HOKIES HOOPS CENTRAL: Virginia Tech (9-4) At Florida State (7-6) 4PM ACCN
First one of 2024 🎇🆚 Florida State🕓 4PM ET📺 ACCN📍 Tallahassee, Fla.#StoneByStone x #Hokies pic.twitter.com/pT82i9MlBT— Virginia Tech Men's Basketball (@HokiesMBB) January 6, 2024
Virginia Tech (9-4)
At Florida State (7-6)
January 6th, 2023
Donald L. Tucker Center
p.m. ET
ACCN
Virginia Tech Sports Network
ESPN+/ACCNX
Play-by-Play: Jay Alter
Analyst: Josh Pastner
Local Radio
Virginia Tech Sports Network
Play-by-Play: Zach Mackey
Analyst: Mike Burnop
Current Spread: Hokies -1.5
Over/Under: -144.5
Bring on the Noles 😤#StoneByStone x #Hokies pic.twitter.com/rVVhLZIZgc— Virginia Tech Men's Basketball (@HokiesMBB) January 6, 2024
Who controls the paint?
The Hokies head south to Florida State. The Hokies had no answer for Wake Forest inside, dropping a 86-63 dud to end the year. FSU's last game was an 82-71 win over Georgia Tech.
The Florida State Seminoles squad comes in 7-6. This will be the 61st meeting between the Hokies and Florida State. The Hokies are 24-36 but have won the last two with the win in Tallahassee in 2022 ending a thirteen-game losing streak on the road.
The Seminoles have been coached by Leonard Hamilton since 2002. Florida State is his fourth head coaching job including a one year stint as the Washington Wizards head coach. He also spent time as an assistant at Austin Peay and Kentucky from 1971-1986. The Seminoles come in 7-6 with only one Notable win over Colorado in OT. Their understandable losses were to Georgia, Florida and UNC. They also lost to SMU, USF, and Lipscomb which were quite ugly with USF and SMU both winning by double digits.
FSU lost two of their three top scorers to the transfer portal. Florida State returnees Darin Green Jr and Baba Miller are major contributors. The Seminoles also got three transfers in guards Josh Nickleberry from LaSalle and Primo Spears from Georgetown (winning the name to school name squad first team award), and forward Jamir Watkins from VCU. Watkins is a starter with Spears playing starter minutes off the bench and Nickleberry getting about 13 mpg. Four-star forward Taylor Bowen was their only freshman commit and has played in almost every game.
Spears missed the Seminoles first eight games waiting on his NCAA transfer waiver to be approved by the NCAA and was freed up by the recent court decision that allowed all transfers to play immediately.
The Seminoles Darin Green Jr is the only one playing more than 30 mpg. They have four players averaging more than 22 mpg but have seven more that regularly average at least 10 mpg. The starting five are Green, Watkins, Miller, Warley, and either De'Ante Green or Cameron Corhen. Spears and Cam'Ron Fletcher are the two primary subs off the bench.
Hamilton has the Noles playing a loose man-to-man defense focused on collapsing to the lane. His teams focus on preventing open shots, limiting dribble penetration and disrupting interior passes. They are very focused on positioning to get defensive rebounds and clogging the paint to prevent second chance opportunities. So far opponents have shot 33% from outside on 23 shots per game. They tend to lose perimeter coverage off screens and crossing runs along the baseline allowing open corner looks.
Offensively, the Seminoles prefer to get to the hoop or find an interior pass to a big. They average 23 threes attempted per game, shooting just over 33%. That average though is deceiving as they shot an extraordinary amount from outside in their first few games. Expect more in the 15-18 range of perimeter attempts. Dribble penetration by Green and Spears drives their offense. This isn't the forest of bigs that Florida State has typically had in years past but there will be one or two 6'10+ players on the floor at all times.
Seminoles Backcourt
Darin Green
22 SR G 6-4 180
12.8 Pts, 2.8 Reb, 0.8 Ast
Jalen Warley
1 JR G 6-6 200
6.8 Pts, 2.5 Reb, 2.4 Ast
Chandler Jackson
0 SO G 6-5 215
5.3 Pts, 1.2 Reb, 1.5 Ast
Primo Spears
23 JR G 6-3 185
12.0 Pts, 2.0 Reb, 2.2 Ast
Josh Nickelberry
20 SR G 6-4 205
4.1 Pts, 1.6 Reb, 0.5 Ast
Seminoles Frontcourt
Jamir Watkins
2 JR F 6-7 210
13.0 Pts, 6.2 Reb, 2.9 Ast
Baba Miller
11 SO F 6-11 204
7.5 Pts, 4.8 Reb, 1.3 Ast
De'Ante Green
5 SO F 6-10 210
6.8 Pts, 3.0 Reb, 0.7 Ast
Cameron Corhen
3 SO F 6-10 225
8.9 Pts, 3.9 Reb, 0.9 Ast
Cam'Ron Fletcher
21 SR F 6-6 215
6.7 Pts, 5.0 Reb, 1.0 Ast
Taylor Bol Bowen
10 FR F 6-10 195
2.9 Pts, 3.0 Reb, 0.4 Ast
What to expect from Florida State?
The Seminoles will alternate a three guard/two forward set versus two guard/three forward sets. Watkins is the swing forward so with him on the floor its typically a two guard/three forward set. They are led in scoring by the combo of Watkins and Green.
Green and Spears driving to the hoop creates most of the Seminoles offensive opportunities. Their dribble penetration force defenses to adjust to them. The Hokies cant afford to let these two dictate inside adjustments. Getting around screens cleanly or switching off will be crucial to success. Spears is coming off the bench but playing 25 mpg. He is like a change of pace back in football so Hokies need to be aware of him when he checks in.
The Noles have active hands, creating 15 turnovers and 9 steals per contest. They are quick to get guards into transition opportunities. Protecting the ball will be a critical factor to limit easy buckets.
FSU has played several real duds, struggling defensively to keep teams out of the paint. The more success the Hokies have inside the more FSU draws to the lane, leaving shooters open outside. Perimeter could be a rejuvenation game after several games struggling from outside for the Hokies.
The Seminoles have a heavy focus on getting defensive rebounds. That said there is very little difference in the rebounding averages this season. They allow 11.8 offensive rebounds per game and 12 second chance points.
The Hokies
Pulled up to the Tuck 🪣👀#StoneByStone x #Hokies pic.twitter.com/Zb3fSkhlUG— Virginia Tech Men's Basketball (@HokiesMBB) January 6, 2024
Can the Hokies put forth a better effort inside than they did against Wake? FSU while not as big inside as years past still has formidable size inside which proved too much for the Hokies to handle at Wake. I really would love to see Kidd and Poteat on the floor together but don't expect to see Young utilize that combination.
Last time at FSU 🏹🏹🔥Hunt and Sean 🤯🔥 47 points🔥 15-18 3FG pic.twitter.com/uGlXSTmSKj— Virginia Tech Men's Basketball (@HokiesMBB) January 2, 2024
The Hokies must get ten threes to fall to keep FSU honest or it will be another long game. FSU is susceptible to dribble penetration and overreacts in terms of collapsing inside. In moving to prevent lane possessions they lose track of perimeter shooters. Their losses to South Florida and Lipscomb saw those teams shoot 52% and 48% from outside respectively. Winthrop also shot 44% from outside in a game that they led FSU for the majority of the game.
The Noles struggle with fouls with five players averaging at least 2.8 per game. The Hokies have a great opportunity to get starters off the floor and get to the line if they can create opportunities for Kidd under the basket. The ability to work guards along the baseline is another area FSU has had a hard time defending and has led to reach in fouls or offside layups.
In Closing
Who dictates pace and space? The more the Hokies can get the Noles to adjust to them in the paint the more likely they come out of Tallahassee with a win. Forcing FSU to score outside of three feet is another major factor in getting a win. Controlling the paint unfortunately isn't a strong suit for the Hokies.
What kind of crowd can we expect? The student section will likely be nearly empty and watching two FSU games over the holidays it was kind of a ghost town crowd.
The Noles struggle against perimeter shooting teams that can pass the ball effectively around the perimeter. They lose though when they are forced to make baskets away from the hoop. In their six losses they only shot above 40% overall in one game. They only manage about 8 second chance points a game as well. They lose when they come away with no points on six out of ten possessions. Not really surprising when you see it like that. Bottom line: Contest shots and pack the lane.
Love seeing JRob still getting after it
Justin Robinson has taken things to another level in his past seven games 📈Catch Robinson and the @illawarrahawks in action in less than five minutes, live on ESPN via Kayo 📺 pic.twitter.com/V3XcnE0eL6— NBL (@NBL) January 5, 2024
Also a little Butts for Mutts
Nothing new here 😮💨🙆🏽♂️ J-Mutty showing off his bounce in the FIBA Asia Champions Cup! pic.twitter.com/ddwwK1TjqI— Virginia Tech Men's Basketball (@HokiesMBB) January 3, 2024
Comments
Coached by Steve Hamilton??
HOKIES!!!
Yeah missed replacing that. Good thing its not my day job
Can someone give a 3 sentence or less summary of the team this year? I'm still in football mode and probably won't start watching bball closely until after NSD.
Struggling to score inside against comparable bigs. Too many turnovers by Pedulla. Not athletic enough to contest teams in transition or with speed. Good assist to basket ratio. Inconsistent perimeter shooting. Great free throw shooting. Surprising ability to rebound.
Good to know! Do we have a plausible path to the tourney?
Plausible maybe, realistically I think we end up outside looking in
Letting FSU be really physical in the full court press doesnt bode well for Hokies
Just said that watching the game. No freedom of movement on offense the way they're grabbing and pushing on every cut.
Oh shit is Jrob playing professionally in Australia?? That doesn't sound like a bad situation.
Yep, 12.3 ppg and 4.3 apg for the Hawks this year
Nice hustle by Beran there
This is ugggggggly offense by VT
Game is kinda ugly in general
Cant handle the physicality of the constant pressure
They obviously watched the Wake film
I agree because FSU hasnt employed full court very often this season
Lot of uncalled contact when we're on offense
Always happens with us. When you don't have anyone who can drive the lane through contact you don't get to the line as often and refs seem to get more lax.
Why we end up getting called for ticky tack stuff on the other end I have no idea. I would assume it has to do with the opponent's offensive strategy against us
Mike Young teams from now to eternity are going to only be good when they knock down 3 point shots. That's his system. Don't shoot the ball well from 3, you lose. He is Doug McDermott light. He doesn't recruit as well, but it's the same premise. Knock down 3's- win. Don't- don't. It what we have to deal with.
I'm not a fan of that style of play either. But unfortunately there are several games this season where we still lose even if we shot the ball well from three.
That's my main problem with his system
Both of these are due to a lack of athleticism. Not quick enough to create off the dribble on offense and always a half-step late on defense leading to fouls.
MJ collins looking like a different dude. Way more confident.
Lynn Kidd getting contact from three players at once and no call
very physical game with few whistles
Hopefully they get used to it as I expect this more and more from ACC. other than when you play at Duke or at UNC
Had to be offensive goaltend
edit: slo mo looked clean
Cattoor signalled for timeout twice before the jump ball was called
There's just no way that's how the end of the half play was supposed to go. Man, that was ugly.
Seems to happen to us in every game at the end of half. Hate being so negative on the basketball board this year but we don't do much very well. Screaming at the TV before half every game because we don't even get a good shot off
yeah when Bar asked for the three sentence summary I wanted to be positive but just couldnt. You cant point to anything but free throw shooting as being above par.
Long gets grabbed by both hands going up on that transition drive but nope. Side out
Really surprised FSU hasnt doubled the ball handlers after the inbounds on the full court press
We get into transition 1v1 and back out...just shows zero confidence on being able to finish
Pedulla is a bit reckless
Pedulla gets poked in face driving but no whistle. Immediate whistle on other end.
Every single shooting foul called against us and Lynn can't get a foul to save his life banging bodies down low
Collins wasnt even looking at the ball
Kidd was all by himself for two seconds and waited for defender to get between him and basket... and then turns it over
That was baffling.
You just can't be this fundamentally bad and devoid of athletes in year five.
Seriously!? Bodies and minor hand slaps called against us and it's not happening on the other end now. This is such bs man.
Long airballing a FT is peak gamer
Dropped three straight rebounds turned into points by FSU. Just sloppy all around
egregious lack of calls on the guys pounding cattoor
then ticky tack other way... our guys being trucked by defenders no call
WTF was that... how many times did Miller hit him with the ball. Six? Seven?
this is mind boggling to watch. The reffing is nothing close to even
And Lynn brushes him and it's a shooting foul
What a load of horseshit.
We cant get boards on missed foul shots. how is that possible
I've honestly never seen a sequence like that
We will win. Ugly as shit but will win.
Don't think so but like your optimism
lol jk this team is complete trash and coach young is just a decent coach. Im sick of consistent mediocrity being the acceptable norm.
Now this I can get behind!
As many non calls as there were in first half is as many FSU calls have happened in last five minutes
pedulla just got teucked... no call into a dunk
Elbow in his ear.
Thats what I get for saying one nice thing about free throw shooting....they have crapped the bed at the line today
Shit the bed late
Honestly, what is there to look forward to this season. We have the least athletic team in the ACC, and running an offense that doesn't mesh with the players we are putting on the court. CMY can only hope we begin to figure it out or hit the portal hard this offseason. I know Whit won't get rid of him after this year but man, this is bad so far.
Yeah if you cant beat this team, who are you going beat the rest of the way?
Keep the press on...its working
Good lord nickel
Since when can you call a timeout in the middle of foul shots
press the inbounds please
Nope
Cost them the game
Bullshit
Terrible call with game on the line
Never touched him
What is the fucking point of playing the game with calls like that?
I guess the plan was to just let them win the game with a layup or hope they miss it and go to overtime.
#GoACC officiating
Absolutely no resistance - let him run the length of the court. Unbelievable.
Mike young oblivious that the clock started early, already in the handshake like while his players are on the court chasing down the officials. Way to go coach
Just embarrassing to lose this game. Did nothing right consistently
I feel the sun is setting on the Mike Young era. Great cultural fit and face of the program, but roster management and scheme is very Fuente like.
At least the refs were worse than us.. I will not watch another mens game this season but LETS GO LADY HOKIES tomorrow and get that huge win at home.
The refs have been worse with the women's team when in marquee games, going back to the loss in the final 4 if last year. We'll never get the calls over the e$pn darlings.
But boy, what a story line and click-bait opportunity it would be for e$pn if they would capitalize on the Hokies first team bcaa championship
We lost because we are a bad basketball team (I don't think CMY is cut out for P5 basketball), however, these officials shouldn't be allowed on a high school court.
Technically clock started way early but it doesnt matter
Fucked by refs twice in 2 seconds at the end.
The least they can do is buy us dinner amirite???
What's this new rule about blocking fouls being called almost automatically? One of the commentators kept mentioning something along those lines.
Unless the defender is set before the offensive player begins the act of shooting it is a block now. So defender can be set in a defending position when contact happens but officials will lean towards it being a block unless they were set before the ballhandler takes a dribble toward the basket. All depends on what the official defines as "act of shooting" It really is a stupid rule. They claim they did it for player safety but it's result is all about adding points.
Yup all it would take is a help defender coming over to trap/double at half court and disrupt the ball handler. You cant let him go coast to coast. Basketball 101.
It's the same thing everywhere, almost every sport. Tilt the table however necessary for points, dunks, TDs, etc. It's so blatantly artificial it just sucks the real joy out of the sport.
I'm proud of the our effort in coming back to tie it. Shame that the refs decided to not let the players decide the game, but the foul was BS, there was no contact.
Also, why didn't we press the inbounds? It had been working so well!
Still, Go Hokies!
Another in game strategy blunder by Young and his staff. Gets old. Young is so risk adverse that he preferred to rely on them screwing up rather than challenging them to create it. Didn't even need a hard press, just a screening action to slow the dribble.
We a Football skool....
...again
It is very hard to win a basketball game when the team is playing against themselves (bad free throws), the other team and the refs. Two out of the three and we win that game, against all three and we lost.
Those refs that the announcers were gushing over for most of the game should never be allowed to ref an elementary school match let alone any type of real game. It was amazing how often our players were punched, slapped, or elbowed in the FACE for no calls. I counted at least four.
We have seen this scenario enough times regarding the ref's allowing our opponents to be very chippy and aggressive, but call fouls on us when we breathe or fart near them. IMO, this happens too much. The delta between what's a foul and when it's a foul cannot be chalked up to coincidence or fan goggles playing tricks on our eyes. There seems to be some sort of unwritten rule when officiating a VT game. The two different versions of officiating cannot be ignored. It's bizarre.
Squeaky repetitive gear gets the grease and unfortunately I doubt Young squeaks at all. If they were sending tapes after every game with all the questionable calls I think you would see things normalize. I guarantee that Leonard Hamilton has his staff putting a tape together asking for more calls in their favor.
IMO it is our lack of athleticism that leads us to be a step slow and more handsy on defense. Not necessarily physical but being out of position bc we are slower than our opponents.
They may be more physical, but are in better positions defensively bc we aren't athletic enough to get around/away from them and force a foul call
Who cares what happens to this team?
Young Built a team that would be okay- at Wofford.
He's built a mid-major team at an acc school and has ran any semblance of "talent" out of the door:
See:
Cone
Buchanan
Rice
Maddox
Etc
Won't watch another Game under the mike young era- complete waste of time.
Maddux was not run off, he had family reasons to go closer to home
Cone was like 5'4", was not going to cut it at all ACC program.
I think it was five foot seven, the same height as Georgia Amoore.
Watch the Sons of Saturday 3 point contest video where she is standing next to Hunter Cattoor. He's a giant next to her. He is also on the short end for ACC guards.
Cone wanted to be the primary ball handler and that was never going to happen. If he would have stuck to being a shooting guard he likely would have had a successful time at Tech if he continued defensive improvements. Guy has continued to put up buckets everywhere he has gone.
Has shot above or near 35% from three every season and improved his inside scoring since his freshman season so overall above 41% from the floor.
He is putting in 14.3 ppg, 2.4apg, 2.1rpg this season at California. Has shot over 80% from the line every season.
I balanced out your downvote, because this is true, although I don't think CMY is "running players out the door." I think he is having trouble keeping talent (and I have a theory), but to your initial point, CMY has built a G-5 team in Blacksburg because that is the type of coach he is. He is a career .500 coach who happens to be an amazing person and someone who fits in very well here in Blacksburg.
While the Hokies are bad at least we aren't Loserville.
Missing tights, player announced in portal by school but refuted by player and now this...
Kenny Payne seeking walk ons mid season to fill the roster...
Louisville has seven active scholarship players available at this point.
This team needs some athleticism. We have system guys, but nobody that will wow you. defense played well outside of a series of offensive rebounds, the offense is just missing that spark.
You mean like this
But Young wouldn't let him on the floor....
Infuriating. And he says the freshmen can't get on the floor until they can play defense. Yet, he loves to joke that hunter cattoor, who has played since day 1, "couldn't guard me when he got here." His refusal to put athletic young players on the floor is leading to their departure and forcing us to bring in mediocre older transfers to generate production. If he'd just developed these guys from the outset we'd be in far better position. I think we finish near the bottom of the ACC this year. And next year without cattoor is going to be really bad.
Overall I agree with your point about MY not playing guys who aren't in synch on the defensive end, but specifically in regards to Catoor I don't think he had much of a choice but to play him since there were so few players on the roster when he got here.
also Cattoor was a reserve as a freshman. Naheim Alleyne started
Young has put in an official complaint over the clock mismanagement and the refs over the end of the FSU game.
Those darned refs, that darned coach...but we couldn't make lay ups...but those darned refs, that darned coach...but we couldn't make foul shots...but those darned refs, that darned coach...
None of it helps, right?
One hundred percent the foul shots killed us. We normally shoot better than that and it would have made the difference. However that darned coach had to submit game film to the NCAA about those darned Refs because they screwed up.
Had we not gone on a heater a couple years ago and won the ACC Tournament, I'm not sure Young is the coach right now. The team is not physical enough to really contend from a game to game basis in this conference. We will always have shooters, and if they get hot, we have a chance to win any game, but that's pretty much all of our strategy.
But one of the big issues I have with Tech basketball is that we have some of the same issues present that we've had since the Ricky Stokes years, and its like we never learn from a program level. Primary thing is, in this league you don't go to the foul line if you don't consistently drive the paint and drive to the basket. That's where you draw calls in the ACC. And so many games we spend time bitching and moaning about foul discrepancies when we've been a perimeter shooting team going up against one that drives to the hoop, as if we want the refs to change when we should have 20+ years of evidence that we're the ones who need to change.
Not only that we are a team that has coached how to take a charge and they have literally changed the rules to basically not call charges anymore.