Three man down linemen, with a nose, a 3 tech to the side of the jack LB and a five/seven tech to the WILL linebacker side. I expect the nose to be Gilliam/Priester/Copeland, with Nash, Copeland, and Laws at the 3 tech and Burgos, Stevens, and Abbey at the field side DE.
Jack linebacker is a hybrid stand up DE/LB, standing up on the edge ala Fred Dean, Rickey Jackson, Bryce Paup, Kevin Greene, etc. Bell and Djonkman fit that mold, and Stevens, as a former LB, could play it as well.
Mike is alone between the tackles. Woodson I think gets that spot. He still has to fit, but has to move laterally and step into the hole.
Will is kind of like the STAR- has to cover and lines up away from the Jack. I think Spencer, Ellis, and Covil potentially play that role. Long term, Gabe Williams will fit if he can recover from his injury.
Corners won't change. Isiah Brown Murray gives depth at corner and can replace the WILL
Field hash safety could be Reddish or Covil. Middle safety could be Ellis or Cash. Boundary safety could be Cash or Reddish. I don't expect Tyson Flowers to make much of a contribution could be wrong.
Ok, who am I missing? Given this change, I wouldn't be shocked to see Keller depart if he graduates this spring. He doesn't fit. Djonkman can always move to MIKE if needed (one of the most productive inside LBs in CFB last year.) And if you are a safety not named Reddish or the Robinson kid coming in as a true frosh, it may be time to look elsewhere.
I am starting a detailed film review looking at the AZ Cardinals and 2019 Wofford this weekend. It may take a bit. This is a new scheme for me so it will take some time to draw valuable conconclusions.
Comments
First impression, based on your information...
Want.
I've recently become a fan of a 3 man front, particularly of the 3-0-5/7 variety.
Love the flexibility of the JACK
Well, the Jack is on the LOS so it is a 4 man front, but the center is covered so it is an odd front call for the center. It can become a five man front when they walk up the WILL. The MIKE is the closest thing to a traditional LB. Middle safety is the hero in the scheme.
Will be a selling point to recruits. Will be interested to see if that plays a role in getting blue chip safeties moving forward.
French! Great stuff. Look forward to the next analysis u provide, it'll be very revealing.
Question: How does this fit w Bud as a Key Advisor to the plan? That will be key, IMHO
I'm all for this change!
The hope is Siefkes is malleable enough to fit scheme to personnel...identify your best 11 and build a scheme around it.
Think what you laid out makes sense. Would try to find a way to have Djonkman as the jack and Bell as one of the 3 down lineman. Would have Covil as one of the safeties as he didn't fair well at Clemson closer to LOS (that may have just been a scheme / coaching issue, idk). Like Ellis as middle safety in the "Budda Baker role".
Ellis will knock your dick in the fort but he will miss too.
Cash is really reliable but not sure he is athletic enough to be dynamic. But when he puts hands on you, you go down.
Did you forget about Bass or you don't think he starts?
DUI first week on campus isn't a great start. Plus not sure if he wants to play O or D.
And Pry must have been considering this change because the rumor is that Jim Knowles was coming to VT after the Michigan game then they went on their run, and they use the three high with a four man front. But VT doesn't hav Caleb Downs last I checked.
You know what, at this point after 3 (Pry) and 13 (organizationally) years in football purgatory accepting mediocrity.... bring it on. Balls to the wall.
Better than trying to do the same thing and expecting a different result.
I just want to see that dog mentality come back to the defense like it was when I was at VT ('06-'11). Those defenses was so endearing because all 11 guys knew what they were doing and would play their nuts off.
I miss my dawg years from '04-'09; now those were some dog years... 🐶
35 years
Thanks for sharing! Looking forward to the review!
How good are these personnel fits? Forced based on who's on the roster or do they actually make sense?
For those simple-minded of us -- what are the benefits of Siefkes's scheme? I feel like I read something about how having 3 safeties basically helps make up for weakness in the front 7, but I could be totally wrong. Weakness in the front 7 sounds about right for us in the post-APR and post-Peebles world.
My googling shows that it allows for a lot of disguising and exotic blitzes.
So going off WVUs 335 stack from years ago it's more than just blitzes. you can easily drop 8, and it also the position of the dline gets you some annoying things like NT over the ball, centers hate that. The Dline positions stresses the oline and forces more 1v1 matchups.
I'm not sure how this relates to that defense, but largely the concepts should be there.
It's also easier to find LBs and Safeties that DTs so makes recruiting a bit easier as the NT is a tough position but you don't need two DTs.
Limits big plays, forces QBs to dink and dunk their way downfield
Limiting big plays would be a nice change.
don't know if this is scheme or philosophy or both, but listened to a Siefkes interview from when he was at Wofford. Said he looks for the opponents worst guy and attacks him with his best guy. I'm guessing the scheme has enough flexibility to implement that philosophy; otherwise why have it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFybJK2N93U
This combination made me laugh
Follow up question - if we're abandoning the foster scheme, how do you see him providing value in this arrangement?
Bud has decades of watching film and how to stop opponents, at the end of the day there are only 3 things your trying to accomplish, incomplete pass, ball carrier on the ground, ball in you possession. Players need to know how to fill a gap still, and our LBs are bad at that.
One big thing is that 5 wide means cover 0 is a possible, but you might want to hide that, the OSU game was a PhD thesis in hiding cover1 while showing cover 0.
Bud wasn't just a gap-spill scheme guy. He tinkered his defense on a weekly basis to exploit weaknesses and surprise OCs with something they had not yet seen on film. He found ways to get to the quarterback or confuse the quarterback using unusual alignments and different looks. He was able to adjust and tinker his defense mid-game to not only stop successes of an offense but to further exploit their weaknesses. And Bud was always borrowing concepts from other top defenses in CFB and NFL, even though he stuck with his base gap-spilling scheme. I don't think his ability to contribute in his current role would be limited to gap-spilling scheme, and quite honestly I think he would be another good mentor for Seifkes who has had a few good mentors already.
From what I've heard about Siefkes, he also has a knack on how to exploit weaknesses of an offense and able to tinker his defense. If Bud and Seifkes are cooperative and receptive, they can probably really meld their minds together to scheme up something interesting every week. I think it could be a really good pairing.
I would be disappointed if Pry had not taken Bud's opinion and advice on the hire in the highest regard. My guess is Foster liked the idea being part of a new innovative approach and is already dreaming about ways to suggest using it to F with ACC foes.
I think at a minimum, Bud can provide valuable management guidance, film review skills, and teach the art of playcalling (regardless of what scheme the plays are for).
He should also be invaluable in helping Seifkes learn how to identify specifically what is going wrong so that the right adjustments can be made. Not just "we're getting beat deep", but specifically why that is happening.
Give Bud a headset directly to Pry with override to yell at him about clock management.
Would anybody with spare time be able to make a graphic of these positions and personnel groupings?? I have basically zero football knowledge and a schematic would be super helpful.
If I could figure out how to post a screenshot then I have the perfect example of it from the Cardinals base formation
Upload the screenshot to imgur then use that link to post the pic. Or if you have a link/time stamp I'll do it for you
Not sure if anyone else has been having problems with Imgur. It keeps giving me error messages when I try to load photos. Had used it for years but all of a sudden it doesn't work.
I use imgBB.com no login and instant upload to get link.
Thanks I'll jump on it when I'm back in the office this afternoon
Long story short, I see it pretty similarly to French except for a couple adjustments. He is much much much more knowledgeable about football than I am so I am going based on either what I have been told or assumptions based on recruitments.
I agree that the Jack spot goes to Djonkam but I see Stevens being his backup there. Both are linebackers who have been converted to edge rushers and profile very similarly physically,
I would put Bell at the 5-tech even though he may be a bit undersized (LJ Collier on the Cardinals is 291 pounds) but I know he was recruited to be a starting end. I do wonder if they actually flip it from what we're thinking to have the speedier/high motor guys in Bell and Burgos at Jack with the stouter Djonkam and Stevens holding down the edge on the field side.
I think this Will spot is tailor made for Bass. Like French said, it's pretty similar to our Star under Marve, which is what Bass effectively was at Pitt. I'm not sold that Spencer stays there but not sure we have a choice with Gabe's injury. He was initially recruited to play a "big nickel" which in my eyes would align more with the center safety, but again, might need to keep him there for depth reasons.
Woodson is going to be the biggest beneficiary from the scheme shift imo. They have wanted to move him to Mike since his first summer on campus as he continued to grow and fill out. From my understanding, this scheme asks less of the Mike's to come up and fill gaps but is more reliant on their ability to move sideline to sideline. Agree with French that Keller is an awkward fit. Also not sure where I see Clatterbaugh fitting into this scheme but that's a tomorrow problem.
I see it similarly to French on the backend but I do think Flowers has a role on the field side. There isn't a ton of run support responsibility over there with the Will covering the 5 tech, and his coverage ability would be an asset. The one that I don't see having as much of a natural fit is unfortunately Covil.
right click on the image and click "open image in new tab". Then copy the URL of the new tab that was opened and paste into the comment.
Good looks, that worked. Thanks!
That explains the excessive DB transfers in.
Like someone mentioned above, I am one of those "simple-minded of us" people who is far from knowing the fine details of systems. Was wondering if this system was like the one my other team (Iowa State) uses. Feels like they like to rush only 3 or 4 people and drop 7 or 8 into coverage to clog up the passing lanes. And like to use 5 DBs at times. Definitely give off bend-but-don't break vibes and force the offense to move slowly down the field. They don't do a lot of blitzing though. End up giving up decent amounts of yards and first downs but - often times - not many points.
I might be totally off-base, but was wondering if this system would be more like Iowa State's and totally different from the aggressive, attacking defenses of the good old days when Foster ran things. Any feel for that?
I watched an older podcast interview with Siefkes where he mentioned that his back to back top-ranked defenses at Wofford did it with 3 down linemen year one, and 4 down linemen year 2 because that is what the personnel dictated. That is some interesting flexibility. I would guess he ultimately wants to run with 3 down linemen, but might transition into that based on the specific players we have available. My question is what position would dictate this? I am assuming we have some guys who can play standup edge, like you mention above. Do we have the right bigs in the middle to run this? Can his defense work with smaller twitch guys on the line? Aside from the base alignment, what are the important concepts that The Chef carries through his defenses?
Hope this sticks.
We already have a Chef over on the baseball field.
But this one has the opportunity to field a Chef's Kiss defense.
😗🤌
Alright - who else has talked themselves into this hire? I'm ready to hop on the hype train again.
I know. KNOW. that I will get hurt. But I just can't help myself. I'm going to allow myself to get excited, just like I do every year. Then I'm going to be disappointed. Just like I am every year. It's a cycle that I just can't get away from.
Might as well spend 8 months happy and excited each year is my perspective... seasons have been depressing enough to let that ruin the offseason too. I feel like Pry is close to cracking the nut and I choose to believe next year will be the year
being happy for 2/3s of the year ain't bad at all. I like that perspective. Also, why I'm not a big basketball fan. Stick to football. Live in misery for 3.5 months and spend the rest of the year looking forward to the next one.
I am definitely not hopping on the hype train. But I'm not doom and gloom either. Give the man a chance.
We have new coaches replacing the worst ones from last season. Lost a lot, but also seem to have a good portal group. The team was 6-7 and with better coaching (and less cheating for Miami) could have easily gone 8-5 or 9-4. Does not have to be a home run hire to get us to being a pretty decent 8-9 win team. That is what I'm hoping for. Just wait and see. Guess you could say I'm hoping, but not hopping.
I am keeping my expectations low. That way, he doesn't have to do as much to meet them.
(The more I learn about this guy, though, the more cautiously optimistic I am. I mean....he can't be worse than Marve.....right?)
There was concern over Marve to begin with - not enough experience, could he pick it up, could he overcome the personnel. The longer we went and the more people we saw shuffle through at linebacker, the more it became apparent he was not picking it up. The players were not executing assignments. Constant breakdowns in alleys and coverages. There were not noticeable adjustments, as we got beat on the same thing again and again. The defenses and especially blitzes became predictable. There was little situational play calling. How may times were you watching and said "here comes the QB draw, or roll out to the tight end, etc, and were right and the defense was not ready for it? And the kicker is the position he was in charge of was often the biggest part of the problem. MAYBE it could be worse, but firing him was unquestionably the right thing to do, and having the bar at improvement is a VERY low bar.
"I mean....he can't be worse than Marve.....right?"
Probably. And, like you, I am staying cautiously optimistic. But there is a saying in Venezuela (which was used as the title of a book I read about the collapse of Venezuela):
"Things Are Never So Bad They Can't Get Worse"
This sounds interesting, so I added it to my "Overpriced Ebook List" on Amazon, which I look at occasionally to see which ebooks I want to read have dropped below $10. Apparently I added this to the list already in September 2023. Price hasn't come down yet. =^/
Sounds like we need an upgrade in Safeties coaching. They could have played 3 at a time last year and I'm not it would have mattered other than having 3 guys, 20 yards off the ball and tentative.
Pry mentioned that he and Siefkes will be going over staff this week. Although Ryan Smith coached CBs at Arizona, perhaps he would come back to VT to coach the safeties being familiar with the scheme.
Maybe VT can convince Cheetah's old co-DC Matt Guerrieri (safeties coach under Knowles at OSU) to come take a major role at VT. Probably would take some money to do that, but maybe it happens.
VT also needs a LB coach, since Siefkes won't be directly overseeing a position. Could be an internal hire there, having direct tutelage from 3 elite LBs coach on staff.
(Side Bar: I really think Marve must have been so unwilling to learn from Pry and Bud. How does he not get the skills to teach LB as good as those two when one's your boss and the other is in the building. Sigh. Clearly a misevaluation from Pry when hiring him.)
Marve had zero interesting in leaning on Bud. In fact, he once became furious with Pry for getting Bud's opinion on something.
Bud is more than happy to help but he's not going to go out of his way to do so if he is not asked
Should've been fired on the spot
Whoa. Yeah, I'm glad he's gone
I think this, more than anything, proves that he thought of himself as the smartest person in any room and was too rigid in his ways and thinking to adjust. I'm sure he is a smart person, probably can do tons of research and come up with ideas, but if you aren't open to others opinions and can't adjust on the fly then you need to get out of coaching altogether honestly
Marve is EXTREMELY smart. Problem is he knows it and wants everyone else to know it as well. He is very image conscious and how he is perceived is always at the forefront of his brain and is partially why he rose in the ranks so quickly.
His intelligence was pretty evident in how he gameplanned, but he obviously either entirely lacks feel/intuition or hasnt had the necessary experience to develop it
smart. not humble. got it.
I haven't had a super long career but long enough to learn that EVERYONE has something to learn from EVERYONE ELSE. Doesn't matter how high or low you are on the corporate ladder, there are folks either side of you that you can learn from. I think what sets the best employees apart from everyone else is the curiosity and willingness to learn from others regardless of their station. The best managers I've worked for aren't super smart know-it-all types that have the answer to every question. The best managers I've worked for are the humble ones who don't project a belief that they know everything already and instead approach every situation with the mindset that someone else has something to teach them. It's not important to them that they are, or appear to be, the smartest in the room. It's important to them that they enter every room intent on learning something from someone else. And they truly are the smartest folks in the room without trying to be.
This. Best advice I could give any young engineer that might be thinking about a construction career. Have conversations with the contractor superintendents on the jobsite on how they actually go about building things. It both improves the working relationships and makes future plans better.
The best managers didn't know all the answers, they knew the questions.
And who to ask for answers...
Therein lies the problem....
Wow. Thanks for confirming. I was just conjecturing based on the fact Marve acted dismissive in his interviews, the fact Pry seemed to be displeased with Marve and subtly calling him out after the Syracuse game, and the fact that the linebackers never got better (unlike when coached by Bud or by Pry). But that really explains a lot.
We should start a position coaches discussion thread. Maybe skip to part 2 to accelerate the process
Currently
DL - Price
ass. DL - Jan Johnson
LB - ?
Prof emeritus LB - Bud
Assoc LB - Adibi
Star/Nickle- Quinn
CB - 🐆
S - Prioleau
Assoc S - Gouvia Winslow
Future?
DL probably set
Quinn moves to LB?
Cheetah stays at DB? Ryan Smith is an upgrade to me
Prioleau at S
New safety coach to replace star/nickel, or Quinn goes here.
I personally hope that we have more external influence on LB and S at the very least. I wouldn't mind shaking up the entire position coach staff tbh as long as we can keep Price on in some capacity.
The one thing which is slowly getting mentioned but I don't think is realized as much, we (and everyone else) has assistant position coaches. Crist is the QB coach, Bowen isn't teaching the QBs how to QB but how the offense works. This wasn't the case 10-15 years ago. Siefkes doesn't have to be a recruiting coach like coordinators had to years ago. You have more coaches who can recruit AND you just have more coaches.
It's possible that CFB coaching staffs look completely different in a few years. You could have major coaches that don't recruit because you have better recruiters at lower positions.
I am glad to see a change in our defensive scheme. My only hope is that we can improve mike and safety play. The middle of our defense has been abysmal. Wonder if he can teach our players to tackle? The shoulder hit without wrap up makes me cringe every time
One thing I'm interested in knowing is how different/alike the Arizona three-high safety defense is from the defense that Knowles runs.
And I do wonder with Knowles being at PSU now, whether there will be some offseason coordinator meetings between Knowles and his staff with Siefkes and his staff; and maybe Nick Rallis and the AZ Cards staff too. And hell, invite the recently retired Mike Zimmer too. That would be a lot of bright defensive football minds.
Marve-el-less
Stop
Sorry, I shouldn't have had the gall(t) to make that joke.