Tech had eight penalties at Pitt. Seven were of the pre-snap variety on the offense. It's driving the coaches nuts, and they're still trying to diagnose the exact reason for them.
"Things that dont make sense," Loeffler said. "We were 35 million times more complicated cadence-wise [last year], because we were in the huddle, had multiple [cadences]. We dont have multiple cadences right now. Its as simple as Ive ever had it. Its weird. We cant figure it out. Its just odd."
In some respects, this has been way more frustrating than the turnovers.
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Seriously, coach, for people who don't have a hearing loss, it's hard to understand, but I might consider giving my players hearing tests. They might hear just fine when there is no background noise, but in a noisy stadium there might be added problems discriminating sounds. Just a thought considering the widespread and heavy use of earphone devices which can lead to early loss.
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Then the penalties at Pitt really make no sense. That place was a ghost town. Barely heard the crowd at all on TV.
I really doubt it's anything to do with hearing loss. Every team is loaded with players who always have headphones on constantly. We seem to be the ones with problems.
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It certainly wasn't due to anything the crowd at Pitt did. I was there, and they could have closed the upper deck and still fit everyone in. Their students were a bit loud on a few 3rd downs, but we were never playing with our backs against the wall on that end nor much in the redzone down there either. Hard to rationalize no matter the circumstances.
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Sometimes it seems that our OL are so worried about making the block that they get jumpy. They see a blitz coming or they see a DE start to move and then they move, drawing the false start. Illegal formation, illegal motion with 2 men moving and the like, that's a mental mistake that needs to be corrected. Either Brewer needs to wait for the guys to get set (meaning don't wait until 1 second on the play clock to call for the snap) or the players need to make sure they know what they are doing when they line up on the field. For every illegal substitution penalty we've reduced, we've picked up another false start.
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I think this is basically what David Wang was getting at. He called it a lack of focus, but it's probably what you're saying, or perhaps as Bud might put it, "letting their heads tie up their feet." Over-thinking or over-anticipating to the point of making a small (or big) mistake.
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Oh absolutely is it a case of letting their heads tie up their feet. I realize many people think that some of this is due to offensive complexity, but many of the penalties can be broken down to just a complete mental error. For instance, on the illegal motion with 2 men in motion and the player not being set last game, that shouldn't have happened. The reason it did was because Rogers was not in the correct position at the right time and moved to it as Newsome began motioning across. That's just a mental error and not something that is due to our offense being too complicated. Mental errors are KILLING us.
Now I'm going to find somewhere to hide for mentioning that Sam Rogers made a mistake before he finds me. He's right behind me isn't he?
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Yea my GF was confused as to why I was so mad at the OL that game. I had to explain to her by turning up the TV and telling my 5 year old in the other room to get up and run whenever she heard me utter the number 3. Needless to say there was no "penalty". I understand that's a generalization of a more complicated situation but yeah, No excuse even at the high school ,much less, collegiate level.
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I'm starting to think that Searles having Gibson and McGlock swap sides is having unintended consequences. Neither looks as good as they did last season.
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It has to be mental. In high school we were taught to watch the ball if we had questions on the snap count or if noise was an issue. The wideouts and TE's appear to not have an issue with it. The fact that Lefty said it was more complicated in the huddle (when the cadence was given to everyone) last year, the fact the line can't go on the snap of the ball is a serious issue.
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I've never played organized football at any level, so this could be way wrong. But while that might work in a pinch at the High School level, it sounds like a great way to get blown off the line in D-1 college ball. Isn't one of the advantages of being on offense that split second of movement before the defense reacts to the ball being snapped? Especially if the reports are true about the defense picking up on the snap count: if the o-line is reduced to watching the ball, I just can't see that working well.
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That's true about playing against playing against higher level players and being at a disadvantage. But if (and i'm just going off Lefty's quote) they seem to not be going off a given cadence. So it must be the movement of the ball, at least it seems. Once again as a disclaimer I only have JV and Varsity experience, college level could be completely different.
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We dont have multiple cadences right now. Its as simple as Ive ever had it.
Maybe I'm misunderstanding your point, but the way I read that is they only have one cadence (with some variation, I hope), not that they don't have a cadence at all
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someone on another thread had mentioned that the Pitt D had figured the cadence out or was just yelling it out which caused some of the confusion. Wether that's true or not I have no idea.
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With all the injuries, this year is quickly turning into a dumpster fire. Our injury-inhibited talent and depth level right now on this team is just not good. The way things are playing out, just getting to a bowl might be an accomplishment this year.
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Calm yourself. You made your comment about this year being a dumpster fire to which mine was to say you're overreacting. If that's belittling to you, I apologize, but the world is not ending. After week 7 in 2012 (with a less talented team), we were 4-3 and still made a bowl game. Everything isn't doom and gloom right now.
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I'd like to also take this moment to remind you that not only do we have a winning record at 4-3, we are also 2-1 in our last three games. I guess with the bye everyone forget we were on a winning streak going into Pitt?
I get you're worried about the team's lack of depth, we all are. But to call this a dumpster fire of a season when we still have a winning record is a bit of a knee-jerk reaction to one really lousy game, if you ask me.
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4-3 sounds like a dumpster fire to me. We're not 4-3 in the Big 12, SEC, or Pac 12. We're 4-3 in the garbage coastal. Coastal might be the worst division in power 5 football.
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But we aren't getting blown out in those games. Of our 3 losses, 2 were lost within the last 16 seconds of the game. The 3rd one we tried to comeback and failed, but still lost by less than 1 TD. This team could be 6-1 right now, possibly 7-0, if they played consistently. Inconsistency and mental mistakes are why we are 4-3, not because we are a bad team.
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I know I'm replying to my own comment, but Bruce Feldman just posted this and I think it speaks to why we are where we are.
Among the nation's Top10 CFB teams 8 have at least 16 of 22 starters who are JRs or SRs except #UGA (14) & #NotreDame (13).— Bruce Feldman (@BruceFeldmanCFB) October 22, 2014
Including the "OR" players on our depth chart, we have 11 of 24 that are Juniors or Seniors.
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Motu's going to have a tough task ahead of him. As we've learned from the film reviews, Bud Foster's defense requires everyone to play their assignments and trust their team mates to do the same. A week of starting practice will put him in a better spot than he was coming off the bench vs. Pitt. I think we're all excited about the kid's future here, but right now it's hard to see the loss of Williams as anything other than a heavy blow.
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The good thing is he seems to have made a couple good stops when reading the gaps directly ahead of him. He seemed to have struggle with Pitt stunting off tackle a bit. when he was forced laterally they capitalized off of a few gap responsibility errors he made. You are right though, you can see his athleticism and he has a bright future. A week preparing as "THE GUY" make me think he'll be fine. Reps mean alot when the speed of game is experienced (and not just special teams, but his home position). I think he'll benefit from the Pitt reps and film will allow him to see what he made mental errors on. I recall Bud really being impressed last spring saying he was playing with hair on fire. Bud also said he can be inconsistent at times and kind of regressed in fall camp too, so we'll see.
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I must be in the wrong place, but I thought Bitter's title meant we could discuss Motu (our of flyin Hawaiian; from VA Beach, no less) some. I was largely impressed with his play when he first entered the game. He was playing deeper than necessary and the QB was able to gain 5-10 yards on each rush, but he made three straight tackles in three plays so I applaud his showing. I am excited to see how well he can fill in for Chase.
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I predicted Motuapuaka would be the starter at some point this season, but Williams play has far exceeded my expectations. AM played very well and will be a star here if he stays healthy, but you hope that Williams can come back and finish his senior season as a starter.
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My ears bled everytime that guy tried to pronounce his name last Thursday. Maybe now that he's starting they can practice it a couple times. It's not that hard after you think about it for a minute: "Mo-too-uh-poo-ah-ka".
Thanks for that absurdly quick special teams TD, Beamer Ball!
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Comments
In some respects, this has been way more frustrating than the turnovers.
Seriously, coach, for people who don't have a hearing loss, it's hard to understand, but I might consider giving my players hearing tests. They might hear just fine when there is no background noise, but in a noisy stadium there might be added problems discriminating sounds. Just a thought considering the widespread and heavy use of earphone devices which can lead to early loss.
Then the penalties at Pitt really make no sense. That place was a ghost town. Barely heard the crowd at all on TV.
I really doubt it's anything to do with hearing loss. Every team is loaded with players who always have headphones on constantly. We seem to be the ones with problems.
It certainly wasn't due to anything the crowd at Pitt did. I was there, and they could have closed the upper deck and still fit everyone in. Their students were a bit loud on a few 3rd downs, but we were never playing with our backs against the wall on that end nor much in the redzone down there either. Hard to rationalize no matter the circumstances.
Sometimes it seems that our OL are so worried about making the block that they get jumpy. They see a blitz coming or they see a DE start to move and then they move, drawing the false start. Illegal formation, illegal motion with 2 men moving and the like, that's a mental mistake that needs to be corrected. Either Brewer needs to wait for the guys to get set (meaning don't wait until 1 second on the play clock to call for the snap) or the players need to make sure they know what they are doing when they line up on the field. For every illegal substitution penalty we've reduced, we've picked up another false start.
I think this is basically what David Wang was getting at. He called it a lack of focus, but it's probably what you're saying, or perhaps as Bud might put it, "letting their heads tie up their feet." Over-thinking or over-anticipating to the point of making a small (or big) mistake.
Oh absolutely is it a case of letting their heads tie up their feet. I realize many people think that some of this is due to offensive complexity, but many of the penalties can be broken down to just a complete mental error. For instance, on the illegal motion with 2 men in motion and the player not being set last game, that shouldn't have happened. The reason it did was because Rogers was not in the correct position at the right time and moved to it as Newsome began motioning across. That's just a mental error and not something that is due to our offense being too complicated. Mental errors are KILLING us.
Now I'm going to find somewhere to hide for mentioning that Sam Rogers made a mistake before he finds me. He's right behind me isn't he?
Sam is not amused.
Yea my GF was confused as to why I was so mad at the OL that game. I had to explain to her by turning up the TV and telling my 5 year old in the other room to get up and run whenever she heard me utter the number 3. Needless to say there was no "penalty". I understand that's a generalization of a more complicated situation but yeah, No excuse even at the high school ,much less, collegiate level.
McLaughlin had a good 2 or 3 more too that weren't called. Not sure what his deal was.
I'm starting to think that Searles having Gibson and McGlock swap sides is having unintended consequences. Neither looks as good as they did last season.
I've been wondering about this myself.
All I took from this is Loeffler saying that they were 35 million times more complicated on cadence last year.
Can cadence complication even be measured? And 35 million times? That sounds really complicated.
Unless he's just trying to obfuscate. If the complication level this year is 0, 37 million times 0 is still zero. I'm on to you, Loeffler...
The blinders are now off... Thanks Trumpet.
It has to be mental. In high school we were taught to watch the ball if we had questions on the snap count or if noise was an issue. The wideouts and TE's appear to not have an issue with it. The fact that Lefty said it was more complicated in the huddle (when the cadence was given to everyone) last year, the fact the line can't go on the snap of the ball is a serious issue.
I've never played organized football at any level, so this could be way wrong. But while that might work in a pinch at the High School level, it sounds like a great way to get blown off the line in D-1 college ball. Isn't one of the advantages of being on offense that split second of movement before the defense reacts to the ball being snapped? Especially if the reports are true about the defense picking up on the snap count: if the o-line is reduced to watching the ball, I just can't see that working well.
That's true about playing against playing against higher level players and being at a disadvantage. But if (and i'm just going off Lefty's quote) they seem to not be going off a given cadence. So it must be the movement of the ball, at least it seems. Once again as a disclaimer I only have JV and Varsity experience, college level could be completely different.
Maybe I'm misunderstanding your point, but the way I read that is they only have one cadence (with some variation, I hope), not that they don't have a cadence at all
someone on another thread had mentioned that the Pitt D had figured the cadence out or was just yelling it out which caused some of the confusion. Wether that's true or not I have no idea.
With all the injuries, this year is quickly turning into a dumpster fire. Our injury-inhibited talent and depth level right now on this team is just not good. The way things are playing out, just getting to a bowl might be an accomplishment this year.
If 4-3 is a dumpster fire with all 3 losses being by 1 possession, I worry for you when our bowl streak ends and we have a losing season.
Oh joy, the TechSideline attitude of belittling others for sharing a viewpoint you find to be beneath yourself has made its way to TKP.
Calm yourself. You made your comment about this year being a dumpster fire to which mine was to say you're overreacting. If that's belittling to you, I apologize, but the world is not ending. After week 7 in 2012 (with a less talented team), we were 4-3 and still made a bowl game. Everything isn't doom and gloom right now.
I'd like to also take this moment to remind you that not only do we have a winning record at 4-3, we are also 2-1 in our last three games. I guess with the bye everyone forget we were on a winning streak going into Pitt?
I get you're worried about the team's lack of depth, we all are. But to call this a dumpster fire of a season when we still have a winning record is a bit of a knee-jerk reaction to one really lousy game, if you ask me.
4-3 sounds like a dumpster fire to me. We're not 4-3 in the Big 12, SEC, or Pac 12. We're 4-3 in the garbage coastal. Coastal might be the worst division in power 5 football.
Except the Coastal always beats up on itself, keeping everyone in the middle of the road. So we're exactly where we should be.
But we aren't getting blown out in those games. Of our 3 losses, 2 were lost within the last 16 seconds of the game. The 3rd one we tried to comeback and failed, but still lost by less than 1 TD. This team could be 6-1 right now, possibly 7-0, if they played consistently. Inconsistency and mental mistakes are why we are 4-3, not because we are a bad team.
I know I'm replying to my own comment, but Bruce Feldman just posted this and I think it speaks to why we are where we are.
Including the "OR" players on our depth chart, we have 11 of 24 that are Juniors or Seniors.
If this year is a dumpster fire, what was 2012?
Nuclear winter
Landfill Inferno
As long as we avoid the dreaded goat rodeo, I think we'll be okay
Al Groh
Motu's going to have a tough task ahead of him. As we've learned from the film reviews, Bud Foster's defense requires everyone to play their assignments and trust their team mates to do the same. A week of starting practice will put him in a better spot than he was coming off the bench vs. Pitt. I think we're all excited about the kid's future here, but right now it's hard to see the loss of Williams as anything other than a heavy blow.
The good thing is he seems to have made a couple good stops when reading the gaps directly ahead of him. He seemed to have struggle with Pitt stunting off tackle a bit. when he was forced laterally they capitalized off of a few gap responsibility errors he made. You are right though, you can see his athleticism and he has a bright future. A week preparing as "THE GUY" make me think he'll be fine. Reps mean alot when the speed of game is experienced (and not just special teams, but his home position). I think he'll benefit from the Pitt reps and film will allow him to see what he made mental errors on. I recall Bud really being impressed last spring saying he was playing with hair on fire. Bud also said he can be inconsistent at times and kind of regressed in fall camp too, so we'll see.
I must be in the wrong place, but I thought Bitter's title meant we could discuss Motu (our of flyin Hawaiian; from VA Beach, no less) some. I was largely impressed with his play when he first entered the game. He was playing deeper than necessary and the QB was able to gain 5-10 yards on each rush, but he made three straight tackles in three plays so I applaud his showing. I am excited to see how well he can fill in for Chase.
Everyone's too worried about Loeffler and the RBs lol
Its going to be fun to listen to the different announcers try to pronounce his name over the next 3 years....
As long as they dont call him Anthony Exhume, we are ok....
I predicted Motuapuaka would be the starter at some point this season, but Williams play has far exceeded my expectations. AM played very well and will be a star here if he stays healthy, but you hope that Williams can come back and finish his senior season as a starter.
My ears bled everytime that guy tried to pronounce his name last Thursday. Maybe now that he's starting they can practice it a couple times. It's not that hard after you think about it for a minute: "Mo-too-uh-poo-ah-ka".
Thanks for that absurdly quick special teams TD, Beamer Ball!
Think "Hakuna Matata" and you'll have no worries.
This is why you are the King. No Lion.