So...while we are all suspecting something is amiss in the VT BBall Program (maybe it still is); looking thru the 2024 Transfer Portal Tracker...we are only one of a number of major conference teams with 3+ players in the Portal.
Louisville, USCw, Stanford, Miami, Arkansas, Vanderbilt all have multiple players in the TP, most of them in the top-100 and higher-ranked than any VT player other than Kidd.
Hell, Stanford has 3 of the top 6 rated players in the Portal by themselves.
So maybe this is just the "new normal" of the scummy NIL practice. Enter the Portal every year...see if you can get a bigger bag or at least get your current team to match what someone else offers you.
Pedulla's Tweet made it pretty clear that there isn't bad blood involved in his decision.
NIL just keeps getting better and better.
Edit:
Also, it seems worse for us because CMY has struggled to develop depth (I do think a legitimate criticism is his inability to trust his bench) and that he didn't exactly light the world on fire in the Portal this year...Nickel may develop but has a ways to go, Beran was disappointing and Long was a glue-guy at best and injured.
Edit #2: TBF Louisville is a dumpster fire and Stanford and Vandy both have fired coaches. USC's coach may be leaving.
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My oversimplified theory on all the transfers so far:
Pedulla: I have to do everything and its annoying (and I want a bag)
Kidd: I think I'm way better than I actually am because of those 10 minute stretches here and there where I dominate (and I want a bag)
Collins: People think I can't shoot so I'm gonna go somewhere and put up 20 shots a game to prove that I can (I want a bag, but probably can't get a heavy one)
Poteat: I wanna dominate at a lower level cause POTEAT NEED TO EAT (bag optional)
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the budget of Triumph? I mean, idk what the OP meant, but the collectives should have an operating budget and set a budget in the pay-to-play portion of NIL. And yes, the pay-to-play portion of NIL is stupid and complete misrepresentation of NIL. And yes the people of Kentucky pay way more of their dollars, despite being poor, into their collective's NIL resulting in a bigger budget.
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I suspect it might be after the surge in football NIL in December. That money had to come from somewhere. Also expect they ponied up for Kitley and King to stay for this season with some catch up happening now. This is probably the base "guarantee" money not accounting for merch sales/direct businesses affiliating marketing with specific athletes.
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there is no budget for NIL. we need to stop referencing NIL in most cases, and anything related to our collectives needs to be called what it really is...Pay for Play (PFP)
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Yes. that's what I was getting at. The schools are not "supposed" to be paying these kids. NIL is Caitlin Clark and her agent scoring a deal for her from Iowa Corn independent of the school. That's what these players bitched about for years. But in 5 seconds that turned into Whit rationing salaries to players. Fucking shit show.
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And this is what I meant when I said VT either goes to the P2 or the athletic department dies.
Financially we can't compete without equal revenue streams. And more and more we appear to be choosing to defund everything except football to hold onto whatever threads are still left. And even then, we cannot financially keep pace in football, either.
And yes, I know that NIL is separate, but when you have revenue streams as strong as you do in the P2 you don't need fundraising to keep the lights on. You send all of those efforts to NIL purposes which gives you a massive leg up in the game.
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Players on full ride scholarships at major universities getting of the chartered plane in Air Jordans and Beats by dre 400 dollar headphones were called slave labor. Coaches were chided for actually getting paid a salary instead. This is the result. Professional sports in the matter of 5 seconds because emotional decision were made and not a real plan.
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Everyone was sooo concerned about these "poor athletes"--many of whom were living better and had many more free benefits than the average student that we jumped to just throwing cash at them.
Meanwhile, in backrooms, ESPN, the SEC and B1G as well as a host of other middlemen were figuring out how to make NIL work for them--to create more money and more power for them.
And now we have what we have--a completely unregulated shitshow that is completely lopsided and unsustainable.
The funniest thing to me about this whole process is there are still people who think the long-term outcome of this for players to be awarded fair profit-share agreement once the bottom falls out.
Ha---fucking---ha. Athletes are never getting more than an absolute crumb if that TV money--its the whole point of having NIL is to have private citzens subsidize paying off 17 year olds. The "real money" has already been earmarked for yachts, luxury watches and sportscars for TV execs and college admins.
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Amen. What I laugh at is the people that argue Lane will be packed on a Saturday in the world of salary caps, holdouts, trade deadlines, players being cut mid week, players making more than professors, freshman being paid more than the people in the stands working. Yep, VT football will always be as popular as ever if that happens.
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It's probably not accurate to call a supreme court decision an emotional decision. But sure, all 9 justices were unanimously emotional to allow NCAA players to earn money via their name, image and likeness.
And this is what happens during any major shifting supreme court decision. It's chaos until further court cases, congressional law, regulations, etc. are put into place.
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"to allow NCAA players to earn money via their name, image and likeness." - awesome good for the judges. That is not what we are talking about here, and that is not what is happening - which is why it will be challenged. Unless you believe the lie that a car dealership on it's own offered Linn Kidd- a mid college player not known outside of the VT fanbase - an endorsement deal. If you believe that, I can't help you.
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Yeah I don't get why people are mad at the SCOTUS decision, that's not the issue. Fundamentally, I have no issues allowing a student athlete or anyone for that matter to profit from their own name, image, and likeness. The problem is that the regulatory body here, the NCAA, instead of establishing a framework, rules, compliance, and enforcement around NIL has basically said "fuck it" and thrown their hands up, turning college athletics into the Wild West and a total market failure.
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The NCAA bears a ton of blame here because they made zero effort to get out ahead of this.
But to be fair, every effort they have made to try to do anything to reign this back in has been met by losses in court. The Legal System has essentially told the NCAA they can do nothing and that chaos is the best route going forward.
Essentially court decisions at this point have made it such that ( 1 ) NIL can be used in a direct pay-for-play method ( 2 ) Transfers are completely unrestricted.
The CFB Portal opens back up in April...don't be shocked if not great things happen to our Roster.
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The issue isn't the NCAA per se, the issue is that the NCAA was never designed to run professional sports. You have to have some real collective agreement among the collegiate institutions, and with the collegiate athletes that provides a centralized agency that governs an agreeable revenue sharing, spending cap, and roster rules. It's an impossible task based on the real differences between the collegiate universities and the various needs of different sports. I think the solution will require setting up unique agencies for different sports and for different competition levels.
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I don't know about yall, but this whole shit has got me about ready to check out on hoops. I'll probably watch next season, but if we have an entire roster flip again, I'm out.
I'm not interested in watching a squad of all new, random faces each year just cause they got a VT jersey on for one season.
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I heard Young and Co. broke the news to the team on what NIL they were getting and then the team immediately began to "shop around". I heard it was really a dollars and cents thing and some of them will be coming back after the waters are tested.
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Basketball NIL is basically non-existent, with all NIL resources going toward football primarily. Think about how a few months ago our fanbase was so jubilant that we retained our entire football roster and added some much sought-after transfers with lucrative NIL offerings. We held off big P2 programs from poaching Delane and even convinced Strong to stay and forego the NFL. Also think about now with the spring portal window in April, we need to keep a lot of dry powder to prevent additional poaching efforts and pick up additional transfers as needed. We are extremely competitive with football NIL because that's where the focus is, to the detriment of basketball. This is what going "all-in" on football looks like, and IMO it's the right move until the P2 ship has sailed.
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Well great, let's re-set our expectations then. No big dance, mire at the bottom of the ACC, not make the new "ACC" tourney with the expanded conference. Root for our team until Feb 28th- not march. That is the expectation if you are going all in on football.
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While UK is obviously a basketball blueblood, the reality of SEC membership is that you can have your cake and eat it too (they don't have to choose between hoops and football). UK football has been on the come up, and they made Stoops one of the top-10 highest paid coaches.
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No such thing. Horses are a prestige hobby for people with money throw away and things to compensate for. But Most of what you see racing in the derby has little connection to the state of Kentucky. Horses are a financial black hole, not a revenue generator. Aside from a couple wealthy donors who happen to have horses, I doubt very seriously that horse money is a source of revenue for UK.
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Serious question. Tyler Nikel- 6th man type, stretch 3/4, not a great defender, hasn't really proven anything beyond nice guy off the bench. Seriously what bag man is coming for him? Is there really a demand out there?
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Bingo - Kidd got a bag and because VT basketball NIL is bad, everyone thinks they are worth more than they are on the open market. From the VT perspective, would you rather sink your dry powder into football where you have momentum and real potential to jump back into the national scene and make you more attractive for the P2, achieving long term financial security? Or sink money into retaining a MBB roster that 19-15, 2-10 on the road at the detriment of football? Even if we won two back-to-back nattys in MBB or WBB it's not changing the long-term financial picture or moving the P2 needle. Short term pain, long term gain.
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Comments
Long and Beran should be marked as OOE I believe
Thanks, I had a tough time looking up who walked on senior night.
Only remaining scholarships are Rechsteiner, Young, Wessler, Nickel with Commits Ryan Jones and Tyler Johnson
We can offer lots of playing time for all portal candidates.
So...while we are all suspecting something is amiss in the VT BBall Program (maybe it still is); looking thru the 2024 Transfer Portal Tracker...we are only one of a number of major conference teams with 3+ players in the Portal.
Louisville, USCw, Stanford, Miami, Arkansas, Vanderbilt all have multiple players in the TP, most of them in the top-100 and higher-ranked than any VT player other than Kidd.
Hell, Stanford has 3 of the top 6 rated players in the Portal by themselves.
So maybe this is just the "new normal" of the scummy NIL practice. Enter the Portal every year...see if you can get a bigger bag or at least get your current team to match what someone else offers you.
Pedulla's Tweet made it pretty clear that there isn't bad blood involved in his decision.
NIL just keeps getting better and better.
Edit:
Also, it seems worse for us because CMY has struggled to develop depth (I do think a legitimate criticism is his inability to trust his bench) and that he didn't exactly light the world on fire in the Portal this year...Nickel may develop but has a ways to go, Beran was disappointing and Long was a glue-guy at best and injured.
Edit #2: TBF Louisville is a dumpster fire and Stanford and Vandy both have fired coaches. USC's coach may be leaving.
3.19 players per team last year in the portal. This is the new normal.
I doubt it's 3.19 of the starting 5 though. Bench players prob make up most of that correct?
My oversimplified theory on all the transfers so far:
Pedulla: I have to do everything and its annoying (and I want a bag)
Kidd: I think I'm way better than I actually am because of those 10 minute stretches here and there where I dominate (and I want a bag)
Collins: People think I can't shoot so I'm gonna go somewhere and put up 20 shots a game to prove that I can (I want a bag, but probably can't get a heavy one)
Poteat: I wanna dominate at a lower level cause POTEAT NEED TO EAT (bag optional)
Rumor I saw on the tweeter is that Miami has offered $650K
19.2% of minutes played and 15.7% of total scoring returning right now. 84% of scoring is gone for now.
So we uh, we playing basketball next year or...
We moving to the Big 3 league.
They offered Caitlin Clark $5M, we can't afford the Big3
So our WBB coach leaves and we lose half our Men's roster?
No, nothing is wrong here.
If losing half the mens roster means we keep more of the womens, I will be ok with that
I'll second that.
yeah... you will not be OK.
I hate to say it, but I think I'd have sold the men's team in order to keep Kenny Brooks and the women's team.
Absolutely 💯
I meant to post this here instead of the Poteat transfer thread:
That was after Rodney left, I think?
Yep, maybe it still applies - time will tell
college sports aren't fun anymore :(
This can't be accurate, can it?
Budget? LMAO. I thought NIL was not paid for by VT? What "budget" is this?
the budget of Triumph? I mean, idk what the OP meant, but the collectives should have an operating budget and set a budget in the pay-to-play portion of NIL. And yes, the pay-to-play portion of NIL is stupid and complete misrepresentation of NIL. And yes the people of Kentucky pay way more of their dollars, despite being poor, into their collective's NIL resulting in a bigger budget.
Maybe we are cheating like you've wanted and we're just bad at it
I suspect it might be after the surge in football NIL in December. That money had to come from somewhere. Also expect they ponied up for Kitley and King to stay for this season with some catch up happening now. This is probably the base "guarantee" money not accounting for merch sales/direct businesses affiliating marketing with specific athletes.
Maybe they should have kept some money for Brooks.
there is no budget for NIL. we need to stop referencing NIL in most cases, and anything related to our collectives needs to be called what it really is...Pay for Play (PFP)
Yes. that's what I was getting at. The schools are not "supposed" to be paying these kids. NIL is Caitlin Clark and her agent scoring a deal for her from Iowa Corn independent of the school. That's what these players bitched about for years. But in 5 seconds that turned into Whit rationing salaries to players. Fucking shit show.
And this is what I meant when I said VT either goes to the P2 or the athletic department dies.
Financially we can't compete without equal revenue streams. And more and more we appear to be choosing to defund everything except football to hold onto whatever threads are still left. And even then, we cannot financially keep pace in football, either.
And yes, I know that NIL is separate, but when you have revenue streams as strong as you do in the P2 you don't need fundraising to keep the lights on. You send all of those efforts to NIL purposes which gives you a massive leg up in the game.
Players on full ride scholarships at major universities getting of the chartered plane in Air Jordans and Beats by dre 400 dollar headphones were called slave labor. Coaches were chided for actually getting paid a salary instead. This is the result. Professional sports in the matter of 5 seconds because emotional decision were made and not a real plan.
Nail on head.
Everyone was sooo concerned about these "poor athletes"--many of whom were living better and had many more free benefits than the average student that we jumped to just throwing cash at them.
Meanwhile, in backrooms, ESPN, the SEC and B1G as well as a host of other middlemen were figuring out how to make NIL work for them--to create more money and more power for them.
And now we have what we have--a completely unregulated shitshow that is completely lopsided and unsustainable.
The funniest thing to me about this whole process is there are still people who think the long-term outcome of this for players to be awarded fair profit-share agreement once the bottom falls out.
Ha---fucking---ha. Athletes are never getting more than an absolute crumb if that TV money--its the whole point of having NIL is to have private citzens subsidize paying off 17 year olds. The "real money" has already been earmarked for yachts, luxury watches and sportscars for TV execs and college admins.
Amen. What I laugh at is the people that argue Lane will be packed on a Saturday in the world of salary caps, holdouts, trade deadlines, players being cut mid week, players making more than professors, freshman being paid more than the people in the stands working. Yep, VT football will always be as popular as ever if that happens.
It's probably not accurate to call a supreme court decision an emotional decision. But sure, all 9 justices were unanimously emotional to allow NCAA players to earn money via their name, image and likeness.
And this is what happens during any major shifting supreme court decision. It's chaos until further court cases, congressional law, regulations, etc. are put into place.
"to allow NCAA players to earn money via their name, image and likeness." - awesome good for the judges. That is not what we are talking about here, and that is not what is happening - which is why it will be challenged. Unless you believe the lie that a car dealership on it's own offered Linn Kidd- a mid college player not known outside of the VT fanbase - an endorsement deal. If you believe that, I can't help you.
Apologies, what emotional decision are you referring to?
The Supreme Court has been bought and paid for and its been this way for a very long time
It was 9-0 decision... try again.
Cause they're all just the uniparty, maaaaan.
/sssss
Just like the science behind the va.... just kidding that's "political" and not to be posted here lol.
why
Yeah I don't get why people are mad at the SCOTUS decision, that's not the issue. Fundamentally, I have no issues allowing a student athlete or anyone for that matter to profit from their own name, image, and likeness. The problem is that the regulatory body here, the NCAA, instead of establishing a framework, rules, compliance, and enforcement around NIL has basically said "fuck it" and thrown their hands up, turning college athletics into the Wild West and a total market failure.
The NCAA bears a ton of blame here because they made zero effort to get out ahead of this.
But to be fair, every effort they have made to try to do anything to reign this back in has been met by losses in court. The Legal System has essentially told the NCAA they can do nothing and that chaos is the best route going forward.
Essentially court decisions at this point have made it such that ( 1 ) NIL can be used in a direct pay-for-play method ( 2 ) Transfers are completely unrestricted.
The CFB Portal opens back up in April...don't be shocked if not great things happen to our Roster.
The issue isn't the NCAA per se, the issue is that the NCAA was never designed to run professional sports. You have to have some real collective agreement among the collegiate institutions, and with the collegiate athletes that provides a centralized agency that governs an agreeable revenue sharing, spending cap, and roster rules. It's an impossible task based on the real differences between the collegiate universities and the various needs of different sports. I think the solution will require setting up unique agencies for different sports and for different competition levels.
Brooks is getting a five million budget for staff, assistants and NIL. I thought Coaches/Schools weren't supposed to be paying for players.
Does anyone actually believe schools aren't paying for players at this point.
lolololol - of fucking course they are.
leg for the graphic
Cross out Nickel
I'm on it. Gotta wait until after bedtime!
I don't know about yall, but this whole shit has got me about ready to check out on hoops. I'll probably watch next season, but if we have an entire roster flip again, I'm out.
I'm not interested in watching a squad of all new, random faces each year just cause they got a VT jersey on for one season.
I had finally figured out how to pronounce Kevin Poteat's first name.... Damn it all to hell.
I hate this, but I feel like this image deserves to be in this thread
He is out of eligibility and if Brooks wants to hire him as staff or an assistant coach I have no problem with that.
Sure hope he has a orange and maroon shirt under that blue one. Not a good look.
Something is rotten in Blacksburg
"I love my job...Boss, I have three other offers from other companies, what can you do to make me stay?"
If those 3 offers in the real world are real/legit- then you do have more leverage than you will ever have, so yeah ask for that raise/promotion, etc.
I heard Young and Co. broke the news to the team on what NIL they were getting and then the team immediately began to "shop around". I heard it was really a dollars and cents thing and some of them will be coming back after the waters are tested.
Basketball NIL is basically non-existent, with all NIL resources going toward football primarily. Think about how a few months ago our fanbase was so jubilant that we retained our entire football roster and added some much sought-after transfers with lucrative NIL offerings. We held off big P2 programs from poaching Delane and even convinced Strong to stay and forego the NFL. Also think about now with the spring portal window in April, we need to keep a lot of dry powder to prevent additional poaching efforts and pick up additional transfers as needed. We are extremely competitive with football NIL because that's where the focus is, to the detriment of basketball. This is what going "all-in" on football looks like, and IMO it's the right move until the P2 ship has sailed.
This is also why the Kenny Brooks press conference at kentucky referenced "Happy to be at a Basketball First School"
Well great, let's re-set our expectations then. No big dance, mire at the bottom of the ACC, not make the new "ACC" tourney with the expanded conference. Root for our team until Feb 28th- not march. That is the expectation if you are going all in on football.
Seems like the best play from a shitty hand, no? Push all your chips in on football in the hopes that you can attract P2 attention.
While UK is obviously a basketball blueblood, the reality of SEC membership is that you can have your cake and eat it too (they don't have to choose between hoops and football). UK football has been on the come up, and they made Stoops one of the top-10 highest paid coaches.
In a state that can't fund public utilities...unlimited money.
My wife (Wildcat, from KY) likes to remind me that UK has that "racehorse money".
No such thing. Horses are a prestige hobby for people with money throw away and things to compensate for. But Most of what you see racing in the derby has little connection to the state of Kentucky. Horses are a financial black hole, not a revenue generator. Aside from a couple wealthy donors who happen to have horses, I doubt very seriously that horse money is a source of revenue for UK.
"Basketball first school" KY football coach Mark Stoops makes $9 million a year. "All-in on football" VT pays their football coach $4 million a year.
lol. exactly.
Before the bag men came calling
Serious question. Tyler Nikel- 6th man type, stretch 3/4, not a great defender, hasn't really proven anything beyond nice guy off the bench. Seriously what bag man is coming for him? Is there really a demand out there?
IMO theres a real possibility he goes back to UNC
Bingo - Kidd got a bag and because VT basketball NIL is bad, everyone thinks they are worth more than they are on the open market. From the VT perspective, would you rather sink your dry powder into football where you have momentum and real potential to jump back into the national scene and make you more attractive for the P2, achieving long term financial security? Or sink money into retaining a MBB roster that 19-15, 2-10 on the road at the detriment of football? Even if we won two back-to-back nattys in MBB or WBB it's not changing the long-term financial picture or moving the P2 needle. Short term pain, long term gain.
He shot 39% from three. There will be schools willing to cut a check simply for that.
The fact that this is still the headline article on TKP is pretty funny
"HOW MIKE YOUNG CAN GET VIRGINIA TECH'S GROOVE BACK"
By cleaning house?.....
Updated with recent portal news. Let me know if I missed someone.
Crazy we're gonna almost have a brand new roster next year
Yeah 9 of 13 if Pedulla and Camden don't return
assuming we even find 13 bodies