Can someone post a table in this thread with the potential candidates (I.e. Chris Marve, Donald Duck, Horse on a Treadmill, Gritty, etc.) even the ones that have passed on us?
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At this point, I have to imagine Pry is sitting at his desk, staring at a ham sandwich wondering, "if I leave that out in the sun long enough, will it develop rudimentary intelligence so I can hire it?"
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~500 comments with over 2/3rds of the comments complaining about the choice is my bold prediction. Parlay that with the 2/3rds of complaints coming from <1/3rd of the individual commenters.
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You know how it goes on TKP: 2/3rds of the comments will hate the pick and say our program is doomed. Another 2/3rds will love the pick and start predicting 10 win seasons. And the final 2/3rds will just be arguing about cake or mayonnaise or whether QBs and TEs are basically the same position.
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the fact that we're now on thread 2 without an announcement scares the absolute sh*t out of me about the state of the program, Pry's ability to find the right person, and Whit's ability to pay said person. WTF is going on???
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The number of message board posts about a thing is not a referendum on the state of the program. I can make 1000 posts about how VT is a failure for not hiring Jabba the Hutt as DC, the volume of posts about a thing doesn't give it legitimacy.
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PSU reportedly offering a large package for Knowles to steal him away from their intraconference rivals. PSU fans at least have something to salivate over. VT fans just staring at the sun with no shades on, wondering why it burns.
I still think he stays at OSU with a bigger paycheck, but we'll see.
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Some behind paywall rumblings/frustrations boiling over from insiders. I'm firmly resetting expectations for this program. Might want to get the new AD/HC thread fired up at this point. I'll leave it there.
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I know there's a lot of consternation and panicking right now from people on both this thread and thread #1. I've mostly not been paying attention, but even reading everything I'm not really concerned much at the moment. What the people who are panicking haven't acknowledged or seem to even have thought about is that the college carousel calendar has changed. Because of the expanded playoff, not only are more teams, and therefore more coaches, not moving after conference championship weekend/Signing Day, but the timeframe at which they might move is extended. We have to adjust our timeline expectations because of this.
Previous timeline (2023)
- Coaches fired:
After conference championship weekend ~Dec. 3rd
After Signing Day ~Dec. 23rd (ESD went from 20-22nd in 2023)
-Coaches available to be hired:
Post CFP semifinals (only two teams are left, all other coaches from top teams are available) ~Jan. 2nd
Current timeline
-Coaches fired:
After Signing Day ~Dec. 7th (ESD was two weeks earlier than normal)
After conference championship weekend ~Dec. 8th
-Coaches hired:
Post CFP semifinals ~Jan. 11th
Marve was fired on Dec. 12th, more than ten days before he would've been fired in previous years. Movement of coaches from top teams didn't reach an equal point to previous seasons until Jan. 11th, nearly ten days later than it did in previous cycles. There is a 20 day difference in this years coaching carousel vs. the coaching carousels that you are used to. Looking at the old thread, people started voicing concerns about two weeks ago (20 something days ago). In the ensuing time those concerns waterfalled into panic. But, because of the new timeline, concerns shouldn't have been popping up until after the National Championship Game. Going into the week of Feb 3-7 is when those concerns should start to waterfall into panic.
TLDR: we are currently in peak coordinator carousel. Not hiring a DC so far is likely because of college football's calendar changes. Adjust your expectations accordingly.
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P4 teams that have all recently filled coordinator roles without replacing a head coach:
UW: DC - poached by UNC on 12/12, new hire announced on 1/3
South Carolina: OC - Poached to be app st HC on 12/7, new hire announced on 12/18 (hire was an analyst on staff)
UCLA: OC - fired on 12/5, new hire made on 12/12 (new hire was coaching in cfp)
Nebraska: OC - fired midseason, Holgerson replaced him midseason, got the job
FSU: OC and DC - new hires made 11/30 and 12/2, respectively
Clemson: DC - Fired Wes Goodwin on 1/6, hired PSU's DC on 1/15 (shortly after their final playoff game)
Michigan: OC - fired 12/3, new OC hired 12/10
Miami: DC - fired 12/31, replacement hired 1/12
NC State: DC - poached to be Marshall HC on 12/8, replacement hired 12/31
OU: OC - fired in October, replaced 12/2
P4 teams with an open coordinator roles without replacing a head coach:
Penn State - DC hired away on 1/15
I used this tracker as my starting point, verified stuff via google too. I didn't include G5 or FCS hires. I did not include co-DC/OC's in this (which Bama, UF, and others are hiring for).
Of the 10ish teams listed above, the longest search (excluding OU's mid-season firing) was half the length of ours. Yea, NC State is the only school on this list that is in a very similar boat to us BUT, there's four ACC teams on this list. UW is P2, but doesn't get full B10 paychecks. UCLA's athletic department is fucked. So it's not like we're comparing apples and oranges here.
This just feels like another one of those things where, at the micro-level, you can explain why every other school was able to fill a position faster than we were. But at the macro level, it's an indication of a problem. It's just like in recruiting - you miss on one guy because he wants to be closer to home, miss on another guy because OSU comes in at the last minute, miss on another guy because he wants a city school, miss on another guy because a rival hired his high school coach - you miss on 5 guys, each for understandable reasons, but when your top 5 can all find a reason to not come to a VT, it's a problem.
So something is wrong with this search. What? I don't know. But I'm sure it's something like recruiting... One guy got more money than we can offer, one guy got an HC gig, one guy had his dream job open when Clemson poached his boss, one guy's wife doesn't want to live in Blacksburg, one guy is afraid he'll be back on the job market next year, etc... Like recruiting, when guys find reasons not to come instead of finding reason to come - even if each reason is bespoke to their situation - it's a problem.
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To add to this, Oklahoma fired their DC around 1/4 and Notre Dame's DC just went to the Bengals. So that is an "SEC" blue-blood and ND in the list with PSU.
Basically, the coaching hires are like being in line at a club. The VIPs cut the line. VT is not a VIP. Everytime a VIP shows up (their DC job becomes available), we have to wait longer. VT may not be directly competing with blue-bloods and upper tier P2 teams for DCs, but their moves cause dominoes to fall whose effects cascade down to VT. I firmly believe that Clemson poaching PSU's DC basically reset our timeline. We could still realistically get someone like Dex or someone else who could turn out to be a good to great hire, but we have to wait for all of the dominoes above us to fall in place. It sucks, but it is what it is. It is just the result of where we currently stand in the hierarchy of CFB.
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NC State managed a relatively quick hire by going after a guy that was an analyst at Baylor in 2024. Not a coordinator, not a position coach, but an analyst.
At Baylor. He was the LB coach for the Philadelphia Eagles in 2023. He was last a college DC in 2022 at Temple. If VT hired someone with that resume there would be an absolute meltdown. NC State's hire screams, "Let's get a warm body in here and get this over with."
FWIW: My opinion is that it will take as long as it takes. We're just getting antsy and since VT has a history of a combination of getting big-dogged and underwhelming, down-the-hall hires everyone is reading way too much into the timing. It's understandable. I'm getting a bit concerned myself. But whoever we hire will be whoever we hire. Even then we won't know if it's a good hire until about halfway through next season. So my opinion is that the timing "may" be concerning, but it isn't a direct indication that the program is in freefall.
Now, if all of the dominoes fall into place and we then take another month to just promote Quinn, then I'll change my tune.
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bar, this is why you're my favorite person on this board. You always come with the fucking facts!
I would argue that this is still a small sample size. If you narrow it a little to find equivalents, IMO it's hard to how bad our outlier status is. PSU, OU, Miami, Clemson, FSU, and Michigan are all above us in the pecking order unfortunately. You could argue Nebraska and UW, I wouldn't I think those are close enough comps. I am going to eliminate Nebraska because that was midseason firing. That leaves
Washington: 22 days
SCar: 11 days
UCLA: 7 days
NCST: 23 days
VT: 45 days as of 1/26
We're more than double any other search, which to your point is alarming. I'm not sure I'm ready to panic based on that considering the carousel is still churning. Of the two DC hires, Walters is getting about $1.4m/yr. NC State hired DJ Eliot as DC and Charlton Warren as co-DC, which someone please explain to me like I'm 5.
Not entirely sure there's a macro analysis to be had here. But I concede there's more reason for alarm than I previously thought.
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How long we take to hire someone is irrelevant. It only matters if it's a good hire.
If we hire someone quickly and he sucks, then we didn't take enough time to evaluate candidates.
If we hire someone quickly and he's awesome, then we made a great hire.
If we take a long time to hire someone and he sucks, then we must have missed on better candidates and this is the best we could settle for.
If we take a long time to hire someone and he's awesome, then we did our due diligence and made sure we were hiring the right guy rather than rushing into it.
The timeframe means nothing, only the hire matters. If he's a good hire then it's good, if not then it's bad. This is true whether he's hired in December or February.
The timeframe means 2 things: Jack and shit, and Jack left town. Let's see what poor sucker gets hired as our DC and then we can bitch about how much he sucks. All this preemptive whining is a waste of time and energy.
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I appreciate the kind words! I try very hard not to be over-emotional-uninformed-fanatic, and instead be over-emotional-mildly-well-informed-fanatic.
Not entirely sure there's a macro analysis to be had here. But I concede there's more reason for alarm than I previously thought.
My belief is that a given hire is just as good regardless of when it is made; it doesn't matter much if Quinn was hired on 12/20, 12/31, 1/20, or 1/31. It's still Shawn Quinn. Same goes for any hypothetical candidate.
But, the issue is that, typically you start with your #1 hire, then move down the list. If we've been here for 45 days, how far down the list are we?
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It's absolutely irrelevant how long it takes. It's not like picking up donuts at a bakery, where they're all basically the same, and the next person in line gets the best ones out of the ones that look just alike. VT, in particular, has a specific scheme that we've been using that's not generic, and likely doesn't have an unlimited budget to break all historical records with their offer. While I'd prefer sooner, what I really want is improvement.
So the standard for evaluating the hire hasn't changed. It doesn't matter if VT superfans are nervous. All that matters is if they get someone who can build and run a defense, and the only time constraint is that he has to have his system in place and effective by September.
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He mentioned meeting the new staff additions, so they may already be on campus just not announced for whatever reason.
Going off of his post, we can assume PJ and DJ are still on staff. Maybe some of the others aren't and what we're doing is trying to fill out the whole defensive staff before an announcement.
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Maybe they don't want our message boards exploding and taking out the fan base due to an internal promotion? I'm starting a Rumor JC Price got promoted due to prior HC experience.
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I'm hearing rumors that we may not actually hire a DC at all and just let the guys wing it out there for one year with Bud Foster just giving them the death stare from the booth to see if we actually improve over whatever the fuck it was that Marve was trying to do.
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Reliable sources confirm that barring last second change of heart, Jim Knowles is headed to Penn State. He has notified James Franklin that he'll accept their offer of well over $3 million to be highest paid coordinator in college football history. Knowles is from Philly.— Toby Rowland (@TRowOU) January 26, 2025
Does this open up another shot at Poindexter?
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1. That is insane money for a coordinator. Really displays the disparity between P2 and everyone else.
2. Leaving the defending Champs with a Roster stacked with talent to join a conference rival in an adjacent state is some cutthroat shit.
3. The folks at PSU at least have some insight. James Franklin is only as good as his Coordinators--his job is to bring in the talent, someone else needs to figure out how to use them. They ponied up the big $$ because they knew they needed to.
4. None of this is exactly a ringing endorsement for Poindexter as a potential D.C. if he even is/was/will be a candidate here.
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that would make him 1-B like four times running for them. Now none of the guys chosen over him have been slouches so it stands to reason he still might be a better DC than Marve.
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Ross Dellenger just put out an article on Yahoo which reads like propaganda from Franklin. Apparently Dex was the leading candidate for the job, until Knowles became interested. Somehow Dellenger was a fly on the wall and overheard a quote between Dex and Franklin, with Dex saying "Oh we could really get Jim?" And turned down "other P4 coordinator offers" to return to PSU and be passed over for a third time.
Smells like a total propaganda piece put out by Franklin. Really hate that POS.
Unless Pry just wasn't interested in Dex, he's crazy for hanging around there. He's never going to get the main DC job and he needs to move toward being a coordinator sooner rather than later.
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Have read rumors that the relationship there is a little icy from them slow playing him last time for Elliott. Especially with Carla still there. But things could change I suppose.
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We made 5 mil in profit last year. We paid Joe Rudolph $0.5mil more a year than we paid Crooks and Moore, heck we are barely paying Moore this year due to his WVU contract. Mines got a raise but no where close to cover the difference in Brad Glenns salary vs Brooks. We are paying are coaching staff are $0.75 mil less than 3 years ago. We can easily afford a $1.5 mil DC. We have the revenue to afford even higher.
Honestly if we're not in the $2.5 mil range then we aren't getting any top notch coordinator. We have to overpay because most likely they will have to look for a job in two years.
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Sean Spencer is the DL coach who coached under wait for it....James Franklin at Vanderbilt. Jay Bateman is DC under Mike Elko, who both coached together at Richmond.
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He was not good at UNC, mostly good or okay last year A&M, couple blowup games with Auburn and SC.
I feel kinda weird about the hire if we're able to steal him from them, might mean they didn't put up much of a fight. On the other hand at least he does have play calling experience. But not with our scheme
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Interesting, from Richmond, VA, went to Randolph-Macon, was DC of Army when Brent Davis was OC, also received improper information about Wake Forest in 2017, "brought in several top defensive recruits to the [UNC] program"
I'm intrigued...
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After a quick google search, there were at least two articles 4 weeks ago talking about the possibility of him being fired and looking at replacements.
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He's had a pretty up-and-down tenure since leaving Army, where he was a Broyles finalist.
He started off great at UNC, but peaked quickly and had a pretty woeful 2021 with decent talent. Now, to be fair, no one who has replaced him has fared much better---so was it a Bateman issue or a UNC one?
It seems the opinion on his performance at Texas A&M has been quite mixed.
As compared to an internal hire like Quinn or even Poindexter (who has now been passed over 3 or 4?? times at PSU) Bateman would be a reasonably solid hire.
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"While the rumors swirl, this would be the right move, especially concerning late-game adjustments, as Bateman failed to slow down opponents in losses to South Carolina, Auburn, and USC in the Las Vegas Bowl, mainly due to issues in the secondary and a lack of timely blitzing."
This doesn't give me the good feels after the year we just had...
Yeah i can't find consistent reports for the exact number but year 1 was $4.0m and year 6 is $5.0m so yeah 4 is $4.6m?
The original assistant budget was $5.5 and we spent $4.4 last year. So we've been saving $1.1m a year for 2 years from our budget. Also assume that we can get the same 200k increase Pry gets every year for assistance then that is $1.7m budget over what we spent last season. Add in Marve's salary and we are close to $2.6m within our budget! There are also escalators for 8 wins and 11 wins. Had we won half the 1 score games we'd be at $3 mil easy.
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Probably should pay each coordinator half of what the head coach makes. This would assume each coordinator (O & D, not ST) is responsible for 25% of the team's success and the head coach is responsible for half
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So I'm sure we will find reasons to not like a hire like this but given he was likely not in top 3 choices, I can imagine worse hire than current SEC DC, former HC, DC for precious ACC school, former broyles finalist, with VA ties. Remember we had Marve as our last DC ( has none of those boxes checked). I'm not saying it's perfect , checkered success, maybe differences in scheme etc but it's not dumpster fire either , like hiring within or some no name high risk.
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To quote the legendary Bob Uecker, "I don't know what the hell they are doing." All my names except Bob Shoop are off the board, and Shoop is on the downside.
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If anyone is interested in the Bateman rumors, here's a UNC-quality film review from a UNC site. It's clearly not of the same quality as French's but what else are we going to talk about?
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Sources: Virginia Tech is targeting Arizona Cardinals LB coach Sam Siefkes as the school's new defensive coordinator. Siefkes is an integral part of the Cardinals' innovative NFL scheme, and he brings collegiate defensive coordinator experience, including a stint at Wofford. He brings NFL experience from two seasons with the Vikings as a quality control coach and the assistant linebackers coach. Along with his time at Wofford, he's also coordinated defense at UW-Platteville.
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Sources: Virginia Tech is targeting Arizona Cardinals LB coach Sam Siefkes as the school's new defensive coordinator. Siefkes is an integral part of the Cardinals' innovative NFL scheme, and he brings collegiate defensive coordinator experience, including a stint at Wofford. pic.twitter.com/FNKxzg8Fah— Pete Thamel (@PeteThamel) January 27, 2025
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Yeah...make no mistake about it, this is an absolute flop of a hire. You can't spin it any other way. Especially if we pay an NFL LB coach with VERY minimal college experience anywhere near $1M - $1.5M.
Honestly, just go ahead and fire up the new AD/HC conversation thread. We all know how this is going to end.
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Jumping from Wofford to the Vikings seems like a very big jump. Is that type of promotion common? Why only one year at Vikings before going to Cardinals? Not staying anywhere long. Was he that good, worked for the wrong coaches, or that bad?
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Siefkes was the defensive coordinator/inside linebackers coach at Wofford College (2018-20).
His final season at Wofford in 2020 was postponed due to COVID-19. In 2019, he led the nation's 20th ranked defense that helped guide the program to its 3rd straight Southern Conference Championship and 4th straight appearance in the FCS Playoffs. The defense ranked 1st in the conference in total defense and rushing defense and 2nd in scoring defense.
In his first season at Wofford in 2018, the Terriers led the conference in total defense, scoring defense, passing defense, and rushing defense. Nationally, they ranked 8th in scoring defense and 12th in total defense. Wofford had a 9-4 overall record, won the Southern Conference Championship and advanced to the second round of the FCS Playoffs.
Siefkes spent two seasons (2016-17) as the defensive coordinator/inside linebackers coach at UW-Platteville.
His defense allowed just 18.9 points per game in 2017 and had three shutouts. The Pioneers finished the 2016 season with an 8-3 record and advanced to the playoffs.
In 2015, Siefkes worked as a defensive graduate assistant at the University of Wisconsin, helping with the defensive line. With the Badgers, he coached alongside former defensive coordinator and current Baylor head coach Dave Aranda. Wisconsin led the nation in scoring defense (13.7 ppg) and ranked 2nd nationally in total defense (268.5 ypg) that season. They defeated USC in the Holiday Bowl, the Badgers second consecutive bowl game victory.
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All the folks on Reddit were stoked that we were potentially taking Bateman off their hands, so I'm willing to give Siefkes the benefit of the doubt. NFL experience and was pretty solid at Wofford.
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Is there some existing connection between Pry and Siefkes? Like how is he even on our radar? I didn't really follow the Cardinals this year, but I also didn't hear anything about their defense/linebackers at any point this season.
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Honestly I don't even care at this point. If we hire him and he sucks, then everyone will get canned and we can start Rebuild 2.0, and if he turns out to be Foster-level legendary then we'll get big-dogged and he'll be gone in 3-4 years anyways.
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What's crazy is that if we're getting him on a cheap deal and he comes and does well, someone will probably just hire him away after a year or two if Pry is still around.
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Exactly, we need someone to fix the coaching. If he comes in and the staff is still intact in 2 seasons we will likely have finally found success and can go get a flashy hire then if that what Pry thinks we need
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This guy has been a defensive coordinator before, and done well at it.
He also has four years of NFL coaching experience.
He may well be able to pull this off, and he'll have Bud helping out. All he has to do (heh, heh) is make the defense better. Won't surprise me if he's able to do that.
I like that it's not a failed P2 coordinator.
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Pry on the length of the DC hiring process: "To be honest, we had a candidate coaching in the championship game." #Hokies— Andy Bitter (@AndyBitterVT) January 28, 2025
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I'm not sure who was leading brent to believe that we had a realistic shot at Golden or Knowles. Again, our program just feels out of touch with nobody in that building giving them a reality check
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AND he didn't say which championship game. Although it does imply CFP championship. Definitely was not Golden, he was already going to the Bengals after they beat PSU.
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Sounds like it was Knowles. But the OSU championship run really ramped up his value. He was probably ready to get out of there after the toxic situation from the Michigan loss.
It really feels slimey to me that Pry was seriously interested in Knowles and courting him all the way up to the championship, then his dear old friend James swoops in and pays top dollar to hire him away. Fair or not, I'm starting to hold Pry's association with Franklin against him. I dislike Franklin that much.
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This is a narrative that you've harped on since day one of Pry, and I find it preposterous. Pry is not secretly directing assets to PSU and Franklin. He is not recruiting kids to PSU or easing up on recruiting kids if PSU is interested in them.
The explanation, if we were ever seriously in the running for Knowles which I highly doubt, is that Knowles was frustrated with his role at OSU which is now public knowledge and was looking to jump ship to somewhere he could have more autonomy. He is one of the top DCs in the country, which is why OSU poached him from OKSt, and so once Tom Allen left for Clemson, he was immediately top of their board as he should be and they made him a huge offer.
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Not since day one. Was pretty excited for Pry early on. But considering the fact he didn't bring a single transfer or hire from the PSU staff with him to Blacksburg, we haven't actively tried to flip any PSU commits and haven't even found ourselves in many head to head recruiting battles with them if at all, Franklin tried to poach Mines, we are actively trying to hire Knowles and it's PSU that ponies up to take him, and it seems Pry's game management came directly from the Franklin school of coaching. Yeah I find it a tad concerning to say the least.
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To the last point, I'm in no way surprised that Pry struggles with game management because of what you said. I do find that concerning and always have. The rest I don't believe a whiff of.
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We were literally in talks with Knowles since before the playoffs. Negotiated twice to increase the salary we would offer. They kept winning. He became a hot commodity. His price kept going up. He was ready to leave tOSU. Winning the ship was the best thing for him to create that demand to get himself paid.
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#Sauces? It seems weird that we'd go from wanting and negotiating with a DC in the championship game, presumably over weeks, losing out on him, then going to a DC that is like a complete 180 from playoff-level DC in less than a week. Not sure I'm buying it.
Edit: also - weird that you'd know that we'd been negotiating with him like that, but didn't have that insight beforehand when everyone was wondering what was going on.
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Knowles was definitely a candidate for the VT job. He wanted out of OSU. VT was one of his options.
Unfortunately for us he/OSU kept winning which delayed any aggressive hiring action we could take (e.g. get him for $2mil per year) and Clemson sniped PSU's DC, opening the door for PSU to back up the Brinks truck and hire him for a # we certainly could not match, much less beat.
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Comments
Part Deuce. Excellent
Pt 1 is dead. Long live Pt 2!
Only 997 more comments to go on this one!
The old thread wouldn't even show me new comments first when I clicked on the option any longer. Thanks for starting a new one.
I got way behind on the last thread and there was no way I was going to catch up, so I'm happy to see a new one.
Not so happy that we need a 2nd thread because we still haven't hired a DC, though...
we actually named a dc on page 2, you should catch up
/s
Can someone post a table in this thread with the potential candidates (I.e. Chris Marve, Donald Duck, Horse on a Treadmill, Gritty, etc.) even the ones that have passed on us?
At this point, I have to imagine Pry is sitting at his desk, staring at a ham sandwich wondering, "if I leave that out in the sun long enough, will it develop rudimentary intelligence so I can hire it?"
Justin HAMilton confirmed
Someone say "Part Deux"?
what if this is like Valve and we only have part 2 and never a 3rd?
Part 2.1 and 2.2 but never a 3rd
To be fair (to be fair), this is more of a "No DC" thread than a "DC" thread.
If and when they finally announced one, who thinks it will reach 1k posts, too?
~500 comments with over 2/3rds of the comments complaining about the choice is my bold prediction. Parlay that with the 2/3rds of complaints coming from <1/3rd of the individual commenters.
What kind of odds are you giving?
You know how it goes on TKP: 2/3rds of the comments will hate the pick and say our program is doomed. Another 2/3rds will love the pick and start predicting 10 win seasons. And the final 2/3rds will just be arguing about cake or mayonnaise or whether QBs and TEs are basically the same position.
Im not good at math but 6/3's is a lot
Math is hard.
6/3 = 2 ... 2 dc threads confirmed
It's Scott Steiner math.
the fact that we're now on thread 2 without an announcement scares the absolute sh*t out of me about the state of the program, Pry's ability to find the right person, and Whit's ability to pay said person. WTF is going on???
The number of message board posts about a thing is not a referendum on the state of the program. I can make 1000 posts about how VT is a failure for not hiring Jabba the Hutt as DC, the volume of posts about a thing doesn't give it legitimacy.
I mean, would Jabba the Hutt be much worse than what we've had the last 7 years?
Yes, he doesn't exist.
Well really this is more like year 1 anyway
More DC threads than fans at loluva's spring festivus!
The longer this takes the more I feel my reaction is going to be like this.....
via GIPHY
I read through the entire original thread for the first time today. Took me 3 hours. AND FOR WHAT??? FOR A NEW THREAD TO APPEAR??? pfff
Part 2?!?
What is this, the fuckin Godfather movies? Maybe this time something will actually happen
I don't like to be over dramatic about the state of the program, but if we get to part 3 we actually are as screwed as everyone says
THANK YOU!!!
PSU reportedly offering a large package for Knowles to steal him away from their intraconference rivals. PSU fans at least have something to salivate over. VT fans just staring at the sun with no shades on, wondering why it burns.
I still think he stays at OSU with a bigger paycheck, but we'll see.
Hearing in my neck of the woods that Wiseman from Michigan might be in play for an NFL gig which would open yet another DC position.
🙄🙄
Always, always, always a leg for this movie.
Or almost any John Candy reference actually.
At this point, we are going to promote Quinn and the program will start to smolder into a dumpster fire
Start to? We aren't there?
74-66 in the last decade.
74-66 is still above .500 though. We've only had one bad season (2022) in that stretch. It can get a lot worse
You shut that whore mouth!
If you mean Dan Quinn I'm fine with that. Ecstatic actually.
I wonder if the football program has someone check out threads like these to read the pulse of the fans?
What pulse?
Cue Ron Rivera cutting the kicker because the Redskins / Football Team / 'Ders fans were upset
We don't donate enough for our opinions to matter, remember?
lol no
Holy fucking shit. How long has it been since Pry fired whatever his name was?
This is beyond embarrassing. Bud might as well come back
In the tune to I love the 80s: strikes back from vh1:
🎶 I Love DC Threeeeaaadds: Part Deux! 🎵
Speaking as a Cowboys fan, i.... hope my Hokies don't let me down with this decision.
My fandom these days is really being tested
I haven't spoken as a cowboy fan since 1995!
No announcement yet, but hey what's new?
Some behind paywall rumblings/frustrations boiling over from insiders. I'm firmly resetting expectations for this program. Might want to get the new AD/HC thread fired up at this point. I'll leave it there.
I haven't paid a minute of attention to this and let me tell y'all, ignorance is bliss.
joker
DC
ai
last meals
...I miss anything fellas?
Wow, AI technology is incredible.
oh, right. and this.
I swear, every time I see this, the smoke seems to be getting thicker!
meant to be a reply to GKM
"wake me when it's over"
YAY! let's share pictures of our cats and nominate them to be our new DC! And derail this thread yet again since nothing new is happening!
My candidate #1......'Creamer'
but I hardly know her!
Cats a fatass who skipped leg day.
👀👀
Another month, another who-the-hell-will-the-DC-be? thread.
Wrong thread.
I know there's a lot of consternation and panicking right now from people on both this thread and thread #1. I've mostly not been paying attention, but even reading everything I'm not really concerned much at the moment. What the people who are panicking haven't acknowledged or seem to even have thought about is that the college carousel calendar has changed. Because of the expanded playoff, not only are more teams, and therefore more coaches, not moving after conference championship weekend/Signing Day, but the timeframe at which they might move is extended. We have to adjust our timeline expectations because of this.
Previous timeline (2023)
- Coaches fired:
-Coaches available to be hired:
Current timeline
-Coaches fired:
-Coaches hired:
Marve was fired on Dec. 12th, more than ten days before he would've been fired in previous years. Movement of coaches from top teams didn't reach an equal point to previous seasons until Jan. 11th, nearly ten days later than it did in previous cycles. There is a 20 day difference in this years coaching carousel vs. the coaching carousels that you are used to. Looking at the old thread, people started voicing concerns about two weeks ago (20 something days ago). In the ensuing time those concerns waterfalled into panic. But, because of the new timeline, concerns shouldn't have been popping up until after the National Championship Game. Going into the week of Feb 3-7 is when those concerns should start to waterfall into panic.
TLDR: we are currently in peak coordinator carousel. Not hiring a DC so far is likely because of college football's calendar changes. Adjust your expectations accordingly.
Save all this logic and calm for where it belongs: the inevitable thread #3. /s
But other schools aren't having this issue. What other school has a returning head coaching and a coordinator vacancy that has been open 6 weeks?
Either:
Odds don't look great imo.
Example of program not in the top tier of cfb who fired a coordinator in the same timeframe as we did?
I believe Florida fired their DC in late November, so they have had a vacancy longer than we have.
P4 teams that have all recently filled coordinator roles without replacing a head coach:
P4 teams with an open coordinator roles without replacing a head coach:
I used this tracker as my starting point, verified stuff via google too. I didn't include G5 or FCS hires. I did not include co-DC/OC's in this (which Bama, UF, and others are hiring for).
Of the 10ish teams listed above, the longest search (excluding OU's mid-season firing) was half the length of ours. Yea, NC State is the only school on this list that is in a very similar boat to us BUT, there's four ACC teams on this list. UW is P2, but doesn't get full B10 paychecks. UCLA's athletic department is fucked. So it's not like we're comparing apples and oranges here.
This just feels like another one of those things where, at the micro-level, you can explain why every other school was able to fill a position faster than we were. But at the macro level, it's an indication of a problem. It's just like in recruiting - you miss on one guy because he wants to be closer to home, miss on another guy because OSU comes in at the last minute, miss on another guy because he wants a city school, miss on another guy because a rival hired his high school coach - you miss on 5 guys, each for understandable reasons, but when your top 5 can all find a reason to not come to a VT, it's a problem.
So something is wrong with this search. What? I don't know. But I'm sure it's something like recruiting... One guy got more money than we can offer, one guy got an HC gig, one guy had his dream job open when Clemson poached his boss, one guy's wife doesn't want to live in Blacksburg, one guy is afraid he'll be back on the job market next year, etc... Like recruiting, when guys find reasons not to come instead of finding reason to come - even if each reason is bespoke to their situation - it's a problem.
To add to this, Oklahoma fired their DC around 1/4 and Notre Dame's DC just went to the Bengals. So that is an "SEC" blue-blood and ND in the list with PSU.
Basically, the coaching hires are like being in line at a club. The VIPs cut the line. VT is not a VIP. Everytime a VIP shows up (their DC job becomes available), we have to wait longer. VT may not be directly competing with blue-bloods and upper tier P2 teams for DCs, but their moves cause dominoes to fall whose effects cascade down to VT. I firmly believe that Clemson poaching PSU's DC basically reset our timeline. We could still realistically get someone like Dex or someone else who could turn out to be a good to great hire, but we have to wait for all of the dominoes above us to fall in place. It sucks, but it is what it is. It is just the result of where we currently stand in the hierarchy of CFB.
I think you missed my point (or disagree with it)?
NC managed to make a hire in less than 3 weeks, and didn't have to 'wait in line'.
We'll see. Maybe your theory about Dex is correct. I hope you're correct. But right now it's not looking good.
NC State managed a relatively quick hire by going after a guy that was an analyst at Baylor in 2024. Not a coordinator, not a position coach, but an analyst.
At Baylor. He was the LB coach for the Philadelphia Eagles in 2023. He was last a college DC in 2022 at Temple. If VT hired someone with that resume there would be an absolute meltdown. NC State's hire screams, "Let's get a warm body in here and get this over with."
FWIW: My opinion is that it will take as long as it takes. We're just getting antsy and since VT has a history of a combination of getting big-dogged and underwhelming, down-the-hall hires everyone is reading way too much into the timing. It's understandable. I'm getting a bit concerned myself. But whoever we hire will be whoever we hire. Even then we won't know if it's a good hire until about halfway through next season. So my opinion is that the timing "may" be concerning, but it isn't a direct indication that the program is in freefall.
Now, if all of the dominoes fall into place and we then take another month to just promote Quinn, then I'll change my tune.
Did you just call us the ugly girl at the club?
I mean, if he did, would he be wrong?
No it just cuts me at a level i never knew i had
bar, this is why you're my favorite person on this board. You always come with the fucking facts!
I would argue that this is still a small sample size. If you narrow it a little to find equivalents, IMO it's hard to how bad our outlier status is. PSU, OU, Miami, Clemson, FSU, and Michigan are all above us in the pecking order unfortunately. You could argue Nebraska and UW, I wouldn't I think those are close enough comps. I am going to eliminate Nebraska because that was midseason firing. That leaves
We're more than double any other search, which to your point is alarming. I'm not sure I'm ready to panic based on that considering the carousel is still churning. Of the two DC hires, Walters is getting about $1.4m/yr. NC State hired DJ Eliot as DC and Charlton Warren as co-DC, which someone please explain to me like I'm 5.
Not entirely sure there's a macro analysis to be had here. But I concede there's more reason for alarm than I previously thought.
How long we take to hire someone is irrelevant. It only matters if it's a good hire.
If we hire someone quickly and he sucks, then we didn't take enough time to evaluate candidates.
If we hire someone quickly and he's awesome, then we made a great hire.
If we take a long time to hire someone and he sucks, then we must have missed on better candidates and this is the best we could settle for.
If we take a long time to hire someone and he's awesome, then we did our due diligence and made sure we were hiring the right guy rather than rushing into it.
The timeframe means nothing, only the hire matters. If he's a good hire then it's good, if not then it's bad. This is true whether he's hired in December or February.
The timeframe means 2 things: Jack and shit, and Jack left town. Let's see what poor sucker gets hired as our DC and then we can bitch about how much he sucks. All this preemptive whining is a waste of time and energy.
I appreciate the kind words! I try very hard not to be over-emotional-uninformed-fanatic, and instead be over-emotional-mildly-well-informed-fanatic.
My belief is that a given hire is just as good regardless of when it is made; it doesn't matter much if Quinn was hired on 12/20, 12/31, 1/20, or 1/31. It's still Shawn Quinn. Same goes for any hypothetical candidate.
But, the issue is that, typically you start with your #1 hire, then move down the list. If we've been here for 45 days, how far down the list are we?
So far down Quinn turned it down because it didn't want to look desperate/s
It's absolutely irrelevant how long it takes. It's not like picking up donuts at a bakery, where they're all basically the same, and the next person in line gets the best ones out of the ones that look just alike. VT, in particular, has a specific scheme that we've been using that's not generic, and likely doesn't have an unlimited budget to break all historical records with their offer. While I'd prefer sooner, what I really want is improvement.
So the standard for evaluating the hire hasn't changed. It doesn't matter if VT superfans are nervous. All that matters is if they get someone who can build and run a defense, and the only time constraint is that he has to have his system in place and effective by September.
New staff additions?
I had a great time at @HokiesFB Jr day today. I had the pleasure of meeting the new staff additions as well as. Thank you guys for showing me and my family a good time. @CoachPryVT @CoachPrioleauVT @CoachdjCheetah @VTRecruiting26 @VTScoop247 pic.twitter.com/7SHtabtDv4— Cameron Zoom Hairston-Taylor (@TaylorMadeOnG) January 25, 2025 " target="_blank">
wut
He mentioned meeting the new staff additions, so they may already be on campus just not announced for whatever reason.
Going off of his post, we can assume PJ and DJ are still on staff. Maybe some of the others aren't and what we're doing is trying to fill out the whole defensive staff before an announcement.
why would we fill out the whole staff before sn announcement
"Staff addition" != "new DC."
He could just as easily met the new hire for hype videos, or the new Associate Director of Ensuring Players Drink Their Protein Shakes.
Why the secrecy?!
Maybe they don't want our message boards exploding and taking out the fan base due to an internal promotion? I'm starting a Rumor JC Price got promoted due to prior HC experience.
That's what I'm hearing too🗣️👂😉
I'm hearing rumors that we may not actually hire a DC at all and just let the guys wing it out there for one year with Bud Foster just giving them the death stare from the booth to see if we actually improve over whatever the fuck it was that Marve was trying to do.
The longer the wait becomes, the more convinced I am that it's going to be Daryl Tapp.
Gotta say, I don't hate this theory
Does this open up another shot at Poindexter?
That last second change of heart can get after ya though.
We were just playing the long game
1. That is insane money for a coordinator. Really displays the disparity between P2 and everyone else.
2. Leaving the defending Champs with a Roster stacked with talent to join a conference rival in an adjacent state is some cutthroat shit.
3. The folks at PSU at least have some insight. James Franklin is only as good as his Coordinators--his job is to bring in the talent, someone else needs to figure out how to use them. They ponied up the big $$ because they knew they needed to.
4. None of this is exactly a ringing endorsement for Poindexter as a potential D.C. if he even is/was/will be a candidate here.
If Poindexter was Penn State's choice 1-B after nabbing the champ's DC, why wouldn't that be a ringing endorsement?
that would make him 1-B like four times running for them. Now none of the guys chosen over him have been slouches so it stands to reason he still might be a better DC than Marve.
Ross Dellenger just put out an article on Yahoo which reads like propaganda from Franklin. Apparently Dex was the leading candidate for the job, until Knowles became interested. Somehow Dellenger was a fly on the wall and overheard a quote between Dex and Franklin, with Dex saying "Oh we could really get Jim?" And turned down "other P4 coordinator offers" to return to PSU and be passed over for a third time.
Smells like a total propaganda piece put out by Franklin. Really hate that POS.
https://sports.yahoo.com/we-could-really-get-jim-jim-knowles-anthony-poi...
"he still might be a better DC than Marve". Trying to think if a lower bar exists.
Justin Hamilton is probably neck and neck
Does this mean Dex is back on the table?
Jim Knowles to Penn State..?
my bad, Pete. I'll drink.
So is Dex our prom date or nah, because I totally have a hotter date ready to go from another school
mine's from Canada, you wouldn't know her
This would be really bad for our 3rd down defense stats
At this point I think Pry is just going to take the DC responsibility himself.
Welp, so much for Knowles opening the door for the Dex hire.
Unless Pry just wasn't interested in Dex, he's crazy for hanging around there. He's never going to get the main DC job and he needs to move toward being a coordinator sooner rather than later.
I really do wonder if he thinks Tony Elliot's days are numbered and he thinks he has a decent shot at landing the HC job at UVA
Have read rumors that the relationship there is a little icy from them slow playing him last time for Elliott. Especially with Carla still there. But things could change I suppose.
PSU just paid $3m to hire over Dex. He isn't in line to be their DC (or ours)
Wasn't Knowles viewed as a maybe hire in Part 1? And he just got $3M a year? Yikes. we might be priced out of success.
We made 5 mil in profit last year. We paid Joe Rudolph $0.5mil more a year than we paid Crooks and Moore, heck we are barely paying Moore this year due to his WVU contract. Mines got a raise but no where close to cover the difference in Brad Glenns salary vs Brooks. We are paying are coaching staff are $0.75 mil less than 3 years ago. We can easily afford a $1.5 mil DC. We have the revenue to afford even higher.
Honestly if we're not in the $2.5 mil range then we aren't getting any top notch coordinator. We have to overpay because most likely they will have to look for a job in two years.
This very weird and shady Instagram user says Texas A&M DC Jay Bateman is going to be announced tomorrow...🤷🏼♂️🤷🏼♂️. Account is HokieWatch fyi
Bringing along the current DL coach
Sean Spencer is the DL coach who coached under wait for it....James Franklin at Vanderbilt. Jay Bateman is DC under Mike Elko, who both coached together at Richmond.
What criminal/extramarital deed did Bateman do that TA&M is covering up, potentially to be exposed once we hire him? lol
Contact extension and raise for Bateman at Texas A&M confirmed!
He was not good at UNC, mostly good or okay last year A&M, couple blowup games with Auburn and SC.
I feel kinda weird about the hire if we're able to steal him from them, might mean they didn't put up much of a fight. On the other hand at least he does have play calling experience. But not with our scheme
He was amazing at Army. Pretty weird seeing him go from being the DC on a triple option team to seeing him be the DC on a Phil-Longo-air-raid team.
I'd be excited about.
Interesting, from Richmond, VA, went to Randolph-Macon, was DC of Army when Brent Davis was OC, also received improper information about Wake Forest in 2017, "brought in several top defensive recruits to the [UNC] program"
I'm intrigued...
After a quick google search, there were at least two articles 4 weeks ago talking about the possibility of him being fired and looking at replacements.
He's had a pretty up-and-down tenure since leaving Army, where he was a Broyles finalist.
He started off great at UNC, but peaked quickly and had a pretty woeful 2021 with decent talent. Now, to be fair, no one who has replaced him has fared much better---so was it a Bateman issue or a UNC one?
It seems the opinion on his performance at Texas A&M has been quite mixed.
As compared to an internal hire like Quinn or even Poindexter (who has now been passed over 3 or 4?? times at PSU) Bateman would be a reasonably solid hire.
"While the rumors swirl, this would be the right move, especially concerning late-game adjustments, as Bateman failed to slow down opponents in losses to South Carolina, Auburn, and USC in the Las Vegas Bowl, mainly due to issues in the secondary and a lack of timely blitzing."
This doesn't give me the good feels after the year we just had...
Taken from... Link
https://x.com/GigemBurner/status/1883682946437255475?t=8Jv_p60RHj68GvZRA...
https://x.com/AggiesRecruitEx/status/1883681864734707880?t=Ejut28BXo65uU...
A lot of smoke on X right now from A&M fans about Bateman leaving so let the speculation begin. Is this a hire we would be happy about?
I'll be happy if he can win us the middle 8 and figure out the Rutgers kryptonite play. It's not a high bar the last 2 set.
No he's coached some awful defenses
this is the reality of wanting to poach p2 dcs... they are available bc they suck... to poach good ones seems to cost $3m
We paid frank $2mil when we paid bud $1mil, so top DC is ~ half an HC. 35 coaches make over $6 million, so 3 million doesn't sound off.
it sounds off from our budget
Well we are only paying Pry $4 mil because we are at the bottom of the P4 so a DC is $2 mil. which isn't too far off the budget we had 2 years ago.
To be fair he's just about at $5 mil
Yeah i can't find consistent reports for the exact number but year 1 was $4.0m and year 6 is $5.0m so yeah 4 is $4.6m?
The original assistant budget was $5.5 and we spent $4.4 last year. So we've been saving $1.1m a year for 2 years from our budget. Also assume that we can get the same 200k increase Pry gets every year for assistance then that is $1.7m budget over what we spent last season. Add in Marve's salary and we are close to $2.6m within our budget! There are also escalators for 8 wins and 11 wins. Had we won half the 1 score games we'd be at $3 mil easy.
Probably should pay each coordinator half of what the head coach makes. This would assume each coordinator (O & D, not ST) is responsible for 25% of the team's success and the head coach is responsible for half
That's how you give 125%
Usually not a good sign when fans of the team he's leaving are happy about it
If this board is any indication, I wouldn't put too much emphasis on what the fans think of a departing coordinator when assessing his quality.
So I'm sure we will find reasons to not like a hire like this but given he was likely not in top 3 choices, I can imagine worse hire than current SEC DC, former HC, DC for precious ACC school, former broyles finalist, with VA ties. Remember we had Marve as our last DC ( has none of those boxes checked). I'm not saying it's perfect , checkered success, maybe differences in scheme etc but it's not dumpster fire either , like hiring within or some no name high risk.
I could be pleased with the hire.
Per Prys comments, the DC would be running his scheme, not Elko's.
If Batemen was running the gap fill/spill at army, it could work 🤷♂️
Idk I'm not calling this a home run hire, but I'm not going to riot about either.
Jason or Justine?
Obviously Justine. Only way we would have "Satisfaction".
Edit: The only correct response to my post is "$!&$! you are old"
If it's the aTm DC, why would it have taken so long?
He wasn't our first choice or even in the top 5. We missed out on or we were turned down by enough guys that we've ended up at him.
I didn't know that he was from Richmond, and graduated from Randolph-Macon so he at least has VA ties.
I don't like the Bateman rumor.
the only Bateman I like, is Jason
Always good to see Bud Foster blowing off some steam and relaxing.
Meh, he's not so bad. Really knows his music.
Holy Crap! I knew Christian Bale from American Psycho and Batman, but it was only just now that I realized he played Bateman AND Batman.
So, is today the day? *crosses fingers*
To quote the legendary Bob Uecker, "I don't know what the hell they are doing." All my names except Bob Shoop are off the board, and Shoop is on the downside.
I hear there is white smoke rising over Hokie houses in pot legal states. The DC search is driving Hokies to self medication.
Being a Hokie fan has driven me to self medication
You wanna go where everybody knows your name!
I could be wrong, but I don't think it's happening today, boys.
Day 423!! Give it up for day 423 everybody! 🥴
Lol. Some insiders were saying today was the day. Guess not!
If anyone is interested in the Bateman rumors, here's a UNC-quality film review from a UNC site. It's clearly not of the same quality as French's but what else are we going to talk about?
mayonnaise?
As in, "Mayonnaise a lot of comments for the amount content." ?
Or as in "Your Mayonnaise bowl runner-up VTech small appliance spurtle promo?
Pete Thamel off the top rope on ESPN:
Sources: Virginia Tech is targeting Arizona Cardinals LB coach Sam Siefkes as the school's new defensive coordinator. Siefkes is an integral part of the Cardinals' innovative NFL scheme, and he brings collegiate defensive coordinator experience, including a stint at Wofford. He brings NFL experience from two seasons with the Vikings as a quality control coach and the assistant linebackers coach. Along with his time at Wofford, he's also coordinated defense at UW-Platteville.
Big time meh.
Holy random Batman! How many DCs did we strike out on to be this far down the list?
I'd fell much better about this if he could bring a couple of his linebackers with him.....
I'm sure they could sue for additional eligibility and get some of that sweet sweet NIL
Cards have been running 3 safeties a lot this reason, what a coincidence.
This aint a "home run" hire.
TKP posted 1500 comments for this? Does Pry not read our threads?
Here's his bio:
2012-13 GA at UW-La Crosse
2014 QC coach at FIU
2016-2017: DC & ILB coach at UW-Platteville
2018-2020 DC & ILB coach at Wofford
2021-2022 Vikings LB Coach
2023-2024 Cardinals LB Coach
-----
That is absolutely not a good enough resume for this hire.
This team and program are a complete fucking joke.
Yeah...make no mistake about it, this is an absolute flop of a hire. You can't spin it any other way. Especially if we pay an NFL LB coach with VERY minimal college experience anywhere near $1M - $1.5M.
Honestly, just go ahead and fire up the new AD/HC conversation thread. We all know how this is going to end.
Jumping from Wofford to the Vikings seems like a very big jump. Is that type of promotion common? Why only one year at Vikings before going to Cardinals? Not staying anywhere long. Was he that good, worked for the wrong coaches, or that bad?
Doesn't check a single box. No crootin' ties. No P4 playcalling experience. What are we doing? Can we start the HC Search thread?
Sure he does, cost.
Siefkes was the defensive coordinator/inside linebackers coach at Wofford College (2018-20).
His final season at Wofford in 2020 was postponed due to COVID-19. In 2019, he led the nation's 20th ranked defense that helped guide the program to its 3rd straight Southern Conference Championship and 4th straight appearance in the FCS Playoffs. The defense ranked 1st in the conference in total defense and rushing defense and 2nd in scoring defense.
In his first season at Wofford in 2018, the Terriers led the conference in total defense, scoring defense, passing defense, and rushing defense. Nationally, they ranked 8th in scoring defense and 12th in total defense. Wofford had a 9-4 overall record, won the Southern Conference Championship and advanced to the second round of the FCS Playoffs.
Siefkes spent two seasons (2016-17) as the defensive coordinator/inside linebackers coach at UW-Platteville.
His defense allowed just 18.9 points per game in 2017 and had three shutouts. The Pioneers finished the 2016 season with an 8-3 record and advanced to the playoffs.
In 2015, Siefkes worked as a defensive graduate assistant at the University of Wisconsin, helping with the defensive line. With the Badgers, he coached alongside former defensive coordinator and current Baylor head coach Dave Aranda. Wisconsin led the nation in scoring defense (13.7 ppg) and ranked 2nd nationally in total defense (268.5 ypg) that season. They defeated USC in the Holiday Bowl, the Badgers second consecutive bowl game victory.
Leg, sir. Thank you for adding context.
This is the guy you pick to save your job? Good luck with that one, Brent.
To be fair, the guy you pick to save your job may be different than the guy you pick to appease the fanbase.
If Pry really believes this guy knows what he's doing, and this guy wins, then none of this matters.
I honestly care more about performance than resume. Next year will be telling. But I will excited for him and us right now.
I mean, Bud Foster's only experience was as a LB coach at Murray State before becoming our LB coach, before becoming our DC.
All the folks on Reddit were stoked that we were potentially taking Bateman off their hands, so I'm willing to give Siefkes the benefit of the doubt. NFL experience and was pretty solid at Wofford.
Its Wofford.
Didn't really expect to get a Knowles or A+ hire when your head coach might get canned after this season. Experience is experience, Wofford or not.
The gap between Knowles and this guy would have to be measured in light years.
Yeah no one is debating that.
I think the transition from FCS coordinator to G5 coordinator to P4 coordinator is relatively small (compared to being a head coach).
I'm not saying this is a good hire, but I can talk myself into it.
Is there some existing connection between Pry and Siefkes? Like how is he even on our radar? I didn't really follow the Cardinals this year, but I also didn't hear anything about their defense/linebackers at any point this season.
Ummmmmmm.......
The fire is about to get out of control.
If that's their pick, let em burn.
Can't find many boxes that he checks in terms of an appreciable resume to save a head coaches job...
Honestly I don't even care at this point. If we hire him and he sucks, then everyone will get canned and we can start Rebuild 2.0, and if he turns out to be Foster-level legendary then we'll get big-dogged and he'll be gone in 3-4 years anyways.
Yah...Damb. Guess I gotta start marching out the rebuild years again 😭
This is where I'm at as well.
What's crazy is that if we're getting him on a cheap deal and he comes and does well, someone will probably just hire him away after a year or two if Pry is still around.
Which would be great. That's THE ideal scenario. Look at the DC that just won the national championship.
Exactly, we need someone to fix the coaching. If he comes in and the staff is still intact in 2 seasons we will likely have finally found success and can go get a flashy hire then if that what Pry thinks we need
We got one of the best known OL coaches in the country a couple years ago and it meant essentially nothing to our program.
I would like to be more familiar with Sam but he will either get our D where it needs to be or he won't.
Frankly, I give his NFL endorsements more weight than some other guys defensive ranks 7 years ago.
About the only thing he doesn't bring are connections with players that might transfer this spring.
In the meantime, go Sam! Go Hokies!
Budda Baker got any eligibility left?
This guy has been a defensive coordinator before, and done well at it.
He also has four years of NFL coaching experience.
He may well be able to pull this off, and he'll have Bud helping out. All he has to do (heh, heh) is make the defense better. Won't surprise me if he's able to do that.
I like that it's not a failed P2 coordinator.
So all we had to do to get the new DC announced was get to a part two discussion thread? Duly noted for the next hiring thread! /s sorta
In my will ferrell/anchorman voice... I don't believe you....
I would believe a positions coach.
Has to be Tapp.
I'm not sure who was leading brent to believe that we had a realistic shot at Golden or Knowles. Again, our program just feels out of touch with nobody in that building giving them a reality check
He didn't say it was Golden or Knowles.
AND he didn't say which championship game. Although it does imply CFP championship. Definitely was not Golden, he was already going to the Bengals after they beat PSU.
Sounds like it was Knowles. But the OSU championship run really ramped up his value. He was probably ready to get out of there after the toxic situation from the Michigan loss.
It really feels slimey to me that Pry was seriously interested in Knowles and courting him all the way up to the championship, then his dear old friend James swoops in and pays top dollar to hire him away. Fair or not, I'm starting to hold Pry's association with Franklin against him. I dislike Franklin that much.
When you put it like that, it sounds possible.
No, not really.
Take it for what it's worth but BAG told me on twitter it was Knowles.
(I don't know how connected he remains with the program)
No, I meant the implication that he rolled over for Franklin. He might have been outbid, but it wasn't because he deferred to his friend.
This is a narrative that you've harped on since day one of Pry, and I find it preposterous. Pry is not secretly directing assets to PSU and Franklin. He is not recruiting kids to PSU or easing up on recruiting kids if PSU is interested in them.
The explanation, if we were ever seriously in the running for Knowles which I highly doubt, is that Knowles was frustrated with his role at OSU which is now public knowledge and was looking to jump ship to somewhere he could have more autonomy. He is one of the top DCs in the country, which is why OSU poached him from OKSt, and so once Tom Allen left for Clemson, he was immediately top of their board as he should be and they made him a huge offer.
Not since day one. Was pretty excited for Pry early on. But considering the fact he didn't bring a single transfer or hire from the PSU staff with him to Blacksburg, we haven't actively tried to flip any PSU commits and haven't even found ourselves in many head to head recruiting battles with them if at all, Franklin tried to poach Mines, we are actively trying to hire Knowles and it's PSU that ponies up to take him, and it seems Pry's game management came directly from the Franklin school of coaching. Yeah I find it a tad concerning to say the least.
To the last point, I'm in no way surprised that Pry struggles with game management because of what you said. I do find that concerning and always have. The rest I don't believe a whiff of.
We were literally in talks with Knowles since before the playoffs. Negotiated twice to increase the salary we would offer. They kept winning. He became a hot commodity. His price kept going up. He was ready to leave tOSU. Winning the ship was the best thing for him to create that demand to get himself paid.
If it happened like that, it was great for him, and bad for us.
And cost Penn State a small fortune.
#Sauces? It seems weird that we'd go from wanting and negotiating with a DC in the championship game, presumably over weeks, losing out on him, then going to a DC that is like a complete 180 from playoff-level DC in less than a week. Not sure I'm buying it.
Edit: also - weird that you'd know that we'd been negotiating with him like that, but didn't have that insight beforehand when everyone was wondering what was going on.
Knowles was definitely a candidate for the VT job. He wanted out of OSU. VT was one of his options.
Unfortunately for us he/OSU kept winning which delayed any aggressive hiring action we could take (e.g. get him for $2mil per year) and Clemson sniped PSU's DC, opening the door for PSU to back up the Brinks truck and hire him for a # we certainly could not match, much less beat.
So the rumor is that Knowles wanted out after OU loss because of things said. So we had a chance until Dabo screwed us over.