Edit: USMNT R16 v. Netherlands preview here
Edit: Non-US knockout games discussion thread here
It's finally here (5 months too late)! World Cup 2022 will kick off on November 20 at 11 AM ET with hosts Qatar taking on Ecuador in Group A.
I just want to take a moment to say that it sucks that this tournament is taking place in Qatar. I'm sure everyone knows about what's gone on in terms of the process to award the tournament to Qatar, the human rights issues (putting it mildly) in the buildup, and the general badness of the Qatari government.
ANYWAY - you can find the groups here and the schedule here.
The USMNT opens their campaign against Wales on Monday, November 21 at 2 PM. Then, they take on England in the Revolutionary War on Black Friday also at 2 PM, and finish up the group with Iran on Tuesday, November 29 at 2 PM. It's a group of medium difficulty - not the hardest but not easy by any means - and the USMNT looked pretty poor last time we saw them in friendlies against Japan and Saudi Arabia in September.
If you don't know anything about soccer, the World Cup or the USMNT, check out this short podcast episode- a primer for non-soccer or casual soccer fans to help get you up to speed. Scuffed Podcast
Injuries:
- Chris Richards, CB - As of Oct. 28, was about a week to 10 days from returning to training. It's going to be close, but I think it might be too late for him. Even before the injury he wasn't playing much for Crystal Palace. An unfortunate miss for an already thin position group. EDIT - Chris has posted on Instagram that he will miss the World Cup due to injury.
- Sam Vines, LB - Broken leg over the weekend (Nov. 5). Was on the bubble anyway, but is definitely out now.
- Luca De La Torre, CM - Reported leg injury on Oct. 28, returned to training on Nov. 5.
- Weston McKennie, CM - Thigh injury reported on Oct. 30, out at least 15 days. Reportedly returned to training Nov. 7.
- Josh Sargent, ST - Calf injury reported on Oct. 29. Doesn't sound serious, but haven't seen any updates since then.
I will update this post with the roster when it is announced on November 9, but here is my best guess (not what I would do, and sadly it is not quite the same).
Full Squad:
In list form. ๐Full Roster Details ยป https://t.co/bQXU2MSmXh#USMNT x @budweiserusa https://t.co/625oOUeEJb pic.twitter.com/Bd5aQQZ24dโ U.S. Men's National Soccer Team (@USMNT) November 9, 2022
Projected Squad (26 player max):
GKs: Matt Turner (Arsenal), Zack Steffen (Middlesbrough), Sean Johnson (NYCFC); Just missed: Ethan Horvath (Luton Town), Gaga Slonina (Chicago Fire)
FBs: Sergino Dest (AC Milan), Antonee Robinson (Fulham), DeAndre Yedlin (Inter Miami), Joe Scally (Borussia Monchengladbach), Reggie Cannon (Boavista); Just missed: Shaq Moore (Nashville SC)
CBs: Walker Zimmerman (Nashville SC), Aaron Long (NY Red Bulls), Cameron Carter-Vickers (Celtic), Tim Ream (Fulham); Just missed: Mark McKenzie (Genk), James Sands (Rangers), John Brooks (Benfica), Erik Palmer-Brown (Troyes), Auston Trusty (Birmingham City)
DMs: Tyler Adams (Leeds United), Kellyn Acosta (LAFC)
CMs: Weston McKennie (Juventus), Yunus Musah (Valencia), Luca De La Torre (Celta Vigo); Just missed: Christian Roldan (Seattle Sounders), Eryk Williamson (Portland Timbers)
AMs: Gio Reyna (Borussia Dortmund), Brendan Aaronson (Leeds United), Malik Tillman (Rangers); Just missed: Djordje Mihailovic (AZ Alkmaar)
Wings: Christian Pulisic (Chelsea), Tim Weah (Lille), Paul Arriola (FC Dallas); Just missed: Jordan Morris (Seattle Sounders)
STs: Jesus Ferreira (FC Dallas), Josh Sargent (Norwich City), Ricardo Pepi (Groningen); Just missed: Jordan Pefok (Union Berlin), Brandon Vazquez (FC Cincinnati)
If Richards is able to return in time, I would drop Ream, but it looks like a pretty long shot at this point.
Opponent previews (Summary from The Athletic - paywall):
Cymru (Wales) - Squad
Cymru qualified for the World Cup via the European playoff by finishing second in their UEFA qualification group behind Belgium with 15 points from 8 matches. In the 4-team playoff, they defeated Austria 2-1 in the first round and Ukraine 1-0 in the final. They most recently played the USMNT in a friendly in 2020, which finished in a 0-0 draw.
Their key players are GK Danny Ward (Leicester City), CM Aaron Ramsey (Nice), Winger Dan James (Fulham), ST Kieffer Moore (Bournemouth), and Attacker Gareth Bale (LAFC). They generally play a fairly conservative gameplan and rely on the star power of Bale and the aerial prowess of Moore to grind out results. While Bale hasn't played recently due to injury and hasn't been in good club form for many years, he alwasy seems to turn up for the Dragons. This is not an easy game by any means, but it is one the US should hope to get all three points from and get off to a good start. Cymru will likely look to keep their defense compact and organized and nick a goal on the counter or from a set piece.
England - Squad
England topped their UEFA qualification group with 26 points from 10 matches, which automatically qualified them for the World Cup. Their most recent match against the US was the famous 2010 World Cup group match where Clint Dempsey scored a long-range equalizer (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cIkAxHsr62Q) after a tame shot was spectacularly mishandled by England GK Rob Green to allow the match to finish in a 1-1 draw. Despite the famous proclamation of "EASY - England Algeria Slovenia Yanks" by the British media (https://www.flickr.com/photos/dullhunk/4714590924), the US finished first on the goals scored tiebreaker although England also went through to the knockouts.
I'm sure most people will recognize just about all of their players from watching the Premier League every weekend, but a few of their key players are GK Jordan Pickford (Everton), CB Harry Maguire - not for good reasons (Manchester United), CM Jude Bellingham (Borussia Dortmund), Wingers Raheem Sterling (Chelsea) and Bukayo Saka (Arsenal), and ST Harry Kane (Spurs). Despite having one of the most star-studded squads in international soccer, manager Gareth Southgate tends to set them up in a conservative 3-4-3 formation. They have had trouble scoring goals recently, but they are certainly a sleeping giant waiting to be awoken if Southgate can implement some more progressive tactics. Even so, they were semi-finalists in the 2018 World Cup and finalists at Euro 2020. While the USMNT will certainly be up for this match against some of the best in the world, some of whom are their teammates, England is one of the tournament favorites and a point from this match would be a very good result for the USMNT.
Iran - Squad:
Iran also topped the AFC qualification group with 25 points from 10 matches, automatically qualifying them for the World Cup. They haven't played a match against the USMNT since 2000, a 1-1 draw in a friendly. They recently (September) fired the coach who brought them through qualifying and replaced him with Carlos Queiroz, who managed them previously from 2011-2019. So, they are in a bit of disarray, but should not be discounted.
They have a few players performing at a high level throughout Europe. I will not pretend to be an expert on their squad, but some names I recognize: Winger Alireza Jahanbaksh (Feyenoord), Winger Saman Ghoddos (Brentford), ST Sardar Azmoun (Bayer Leverkusen), and ST Medhi Taremi (FC Porto). In particular, Taremi and Azmoun are big, big threats. Taremi is one of the top strikers in Portugal and has had a good season thus far following a very good season last year.
I believe with Queiroz back at the helm they will adopt some conservative tactics, but they will be very, very dangerous when they do generate good chances with their talented strikers. This will be the final match of the group, so it's possible that one team will not have much to play for. Or, it could be the decider for who goes through. I kind of have a bad feeling about this game - it feels like the Algeria game from 2010. Landon Donovan (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DrGbhNYW030) famously rescued the points and secured qualification in the dying moments, but we were very nearly eliminated. Obviously, Harry Kane is not going to surprise anyone since everyone knows he is one of the best strikers in the world, but I feel Iran's frontmen could sneak up on us and punish us if we are bombing forward needing a result.
USA EDIT - Adding a quick summary of the US for anyone who may not be familiar with the team
The USMNT finished 3rd in the CONCACAF (North America and Carribean) WCQ group, the last of the automatic qualification places, with 25 points from 14 matches. Their coach is Gregg Berhalter, a former USMNT defender and former coach of the Columbus Crew. He generally sets the team up in a 4-3-3 formation. Their playing style varies a bit, but they generally try to keep possession, have the striker drop into the high midfield space and combine with the midfielders while the wingers make aggressive vertical runs in behind. They can also be a very effective pressing team due to their youth and athleticism. The midfielders in particular can cover a ton of ground. However, they have shown vulnerability when pressing against teams who are composed in possession and can find big switches to more advanced wide players and bypass the midfield. They have also had some trouble breaking down teams who like to sit deep and defend in a low block as opposed to pressing them high up the pitch. Some key players: LW Christian Pulisic (Chelsea), RW/AM Giovanni Reyna (Borussia Dortmund), DM Tyler Adams (Leeds United), FB Antonee Robinson (Fulham), CB Walker Zimmerman (Nashville SC), and GK Matt Turner (Arsenal).
Outlook
If the USMNT performs as they have previously in big games (basically whenever they play Mexico), they should advance. If one of the strikers rounds into form during the tournament, the CB opposite Walker Zimmerman (please don't be Aaron Long) is competent and the starting GK doesn't have any howlers (cough - Zack Steffen), we will go through. If we continue to lack ideas in final third, fail to generate chances against low block defenses, and remain vulnerable to the counter, we could be looking at an early exit.
I don't particularly have a lot of confidence left in the manager, Gregg Berhalter, to choose appropriate tactics or to adjust them if Plan A doesn't work. But the players seem to like him and they play hard for him, so here's hoping we can produce another vintage American try-hard performance.
Enjoy the tournament, and discuss below!
Comments
Paging The Fifth Fuller for Wales analysis!
[Hears a British accent]
Me: Excuse me ladies, but are you two from England?
Them: It's Wales you tosser.
Me: Oh I'm sorry. Are you two whales from England?
Damn you. Take your upvote and get the hell outta here.
Working on it
Will be interesting to see if France can kick the Cup winners curse. That team, on paper, is too stacked to get knocked out of the group stage.
Our group will be interesting for sure. England are going in on a downslide, but still very tough. Our game with them will be super important. I'm not too sure how Wales will fair, but Iran could be sneaky difficult for our group. Hopefully, we can kick our back luck of not performing well outside of the States, and make it to the knockout stages. I still think it'll be England/USA to make it out, but it could be tricker than some expect.
FWIW, since we've had a real soccer team we've actually done decently at World Cups. Quarterfinals in 2002 (almost beat Germany to advance to semis), out in group in 2006, advanced to knockouts in 2010 and 2014 (despite being in a group with Germany, Portugal and Ghana. Obviously missed 2018.
This is the first World Cup where we're actually going to try and play soccer as opposed to park the bus and counter so we'll see how that goes. Turns out park the bus and counter is a pretty good strategy in international soccer!
Be very careful what you wish for. The gritty kick you grind it out teams from the past world cups where we actually made some headway were a big part to why we made it in the knockouts. International football isnt always about playing pretty football, see France 2018 as main example or Portugal at the last Euros. Tournament football tends to lean on teams who can simply grind a win out and alot of times the pretty playing teams end up having an off day in front of goal and get dumped out by an iceland or someone who just defends like mad dogs and scrapes a goal or two on the counter. I'd give alot for a guy like Dempsey right now to teach this team how to scrape a win.
Yeah, that's what I'm saying...we're not going to play that way anymore and I'm not sure that's the best idea.
France always gets an easy group, good old FIFA rigging imo. They'll go through easily
They'll go through easily but Denmark is very good, they may top the group. France always seems to have some crazy locker room drama so you really never know what could happen
Lots of injuries too for les bleus
Huge blow to France, they should still get to the knockout stage but this is a massive loss for them.
When the draw happened, I thought we had a good chance to advance out of the group, maybe even win it if things went perfectly. But watching the team over the last month or so, I won't be shocked at all if we go winless. Whatever the result, get Ol Gregg out of there. It's time for new management.
As it is every 3-4 years lmao
Jordan should absolutely be on the roster for this. He's not an out and out 9, but neither really are Ferreira or Sargent, and he does so many other things at a high level. Would be a major asset, even if just as a super sub.
Agree I would bring him, but he is the most 9-like in consideration so not sure what you mean there. Ferreira is very much a 9 and a half. Sargent is a pretty complete forward imo (in terms of style).
But as much as people were clamoring for Pefok earlier this fall, his hot streak has gone cold while others like Sargent and Pepi have been in better form recently. Again, I would bring him but his exclusion won't and never has been egregious or inexplicable.
Ferreira and Sargent both seem to fit better as second strikers or CAMs. Pepi is a natural 9, but he's not exactly lighting the world on fire, and his turn of form has quite a bit to do with the league he's in. Jordan has cooled in terms of goals and assists lately, but he's still contributing at an extremely high level for a team that might just win the most competitive league in Europe.
The way he contributes seem more like a winger or a 10 to me. Excellent off ball and can poach goals, especially on a counter, but not really the target man that Gregg seems to want in the attack.
Excellent off ball and poaches goals are pretty much like the main things a 9 does imo. Target man is a type of striker, not a necessary attribute. And Gregg doesn't seem to prefer a target man at all. He prefers players like Ferreira, Sargent, and Pepi who are good at dropping into midfield to combine with other attackers.
Yeah, the Dutch league isn't great but it's more about confidence for strikers coming into a tournament like this.
Gregg specifically called Pepi in September when he wasn't playing ahead of several more in-form options. And now he's playing and scoring - he's definitely coming. Ferreira has been the starter for every meaningful match since January and scored 18 goals this season. Gregg is bringing him. If Pefok is going to sneak on it will be at the expense of Sargent. I honestly think Sargent should start, and I think he'll be in the squad.
Ordered a pair of kits over a month ago and the order still hasn't been filled. "Very High volume of orders."
Anybody else having problems?
Very high volume? For those kits? Surprised you didn't get it hand delivered by Landon Donovan just for being willing to spend money on it.
In all fairness, they were/are WNT kits.
Potential roster leak - unconfirmed but I heard that players were informed of their place on the roster on Monday so it's definitely possible.
Only difference from my guess is Roldan in over Arriola which, *shrug*
I'm going to the USA v. Iran game :)
That's awesome! US will probably need to win that one to advance. Should be exciting!
I need a break from the EPL:
WTH is going on with the 2 guys on the right?
Looks like there may be a surprise GK decision. I'm thinking either Slonina as 3rd GK or Steffen left off. Probably Slonina
Edit: Sources say no Steffen. Wow - he has been Berhalter's guy since the beginning. Hope this means he is going to be a little less rigid with his system
Honestly Turner is probably the #1 with Horvath just behind. Last summer was huge for both of them and to me they passed Steffen because of that and the way they both are playing currently. Surprising steffen wont be on the plane to qatar atleast but this isnt hugely surprising to me atleast.
I mean it's only surprising in the sense that I didn't think Berhalter was actually able to recognize that Steffen is bad. Most people watching for the past year could see that he makes way too many mistakes, isn't a very good shot stopper, and doesn't provide any meaningful advantage in distribution.
This makes a lot of sense if Turner is the #1 (which he should be). I've heard people say Steffen isn't necessarily happy being in camps as the # (though that might be different for the WC), so do you want to bring someone who tends to be injury prone? Johnson is a great veteran presence/locker room guy, and a solid GK himself, and Horvath has shown he can come up big in big games if you need him.
Heard that as well, but just speculation. Would be ironic since he had been #2 at City for a couple years.
To some extent, I get it, especially for a GK. But it's the World Cup. You should want to be there to support the team even if you're never going to play. Probably his only chance to go to a World Cup. Again, it's speculation so it could just be down to form, which would also be plausible.
Yeah, like taking a trans-Atlantic flight to not play against Honduras/Panama in a qualifier, I get. But like you said, the actual. WC is different. Maybe he didn't get the choice.
Squad reveal:
GKs: Turner, Horvath, Johnson
FBs: Dest, Robinson, Yedlin, Scally, Shaq Moore
CBs: Zimmerman, Long, Carter-Vickers, Ream
DMs: Adams, Acosta
CMs: McKennie, Musah, De La Torre, Aaronson, Roldan
Wings: Pulisic, Reyna, Weah, Morris
STs: Ferreira, Wright, Sargent
- No Steffen
- Shaq Moore surprisingly making the cut over Reggie Cannon
- Aaronson listed as a midfielder
- Morris over Arriola
- Haji Wright from out of nowhere!
- No Pepi is kind of shocking - but some reports that he may have picked up an injury
I like Moore. He finds himself in alot of good positions
I agree, I think Moore is fine and better offensively than Cannon. Just not sure we need 5 FBs at all, but whatever
Yeah, ideally Moore never sees the field, but Dest/Robinson have been somewhat injury prone, so I guess the 5th FB is there because of that.
Love leaving Steffen out. Love Morris over Arriola. Love calling Ream (used to playing beside Robinson, and the back line needs all the help it can get). Can live with Shaq Moore, but I'd have tagged Cannon. HATE that with Pepi not in, Jordan still wasn't the third center forward, but I do love that Haji Wright is getting a chance and I think he fits well.
It seems like Pepi may have picked up an injury late. Otherwise, I'm pretty sure he would've made it.
100%. My only gripe is that even with that slot now open, Jordan still didn't get a call. Makes you wonder if he took Mrs. Berhalter out for a nice seafood dinner and then never called her again.
If we can return to our form from last summer, we will make some noise. If it's the form we were in this fall? Not so much.
Still, I Believe! ๐บ๐ธโฝ๏ธ
Pepi better be hurt because if not, that's dumb as fuck. We likely don't even qualify without him and now you leave him off?
If he was doing Erling Haaland things, yeah, it would make sense to be flustered. He scored three whole goals in qualifying, and was a nonfactor for most games he played. He did absolutely fuck all in Augsburg after getting a big deal, and he's now in decent form in a lower tier league. He's young and needs time to grow, and I think we all put waaaaay too much expectation on him in a rather unfair way. We have no clear cut must start striker, so even if he's not hurt, it's not hard to make an argument for leaving him out.
Apparently no injury, hasn't been mentioned at all to media. Pretty head scratching
Not for nothing, but Haji is tight with the Pulisic, McKennie, Adams core. I'm a bit shocked and a little disappointed for Pepi, but I don't think we should discount Wright's impact off the field in addition to the goals he's scored.
Apparently Wright was in competition with Pefok and Pepi was competing with Sargent and Ferreira. I think Wright is good, it's just surprising because Berhalter kind of called him out when he was called in over the summer. Good player though, one of the top scorers in Turkey and can create his own chances, which none of the other strikers can really do.
Any thoughts on England's roster?
No big surprises. Their starting 11 is pretty much set save a few spots where the quality won't drop much either way. Some depends on if they go back 3 or 4. One of Harry Maguire or Eric Dier is likely going to start, so that's a positive for us. Ideally they don't get 3 points in their opener so they have to be a bit more adventurous against us. Likely going to be Shaw-Maguire on left hand side, so I would target that area.
We can only hope to get so lucky that Southgate keeps putting his faith in Maguire.
I hate Harry Maguire so much and I wish he hadn't made the squad. If England does well it'll be despite him
Harry Maquire is a meme. But Maquire for the national team is completely different than Man U Maquire. Kind of like Pogba. I don't know how, but he is a sold back for Southgate. Don't expect to see a bumbling fool on the back line on Black Friday. Different jersey, different Maquire.
Harry Maguire just lost his man who scored for Iran. If not for his shoddy defense, this might still be a clean sheet
Connor Coady over Fikayo Tomori is a surprise, so is the gamble on Kalvin Phillips. Injury to Reece James made southgate's job a bit easier as England has perhaps the biggest glut of serviceable-to-world class right backs of sny country. No Jadon Sancho is probably the only other noteworthy omission with James Ward-Prowse, Jarrod Bowen, and Ivan Toney always fringe contenders. Tammy Abraham has been awful lately and missed out as well.
Yeah I was going to mention Tomori, but Coadyv isn't going to play, and I don't think Tomori would've either. That's the thing about people getting mad about squads - most of the players you're getting mad about being in or out aren't or weren't going to play more than maybe 5-10 minutes.
I would imagine they back three is Maguire, Stones, and Walker when he's fit. Until then, maybe White? I hope it's Dier though, lol
If anyone doesn't know a lot about the USMNT or the World Cup in general - here is a quick 15 minute podcast for "new" fans. Check it out if you're interested in the tournament or the USMNT but want to know what the heck is going on
Scuffed Podcast
World Cup?
That's soccer, right?
This ban comes 2 days before the events start. Yikes
Bold move for a sport that's best teams hail from countries that love booze
Its a minor thing next to the blatant corruption, slave labor, deaths and stupidly inhospitable environment, but they really are going out of their way to display what a horrifically stupid idea Qatar hosting this event is.
Oh its definitely far from the worst that Qatar has done as a part of hosting, but unfortunately its probably the one thing that will cause the most friction. Keep in mind, Budweiser is a major advertising partner and had apparently prepared for alcohol sales only to have them banned at the last minute after a 12 year plan.
Keep in mind, its not an outright ban. If you're one of the wealthy elites, its open bar in the luxury suites. But for the plebes, you get absolutely nothing.
I really hope Qatar loses every game in their group. It irritates me so much that Russia bought the world cup and set the blueprint for Qatar to do exactly the same thing. Neither nation deserved to host. Its too bad FIFA is so corrupt because the world loves this sport and this tournament.
Saw someone on twitter or reddit this morning explain that it's really not a minor thing. Qatar has made a lot of 'compromises' (for lack of a better term) for this World Cup - things like providing access and safety to journalists, allowing homosexuals into the event, etc - if they're willing to do a last minute 180 on beer sales, what else could they pull a last minute 180 on?
Only minor in comparison to the slave labor and death. People who break agreements in small things break them in large things.
This type of bait and switch should be the expectation.
Assume the downvote was a fat finger...
In regards to the decision, you cannot drink in public in Qatar. Assume this was sort of the plan all along since they came up with the beer garden idea when they said they wouldn't sell in the stadiums. Plus, with them being new stadiums, I can't imagine they have the capacity to keep tons of beer cold in that weather. They were thrown up for the bare minimum. At least at the beer gardens, the Heineken and Carlsburg folks get this concept, can handle the logistics, and will probably end up serving cold beer a lot longer than the stadiums would.
lol its not. I have a stalker downvoting everything I post.
From what I'm reading, FIFA and Bud had an understanding from the start that alcohol sales would be permitted only for the rug to be pulled out at the last minute.
Ah, gotcha.....
And ah, gotcha. Well, what I saw this morning was they were going to allow it in designated areas outside the stadium (thus the beer garden comment.) But this really doesn't surprise me. Making thing up as they go seem to be a more common occurrence than what we are typically used to, in general. One gorilla battling another gorilla in this situation.
Yeah, they were saying for a while that beer would be sold in stadiums only to do a 180 two days before the first game.
Can you imagine the lawsuit that Bud is going to try and file? At this late date, I am assuming they had already started shipping and refrigerating that beer.
I'm surprised this is a surprise.
I was reading on another forum about this and someone made the comment to the effect of "Well it's not like Qatar can ban pre-gaming"
The response they got was basically "Lol. They have banned pregaming since they became a country."
For those who go, hope you enjoy the lovely warm comforts of your stay!
But I'm sure the reporting from the event in the news will be completely factual and not pandering to the Qatar government at all. Its not like they're actively forcing live interviews off the air mid-segment with credentialed crews....
Just saving my money for 2026 when I know what I'm getting into, and could even make it to Philly and back in a day, or have enough miles to get to another stadium easily.
I've been saving for years knowing it's gonna be a financial commitment to have to try and go to games here especially on the east coast.
How much do you think it will cost for a random game in Philly? I'm planning ok going as well for at least a game but I honestly have no idea what the ballpark for tickets will be.
I'm guessing in 4 years, upper deck is gonna run you in the 400 range. But that's just speculation.
The tix for the international cup games were in the 275 range I believe, so w inflation and the spectacle, that's what I would imagine they would be around.
Yeah that's more or less what I expected. Hoping there will be a US game there but it will be cheaper if it's not I imagine. Hopefully my son will want to go!
I understand the draw of the World Cup and why people want to go, but I've got limited sympathy for anyone going to Qatar and being surprised at exactly what they are going to be getting.
I basically just said this to my friends... I don't care how big of a fan of soccer/the World Cup you are... you have to be absolutely brain dead to go over there.
IMHO Something non-soccer related is going to happen over there during the World Cup that is going to make massive national news and make people question (if they haven't already or who aren't aware how corrupt FIFA is) why Qatar got the World Cup bid.
This is a major cluster fuck in the making... I know the FIFA documentary recently came out on Netflix, but I feel like another documentary on the World Cup in Qatar is already in the making.
https://www.npr.org/2022/11/08/1135102137/sepp-blatter-qatar-world-cup-m...
The documentary would be great because these guys are already starting to throw each other under the bus, and the WC hasn't even started yet.
Until the west stands up to this shit.... like I dunno not facilitating blatant sportswashing and bribing to put the worlds biggest soccer event in a state the size of delaware with no world cup history or stadiums at the time, NOTHING is going to change. Slave labor is going to be used, freedom is going to be non existent, and yes beer is going to be banned- along with homosexuality and women's votes and testimony counting equal. As long as the west says "meh, play ball" this shit will never change. US soccer has plenty to say about GA voting laws, etc but gladly plays in Qatar. such hypocrites.
UEFA had plenty to do with this, for certain.
While I don't disagree, the west has zero hand when it comes to FIFA. And there are there own inherent issues with western football, including Brazil, Argentina, Mexico, and the lot. Sep and the rest of FIFA got PAAAAAAAIIIIIIDDDD for Qatar, and now that it's here, we just have to buckle up for the next month and hope that nothing tragic occurs.
And, fwiw, they did learn a little bit from it. They award the next world Cup to North America, where no new stadiums will need to be constructed. And there is substantial infrastructure, hotels, restaurants, public transit to get people where they need to be without recreating the wheel. At least they go that right.
Have you guys seen these reports about Qatar attempting to (possibly?) bribing 8 Ecuador players to throw the first match?
What a disaster this is.
I fucking hope Ecuador buries Qatar 8-0
I'd be more concerned about Qatar bribing officials, TBH
This is exactly what I am expecting to happen, they blatantly and openly bribed FIFA to get the WC in Qatar, and referees have accepted bribes in the past. I'm fully expecting Qatar's group games to have multiple questionable penalty decisions and cards all going in Qatar's favor.
There are reports of issues in the warm-up games for Qatar, https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/sportsnews/article-11445381/World-Cup-...
Really hoping this is correct that is stemmed from an account that is know for frequent false information. Seems he was driving for clicks and got all that...
To that point, the phrasing is interesting. "Bribed" instead of "attempted to bride" alleges that the money has already changed hands. Also it says it's confirm b 5 members of both squads, but says "hope it's false..." Seems fishy to me...
https://www.insidesport.in/fifa-wc-match-fixing-qatar-vs-ecuador-match-fixed-claims-regional-head-of-british-center-middle-east-studies-says-qatar-official-have-paid-7-4-mn-bribe-to-players-check-out/
Doesn't seem beyond reason that it has or would occur. And makes you wonder what else is going on in other matches...the refs and VAR and all that. I'm hoping for no injuries, nobody dying on the pitch (again), and clean games. And for the USMNT to get some good experience for a run in 2026 in front of the home crowd.
Evidently they paid some fans to attend the WC. Now, they've decided to pull the daily stipend they were going to give them as part of the package. The ones that took the deal are now in Qatar and are stuck paying for food and drink themselves.
Authorities claim they made the decision after receiving negative press over the program itself.
Oooooh boy
"We can't make everywhere instantly perfect so its okay to ignore our ongoing corruption, slave labor and deaths."
He knows what it was like for the migrant
slavesworkers. Afterall, he had red hair in his youthhttps://news.sky.com/story/fifa-chief-gianni-infantino-hits-out-at-qatar...
The full quote reads a little differently, but only in that it comes across as "at least FIFA isnt virtue signalling like everybody else is rn"
An absolutely all-time press conference fail. FIFA PR person must've been locked in his shipping container room this morning.
I just read the ESPN article about his press conference. He actually made some good points sandwiched in between some bad points and some cringy comments. I think if the FIFA president is this combative and defensive on the eve of the World Cup, you know things aren't going well.
Personally, I won't watch one second of the matches since the tournament is in Qatar, but I will follow the results and of course root for the US to do well.
"Not taking pictures of people without their permission."
So...are they just escort every photo journalist out of every match, lol.
Imagine paying billions and killing a bunch of migrants to shine a spotlight on yourselves to the whole world reminding them how awful and repressive you are.
I'm going to watch, I'm going to hate Berhalter with a burning passion as I always have, and I'm going to gamble(responsibly of course). But I feel so detached from this World Cup. Middle of the season, in December, surrounded by controversy, so many key players out. Only FIFA could find a way to royally screw this up. Sepp Blatter can go sit on a bear trap.
Lol fuck Qatar, Ecuador score less than 3 minutes in. I hope they get destroyed every game
Edit: var offsides? Hmmmm. but my sentiment still stands
2nd one counts, Valencia gets his goal!!
Enner Valencia with a brace, 2-0 to Ecuador. Could have been a hat trick if it wasn't for a questionable offside call
Don't think it was questionable, just confusing
I thought Qatar looked half decent when they played in the Gold Cup last summer. They looked awful today. Maybe the pressure was just too much. It's hilarious for the embarrassment of the country, but I do feel a little bad for the players. Especially that keeper, he better watch his back.
Imagine "preparing for this game for 12 years" and then crapping the bed like that. Plus they still have to play Netherlands and Senegal! I don't do much worry about the players as I do the coaching staff.
Man, karma...it'll get after ya
I said questionable because during the broadcast this was the only explanation that was given:
That's absolutely terrible and causes confusion instead of clearly demonstrating why the offside call was made. They should be showing actual video and images from real cameras at the game showing the player being offside, not a computer generated image. Want to make it even better? Let us watch and hear the VAR decision being made. The correct call was made but we shouldn't have to look at social media posts to get the images to prove it.
The reason they use the computer images is because there isn't always a camera angle which clearly shows the offside. In this case I imagine the camera shot would have been more confusing because the keeper was in the way (there were two defenders behind him so he wasn't actually important in terms of offside).
I don't think any major leagues share the VAR audio but in this case I'm not sure there is any because I believe they're using semi-automatic offside for the WC, which they also use in the Champions League. I'm not entirely sure how it works, but I believe the referee just gets buzzed and told it's offside.
You have to hope the broadcast team will get better about showing this images more quickly as the tournament goes on. I think the combination of the confusing situation and that it was the first goal/non-goal of the tournament causes for extra scrutiny.
I still don't understand the actual offsides call.
Because there was a deeper defender. Was it because the keeper is actually setting the line there due to the challenge?
There's a lot going on in that image shown in the tweet from Dale Johnson above. There's a deeper defender to the left and then there are four players challenging for the ball where that red box was added. One is the keeper, another is a Qatar defender and then Torres and Estrada from Ecuador are there. In that challenge for the ball, Torres was the one who played it and at that moment, Estrada's leg was offside as it was ahead of the second to last defender. It's an incredibly tight decision and it would have been really helpful to see other camera angles so that everyone could see that Torres was the one that played the ball.
The second to last defender?
I always thought offsides had to be beyond the last defender prior to the pass being sent their way? Honestly, I don't follow soccer that closely and likely never will, and those kinds of plays don't really endear me to the sport. Or is that always been the way it is, just that the keeper is usually the "last defender"?
I appreciate the explanation, but I still don't really get it (not your description, just why that's the rule)
Correct, the actual law is the second to last player on the defensive team, including the goalkeeper. In 99% of situations, all the defenders are further forward than the keeper, which is why it's often termed "the last defender"
In this particular situation, the keeper was way off his line, making him the third defender from his goal. That alone just makes it confusing because many people like yourself understandably don't know that rule. The Ecuador player, who was onside at the initial kick into the box, headed the ball and when he headed the ball, the Ecuador player (#11 I believe) who happened to touch the ball next was closer to the goal than the second to last defender.
Honestly, I'm not really sure why the rule is the way it is. I'm sure there was some weird play a long time ago that necessitated the rule change but that is indeed the way it's been for as long as I've know it. Still makes more sense than some American football rules ๐คท๐ปโโ๏ธ
Edit: it appears the offside rule originated when adapting the game from rugby. It was basically trial and error going from 4 to 3 to eventually 2 players in 1925. It increased the number of goals scored and made the game more exciting so they left it at 2
Correct, no one is sharing live VAR audio as the current IFAB rules only allow it to be shared after matches conclude. There are other sports that allow the audio from reviews to be broadcast live and/or require an explanation from the referee once a decision has been made. Open communication and transparency would be a huge benefit and improvement to the sport.
No argument here
Qatar killed two 9/11's worth of migrant workers to be 2-0'd by Ecuador and lose the first opener of any host country
On one hand I kinda feel bad for the players. They have to be under an immense amount of pressure. And I wouldn't be surprised if some of them "go missing" after the tournament.
On the other, fuck Qatar's corrupt ass "government". I'm glad Ecuador won convincingly. I'm beyond glad, actually. And I hope Netherlands and Senegal do even more. I'm pretty pissed that Qatar bought the world cup.
And even though there's not really much we can do about the monumental shifts Qatar has funded in professional soccer, at least we can enjoy them getting absolutely crushed by real teams.
"Everyone is welcome! But if you wear an armband that says so, you'll get a card."
In a surprise to no one, FIFA really going out of their way to appease Qatar.
I learned that the armbarnds are up to the team wearing them, which blows my mind. I would have thought that as much as FIFA loves control they would have an armband they provided (Like Champions League and other domestic leagues.) They've kicked jerseys out before and have a 92 page equipment regulation book.
I mean its incredibly fitting that, at the end of the day, FIFA is going to bend over backwards to politically cater toward a human rights disaster of a dictatorship, but the second they hold anything in a Western country, they're all about inclusion and making sure none of the visiting countries feel unwelcome. And I'm not saying that the inclusion is wrong, its just that if you're going to demand that from certain countries, demand it from them all.
But of course, they know what its like to be disabled or Jewish, afterall, the president had red hair as a kid.
Fuck FIFA and Fuck Qatar
yeah, pretty much. Though, and I think you mean this anyway, I'd say Fuck Qatar's government, specifically.
Okay, I know this is a dumb question. And really bad timing with the first US match less than 30 minutes away.
But why does everyone even put up with FIFA? I mean, it's almost universally hated, right? Surely if 6-8 of the most important soccer federations (England, Germany, France, Spain, US, etc.) simply said, "Fuck it, we're starting our own international soccer organization," FIFA would be obsolete, wouldn't it? Seems like it would be like a reverse LIV league.
Anyway, I won't be watching, but go USA! Kill the whales!
The Dutch have already said they will be "critically examining" their relationship with FIFA moving forward.
And if there are two things I hate...those that are intolerant of others...and the Dutch.
Joke aside, I think after this WC we may see a shift
I get that reference .gif
There is and there isn't an alternative. Each continent sort of has it's own federation. And they aren't any better than FIFA. To your point about the big boys, they already do their own thing...called the Euros. And to many, me included, it's a much better tournament than the World Cup. You don't get to see Brazil and Argentina against them in that, but the Euros have been fantastic. If you want an example of breaking off to do your own thing, just check out LIV golf...which is actually just about what this world cup is...
So back to the football...
England look quite impressive in this opening match.
Edit: Not so hot take: England and Wales will finish with the top two spots in the group. Iran will finish 3rd.
Disclaimer: I'd love to be wrong, I hope we advance beyond the group stages. Rooting for the Yanks that's for sure.
Wow, I think that's a pretty hot take! Iran did not look good at all. We'll see if I look stupid this afternoon, but I think the US will be just fine against Wales. England look to be firing on all cylinders (although their defense wasn't great) so I won't expect anything from that match, but I think we should still be favorites to advance.
I think the US is favored over everyone except England.
Wales are an ocean animal and I believe soccer is played on grass.
I think we advance.
Nuke the Whales!
Gotta nuke something.
Iran looked pretty bad. England looked like world beaters, and they are a talented side, but that was mostly because Iran played poorly.
I think the US will beat Iran. I'd be pretty surprised if Iran doesn't finish last in group. Even if the US loses to England, which is likely, they still have a chance to advance. Assuming England beats both the US and Wales, and Iran loses out, that leaves the US and Wales tied and it'll come down to goal differential. Based on what I saw today I think the US has a great shot at advancing on goal differential. Keep it close with England and beat the brakes off Iran and hope England dispatch Wales the way they did Iran.
Yeah but Wales could definitely tie England or Iran could find a way to tie us. It may be somewhat likely to advance with 4 pts but not enough for me to feel remotely confident about it.
Also possible that England and Wales could do the "agreed tie" in their last match to send both through. It's somewhat of a rivalry match but England would definitely rather Wales advance than us
Why? I don't think that's definite at all. I don't think England gives 2 shits who advances between US and Wales. England, should they beat the US, likely would let off the gas vs Wales, rest some players, etc. But I don't think they'd play for a draw just to ensure that Wales gets through instead of the US.
The final group games kick off at the same time to avoid the "gentleman's agreement" kind of matches. Either it's already clinched for both of them by that point, or they run the risk of kicking the ball about playing for a 0-0 and then US go up 2-0 on Iran and they need to kick it into gear
.
https://www.espn.com/soccer/fifa-world-cup/story/4808225/world-cup-chaos...
Literally nothing going right for this World Cup.
Love it! Let's go!!!
LETS GOOOOOOO
Why are we starting China's president?
Was confused for a second but I laughed, lol
We are however, starting the son of Liberia's president
There's no way Gregg made this lineup on his own. It's way too good.
Crowdsourced from Twitter? Or maybe he was playing the long game though the last three years convincing the world he was a fraud. Masterclass incoming
No Moore for Wales. Interesting. May even be a 5-3-2? Seems they will try to get in behind rather than try to win second balls playing off of Moore
No hoofing it up to the big lad strategy
Hoof it up to the quick lad instead
Our kits look terrible. Even worse now that I see them wearing them in warmups
Edit: guess those were just the warmup kits
Wales anthem was nice. That's what it's all about
I guess we know where those Qatar bribes went. Yeesh this reffing has been.... Questionable
The yellows were questionable.
The missed foul on Pulisic and then the obvious missed corner kick right after was troubling. How can you not call the foul and then give the ball to the opposing team after they kicked it out.
Then the "stern" talking to after a non-issue foot tangling...this ref is going to make this game an uphill struggle for us.
Refs in the middle east being questionable toward the US? Shocking
Where is Mepham's yellow? That was a blatant yellow.
Exactly! Wales should have been down to 10 men after that. They sent a man on mission and that ref let him get away with it. Trash world cup.
We need to keep pushing it out wide. We are having so much success there.
WEAH
Goooooooooooaaaaaaaallllllll
There we go!
TIM WEAH !!!!!! Goooooaaaalllll!!!!
That's the Weah do it.
What a goal!!!
The holdup. The movement. The run. LFG.
Really glad we got that goal, this game feels like one of those that we control the whole way and then lose 1-0 somehow.
Wales seemed to be playing for a draw hoping to keep it 0-0 at half. I'll be interested to see how they respond in the 2nd half and force our players to play some defense.
Weah you beautiful man
Does the main broadcast camera look terrible to anyone else? The replay cameras have a good quality image for me but the main camera seems like it is in SD. I didn't have this issue with the games earlier today.
I love Timothy. What a finish
Tim Weah is the first player to score against Wales in a World Cup since Pele. Makes you think
Man, come on Pulisic. Weah is making some insane runs on the wing, smh. Missed two of them in the last 2 minutes.
Bale is good at 2 things, golf, and diving....
Edit: man I got a down vote for that...lol; I'd be curious to see where I violated the guidelines, smh
Definitely not a dive, blatant penalty and a boneheaded move by Zimmerman to give that one away
Best challenge to make through someone's legs? Nope! But there were some theatrics involved there for sure, especially since Zimm's made contact with the ball. But I guess making an opinionated statement about a foul is downvote worthy, shrug. It's just legs...
For the record, I did not downvote and don't think you should've been downvoted. Any pro is gonna make a meal of a tackle like that, especially in the box. And most players are gonna go down when there's a tackle like that. Gotta be smarter than that in the box especially
Oh I wasn't saying you downvoted me. Honestly I could care less who did. Chuckled at it honestly. I don't fault Bale for going down there. That was reckless contact, I made that clear.
On a side note, I think Pulisic had an amazing first half, the second half was not nearly as good. A lot of meat (opportunities) left on the bone.
If it stays this way, this is a better point for Wales than it is for the US. (yet again, just my take)
Agreed, though I thought we were well outplayed in the second half
Absolutely pointless foul
Chokers
It's not a choke we've played poorly the majority of the game
I'm curious how you smart people can possibly watch soccer.
The sport is corrupt. The officiating is garbage.
Seriously, it's a terrible game and a terrible watch
And yet, here you are commenting on the World Cup thread..
Blistering retort. Let's look back on this when the US flames out this round
I'm getting downvoted for saying the US played poorly? Can't imagine why I don't pay for TKP access anymore. The bottle opener still impresses though.
you're getting downvoted for going out of your way to pick a fight and then doubling down on being abrasive
in the span of 65 minutes you went from "what a goal!!!" to effectively implying that smart people shouldn't watch and that the whole sport is awful
i locked the subthread here bc nothing good is going to happen from keeping it open, especially bc with the World Cup ongoing for a month, someone is destined to find this comment in three weeks and start things over again
Yes, the most watched sport in the world. Clearly you have the correct take here.
"The most watched" isn't really a qualification of the sport. Look up the "most watched shows"
The international game is years behind clubs bc there's so little relative training time and you're limited by eligible personnel.
The international game isnt great. But the world cup is a spectacle and it's the biggest stage in the world's most popular sport.
Why do we pass wide and cross every time. Why not put it on net when there's spacing. Definitely not showing the urgency to take every chance we can
Jon Brooks doesn't go in for an idiotic tackle like that. And now when we need a goal most, we are bringing on....Jordan Morris. The hatred I have for Berhalter is unmatched.
John Brooks has also barely played in the past six months. You'd have an argument a year ago, but not right now.
Dang some dirty time wasting by the Welsh. We aren't helping with the total lack of urgency
Need to work on our play in the final third. The only shot on goal we had was the Tim Weah goal, gotta be better than that. Ref wasn't very consistent with calls and cards throughout. Keeping things close (or a win obviously) vs England and a big win vs Iran seem necessary
Thought they tried way too many crosses. I get it at the end of the game, just get it in there and hope to get lucky. But they did it a lot earlier as well and I don't think that's a recipe for success for us against any of the teams in this group.
Yeah definitely thought there were too many crosses and don't think more than a couple of them led to chances. Need to work it into the box more.
Exactly, you will not see Germany France or any of the top seeds try that many crosses, especially when the spacing was there for a chance directly on net
FYI France attempted 27 crosses in their opening match ๐คท๐ปโโ๏ธ
They also had more possession than us.
And more goals.
And more success on the crosses.
That's not their identity, but when it's working you keep doing it...
Here's a link explaining France's tactics. Notice it show early crosses. While a cross is a cross, the position on the field matters. France attempts to get it off before reaching the 18 with more of an angle. The US goes deeper and is looking to cross when they are even with the 6. (I looked for the US one but we don't rank high enough to have anything on that site...)
https://www.passion4fm.com/world-cup-2022-tactical-preview-deschamps-france-tactics/
It was no doubt more effective, but "top teams don't cross the ball that much" Is simply untrue. That's all I was saying
And my point above is not all crosses are equal.
Yeah, technically it's a cross from France. I mean it has to be labeled something.
But there's also the point of if it's working you keep doing it. That's more the situation for this game.
Check their game history and the number of crosses they had previously. They weren't this high.
Completely agree on our final third play, it was awful. Need to be more creative, need to try playing through the middle more, and if we are going to resort to crossing all game, we need to do a better job of crossing early before the defense gets set up.
What a wasted opportunity, ๐คฆโโ๏ธ
Really lost control of the game when Moore came on. Lucky they didn't start him for...reasons.
Their ref was legit terrible but there was really no question about the penalty. Zimmerman is a good defender but I'm sure he'd like to have that one back.
I think the boys were a bit nervous. It looked like they were overly concerned of the threat of the counter attack and afraid to try anything that might lose the ball. Unfortunately, this result puts us in a bit of a tough spot. Assuming we don't beat England (I'd love nothing more, but I think a draw is the best we can realistically hope for at this point), we'll go into the last day really needing to beat Iran. I think we can but that's never a situation you want to be in.
Luckily, they English are even more full of themselves than usual and Berhalter strategically left Gio Reyna on the bench for this match, so there's a good chance they don't know he exists. England will have no idea what's coming. 4D chess, people
Moore made their attack so much better. We were fortunate he didn't start, but we also should have put this one away. Absolutely boneheaded mistake on the pen. He had his back to goal and was not an immediate threat and he barreled through him.
Overall, I think the US played well. The second half was subpar. A lot of people are saying there were far too many crosses from wide positions; however, Wales was sitting pretty deep for most of the game and waiting for the counterattack. We need to have more Pulisic runs where he attacks the CB's and looks for a winger to run out wide and across. There were two clear cut chances for that in the 2nd half that would've put serious pressure on them. The best way to break down a low-block team is to move the ball quickly and engage in penetrating runs from the front 3. It'll be tough to get out of the group after this result. England is a must win.
And wide crosses are Pulisic's thing. We just don't have anyone to connect on the other end right now. The goal we scored was thru the middle. Maybe they can sit, reflect, and learn something from that. Doubtful because Gregg is Gregg...but we had some opportunities up top and still pushed it wide.
We owned the first half. Then he started subbing around the 65th minute. That's a concession and taking your foot off the pedal. We needed to keep it up with that starting 11 (minus injuries) until 75 or 80. We lost the chemistry, and Wales stepped up. Yes, that's a stupid foul, but there was chaos on the pitch with all the changes.
The US played better than a 1-1 tie, in general. But when you go 90 minutes and the Wales keeper hasn't made a save, proves that there's not enough pressure in the final 3rd to really dominate. (See England.)
The penetration was through the middle, but Weah ran from a wide position across the backline into a channel. I can think of one opportunity in the 2nd half that this happen, and Weah would've been clean in on the keeper with at best a CB coming in late in recovery.
Agreed. Just saying that Pulisic plays wide normally, and Gregg pushes him to do that. Same with Dest. It doesn't translate for us. The one time we were successful was thru the middle...
Berhalter is totally megh. I've seen enough.
Yeah also not really sure what was with the slow jogging/walking by players with an around the ball when we had possession. The urgency didn't really show until the 30' mark and then completely disappeared after the first goal until the equalizer
Yeah so the opposite of passing it wide for the cross lol. Needed a lot more runs through the middle (we had spacing). Then through balls to crashing defenders. We could've won this game at least 2-0 imo
If you notice there are really only two teams that go towards the corners and look to cross more than they do cut towards the middle. The US and England. Many other teams play around the arc at the top of the box. Gregg loves this tactic and continues to push it.
We got outshot today! Crazy stat, but Wales had more shots than we did. That's silly considering the possession in the first half was 66% us, 34% them.
In order to control destiny, yes. But the US still has a reasonable shot at advancing even with a loss to England. A draw would be good. Winning is best, obviously, but I don't think it's a must win
Mepham should have been DQ'd for two yellow's. Berhalter shouldn't be such a pussy in the second half. Gotta beat England out right!
We head into the England game with 6? guys with 100 minutes on their legs including knocks. Also, reports are that Reyna didn't come in due to an injury and Mckennie & Dest aren't yet ready for a full 90. At this point I'm hoping for a tie on Friday and a victory over Iran, as well as England netting three or so on Wales.
Re: Wales wasting time - yes it is annoying. Literally every soccer team in the entire world does it when they are trying not to concede a goal late in the game. The only way it will stop is if referees actually add the time on to the end, especially when the injuries occur in stoppage time, but they never do. Teams do it because it works, and when it stops working they won't do it anymore.
I'm not trying to tell anyone how to be a fan - the World Cup is a great place for people who don't normally watch soccer to become fans. Just know that if the roles were reversed, the US would do the same thing and it would work in our favor. It's unfortunately not like football or basketball where the clock just stops for an injury and/or theres a penalty for delay of game. I can assure you that if it benefitted teams in other sports they way it does in soccer, they would all be doing the same thing.
The three games today had pretty extensive stoppage time, so it feels like a point of emphasis to improve that. 14 minutes for the first half in England-Iran. 8 for the second half of ours. Think the Senegal game had like 10 in the second half. Possibly a result of France time wasting their way to the trophy in 2018?
I just read that FIFA actually keeps track of all stoppages in play and adds the correct time on at the end. Not sure if that's a new thing or what, because I don't recall ever seeing this much stoppage time. In any case, this might be the only good thing that FIFA has ever actually done in their history.
However, additional stoppages from during stoppage time, which is when the majority of time wasting happens, are still up to the head referee to add on. And they just aren't very good at doing that, historically.
There was a proposal on the table before to make the games 100 minutes to account for time wasting and the potential water breaks.
The 14 minutes in the England game were for mostly the issue with the Iran keeper. He was down for a bit, then had to change his whole kit, get his gloves back on, then be subbed off.
First half was so, so encouraging. Bossed the game, looked well prepared. Wish we got more shots of course, 1-0 at half is awesome. Second half was classic USMNT. Lost all control. Zimmerman, what the actual heck man. You just can't do that. Gutted...honestly it feels like we lost
I remembered why I haven't opened a football game thread on here on several years...lol
It's one game and we've got two more. There are opportunities to adjust. Players have got the jitters out now. If we can surprise England with a draw that wood be great. If Wales and Iran draw, that's even better. Not an ideal result, but the sky isn't falling yet.
Never trust a person who's first name is also a common last name (looking at you, Walker).
/s
Poor challenge, not sure what he was thinking. On to the next!
Such a phenomenal first half but when you're up like that you have to capitalize. Shocking tackle from Zimmerman who till then had played well. Not ideal but still two games to go and atleast we have some guys like Reyna and Aaronson to call on. Weah continues to be a beast love his play.
Weah's runs were incredible today. I worry a little about the yellow's we picked up today. We have to approach Friday's game very cautiously. 2 yellows in the group stage are an automatic suspension.
Yeah that ref was going crazy with the yellows. That rule is so frustrating especially when you have a card-happy ref like today.
I would sub in Reyna or Aaronson for McKennie (def Reyna if he's healthy). Dest got a yellow and didn't look like himself at all - might not be fully fit. I don't want to see Yedlin though, so idk. Someone is going to get suspended for Iran, just gotta hope it's not an important player.
Weah the GOAT
Coulda been better coulda been worse
Deep
Yeah๐
Tough result, we really needed 3 points today.
Everyone seems to think Iran is a guaranteed 3, but I'm not so sure about that.
Nowhere near guaranteed, but after seeing our first half performance (need better final balls, but got into dangerous areas) and how poor Iran were, I think it's fair to say we should be able to win that game especially since it will be a must win.
Bill Connelly runs the numbers which indicate exactly what several of us were saying about the game. The pass to shot rate and 30 crosses at 13% converting are disgusting stats. This has to change next game, and is at least over 50% on the managers
I mean yes, some of it is on the manager, of course. But also, all of the crosses were terrible! Set pieces were all terrible. We had a number of good opportunities in transition in the second half but made bad decisions. I'm not sure why there was an emphasis on crosses - could have been in the game plan or maybe not. But we had them opened up in the second half and did not take advantage. I'm not saying he did nothing wrong, but at a certain point, there's not much more the manager can do and it's up to the players to execute.
To me, the tactics were pretty good. We dominated the first half and got into good areas, just couldn't produce good final balls to create chances. This is largely on the players, as much as I love them. We set up to kill them in transition in the second half, which is the correct call. Didn't execute. The big things Berhalter did wrong IMO were waiting too long to make subs and seemingly not adjusting when Moore was brought on. And not bringing on Reyna, although it's not clear if he's 100% fit, despite what the player may say.
Sorry that's long winded, but I'm curious to know why you think that's >50% on the manager? Low pass to shot rate? They need to make better passes in the final third. I really don't know what to think about the crosses and there's really no way to know whether that was a planned tactic or just player decisions.
When the other squad flips the table on us in the second half, that usually leads to the belief that the other team's tactical adjustments were superior.
This is where I still can't understand the exclusion of Pefok. We just needed someone that finds the back of the net and we brought on Jordan Morris!?
I agree and already said that was one thing Berhalter didn't do well - he didn't adjust. But the Wales manager said they bought Moore on because the US was showing a different press that they hadn't seen before. That's tactics as well, it goes both ways.
Pefok hasn't scored a goal since 9/18. Why are we still doing this? He's a fine player who was in very good form and now is in regular form. He is not some game-breaking player who is going to magically create chances out of nothing. We didn't create chances in the second half, Pefok would not have changed that.
Union Berlin plays a very direct style of game, lots of over the top balls and then pushing play in/through the wider channels. More direct than most Bundesliga teams I have seen. They overload the midfield, which is where our strength (arguably) is, and use those players to support the attack out wide. Seems like a perfect fit for what Berhalter is trying to do, especially when time is running short and you need a goal. At the very least, it gives you another tactical option that isn't a complete 180 from the base formation and style.
If we only go off of current form being the litmus test, we probably wouldn't even be able to field a team.
It's 10000% on Gregg. This is his style. This is what he pushes. This is why Dest is playing back right wing. This is why we are spread more than compact in the middle. This is what he wants. And while it's said the crosses are terrible...well...either you have to change it because it's not working (100 on Gregg) or put different players in there that can cross the ball (still 100 on Gregg.) He installs a system that most of these guys don't play in normally and expects it to click and work. When it doesn't we end up with games like this one and the stats to show it.
If Berhalter plays the same formation against England, our midfield will be in tatters by halftime. With the pace England brings to the pitch and Kane linking up so well as a holding 9, they need more bodies in the middle.
Probably Adams and McKennie in the middle to break up the play, but I'm not sure you can get a full 90 out of them. Having the luxury of bringing on Foden and Grealish after 60+ minutes is ridiculous. I'm not sure who we have that can match them defensively off the bench.
You have said this many times and maybe you're right. I don't think he's ever said that he wants a lot of crosses publicly. So again, maybe. But it's also possible that crosses is what we're left with when we have a lot of aimless possession because no one makes penetrating passes into the middle.
Follow some of the ex players on Insta or Twitter, as well as some of the insiders. You will see that Gregg pushes a system that these guys don't play regularly (outside Dest.) Yeah...I'm beating a dead horse there, but he's made 10 other guys play to how he plays. That's silly. I was happy to see that he put Pulisic outside yesterday and not directly up top, but even then you could see his influence trying to get him deep in the corner. The goal shows where he's dangerous and very few times he got the ball within the middle third of the pitch vertically. It's not a maybe. What you saw yesterday was Gregg Gregg Gregg. 10000%. And the people not being in the middle...well...the opponents KNOW what the tactic is. They fill the box to defend the cross. We don't have a 6'4" attacker to elevate over everyone for headers. And that's been my issue with Sargent and Aaronson...they run...a LOT...but aren't always in a consistent position for the cross. One guy in the corner just tossing it in somewhere. One guy in the middle, somewhere. Maybe it gets close, maybe it goes out of bounds on the other side. It's all a crap shoot. He plays on up top and expects that guy to be a chicken with his head cut off with laser focus. Doesn't happen...can't have it both ways Gregg. That's why I laugh at the "pods" of attackers he was chosing from. JUST PICK THE GUY THAT CAN EFFING SCORE!!!!!!!!!
He's not going to tell the public his tactics, but if you know him, the game, watch all these guys in different leagues, have coached in the past, you can tell his style. It doesn't hide.
Legitimately curious - what is your fascination with Dest? I don't think his strengths are what you're saying at all. His strengths are technical ability and combination play. He's not really a very good crosser at all. So he's certainly not the one player the system is built for if it is as predicated on crosses as you say. I've already said I don't think he played very well but I don't understand the fixation.
Maybe I'm naive, but I just don't believe Berhalter is stupid. I don't agree with some of his tactics, but you don't get to where he is by being completely incompetent. If he has really built a system predicated on crosses, there is no reason why Jesus Ferreira would have been the starting 9 for the majority of qualifying and no reason why Pefok would be left off the roster. Those things don't equate for me.
One more thing - there's never going to be a system that all of your players are comfortable in unless they all play on the same club team. That's why most international teams have very basic tactics. You could argue, and I would agree, that the system he has chosen isn't the best for maximizing our player pool. But tactical familiarity in international soccer takes multiple cycles and that's one thing the US doesn't have right now no matter who the manager is.
RE Dest...I don't hate him personally. I hate that position/style/wingback. Gregg loves it. Some guys can play there, and have a conscience. Meaning, they know when to push and when to get back. My issue with Dest (and Yedlin) is they always look to go forward. And they sometimes get back. That leaves the 2 central defenders on an island having to cover extra space. Which is not how those guys typically play. We have 2 big guys in the back that are used to playing central defender. When Dest takes off, they have to cover, and that's when mistakes are made. They play all the other games, including practice, with a different system. And Gregg leaves them hanging out to dry. If you have a guy in the spot that Dest is in, he needs to be a guy that CAN cross the ball and makes goals occur. He doesn't. He just runs up and down the right side, not playing defense and not creating scoring opportunities. Just play back and let the right mid do what Gregg wants him to do. If you watch, there are many times he's up the right side up top and the right mid is actually outside of him when the ball goes across. That means Dest isn't back to play D, and the mid is out of the play as well. Fast break city. Gregg pushes this. On top of that, he's not a great defender. He plays matador escorting the other guy for some yards before engaging. That's one thing about Moore is he will defend anywhere on the pitch. Too many times Dest (and Yedlin) escort guys for a bit while they are gaining positive field position which allows their team to push forward and have a better scoring opportunity. Make them turn it over in the middle third and this doesn't occur.
Berhalter isn't stupid. Neither was Jurgen. But their ego gets in the way. Yes, coaching "down" to a basic style isn't top tier futbol. But you know what, we didn't play the last WC nor the last 2 Olympics. These guys are the ones (well, quite a bit of them) that should have qualified for the Olympics last time. he just keeps pushing for a system that some colleges utilize, but not all over Europe...which is where the majority of our team plays now. These are professionals that have honed their craft and he tweaks it ever so slightly that it doesn't mesh perfectly. He has an idea n mind, and when the guys don't absolutely fit his system, they are left off. That's why there's some head scratchers on the roster.
While there might not be a single system, there is a process we could go through to get to an identity. Tab Ramos is working on that with the youth team for the US. If you notice Spain, or Germany, or Brazil, you can take any player that plays holding mid, or CAM, or Right back and put them in the squad and very little is lost. They have an identity from youth thru senior club. They play a similar style all the way thru that's consistent, so you don't upset their playability when changing jerseys for the national club. We don't have that because you have dad's coaching youth soccer, guys from England coaching youth soccer, guys that played college in the 90's coaching youth soccer and everyone has a different thought process on just win baby. There isn't a ton of skill enhancement or team building. It's get the ball to Jimmy because Jimmy can score, and if that means a long ball out of the back so be it. No possession is first and foremost, just attack on the counter like basketball. You can watch almost any ae from U16 to senior club for Spain, and the guys in the same positions will play in the same manner. Yeah, some will be better than others, and do little things better, but the progression of passing, positioning, movement will be similar. Jurgen never pushed for that so we just gathered up guys from other countries that could be considered US citizens and slapped a jersey on their back and went forward. Now, we are where we are. Gregg is a placeholder. Not quite a Fuente, but not far from it. The good news is that Tab is getting the youth program together and getting an identity in the younger ranks. this is where 2026 could either be fantastic or a complete disaster...we'll have a ton of young guys that in a U25 tournament like the Olympics could win it, but not make it out of group stage in the WC because Gregg has his pet guys and refuses to pick the best players. We can win a local tournament like the Gold Cup with Gregg at the helm, but he's not going to push us forward to a world stage.
By the way, I enjoy having these discussions with you since you seem like you know what you're talking about. Hope I'm not coming off as standoffish.
I get what you're saying re: Dest. However....
Ignoring the unrelated glaring issue with this picture (somebody should try checking to the ball in the middle of the pitch), you can see that Dest actually was playing like a 3rd CB for at least the first half (this is through 49'). This is not normally what he does, but he wasn't doing at all what you describe in this match.
When Dest is playing well (he did not yesterday), he provides a unique asset to the team. A technically secure outlet who can resist pressure and progress the ball up the wing via either dribbling or combination passing. He can tuck into central midfield and be secure on the ball as an option and allow interchange between the RB, RCM and RW. He is not a very good defender and he is not a very good crosser. I would argue his lack of defense was not really that important in this kind of game as Wales offered nothing in the way of attacking threat until the 2nd half, and even then it wasn't based on 1v1 in wide areas.
You and I seem to fundamentally disagree with what Berhalter's attacking tactics are, but if you are correct about a cross-heavy approach being Plan A then Dest is not the correct choice for RB. Shaq Moore or Joe Scally would be much better options. If Dest continues to play like he did yesterday, they will be better options regardless.
All good my man. And I am speaking more to the General Dest versus yesterday Dest. It did seem that Gregg reeled him back in a bit yesterday. But that's what having McKinnie and Weah on the same side give us...better crossers without having to have Dest go forward. We just haven't seen it much because there's been a different line up every match played under GB.
This is pretty much my issue with him. And no matter how he plays, Gregg loves him. He speaks highly of him in interviews and continues to play him. That's my bone to pick with it all.
He seems like a player who needs confidence, especially at the moment having been frozen out at Barca and now struggling for minutes at Milan. Like Pulisic, he needs to stop trying to do too much and just play within the team and I think he could be a real terror (for the opposition).
looks like the horseshoe of sadness we arsenal fans suffered through a few years ago
I do think we ran out of gas and the subs should've been earlier. But yes mainly the lack of shots given the amount of possessions in their half. That seems to be part of the overall strategy and not just individual decisions by the players no?
We had 1 shot on target the whole match and it was the goal. There was literally a 0% chance for us to score another goal. And there were plenty of opportunities in the second half to put it directly on net, even though not all of them would be quality chances. I just don't see Germany, France, Brazil, Belgium and teams of that caliber passing up those chances. And all their players play in the same European leagues that ours do. So only makes sense to me to blame the manager
I mean, if they have a bunch of possession but don't make good decisions in the final third, I don't understand how that's not on the players? They had the ball with numbers in wide areas multiple times. Make quick combination passes and make runs toward the endline, cut back into the box. The players didn't do that. I just can't believe Berhalter told them "Yeah, just pass it around in a horseshoe for 45 mins"
Sargent had a nice header in the 10' that hit the post and Weah nearly forced an own goal with a spectacular control and dangerous cross. Not much, but we're not in a position to ignore actual chances that we did have.
from the eye test I saw a team (the US) that could get into dangerous areas and create chances for themselves but nobody could finish. The team lacks finishers. That might be their downfall. England's defense is very suspect, though, so if the US can convert one of those early and put the pressure on England they have a chance. I think the US's defense is going to be better than Iran's was. But England has a lot of talent so it's a tall task. To me, the biggest difference between the US and England right now is that England has quality finishers who can capitalize on chances created.
What I saw and I think these numbers show, is they didn't try to finish or create chances the conventional way. The were committed to crossing it in to 2-3 guys outnumbered by 5-6 Welsh defenders. Out of 30 crosses we only got a head or foot on 4 of them, 4!! (None of which were on goal). That means 26 were broken up by Wales or just sailed harmlessly over all the attackers (which I saw at least a few times). That is a complete waste of 30 attacking possessions.
Also 0 shots on target outside the goal = a 0% of scoring more than 1 goal it's that simple. They deserve a lot of criticism for this game
Well, at least we aren't Argentina.
Down goes Argentina. Wow.
Saudis to the Arab soccer world: "Hold my (nonalcoholic) beer"
Saudis to the Arab soccer world: "Hold my (nonalcoholic) beer"
Saudis to the Arab soccer world: "Hold my
(nonalcoholic)root beer"Outside of Argentina falling, today's games have been a bore.
Mexico Poland was exciting, even if it ended scoreless
Man, France's starting XI....yeesh!
They might break that World Cup winner group stage curse frfr
Edit: and then the Roos go and do that, damn I love this sport
Yeah... I got a feeling they won't be continuing that curse. Their biggest issues are deciding which guys to leave at home and which combination of elite talent makes the best XI.
It would be cooler if any of them were actually french, but hey.
They have two guys were were born abroad, and moved the France when they were two, and one who was born in Italy to a French soccer player, so they're all pretty French.
Hugo Lloris: born in Nice, France
Steve Mandanda, born in Zaire, moved to Evreux at 2
Alphonse Areola, born in Paris, France
Benjamin Pavard, born in Maubeuge, France
Axel Disasi, born in Gonesse, France
Raphael Varane, born in Lille, France
Joules Kounde, born in Paris, France
William Saliba, born in Bondy, France
Lucas Hernandez, born in Marseille, France
Theo Hernandez, born in Marseille, France
Dayot Upamecano, born in Evreux, France
Ibrahima Konate, born in Paris, France
Matteo Guendouzi, born in Poissy, France
Aurelien Tchouameni, born in Rouen, France
Youssouf Fofana, born in Paris, France
Adrien Rabiot, born in Saint-Maurice, France
Jordan Veretout, born in Ancenis, France
Eduardo Camavinga, born in an Angolan refugee camp, moved to Fougeres when he was 2
Antoine Griezmann, born in Macon, France
Olivier Giroud, born in Chambery, France
Kylian Mbappe, born in Paris, France
Ousmane Dembele, born in Vernon, France
Randal Kolo Muani, born in Bondy, France
Kingsley Coman, born in Paris, France
Marcus Thuram, born in Parma Italy to his French international footballer Lilian Thuram who was playing professionally for Parma at the time
Also notably missing through injury: Pogba (Lagny-sur-marne), Kante (Paris), Benzema (Lyon), Kimpembe (Beaumont-sur-oise)
Did you mean it would be cooler if any of the Australians were French? Even by your standards, this is blatantly ignorant at best
France looks very good. I think they will have a deep run but forgive me for hoping they don't win it all again
And another 0-0 result.
Germany Japan just now was so fun. What a win for the Japanese. Keeper played out of his mind and what a finish for their second goal.
At least one of Spain and Germany is not making it out of that group
Spain is making sure that if it comes down to goal differential, they're fine...
Germany is not making it out of this group
Not the best start to the tournament for Germany. Japan is really good, and I saw it as a potential banana peel with the inconsistency of attacking options up front for Germany. They're back line looked penetrable as well with the semi-high-line that Germany employs. Japan has a ton of speed up front, so it was only a matter of time until they got behind the back line. Group E is going to be tough, Die Mannschaft has their work cut out for them.
Well I'm a German Hokie, a lot of parallels to be drawn between our season and this match.....I'm going into sports hibernation.
Sweet dreams
Was looking like it was going to end up in a tie Mannschaft
but then it quickly turned into a crie Mannschaft
Spain is just totally dominating. They look real good.
Obviously I'm hoping England win it all, but if it's not them, I'd prefer Spain or Brazil over France. I think Spain v France would be a really interesting match. And if they both win their groups there is a fairly good chance they both make it to the Final
Spain-Germany on Saturday is going to be a very intense match. That is a must-win for Germany. If they lose that they probably don't get out of the group. A draw means they'll likely have to rely on GD and hope that Costa Rica draws Japan (which, after CR's performance looks pretty unlikely). I think Spain will top the group on 7 or 9 points and Japan will go through on 6 or 7. Germany might get 4 but most probably 3. CR will go 0s, I think.
Man I know they lost (what a brutal loss it was) but I'm so jealous of Canada. Extremely fun to watch. I don't think Berhalter is a terrible manager but Herdman is great. What I wouldn't give to have him on our side...
Yeah that was a lot of fun to watch for sure. Feel bad for Canada. Missing the penalty and then the controversy over not getting another when they probably should have. Tough way to lose. But I think Canada has a great shot at advancing anyway. I didn't get to watch the Croatia Morroco match but I'm guessing, just with how much trouble they gave Belgium, that Canada can get at least a win and a draw, if not two wins to finish group stage
Croatia and Morocco was pretty boring. Two teams looking like they were trying not to lose. Morocco looked a little better than I thought they would. But Croatia is old like Belgium. I think Canada will get at least 4 points but I'm not sure that will be enough. Canada looks the best in the group but the element of surprise is gone now.
I agree, Canada looked really good despite the loss just didn't convert their chances. Missing a Pen is tough too
They won the qualifying for a reason. Ahead of us and Mexico. They could pull out the next 2 games to go thru...
Okay maybe not lol
It all started so well! I feel like that match was more about Croatia being next level than Canada being bad. Bit unfair to them that they're eliminated already after those two showings. Davies is just an absolute terror.
In some ways. But also, just set up poorly. Croatia has quite possibly the best midfield in international soccer and Canada left 39-year old Atiba Hutchinson playing on 4 days rest to play defensive midfield by himself. And only Eustaquio as the other midfielder. They were outnumbered from the get go. And they could've easily changed after scoring early but they just got overrun and Croatia are so good. Big tactical fail from Herdman - way too aggressive.
Ronaldo goes to ground very easily, referee gives the penalty, Portugal 1-0.
AND THE GHANIANS EQUALIZE!!!!!!
Edit:
Some late drama in that game, Diego Costa almost cost the Portuguese 3 points single handedly.
Meh. It wasn't a hard foul, but it was a foul. Ronaldo got there first with a clean touch and the defender played through his body and took him out. Probably a fair way to call it given the one they called off in the first half on foul on Ronaldo in the buildup.
That Diogo Costa mistake was dangerously close to being an all-time WC blunder. Wild second half overall.
There was just barely enough contact to make the call. The way Portugal had been comically diving all game a play on would've been more than justified. Good game though
Good morning to any fellow sickos waking up for the 5 AM kickoff between Wales and Iran. Looks like Wales are unchanged from their lineup against the US with the exception of Kieffer Moore coming in for Dan James up top. Huge match for Group B in general. I think the best result for the US is a draw. That leaves Iran with only 1 pt and needing a win going into the final match day which would open them up and make it much easier to score on them. It would leave Wales with 2 points, meaning they would need to win over England to secure advancement. In that scenario, even with a loss to England, a win over Iran likely gets us through. And if England defeat Wales, a draw might even get us through depending on goals.
There are no scenarios which knock us out, but a Wales win coupled with a US loss would be not great. This would mean Wales would only need a draw against England to go through and even if they lost it would come down to tiebreakers for us to get through with a win over Iran.
Let's go...
... Draw!
I can't root for Iran over Wales. Just can't do it.
Warning shot for Wales as an Iran goal ruled out for offside after a horrendous turnover from Conor Roberts. Iran have looked stronger here with a front two of Azmoun and Taremi. A golden chance for Moore also missed with a kick to his face for his troubles.
0-0 at halftime. Iran looking the more dangerous of the two sides. I don't think Wales can hold them off the whole match without making some kind of change.
Iran win better for the US if we're confident we can win that game. Looking the more likely at this point but Wales have had one or two good chances.
Two shots off the post in quick succession for the Iranians plus a point blank save from Hennessy. Goal is coming
Hennessey sent off with 5 minutes of normal time remaining. Came way off his line to clear the ball outside the box and cleaned out the attacker. Wales trying to hold on for the draw now. Danny Ward in goal now.
Wow, Iran score the winner at the death. Crazy match. Heartbreaking for Wales who will have a difficult way through now. Jahanbaksh for Iran will miss the last match after picking up a yellow in the first two matches. Obviously Hennessey out for Wales as well.
Iran score again making the final score 2-0. Could come into play since they were deep in the hole on GD. Now just -2
Iran played better all day. Wales was outmatched. Particularly when Wales was limited to 10 players.
Defending with 10 guys for the last 10 minutes was a pretty big ask. Now Iran wins with two.
Wales couldn't overcome the red card.
I mean it's not that much time to defend a man down. They just were outplayed all day, regardless of the red card like you said. Certainly didn't help but I don't think it was the deciding factor. They were 60 seconds away from holding.
Iran was playing very aggressively, and it was working.
Will add that we should not play anyone who's on a yellow. Can't afford to have anyone miss the Iran match. We have a chance vs England but the odds are much better if we concentrate on beating Iran.
What I saw is Scally might be in for Dest. I'm fine w McKinnie getting a number today...he's not a card machine. And he's one of the top guys. Zimmerman, well that was a stupid yellow but I still keep him in the lineup today. Get the result today. Don't wait for tomorrow.
I think they should obviously try for the win. But don't let key guys run themselves into the ground. Push for the win late if we're tied. Just don't get any yellows.
Wright starting indicates we're planning to hit them on the counter. Good
This is indeed the starting 11. Don't love starting Dest and McKennie but ๐คท๐ปโโ๏ธ
I
I BELIEVE
I BELIEVE THAT
I Believe that we need a win!
LET'S GO!
Great first half. Love our energy! Just need a better second half than we had on Monday. ๐บ๐ธโฝ๏ธ
Don't play the ball in the box on the final play of game????? Wtf
Really encouraging result to keep a clean sheet and honestly look the better of the teams. Really need Reyna in the iran game and maybe Aaronson we have to get goals against iran. Really can't state how impressed I was in the US midfield tonight.
WTF was that at the end? It was a literal free play. The game was gonna be over. Launch that shit in the box and bulldoze over anybody to knock it in.
Other than that, I ain't mad. Played better than you hoped for going in. Would have been nice to get some better player movement on some of the crosses Pulisic put in to knock at least one in, but if you would have told me a month ago we'd draw vs England, I'd be happy.
Honestly, we kicked their butts up and down the pitch today. Not sure what happened on Monday, but they didn't look like the same team at all.
We were by far the better team and I know that results are what's important and no one wants to hear this after a scoreless draw, but that was the best match I've seen the USA play (considering the quality of the opponent) possibly ever.
If we can just get to the knockouts I think we can win one. This team is good.
(Sigh)...laugh...leg
Brilliant. I'm happy to have given you leg 25.
First impression...we dominated the three lions overall. They had some good opportunities, but so did the US. Will take the point and hope w throw everything at Iran on Tuesday, scoring early and often.
So this makes it very simple. Win and we're through.
Unfortunately, Wales will need to make up a 6-goal differential and a 5-goal scored margin to eliminate England and for the US to win. But we can cheer for that now because that result doesn't affect our fate!
To top the group, we need an England loss/draw and to make up the same goal margins as Wales. Since England scored 6 goals, it's much more likely that we need to better their GD. A 1 goal Wales win and a 4-goal US win (or 2-goal Wales win and 3-goal US wins and so on). But we just need to win, so let's do that. Iran looked much better today, not going to be an easy match.
Just more evidence that the draw against Wales hurts. We'll see if we have the quality to take care of business against Iran. Put up or shut up
A view from the other side from during the match. Just one man's opinion of course, but it is interesting to see how impressed the English were with the team/Berhalter. Check out his timeline for more thoughts about players etc.
Berhalter's attacking tactics are his weakest point I think, but defensively and press wise he has turned this team into an elite unit. Don't think he gets enough credit for for those aspects.
I appreciate the link/quote, really interesting. I've always felt like Gregg was under appreciated a bit and suffered (suffers!) from not having a real CF goal scorer, albeit that's a luxury few have. I'm fascinated to see what US soccer does with him, win or lose/draw on Tuesday.
I mean, I'm not sure there was ever really any question in US Soccer's mind, but he is 100% coming back. I would really like to have Jesse Marsch or Jim Curtain but the only way he was realistically getting let go was an absolute stinker of a World Cup. They've played well so even if they don't make it out I doubt they can him.
People should also remember that the quality of international managers is lower than club soccer. Club jobs are generally more desirable since you get to pick your players and work with them every day. The top international managers are generally coaching their own country because that's what they want/national pride.
I didn't want to respond to this early and jinx anything, but yeah, Gregggg seems pretty safe after today
The US played well. They looked like the better team today. Ultimately this is a good result for England and an okay result for the US. England is almost certainly through. With 4 points and a +4 GD it would take a lot for two teams to jump them.
US wins against Iran and they advance. England might even be okay with taking second place so they don't have to play France.
A US win and England win sends both through with England topping the group.
A US win and England draw would send the US and England through with England likely topping the group on GD.
A US win and England loss puts England and the US through (unless England loses to Wales by more than 3) with US topping the group and England advancing in second ahead of Wales on GD.
A US draw sends England through regardless and either Iran or Wales depending on the Wales England result. Iran, with a draw, wouldn't improve their GD so they'd be behind England. If Wales wins England and Wales would advance and GD would determine the order.
If the US loses then Iran gets through on 6 points. England would hold the tie breaker over Wales, should Wales win, unless Wales wins by more than 3 goals to win the GD (extremely unlikely, IMO).
Iran is a must win for the US (i figured as much) . But the good news is that they control their destiny. Win, and they're in. No help required. I think England and the US will both advance out of this group. The US needs to do better finishing in front of goal, but they're creating chances. The dam has to break at some point. Here's hoping it's against Iran.
Edit: messed up the math(s)
Wales sits at (-2) for GD
England sits at (+4)
If Wales wins by 3, they are tied for GD at (+1). This, Wales wins tie breakers with a 4 goal win, not a 6.
Ah, yes the classic "I forgot that losing negatively impacts GD" problem. Oops. I'll fix it. I still think it's very unlikely Wales wins by 4
We looked good for much of the match, butI really take issue with the last 10 minutes. You have to know that a loss and a draw are the same thing in this scenario, it mathematically makes zero difference unless Wales were to beat England by multiple goals, which is not happening. We should've pushed hard for the win during the final third and had everyone up including Turner during the final 5-10 min + extra time. Can't criticize too much because we played well, but running probabilities you're in much better shape at 0-0 in with possession in the 80th (in a match you've mostly dominated) than you are expecting to win any given match even against Iran. Any given team can park the bus for 90 min and get a draw when they need it especially a team like Iran who plays that style, against a team like us who rely on low percentage chances to score
Take care of business against Iran. This team showed a lot today, but we need that result.
Just win, baby!
L Tri in the mud again. They're gonna leave Tata in Qatar
Insert all of your gifs from the Ronaldo comments in the EPL thread heh heh. They just don't have any answers it seems.
Dos a cero!!
Belgium and Canada down Damb
Germany keeps their hopes alive with an 83rd minute equalizer to draw Spain. Now they need to beat Costa Rica and have Spain beat Japan to get out of group stage.
Fun wrinkle: Spain can throw their game against Japan (so long as they don't lose their 7 goal differential lead) and take second place in the group, screwing over Germany and, in theory, making for an easier round of 16 game...๐ค
If they lose and Costa Rica wins then Spain is out so...that's probably not gonna happen.
Yeah but if Spain checks the score at halftime and sees Germany up...
But why? They'll play either Croatia, Morocco, or Belgium. I guess they'll know how the other group finished when they kick off but if advancing isn't guaranteed there's no way they'll do anything other than try to win in the first half.
Maybe Enrique will tell us the plan on one of his Twitch streams
You're right. I was thinking Morocco was going to win group F and they could avoid Croatia by tanking, but I was wrong. I guess it comes down to how group F shakes out. They can pick their opponent by throwing the game, is what I'm saying. If Germany is looking to win, but not by a ton (less than 6) then allowing a late Japanese goal to lose by 1 ensures that Japan and Spain go through, if Spain prefers the first place team from F. Otherwise, push to win or draw and take the group (if Costa Rica doesn't win)...OR, win the whole damned thing. They are in a great position to choose their own adventure...
Yep, definitely possible. We'll see if anything sketchy goes down in the second half.
Relatively speaking of course, Belgium has looked like ass in this tournament.
Was talking about this German team with friends today and want to see what you all think. Is this the worst German team...ever?
Not at all. I think at the very least they are better than 2018 when they finished last in the group. I don't think they are bad at all. They went toe to toe with Spain yesterday who should be amongst the tournament favorites. They were a bit unlucky to only score once against Japan.
The lack of striker and bench depth is hurting them quite a bit. I thought they looked much better when Fรผllkrug came on. They've really struggled to replace Klose since he retired.
I think a much bigger issue is playing center backs as fullbacks. Raum has done well on the left, but I really wish Hector had stepped up when Flick asked him to come back. Sule as a fullback is a massive head scratcher. Just play Kimmich there, and have one of the 19 other midfielders slot in next to Gundogan.
Sule started at CB yesterday. In the first match he was at RB but he was staying home in a back 3 in possession so it doesn't make a huge difference. My bigger issue is that I don't think Sule is very good but no problem playing a CB at FB if you're not going to ask them to attack. Yesterday I thought Kehrer and Klosterman were fine.
I would leave Kimmich in midfield. They have other good mids yes, but he is the only DM. Can't leave your back line exposed by playing Gundogan or Goretzka as a DM. IDK if they had other options that they could've brought, but that goes back to the squad depth issue. If Kimmich misses a game they have to change all their tactics and likely go to a back 3 since they have no DM cover.
Also struggled since Lahm retired. I think that was a bigger loss than Klose, imho.
They have been surprisingly lacking in fullback talent for quite a while. Some of the greatest players of all time are difficult to replace - who knew?
So the games tomorrow will take place simultaneously within the group. So, they Wakes-England match will be happening while they US plays Iran. This of course doesn't really affect the US since we are win and in. But, while unlikely, Iran could see at halftime that a draw may not be sufficient for them to go through (if Wales are winning).
Because Iran will likely advance with a draw, I imagine they will be quite conservative, which obviously is a big disadvantage for the US. This is generally the case in most matches, but an early goal will be extremely helpful for us as it will force Iran out of their shell and create counterattacking opportunities.
I wouldn't be surprised to see Ferreira get start since we'll likely need to unlock a compact defense. We could also see an Aaronson start in midfield, but I suspect that will more likely be an early sub if we still need a goal..
If we win, we will likely place second which means we would face the winner of Group A, which will probably be the Netherlands but could be Ecuador if they win by more goals over Senegal than Netherlands does over Qatar. It could also be Senegal if they defeat Ecuador and Netherlands fails to defeat Qatar. Group A is playing first so we will know our opponent but there's only one focus - win
Reminder that Iran is a good team. Their first match was obviously awful but they looked much better against Wales and more in line with pre-tournament expectations. They are beatable and while we certainly can and believe we will win, Iran is more than a worthy opponent.
And before things get emotional tomorrow, a couple reminders:
- Berhalter is extremely unlikely to be fired even if we are knocked out ๐คท๐ปโโ๏ธ sorry
- This is a talented team but they are young. That matters in international soccer. We may see the effects of this tomorrow.
- The US was never going to win this tournament. This has always been about setting the team up for success is 2026. A World Cup on our home soil with a talent level that is night and day from 1994 is important to show the world we are for real. We're playing the long game
- Tournaments are extremely high-variance. We could play like garbage and win on a tame shot that squirts through the keepers legs. We could play lights out but get unlucky with finishing and get knocked out.
- Tim Weah is extremely good at soccer
LETS GO USA!
I'm like Hokies in the ACC championship game levels of nervous about tomorrow. An early goal for us will make things so much easier. Can't wait!!
Big day for USA - Win and they're in. Iran isn't going to be an easy team to break down but I've seen the US unlock a couple of defenses already - they just aren't finishing. Iran only needs a draw to advance (assuming England beats Wales) so they are going to play a conservative game in the first half, at least. I think getting an early goal would be a huge advantage for the US. I also think England is going to play a predictably boring defensive game against Wales. With any luck, Wales will score a goal in the first half and Iran will see the score at half time and realize they need to do more than just draw the US to advance. If England drops a goal early that could loosen up Iran's defense a bit in the second half and the US, I think, has enough pace on the counter to be really dangerous. England would probably be fine with a loss so long as it's only 1 goal. They have the GD edge and enough points to advance as long as they don't lose to Wales by 3+ goals. Losing group B would put them on an easier route to the Semis. Winning group B means they would, assuming they win the first knockout game, likely face France in the Quarters. Losing group B would likely get them Poland in the Quarters and they wouldn't face a real power until the Semis (likely Spain)
Shut all the tv's off in the locker room.
Turn all the radios off in the locker room.
One thing, and one thing only matters.
JUST WIN.
No worries about things that are out of our control.
No worries about other games, or scores, or possibilities.
We own our own destiny. Nobody can take that from us.
Own it. Go get it. WIN!!!!
yes. And also, turn on everything in Iran's locker room. Make them think about it
Ecuador ties the game in the 67th minute and Senegal responds with a goal in the 70th minute to take the lead back. The Netherlands are cruising to easy win to take the top spot in Group A.
That's impressive. Normally I'd say the advantage is to the team that only needs a draw, but Senegal is willing themselves through to knockout play
I am very nervous. We NEED an early one. England forced them to play rather than park and it worked perfectly. But, I also have as much faith in Gregg Berhalter as I did in Brad Cornelson in a crucial moment.
It's the US in a world cup. 2 goals is the absolute max we can score against any decent team, and that has to break right. When 2 goals is the max, yes each game is a stomach ache- even against barbaric terrorist nations where none of their players actually live or train there.
Didn't downvote, but this is the second comment you've made about players not being born in the country they play for. Not sure where this comes from , but the rules to play for a country are pretty strict. And they start at age 16...I've had to get 2 kids thru international clearance just to play local club soccer.
Maybe you should look at the US team before saying that as well. Nearly none of our starters "live or train here" since they play internationally.
No- I said live and train for Iran. Didn't say born.
But you did about the France squad earlier...
I did - because until recently, they were notorious about it.
is...is this actually true?
No
I had my doubts...
First time interacting with dcwilson40?
I can decipher a lot of it, but the not living in or training in confused me.
Still not sure I get it, but guess I follow international soccer close enough to understand the nuances and reality of players playing in other countries.
It's dcwilson. Allow me to translate:
Dcwilson knows football but little else. If he's spouting off about anything not football related just ignore and move on.
Not that it matters at all, but 9 of the current Iran squad play for teams based in Iran.
Senegal fans 4 minutes into stoppage time:
Two changes - Carter-Vickers in for Zimmerman and Sargent back in for Wright. COME ON BOYS!
A World Cup debut for CCV.
Gio left out again. Regardless of the outcome, can we leave Berhalter in Qatar after its over?
I'm hopeful Gio comes on in the 60th minute for a shot of offense at the end, but also hope we won't need it!
One can hope.
I just don't think they feel comfortable with him playing the full 90 yet. They said he experience some tightness in the friendly in Qatar, and don't want to risk it. Plus he'd probably be taking Weah's place, and he's been one of our best players.
I've seen this a bunch, but I feel like it is weird to use roman numerals in this context. Like, are we avoiding Arabic numerals or something? Or is there a theme that we are tied to? Or is it just a weird design choice?
Weird design choice. Their FB page is like a high school project. They definitely could use some adult supervision, but it's not that different than a FB Twitter account near from a place near and dear to our hearts previously...
And now the USMNT social media has done something stupid. They removed the Islamic symbol from the Iranian flag when posting about the game and the group standings. Come on man, just post their flag. Don't alter it. Don't throw silly jabs out there.
Again? This was a story from a few days ago
Yeah, I think they did it again.
Unless they've already deleted it, they have not done it again.
Ok, sorry for the delay. Still stupid.
No worries. There's a lot of stuff on the internet to go through.
I know that a lot (maybe most) teams do this, but it also bugs me how they list the players in numerical order. I don't care about their numbers, I want to know the formation. Especially annoying for opposing teams when I don't really know the players.
It's common in soccer to use xi instead of "eleven" or "11". I imagine it was to avoid confusion with jersey numbers and stuck
Iran going with Taremi and Azmoun up top again, as they did v. Wales. We'll see how they come out but this could indicate they are going for the win and not counting on England to beat Wales.
Robinson better figure out where he is for the 2 hours. He was out there taking pictures as the ball went all around him.
His touch has been miserable all tournament. He's gotta get right for Saturday
I'm just not getting a good feeling about this game so far. Not sure why but they don't seem to be on the same page
McKennie and Musah have swapped sides. It's messing w the flow a little bit.
We have passed up multiple shots from 18-22 out. I know we need to work the ball around but man, take some chances.
The over the top time wasting has begun
PULISSSSSSSIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIC
These corners...๐คข
Pulisic took a ๐ฅshot...but.....GOAL!
S/N: we really need to work on our supporter atmosphere, they just showed a shot of our supporters, and they've already calmed down after a potential knockout round clinching goal, come on Yanks!
Pretty sure that's because of concern for Pulisic and not at all having to do with the goal lol
Good point, I was concerned as well LOL
I will say, Dest has been fantastic the last 2 games.
Pulisic with the goal and the cup check!
so he looks like he's not having kids any time soon...
OMG how do they mess that break up
Pulisic is a warrior but he doesn't look comfortable. Might be best to just put Aaronson in.
Gio!!!!!
Guessing he'll be fine after the half. That was a pretty rough nut shot but he seems to be running it off just fine.
Think it was more on the hip area. If you've ever gotten a hip flexor...it hurts like hell.
What a wasted (incredible) finish by Weah; I think the defender's leg played him on, how do you not go to VAR for that?
Boy that looked onside to me...what a finish again though
... why can't offsides call be reviewed????
It was...quickly
I didn't realize FIFA refs could get bribed that quickly
They were bribed before the games began.
How the fuck is that offside
Holy shit, that's fucking shady
US vs Iran in the Middle East.
Not saying there's political shenanigans, but the immediate denial of VAR on that is.... questionable
Lol it didn't even go to VAR
It did go to VAR. They review all sorts of things live. And the announcers even said they called down quickly to confirm the call.
I mean, MAYBE, his knee cap put him offsides.
I would rather see lines drawn on actual game footage similar to how the EPL has been doing for offside VAR discussions. These images may be accurate, however they could also be 100% fabricated based on whomever is bribing FIFA this time.
Agree. It gives me Wimbledon replay vibes. Like. Yeah, I guess that's what happened. But also you could've just made it up and I would never know...
England up 1-0
Make that 2-0
The real content were all here for
We can't play conservative here; we have to work for a second goal
If we play to not lose, we will in fact, lose. Matt Ryan taught me that.
We're playing Bud Foster levels of prevent right now and it's concerning atm.
Fuck Matt Ryan
3-0 England
Rashford with his 2nd and Wales just has nothing today
All time unlucky injury for Sargent. Geez.
That looked painful...
Hopefully Josh can shake it off.
Wtf does Gregg have against Gio?
I think he's to scared for him too get injured
I wish they'd give Gio a look at the CF spot. Who are you going to pull for him in the starting XI though? Pulisic? No. Weah? No. I don't think Gio presses as much as Greggggg wants.
Don't need him to start, but when you are using all the subs and he's not one of them...
I think he should've started on the wing with Weah at CF.
Situationally in the match today, I don't know what advantage he would've brought coming on as a sub in the 2nd half, though. Who was he a fit for that came off? Mckennie? (No). Pulisic? (Maybe! But Aaronson presses and is more energetic without the ball). Dest? (no). Sargent? (Over Haji as a holding CF to help kill the game...no). Weah (Over a third CB to kill the game off?)
I can't believe I'm siding with Greggg here, but Gio as a sub today didn't make sense.
He should have replaced McKennie. Acosta offers nothing as a #8.
I wouldn't have put him on at CF but Wright was awful today. Doesn't offer any false 9 type benefits, was very lazy in his pressing even though he was one of the freshest players, and made a huge blunder by shooting late in the game instead of going to the corner to waste time which would have effectively ended the game.
I think it's pretty clear he's not fit, but that's the only reason he shouldn't see the field. If the real (read: probably won't ever be public knowledge) reason is anything other than injury it's just a terrible decision.
Last paragraph, agree!
Acosta wasn't really playing as an 8 right? They went double pivot slash defend the bejesus out of everything. For an MLS guy, I actually like Acosta. He's a G that the team needs.
Wright was so bad. If Sargent can't go against the Dutch (his injury looked bad), maybe it forces a change of thought and Gio starts? Or he'll just start Haji or Jesus anyways ๐คฃ
Wright was lost today. That's where Gio should have come in. And the thought of a one-for-one is a little ham handed seeing as Gregg ended up w 5 in the back anyway. When you make the sub, you can change the formation. He went into prevent mode fairly quickly. And I guess that's where my frustration is. He stopped attacking.
And if Gio isn't fit, he shouldn't be in Qatar. Take another body. I know they had to submit the roster before, but there has to be a better understanding if he's going to be fit or not. And plan accordingly.
I mean the story is that he tweaked it in the warm up friendly a few days before the first match. I'm also not sure which winger they could call in at this point who would be of any help. I do think if he's really injured he should just say that. Obviously he's said he's 100% but I don't think I believe that. We'll never really know I guess. Whatever the reason we can all agree it sucks he's not on the pitch because he would be a massive help To our attacking creativity.
Omg I'm getting wales flashbacks
Shhhhhhhh
9 mins of stoppage time.....
Yikes
Me as 90' rolls around:
via GIPHY
via GIPHY
Somewhere there's a joke about Pulisic's metaphorical massive nuts going in for that score and the resulting actual swollen nuts that happened as a result, but I'm too lazy to find it
MOVING ON
I gotta go change my pants
MOVING ON TO THE NETHERLANDS
Reminder that Orange sucks unless it's paired with Maroon
ADVANCE TO THE NETHER REGIONS
Jesus boys. LET'S GO ๐ค
Relief to go through but Jesus berhalter made that stressful. What kind of subs use was that no Reyna again?
Pulisic sacrificed himself so we could go through we better not let it be in vein. We can't be so negative in the second half against the dutch.
Either GGG doesn't rate him in his formation/tactics or there's something else going on. Either way, if he can't see the field for us then that alone is a fireable offense. Absolutely ridiculous...
Also, I don't think I saw Reyna in any of the camera views where the bench was out celebrating/congratulating the players on the field.
I saw him kind of walking off gingerly. I don't think he's fully healthy.
That wasn't stressful at all
Onto the Dutch (please beat the Dutch so VVD can get in some warm weather training...)
Now I'm hoping Germany can get through as well. (Can qualify for the last 16 with a win and a loss by Spain or Japan. Can also advance with a win by more than one goal and a Japan draw.)
I hate Berhatwr's subs. We played not to lose and thankfully, we did not.
Those last 10 minutes took 10 years off my life.
Still, USA! USA! USA! ๐บ๐ธโฝ๏ธ
Agreed, the subs were questionable. I think we showed the best ball control, when we were pressing for a goal. I don't think the backline has the discipline to park the bus for 10 minutes straight. That got dicey there with those two opportunities there at the end.
I totally agree that we parked the bus too soon, but I didn't hate any of the subs except Shaq Moore. Cannot figure out why that guy in on the field in the World Cup.
They looked like hot garbage in the second half, but a W and the knockout round is a W and the knockout round.
A typical berhalter 2nd half
That was fun! Really enjoyed watching Weah and Musah, but Reyna needs to be on the pitch if he's not injured.
I was slightly nervous when 70' into the match I realized Mateu "showtime" Lahoz was the ref. Though he is a good ref, he does have a tendency towards main character energy. Had me worried during that wild sequence at the end, but he didn't even humor them with a monitor check. Great call and didn't waste all our time (and nerves).
Lol I found this referee blog earlier where they have a thread for literally every game just to discuss them refs decisions and performance. Posters are all refs. They were talking about how this guy is a "unique" ref. Didn't quite know what they meant but sounds like he's the Ted Valentine of soccer which is generally not great!
We stunted on those hoes in the first half. Played em off the park. They didn't get a sniff. If we just kept that going...
Ironically I think it's better if we don't score early so we're forced to keep playing positively and not bunker. Guys looked gassed and maybe that's part of it, but probably because they were made to defend for the entire second half instead of keeping possession.
Reyna has to be hurt. He has to. I mean this is getting ridiculous.
Yeah, Adams and Musah got run into the ground today. Texted a friend on Reyna but he wouldn't touch it. The plot thickens.
On to the next round.
These second-half "adjustments" are so bad. For the love of God, leave Berhalter in Qatar. Two goals in 270 minutes, 300 counting stoppage, is not great. Also, Shaq Moore, OF NASVILLE FC, has more minutes than Gio Reyna.
Just posted above about Shaq Moore, agree. But...I'll say it...I think Greggggg has had a great tournament. After Wynalda backtracked I definitely think he's on the right side of Gio gate. Every change to starting XI he's made has been pretty effective I feel like.
Look man I get that it's not always pretty but we advanced to the R16 conceding 0 goals from open play and 1 goal overall. This starting 11 is basically an Olympic team (U23) and they were in one of the more difficult groups.
The second halves have been poor, but the first halves have been legitimately the best soccer the US has ever played. Do they need a bit more attacking creativity? Sure.
Gio is pretty obviously not able to play significant minutes. It sucks, but it is what it is. The whole "Gio is 100%" line is clearly gamesmanship.
Is this a legit screen grab or is this photoshopped? Genuinely curious
It's legit lol
Anyone knows what's going on with Reyna
He had some muscle tightness the week before the WC started, so they haven't felt comfortable starting him (plus Weah's been playing well). He definitely could have been used today to help control the ball some more at the end, but Berhalter went with more defensive subs.
So you think the whole Eric Wynalda bit to the Los Angeles times about Berhalter having beef with gio and lying about his injury to media is telephone and exaggeration? Because that would be so petty yet we've seen it before
I thought Wynalda spoke out backing off his initial comments, no?
Either way, Wynalda is a pretty notorious shit starter.
Yeah, as stated ^^^ Wynalda has backed off those comments. From what I've read/heard from National Team reporters it's more of a case of a frustrated father (Claudio) venting to a friend like you'd do with a little league team. I also think Gio feels he's 100%, but what 20yr old doesn't?
Onto the knockout stage
He almost took Maguire's soul in the England match...but he was just practicing for the real thing on VVD ๐
FYI I will make a Netherlands preview and post later this week. Will probably make a separate thread for knockout round discussion as well.
Guess they couldn't go with: Christian Pulisic, day-to-day (balls)
Dude is gonna play. No way he misses this one.
Saw this in the replies. Laughed
Was I the only one that had a smile on his face when the display showed "ECU Eliminated"?
Player ratings:
Matt Turner - 7: Not a lot to do in goal but was ready when it counted. Started the attack that led to goal with an excellent pass and had another dime to Weah over the top in the second half. Silky distribution overall - that Arsenal DNA is showing.
Sergio Dest - 8: Excellent driving forward with the ball creating danger. Very nice assist. Not tested too much defensively but didn't notice any issues.
Cameron Carter-Vickers - 8: Massive performance. So physically strong sneak made a number of good interventions. Looked very comfortable on the ball as well. Should start next game.
Tim Ream - 7: Another calm display from the crafty veteran. His resurgence has been remarkable and sorely needed.
Antonee Robinson - 5: Not his best game. Seemed like every time he got the ball he played a touch too heavy and lost it. Played some decent balls into the box. Hope he settles down for the next game.
Tyler Adams - 9.5: What else can you say? Ran over 8 miles in the match, covers ground like no one else. He's just incredible man. What a player. Only blemish is a yellow card which means he will have to think twice in the next match.
Yunus Musah - 7: A very good performance that tailed off late in the game as he was clearly gassed. I don't believe he's been subbed yet, he may need a break. Absolutely pantsed a dude in midfield, as per usual.
Weston McKennie - 9: Wow. When McKennie is on, he is almost unstoppable. The definition of a big game player. Lovely ball for the hockey assist on the first goal and inches away from an assist to Weah on the offside goal. Our midfield is so freaking good man.
Tim Weah - 8: More excellent movement off the ball and what a finish for the offside goal. That is so, so difficult to pull off. He's our best finisher by far. Should have done better on his headed chance after Sargent's shot was deflected.
Josh Sargent - 7: Very good performance from him. Did a great job being available to receive between the lines and linking up and worked hard in the press. Really hope his injury isn't severe because he locked up the starting spot if he's fit.
Christian Pulisic - 8: A real ballsy performance. Absolutely ran his nuts off. Great run on the goal but it seems he got shafted with that collision.
Subs:
Brendan Aaronson - 6: Started brightly but didn't really have enough of the ball to make much of an impact as the US lost control of the game flow.
Kellyn Acosta - 5: Didn't really impact the game in a meaningful way. He didn't do anything poorly but he was a passenger. I really wish Berhalter would stop pretending Acosta is a #8.
Haji Wright - 3: Very poor . He did not seem to be trying hard in the press at all (you have the freshest legs of anyone!). Didn't provide much hold up play. Terrible decision to take a shot near the end of stoppage time instead of dribbling into the corner to salt the game away.
Shaq Moore - 6: He was fine. I don't remember him doing anything wrong defensively. He did get caught upfield one time but that was not really his fault since it was a bad giveaway on our part.
Walker Zimmerman - 7: Came on to win some headers and he did. CCV played his way into the starting 11 but Zimmerman is still a decent player who is useful because of his aerial dominance.
I was losing my mind when Wright shot that. I mean, love the confidence, but got to have some awareness and soccer IQ. I think he scuffed it? It definitely did not come off clean.
Shaq Moore seemed to give up the ball anytime he got it. He and Wright both sucked.
I really enjoy watching Adams quietly controlling the game from the midfield - nothing fancy, just consistently smart and steady, with good decisions and movement.
Like the ratings, thanks for taking the time to put them together. Only thing I see worth talking about is that I'd flip the ratings for McKinnie and Musah for this game. Musah had almost 2x as many touches (with fewer turnovers), was winning challenges and recovering more balls (led the team in interceptions). The connection of Dest-Musah-Weah in the first half was really solid as well - think I saw a stat that said that connection was responsible for 42% of the US attack in the first half. He definitely got gassed in the end of the game, but his overall contribution for the night had a greater impact imho.
Surprised nobody has commented on your Pulisic analysis... well done.
Also note, the 1.9 goals we scored yesterday came thru the middle attack, not off the wings and crossed. McKinnie to Dest to Pulisic was generated out of the middle. And the thru ball to Weah was from the middle. Hope Gregg is paying attention to that...
VENT TIME, why the fuck does the hand of the attacker count as a part of the player for offside when the hand of the defender is not where the line gets drawn? genuinely befuddled how it isnt "any part of the attacker that can play the ball"
The really nice tactic change from Berhalter was using Weah as an inverted winger at times against the 4-4-2 Iran were in which got Dest one v one alot on the right which in the end was how the US got their goal from the switched ball by Mckennie who had a great game before his legs went out.
Per this, his leg and half his body was offsides...
So the arm of the Iranian defender doesn't count, but the hairs on Weah's knee does?
The whole thing is a joke. Especially when you go to this level of computer graphics when we already have this.
That simulated image can easily be manipulated, and we damn well know that FIFA is absolutely not above taking bribes to manipulate results. The fact that the ruling came immediately to keep playing without even pretending to review it reeks of manipulation.
Apparently they use a sensor in the ball to determine the exact moment the ball is kicked. I've always thought that using the frame that the ball appears to be kicked and then measuring offsides to the millimeter is a bit like using the chain to exactly measure a football ref's somewhat approximate spot. If the camera frame rate is 24 fps, a player is running at 5 m/s (well below the fastest players top speeds, the error could be around 20 cm. I'd love to know what kind of frame rate this new system runs at and what the error tolerances are.
Looking at the images, it's half of Weah, not just some hairs.
And we are assuming that the two images are absolutely the exact same time. It actually looks like Weston hasn't kicked the ball yet in the "real" image, so take it a frame a bit or two ahead and that's where Weah is off.
I agree that it would be much more convincing if they were using actual photos instead of the computer generated graphics. I think it's super close. In the end, it doesn't really matter. The US won the game and are through to the knockouts.
Ultimately, I think the technology is in its infancy and will continue to improve with time. The next world cup may use more advanced versions of this same technology, which may include actual live frame-shots instead of this computer generated nonsense. That will be much more convincing, IMO. I also thought the offsides call that went against Ecuador in the very first match against Qatar was questionable and I didn't really buy the graphic. Then they completely botched the offsides call that ultimately negated the penalty that should have been awarded to Canada against Belgium. So, across the three instances where the technology is really being called into question, it really only mattered in the match between Canada and Belgium. That could have ended in a 1-1 draw instead of a 1-0 Belgium victory. I don't think that was manipulation or corruption so much as just plain incompetence.
I agree the technology is new, but it shouldn't be going through these growing pains with its wide rollout during the World Cup itself. It should have been implemented in 4 years of friendlies and maybe the Gold Cup and other smaller tournaments before getting to this point.
You say growing pains...but is it really? The call in the US-Iran game was correct. Just because we are upset over it, and it's new technology, that doesn't mean there are growing pains. It's worked and it worked on that call. If Weah was 2' behind him, then it would be growing pains and not working.
Plus, we are taking cues from Fox and their announcers. Fox...the network that brought us the glow puck in hockey. And John Strong and Stu Holden in the box. As much as Taylor is a pain that drones on sometimes, he does understand the rules and explains them well most of the time.
the call is correct if you believe the image presented. I think that is the issue that Alum has with this. The question is whether or not this graphic is manipulated. Its hard because it probably is accurate, but given FIFA's history of corruption there is a seed of doubt and these graphics could much more easily be manipulated than, say, a live photo. Offsides is also difficult to capture because it can happen anywhere on the field. With touchdowns in American football you can shoot a camera straight down the line to the endzone and capture, fairly easily, whether the ball actually breaks the plane. That sort of evidence would be much more convincing than computer generated graphics that roughly represent the players on the pitch. I just don't know if the technology is that advanced yet.
Yep. Quite frankly, I just don't trust FIFA. They've proven time and time again they are willing to do whatever the highest bidder wants.
I agree with FIFA being corrupt but the ref held his ground and didn't give Iran a penalty at the end when he could have. I don't think there was anything nefarious going on in this game.
USA: *wins, keeps a clean sheet, no penalties conceded, single clear yellow card, advances to knockout rounds*
People on the Internet after one tight offside call: FIFA IS CORRUPT AND IT'S ALL RIGGED AND THE VAR OFFICIALS ARE BRIBED
we need something to complain about...we're conditioned to it
Kinda like watching a VT BB game.
As saladhokie once warned us all, you cannot overcome the predetermine
The Iranian player's hand doesn't count because only body parts which can legally play the ball are considered for offsides. So the Iranian player's hip counts as the furthest back body part for him, while Weah's knee and head are clearly behind that player. It's a fairly tame and not controversial VAR offsides decision compared to many others recently. It was close for sure, but was definitely a correct offsides decision and that's why the check happened as quickly as it did.
Technology is great in sports, but instances like this is where it gets a little overboard. No way you can visibly see this in real time let alone "review and confirm" the call within seconds of it happening. Both feet behind the defender too. So basically, we got shafted due to a weight distribution issue.
We won 2-0
The ball has a sensor in it, and there are cameras all throughout the stadium. This is taking goal line technology to the nth degree.
I know it's frustrating. But they've shown the images of Weah offside. The rule is the rule, and he was offside when McKennie made contact with the ball by the rules. I don't like the fact that the linesman raised the flag since they've been instructed to let it play out unless it's clear an obvious. This one wasn't clear, but he happened to get the call right and has been backed up by the video confirmation. It doesn't change the outcome. 1-0 or 5-0, we won and are in the round of 16.
I believe the linesman waited until after the ball went in to raise the flag, which is correct. If VAR/offside system determined he was on, the goal would have counted.
You explained things quite well above, but I'll just add:
This is not "new" technology. This is technology that has been in place for some time being adapted to soccer. Also, it's been used in the Champions League this season, so this is not the first competition in which it's being used. As you said, the sensor in the ball is able to determine the precise moment it is kicked and everything is done automatically. That's why the decision is nearly instantaneous, even if it takes several minutes to generate the animation. I can't blame people for not trusting that - it's not hard to imagine FIFA "encouraging" manipulation of this technology. Although, as someone who works with motion capture (what is used to determine the players' position) I can say that it's not a trivial task to manipulate all that information to look credible in that short of a time.
Should go with Arsene Wenger's daylight rule. If you can see space between the attacker and the last defender, it's offside. Score more goals. Make defenders actually defend instead of holding a high line.
Why FIFA won't accept it is beyond me. This is more complicated and controversial.
That creates a problem to me. The high line and trap play has been apart of the game and taught as long as I can remember. That is part of defense.
Make attackers properly hold their runs.
I figured as a former defensive player I'd get flack for that. Can't fault players for playing within the confines of the rules.
I'll still leg for a funny gif.
Only the shoulder is counted for offsides. The graphic is confusing, they should grey out the arm or something to make that more obvious.
Hot take: we should do away with offsides in a series of friendlies and see what happens to the game, how it changes offenses and defenses.
I would 1000% watch soccer more than once every 4 years if this happened
Bit of drama unfolding in Group D. Denmark must win advance and are currently level with Australia, who probably only need a draw to advance. Tunisia must defeat France, who are already through. Could be a big upset if Australia can knock out Denmark.
And now Tunisia have scored to make it 1-0. As it stands, they would go through with 4 points on GD over Australia. If Denmark can take the lead, they would go through on goals scored over Tunisia.
Updates coming in fast as Australia scores to lead 1-0! With a win, they will advance with 6 points, nothing Tunisia can do about that. Australia are unlikely to top the group as they have (currently) a 4 goal GD gap with France.
It was a lovely goal as well, very surprised at Australia's play thus far this tournament.
Mbappe is out here not passing to a single soul in a game that is meaningless for them trying to get that Golden Boot. You have to respect it
Australia wins and advances to the knockouts! What an upset for the Socceroos!
Griezmann scores at the death to clinch a point for France. Heartbreaking for Tunisia, who were already eliminated with Australia's win, but probably didn't know it on the pitch.
Called back for offside, Tunisia still eliminated. What an emotional roller coaster that is going to be for them
As he scored, I was wondering why the offside wasn't called. When they reviewed it seemed pretty obvious. Has to be a fun time for the Tunisia side tonight.
Well they're still eliminated so...
It shouldn't have been offside. I guess it's kind of subjective, but the initial ball into the box was not contested by Griezmann (the offside player). In my opinion, he did not affect that initial play. The defender had to head it away because of the presence of a different (onside) player. Once he does that, the play resets and Griezmann is onside. Really not sure why is was called off but as I said it doesn't matter this time.
I get that..... I meant it as they could be happy they defeated a European team in the WC which they'd never done before. Guess I should've worded it that way.
I guess as a ref I wouldn't consider that a reset because it was still a chance off the initial ball in. If it cleared the potential "dangerous" area then it would reset to me. He was lost in the wash because he was behind the line originally. I know I haven't worded it correctly but have to get back to work.
Got it - bittersweet victory for sure.
It is largely up to the referee's interpretation which is why I think it's such a confusing aspect of the rule for most fans.
Work? Oh right, I'm supposed to be doing that...
Just take off til the final. I'm sure the boss will understand. I appreciate your view and context on the WC when I need a catch up.
I know it's paywall (sorry, The Athletic has good content!), but here's a nice article that gives some non-US perspective on our team. I'll say it again - international soccer is a much lower, more basic level than club soccer. If you don't normally watch international (which is fine, I totally get it), I think maybe you are overestimating the normal level of play. It hasn't been perfect, and they haven't been able to sustain it over 90 minutes, but Triple G has the US playing some good ball. You have to acknowledge that even if you have (some fair) criticisms. Otherwise, you're simply not being objective.
The Athletic also had an outstanding article detailing the final 9m53s of stoppage time of USA v Iran. No linky, but title is "Nine minutes and 53 seconds: The excruciating final moments of the USMNT's win over Iran".
I can admit that 3 of the last 4 halves the USMNT has played have been some of the best I've ever seen them play. Drawing England and dominating the first half against Iran was a pleasant departure from the qualifying. Not sure what's made the difference, but it's even improved from the game against Wales...
Heading into the Netherlands game, we might be playing better than them. Gotta come out, hope Pulisic is healthy and ready, and Matt keeps on his toes. Let's Go!!!
I will say, I noticed a heavy amount of crosses again yesterday. It's clear that, as you said, that is a part of the gameplan. I do think it is probably matchup specific though. The Dutch play with high wing backs so there will likely be space in the wide areas of the box again, so I would anticipate another game with a high number of crosses.
I have to say, if we had to pick one regular starter to not be fit, it might be Pulisic. He has been playing well but for me there is no drop off from him to Aaronson or Reyna if he's available. They might even be better. Still hope he's available though, if not just to come off the bench.
Taylor saying it like it is...
I may have plagiarized that tweet
What a start to the second half for Argentina. More importantly, nothing would delight me more than a goalless draw or defeat for El Tri. Having to head home without a single goal is beautiful. Sadly, Tata would be gone and he has been great for us over the past three years.
Edit: Andddd, they get a goal.
Even now up 2-0 they aren't going thru because of goal differential...
Unless they score two more...
Correct. But if Argentina puts another one in, it's tied. And multiple tiebreakers come into play. Might just root for chaos and have fair play rules determine it.
you were saying?
Another one in on line 1. Now all Tri need is one more goal. Plot twist...
Edit: Tri with
twothree potential goal opportunities...this is getting interesting...i would love nothing more than mexico not making it through because of yellows accumulation lmao the schadenfreude
It would somehow be more beautiful than going home with zero goals scored.
With both games at 2-0, fair play tiebreaker rules come into effect. Poland would go through atm because Mexico has more yellow cards.
Tie goes against the assholes...
and Poland just gets a yellow...
This was a really weak, but very entertaining group. Hopefully Poland can go through for the sake of my Polish friend.
Now a two yellow card difference with Poland still advancing.
That darn high line keeping Mexico needing a goal. Couldn't happen to a better set of individuals.
Edit: and SA puts the nail in the coffin with a stoppage time goal. Hate to see it.
There's the nail!!!
Saudi's...
via GIPHY
CONCACAF Champions: Out
L Tri: Gone
Costa Rica: Allowed 7 goals in one game
America: Thriving.
Truly shows how poor we were during qualifying!
Glad we turned it on now. A lot of the frustration was born from knowing we could and should play better than we were. And we are at the right time.
Nah, nobody gives a ๐ฉ about the WCQ table. We are Gold Cup and Nations League champs. There is only one CONCACAF champion and they don't have a GD leaf on their flag.
it brings me much joy that Mexico is eliminated. They were the better team, though. Just didn't score. Poland's keeper really was the reason, though. Argentina really should have scored 2 or 3 more but there were some great saves. It would have been really poetic justice if the 2-0 score lines held and Mexico was eliminated on fair play. Especially with all the diving they do. I hate them for that.
On a serious note, this will cause huge change in the Mexican federation. They have papered over the warning signs for too many years. Not integrating young talent, discouraging their players to move to Europe, and freezing out their best attackers (both of whom play in MLS by the way, lol). Tata was never going to continue after this tournament even without the group exit, but this will cause big, big change. Honestly, their inability to win even one knockout game in their history is pretty pathetic considering they are by far and away the most populous Spanish-speaking country in the world where soccer is the only sport anyone cares about. Their fans are crazy but they are not wrong to expect better.
They definitely brought an aging roster to Qatar and failed to integrate any of their younger players. I've enjoyed watching them suffer...
Per USSF, Christian Pulisic and Josh Sargent are both considered day-to-day. Sargent is listed as having "ankle soreness". Pulisic is doing the press conference today, so that seems like a pretty good indication that he's playing. I doubt those statuses will change before the game so we don't tip our hand.
Guys a legend
Nothing like some nice schadenfreude in the morning. Group F could have some thrilling finishes this morning with Belgium working to find it way in.
I'm all for using technology to aid officials but damn that is close to call
Calls like this drive me absolutely insane. You shouldn't be called offside if a body part that you can't play the ball with, is beyond "the line." I know you can touch the ball above your sleeve, and it's considered contact with the shoulder, but the amount of sleeve in that is comical.
My two cents, if you want to call it this tight you better have evidence the ball has actually left his foot as well if you want to nitpick this bad. I'm all for VAR and its use but this level is getting absurd.
Agreed, I think those two aspects should be paired together. Separation between ball and foot with corresponding time stamp along with the image of 1/8 of an inch of shirt sleeve across the line. SMH
If we want to measure this tight we need to be sure we are measuring the exact moment the ball separates from the foot otherwise we are getting way to tight.
Why does it matter when the ball separates from the foot? With the sensors in the ball measuring the exact positioning of the ball, that allows for a precise definition, however it is defined, of the moment the ball is "kicked". So long as that definition is consistent (and it would be given the data that's being tracked), then trying to ascertain "when the ball leaves the foot" would be a much inferior method of defining the precise timing of the "kick" versus something like the peak in the acceleration curve during the foot-ball impact. With the sensor data coming in at 500Hz (vs 50Hz for HD video), you're going to have a much more accurate measurement from the sensors than you will from analyzing video to determine separation from the foot.
From 538's article on the new World Cup ball:
I think that's what the sensor in the ball is for.
Yeah I think what Nator is saying, is there needs to be an associated image when the ball leaves for a pass.
I argued with someone on here about the way offside is being called these days with VAR.
I think it's a net negative at this point. The rule was designed to keep the attacker from gaining an unfair advantage. Not to measure the mm or cm offside position of a body part that "technically" can be used to score.
Frankly, I think VAR has led to handball calls being worse as well. Then look at that bullshit pen Argentina got yesterday for incidental contact that happens on almost any set piece into the box.
VAR has some great aspects but we are getting to a level that is making it hard to tolerate now. If were going to measure this tightly they need to start measuring the gap for the ball or quit this hair splitting bs.
The argentina penalty was scandalous no other way of putting it complete joke of a pen. I'm all for technology but we have to be careful we dont sap the essence of the game out from under it.
I think VAR by itself is fine, it has some usefulness. The problem (as it was before) is that many (most?) referees are not very good. They are using VAR in ways for which it was never intended to be used (Messi penalty v. Poland) and examining things frame by frame makes everything look worse.
I wasn't really watching so I don't know what the explanation for the Croatia offside was. But I mean that is just an absurd call. There has to be a cutoff point somewhere so there will always be calls that seem too harsh, but I can't even tell where the offside is based on the image.
Looking at if frame by frame is really no different than reviewing things in football or basketball (especially targeting in football). It always looks worse in slow motion.
It doesn't help that the offside rule has some ambiguity in it, too.
I'm fine if they keep offside with this rule if there is an allowable error of a few inches or so. This mm wide line is crap and it should be thicker. Or they can back it up with actual images from the field of play. These computer generated images are not the most transparent as it isn't the actual player, and it's already been shown that it doesn't seem like it's the same angle as it actually was in the field.
The other option is the attacking players front foot should be completely behind the second to last defenders back foot. That way there is none of this leaning and deciding if this persons armpit is behind the defender.
Oh Lukaku....
I feel bad for the guy he wasnt even supposed to be on the field until next week but the situation was desperate.
So...does Spain jockey for a 2nd place finish to face Morocco instead of Croatia (assuming Germany has a healthy, but not too healthy, lead at the half)? It also means they miss Brazil (assuming they win group G)
EDIT: ๐ค
interesting thought. Germany needs to win. They are sitting on 1 point right now so a draw does them no good. Costa Rica probably also needs to win unless they see Spain is up on Japan at half time. If Japan and CR both force draws, Japan would advance on GD. Spain has one foot in but they can't lose. If CR and Japan both win they jump Spain. If CR wins and Spain gets a draw they get second. But that's a huge risk because Japan needs to win (if CR wins and Japan just draws, CR and Spain will advance) and will be trying to get a goal late. If Japan gets a late goal to win and CR beats Germany Spain is heading home.
I think Spain is going to try winning. Playing cute and angling for 2nd isn't really worth the risk. Just get through to the knockouts and deal with who they have to deal with. They are one of the favorites to win so they'll be expecting to play the best teams anyway. It would be pretty humiliating if they try to get second and concede a late goal to lose and get sent home because CR beats Germany.
It will probably be a pretty exciting set of games to watch. Germany is the only team that truly has a must win situation. But drawing is so perilous for all 3 of the other teams that I think it's unlikely they'll play to that end.
I might not have this quite right but I think it goes something like this:
Spain [4] - advances with a win or a draw. advances if Germany wins (assuming they don't make up ground on GD). Goes home if CR and Japan both win.
Japan [3] - advances with win or a draw and Germany win or draw. Goes home with a draw and CR win. Potentially goes home with draw and Germany win (depending on GD)
Costa Rica [3] - advances with win or draw and Spain win. goes home if both games end in draw (GD). Goes home with loss (GD)
Germany [1] - advances with win and Spain win. Potentially advances with win and Japan win if they make up GD (very unlikely). Goes home with draw or loss.
it would also be humiliating if they finish second to duck
england, francebrazil and croatia and then lose to morocco. just play to winedit: read the bracket wrong
yeah, that would be even worse. Both sides of the bracket look formidable. I think the side England and France are on (assuming things play out how we'd expect) is the easier route to the Final. Those two teams, plus Portugal, are the real powers. On the other side, you have Brazil, Spain, Croatia, Argentina and the US. I could see a Spain-France or Brazil-France final. I'd love to see England get there but I think France is just too damn talented.
EDIT: Well, with Japan winning, I think the side with England and France is now the scarier looking side. Spain, France, England and Portugal are all heavy hitters. This is a huge break for Brazil, IMO. They have a relatively easy route to the Final, with their toughest test likely being Argentina in the Semi-final. If things play out more or less as they stand now Brazil will have Ghana, then winner of Japan-Croatia to get to the Semi-final. I think England and France will both advance to the Quarters, where they will meet. Similarly, I think Portugal and Spain will meet in the Quarters. Those are going to be some great games. And the winners will have a very tough test in the Semi-final. Good chance that the winner there could see Brazil in the Final.
No
I really want to see Del Torre and Reyna in as subs after Mckinnie and Musah get tired.
Good start for Deutschland!
Edit: Ah hell....
LMAO, Spain and Germany are about to go out if current results hold...
edit: Dang, never mind
Spain has a 13 goal differential lead on Costa Rica...
Well Germany scored again so now CRC definitely won't win. But man, that was close.
The insanity is beautiful.
COME ON SPAIN! LMBO
Edit: Well, 1 for 2 is still batting .500...smh
Sad we didn't get maximum chaos, but lol Germany
Imagine thinking this sport is boring
Netherlands preview posted here.
Knockout discussion thread will be posted tomorrow when the last matchups are finalized.
For the morning matches:
Early goal gives Portugal the 1-0 lead over South Korea.
12 years after the famous Luis Suarez handball and penalty miss for Ghana, Ghana gets a penalty against Uruguay...and it's saved. Still 0-0
And now Uruguay scores off the rebound of a saved Suarez shot. Seconds later, Korea scores off a corner. Currently Portugal and Uruguay through, but another Korea goal would put them above Uruguay.
Uruguay 2-0. Ghana only need to draw, but it's a long way back now.
it upsets me immensely that Uruguay may advance. I hate Suarez and I hate how much the Uruguayan players dive and whine. I would love to see South Korea get a late goal to send Uruguay home
And your wish (and mine) has been granted. Head to warm weather training Darwin!
Edit: Where my Wolves supporters at? What a finish! Saved by a hand...that of which you cannot use to play the ball, smh. So happy for Son though, love that guy, what a player.
The line was on the defenders knee. While the hand was shown, it wasn't a factor in the offside/onside review.
I'm clearly watching Telemundo...thanks for the heads up lol
Wolves have supporters?
Hey, if TKP has Newcastle and Aston supporters, I figured there was one Wolverhampton believer out there ๐
Disclaimer: because everything needs a disclaimer nowadays, I wasn't throwing shade at the Newcastle or Aston supporters, just alluding to those who support teams that typically end up near the mid to upper mid table. Clearly Newcastle is doing amazing this season thus far.
All good! As a Geordie I've learned to just roll with things. This VT football season has been what it was like watching the Magpies for the past 2 decades.
Fireman even pops up now and then to remind everyone he jumped on the Leicester City train in 2015! and Cb.vb.VT (who mostly lurks on TKP but is an IRL bff of me and Brad) is a West Ham supporter
very happy with that result. I understand the Uruguayan players are upset but it's pretty classless to harrass the ref like that at the end of the match, following him into the locker room. I thought the ref called a fairly decent game. He wasn't buying their diving bullsh*t and that really drove them nuts.
They were just reacting how they would react at home. CONMEBOL at its finest.
WOLVES RIGHT HERE. I thought I was the only one.
But I'm glad I'm working at home today, because I'm also Portuguese and screamed and punched my desk when he scored. Country before club, as it were.
>wolves
>portuguese
the math checks out here tbh
Well done GGC, EPL watchers will understand this...take your leg sir
Hey, there we go. No shade intended, just assumed a largely American population on TKP would not have any supporters of a relatively small club in the Midlands.
No shade taken, it's all good. And I'm used to it โ I've had to explain more than once why I have a sticker of some guy named "NUNO" on one of my notebooks.
See I knew it! LOL
Korea scores in stoppage time! If the scores hold, they will advance over Uruguay.
soccer newb here... how did this tie-breaker work? Both teams were 1-1-1, the draw was against each other, and both teams had a net-0 goal differential.
nm - found the answer which came down to total goals scored.
and if that had been even, it then goes to fair play rules where they count yellow cards (red cards count for 4, I think) and whichever team has fewer cards advances. If even that is still even they draw lots. I've never seen it come to that but maybe it has?
I don't believe they've ever had to draw out of a hat or flip a coin before. Poked around quickly but couldn't find anything. And fair play tie breaker has only been needed a handful of times.
Looks like it was based off yellow/red cards?
Per https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_FIFA_World_Cup_Group_H#Discipline, Uruguay had 8 discipline points to South Korea's 5.
NM, I was wrong, Rif found his answer, it was total goals scored.
Scenarios for Group G:
- Brazil (v. Cameroon, +3 GD): Already guaranteed to advance. Will win the group unless Switzerland win and win tiebreakers
- Switzerland (v. Serbia, 0 GD): Advance with win OR draw + Cameroon fail to win (could still beat Cameroon on tiebreakers if Cameroon win)
- Cameroon (-1 GD): Advance with win + Switzerland loss (would have to beat Serbia on tiebreakers) or draw (would have to beat Switzerland on tiebreakers)
- Serbia (-2 GD): Advance with win + Cameroon fail to win (could still beat Cameroon on tiebreakers if Cameroon win)
so, basically, everyone except Brazil needs to win. I know Switzerland doesn't technically need to win but they probably wouldn't take their chances drawing a team that does need to win and hoping Brazil takes care of business. France, Spain and Portugal have all shown that there's no guarantee the better team will
win"take care of business" when they don't need to win to advance.EDIT: interestingly, not a single team (yet) has advanced on 9 points. Brazil could be the only team to go through with 3 wins in group stage. IDK if they would play for that because it's not really an official accomplishment. I do think Cameroon is the weakest team in that group, though, so the likelihood of Brazil drawing or losing is slim.
Swiss jumping out early w Shaqiri.
Switzerland lead 1-0 after a well-taken goal from Albanian-born Xherdan Shaqiri. No double-eagle symbol this time.
Serbia levels through an Alexander Mitrovic header. This could be a good one
And Vlahovic makes it 2-1. Lots of goals in this one. Switzerland missing their #1 keeper, Sommer, to illness.
Embolo levels for 2-2 Switzerland! Anyone want to play defense?
it's been a hell of a lot of fun to watch though
Switzerland went ahead 3-2 shortly after half. Currently going through
Hold up.....
Cameroon with a late winner from Aboubakar (who then gets sent off with a second yellow for celebration, lol) but still go out since Switzerland hang on to win. Brazil top, Swiss second.
The knockout are set - let's move discussion to this thread since this one is getting way too big.
I know it was a foolish send off on his part, but I think in that situation I'd maybe do the same.
Well, if I was ripped like him too.