number? You're looking closer to ~275k VA students so is more like $22,000 per student per year. Which tracks with what others are saying about $50k a year verse the around 25k I paid a year when I was there.
Ah got it. Thank you. But the other points all still stand about increased funding having minimal impact on tuition when you look at state-by-state levels and private schools. Unlimited government-backed loans with 0 risk for the school if things do not work out is the driver of tuition increases. Not lack of state spending. When you are on the inside and just see the layers and layers of bureaucracy, it is just ... ugh.
I mean I would argue that the money was alway government backed, it used to be coming directly from the state, now it comes through the students.
When it came from the state then the state has a say because it's their money. Now the risk is all on the students and they dont have a collective voice. Basically it's now money with no strings attached to the school.
You should hop into the private sector and see the layers and layers of bureaucracy in any financial institution large enough to be a player in this space. Easy to say private loans solve everything, but that also sets us back generations by making higher education inaccessible to all but the wealthy. Using government money to build institutions like Virginia Tech (ie. land grant), and making enrollment accessible to as many people as possible, is a big part of what spurred US growth and innovation over the past 150 years. What you're describing is a problem, no doubt, but pretending the solutions are so simple is counter-productive imo.
Oh I'm in the private sector. And comparing it with universities, we are waaaay more lean! Never been in banking though. Are you in finance and is it that bad there? I could imagine so.
I do think the solution is very simple though. And, as I noted, it will cause sharp short-term pain. But once universities have empty campuses for a few years as only the well off can afford their pricing structure, and universities start failing because of that, watch the tuition come down fast and the Club Med perks drop off. I see it like the Fed crushing inflation in the 80s. It sucked, but if we stayed in the 70s, we would have crashed anyway. Just get the pain over with before things get any worse. Wanted that to happen many years ago.
This. 100% this. College tuition has increased something like 8 times the rate of wages, and it is all because the loan money is completely guaranteed by the government. There's simply no accountability to those who passed the law when the students default (instead they literally just pass the buck to the tax payer) so it created a monster. The schools increased tuition year over year for no other reason than they could (and who could blame them). The government kept lending because, well, didn't it make us all feel good to send so many kids to college? The 18 year olds didn't understand what they were signing up for regarding repayment, instead believing they were doing what everyone told them they had to do for their whole lives if they wanted to be successful: go to college. So, naturally, many of them think they're doing the right thing when they see big shiny buildings and gleefully agree to pay $40k or more per year to study the art and science of being jobless.
You really can't blame the kids, as they don't know any better. The universities have some blame, but it's hard for anyone to turn down free money. Private businesses would do the same thing (see pandemic relief debacle). The painful irony ends up being that all of this eventually is paid for by folks who graduated before it was set in motion, those who didn't go to college but have valuable skills, and the few who successfully navigated the system. While designed to be more inclusive, I'd argue that this system ends up perpetuating the economic divide, as only the wealthy can afford to have their kids not saddled with student loan debt.
I say all this as someone with far too much experience in it. My wife (pharmacist) and I (lawyer) both come from middle class to blue collar backgrounds. I've been out for almost 10 years and our monthly student loan obligations (which we've refinanced 4 times to get lower rates) are still significantly more than our mortgage (and we're blessed to have a pretty nice house). We aren't hurting by any means (other than having no free time together), but can deeply appreciate how the system we navigated will crush others for life. The good news for us though is that as soon as we pay ours off, we can start saving 200k+ per child so they don't have to deal with this. [Dies a little inside and searches for Bourbon].
Good luck and wishing you the folks best. We opened 2 529 plans for out daughter right about 2 months after she was born so she would (hopefully) not need to deal with this.
Thanks. And yep. That's the plan as soon as they arrive.
Would love to get into a lovely conversation on that subject, but we are straying into political waters with a lot of cross currents and shallow reefs. So instead I agree, and it is something that needs to be addressed.
How about this weather?
Counter: the same 'lifestyle inflation' in colleges (over the top dorms, student centers, etc) are happening at non-football schools too.
Actually UNC (and USCe if you have ACT scores over 21) are significantly lower if you live in North Carolina. Mid 30's. Still a lot, but significantly less.
Source: Senior at USCe who chose there over VT because of the $70K cost difference.
Here's a really good Podcast explaining what's happening. TL;DR:
The graphics/recruiting team is really putting in good work. Saw a bunch of these on Twitter today
I don't know if I am just out of touch but I was happier to see the financial rewards for good "student" athletes more than the NIL stuff.
You're right, of course. But that's not the reality of college football or basketball right now.
It's more of a "show them the money" situation.
So not VT related, but NIL related......
John Daly is an absolute specimen of a man. I too love getting drunk and smoking cigars on a golf course but I shoot a 100+ not a PGA golfer...
They're not even hiding this is straight up pay to play at this point. And a car, built into NIL while he's at Miami. Awesome
I'm so mad that the NCAA didn't bother to regulate NIL. We all knew this would happen, but they refused to accept to possibility of court decisions going against them and preparing for the inevitable.
Yep. This kid gets $400k per year and a car to go along with free tuition while the kids he sits next to in class are signed up for a lifetime of debt due to predatory student loans they have no hope of paying off.
This shit ain't right.
I'm not gonna be upset about a kid getting money, but there should be regulations on how this works. If it's really NIL, then the school shouldn't be funneling money for commitments. The players should be getting paid by companies for autographs, their image being used on video games or ads, not the school directing funds to players via a "collective."
It's a shame the NCAA put no guard rails around this at all. If we're going down the road then it may as well be actual pay for play.
If they HAD put up guard rails, they likely would have been sued.
But they should have at least tried.
This is getting out of hand quickly. Even the NFL has salary caps.
The whole reason the NCAA doesn't want to be involved is so it's not pay for play, making athletes employees opens a whole can of worms.
And instead of addressing the root of the problem they're willing to let the entire system die of corporate greed so that they can keep their hands clean.
Higher education bubble is getting closer and closer to bursting. This shit is getting downright ridiculous and makes it hard to maintain interest in college athletics.
Yet somehow, we're all still interested, and ratings are as high as ever.
....for now.....
The mortgage market was really strong in 2007 as well. When these things pop, shit gets ugly in a hurry. The second that students start realizing the financial inequity that is now in place between athletes and the student body and that their tuition is going in part to help fund the lavish facilities that those paid to play athletes are getting, shit is going to hit the fan, and its going to spread across the academic fields like a wildfire. And now you have schools partnering with firms that are advertising 6 figure salaries plus company car for a kid to pretend to take classes and shoot a basketball in a sport that the student body of Miami has routinely showed they don't care about? We're just inching closer to the precipice.
I don't think anyone is, or will be, surprised that athletes are paid a lot.
Tuition and college expenses are too high, but mostly because of the way the government supports higher education. Unfortunately, government doesn't seem to have the will to fix higher education, mostly because a lot of people in charge are comfortable with there being inequities.
One thing I didn't find out until recently is that getting advocates for higher education is really hard. In the state of WV a highschool teacher can be involved in lobbying, or can even run for state legislation and continue to teach. A college professor is either a state employee or at a private institution. As a state employee they cant lobby the government or become a legislator and keep their college position.
So it's much harder to work the system so to speak.
There was no nuance or forsight, so here we are- pay for play. The Calipari's, Jay Bilas's and Jalen Roses of the world compared kids getting a free ride to Duke wearing their designer clothes, Jordans and 500 dollar headphones off the bus to "slaves". So there was pressure to do "something" and in typical NCAA fashion, they botched it. There is no putting this genie back in the bottle.
Really? That trash does not belong on TKP.
I didn't downvote, but which part of the comment is trash?
DC didn't provide a source. But provided it's a verifiable quote from one of those people, what would be the issue? It's not trash if it's a statement of fact that one of the referenced people said such things.
Call me crazy, but I don't think anyone should be compared to slaves. I don't care if it a verifiable quote. There are lots of quotes that shouldn't be repeated.
Don't think anyone disagrees with you? Really dumb comparison to make by one of those 3 names above.
Wait until he gets the 100,000 plus in taxes bills.
That brings up a really good point. The majority of athletes will never see NIL deals like this, but for the ones that do I hope they are getting good financial advice. I know I would have screwed a lot of things up at the age of 18 if I had this kind of money.
Is he eligible to put any of that into a retirement program? Will he be considered self employed for Social Security, etc to take a chunk out?
Are these basically Super PACs, but for college sports?