I don't think the losingest team in FBS history is regretting extending their coach who won the most games in a single season in school history and brought them to the playoffs. Especially since that coach comes from the Saban tree and has never had a losing season as a head coach. His career record is 130-37. Guys who win for a long time at all different levels and calibers of schools win.
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Don't worry they'll use the Indiana performance as some kind of referendum against schools in the ACC and BigXII to ensure we get even fewer bids going forward.
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I don't have a quote, but before the comeback McDonough was basically stating that he had seen enough playoff and that going forward the committee needs to emphasize strength of record (i.e. Alabama, or at least another SEC team probably should have gotten in over Indiana).
I'm not willing to group him into the "sensible, and definitely not just hot takes & stanning the SEC" category anytime soon.
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Kirk Herbstreit just said Indiana "didn't belong on the field" last night because "they didn't beat anybody."Pat McAfee added SMU "better show up today" because they have no rank wins either.Meanwhile, Texas is also without a ranked win and wasn't brought up this way. Weird🤔— Josh Graham (@JoshGrahamShow) December 21, 2024
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Tennessee wasn't outclassed. They were a team that earned the right to be on the field even when you consider other teams that could've been there. The same goes for Indiana. They both had an off night at the wrong time regardless of what conference they play in.— Robert Griffin III (@RGIII) December 22, 2024
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How awesome was that environment last night? You know ESPN has to love it from the presentation perspective.
This current format feels wacky that the 4 teams with byes don't get to play at home. If VT makes the playoffs Id rather be the 5 seed than 1-4 just to experience a post season Lane Stadium environment.
I would really like to see the format change to the first 2 rounds on campus sites. 3 rounds of neutral site games is too much.
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I totally agree, but the big bowls want to be a part of the playoff. I think the home environments are way more exciting for the playoffs though. Move the semis to bowls if you must but the first two rounds should be at home stadiums I agree.
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Get rid of the bowls. Such a money drain for the majority of them. That or force the bowls to cover ALL team expenses, especially since they are non-profit organizations.
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I personally think the bowls should be moved to the opening weekend of the regular season. That's basically what has started happening with these big kickoff games at neutral sites. Bowls just make no sense with a large playoff format. Ridiculous to travel to three neutral site games in the span of less than a month.
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Gonna have to move that Army/Navy game up a week... or two... make that part of rivalry weekend and make it count from a conference standing standpoint.
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Everything else has been modernized in the sport to the point that tradition, development, and loyalty dont matter at all. The only things that remain are the bowls and rankings, and both need to go. Drop the bowl games, focus on the playoffs, and have the national championship (or even the semifinals) be hosted at a neutral site. If you're the "home" team you should be playing at home for at least one game.
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Man I see where Pry gets his excellent game management decision-making from. Franklin going for it on fourth and long and turning it over giving SMU decent field position.
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Prepare for the SEC/B1G both "deserve" 4 Autobids argument...
The thing that drives me insane about this argument from the SEC/big 10 that's just redundant – if you're so good, and so confident in yourself, then you don't need bids - you'll get them every year.
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But that's really their angle. Its not about competition...its about eliminating it.
If we've learned anything from the first few games of the CFP, its that there aren't really 12 teams with any legitimate shot at winning the Championship (or even advancing for that matter) so arguing over the last 2-3 teams in is really a waste of energy.
But the perception of having more "deserving" teams is valuable to Conferences in terms of prestige and the almighty TV $$$ which has really become the only thing that actually matters from a macro perspective.
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Yeah it really angers me. SMU had a shit day and got blown out - that happens. Their QB crumbled under the cold and the environment and his OL did him no favors. That stuff happens. But they were absolutely more deserving than some 3 loss SEC team IMO. Don't care that it just means more" or whatever in the SEC.
I hate that the networks start these narratives because you're right - at the end of the day this is all about $$$ and nothing more. They want to contrive these big time matchups for ratings and think big brand teams will bring in more eyeballs and give them a higher chance of a really close game. But sometimes teams just have a bad day and get blown out. I remember just a few years ago a heavyweight national title game between Bama and Ohio State, and Bama blew the doors off OSU. Was OSU not deserving? Clemson blew the doors off Bama in the title game in 2018, I guess Bama wasn't deserving then either.
Just put the teams in there and let it play out. I just hate the networks always scheming for more $ and ratings.
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I'm seeing a lot of the same game management errors with PSU as we see with Tech. Questionable calls to go for it on fourth, and when the offense is driving and has momentum, a random trick/gadget play out of nowhere that almost backfired horribly.
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This would be a tight game if SMU's QB didn't make some god awful decisions under pressure. You can tell coach told him to throw it away instead of forcing it after his 100th interception this game. 21 points off turnovers...yikes
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I noticed the same. Pretty clear he's not used to this kind of environment, and the neither are the coaches otherwise they would have had them better prepared.
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I can't watch Texas or Oklahoma on tv because they play their stupid ass fight songs after every play. Texas playing "I've been working on the railroad" would be the dumbest thing that ever happened in a football game if it weren't for UVA.
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Yes , the warchant is the worst, and it's constant.
The gator chomp is pretty annoying too.
And then those idiots down there in Auburn screaming "war damn eagle" all the time.
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Yep. Clemson (being ACC) is suffering a similar fate as we are. And I agree Dabo's hard headed stubborn refusal to adjust to the current college football environment is catching up to Clemson.
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Agreed. Except for my Pastor, who is indeed the real deal, is a huge Clemson fan so I feel for him.
Only (and I mean only reason) I pull for Clemson is that we are tied at the hip (thanks to a shitty TV contract) to them and need some semblance of respectability out of the ACC. At least until we get our own act straightened out and take the conference back.
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So SMU gone (which yeah I get is technically ACC, thanks Jim Phillips you little twerp) and Clemson gone. So now the nearest claim to fame the ACC has to root for is Notre Dame. 🙄🙄
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I say all first and second round playoff games played at home stadiums. Way more electric playoff atmosphere than bowls. The only three bowls that should be involved are the Sugar, Orange, and Rose. Those should be your semis and national title game, alternate each year.
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Actually no looks like their star RB is mysteriously out for "hamstring tightness." Setting this up for an injury excuse. Bet if they get back in this game he'll be back out on the field pretty quickly.
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I talked about how awesome the sky cast is last night on the other bowls thread, but the SECN one-upped it with the Tenn radio guys calling the game. Screw the SEC/Tenn, but man I would love to have a Hokie sky cast with Roth and Burnop.
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Edit: I often think of this piece by Phil Steele where he goes through the entire BCS period, and looks at what an ideal playoff would look like. In an ideal world, I think the committee would look at the field each year, and decide on a cutoff line. Maybe it's 2 teams, 4 teams, 6, 8, 16, etc.
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12 teams in this format is going to take 4 weeks and I love the home playoff games, but the way they did it to appease the bowls is silly. It should be P-whatever champions, 1-2 G5 champs, and the rest at-large to add up to 8 teams.
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I came here to say exactly this just now. All the four bottom seeds lost handily. I think an 8 team playoff would be plenty. Playing until Jan 20 is just too long a season honestly.
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We should get rid of 16 seeds in the ncaa tournament too because they always lose.
IMO the only problem with the 12 team playoff is the scheduling. Which is a problem with a lot of college football, shouldn't wait nearly this long to play the first round of games.
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That's my main problem with it. Not opposed to 12 but the season being extended almost two months from the end of the regular season through championship weekend and then four rounds of the playoff is pretty crazy. They needed to have the first round last weekend and the second round should have been this weekend. Semis around New Years and championship game the week after as has been the case for a while now. I also think the first two rounds need to be at the team's home stadiums (way better environment for playoffs and less neutral site travel), then the Sugar/Orange/Rose host the semis and national championship each year and rotate.
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The 2018 Hoos would like a word.
I get you are making an argument, but selfishly I would be fine with getting rid of the 16 seed just to stick the Hoos with a shame that could never be matched.
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Yeah I mean the low seeded teams are going to be a blowout usually. It's when they aren't that college sports are fun. Realistically we can eyeball the best 2 teams every year that are head and shoulders better than every other team but it wasn't very exciting to just shoehorn them in (especially now that it's the same cycle of 5 teams).
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College football and basketball both had something unique, basketball still has the tourney, and it delivers. Football has nothing which meant every week mattered. No other sport would you be out of you own control with a single loss. It was amazing, September mattered, now it doesn't matter until late December. What was 3 months is now 3 weeks all for what? An OSU team to have more losses than Oregon, that win the same conference and lost to OSU to be crowned champions? This isn't the NFL where 6-8 or so teams have a legit shot at the championship, its even less. We've removed the importance of 98% of the games played for maybe 3 teams. We never needed a national title game much less a playoff.
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Does it? I watch the first weekend, and that's about it now. BUT that might be a mean thing, not a tournament or everyone else thing.
I do know that the college basketball regular season is getting less and less viewership every year. I too rarely watch college basketball. Part of it is because I'd rather watch other sports like college football and tennis, but for the last decade, it feels like college basketball just doesn't matter until March.
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People love upsets in the hoops tourney - EARLY... that's it. They don't like sister jean beating kansas in the elite 8- those games get the worst viewership of the tourney. If it's early- first round- you never hear Seth Greenberg say UMBC didn't belong like they do in football. That's fun, that's romantic about the tourney, but the further you go, the more people hate the little guy - like they do in college football. Everyone hates Boise, ASU, etc. this year. Everyone hated Indiana- killed them in every way... That's the difference from hoops.
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So after a Saturday of Snoozers (Clemson-Tx was borderline competitive at best), here's how I would propose the CFP be done:
1. 8 Teams, ordered by Ranking. No Autobids at all. First Round on Campus, top 4 seeds get home Games.
2. Teams are chosen by a Computer. No human bias....no Warde Manual to talk out of both sides of his mouth. Certainly, we can create an algorithm to weight the relative value of wins/losses based on S.O.S and Opponent metrics at this point. No useless committee and no $1200 Conference rooms to rent. No Greg Sankey attempting to put his thumb on the scale.
3. 2nd Round/Semis played at Neutral Sites Rotating between 4 Major Bowls (Rose, Sugar, Orange, Fiesta). Sorry Cotton and Peach.
4. Championship Game Like it has been in the past--Neutral site as well, stand-alone game. Warm-weather or Indoor Stadium.
Reasons why this will never happen:
-Most obviously, now that it has been expanded to 12, there is no way that people are going to accept less. Like so many other things in CFB, putting Pandora back in the Box isn't gonna happen.
-Tangential to above---- TV Money and E$$$PN---less games is less dollars, and TV Executives are the real people who run college football at this point.
-The Bowls would revolt--the 2 Semi sites would be must-see each year while the others would be less relevant than ever because 4 of the top 8 would already be eliminated.
-SEC and B1G would lose their minds not getting Autobids
-People wouldn't "trust the computers" even though they would obviously not have selection bias. For ESPN, paying a bunch of talking heads to debate the Playoff Committee rankings each week is also content.
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I want no part of a system that does not guarantee conference champions a shot at the title. If we let the talking heads get their way it'll be the SEC Invitational every year, we have to have regulations in place that prevent that from happening.
And quite frankly I don't care that games were not competitive this weekend. Keep things as they are. The second that players realize they can go anywhere and have a legit shot at a title the talent will become more distributed and the quality of playoff games will improve. Just have to give it time.
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Sure, no one wants this to be SEC v. B1G challenge just in football, but how do you even define a Conference Champion at this point with the conferences so bloated?
ACC is a perfect example SMU, Clemson and Miami never played each other. I think after watching yesterday, it's really hard to imagine that Cam Ward wouldn't have been more up to the task than Kevin Jennings.
I would much rather have interesting games than what we had yesterday.
And as far as players..I think the narrative that they are going to recieve is this: if you want a real shot to win a Championship--you go to OSU, TX, Georgia, ect...which they already are. Since they can transfer whenever they want, get paid, and keep playing more or less indefinitely by filing a lawsuit, there's no risk to being the 4th 5* WR to commit somewhere.
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We need to have true revenue sharing and collective bargaining with all conferences involved to start with. Then I think we need conference retraction long term because these bloated super conferences just aren't sustainable. More, smaller conferences again so you can play a true round robin schedule or at least divisional format that makes sense, and all conference champs get autobids. Then the conference championship is basically a de facto first round of the playoff. Should only have 2-4 at large teams max.
If we got back to a P6 with six ten member conferences (60 teams), all champs get autobids, plus a few G5 champs, and 3-4 at large teams max, I think that's a great playoff setup.
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Problem is, there is no motivation for any of the Conferences (particularly the P2) to do that.
In light of that not happening, I am interested in seeing competitive football games rather than trying to pretend like SMU, Indiana, and Arizona St. have any realistic chance of competing.
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I want to be in the room when you tell the SEC they have to kick out 8 teams and the B!G that they are splitting East - West into two different conferences.
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Nah, SEC and Big 10 will have two divisions each where the divisions will have a title game, still the SEC, still the Big Ten, but different. It will just redefine what conferences and divisions are because of how tv contracts work.
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This is what I was talking about. With conferences this big, you have to go to a pod format. 4 pods of 4-6 teams each. Incorporate the conference race into the playoffs. Either that or more smaller conferences.
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Right now there are 16 Big12 teams, 17 ACC, 18 B1G, and 16 SEC teams, and ND. That means it the top level there are 68 teams ... which sucks as a number. So OSUw and WSU come back, we add Boise and whomever else to get 72.
So 4 conferences, 18 teams, two divisions of 9, or we really consolidate and have two conferences (SEC/Big10) with 6 divisons of 6. This means everyone divisions winner gets a playoff berth. Make it a 16 teams play off and add the top G5 and 3 at larges and be done with it.
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Same - the playoff teams need to be determined by conference championships, not by computer or by coaches or the AP. If that's allowed then we just get right back to where we were. Under a caste system like that we don't get Arizona St or Boise St in these playoffs. A conference-based system could potentially have the affect of a rebalance of power for the schools that are smart about it and choosing to relocate to a non-P4 conference for the purpose of winning championships. That might only work for a short while until there's a total realization that true geography-based conferences without historical rivalries is the way to go.
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I stopped reading here. This won't do anything to solve the issues with the cfp. You need to shrink it back down to 4 and make conference championship a requirement to make it in. Top 4 ranked conference champions get in. Hard stop.
You want to play in the playoff? Win your fucking conference. Too many goddamn snowflakes in cfb now. Everyone wants a shot and the sec and big think they are entitled and nobody is more butthurt at not getting in than sec and big fans. Fucking softies.
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Alabama whining about not getting in with three losses is a perfect example. Want to be in the playoffs? Don't lose three games. I don't care who you lost to, win or go home, babies.
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2." Teams are chosen by a Computer. No human bias....no Warde Manual to talk out of both sides of his mouth. Certainly, we can create an algorithm to weight the relative value of wins/losses based on S.O.S and Opponent metrics at this point. No useless committee and no $1200 Conference rooms to rent. No Greg Sankey attempting to put his thumb on the scale." - This issue with this was that teams will game the computers like they did in hoops when it was heavily RPI rated. Football teams will figure out how to schedule "tough" games on paper but not reality. Bama will schedule an OOC game with a P4 team that also plays tough teams to boost their computer rankings- whether or not said team is actually "good". This is how the A 10 would get 6 teams in the NCAA tourney. When it is perceived that playing at Rhode Island in front of 2K people is a "tough" game, you get credit for a tough game. That's the issues with the computers.
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it needs to be settled on the field. no committee. no computers. hell, no rankings for all I care (but I know the talking heads need that to drive traffic, etc)
each conference gets to place their champion in the playoff. Hard stop. Each conference has to structure a league schedule that creates a route for each of its members to win the league indisputably. Each conference needs to allow each team in their league to schedule a set number of non-conference games. It's up to the individual teams to decide what those non-con games are.
If you have more conferences than you have playoff spots, then the strength of your conference champion is subject of debate. But if you want to even be near the conversation, you need to win your league. That makes every game matter. And I don't give two shits if the "two best teams" in the country are in the same conference. Too fucking bad. One of them has to win the league and only one of them gets to the playoff. Prove it on the field. If you're not able to beat the best team in your league you're not championship worthy. I'm tired of these second chance bullshit opportunities that 2-loss teams get just because "they played a harder schedule". STFU. Win the games you play. Let your play on the field speak for itself. Bunch of GD snowflakes.
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What I liked about the BCS was the transparency of it all. They published the computer algorithms that determined your rating so everyone knew objectively what they needed to do to be successful. There was still the bullshit human element with the Coaches and AP polls, but so much of the beauty pageant mess was mitigated by the computers and it made the seasons enjoyable, because it was the best system we had that took bias out of the equation.
Of course, the logic involved is exactly why we no longer use computers. There's no controversy to be had with logical objective formulas determining ratings. Its hard to stack the deck in your favor when everything needs to be transparent.
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This entire playoff is experimental. Things will change. Potential reseeding after round one. It may expand to 14 games. Change is inevitable. But let's make one non negotiable rule — Indiana can never be invited again.— Colin Cowherd (@colincowherd) December 21, 2024
SEC darling Tennessee loses by 25:
What did we learn from the first round of the college football playoffs? College teams get overwhelmed very quickly playing on the road. Just like the regular season.— Colin Cowherd (@colincowherd) December 22, 2024
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Yep, that's a perfect example of SEC entitlement right there. Ironically, I think this year's playoffs may end up showing that the SEC isn't actually very good this year.
If Ohio State didn't have to play Oregon next week, I think there would be a very good chance that 3 of the 4 semifinal teams would be Big 10, because I'd favor either of those teams against Texas, and certainly Penn State over Boise State. I'll also take Notre Dame over a very overrated Georgia.
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Time to reset the voices that matter in College Football. Herbstreit and Finebaum and all the other "Media" members simping for an all SEC CFP can go with them while they play with each other. WINS matter.
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That is just shamelessly setting the table for the national media to completely discount and disqualify anyone but the SEC from having a seat at the playoff table.
Such fucking horseshit. I used to respect this man but he whored himself out HARD for the SEC over the last 10 years or so, and now he's nothing more than a SEC shill with the biggest platform to spew whatever talking point the league front office wants to focus on this week. He single handedly led the charge into dismissing the entire FSU undefeated season last year because of one injury and now he's laying the groundwork to preemptively apply that same disqualification it for the vast majority of teams in college football before the games are even played because they don't have the correct conference patch on their jersey.
Case in point, a few years back, look at his argument when it came to discounting his own alma mater so that it would benefit the SEC
Here's what Kirk Herbstreit (& Jesse Palmer) said on the day of the 2017 CFP selection show when 11-1 Bama was put in over 10-2 Ohio St even though OSU had 2 better Ws per the CFP rankings than Bama did.Why is it different in 2024? The only constant ESPN narrative is pro SEC https://t.co/89FDlOvggHpic.twitter.com/FkcuVY1kZf— Jack Grossman (@JackGrossman97) December 23, 2024
He's everything that is wrong about college sports right now. Absolute personification of the greed and grift that it has all become. Two faced hypocritical asshole who will spew whatever bullshit he needs in order to satisfy whatever agenda he's being told to support this week. The only morals he has anymore is to do whatever is best for the SEC, and not college football in general. Fuck him.
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I'd take the magic computer BCS selections back please. I'm tired of ESPN and the media raising and sinking entire conferences just based on what they say.
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Just as long as the rankings are not a criteria because otherwise that's how they would game the computers. Independent body determines Strength of Schedule criteria.
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ain't no way the SEC will agree to an independent body determining SoS because then someone might actually take a critical look at their OOC scheduling and realize that the conference is famous for never playing true away games and any neutral site has to be solidly within their footprint.
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Yep if you say Florida, Kentucky, USCe, Miss State, Missouri are great teams, impossible places to win over and over and over again, despite no truth to it, you feed the machine.
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Which is fine, I think they got it right this year but its the continued narrative that drives me nuts and IMO will eventually lead to the committee being weaponized to support the $EC.
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Oh they are 100% going to kill the fucking golden goose. 100% . Herbstreit is rich because college football is a passionate regional sport with a meaningful regular season. He's living proof- is e famous for his fucking NFL thursday night gig? Does anyone give a shit that he calls Rams Saints on a random thursday? no. But they tune in to watch him on Saturday mornings. Why? because it used to mean something to be a VT fan, an - insert not SEC- team fan. If they continue to simp for one conference and give them 4, 5,6 auto bids in the playoffs- the regular season is meaningless- much like it was for Tennessee and Penn State this year... lose to the best teams you play, get in the playoff. Tennessee Bama was MUCH bigger when the loser went home basically. They will kill it soon enough
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Imagine if this is how the NFL worked, where being the best on paper was more important than your record. Detroit would be getting hammered by the media just like FSU did when the injuries hit, Minnesota might be on a pedestal (higher than KC) because of their SOS, and the Ravens would be a lock because they have Jackson at QB despite being tied in their division w Pittsburgh, splitting the season, and Pittsburgh having a more difficult schedule.
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If the NFL operated like college the 2017 Eagles wouldn't have been allowed in the playoffs after Wentz hurt his knee and Foles would have never been allowed to go on the run he did. But the unexpected is what is great about sports. The most deserving teams don't always win. The big money doesn't always win.
ESPN is actively trying to make sure their investments always cash, rigging the desk in their favor. And it's bullshit.
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Exactly. I mean why play the game? I could care less who is "better". Have some criteria and let teams play it out. If they're right, the winner should be who they think it is. We've watched Bama lose to two 6-6 teams. Give some other teams that have merit or meet certain criteria a chance. If we don't, what's the point in playing the game.
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ESPN has somehow gaslit a major portion of their audience into thinking that wins and losses don't matter, the only thing that matters is how good we think a team is. That is what this is all built upon. There is controversy because they've spent time and money propping up certain teams and certain conferences and they need to make sure that investment pays.
That's it. That's what this is all about. They will throw any agenda in your face that they can to argue their case on why their chosen teams should get preferential treatment and enough people have sucked down the kool-aid for so long that the mindless masses will fall in line and argue it for them. They don't care who their teams lose to, they don't care what your teams do, they will go out of your way to trash your teams as long as theirs get their way.
With the way ESPN is trying to stack the deck now, I honestly don't think that the 1999 VT team gets a chance to play for the national title if the current discourse existed back then. Assholes like Herbie would be front and center saying how some 2 loss SEC team was more deserving than an undefeated because of their "brutal" SEC conference schedule.
And the worst part is that ESPN has significant pull on the playoff committee. So whatever they push now is going to be the norm in a couple years time.
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VT 99 team did have 4 wins over ranked opponents- #24 UVA 31-7; #16 Syracuse 62-0!!; #19 Miami 43-10; and #22 BC 38-14)- all by 14 or more points; only wins by less than 20 were @Pitt 30-17 and @WVU 22-20.
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It's funny how they keep harping on Indiana and to a lesser degree Clemson about not being one of the best, but nothing, not a word about Tennessee losing and they lost by the biggest margin.
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Even for Paul Finebaum's standards, his take today was grotesque.He's not just an SEC Network host. ESPN has given him the title of national CFB analyst, supposedly tasking him with covering the whole sport.Yet he calls SMU and Indiana "frauds" while giving Tennessee a pass. pic.twitter.com/28yju7ZgCl— Josh Graham (@JoshGrahamShow) December 23, 2024
This right here. This is the ESPN spin in full force. Tennessee is excused because they deserved to be there for reasons that you're just expected to know and SMU and Indiana are "frauds" because they didn't for reasons you're just expected to know.
ESPN isn't even trying to hide the manipulation anymore. They're not even trying to pretend they're not in bed with the SEC. Its blatant, its out in the open, and they're flaunting it for us all to watch in real time.
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This SEC problem didn't exist until ~2007 when the SEC went on their run of championships which didn't end until FSU stopped the trend, against Auburn. It was also the first time an SEC team lost the game when they weren't playing another SEC opponent.
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I would absolutely love it if the remainder of college football abandoned the NCAA and formed its own league, leaving ESPN alone w just the SEC. I have no idea if it would work out, but you would have a national champion every year, and then you would have ESPN's SEC "champion".
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Im Finally fully on this bandwagon. Let the SEC and the big 10-13-15-18 be there own God damn League. Fuck them let them claim a club championship and then let the rest of us actual have an actual championship. All we have to do is make a bigger trophy than they do! Then ours means more!
Oh yeah- we all also refuse to play them all year, including FCS. Let them just play each other in one big circle jerk.
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And then watch as the Vanderbilts, Missouris, Marylands, Rutgers,etc beg us to take them back when they realize they will NEVER FUCKING WIN ANYTHING IN THAT CLUB AND THEY ARE ONLY THERE TO GIVE EVERYBODY ELSE THE EASY WINS THEY USED TO GET FROM FCS TEAMS. and of course, the haves will have already taken away the equal revenue sharing from those teams. And we can all tell them all to fuck off as they lose TV contracts as they become irrelevant because it all becomes just too boring and nobody watches anymore. It might take 30 years, but it'll happen.
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Some form of this is going to happen sooner rather than later. The Top 20-ish "brands" with the most TV appeal will split off and form their own league and voila, there we go. The SEC and the BIG can't kick out charter members, but Georgia, Michigan, Alabama, anOSU, etc can all leave those conferences for a new structure. That's the only way to make the line go up and make the money go up at a certain point. And frankly I hope they do it as quickly as possible so I can go back to enjoying competitive games.
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Man I just want to watch a VT game without being bombarded with discussions about a playoff rather than the game we are actively watching.
Hell, I'm still bitter about the ACC Championship Game last year where ESPN spent the entire broadcast shitting all over both ACC squads in an effort to manipulate the playoff picture. It actively makes watching games miserable from a fan perspective.
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Because of all of the above, I watch VT games exclusively. Only watch others while tailgating (before and after depending on game) and we constant switch for the most competitive game, not the 'brand name' game. Mostly watching quads (four games on one TV).
No need to to change.
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This right here, except, I don't even watch VT on ESPN. In fact I won't watch anything on ESPN unless I am at a bar where it's on a TV. It's time to stop giving those clowns eyeballs.
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Beck is done for the season per ESPN. I think ESPN still would have found a reason to include them in the playoffs even if they had lost to Texas. Given what happened to FSU last year, under the same rules, would have the SEC conference champ who lost their starting QB have been punished because they were the same caliber team? I think we all know the Mouse's answer.
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Alabama was a 22.5-point favorite over Vanderbilt, a 14-point favorite over Oklahoma and a 16.5-point favorite over Michigan. Please never talk about hypothetical point spreads again.— Chris Vannini (@ChrisVannini) December 31, 2024
And THIS is the problem about trying to find the best teams rather than just taking the ones who earn it on the field.
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I'm not about to go that far. What I will say is that PSU is executing to perfection on offense. Those two TD passes could not have been placed any more perfectly than they were.
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This game is competitive due only to Penn State's ineptitude.
They have a tremendous advantage on the fronts and could steamroll Boise downfield running the ball, but they continue to try to pass so they can prove they are "diverse"
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He could enter the portal between quarters and sign with Penn State to finish it out behind a better line and get the record. DC would say, hey it's possible just do it.
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What would the NCAA (lol) do to Boise? after a 3 year investigation into Jeanty playing for Penn State the second half? let them self impose a bowl ban for the potato bowl?
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They'd take away their championship, which well everyone remembers so not really a punishment, PSU already would have sold the memorabilia. I mean the NCAA let a player punch a bunch of people right before the game and nothing happened so ...
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This is one of those games where it's too bad both teams can't lose.
At least Barry's record looks safe. Would hate to see him lose it to someone that plays in a shit conference against shit competition in more games
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Agree here. Don't like PSU at all, but I also dislike Boise a lot. Ever since Kellen Moore came out grinning and they beat us in 2010. Have always thought they are incredibly overrated and play a garbage schedule.
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I can't stand pedo state for obvious reasons but I also can't stand boise. My experience with their fans at FedEx was horrible. Most entitled, whiny, arrogant fucktards i've ever encountered at a game. The only fans that may be worse are the ND St fans who purchase their hotel rooms to the national championship at least a year in advance.
Now to clarify my earlier drunken comment about Jeanty: I do think he's a heck of a RB and has uncanny balance especially after contact, however my point still stands- Barry was the greatest and deserves to have that record until the Earth blows up
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Serious question - is Franklin keeping Dex quarantined or something? Haven't seen a glimpse of him on the sideline last two games since smoke around him and our DC position, not even a mention of him.
Nvm think I finally caught a glimpse of him.
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CFP games 0-5 for me. Not compelling or interesting, ESPN just trying desperately to drum up ratings. Think this is just too long a season for college. I'm ready for it to be over but we've got 3 weeks to go still with this.
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It was closer than it should have been, but only because of many PSU mishaps. Boise was clearly out talented from the opening snap. There wasn't a single point from the time PSU went up 14-0 in the 1st that I thought Boise would seriously win the game.
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IDK, when Boise got 2 or 3 straight stops, and scored a TD, I thought it was possible.
Back to your original point about the CFP not being fun... I think CFB is a sport of blowouts. It's routine to see 4+ TD spreads. I don't think there's anyway to design a playoff where you're not getting blowouts in ~50% of the games.
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Yeah, it just happens in football. I can't think of a sport that has better parity than the NFL, and five teams won by 4 scores last week.
I don't think it's necessarily a problem with the playoff itself, the issue is the talking heads pointing to the lopsided score and saying the loser didn't deserve to be there in the first place (as long as the loser isn't an SEC team).
People who want the CFP to exclude non P2 teams will say Boise didn't deserve their slot, but I think that's a false narrative. Sometimes you just get beat. I think Boise absolutely had a chance to win, but you can't drive the length of the field twice in the second half and come away with zero points. They convert on those two drives and it's a different ballgame in the fourth quarter.
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There's just too much a talent skew toward the P2 programs now IMO. You're rarely if ever going to see the mid-majors shock those teams anymore. Not saying it could never happen, but increasingly unlikely. College basketball is a sport where almost anyone could lose on a given day if they're cold and the other team is hot, but in football the teams with the jimmies and joes are just going to wear you out and overwhelm you 99% of the time.
I think a 12 team playoff is likely too much. There aren't that many elite teams in a given year that could legitimately contend for it. 6-8 seems better. You're going to get a lot of squash games like we've seen with a 12 team field. But most likely they keep it at 12 and eventually the SEC and Big Ten just get a ton of guaranteed autobids. This is ultimately about money and nothing else anyway.
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Boise State acquitted itself well. Fun game. Competitive until late. More than 400 yards, outgained PSU, nearly the same ypp. Both teams made killer mistakes. If Boise finishes a few drives, they'd have been right in it. Deserved to be here.— Chris Vannini (@ChrisVannini) January 1, 2025
Really hadn't looked at the stats so this surprised me a bit
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I agreed with the no targeting against Texas. Especially as they didn't call targeting the other way earlier in the quarter when the ASU player clearly launched at a helpless WR.
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Texas is going to have a lot to complain about this off season if they lose for why the refs didn't throw a phantom flag after that ball hit the upright.
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I think the no call Targeting on the ASU receiver was 100% right. He caught the ball and turned as a ball carrier with possession, while the tackle was NOT a lunch, NOT with the crown, textbook facemask up to protect the neck, a wrap up tackle rather than, again, a launch. etc. I think the ASU pick in the 4th where the guy absolutely cleaned Bond's clock from the opposite direction was a real defenseless receiver situation, and they didn't even review that one.
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Interesting. I don't see how he's not defenseless he could do nothing to protect himself as he hadn't even finished turning around. IMO the way the rule is written it was targeting (defenseless + forceable contact) but the rule is terrible and that was a textbook tackle.
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The defenseless route is the only way to make the argument for targeting, and that's sort of the problem here, that definition is not so clear. Obviously whoever was in the booth saw it the way I did, not defenseless, but it also raises the question on the Isaiah Bond hit on the ASU pick, who seemed much more "defenseless" by any definition I can think of, and they didn't even review it.
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The refs did review that one and correctly decided it was not targeting. didn't lean in and didn't even hit his helmet. The review showed his head whiplashed because the contact to the receiver's shoulder stopped him so abruptly.
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Respectfully, but I disagree. The ASU player launched into a defenseless receiver. The only reason it wasn't called targeting was A) It hit chest first before going into his facemask. B) It would have undone the interception and the game would have been over.
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I think they would have gotten lynched if they called one targeting and the other not. The ASU pick play, the other ASU defender clearly launched into a defenseless receiver. It should have been targeting 100% of the time.
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If they win it all, they will be the perfect example of what I warned about in the lead up to the 12 team playoff. It won't result in underdog national championships, the 12 team playoff will result in that super elite team who disappointingly lost two games, in this case, a respectable loss to Oregon and a not so respectable loss to a 6-5 Michigan team who could go band for band with some of our worst offenses at VT.
In the 12 team playoff era, they were punished with a home game, millions and millions of dollars of revenue and economic impact for Ohio State/Columbus, and as good a shot as anyone to win a national title.
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Yeah I've been talking about this with a buddy of mine. I think the first round bye is actually way worse. There's just way too much time off (3.5 weeks) between the conference championship game and your first playoff game. And it's a neutral site game. You're basically going cold into a traditional bowl game, whereas your opponent just played 1.5 weeks ago and is more at game speed. Being a 5-8 seed honestly is where it's at, and you get that home game and the additional revenue to boot.
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Ohio State: (1) Home game Rd1, (2) Quarterfinal, (3) Semifinal, 4 (Final)
The only benefit for Oregon is that the B1G CCG is not technically an elimination game, so they only have to play 3 elimination games, but it's the same number of games, and when you factor in the revenue/economic impact on the town and surrounding area of a home game, it's really a no brainer.
The worst situation you can be in: Making and then losing your conference championship, but still making the playoff. Then you have to play (5) total games to finish the season.
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Conference championships truly mean nothing anymore. They might as well just do away with those games honestly. The Big Ten champ who already beat Ohio State head to head and is 13-0 is currently getting boat raced by the best team on paper in the Big Ten. The conferences have gotten so big you don't even play half of the teams in your league, how can you call anyone a true champion?
Either do away with conference championships and put the top 12 ranked teams in, no championship auto bids. Or incorporate the conference races into the playoffs so there's a true elimination aspect. But that's going to require smaller conferences.
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Any reasonable person knows that they should do away with conference championship games. The reason they will not is the same reason they were created- money. The SEC signed a TWO year agreement with birmingham initially for the SEC title game. Why? They didn't think it would last/make money. Spurrier said that and he also said that the league told him "this better be a great game" before they played in the first one. They won't get rid of the conference champ games until they stop being very very profitable from ESPN money.
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Yep I always used 2021 Ohio State and 2022 Bama as examples of exactly what this Ohio State team is doing. In a 12 team, both of those teams would have gotten in with a home game, dodged their CCG, and both would have had a real shot at winning a title because of their elite talent. Bama was the only team to beat UGA (and twice) since 2020 until they lost to Ole Miss a couple months ago. That team with Bryce Young and Will Anderson would have at least had a chance to give 2022 UGA a game, much like they beat a better 2021 UGA when they had their two best WR's and their two starting corners, which they didn't have in the rematch. For that 2021 Ohio State team, they would have still had their 3 (4?) first round wide receivers and CJ Stroud, which would have given them a chance against either 21 UGA or Bama. However, I was fine with both of those teams not making the playoff, because they didn't earn it in the regular season by losing two critical regular season games. This Ohio State team lost 2 out of the 3 games they could realistically lose in the regular season, and now look poised and locked in to win a national title. Obviously, they could still lose to someone else, but it will be one of Texas, Georgia, Notre Dame, or Penn State who will stop them... Not exactly a list of underdog programs.
Though as I say that Oregon has made it 34-15 so it's not totally out of the realm of possibility that they could also lose to this Oregon, which is the number one overall seed.
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Regardless, if Ohio State happens to win it all, they absolutely deserve it. Going 4-0 against the gauntlet of a 10-win Tennessee, undefeated Oregon, Texas, and then potentially Georgia makes you unquestionably the national champion and best team in the country. But if this is all just about the best teams going head to head to determine THE best team, and not the most deserving teams based on the regular season or conference races, then just scrap conference championship games and throw the top 12 teams in the bracket and call it a day. Rename it the College Football Pageant (CFP).
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Of course. They would have earned it in the format that exists. My issue with expansion was always more about losing elements of what I think makes college football unique rather than it not being a legitimate way to handle a postseason.
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If they are seeded based on rankings alone, then rankings shouldn't be allowed to be made until week 6.
ESPN and voters never punish Top 10 P2 teams properly when they lose. An SEC team loses to an unranked SEC and they go down 2 spots but stay in the Top 10 if not Top 5. ACC team loses to the same team and they're dropped to the 11-16 spots.
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But the teams are still ranked preseason and early by the AP and coaches which heavily influence where teams open at when they release the first CFP rankings....
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Unfortunately THAT will never happen and even if it somehow DID, there would still be 'unofficial rankings " that would be done and those would be used as the starting points in determining which wins and losses were 'quality wins/losses'...
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oh I don't think I've watched a single CFP game live, ever. Like, anytime in the last 10 years, haha.
Then again I don't have TV, I just have streaming. If I want to watch a VT game or the important parts of the VT game, I have youtube. For everything else, I have y'all.
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12% of the College football fanbase vehemently disagrees with you...fans of Ohio State, Georgia, Texas, Georgia, and Alabama i.e. the only teams with any hope of sustainable success in the current shitshow.
The other 88% are either somewhere along the path of losing interest or wasting their income donating to NIL collectives in some veiled hope that it has any benefit whatsoever.
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12% of the College football fanbase vehemently disagrees with you...fans of Ohio State, Georgia, Texas, Georgia, and Alabama i.e. the only teams with any hope of sustainable success in the current shitshow.
NFL fans too. The NFL fans who are casual CFB viewers love where CFB is going. More helmet games, easier to watch future draft picks, better on-the-field-football, etc.
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The TV ratings (zero.zero) , sparce attendance, and soon to be non existent/bankrupt UFL shows you that casual fans of american football don't care about the quality of the games- the UFL is a higher quality of player than 99% of college teams and it draws no interest. Casuals care about 1. betting and 2. rooting for the team their brothers wifes cousin went to- the big name. The name on the front of the jersey, not the back- 100%. I live in PHX. Last year very good seats to the fiesta bowl were 10-12 dollars or free from a number of car dealerships, etc, etc. Liberty played in the game. No interest. This year with the cult of penn state fans who show up for Drew Allar or Saquan Barkley or Joe Paterno or Franco Harris or Lavar Harrington or insert any fucking PSU player from the 757... tickets were uber expensive right up until kickoff. It will take 100 years for that to change.
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Agreed...if most fans really cared about the "quality of the football", there wouldn't be 6 failed Spring Football leagues.
And even with a Celebrity owner and National TV partners, the UFL would be dead too wothout the NFL subsidizing it.
And I really doubt Steelers or Jaguars fans are watching Ohio State games intently trying to "scout" players. If they cared that much to start with, there are 2.5 months of endless NFL Draft prognostication on ESPN from February to Draft Day.
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Each of the scenarios was different. Texas and PSU were favorites (by Vegas), OSU hit their stride, but idk if that has anything to do with a bye. UGA down a starting QB
Need more way data points before I say the first round bye causes losses.
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Nothing more I hate than really idiotic talking points... BUT they really should disqualify any team whose starting quarterback gets injured. Call it the Bulldog rule or something. /FSU
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We normally try to get out of Ohio in January and head somewhere in Central America. Watching bowls in Spanish is becoming something of a tradition. This ESPN Costa Rica crew is awesome.
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Personally love how the commentators are ragging the ND OL and Joe Rudolph. Missed blocks, poor pass pro. Literally the one thing holding ND back from being out in front even more.
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It sucks not having the public announcement yet, but I'm fairly confident all the players and recruits know. We keep signing guys with supposedly only "some phone and Zoom calls" with DC candidates. I think it's sewn up and the people who need to know already know.
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LOL the guys tried to give him a Gatorade bath but he paused them... because... Molly was there? They backed down and Freeman was just like yeah give it to me.
OK I was born into ND and I got a grad degree from PSU so my loyalty is divided...
sike ND all the way baby let's go.
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I totally love it. If it wasn't for ASU forgetting to cover a Texas guy on 4th-and-game in OT, there would be exactly ZERO SEC teams among the final four.
This is why the SEC wants a bunch of guaranteed berths in the playoffs - without The Godfather Nick Saban guaranteeing a national championship for the conference every 3 years they are not particularly remarkable.
Their argument for getting a bunch of teams in next year just evaporated.
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As much as the SEC deserves their comeuppance this year, I feel much more strongly about the big ten needing to be put in their place. All of this is their fault
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Maybe this will force a change in the host format moving forward. With every home team winning in the first round, and every team with a bye and being the listed home team losing, it's pretty clear that there's a lot to be said about NOT playing these games at a neutral site. Getting a bye after already having 3 weeks off looks completely irrelevant after the results for this round.
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We know that perhaps as early as next year and certainly for 2026, the top 4 teams will get byes whether they are conference champs or not. That change is coming. What is also coming is whatever the committee can do to further tip the scales to the B1G and SEC, they will in fact do.
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The format isn't broken, there is no reason to fix it.
Let this continue playing out. Let schools get used to this format. Let it breathe so we can settle in.
But no, we will see only one SEC team in the final four and declare it a national emergency that requires immediate attention so that it never happens again.
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I think the bracket format is fine. It's the hosting locale for the 2nd round that I don't care for. Every "home" team deserves at least one game at their actual home stadium.
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This really has been the perfect year for a 12 team playoff introduction because there were no true death star teams for the first time in awhile. I think a significant factor for this is nobody having a truly elite QB on any of these top teams.
What I don't want to hear is revisionism that this format would have been relevant in most years. From 2014-2022, some combination of Alabama, Clemson, Georgia and Ohio State were a step above the rest of the pack. Before that you have some seriously elite Florida, Alabama, and 2013 FSU squads. The only thing that would have changed is that teams like 2013, 2019, and 2022 Bama would have gotten a shot, 2021 Ohio State, 2018 UGA, etc.
I think one reason for the slight increase in parity is going to disappear, which is the COVID eligibility super seniors. Having a core of significantly older adult men with veteran experience on the team has helped out quite a few teams to punch up or even out talent gaps.
The parity increase that I think will stick around is the portal. While the portal is still primarily helping the top teams, it is making it slightly easier for teams to have a one season or two season shot to jump up a tier... before their own players get yoinked. NIL seems to have helped a little bit to redistribute some of the top QB's and DL talent, in particular, but I think that is still primarily benefitting the top and/or richest donor base programs more than anyone else, and by a lot.
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1. The NCAA is poised to approve Covid forever (5 years of eligibility across the board) and 2. Shame Bama didn't get in..... with the best resume/wins and all.
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2008 Florida vs USC was the dream championship that year that should have happened. Would have loved a playoff format then to allow that. Both of those teams were pretty loaded. 2007 would have also been an interesting year for this given the chaos. LSU was the most loaded team but even they lost two that crazy year.
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I think we all agree 12 is too many. I think 4 is plenty. I don't think we need to make it any bigger than 4, ever. Leave the committee in place so they can choose which 4 conference champions get to play and let the debates go from there. Make it super simple. The only way to get to the playoff is to win a conference championship. That makes it super simple for the committee. - they only have to choose from (9?) conference champions across the P4 and the G5. They pick the 4 best champions they deem fit to play and then it goes from there. Everyone else goes to bowl games like before. You want to play in the playoff? Win your goddamn conference. Done.
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Brace yourself because it's getting bigger not smaller. Why is it expanding? Because it was a national crime this year that Bama, Ole Miss, and USCe didn't get a shot at a national championship- because they play really hard games all year - allegedly. So the SEC and B1G want more GAURENTEED spots- you know the opposite of earning it on the field. It will be 16 teams soon to avoid the tragedy of Shane not getting in this year.
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Four teams wasn't enough - though it did highly value the regular season. If you hadn't "earned it" in the regular season you weren't worth considering. But the subjectiveness of the polls means that determining who had 'earned it' the most (or top-four-most) was always going to be a guess. And with so much money and politics involved, I don't think we were ending up with the "earned it" evaluation really being all that fair anyway.
But 12 teams? Why jump straight into 12 teams? I can't recall a single season where I thought to myself... Hmm that ninth-ranked team REALLY looks like the dark horse to win it all. The regular season should be good enough for us to judge which teams earned it enough (though here I am falling back on the subjectivity of my own eye test).
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I also agree 8 would have been the right number. It avoids the complication of bye weeks and would have been enough space for power conference champions and exceptional independents or runner ups.
FWIW I recall it being reported the expansion of playoff directly to 12 instead of 8 was primarily advocated for by the SEC and Big 10, because an 8 team playoff with automatic qualifying conference champions would have expanded the field without allowing as many representatives from the same conference, therefore decreasing the likelihood of an SEC or Big 10 team winning the national championship compared to either of the 4 or 12 team formats. College football can't have the most logical playoff format if it doesn't benefit the SEC and Big 10.
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Ok so this actually got me thinking and was pretty fun. Built my own 12-team playoff bracket based on the 2007 season here. Bracket seeding based on final BCS rankings here.
Top four seeds and first round byes:
1 - Ohio State (11-1) Big Ten Champs
2- LSU (11-2) SEC Champs
3 - Virginia Tech (11-2) ACC Champs
4 - Oklahoma (11-2) Big 12 Champs
Rest of the field:
6- Georgia (10-2) SEC
7 - Missouri (11-2) Big 12
8 - Kansas (11-1) Big 12
9 - WVU (10-2) Big East Champ (could be six but at the time the Big East was already seen as a mid-major league, so feel like they would have bumped other teams over them)
10 - Hawaii (12-0) WAC Champs
11 - Arizona State (10-2) Pac-10
12 - Choices here would have been Florida (9-3), Illinois (9-3), or Boston College (10-3). Having the Heisman winner Tebow in the field could have been compelling, but assuming the committee wouldn't penalize Boston College for playing and losing the ACC championship game. Plus BC had Matt Ryan and were pretty good that year anyway. So I give the nod to BC for 12.
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(12) Boston College at (5) USC - like the Trojans here. They were one of the hottest teams in the country by the end of the season and demolished a good Illinois team in the Rose Bowl.
(11) Arizona State at (6) Georgia - I honestly don't remember much about Arizona State that year, but I think playing UGA and against Matt Stafford would be tough on the road would be tough. Would take Georgia.
(10) Hawaii at (7) Missouri - this would could have been interesting with Colt Brennan and the Air Raid at Hawaii. But still would take Mizzou.
(9) WVU at (8) Kansas - future Big 12 game! Like WVU big here, that Kansas team was so overrated. Still mad we let them beat us.
Second round:
(5) USC vs (4) Oklahoma, Fiesta Bowl - I like USC here. 2007 was one of the less memorable Oklahoma teams of the decade, had just lost Adrian Peterson and Sam Bradford and DeMarco Murray were just freshmen.
(9) WVU vs (1) Ohio State, Rose Bowl - serious Beverly Hillbillies vibes with the Cousins heading out to Pasadena. I honestly like Rich Rod and WVU. Ohio State was overrated more often than not in the 2000s and didn't have the defensive speed to deal with Pat White and Steve Slaton.
(6) Georgia vs (3) Virginia Tech, Peach Bowl - does the 2007 VT team that was unprepared and didn't take practice seriously at the real Orange Bowl show, or do we have a little more fire knowing we are playing for the title? Rematch of the Peach Bowl from the year before. I think it's a great game and I will take VT in a very close one (maybe I'm being a homer).
(7) Missouri vs (2) LSU, Sugar Bowl - could be an intriguing game, but I think the LSU defense would just be too talented for Missouri. Plus the physical LSU run game would be a mismatch for a Big 12 pass-oriented defense IMO. Take LSU
Semi-finals:
(9) WVU vs (5) USC, Cotton Bowl - Would take USC yet again. Just too much talent and they were very hot at the end of 2007 playing their best football.
(3) VT vs (2) LSU, Orange Bowl - Rematch of the regular season game. Think we make it much closer, but just think LSU is too much for us still.
National title game
(5) USC vs (2) LSU - now this I think would be very interesting. Two really good defenses. Could go either way but I would take USC and their skill talent in a close one IMO.
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I honestly didn't remember those comments. I just remember there being a lot of sentiment after that loss that Frank treated the bowl as a reward for the players and weren't as serious in practice. Also Vince Hall got injured on a jet ski playing around the week before.
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I think a significant factor for this is nobody having a truly elite QB on any of these top teams
I think part of the issue, and we'll see this over the next few years until things inevitably change again, is that players move around too much. They don't stay in one place and develop. Everyone wants to play NOW and nobody is willing to work behind the scenes until they get their shot. The result is that you're going to get lots of talented players that don't properly develop and make miscues related to lack of experience or lack of cohesion with the rest of their teammates.
We don't have any truly great teams this year (and we won't for a long time) because so many teams are completely overhauling their rosters every off-season because players are moving around. There's no time for coaches to build a really good team, molding the players to their schemes and identities over the course of 3 or 4 years. Coaches need to find players who can play straight out of the box. That lack of development is going to hurt the quality of the sport in the long run - and this will trickle up too. You're going to see a dip in quality from the NFL as the younger under-developed players start to take over the league. The NFL teams are going to be forced to do more development of the players as they come in since so many will come in even more raw than before. In the next 7-10 years, the best NFL players are going to be those that stuck with a single team and developed over their collegiate career before hitting the pros. They may not be the most talented, but they'll make the fewest mistakes and be the best quality players you can get.
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We've seen this in basketball a bit with the 1 and done. It's really tough to win a championship with a team of new players every year. UVA, uconn both won with teams composed largely with their recruits and had played together the year before. Lots of others played the one and done and haven't done as well.
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Larranaga mentioned it when he resigned, that directly after their final 4 appearance 8 of the kids that still had eligibility entered the portal. When confronted, they all said they LOVED Miami, but wanted moar $$$$... And they went from Elite Eight to Final Four to 15-17 and 14th in the ACC.
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Boise just had a 1st round bye in the playoffs and their 43 year DC just retired with a message that basically says "we can't afford to compete anymore" due to players on their roster getting offers of 2x to 10x to play elsewhere
There isn't a team in this year's playoff close to the level of the champions of those seasons.
You would think that the playoffs this year would teach people that what they think doesn't mean anything, but alas I guess we are still going to ride with it.
Those teams were good, but not unbeatable. And this year the games are proving that there is no guarantee that the "best" teams are going to win. Even the vaunted SEC is capable of being thoroughly humbled and this is only 2 weeks after crying endlessly that we just KNOW for a fact they are heads and shoulders better than everyone else.
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There are metrics we can use to compare these teams. The highest rated FPI team this season is a 26.8 (Ohio State), and 2019 alone had four teams over that 29.4 Bama, 30.3 LSU, 31.5 Clemson, 33.7 Ohio State. In addition to the numbers (and part of the reason FOR the numbers), those teams all had elite QB play as well, something none of this year's playoff teams have.
You have to go back to 2007 to find a season where there wasn't 1, sometimes quite a few more, teams rated higher than a 26.8.
I certainly can't "prove" 2019 LSU, for example, would comfortably beat every team in this playoff, but I don't think I am saying something that the vast majority of people don't agree with.
The eye test, the metrics, and the QB play all align to agree with what I am saying.
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My personal snark is that leading into next year- the SEC is the best, they just are, Bama has the most talent, Nobody can beat UGA, there should be 11 SEC teams in the top 25, USCe just beat a lower tier VT from the ACC, so crown them etc. My issue is that if all of that is true- why play the season? Just put 8 SEC teams in the playoff... they are the best right? and it can't be disputed. Why should VT play USCe? no contest right, just means more. It's nauseating and I have no idea why people are surprised when someone takes an opportunity to dunk on the mighty SEC.
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Lol because they peacocked loud and proud to shit all over the likes of Indiana, SMU and Boise because they deemed Alabama, SCarolina and Ole Miss so much more worthy of bids.
Herbie even went on record to say people are focusing too much on the games that teams win when trying to determine someone's worth in an effort to prop up the SEC. OF FUCKING COURSE everyone is going to dunk on them after all that
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Good. They can handle it. They literally sign ALL of the best HS players every year. Ohio State and Penn State get some bread crumbs but the vast majority of the best HS players sign with the SEC. Boo Hoo if they get dunked on. It's like Brady whining for roughing the passer calls in his 7 super bowl prime- fuck off. When SEC fan boi's proclaim - for 20 fucking years- that the league is just better, every team is better, every game is tougher, every schedule is better well non fan bois get sick of that shit. Why was UGA considered for the playoff this year when they lost their starting QB? Why not penalize them like they did FSU last year? Why does fucking South Carolina have any argument for the playoff???? Why was Missou ranked in the top 10 in every preseason poll? I've got snark for days- so do millions of people.
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You're not wrong. Hell, I was rooting for ND last night for some reason. I hate ND. I'm just tired of the damn SEC circle jerk every time college football is mentioned.
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I did not go to Notre Dame, I have no association with the school, so nope not rooting for them- they have a million people that didn't go there and have no association to the school that DO root for them, so they don't need me.
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I used to hate ND fans, but really there is just a special level of loathing I have for the cult of SEC right now. That cult is actively trying to destroy everything that is good about this sport for their own personal gains and I want nothing more than to watch it all blow up in their faces.
I don't have any love lost for ND, but I was pulling for them to pistol whip Georgia. And while I don't like the Big Ten at all for how they blew up the Pac, I am pulling for Ohio State to embarrass Texas. I want every single narrative that ESPN has been pushing this year to implode. I want to see angry Herbie again. I want those assholes to suffer.
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Co-DC from a final 4 team is plenty of hype for me. I'd be more anxious about the hire falling through after a counter offer to keep Poindexter at Penn State if they actually won the national championship. Hope Penn State loses and that announcement is made ASAP.
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Not the first time someone has studied their prey in the Penn State locker room! https://t.co/otuHiQjFZa— John "Unc" Gerald (@Johngerald322) January 3, 2025
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My grandfather was offered a scholly to play at ND so for that fact, I will be hoping they win. Despite my normal animosity towards them year in/year out.
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I'll just say that while I cannot stand Notre Dame, I do love the fact that Brian Kelly left there because he thought he'd be able to win a title with LSU. And instead, his replacement has ND in the semi-finals, and Brian Kelly and his LSU Tigers unranked and out of playoff consideration.
Guess my disdain for Kelly is deeper than that for ND
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Brian Kelly is scum and what is wrong with college sports. He really is. He's a bully, takes no accountability- he pulls his QB when he throws an incompletion, he fires coaches every year, etc. It's never his fault. He also used to cuss out everyone on the ND sideline every play until the school ordered him to tone it down. But he wasn't wrong to leave for LSU, he's not dumb. He knows Tiger football is more important to people down there than literally anything else- health, their children, their retirement savings. He was 100% right to leave ND- where there is still some semblence of academics, pretending to be an institution of higher learning. Any smart coach would have made that move in the NIL era. If Kelly needs a new QB, LSU boosters will buy him one every day and twice on Sunday.
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Pretty impressed with Angeli there for ND. Looks like he has really opened up the passing game. That's going to be the key to winning this one, running against PSU will be tough sledding.
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#3 PSU probably the most blatant hold in the history of football, right as the running back was trying to get the edge and right in front of the referee.
They scored on the next play.
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Can't/shouldn't penalize the defense for an under thrown ball that would've been picked regardless. One thing if that happened in one on one coverage but that safety was undercutting that for the pick even if 8 wasn't there.
Glad ND responded with a TD.
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Going to reiterate my point about the overall lower ceiling of the teams in college football this season. Two teams with offenses like this would have absolutely no shot in almost any season the last 15+ years. I think Penn State was winning in the 4th quarter of this game without having completed a pass to a wide receiver. The mid-late 2010's teams would beat either of these teams by 40.
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Duds are exactly why the SEC didn't have more playoff teams... Bama against OU, Ole Miss against Kentucky, etc. Why are you valiantly fighting against an argument that nobody is making?
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many are making this argument and constantly do. Who cares if Bama has 3 losses? they have the best "win" - eventual 3 loss UGA- on the board. Wasn't that you who said that or something similar?
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I said these things: I would have preferred Alabama to make the playoff for my enjoyment of watching the games and because I think, despite three losses, they still had a better resume than some teams who did make it and had no good wins. Bama did have good wins, I don't really think that's debatable. Additionally, you can miss me with Georgia's playoff loss with their backup QB as a denigration of Georgia's quality as a football team.
However, none of this is relevant to our current exchange, because at no point did I, or anyone that I've seen, make an argument saying those teams did not have "duds," which is the argument you are making here. I think everyone agrees that the "duds" from the SEC teams is why they didn't make it... Bama doesn't lose to OU and they are in. Ole Miss doesn't lose to Kentucky and they are in. I think almost anyone would agree that it was precisely those "duds" that cost them their place in the playoff.
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"Additionally, you can miss me with Georgia's playoff loss with their backup QB as a denigration of Georgia's quality as a football team." - you are better than this - come on. You are an unapologetic SEC homer- however you have used real points and not bullshit hypotheticals like this one to make your points in the past- don't be bullshit hypothetical fan. If VT didn't lose 6 games, we would be in the playoffs- that is so intelligent right? You can shill for a 100% meh bama team that lost to Michigans worst team in a decade... fine... I can be sarcastic about the SEC - you had to know this was coming and will come 100 fold if Texas loses tonight. But don't worry in August we will be right back to- Missou is top 5, just because and you have to rank Vandy and Kentucky in the top 25...duhhhh. August will be here for you soon.
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To be clear I would have been fine with Penn St in the championship and winning it all. I don't have the same hatred towards them as others. But I do feel dirty cheering for ND to win it. Is it worth dealing with their arrogant fan base in exchange for denying the B10 or SEC a title? We'll find out... at least we don't have an all B10 championship... that would have been a disaster for so many reasons
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"PSU competes directly with us for many more recruits" we think so, but this is really not the case- meaning when they want someone we don't get them. I can't think of a kid since Kevin Jones that actually chose VT over PSU as the only 2 contenders?? Their all world TE- case in point- ultimately they all go to PSU. In order to be competitive with them we need to actually land someone they really want.
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Give me Texas vs ND in the final. That at least makes me laugh at the B1G and SEC with their only representation being a Big12 team that's as SEC as SMU is ACC
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ND fans are so entitled. My 4th gen wife has complained to me multiple times that she's the only one of her family that didn't witness a Natty during her time there (boo fricken hoo).
It doesn't help that they decided to actually be more than just a football factory in the 80s and improved their academics. Now they jump to the "well we're smarter than you" argument when they lose... arrogant and pretentious af.
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It's shit like this that makes me worried we'll never get the game management stuff right with Pry at the helm. Good Lord Penn State, what are you doing?
Gotta hand it to James Franklin. He was NOT going to let Notre Dame beat him with a fake field goal. pic.twitter.com/l5u9alvyVQ— Scott Bell (@sbell021) January 10, 2025
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1. Game was tied. College OT is so fucking random given the rules. Yes, Freeman is -probably- not faking it there, but keep in mind, if he did and didn't make it- tie game, go to OT. ND was not behind here- so you can't take a fake totally out of the realm. 2. Blocking a short-ish FG is nearly impossible today. So why not put a couple guys back? You had a better chance of a nervous self shank than blocking that short kick.
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The kicker's accuracy was bad during the regular season due to a groin injury. He's been really good in the CFP after he healed up. I don't think he was going to miss that kick unless it was blocked.
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Hes also a portal guy... I LOVED McDonough mentioning 100 times that ND doesn't really portal... lol except they took 13 guys last year- as if every other team takes 40. ESPN is so fucking shameless now its almost unwatchable. ND doesn't portal- until they do. Nauseating.
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I think this alignment is fine you can't double team the blockers so you've got hat on a hat and are attempting to beat the edge from one side which they nearly did and still have an extra guy back for block return/wild shank/fake stop
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As a VT fan, you should root for ND... as part of our great ACC deal with them, we get a share of their 20 million dollar playoff money..... oh no, that's not right- we get zero. Nothing. Like basically what the ACC got in return for this deal.
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To be clear, my love for ND has nothing to do with the ACC. I was raised in an Irish Catholic barn so I was indoctrinated at an early age. VT only became my #1 team when I attended. The Irish are my second favorite team now.
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You can make a pretty good case that the ACC didn't get enough from this deal, but it's a fallacy that they got nothing.
"During the past four-plus seasons, Notre Dame played 26 regular-season games with available television ratings against ACC opponents. Seventeen of those ranked as the top ACC broadcast that weekend. Another eight ranked second."
The Athletic, November 2024
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Nothing "material/good/of real value"- how's that? The ACC TV deal is the worst in the P4, the conference is dying and desperately added fucking Cal and SMU... so EFFECTIVLEY we got nothing from this deal, while Hildalgo gets to showcase herself in the best conference for womens hoops and their lacrosse team prospers. now if you argue - well the ACC's TV deal would be even worse? well probably not, and that's a hypothetical. The fact that the league is on life support with teams suing to leave is a fact- not hypothetical.
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"he is responsible for our son's death, but we are not going to sue him because we need him to win 9 games... go Irish above all".... Still fucking blows my mind.
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This morning on the Dan Patrick show, their morning poll question was "Who would you rather be this morning, James Franklin or Brian Kelly?" Apart from the revulsion of either choice, my choice would be Franklin, because I'd still have a soul.
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I'm rooting for Ohio State regardless as I actually like them. My favorite good/blue blood/whatever you want to call it team.
(1) I considered going there for undergrad, but felt the campus was too big and too urban.
(2) Friend of mine from grad school and her husband went there and they were very good people (postdocs when I was a grad student)
(3) Maybe I've just been lucky, but I've never run across the insufferable fans people always point out at programs like this. Penn State and Michigan have been the worst for me personally. Notre Dame and West Virginia can be there too. And of course the JMU person who has to mention the 1 game they won over-and-over-and-over again.
(4) You could pretty much count on Ohio State to beat the good teams I despise the most - Penn State, Notre Dame and (until recently) Michigan.
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I've had too many people say they went to THE Ohio State University to my face. It's not even the fans, it's just people who went there. I don't know what to say, but it comes across as arrogant as fuck. And I've met more than one or two.
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Opposite for me - rooting for (1) a meteor to hit the stadium; (2) Texas because to hell with the Big Ten and (3) anyone but Ohio State.
But OSU does seem to be peaking at the right time - if tonight's game is anything like the Oregon game I think they will probably roll in the championship game.
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I'm torn between what you said and the poster above. If not a meteor, then maybe Texas for the reasons you stated. I honestly like Texas but the whole $EC thing kind of washes that. I absolutely loathe a ohio state and they sit right there with miami/unc/pedo state/nd on that second step of hatedness (first step solely belongs to loluva)
But, just for this year, nd has my support. Screw anything $ec and Big10. .
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The open field tackling has been impressive to watch... or this is just how it's supposed to be and I'm acclimated in the wrong way because of what tackling is like at Virginia Tech.
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I never thought I'd say this but their annoying g fans are just so old, ND hasn't done anything in 30 years. They got blown out of one National Title game. There are still annoying this like 2000 bowl selection. But the also set the trcord for most consecutive bowl losses because a 9-3 ND is better than a 11-1 everyone else. So they get stomped when playing better completion.
It hasn't really been that way the last decade. No one talks about ND, they had 1 loss and no one talked about them this year. Most of the media probably had them losing their first CFP game. Think about the Bush Push, an illegal play that USC won the game on. That shit never happened to 80s/90s ND. The younger generation has grown up with ND not being what most of us think of ND. It helps that there is no Lou Holtz, there is no Brian Kelly, Marcus Freeman seems like an okay guy who just wants to coach football. He's harder to hate than the past coaches. I see so much less about ND now that'll 20 years ago and that's made a huge difference, now if they win it might get bad again but a villain is still a villain so let's make them the best villain they can be.
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There's no shortage of villains in modern day CFB.
I remember the Bush Push and was actually rooting very hard for ND in that game. But people don't talk about them as much because they came up small on the biggest stages over and over and over, and so it's kind of taken for granted that they always will.
Sounds familiar, doesn't it.
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It still blows my mind that ND took the consecutive bowl loss record away from WVU. I sat through a LOT of WVU bowl losses in my childhood, teens, and early 20s.
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I still want to know why when they were reviewing the Arch Manning play to see if he fumbled the ball the Ohio State player wasn't ejected for targeting? aOSU player lowered his head and lead with Helmet to Arch's helmet.
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Targeting is a spectrum, but I think this one is pretty far away from a call.
I personally wish they'd call more hits to the head or neck area, (especially when it causes the head to go full bobble head).
But in this case the primary point of impact is the OSUs shoulder and the middle of the Manning kid's back.
The reason this play looks so awkward and disjointed has nothing to do with the defender's approach or hit- Arch dives way too late and the awkward hit on the back was because of that. It's on the QB to either keep going into a solid tackle or dive before the defender arrives. He decides on neither, instead compromising and doing both poorly.
The Nebraska QB had a really similar play a week ago- he got up and starting shoving the DB, which should have been a 15 yard penalty on him. Instead, it ended up convincing the refs they missed something, so they called a late hit on the unsuspecting defender.
Comments
I only created this thread because nobody else had, and I really need to post this to summarize the IU/ND game:
Yeah Big10 getting exposed a bit. Indiana may be regretting that Cignetti extension. Just confirms how soft their schedule was.
Why wouldn't Indiana make the same mistake we made with Fuente? They already copied our stadium. They clearly have a thing for VT.
I don't think the losingest team in FBS history is regretting extending their coach who won the most games in a single season in school history and brought them to the playoffs. Especially since that coach comes from the Saban tree and has never had a losing season as a head coach. His career record is 130-37. Guys who win for a long time at all different levels and calibers of schools win.
Lee Corso once took a timeout in the first quarter against Ohio State for photo op.
His Hoosiers posed in front of the scoreboard because they were up 7-0 on the Buckeyes.
Exactly. That's the program we're talking about. I would personally take Cignetti at Tech in a heartbeat. There's no regret to this extension.
Nice perspective. When you frame the complete picture, yeah I think you are right.
Notre Dame fucking around and about to make this game look close.
Notre Dame playing like the Hokies under 2 minutes.
🤣 they wanted to spice things up there at the end for a bit
Great opening salvo from the ACC against B1g10.
Don't worry they'll use the Indiana performance as some kind of referendum against schools in the ACC and BigXII to ensure we get even fewer bids going forward.
No it went the other way last night. Sean McDonough.
Most of the other talking heads nodding in agreement.
Uh, because his own employer spins that narrative constantly? Go see exhibit A - Paul Finebaum.
It was nice to hear the ACC being defended on national TV even if it was in the last minutes of a game that should have been a blowout.
Hah, that's just cause ESPN hasn't found a way to spin it yet
And more likely it'll be used as a push to get 7 or 8 SEC teams in next year because it means so much more there
Let's just expand the playoff to 16 and put the whole SEC in it. Come on ESPN you know you want to.
I don't have a quote, but before the comeback McDonough was basically stating that he had seen enough playoff and that going forward the committee needs to emphasize strength of record (i.e. Alabama, or at least another SEC team probably should have gotten in over Indiana).
I'm not willing to group him into the "sensible, and definitely not just hot takes & stanning the SEC" category anytime soon.
Called it
Lol yup
LOL the tone flipping is hilarious
Woohoo go Notre Dame!
Rooting for Clemson Tennessee and SMU today. It's kinda cold up here in state college
Well this didn't go well
How awesome was that environment last night? You know ESPN has to love it from the presentation perspective.
This current format feels wacky that the 4 teams with byes don't get to play at home. If VT makes the playoffs Id rather be the 5 seed than 1-4 just to experience a post season Lane Stadium environment.
I would really like to see the format change to the first 2 rounds on campus sites. 3 rounds of neutral site games is too much.
I totally agree, but the big bowls want to be a part of the playoff. I think the home environments are way more exciting for the playoffs though. Move the semis to bowls if you must but the first two rounds should be at home stadiums I agree.
Get rid of the bowls. Such a money drain for the majority of them. That or force the bowls to cover ALL team expenses, especially since they are non-profit organizations.
I personally think the bowls should be moved to the opening weekend of the regular season. That's basically what has started happening with these big kickoff games at neutral sites. Bowls just make no sense with a large playoff format. Ridiculous to travel to three neutral site games in the span of less than a month.
Gonna have to move that Army/Navy game up a week... or two... make that part of rivalry weekend and make it count from a conference standing standpoint.
I love this idea. I miss more of the opening weekend neutral site games.
The only issue I see with this format is the "name" teams are going to always be chosen.
This ^
Everything else has been modernized in the sport to the point that tradition, development, and loyalty dont matter at all. The only things that remain are the bowls and rankings, and both need to go. Drop the bowl games, focus on the playoffs, and have the national championship (or even the semifinals) be hosted at a neutral site. If you're the "home" team you should be playing at home for at least one game.
Adios Indiana. It was a fun run.
Man I see where Pry gets his excellent game management decision-making from. Franklin going for it on fourth and long and turning it over giving SMU decent field position.
Yep..."Big Game" James strikes again.
PSU will probably still win today because SMU looks overmatched at the LOS but James Franklin is a liability on Gameday...and Pry learned from him...
Damn two pick sixes for SMU's QB. They're going to get smoked.
The stage and crowd is getting to Jennings bad.
SMU is totally lost.
ESPN revving up their talking heads as we speak..
Prepare for the SEC/B1G both "deserve" 4 Autobids argument...
The thing that drives me insane about this argument from the SEC/big 10 that's just redundant – if you're so good, and so confident in yourself, then you don't need bids - you'll get them every year.
But that's really their angle. Its not about competition...its about eliminating it.
If we've learned anything from the first few games of the CFP, its that there aren't really 12 teams with any legitimate shot at winning the Championship (or even advancing for that matter) so arguing over the last 2-3 teams in is really a waste of energy.
But the perception of having more "deserving" teams is valuable to Conferences in terms of prestige and the almighty TV $$$ which has really become the only thing that actually matters from a macro perspective.
Yeah it really angers me. SMU had a shit day and got blown out - that happens. Their QB crumbled under the cold and the environment and his OL did him no favors. That stuff happens. But they were absolutely more deserving than some 3 loss SEC team IMO. Don't care that it just means more" or whatever in the SEC.
I hate that the networks start these narratives because you're right - at the end of the day this is all about $$$ and nothing more. They want to contrive these big time matchups for ratings and think big brand teams will bring in more eyeballs and give them a higher chance of a really close game. But sometimes teams just have a bad day and get blown out. I remember just a few years ago a heavyweight national title game between Bama and Ohio State, and Bama blew the doors off OSU. Was OSU not deserving? Clemson blew the doors off Bama in the title game in 2018, I guess Bama wasn't deserving then either.
Just put the teams in there and let it play out. I just hate the networks always scheming for more $ and ratings.
this is a 7-0 SMU lead if not for three very bad choices by the SMU QB
James Franklin is an absolute idiot.
Up two scores with all the momentum.. defense is dominating.
And you give them a short field to put them back in the game.
Edit: NVM...Jennings going for all-time record for INTs bailing him out.
At what point does Lashlee pull the plug here?
The only thing worse than Franklin in this game is Jennings. He's going to hand this one to dear old James.
I'm seeing a lot of the same game management errors with PSU as we see with Tech. Questionable calls to go for it on fourth, and when the offense is driving and has momentum, a random trick/gadget play out of nowhere that almost backfired horribly.
https://www.instagram.com/reel/DD1APFmMJgO/?igsh=NndhbzNiZmo5YjBl
SMU's complete inability to take care of the ball in the only reason this is not a game.
Jennings making plays all over the field. Too bad most of them are for PSU. 🙄🙄
Yes and no. Jennings has absolutely been a mess but PSUs defensive front is mauling SMU.
Big part of the reason why Jennings keeps having happy feet.
Agree he is under duress. But he is also playing recklessly with the ball.
Sounds like when they had like 9 turnovers against duke, but still somehow won... minus the winning
This right here is why the ACC gets no respect and deservedly so. SMU's QB completely shitting the bed and handing the game to PSU.
SMU's OL looks completely overmatched
This would be a tight game if SMU's QB didn't make some god awful decisions under pressure. You can tell coach told him to throw it away instead of forcing it after his 100th interception this game. 21 points off turnovers...yikes
Penn St. getting free Rusher off the edge whenever they want.
SMU doesn't look prepared for the cold or the noise.
hard to do either when you play in texas and your stadium seats
3332kedit: or 34k... wikipedia has no idea what the actual capacity is
Lots of teams bring in outside noise to practice.
Not saying that would have changed the outcome here tremendously but Jennings has had his hands up to his ears repeatedly
I noticed the same. Pretty clear he's not used to this kind of environment, and the neither are the coaches otherwise they would have had them better prepared.
Tony Rojas is legit
Jennings is having a rough day, but his receivers have done nothing to help him out.
PSU playing almost entire 4th Q with backup (who is really 3rd string) QB.
#goACC..
Maybe Jim Philips can call Jordan Travis and see if he can help..lol
James Franklin is such a clown. Going full ballistic on the sideline that his backup threw and interception up 5 scores.
It's such a dabo move.
Dear football gods, please let klempson get throttled!
If Clemson doesn't at least keep this game close all they are going to pump is auto bids for sec and b10
They will do this anyway. It is the P2 and the feeder minor leagues.
Texas runs same run play with no resistance. Old school football, make them stop what they can't, then throw over the top
Damn, now Clemson going to get boatraced. Typical #goACC. We will be lucky to get the champion a playoff bid next year year.
Taking TDs away from them on interceptions really doesn't help. SEC bias is strong.
Glad I'm not the only one who thought that flag was weak.
Texas didn't get a penalty called on them until the fourth quarter.
i hate texas. everything about texas. the state. the people. all garbage.
I can't watch Texas or Oklahoma on tv because they play their stupid ass fight songs after every play. Texas playing "I've been working on the railroad" would be the dumbest thing that ever happened in a football game if it weren't for UVA.
this is a hysterical comment, but also: the FSU Warchant would like a word.
Yes , the warchant is the worst, and it's constant.
The gator chomp is pretty annoying too.
And then those idiots down there in Auburn screaming "war damn eagle" all the time.
Truer words have never been spoken.
I would pay to see McConaughey vs Dabo in a bullshitting contest.
Clemson looks tiny compared to Texas. Now seeing the effects of Dabo not wanting to use the portal. Program in decline for sure.
Yep. Clemson (being ACC) is suffering a similar fate as we are. And I agree Dabo's hard headed stubborn refusal to adjust to the current college football environment is catching up to Clemson.
This.
Good. Couldn't happen to a shittier fan base.
Agreed. Except for my Pastor, who is indeed the real deal, is a huge Clemson fan so I feel for him.
Only (and I mean only reason) I pull for Clemson is that we are tied at the hip (thanks to a shitty TV contract) to them and need some semblance of respectability out of the ACC. At least until we get our own act straightened out and take the conference back.
So SMU gone (which yeah I get is technically ACC, thanks Jim Phillips you little twerp) and Clemson gone. So now the nearest claim to fame the ACC has to root for is Notre Dame. 🙄🙄
Time to root for Arizona state and Boise state.
I say all first and second round playoff games played at home stadiums. Way more electric playoff atmosphere than bowls. The only three bowls that should be involved are the Sugar, Orange, and Rose. Those should be your semis and national title game, alternate each year.
Tennessee is showing that obviously the SEC isn't as good as everyone thought, probably didn't deserve an entrance into the playoffs
That's how this works, right?
Nah, it's just a quality loss for an SEC power.
Actually no looks like their star RB is mysteriously out for "hamstring tightness." Setting this up for an injury excuse. Bet if they get back in this game he'll be back out on the field pretty quickly.
ut is the most overrated program in the history of cfb lol
So far, the more talented team has won every game handily.
Is it that or home field advantage?
The crowds have been pretty good so far. Way better than a neutral site game.
How playoffs are supposed to be. They've been great.
Agreed. Would love to have playoff game in Lane. That would be awesome.
In my CFB '25 dynasty Cartoons Plural took the Hokies to the playoffs in year two with a first round snow game in Lane. It was beautiful.
Home field advantage is at most ~3 point advantage. Not a multi score advantage.
I talked about how awesome the sky cast is last night on the other bowls thread, but the SECN one-upped it with the Tenn radio guys calling the game. Screw the SEC/Tenn, but man I would love to have a Hokie sky cast with Roth and Burnop.
An 8 team playoff would be fine.
Edit: I often think of this piece by Phil Steele where he goes through the entire BCS period, and looks at what an ideal playoff would look like. In an ideal world, I think the committee would look at the field each year, and decide on a cutoff line. Maybe it's 2 teams, 4 teams, 6, 8, 16, etc.
12 teams in this format is going to take 4 weeks and I love the home playoff games, but the way they did it to appease the bowls is silly. It should be P-whatever champions, 1-2 G5 champs, and the rest at-large to add up to 8 teams.
Totally agree on this one.
My primary take-away from this Weekend is there aren't 12 teams that are nearly on a Championship level.
8 would be fine, but then the talking heads on ESPN would just argue more.
My expectation is a push to expand to 16 even though it's clearly not warranted or needed.
There's about one season every decade where there's more than 3 'championship level' teams. Most years it's 1-2.
I came here to say exactly this just now. All the four bottom seeds lost handily. I think an 8 team playoff would be plenty. Playing until Jan 20 is just too long a season honestly.
We should get rid of 16 seeds in the ncaa tournament too because they always lose.
IMO the only problem with the 12 team playoff is the scheduling. Which is a problem with a lot of college football, shouldn't wait nearly this long to play the first round of games.
That's my main problem with it. Not opposed to 12 but the season being extended almost two months from the end of the regular season through championship weekend and then four rounds of the playoff is pretty crazy. They needed to have the first round last weekend and the second round should have been this weekend. Semis around New Years and championship game the week after as has been the case for a while now. I also think the first two rounds need to be at the team's home stadiums (way better environment for playoffs and less neutral site travel), then the Sugar/Orange/Rose host the semis and national championship each year and rotate.
If that's your logic, then every team should have a go at the playoff.
Nobody said this but you.
Go touch grass.
The 2018 Hoos would like a word.
I get you are making an argument, but selfishly I would be fine with getting rid of the 16 seed just to stick the Hoos with a shame that could never be matched.
Yeah I mean the low seeded teams are going to be a blowout usually. It's when they aren't that college sports are fun. Realistically we can eyeball the best 2 teams every year that are head and shoulders better than every other team but it wasn't very exciting to just shoehorn them in (especially now that it's the same cycle of 5 teams).
There has rarely been a year where more than 3 teams are good enough to be the champion.
I agree I even said as much but that's a poor argument to do away with the playoff.
College football and basketball both had something unique, basketball still has the tourney, and it delivers. Football has nothing which meant every week mattered. No other sport would you be out of you own control with a single loss. It was amazing, September mattered, now it doesn't matter until late December. What was 3 months is now 3 weeks all for what? An OSU team to have more losses than Oregon, that win the same conference and lost to OSU to be crowned champions? This isn't the NFL where 6-8 or so teams have a legit shot at the championship, its even less. We've removed the importance of 98% of the games played for maybe 3 teams. We never needed a national title game much less a playoff.
This is the argument I was making several years ago.
There are too many teams and not enough games played to even get close to seeding a playoff.
Keep it at conference championships and a small number of key invitational bowl games and allow the argumentation in the offseason.
Does it? I watch the first weekend, and that's about it now. BUT that might be a mean thing, not a tournament or everyone else thing.
I do know that the college basketball regular season is getting less and less viewership every year. I too rarely watch college basketball. Part of it is because I'd rather watch other sports like college football and tennis, but for the last decade, it feels like college basketball just doesn't matter until March.
People love upsets in the hoops tourney - EARLY... that's it. They don't like sister jean beating kansas in the elite 8- those games get the worst viewership of the tourney. If it's early- first round- you never hear Seth Greenberg say UMBC didn't belong like they do in football. That's fun, that's romantic about the tourney, but the further you go, the more people hate the little guy - like they do in college football. Everyone hates Boise, ASU, etc. this year. Everyone hated Indiana- killed them in every way... That's the difference from hoops.
Yup - the best possible elite 8 (for national interest) is Kansas, Duke, UNC, Indiana, UCLA, Michigan, Kentucky, and one 16-seed.
For anyone still hanging on, the ESPN Field Pass w Pat McAfee is the only entertaining way to finish watching this game.
what an ugly weekend
not one competitive or fun watch, unless you're a fan of the home
So after a Saturday of Snoozers (Clemson-Tx was borderline competitive at best), here's how I would propose the CFP be done:
1. 8 Teams, ordered by Ranking. No Autobids at all. First Round on Campus, top 4 seeds get home Games.
2. Teams are chosen by a Computer. No human bias....no Warde Manual to talk out of both sides of his mouth. Certainly, we can create an algorithm to weight the relative value of wins/losses based on S.O.S and Opponent metrics at this point. No useless committee and no $1200 Conference rooms to rent. No Greg Sankey attempting to put his thumb on the scale.
3. 2nd Round/Semis played at Neutral Sites Rotating between 4 Major Bowls (Rose, Sugar, Orange, Fiesta). Sorry Cotton and Peach.
4. Championship Game Like it has been in the past--Neutral site as well, stand-alone game. Warm-weather or Indoor Stadium.
Reasons why this will never happen:
-Most obviously, now that it has been expanded to 12, there is no way that people are going to accept less. Like so many other things in CFB, putting Pandora back in the Box isn't gonna happen.
-Tangential to above---- TV Money and E$$$PN---less games is less dollars, and TV Executives are the real people who run college football at this point.
-The Bowls would revolt--the 2 Semi sites would be must-see each year while the others would be less relevant than ever because 4 of the top 8 would already be eliminated.
-SEC and B1G would lose their minds not getting Autobids
-People wouldn't "trust the computers" even though they would obviously not have selection bias. For ESPN, paying a bunch of talking heads to debate the Playoff Committee rankings each week is also content.
I want no part of a system that does not guarantee conference champions a shot at the title. If we let the talking heads get their way it'll be the SEC Invitational every year, we have to have regulations in place that prevent that from happening.
And quite frankly I don't care that games were not competitive this weekend. Keep things as they are. The second that players realize they can go anywhere and have a legit shot at a title the talent will become more distributed and the quality of playoff games will improve. Just have to give it time.
Sure, no one wants this to be SEC v. B1G challenge just in football, but how do you even define a Conference Champion at this point with the conferences so bloated?
ACC is a perfect example SMU, Clemson and Miami never played each other. I think after watching yesterday, it's really hard to imagine that Cam Ward wouldn't have been more up to the task than Kevin Jennings.
I would much rather have interesting games than what we had yesterday.
And as far as players..I think the narrative that they are going to recieve is this: if you want a real shot to win a Championship--you go to OSU, TX, Georgia, ect...which they already are. Since they can transfer whenever they want, get paid, and keep playing more or less indefinitely by filing a lawsuit, there's no risk to being the 4th 5* WR to commit somewhere.
We need to have true revenue sharing and collective bargaining with all conferences involved to start with. Then I think we need conference retraction long term because these bloated super conferences just aren't sustainable. More, smaller conferences again so you can play a true round robin schedule or at least divisional format that makes sense, and all conference champs get autobids. Then the conference championship is basically a de facto first round of the playoff. Should only have 2-4 at large teams max.
If we got back to a P6 with six ten member conferences (60 teams), all champs get autobids, plus a few G5 champs, and 3-4 at large teams max, I think that's a great playoff setup.
Oh 1000% agree.
Problem is, there is no motivation for any of the Conferences (particularly the P2) to do that.
In light of that not happening, I am interested in seeing competitive football games rather than trying to pretend like SMU, Indiana, and Arizona St. have any realistic chance of competing.
I want to be in the room when you tell the SEC they have to kick out 8 teams and the B!G that they are splitting East - West into two different conferences.
If ESPN wants it, they'll make it so.
Nah, SEC and Big 10 will have two divisions each where the divisions will have a title game, still the SEC, still the Big Ten, but different. It will just redefine what conferences and divisions are because of how tv contracts work.
This is what I was talking about. With conferences this big, you have to go to a pod format. 4 pods of 4-6 teams each. Incorporate the conference race into the playoffs. Either that or more smaller conferences.
Right now there are 16 Big12 teams, 17 ACC, 18 B1G, and 16 SEC teams, and ND. That means it the top level there are 68 teams ... which sucks as a number. So OSUw and WSU come back, we add Boise and whomever else to get 72.
So 4 conferences, 18 teams, two divisions of 9, or we really consolidate and have two conferences (SEC/Big10) with 6 divisons of 6. This means everyone divisions winner gets a playoff berth. Make it a 16 teams play off and add the top G5 and 3 at larges and be done with it.
Same - the playoff teams need to be determined by conference championships, not by computer or by coaches or the AP. If that's allowed then we just get right back to where we were. Under a caste system like that we don't get Arizona St or Boise St in these playoffs. A conference-based system could potentially have the affect of a rebalance of power for the schools that are smart about it and choosing to relocate to a non-P4 conference for the purpose of winning championships. That might only work for a short while until there's a total realization that true geography-based conferences without historical rivalries is the way to go.
I stopped reading here. This won't do anything to solve the issues with the cfp. You need to shrink it back down to 4 and make conference championship a requirement to make it in. Top 4 ranked conference champions get in. Hard stop.
You want to play in the playoff? Win your fucking conference. Too many goddamn snowflakes in cfb now. Everyone wants a shot and the sec and big think they are entitled and nobody is more butthurt at not getting in than sec and big fans. Fucking softies.
Alabama whining about not getting in with three losses is a perfect example. Want to be in the playoffs? Don't lose three games. I don't care who you lost to, win or go home, babies.
Exactly. Lord knows they'd be saying the same thing if the shoe were on the other foot.
2." Teams are chosen by a Computer. No human bias....no Warde Manual to talk out of both sides of his mouth. Certainly, we can create an algorithm to weight the relative value of wins/losses based on S.O.S and Opponent metrics at this point. No useless committee and no $1200 Conference rooms to rent. No Greg Sankey attempting to put his thumb on the scale." - This issue with this was that teams will game the computers like they did in hoops when it was heavily RPI rated. Football teams will figure out how to schedule "tough" games on paper but not reality. Bama will schedule an OOC game with a P4 team that also plays tough teams to boost their computer rankings- whether or not said team is actually "good". This is how the A 10 would get 6 teams in the NCAA tourney. When it is perceived that playing at Rhode Island in front of 2K people is a "tough" game, you get credit for a tough game. That's the issues with the computers.
it needs to be settled on the field. no committee. no computers. hell, no rankings for all I care (but I know the talking heads need that to drive traffic, etc)
each conference gets to place their champion in the playoff. Hard stop. Each conference has to structure a league schedule that creates a route for each of its members to win the league indisputably. Each conference needs to allow each team in their league to schedule a set number of non-conference games. It's up to the individual teams to decide what those non-con games are.
If you have more conferences than you have playoff spots, then the strength of your conference champion is subject of debate. But if you want to even be near the conversation, you need to win your league. That makes every game matter. And I don't give two shits if the "two best teams" in the country are in the same conference. Too fucking bad. One of them has to win the league and only one of them gets to the playoff. Prove it on the field. If you're not able to beat the best team in your league you're not championship worthy. I'm tired of these second chance bullshit opportunities that 2-loss teams get just because "they played a harder schedule". STFU. Win the games you play. Let your play on the field speak for itself. Bunch of GD snowflakes.
What I liked about the BCS was the transparency of it all. They published the computer algorithms that determined your rating so everyone knew objectively what they needed to do to be successful. There was still the bullshit human element with the Coaches and AP polls, but so much of the beauty pageant mess was mitigated by the computers and it made the seasons enjoyable, because it was the best system we had that took bias out of the equation.
Of course, the logic involved is exactly why we no longer use computers. There's no controversy to be had with logical objective formulas determining ratings. Its hard to stack the deck in your favor when everything needs to be transparent.
Indiana loses by 10:
SEC darling Tennessee loses by 25:
Yep, that's a perfect example of SEC entitlement right there. Ironically, I think this year's playoffs may end up showing that the SEC isn't actually very good this year.
If Ohio State didn't have to play Oregon next week, I think there would be a very good chance that 3 of the 4 semifinal teams would be Big 10, because I'd favor either of those teams against Texas, and certainly Penn State over Boise State. I'll also take Notre Dame over a very overrated Georgia.
The Herbstreit simping continues...
Time to reset the voices that matter in College Football. Herbstreit and Finebaum and all the other "Media" members simping for an all SEC CFP can go with them while they play with each other. WINS matter.
That is just shamelessly setting the table for the national media to completely discount and disqualify anyone but the SEC from having a seat at the playoff table.
Such fucking horseshit. I used to respect this man but he whored himself out HARD for the SEC over the last 10 years or so, and now he's nothing more than a SEC shill with the biggest platform to spew whatever talking point the league front office wants to focus on this week. He single handedly led the charge into dismissing the entire FSU undefeated season last year because of one injury and now he's laying the groundwork to preemptively apply that same disqualification it for the vast majority of teams in college football before the games are even played because they don't have the correct conference patch on their jersey.
Case in point, a few years back, look at his argument when it came to discounting his own alma mater so that it would benefit the SEC
He's everything that is wrong about college sports right now. Absolute personification of the greed and grift that it has all become. Two faced hypocritical asshole who will spew whatever bullshit he needs in order to satisfy whatever agenda he's being told to support this week. The only morals he has anymore is to do whatever is best for the SEC, and not college football in general. Fuck him.
It's the company line, and he works for the company.
And they want all the pie for themselves.
I'd take the magic computer BCS selections back please. I'm tired of ESPN and the media raising and sinking entire conferences just based on what they say.
Just as long as the rankings are not a criteria because otherwise that's how they would game the computers. Independent body determines Strength of Schedule criteria.
The B1G and SEC are on record saying they won't agree to playoff expansion unless they get multiple automatic bids.
Great then don't expand it or the rest of football can tell them to go spin on a stick
This year if anything makes a case for contracting the playoff- absolute shit games thus far. 8 teams would have been enough.
yupp we have so many independent advanced analytics now, find an independent model that's consistent and limits subjectivity and run with it.
ain't no way the SEC will agree to an independent body determining SoS because then someone might actually take a critical look at their OOC scheduling and realize that the conference is famous for never playing true away games and any neutral site has to be solidly within their footprint.
Yep if you say Florida, Kentucky, USCe, Miss State, Missouri are great teams, impossible places to win over and over and over again, despite no truth to it, you feed the machine.
Pretty sure the BCS rankings (had they been continued) would have matched cfp selection every year until FSU was left out.
I'm all for computer rankings. Just publicize the algorithm(s).
Which is fine, I think they got it right this year but its the continued narrative that drives me nuts and IMO will eventually lead to the committee being weaponized to support the $EC.
Total agreement
Just saying that the BCS rankings are historically pretty aligned with the committees decisions
Oh they are 100% going to kill the fucking golden goose. 100% . Herbstreit is rich because college football is a passionate regional sport with a meaningful regular season. He's living proof- is e famous for his fucking NFL thursday night gig? Does anyone give a shit that he calls Rams Saints on a random thursday? no. But they tune in to watch him on Saturday mornings. Why? because it used to mean something to be a VT fan, an - insert not SEC- team fan. If they continue to simp for one conference and give them 4, 5,6 auto bids in the playoffs- the regular season is meaningless- much like it was for Tennessee and Penn State this year... lose to the best teams you play, get in the playoff. Tennessee Bama was MUCH bigger when the loser went home basically. They will kill it soon enough
Imagine if this is how the NFL worked, where being the best on paper was more important than your record. Detroit would be getting hammered by the media just like FSU did when the injuries hit, Minnesota might be on a pedestal (higher than KC) because of their SOS, and the Ravens would be a lock because they have Jackson at QB despite being tied in their division w Pittsburgh, splitting the season, and Pittsburgh having a more difficult schedule.
If the NFL operated like college the 2017 Eagles wouldn't have been allowed in the playoffs after Wentz hurt his knee and Foles would have never been allowed to go on the run he did. But the unexpected is what is great about sports. The most deserving teams don't always win. The big money doesn't always win.
ESPN is actively trying to make sure their investments always cash, rigging the desk in their favor. And it's bullshit.
Exactly. I mean why play the game? I could care less who is "better". Have some criteria and let teams play it out. If they're right, the winner should be who they think it is. We've watched Bama lose to two 6-6 teams. Give some other teams that have merit or meet certain criteria a chance. If we don't, what's the point in playing the game.
ESPN has somehow gaslit a major portion of their audience into thinking that wins and losses don't matter, the only thing that matters is how good we think a team is. That is what this is all built upon. There is controversy because they've spent time and money propping up certain teams and certain conferences and they need to make sure that investment pays.
That's it. That's what this is all about. They will throw any agenda in your face that they can to argue their case on why their chosen teams should get preferential treatment and enough people have sucked down the kool-aid for so long that the mindless masses will fall in line and argue it for them. They don't care who their teams lose to, they don't care what your teams do, they will go out of your way to trash your teams as long as theirs get their way.
With the way ESPN is trying to stack the deck now, I honestly don't think that the 1999 VT team gets a chance to play for the national title if the current discourse existed back then. Assholes like Herbie would be front and center saying how some 2 loss SEC team was more deserving than an undefeated because of their "brutal" SEC conference schedule.
And the worst part is that ESPN has significant pull on the playoff committee. So whatever they push now is going to be the norm in a couple years time.
Yep- if you follow ESPN's logic, Bama gets in because the have 3 great wins.. even if they went 3-9. losses don't matter.
A bit extreme, but also true
VT 99 team did have 4 wins over ranked opponents- #24 UVA 31-7; #16 Syracuse 62-0!!; #19 Miami 43-10; and #22 BC 38-14)- all by 14 or more points; only wins by less than 20 were @Pitt 30-17 and @WVU 22-20.
The shitbag is still at it
Got to build the house for the $EC to live in....
It's funny how they keep harping on Indiana and to a lesser degree Clemson about not being one of the best, but nothing, not a word about Tennessee losing and they lost by the biggest margin.
And it wasn't as close as the 25 point loss indicated...
This right here. This is the ESPN spin in full force. Tennessee is excused because they deserved to be there for reasons that you're just expected to know and SMU and Indiana are "frauds" because they didn't for reasons you're just expected to know.
ESPN isn't even trying to hide the manipulation anymore. They're not even trying to pretend they're not in bed with the SEC. Its blatant, its out in the open, and they're flaunting it for us all to watch in real time.
Nothing new... in the BCS days, any SEC team that lost "didn't want to be there", "It was a let down", etc. nothing new.
This SEC problem didn't exist until ~2007 when the SEC went on their run of championships which didn't end until FSU stopped the trend, against Auburn. It was also the first time an SEC team lost the game when they weren't playing another SEC opponent.
I would absolutely love it if the remainder of college football abandoned the NCAA and formed its own league, leaving ESPN alone w just the SEC. I have no idea if it would work out, but you would have a national champion every year, and then you would have ESPN's SEC "champion".
Im Finally fully on this bandwagon. Let the SEC and the big 10-13-15-18 be there own God damn League. Fuck them let them claim a club championship and then let the rest of us actual have an actual championship. All we have to do is make a bigger trophy than they do! Then ours means more!
Oh yeah- we all also refuse to play them all year, including FCS. Let them just play each other in one big circle jerk.
I would love this- seriously
And then watch as the Vanderbilts, Missouris, Marylands, Rutgers,etc beg us to take them back when they realize they will NEVER FUCKING WIN ANYTHING IN THAT CLUB AND THEY ARE ONLY THERE TO GIVE EVERYBODY ELSE THE EASY WINS THEY USED TO GET FROM FCS TEAMS. and of course, the haves will have already taken away the equal revenue sharing from those teams. And we can all tell them all to fuck off as they lose TV contracts as they become irrelevant because it all becomes just too boring and nobody watches anymore. It might take 30 years, but it'll happen.
This is the way
Some form of this is going to happen sooner rather than later. The Top 20-ish "brands" with the most TV appeal will split off and form their own league and voila, there we go. The SEC and the BIG can't kick out charter members, but Georgia, Michigan, Alabama, anOSU, etc can all leave those conferences for a new structure. That's the only way to make the line go up and make the money go up at a certain point. And frankly I hope they do it as quickly as possible so I can go back to enjoying competitive games.
Man I just want to watch a VT game without being bombarded with discussions about a playoff rather than the game we are actively watching.
Hell, I'm still bitter about the ACC Championship Game last year where ESPN spent the entire broadcast shitting all over both ACC squads in an effort to manipulate the playoff picture. It actively makes watching games miserable from a fan perspective.
Yeap. At some point, Alabama has more in common with Southern Cal than they do with Mississippi state.
And that's when it all falls apart.
For the life of me, I can't understand why people continue to watch
I mean, I still enjoy the sport. I definitely have a lot of concern for the future of the sport, but I still enjoy every college football Saturday.
Because of all of the above, I watch VT games exclusively. Only watch others while tailgating (before and after depending on game) and we constant switch for the most competitive game, not the 'brand name' game. Mostly watching quads (four games on one TV).
No need to to change.
This right here, except, I don't even watch VT on ESPN. In fact I won't watch anything on ESPN unless I am at a bar where it's on a TV. It's time to stop giving those clowns eyeballs.
I just turn the volume off
Beck is done for the season per ESPN. I think ESPN still would have found a reason to include them in the playoffs even if they had lost to Texas. Given what happened to FSU last year, under the same rules, would have the SEC conference champ who lost their starting QB have been punished because they were the same caliber team? I think we all know the Mouse's answer.
And THIS is the problem about trying to find the best teams rather than just taking the ones who earn it on the field.
Penn St. got an incredible draw.
This game looks less competitive than SMU.
Lmao and.....it's over already.
Boise is straight garbage. PSU walking into the semis.
I'm not about to go that far. What I will say is that PSU is executing to perfection on offense. Those two TD passes could not have been placed any more perfectly than they were.
Wow
Welp, Boise I guess the lights are too bright
They are simply being out talented on both lines. And PSU's talent is a step and a half ahead of theirs.
Yep...bigger, stronger, faster.
Boys vs. Men out there.
SMU's D at least showed up before Jennings imploded. This isn't even competitive if you squint really hard.
Semi-pros vs. Pros.
Surrenderer cobra sighting already on the BSU sideline
And the happy Cobra takes over
Guess the narrative:
Boise wins - They gained an unfair advantage with the bye. Penn State was the more deserving team.
Penn St wins - The better team won and it is obvious they should have had the bye to begin with.
Either way the obvious answer is we need more Autobids for the B1G and SEC
Pry's friend or not, man James Franklin has a punchable face. Can't stand that guy.
Boise St coach was like five yards on field calling for a false start on that FG.
Only slightly less aggro than Shane Beamer trying to throw hands with Brett Bielema.
Bielema was asking for it
Oh, for sure. That was some BS.
Bielema is Butt-Head's dad.
I still refer to him as coach Dodsworth.
Aaaaand we've got a game
such shitty OL play this game lol
This game is competitive due only to Penn State's ineptitude.
They have a tremendous advantage on the fronts and could steamroll Boise downfield running the ball, but they continue to try to pass so they can prove they are "diverse"
That 3rd and 1 was a perfect example. Tried to get cute with the pass.
Oh no! Jeanty only has 59 yards rushing, going into the 4th; what on earth are we gonna do?
He could enter the portal between quarters and sign with Penn State to finish it out behind a better line and get the record. DC would say, hey it's possible just do it.
DC would say, hey it's possible just do it.
Bama, OSU etc already are. Have been for years.
What would the NCAA (lol) do to Boise? after a 3 year investigation into Jeanty playing for Penn State the second half? let them self impose a bowl ban for the potato bowl?
They'd take away their championship, which well everyone remembers so not really a punishment, PSU already would have sold the memorabilia. I mean the NCAA let a player punch a bunch of people right before the game and nothing happened so ...
Penn State playing dirty, lots of penalties and a few cheap shots
I don't understand Boise continuing to run Jeanty up the middle. Get him outside that Penn State defensive line.
....and even under two minutes they continue to send him right up the middle. Just stupid.
Late Penn State sub was offside on that sack at the 20 yard line. No flag
Boise kicker better find his own way home. Two missed FG in a 10 point game.
Say what you rightly want about Boise being outclassed, but a TD wins it for Boise with a decent kicker.
Edit: nvm, it's fixed
Well going to have to wait even longer for our DC thanks to dear old James.
This is one of those games where it's too bad both teams can't lose.
At least Barry's record looks safe. Would hate to see him lose it to someone that plays in a shit conference against shit competition in more games
Agree here. Don't like PSU at all, but I also dislike Boise a lot. Ever since Kellen Moore came out grinning and they beat us in 2010. Have always thought they are incredibly overrated and play a garbage schedule.
I can't stand pedo state for obvious reasons but I also can't stand boise. My experience with their fans at FedEx was horrible. Most entitled, whiny, arrogant fucktards i've ever encountered at a game. The only fans that may be worse are the ND St fans who purchase their hotel rooms to the national championship at least a year in advance.
Now to clarify my earlier drunken comment about Jeanty: I do think he's a heck of a RB and has uncanny balance especially after contact, however my point still stands- Barry was the greatest and deserves to have that record until the Earth blows up
Barry record was safe regardless. Barry did it in at least 2 less games.
Serious question - is Franklin keeping Dex quarantined or something? Haven't seen a glimpse of him on the sideline last two games since smoke around him and our DC position, not even a mention of him.
Nvm think I finally caught a glimpse of him.
CFP games 0-5 for me. Not compelling or interesting, ESPN just trying desperately to drum up ratings. Think this is just too long a season for college. I'm ready for it to be over but we've got 3 weeks to go still with this.
I enjoyed the PSU game
It was closer than it should have been, but only because of many PSU mishaps. Boise was clearly out talented from the opening snap. There wasn't a single point from the time PSU went up 14-0 in the 1st that I thought Boise would seriously win the game.
IDK, when Boise got 2 or 3 straight stops, and scored a TD, I thought it was possible.
Back to your original point about the CFP not being fun... I think CFB is a sport of blowouts. It's routine to see 4+ TD spreads. I don't think there's anyway to design a playoff where you're not getting blowouts in ~50% of the games.
Yeah, it just happens in football. I can't think of a sport that has better parity than the NFL, and five teams won by 4 scores last week.
I don't think it's necessarily a problem with the playoff itself, the issue is the talking heads pointing to the lopsided score and saying the loser didn't deserve to be there in the first place (as long as the loser isn't an SEC team).
People who want the CFP to exclude non P2 teams will say Boise didn't deserve their slot, but I think that's a false narrative. Sometimes you just get beat. I think Boise absolutely had a chance to win, but you can't drive the length of the field twice in the second half and come away with zero points. They convert on those two drives and it's a different ballgame in the fourth quarter.
There's just too much a talent skew toward the P2 programs now IMO. You're rarely if ever going to see the mid-majors shock those teams anymore. Not saying it could never happen, but increasingly unlikely. College basketball is a sport where almost anyone could lose on a given day if they're cold and the other team is hot, but in football the teams with the jimmies and joes are just going to wear you out and overwhelm you 99% of the time.
I think a 12 team playoff is likely too much. There aren't that many elite teams in a given year that could legitimately contend for it. 6-8 seems better. You're going to get a lot of squash games like we've seen with a 12 team field. But most likely they keep it at 12 and eventually the SEC and Big Ten just get a ton of guaranteed autobids. This is ultimately about money and nothing else anyway.
Really hadn't looked at the stats so this surprised me a bit
Womp womp, better luck next time kid...
I need to know what Kirk thinks.
Fuck that simp
He doesn't, that's the problem...
Whatever ESPN tells him to think.
Looks like another "competitive" playoff game 🙄
Man I hope I am wrong and ASU can turn this around.
If ASU had any kind of passing game, they'd be winning
Special teams is difference today. Blocked field goal by Texas and the TD off of the return. Just there is 10 point swing.
Texas olineman just blatantly tackled an asu dlineman on that touchdown. No call.
I wanted all of the playoff games to suck, but the fourth quarter of this game has been crazy.
Let's go Sun Devils!
I'm want a non-SEC/Big 10 champion so bad I can taste it.
TARGETING 100%
SPINELESS REFS
Exactly. Textbook definition.
These refs need to turn in their stripes.
I would be ashamed of myself for that call regardless of how big the SEC check is.
Ehhh it was facemask to facemask. He did not launch or lead with the crown of his helmet. I can see why they ruled it that way.
Same thoughts. I didn't think he was doing anything egregious.
I agreed with the no targeting against Texas. Especially as they didn't call targeting the other way earlier in the quarter when the ASU player clearly launched at a helpless WR.
Looks like the fix is in and Texas given the win with the no call
That was the clearest instance of targeting I've ever seen. Literally the textbook definition.
LMAO wow the refs bailed Texas out big, idk how that wasn't targeting
LOL that was karma
OT baby! Can't let Texas win after choking away the refs gift.
Doink!
Texas is going to have a lot to complain about this off season if they lose for why the refs didn't throw a phantom flag after that ball hit the upright.
lol if that was Texas, there wouldn't be a review
Holy shit. Go ASU!
wow, that was a ballsy play call, AND a 2 PT conversion
I don't know if i've seen worse defense than AzSt's 4th and 13 defense
I have no idea why they blitz there. Maybe hired Marve as an analyst??
Also, no idea what #7 was doing there, he bit up like the receiver was going to stop short of the sticks....
You must not be comparing it to Marve's 3rd and anything defense.
Yeah that blitz was miserably bad they sent 3 guys through the A gap and managed 0 pressure.
Deliberately deciding not to cover Golden is definitely an interesting choice.
Maybe ASU should have tried running it up the gut with Skippedeedoodah again.
Well that was fun while it lasted...
I think the no call Targeting on the ASU receiver was 100% right. He caught the ball and turned as a ball carrier with possession, while the tackle was NOT a lunch, NOT with the crown, textbook facemask up to protect the neck, a wrap up tackle rather than, again, a launch. etc. I think the ASU pick in the 4th where the guy absolutely cleaned Bond's clock from the opposite direction was a real defenseless receiver situation, and they didn't even review that one.
Interesting. I don't see how he's not defenseless he could do nothing to protect himself as he hadn't even finished turning around. IMO the way the rule is written it was targeting (defenseless + forceable contact) but the rule is terrible and that was a textbook tackle.
The defenseless route is the only way to make the argument for targeting, and that's sort of the problem here, that definition is not so clear. Obviously whoever was in the booth saw it the way I did, not defenseless, but it also raises the question on the Isaiah Bond hit on the ASU pick, who seemed much more "defenseless" by any definition I can think of, and they didn't even review it.
IIRC they did review that
I thought they showed a replay on the broadcast but didn't go to the booth. I could be mistaken on that part.
Either way, that play was much more targeting than the one at the end.
The refs did review that one and correctly decided it was not targeting. didn't lean in and didn't even hit his helmet. The review showed his head whiplashed because the contact to the receiver's shoulder stopped him so abruptly.
Respectfully, but I disagree. The ASU player launched into a defenseless receiver. The only reason it wasn't called targeting was A) It hit chest first before going into his facemask. B) It would have undone the interception and the game would have been over.
I think they would have gotten lynched if they called one targeting and the other not. The ASU pick play, the other ASU defender clearly launched into a defenseless receiver. It should have been targeting 100% of the time.
Ohio St. looking like that "best team money can buy" that was promised.
If they win it all, they will be the perfect example of what I warned about in the lead up to the 12 team playoff. It won't result in underdog national championships, the 12 team playoff will result in that super elite team who disappointingly lost two games, in this case, a respectable loss to Oregon and a not so respectable loss to a 6-5 Michigan team who could go band for band with some of our worst offenses at VT.
In the 12 team playoff era, they were punished with a home game, millions and millions of dollars of revenue and economic impact for Ohio State/Columbus, and as good a shot as anyone to win a national title.
Yeah I've been talking about this with a buddy of mine. I think the first round bye is actually way worse. There's just way too much time off (3.5 weeks) between the conference championship game and your first playoff game. And it's a neutral site game. You're basically going cold into a traditional bowl game, whereas your opponent just played 1.5 weeks ago and is more at game speed. Being a 5-8 seed honestly is where it's at, and you get that home game and the additional revenue to boot.
Exactly. The BYE for Oregon didn't even result in them playing fewer football games (potentially):
Oregon: (1) B1G championship (neutral), (2) Quarterfinal, (3) Semifinal, (4) Final.
Ohio State: (1) Home game Rd1, (2) Quarterfinal, (3) Semifinal, 4 (Final)
The only benefit for Oregon is that the B1G CCG is not technically an elimination game, so they only have to play 3 elimination games, but it's the same number of games, and when you factor in the revenue/economic impact on the town and surrounding area of a home game, it's really a no brainer.
The worst situation you can be in: Making and then losing your conference championship, but still making the playoff. Then you have to play (5) total games to finish the season.
Conference championships truly mean nothing anymore. They might as well just do away with those games honestly. The Big Ten champ who already beat Ohio State head to head and is 13-0 is currently getting boat raced by the best team on paper in the Big Ten. The conferences have gotten so big you don't even play half of the teams in your league, how can you call anyone a true champion?
Either do away with conference championships and put the top 12 ranked teams in, no championship auto bids. Or incorporate the conference races into the playoffs so there's a true elimination aspect. But that's going to require smaller conferences.
Any reasonable person knows that they should do away with conference championship games. The reason they will not is the same reason they were created- money. The SEC signed a TWO year agreement with birmingham initially for the SEC title game. Why? They didn't think it would last/make money. Spurrier said that and he also said that the league told him "this better be a great game" before they played in the first one. They won't get rid of the conference champ games until they stop being very very profitable from ESPN money.
Yep, I've been beating the same drum.
All we did was make the Michigan game less important.
Yep I always used 2021 Ohio State and 2022 Bama as examples of exactly what this Ohio State team is doing. In a 12 team, both of those teams would have gotten in with a home game, dodged their CCG, and both would have had a real shot at winning a title because of their elite talent. Bama was the only team to beat UGA (and twice) since 2020 until they lost to Ole Miss a couple months ago. That team with Bryce Young and Will Anderson would have at least had a chance to give 2022 UGA a game, much like they beat a better 2021 UGA when they had their two best WR's and their two starting corners, which they didn't have in the rematch. For that 2021 Ohio State team, they would have still had their 3 (4?) first round wide receivers and CJ Stroud, which would have given them a chance against either 21 UGA or Bama. However, I was fine with both of those teams not making the playoff, because they didn't earn it in the regular season by losing two critical regular season games. This Ohio State team lost 2 out of the 3 games they could realistically lose in the regular season, and now look poised and locked in to win a national title. Obviously, they could still lose to someone else, but it will be one of Texas, Georgia, Notre Dame, or Penn State who will stop them... Not exactly a list of underdog programs.
Though as I say that Oregon has made it 34-15 so it's not totally out of the realm of possibility that they could also lose to this Oregon, which is the number one overall seed.
Regardless, if Ohio State happens to win it all, they absolutely deserve it. Going 4-0 against the gauntlet of a 10-win Tennessee, undefeated Oregon, Texas, and then potentially Georgia makes you unquestionably the national champion and best team in the country. But if this is all just about the best teams going head to head to determine THE best team, and not the most deserving teams based on the regular season or conference races, then just scrap conference championship games and throw the top 12 teams in the bracket and call it a day. Rename it the College Football Pageant (CFP).
Of course. They would have earned it in the format that exists. My issue with expansion was always more about losing elements of what I think makes college football unique rather than it not being a legitimate way to handle a postseason.
If they are seeded based on rankings alone, then rankings shouldn't be allowed to be made until week 6.
ESPN and voters never punish Top 10 P2 teams properly when they lose. An SEC team loses to an unranked SEC and they go down 2 spots but stay in the Top 10 if not Top 5. ACC team loses to the same team and they're dropped to the 11-16 spots.
You know that the CFP doesn't drop rankings until week 10 or 11 right?
But the teams are still ranked preseason and early by the AP and coaches which heavily influence where teams open at when they release the first CFP rankings....
Sorry it was unclear, I meant no official rankings at all. Coaches, AP, none of them.
Unfortunately THAT will never happen and even if it somehow DID, there would still be 'unofficial rankings " that would be done and those would be used as the starting points in determining which wins and losses were 'quality wins/losses'...
Banning speech within the U.S. is a pretty tough cookie to get baked.
At this point, I'm pretty much down to this:
Please Lord, anyone but Penn State.
James Feanklin will lose to the first competent coach
Ohio State straight blowing the doors off of Oregon.
Correction:
I don't know if i've seen worse than ALL OF WHAT OREGON IS DOING
Never expected Ohio State to run roughshod over Oregon. 😳
Oregon got their first snap in Ohio State territory with 40 seconds in the first half
Let's just be happy we had a proper Big XII championship game with Texas vs AzSt
I hate college football.
I hear what you are saying. But would say "I hate what college football has turned into" instead.
I mean, this is the real answer.
But it didn't have the same impact.
I havent watched a single minute of any cfp games. they arent getting my viewership number.
oh I don't think I've watched a single CFP game live, ever. Like, anytime in the last 10 years, haha.
Then again I don't have TV, I just have streaming. If I want to watch a VT game or the important parts of the VT game, I have youtube. For everything else, I have y'all.
I'm with you. So far, have watched the following:
Iowa State game (recorded, not live)
Baylor game live
That's it.
Plan on watching VT game live.
No interest in anything else.
12% of the College football fanbase vehemently disagrees with you...fans of Ohio State, Georgia, Texas, Georgia, and Alabama i.e. the only teams with any hope of sustainable success in the current shitshow.
The other 88% are either somewhere along the path of losing interest or wasting their income donating to NIL collectives in some veiled hope that it has any benefit whatsoever.
NFL fans too. The NFL fans who are casual CFB viewers love where CFB is going. More helmet games, easier to watch future draft picks, better on-the-field-football, etc.
I'm turning into an NFL fan that's a casual CFB viewer. although really, that just means an NFL fan who's a casual VT viewer.
The TV ratings (zero.zero) , sparce attendance, and soon to be non existent/bankrupt UFL shows you that casual fans of american football don't care about the quality of the games- the UFL is a higher quality of player than 99% of college teams and it draws no interest. Casuals care about 1. betting and 2. rooting for the team their brothers wifes cousin went to- the big name. The name on the front of the jersey, not the back- 100%. I live in PHX. Last year very good seats to the fiesta bowl were 10-12 dollars or free from a number of car dealerships, etc, etc. Liberty played in the game. No interest. This year with the cult of penn state fans who show up for Drew Allar or Saquan Barkley or Joe Paterno or Franco Harris or Lavar Harrington or insert any fucking PSU player from the 757... tickets were uber expensive right up until kickoff. It will take 100 years for that to change.
Agreed...if most fans really cared about the "quality of the football", there wouldn't be 6 failed Spring Football leagues.
And even with a Celebrity owner and National TV partners, the UFL would be dead too wothout the NFL subsidizing it.
And I really doubt Steelers or Jaguars fans are watching Ohio State games intently trying to "scout" players. If they cared that much to start with, there are 2.5 months of endless NFL Draft prognostication on ESPN from February to Draft Day.
So if this holds up, the final four will be the 5, 6, 7, and 8 seeds. The first round bye has caused a lot of rust IMO.
Each of the scenarios was different. Texas and PSU were favorites (by Vegas), OSU hit their stride, but idk if that has anything to do with a bye. UGA down a starting QB
Need more way data points before I say the first round bye causes losses.
Irish with 17 points in 52 seconds of clock time between end of first half and beginning of second.
Nothing more I hate than really idiotic talking points... BUT they really should disqualify any team whose starting quarterback gets injured. Call it the Bulldog rule or something.
/FSU
Yeah, that was an amazing run at this level.
They are working hard in Q3 to give the game back though.
I wish their was a Herbstreit mute filter option. The play by play guy is ok but Herbie grates on my nerves.
We normally try to get out of Ohio in January and head somewhere in Central America. Watching bowls in Spanish is becoming something of a tradition. This ESPN Costa Rica crew is awesome.
Personally love how the commentators are ragging the ND OL and Joe Rudolph. Missed blocks, poor pass pro. Literally the one thing holding ND back from being out in front even more.
That PI was weak sauce.
So was that illegal motion BS penalty on ND's last drive. Refs have been clearly on UGA's side all game.
As weak as I've ever seen.
Yeah, the ball wasn't catchable as it hit the defender in the back.
And Bulldogs lose it on downs inside the ND 10.
It feels wrong to be rooting for historical underdog Notre Dame right now but I guess that is the best option remaining in the playoffs.
Sheesh that punt substitution play was nuts and ND got away with it. Crazy call, well done ND
Riley Leonard is playing possessed right now. I figured ND frowned upon that.
No it's cool, God made an exception for football.
Neither of these teams make me think they can beat Penn State unfortunately
Which sucks for us, need Penn State to lose so we can announce Dex as DC.
It sucks not having the public announcement yet, but I'm fairly confident all the players and recruits know. We keep signing guys with supposedly only "some phone and Zoom calls" with DC candidates. I think it's sewn up and the people who need to know already know.
No, Penn State needs to lose because they are Penn State. That's all the explanation that is needed.
I'm loving the SEC champ and their just means more bs getting taken to the woodshed right now.
No conference champions advanced in the playoffs. I didn't have that on my bracket predictions
Gotta love dumb postseason arguments based on this sport being too predictable.
LOL the guys tried to give him a Gatorade bath but he paused them... because... Molly was there? They backed down and Freeman was just like yeah give it to me.
OK I was born into ND and I got a grad degree from PSU so my loyalty is divided...
sike ND all the way baby let's go.
Yeah, that's clearly the horse play.
UGA lost.
So nice to yet another SEC eliminated. Only the psudo-SEC Texas left to be eliminated.
Findbums is gonna self implode
I totally love it. If it wasn't for ASU forgetting to cover a Texas guy on 4th-and-game in OT, there would be exactly ZERO SEC teams among the final four.
This is why the SEC wants a bunch of guaranteed berths in the playoffs - without The Godfather Nick Saban guaranteeing a national championship for the conference every 3 years they are not particularly remarkable.
Their argument for getting a bunch of teams in next year just evaporated.
As much as the SEC deserves their comeuppance this year, I feel much more strongly about the big ten needing to be put in their place. All of this is their fault
Whichever team wins the championship will be their head coaches first title. All four remaining have zero.
Thank God. Maybe the "playoff" isn't the worst of all evils
Only 2 active coaches have titles at the moment. Enter the new age.
i will never forgive uga for making me root for nd
Yup. It's like vomiting then eating said vomit
Maybe this will force a change in the host format moving forward. With every home team winning in the first round, and every team with a bye and being the listed home team losing, it's pretty clear that there's a lot to be said about NOT playing these games at a neutral site. Getting a bye after already having 3 weeks off looks completely irrelevant after the results for this round.
We know that perhaps as early as next year and certainly for 2026, the top 4 teams will get byes whether they are conference champs or not. That change is coming. What is also coming is whatever the committee can do to further tip the scales to the B1G and SEC, they will in fact do.
The format isn't broken, there is no reason to fix it.
Let this continue playing out. Let schools get used to this format. Let it breathe so we can settle in.
But no, we will see only one SEC team in the final four and declare it a national emergency that requires immediate attention so that it never happens again.
And it's still hard for me to consider Texas an SEC team. Texas is just Texas. They should almost be independent like ND.
I think the bracket format is fine. It's the hosting locale for the 2nd round that I don't care for. Every "home" team deserves at least one game at their actual home stadium.
This really has been the perfect year for a 12 team playoff introduction because there were no true death star teams for the first time in awhile. I think a significant factor for this is nobody having a truly elite QB on any of these top teams.
What I don't want to hear is revisionism that this format would have been relevant in most years. From 2014-2022, some combination of Alabama, Clemson, Georgia and Ohio State were a step above the rest of the pack. Before that you have some seriously elite Florida, Alabama, and 2013 FSU squads. The only thing that would have changed is that teams like 2013, 2019, and 2022 Bama would have gotten a shot, 2021 Ohio State, 2018 UGA, etc.
I think one reason for the slight increase in parity is going to disappear, which is the COVID eligibility super seniors. Having a core of significantly older adult men with veteran experience on the team has helped out quite a few teams to punch up or even out talent gaps.
The parity increase that I think will stick around is the portal. While the portal is still primarily helping the top teams, it is making it slightly easier for teams to have a one season or two season shot to jump up a tier... before their own players get yoinked. NIL seems to have helped a little bit to redistribute some of the top QB's and DL talent, in particular, but I think that is still primarily benefitting the top and/or richest donor base programs more than anyone else, and by a lot.
1. The NCAA is poised to approve Covid forever (5 years of eligibility across the board) and 2. Shame Bama didn't get in..... with the best resume/wins and all.
This is a pointless and unrelated comment to anything I said here.
Sure it is- a team with an elite QB- Milroe and the best resume/wins got left out. It's totally relevant.
It is not relevant because I am not making a comment on who did or did not get into this year's 12 team playoff
2008 Florida vs USC was the dream championship that year that should have happened. Would have loved a playoff format then to allow that. Both of those teams were pretty loaded. 2007 would have also been an interesting year for this given the chaos. LSU was the most loaded team but even they lost two that crazy year.
Those are great examples, but would have been handled comfortably by the 4 team playoff. Scenes for 2007 VT in a playoff.
2013 would have been handled by a 4 team as well: FSU, Auburn, Bama, Michigan State.
Agree, I think 12 is way too many. 4-8 max is where it should be.
I think we all agree 12 is too many. I think 4 is plenty. I don't think we need to make it any bigger than 4, ever. Leave the committee in place so they can choose which 4 conference champions get to play and let the debates go from there. Make it super simple. The only way to get to the playoff is to win a conference championship. That makes it super simple for the committee. - they only have to choose from (9?) conference champions across the P4 and the G5. They pick the 4 best champions they deem fit to play and then it goes from there. Everyone else goes to bowl games like before. You want to play in the playoff? Win your goddamn conference. Done.
Brace yourself because it's getting bigger not smaller. Why is it expanding? Because it was a national crime this year that Bama, Ole Miss, and USCe didn't get a shot at a national championship- because they play really hard games all year - allegedly. So the SEC and B1G want more GAURENTEED spots- you know the opposite of earning it on the field. It will be 16 teams soon to avoid the tragedy of Shane not getting in this year.
8 is probably right. 4 teams would have left out Ohio St this year and they look like the best team in the playoff so far.
Fully agree with this.
Four teams wasn't enough - though it did highly value the regular season. If you hadn't "earned it" in the regular season you weren't worth considering. But the subjectiveness of the polls means that determining who had 'earned it' the most (or top-four-most) was always going to be a guess. And with so much money and politics involved, I don't think we were ending up with the "earned it" evaluation really being all that fair anyway.
But 12 teams? Why jump straight into 12 teams? I can't recall a single season where I thought to myself... Hmm that ninth-ranked team REALLY looks like the dark horse to win it all. The regular season should be good enough for us to judge which teams earned it enough (though here I am falling back on the subjectivity of my own eye test).
I also agree 8 would have been the right number. It avoids the complication of bye weeks and would have been enough space for power conference champions and exceptional independents or runner ups.
FWIW I recall it being reported the expansion of playoff directly to 12 instead of 8 was primarily advocated for by the SEC and Big 10, because an 8 team playoff with automatic qualifying conference champions would have expanded the field without allowing as many representatives from the same conference, therefore decreasing the likelihood of an SEC or Big 10 team winning the national championship compared to either of the 4 or 12 team formats. College football can't have the most logical playoff format if it doesn't benefit the SEC and Big 10.
Ok so this actually got me thinking and was pretty fun. Built my own 12-team playoff bracket based on the 2007 season here. Bracket seeding based on final BCS rankings here.
Top four seeds and first round byes:
1 - Ohio State (11-1) Big Ten Champs
2- LSU (11-2) SEC Champs
3 - Virginia Tech (11-2) ACC Champs
4 - Oklahoma (11-2) Big 12 Champs
Fifth highest-ranked conference champ:
5 - USC (10-2) Pac-10 Champs
Rest of the field:
6- Georgia (10-2) SEC
7 - Missouri (11-2) Big 12
8 - Kansas (11-1) Big 12
9 - WVU (10-2) Big East Champ (could be six but at the time the Big East was already seen as a mid-major league, so feel like they would have bumped other teams over them)
10 - Hawaii (12-0) WAC Champs
11 - Arizona State (10-2) Pac-10
12 - Choices here would have been Florida (9-3), Illinois (9-3), or Boston College (10-3). Having the Heisman winner Tebow in the field could have been compelling, but assuming the committee wouldn't penalize Boston College for playing and losing the ACC championship game. Plus BC had Matt Ryan and were pretty good that year anyway. So I give the nod to BC for 12.
First round:
(12) Boston College at (5) USC - like the Trojans here. They were one of the hottest teams in the country by the end of the season and demolished a good Illinois team in the Rose Bowl.
(11) Arizona State at (6) Georgia - I honestly don't remember much about Arizona State that year, but I think playing UGA and against Matt Stafford would be tough on the road would be tough. Would take Georgia.
(10) Hawaii at (7) Missouri - this would could have been interesting with Colt Brennan and the Air Raid at Hawaii. But still would take Mizzou.
(9) WVU at (8) Kansas - future Big 12 game! Like WVU big here, that Kansas team was so overrated. Still mad we let them beat us.
Second round:
(5) USC vs (4) Oklahoma, Fiesta Bowl - I like USC here. 2007 was one of the less memorable Oklahoma teams of the decade, had just lost Adrian Peterson and Sam Bradford and DeMarco Murray were just freshmen.
(9) WVU vs (1) Ohio State, Rose Bowl - serious Beverly Hillbillies vibes with the Cousins heading out to Pasadena. I honestly like Rich Rod and WVU. Ohio State was overrated more often than not in the 2000s and didn't have the defensive speed to deal with Pat White and Steve Slaton.
(6) Georgia vs (3) Virginia Tech, Peach Bowl - does the 2007 VT team that was unprepared and didn't take practice seriously at the real Orange Bowl show, or do we have a little more fire knowing we are playing for the title? Rematch of the Peach Bowl from the year before. I think it's a great game and I will take VT in a very close one (maybe I'm being a homer).
(7) Missouri vs (2) LSU, Sugar Bowl - could be an intriguing game, but I think the LSU defense would just be too talented for Missouri. Plus the physical LSU run game would be a mismatch for a Big 12 pass-oriented defense IMO. Take LSU
Semi-finals:
(9) WVU vs (5) USC, Cotton Bowl - Would take USC yet again. Just too much talent and they were very hot at the end of 2007 playing their best football.
(3) VT vs (2) LSU, Orange Bowl - Rematch of the regular season game. Think we make it much closer, but just think LSU is too much for us still.
National title game
(5) USC vs (2) LSU - now this I think would be very interesting. Two really good defenses. Could go either way but I would take USC and their skill talent in a close one IMO.
Bud Foster has said more than 1 time that he thought the 2007 OB practice was the best bowl prep they ever had.
I honestly didn't remember those comments. I just remember there being a lot of sentiment after that loss that Frank treated the bowl as a reward for the players and weren't as serious in practice. Also Vince Hall got injured on a jet ski playing around the week before.
I think part of the issue, and we'll see this over the next few years until things inevitably change again, is that players move around too much. They don't stay in one place and develop. Everyone wants to play NOW and nobody is willing to work behind the scenes until they get their shot. The result is that you're going to get lots of talented players that don't properly develop and make miscues related to lack of experience or lack of cohesion with the rest of their teammates.
We don't have any truly great teams this year (and we won't for a long time) because so many teams are completely overhauling their rosters every off-season because players are moving around. There's no time for coaches to build a really good team, molding the players to their schemes and identities over the course of 3 or 4 years. Coaches need to find players who can play straight out of the box. That lack of development is going to hurt the quality of the sport in the long run - and this will trickle up too. You're going to see a dip in quality from the NFL as the younger under-developed players start to take over the league. The NFL teams are going to be forced to do more development of the players as they come in since so many will come in even more raw than before. In the next 7-10 years, the best NFL players are going to be those that stuck with a single team and developed over their collegiate career before hitting the pros. They may not be the most talented, but they'll make the fewest mistakes and be the best quality players you can get.
We've seen this in basketball a bit with the 1 and done. It's really tough to win a championship with a team of new players every year. UVA, uconn both won with teams composed largely with their recruits and had played together the year before. Lots of others played the one and done and haven't done as well.
Larranaga mentioned it when he resigned, that directly after their final 4 appearance 8 of the kids that still had eligibility entered the portal. When confronted, they all said they LOVED Miami, but wanted moar $$$$... And they went from Elite Eight to Final Four to 15-17 and 14th in the ACC.
Boise just had a 1st round bye in the playoffs and their 43 year DC just retired with a message that basically says "we can't afford to compete anymore" due to players on their roster getting offers of 2x to 10x to play elsewhere
Calipari had the Harrison twins, Karl Anthony Towns, Cauley Stine, Devin Booker and Trey Liles on ONE team and lost to Wisky. lol.
Those teams have never lost a hypothetical game.
They also beat the brakes off of just about every team they played except each other, and sometimes each other.
I don't really understand the snark here? There isn't a team in this year's playoff close to the level of the champions of those seasons.
You would think that the playoffs this year would teach people that what they think doesn't mean anything, but alas I guess we are still going to ride with it.
Those teams were good, but not unbeatable. And this year the games are proving that there is no guarantee that the "best" teams are going to win. Even the vaunted SEC is capable of being thoroughly humbled and this is only 2 weeks after crying endlessly that we just KNOW for a fact they are heads and shoulders better than everyone else.
There are metrics we can use to compare these teams. The highest rated FPI team this season is a 26.8 (Ohio State), and 2019 alone had four teams over that 29.4 Bama, 30.3 LSU, 31.5 Clemson, 33.7 Ohio State. In addition to the numbers (and part of the reason FOR the numbers), those teams all had elite QB play as well, something none of this year's playoff teams have.
You have to go back to 2007 to find a season where there wasn't 1, sometimes quite a few more, teams rated higher than a 26.8.
I certainly can't "prove" 2019 LSU, for example, would comfortably beat every team in this playoff, but I don't think I am saying something that the vast majority of people don't agree with.
The eye test, the metrics, and the QB play all align to agree with what I am saying.
My personal snark is that leading into next year- the SEC is the best, they just are, Bama has the most talent, Nobody can beat UGA, there should be 11 SEC teams in the top 25, USCe just beat a lower tier VT from the ACC, so crown them etc. My issue is that if all of that is true- why play the season? Just put 8 SEC teams in the playoff... they are the best right? and it can't be disputed. Why should VT play USCe? no contest right, just means more. It's nauseating and I have no idea why people are surprised when someone takes an opportunity to dunk on the mighty SEC.
The vast majority of cfb discourse for the last month or so has been dunking on the SEC.
Lol because they peacocked loud and proud to shit all over the likes of Indiana, SMU and Boise because they deemed Alabama, SCarolina and Ole Miss so much more worthy of bids.
Herbie even went on record to say people are focusing too much on the games that teams win when trying to determine someone's worth in an effort to prop up the SEC. OF FUCKING COURSE everyone is going to dunk on them after all that
Good. They can handle it. They literally sign ALL of the best HS players every year. Ohio State and Penn State get some bread crumbs but the vast majority of the best HS players sign with the SEC. Boo Hoo if they get dunked on. It's like Brady whining for roughing the passer calls in his 7 super bowl prime- fuck off. When SEC fan boi's proclaim - for 20 fucking years- that the league is just better, every team is better, every game is tougher, every schedule is better well non fan bois get sick of that shit. Why was UGA considered for the playoff this year when they lost their starting QB? Why not penalize them like they did FSU last year? Why does fucking South Carolina have any argument for the playoff???? Why was Missou ranked in the top 10 in every preseason poll? I've got snark for days- so do millions of people.
You're not wrong. Hell, I was rooting for ND last night for some reason. I hate ND. I'm just tired of the damn SEC circle jerk every time college football is mentioned.
I will be rooting for ND in the next game. Probably the first time I have done that in many years. Anyone but Penn State.
I did not go to Notre Dame, I have no association with the school, so nope not rooting for them- they have a million people that didn't go there and have no association to the school that DO root for them, so they don't need me.
ND grads themselves are hit or miss. But man, I truly believe their Walmart fans are in the top tier of the worst fans in CFB.
I've said this here before but I'm married to a fourth gen domer so I've witnessed it firsthand.
I used to hate ND fans, but really there is just a special level of loathing I have for the cult of SEC right now. That cult is actively trying to destroy everything that is good about this sport for their own personal gains and I want nothing more than to watch it all blow up in their faces.
I don't have any love lost for ND, but I was pulling for them to pistol whip Georgia. And while I don't like the Big Ten at all for how they blew up the Pac, I am pulling for Ohio State to embarrass Texas. I want every single narrative that ESPN has been pushing this year to implode. I want to see angry Herbie again. I want those assholes to suffer.
This guy gets it.
Oh I'm fully onboard with OSU taking it all just to keep the other three's droughts continuing.
OSU has multiple recent Nattys, another won't hurt my feelings.
On one hand, if Poindexter really is the next DC, it wouldn't hurt for him to have been a big part of PSU going all the way before coming in.
On the other hand, no, that entire fanbase can rot in hell for their dusky coverup, so looks like I'm cheering for ND again this week.
Co-DC from a final 4 team is plenty of hype for me. I'd be more anxious about the hire falling through after a counter offer to keep Poindexter at Penn State if they actually won the national championship. Hope Penn State loses and that announcement is made ASAP.
Speaking of St Penn
Dayum
Why leave out the hot tub part?!
My grandfather was offered a scholly to play at ND so for that fact, I will be hoping they win. Despite my normal animosity towards them year in/year out.
lesser of two evils, really
I'll just say that while I cannot stand Notre Dame, I do love the fact that Brian Kelly left there because he thought he'd be able to win a title with LSU. And instead, his replacement has ND in the semi-finals, and Brian Kelly and his LSU Tigers unranked and out of playoff consideration.
Guess my disdain for Kelly is deeper than that for ND
Brian Kelly is scum and what is wrong with college sports. He really is. He's a bully, takes no accountability- he pulls his QB when he throws an incompletion, he fires coaches every year, etc. It's never his fault. He also used to cuss out everyone on the ND sideline every play until the school ordered him to tone it down. But he wasn't wrong to leave for LSU, he's not dumb. He knows Tiger football is more important to people down there than literally anything else- health, their children, their retirement savings. He was 100% right to leave ND- where there is still some semblence of academics, pretending to be an institution of higher learning. Any smart coach would have made that move in the NIL era. If Kelly needs a new QB, LSU boosters will buy him one every day and twice on Sunday.
Penn State is looking like the bigger, faster, and stronger team so far. This may get away from ND if they don't make some adjustments soon
Pulling for the Irish in this one.
They need to find a way to stop PSUs run game.
Pretty impressed with Angeli there for ND. Looks like he has really opened up the passing game. That's going to be the key to winning this one, running against PSU will be tough sledding.
I hate ND but sure would like to know if Poindexter is our DC or not.
Refs handed PSU last 2 TDs.
Shamefully bad crew for a game of this magnitude
The DPI on what should've been a pick was insanely soft. But what did the refs do for the previous touchdown?
#3 PSU probably the most blatant hold in the history of football, right as the running back was trying to get the edge and right in front of the referee.
They scored on the next play.
Notre Dame getting the ACC treatment ref swallows whistle on blatant hold on PSU quickly throws the flag on questionable PI
The announcers said it was the right call, but seemed like so little contact.
Can't/shouldn't penalize the defense for an under thrown ball that would've been picked regardless. One thing if that happened in one on one coverage but that safety was undercutting that for the pick even if 8 wasn't there.
Glad ND responded with a TD.
There was nearly no body contact and #8 got his hands on the ball.
This ridiculous notion that just because a defender doesn't turn their head around, it's instant P.I. needs to be completely erased.
It's not anywhere in the rulebook and has been spearheaded by idiots like Herbstreit so that it has become a mantra
I hate to say it, but this is turning into a fun game to watch after a pretty boring first half. Not really caring who wins helps.
This fourth quarter rocks.
Is it just me or does it look like all of Penn State's DBs have skinny legs?
Upper legs or lower legs
All of the above I guess?
Did Rojas get hurt?
Danny? It was the haunted training room, but he's okay now.
That might do it
Oh hell yea this game is dumb. Only thing better would be if Notre Dame has a TO to send this to overtime.
Me right now as Penn State goes down.
I feel robbed of a dumb end of game James Franklin decision
His QB took care of it for him
It's just much less funny this way
There's still plenty to laugh at Big Game James about.
Penn State got an embarrassingly easy draw, Referee assist on 2 TDs tonight and he still couldn't win.
Go ACC?
Cue Dex announcement in 3....2...1
Suck it dear old James!!!
Can't wait to see OSU win their 100 title.
I hope to hear of our new DC soon.
But F*#& are those Irish fans going to be insufferable if they win next week.
(They're insufferable right out of the box)
Going to reiterate my point about the overall lower ceiling of the teams in college football this season. Two teams with offenses like this would have absolutely no shot in almost any season the last 15+ years. I think Penn State was winning in the 4th quarter of this game without having completed a pass to a wide receiver. The mid-late 2010's teams would beat either of these teams by 40.
I think tOSU could beat both by 40 tbh
I agree I think CFB put a chip on the bully's shoulder and they are out to destroy everybody
I think Ohio State and Texas are capable of some duds, as they've shown this year, but I think the winner of that game wins the title.
Michigan on line 1
ND calling to ask if they still have any signs or a Stalion they can borrow.
Edit: I couldn't shake this idea and had to whip this up to piss off my OSU buddy.
TBF, ND can absolutely have a clunker as well. That game against Northern Illinois seems like a distant memory...
It was that kind of year in CFB, there really wasn't a Death Star team.
Ohio State may be reaching that point now.
Michigan must be Red Five
Texas is an SEC team- no duds, not a thing in that league.
Duds are exactly why the SEC didn't have more playoff teams... Bama against OU, Ole Miss against Kentucky, etc. Why are you valiantly fighting against an argument that nobody is making?
many are making this argument and constantly do. Who cares if Bama has 3 losses? they have the best "win" - eventual 3 loss UGA- on the board. Wasn't that you who said that or something similar?
I said these things: I would have preferred Alabama to make the playoff for my enjoyment of watching the games and because I think, despite three losses, they still had a better resume than some teams who did make it and had no good wins. Bama did have good wins, I don't really think that's debatable. Additionally, you can miss me with Georgia's playoff loss with their backup QB as a denigration of Georgia's quality as a football team.
However, none of this is relevant to our current exchange, because at no point did I, or anyone that I've seen, make an argument saying those teams did not have "duds," which is the argument you are making here. I think everyone agrees that the "duds" from the SEC teams is why they didn't make it... Bama doesn't lose to OU and they are in. Ole Miss doesn't lose to Kentucky and they are in. I think almost anyone would agree that it was precisely those "duds" that cost them their place in the playoff.
"Additionally, you can miss me with Georgia's playoff loss with their backup QB as a denigration of Georgia's quality as a football team." - you are better than this - come on. You are an unapologetic SEC homer- however you have used real points and not bullshit hypotheticals like this one to make your points in the past- don't be bullshit hypothetical fan. If VT didn't lose 6 games, we would be in the playoffs- that is so intelligent right? You can shill for a 100% meh bama team that lost to Michigans worst team in a decade... fine... I can be sarcastic about the SEC - you had to know this was coming and will come 100 fold if Texas loses tonight. But don't worry in August we will be right back to- Missou is top 5, just because and you have to rank Vandy and Kentucky in the top 25...duhhhh. August will be here for you soon.
What are we even talking about at this point?
UGA with Beck beats ND? is that what you are arguing? Did ND have any injuries coming into the game? Is their star RB 100% healthy?
I said UGA's third loss occurred with their backup QB, which is literally what happened. That part is just a fact.
If OSU plays like they did against Oregon I don't know who can beat them. I think they rum through Texas.
I'm hopeful the Irish can beat them in the championship though.
I think they'll have an easier go of it if Texas wins gets to the Championship though.
I want to see Obie the Orange Bowl mascot battle Otto the Syracuse Orange to see who is the superior fruit.
To be clear I would have been fine with Penn St in the championship and winning it all. I don't have the same hatred towards them as others. But I do feel dirty cheering for ND to win it. Is it worth dealing with their arrogant fan base in exchange for denying the B10 or SEC a title? We'll find out... at least we don't have an all B10 championship... that would have been a disaster for so many reasons
ND is a national recruiter while PSU competes directly with us for many more recruits
"PSU competes directly with us for many more recruits" we think so, but this is really not the case- meaning when they want someone we don't get them. I can't think of a kid since Kevin Jones that actually chose VT over PSU as the only 2 contenders?? Their all world TE- case in point- ultimately they all go to PSU. In order to be competitive with them we need to actually land someone they really want.
We got Dylan Rivers, unfortunately he never played a game for us
Right and they got countless guys we desperately wanted that actually did contribute.
Give me Texas vs ND in the final. That at least makes me laugh at the B1G and SEC with their only representation being a Big12 team that's as SEC as SMU is ACC
ND fans are so entitled. My 4th gen wife has complained to me multiple times that she's the only one of her family that didn't witness a Natty during her time there (boo fricken hoo).
It doesn't help that they decided to actually be more than just a football factory in the 80s and improved their academics. Now they jump to the "well we're smarter than you" argument when they lose... arrogant and pretentious af.
It's shit like this that makes me worried we'll never get the game management stuff right with Pry at the helm. Good Lord Penn State, what are you doing?
Now this is the sort of James Franklin-ing I wanted last night. Glad it happened, disappointed that I didn't catch it at the time.
1. Game was tied. College OT is so fucking random given the rules. Yes, Freeman is -probably- not faking it there, but keep in mind, if he did and didn't make it- tie game, go to OT. ND was not behind here- so you can't take a fake totally out of the realm. 2. Blocking a short-ish FG is nearly impossible today. So why not put a couple guys back? You had a better chance of a nervous self shank than blocking that short kick.
I guess I could buy a shank, but not a fake. IDK ND's kicker well enough to weigh my odds on a botched kick vs attempting a block.
Edit: it's also crazy that 41 yards is considered short to mid range now.
The kicker's accuracy was bad during the regular season due to a groin injury. He's been really good in the CFP after he healed up. I don't think he was going to miss that kick unless it was blocked.
Oh interesting, wonder if his chiropractor dad flew up to Indiana routinely to help his recovery?
Hes also a portal guy... I LOVED McDonough mentioning 100 times that ND doesn't really portal... lol except they took 13 guys last year- as if every other team takes 40. ESPN is so fucking shameless now its almost unwatchable. ND doesn't portal- until they do. Nauseating.
FTFY - I haven't watched anything on ESPN in at least 3 years. And I'm better off for it
I watch them when they broadcast VT games.
Lo siento, mi amigo
I laughed at that comment as well when McDonough said it. These commentators couldn't more transparently pathetic.
I think this alignment is fine you can't double team the blockers so you've got hat on a hat and are attempting to beat the edge from one side which they nearly did and still have an extra guy back for block return/wild shank/fake stop
Woohoo! Loved seeing ND win this one. Big ND fan over here.
Hoping they win it all against... I dunno Texas I guess
As a VT fan, you should root for ND... as part of our great ACC deal with them, we get a share of their 20 million dollar playoff money..... oh no, that's not right- we get zero. Nothing. Like basically what the ACC got in return for this deal.
To be clear, my love for ND has nothing to do with the ACC. I was raised in an Irish Catholic barn so I was indoctrinated at an early age. VT only became my #1 team when I attended. The Irish are my second favorite team now.
Barn? your profile pic and user name checks out!! :)
You can make a pretty good case that the ACC didn't get enough from this deal, but it's a fallacy that they got nothing.
"During the past four-plus seasons, Notre Dame played 26 regular-season games with available television ratings against ACC opponents. Seventeen of those ranked as the top ACC broadcast that weekend. Another eight ranked second."
The Athletic, November 2024
Nothing "material/good/of real value"- how's that? The ACC TV deal is the worst in the P4, the conference is dying and desperately added fucking Cal and SMU... so EFFECTIVLEY we got nothing from this deal, while Hildalgo gets to showcase herself in the best conference for womens hoops and their lacrosse team prospers. now if you argue - well the ACC's TV deal would be even worse? well probably not, and that's a hypothetical. The fact that the league is on life support with teams suing to leave is a fact- not hypothetical.
No, that isn't fact. You don't know how bad the deal would have been WITHOUT Notre Dame's involvement.
You can't blame Notre Dame for the ACC being hapless negotiators.
Brian Kelly watching Notre Dame advance to the National Championship
"he is responsible for our son's death, but we are not going to sue him because we need him to win 9 games... go Irish above all".... Still fucking blows my mind.
And yet you claim LSU's commitment to football is greater than ND's.
I do, because it is. And always will be. Brian Kelly ordering a kid into a scissor lift in 40 mph winds doesn't change that.
This morning on the Dan Patrick show, their morning poll question was "Who would you rather be this morning, James Franklin or Brian Kelly?" Apart from the revulsion of either choice, my choice would be Franklin, because I'd still have a soul.
So are we rooting for OSU over Texas today, cause fuck the $EC?
Still makes me want to barf rooting either way...
I'm rooting for Ohio State regardless as I actually like them. My favorite good/blue blood/whatever you want to call it team.
(1) I considered going there for undergrad, but felt the campus was too big and too urban.
(2) Friend of mine from grad school and her husband went there and they were very good people (postdocs when I was a grad student)
(3) Maybe I've just been lucky, but I've never run across the insufferable fans people always point out at programs like this. Penn State and Michigan have been the worst for me personally. Notre Dame and West Virginia can be there too. And of course the JMU person who has to mention the 1 game they won over-and-over-and-over again.
(4) You could pretty much count on Ohio State to beat the good teams I despise the most - Penn State, Notre Dame and (until recently) Michigan.
I've had too many people say they went to THE Ohio State University to my face. It's not even the fans, it's just people who went there. I don't know what to say, but it comes across as arrogant as fuck. And I've met more than one or two.
Opposite for me - rooting for (1) a meteor to hit the stadium; (2) Texas because to hell with the Big Ten and (3) anyone but Ohio State.
But OSU does seem to be peaking at the right time - if tonight's game is anything like the Oregon game I think they will probably roll in the championship game.
I'm rooting for Texas. I have an extreme dislike for SEC and the Big Ten but I can root for Texas because they are only pseudo-SEC.
Texas. I want on-the-field proof you can't just buy your way to a starting lineup and national championship team.
I'm rooting for Texas because I think Ohio State would torch Notre Dame. And of the 3 teams remaining i would prefer Notre dame to win.
I'm torn between what you said and the poster above. If not a meteor, then maybe Texas for the reasons you stated. I honestly like Texas but the whole $EC thing kind of washes that. I absolutely loathe a ohio state and they sit right there with miami/unc/pedo state/nd on that second step of hatedness (first step solely belongs to loluva)
But, just for this year, nd has my support. Screw anything $ec and Big10. .
I like An Ohio st. Because the home and home was great including the fans I experienced when at VT.
I like ND because they are ACC.
I think Arch Manning was unconscious from the point the OS defender's helmet made contact until he bounced off the ground.
The open field tackling has been impressive to watch... or this is just how it's supposed to be and I'm acclimated in the wrong way because of what tackling is like at Virginia Tech.
I'm loving the STEW VIRGINIA commercial. Ain't that just like the cousins.
It's a good one.
Though I am partial to High Tide, guys
Strip sack, scoop and score, by Ewers former roommate. An OSU is going to the championship game.
And that should do it... hard to see how Texas is going to come up with a TD, recover the kick, and score another TD in the next 150s
Man, a toss play from the one-inch line is just insane. No idea what Sark was thinking on that third down call.
welp. Somehow, Notre Dame is the least evil. Great.
I know, right?
Ohio State represents the evil empire of "We bought our team for $20 million in NIL this year."
That can't be the right answer.
I never thought I'd say this but their annoying g fans are just so old, ND hasn't done anything in 30 years. They got blown out of one National Title game. There are still annoying this like 2000 bowl selection. But the also set the trcord for most consecutive bowl losses because a 9-3 ND is better than a 11-1 everyone else. So they get stomped when playing better completion.
It hasn't really been that way the last decade. No one talks about ND, they had 1 loss and no one talked about them this year. Most of the media probably had them losing their first CFP game. Think about the Bush Push, an illegal play that USC won the game on. That shit never happened to 80s/90s ND. The younger generation has grown up with ND not being what most of us think of ND. It helps that there is no Lou Holtz, there is no Brian Kelly, Marcus Freeman seems like an okay guy who just wants to coach football. He's harder to hate than the past coaches. I see so much less about ND now that'll 20 years ago and that's made a huge difference, now if they win it might get bad again but a villain is still a villain so let's make them the best villain they can be.
There's no shortage of villains in modern day CFB.
I remember the Bush Push and was actually rooting very hard for ND in that game. But people don't talk about them as much because they came up small on the biggest stages over and over and over, and so it's kind of taken for granted that they always will.
Sounds familiar, doesn't it.
It still blows my mind that ND took the consecutive bowl loss record away from WVU. I sat through a LOT of WVU bowl losses in my childhood, teens, and early 20s.
We all did, I thought my 20 year old friend was going to have a heart attack when Eli manning came in that game.
I still want to know why when they were reviewing the Arch Manning play to see if he fumbled the ball the Ohio State player wasn't ejected for targeting? aOSU player lowered his head and lead with Helmet to Arch's helmet.
Targeting is a spectrum, but I think this one is pretty far away from a call.
I personally wish they'd call more hits to the head or neck area, (especially when it causes the head to go full bobble head).
But in this case the primary point of impact is the OSUs shoulder and the middle of the Manning kid's back.
The reason this play looks so awkward and disjointed has nothing to do with the defender's approach or hit- Arch dives way too late and the awkward hit on the back was because of that. It's on the QB to either keep going into a solid tackle or dive before the defender arrives. He decides on neither, instead compromising and doing both poorly.
The Nebraska QB had a really similar play a week ago- he got up and starting shoving the DB, which should have been a 15 yard penalty on him. Instead, it ended up convincing the refs they missed something, so they called a late hit on the unsuspecting defender.
https://x.com/iam_johnw/status/1877900542426378444?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7...
SEC... All bark no bite
Last game of the year y'all. What are TKP's predictions for tonight?
Notre Dame is in trouble. Buckeyes easily cover the spread. I am going 34-13 Buckeyes.
The $EC did make it to the national championship, just its the officiating crew...
This should help ND. $EC officials can't allow a b1g team to win the natty. Oops, refs are impartial.