Mr. Whit Babcock and Staff:
It happened in the first quarter on Saturday. The very quiet and polite mother sitting with her two young daughters in the row in front of me in Section 3 had a paper airplane land in her lap. As it was at the time, Section 1 and the plethora of students inventing the future of paper airplane engineering already required an air traffic controller.
I leaned over to my dad and said, "Well, I've had it. I'm writing another open letter."
The mother turned around and asked, "About the airplanes?"
"Yes, ma'am."
"Good. This is maddening."
So, here we are. Again. Since last year's letter doesn't seem to have done much to influence your thinking, I don't expect this one to, either, but I do want it to land on your desk (pun, perhaps, intended) as food for thought. The multitude of people who had paper airplanes dive-bombing into the backs of their heads on Saturday afternoon likely agrees with what I'll write here.
As far as the students go, I have no idea why this is a thing. Is it sheer boredom? Is there a rogue aerospace engineering or aerodynamics professor giving out extra credit for these attempts? The cheer when one of the airplanes landed on the field of play in the second quarter of the Furman game was the loudest Section 1 and the North End Zone had been since "Enter Sandman" ended. (I found the flying of paper airplanes at the start of the second quarter when we were down 14 to Ohio State and on the cusp of mounting an incredible comeback to grab the lead heading into halftime to be deliciously ironic – as we are both former Ohioans, you know as well as I that the Wright brothers were born there.)
The two Montgomery County deputy sheriffs stationed at the Section 3 ramp were twice engaged and uninterested in pursuing offenders. Sometime before the end of the first quarter, one of the deputies started up the steps to patrol the student section. I genially encouraged him to deputize me if he needed any help arresting the airplane-throwing offenders. He smiled and was back at his post within three minutes.
The next encounter came after an airplane landed at the second deputy's feet as two more flew overhead. I hollered down to him that, at any time, he could feel free start rounding up those law-breakers. Unexpectedly, he was at my seat a second later asking if something was wrong.
"Yessir. These paper airplanes. You know it's a violation and you have the power to stop it."
"Sir, there are far too many of them and far too few of us to do anything about it. Try to enjoy the game."
So, Whit, there you have it. Every single ticket is printed with a warning about ejecting persons "whose conduct is unsuitable (e.g., throwing objects, abusive acts or vulgar language)," but, according to the very people charged with enforcing these rules, the practicality is apparently impossible.
The problem with the deputy's suggestion is that my enjoyment of the game, like that of many others, was already negatively affected by the paper projectiles soaring towards the field. In addition to disrupting my view and distracting from the game, it reflects negatively on both the university and its fans. When the opposing team's fans see paper airplanes flying around Lane Stadium and hear cheering in reaction, it sends the message that Virginia Tech fans don't care to give their time or attention to the competition on the field.
For a university that President Sands constantly talks and tweets about being on the forefront of technology and innovation, why do we even have tickets that are still being printed on paper? I understand the money and resources conserved in having students print their own tickets, but issuing traditional tickets would prevent this. Further, why isn't every ticket in an electronic form? This is an even more economical and ecofriendly approach. Student tickets could easily be loaded onto and scanned from their Hokie Passport or sent to their smartphone for scanning. I'm sure a similar electronic system could be enacted for Hokie Club season ticket holders.
Mr. Babcock, you have a little under three weeks until the next home game. I hope you take this matter seriously enough to do something about it. If not, I understand. And, if not, you should know that I intend to not pursue this matter any further. Instead, I will join the students and bring reams of paper to Section 1 for their use. I'll be sure to drop a few cases – Georgia-Pacific only, as a nod to my degree from the Pamplin College of Business – in the North End Zone, too. Maybe we can get the Friday night N.C. State game on ESPN looking like a Red Bull Flugtag and have Worsham Field absolutely covered in paper airplanes. I would love to hear the booth team try to explain on national television why there's been a stoppage in play to clean up the field.
#ThisIsHome may be the new refrain of Virginia Tech football, but there are more than a few who sure aren't treating Lane Stadium like it.
Respectfully submitted,
Jeffrey T. Ferguson
Class of 2007
P.S.: This was not a solo effort. The inimitable @HokiESQ helped draft this tome and decided to turn to Twitter as a sort of a vox populi, vox Dei experiment. A collection of responses to her initial tweet appear below.
[View the story "Hokies Twitter on Paper Airplanes" on Storify]
Comments
So playing into this why doesn't VT have more technology at Lane? Wi-if, cell service, electronic ticket scanners?
I can tell you that the WiFi and cell issue is one that many stadiums are looking at, but he cost can be astronomical. The number of access points that would be needed for both to make it anywhere near a workable experience for fans makes it incredibly expensive. I've seen some numbers for a couple of SEC schools that were looking into it and it's a BIG number. I have some experience with both technologies and I believe the numbers. Probably won't happen for a long time unless the cell carriers pitch in to offset some of the installation costs. But they're doing less and less of that these days.
They've been getting a couple of carriers to put up temporary towers outside of Lane for a few years. There's also new equipment on the flag poles. The stuff is expensive. CNS was trying to get the carriers to pay for cell tower upgrades in the area but it's not worth it to them when it works for 99.9% of the time.
Oh, for the sake of all that is Holy and right, turn off your stupid phones, stop making paper airplanes, and quit acting like spoiled, bored juveniles and watch the fuckin' game, you twits! And you don't need wifi or cell towers to watch a football game when YOU'RE AT THE GAME!!! Narcissistic, poorly raised children, in my opinion. If that's your mind set, stay in your dorm room and twerp twitter tweep to your shallow heart's content. No one will miss you. Rant over, no sarcastica, just the simmering disgust of an old fart who obviously just doesn't get it.
Edit: spelling
How dare someone enjoy an experience differently from how I enjoy that experience!!11!!
Yeah, that's the problem with rants. They always get trumped by open minded sorts who aren't pissed off like you are when you rant. You nailed the obvious weakness in my post and I will give you a leg for it. Do I still feel the way I did when I posted? Yep, I do. When your enjoyment begins to negatively impact that of those around you, are you still A-ok? It seems that the airplane thing does just that. And truly, I DON'T understand why selfies and the ubiquitous craned neck pedestrian obliviously working that phone and people driving poorly so as to have conversations that are so important they just couldn't wait a few minutes to have and all the rest of those types of things bug me. But, truth is, they do. Sometimes, just because you want to do it the way you want to do it whenever and wherever you want to do it isn't a good enough reason to do it. Again, though, just my opinion.
I agree on the negative impact on others. However, I do think that the paper airplane thing, while mildly annoying, is a bit overblown. But that's just, like, my opinion, man.
Also, I believe you mentioned texting (or other phone activities) and driving. I put that in a completely different bucket than Instagram'ing food and taking selfies, etc. It's infuriating to see and It should have penalties similar to DUI. (there's my mini-rant)
I do understand that paper airplanes seem like a minor annoyance, though when there are thousands of them flying it might be like being nibbled to death by ducks if you're in the "flyway", so to speak. As for texting while driving, I include most spoken conversations in that same category. Yes, some folks seem to be able to talk on the phone while driving and drive well enough, but many folks cannot have a phone conversation while driving without speeding up or, more likely, slowing down and losing attention to driving that is kinda important to those of us who must drive around them. I do agree, different bucket than the fixation on phones in general, and I agree with your suggestion about penalties for those causing mayhem while playing with their phones.
I like your comic. Nicely done.
Someone should point out, however, that throwing paper airplanes isn't simply enjoying an experience differently.
Throwing paper airplanes is an attempt to get someone else's attention, either by hitting them or getting someone else to appreciate how clever the thrower is (or both). It's not so much enjoying the experience as interfering with someone else's experience. Some people may actually want to watch the game, and paid their hard-earned dollars to have that experience.
But that's just an opinion, man.
Read this too quickly and thought you were mad you were simmering in an old fart. Also, have a leg, annoying how many phones are out during the game.
Ha Fud! I needed a laugh. Last time I simmered in an old fart was during duck season when my neoprene waders were so tight that I, well, I uh,......nevermind.
I'm guessing it ended up something like this...
Are you playing all week? I'm enjoying the comedy and am not kidding when I say I really needed a laugh today. I just laughed so loud my dogs jumped up and rushed the front door barking like the UPS man was here.
Glad to help Fish. I am bored and it's only Tuesday. BTW...I think I've seen a video of one of your dogs.
Ahhh, old Susie performing my famous patented "Bend, and Snap" maneuver. All my dogs must pass this test before getting fed/vetted/etc. for life. If I can ever get one I can train to dive for flounder, I'll be a happy camper.
Bravo, Mr. Boster, standing O at the Fish Shack. And in celebration of my 65th, drinks are on the house.
Happiest of Birthdays to you, and I'll slug a couple down to celebrate at BJ's Brewhouse.
Cheers!
To continue on this bitch rant of a post. Do you realize how many tendons and ligaments hold the largemouth bass' head on the body? Somewhere arounf 17! All are injured when the head is bent over the gunnel like this. A manly dog would be lippin' walleye, northerns and musky!
Really cool gif!
Ease up on the poor dog, she's just a pup. We'll graduate to flatheads and muskies as she matures. And as for the poor bass, well, I was a-fishin' with my Uncle Fud, and in true redneck fashion, he keeps everything he catches anyway, so no real whoop if the bass's mouthparts were damaged. Walleyes, now, I net them. No way I'm gonna take a chance the dog might not get it over the gunnel 'cause I'm just redneck enough to eat most every legal walleye we catch!
I enjoy checking other scores during breaks and communicating with my father who doesn't usually make it to the games about the game. We call and text during games that we are watching at home too so why make it any different because I am there? Does that make me narcissistic and poorly raised?
Agreed. What I'd like even more is the ability to watch the play live, then go to my smartphone so I could choose which replay I wanted to see out of all the available angles. Those replays would have to be queued up pretty quick, though.
We'd need more bandwidth.
Naw, probably not. As I said above, that's the problem with rants. They throw a blanket over an irritation and end up covering way more than they should. Yes, I do think it's kind of weird to be constantly in communication, regardless of the situation, at home or away, excepting maybe catastrophe, etc., but I also made it clear that I am not in tune with the "modern" thing with phones. I do remember the days when we would watch the scoreboard for other scores, not having the instant answer at our fingertips, so I get the convenience of that for you. So please, take my rant with the grain of salt it deserves, and if it isn't you, well then, I wasn't talking about you.
Edit: Deleted - should have never been posted. Apologies.
Hey man, chill a bit.
I can't speak for the man, but I seriously doubt there was any intention to keep people from having contact with their loved ones in emergencies.
I more think it was a 'can't people just watch the game' thing.
It sounds like it hit a nerve, which I'm guessing comes from the stress of having a daughter with type 1 DM. I hope that she's getting good care, on a pump, continuous monitor, etc. If she gets a monitor, you can even trend it from afar via a phone app.
Type 2's ironically have more genetic predisposition than type 1's, but both are affected and effected by environmental factors.
Either way, I know its been difficult raising your girl with the stress of diabetes, but diabetics now have better meds, tools, technology than ever before.
Anyway, just trying to keep the peace, but I seriously doubt anyone would argue your need to stay in contact.
Go Hokies.
Yep, I'm well aware of all the excellent new tools out there for diabetics, and my daughter is actually managing her diabetes very well thanks to her and my wife being extremely diligent with her care. Her endocrinologist actually calls her one of her prize patients. Still doesn't mean she has lows and highs that have to be addressed, but they're not that often. And yes, she has a CGM that will communicate with an app and allows remote monitoring. And we're looking at a pump for her that will communicate with the CGM as well. But you know what many of those apps require? A working internet connection...
At any rate, no worries, I've since gotten over his rant and appreciate your comments. And sorry for boring folks with talking about my daughters condition. Not your problem I know.
Go Hokies!
Good morning Xhurler19. First of all, Shoog had it right. I wasn't directing my rant at you at all, but as he said, just to maybe too broadly vent about the phone thing in general. Sorry it pissed you off, rants will do that, both intentionally and unintentionally, and I absolutely understand medical emergencies and the need for some folks to stay more in touch than others. Having known my share of diabetics, and folks waiting important news, etc., I get that and it is not at all what I am irritated by. However, since it is a new day and life is way to short to be mad two days in a row, please accept my apologies for pushing the button that hit your raw nerve. Please accept, also, my best wishes for your daughter. I'm actually surprised at how few blasts I got for that rant, but the day is young still, I'll check back later and take the heat as it comes.
No worries, and I'm probably equally as wrong for taking such offense. Yes, it hit a nerve, and yes, your rant was over generalized. That's why I generally try to avoid making rants on public forums, but I've been guilty of the same myself unfortunately. Anyway, thanks for the apology (accepted), and please accept mine as well for the return rant/lecture. I'm sure we both are too old to have to be lectured by anyone but our wives. And even then I don't usually take those well...
Also, thank you for the best wishes for my daughter. I truly appreciate it. And I promise not to discuss that on this forum again. Definitely not the place for it.
Go Hokies!
legs to both of you. This is what sets TKP apart from the rest of the interwebz. I love TKP
A big AMEN from my little corner of the congregation.
More annoying: the paper airplanes, or the 'O' during the National Anthem?
Yea what the hell was that?
Unless I'm way off-base, I'm pretty sure it's a Baltimore thing that Orioles (O's) fans yell during the national anthem there.
May have started in Baltimore, but I've seen it done at every level of just about every sport. People did it in Lane at every game I attended.
At least we're not yelling sexual innuendo cleverly disguised as cheering for our team in the red zone!
You forgot the sexually suggestive pelvic thrust.
Yeah, I hate it when mothers with two kids get hit in the back of the head with those!
Can't tell if serious or joking. Laughing uncontrollably nonetheless.
If there's any question with one of my posts, it's generally safe to bet on joking. :)
Bitch rant....OH comeon man!
I think thats what it is. It has no place at VT and Im sure the idiots yelling it have no idea why they are yelling it.
A lot of it comes from certain sections of the MVs (or at least it used to). Tones and/or VTubas and/or the saxes. This is what happens when you put Orioles fans in leadership positions over people who think stupid things are funny.
Never came from the MVs from years 2008-2012, I promise. At least not enough for me to be able to say some section was doing it.
2011 and 2012 seasons, it definitely came from there. MV friends openly admitted doing it, and inciting others to do it. But as far as I know, it was mostly confined to those sections that most enjoy harmless jackassery. Every band has their problem children. Ours were pretty much always my section, the trumpets.
And from those that were in charge, they can tell you that they were the minority. And I can speak for some of the sections that you mentioned specifically.
As I said, it was more like some individuals in the MVs were being obnoxious. The Tones and Tubas stood right behind me and I don't recall ever hearing it from any amount of people that I would call a group. On the other hand, I did learn to not notice what was happening in the Tuba section by rule.
From stories I've heard about those guys, that's probably the safest bet.
Its been going on a lot longer than that
you're correct. the Maryland student contingent do it at every playing of the national anthem. i heard it for four years on campus and before i became a Nats fan, heard it at Camden Yard when i could score free tix
I'm from MD, and I grew up doing this. In fact, the first time I realized this wasn't a thing, I was 16, at a family's graduation or something (I don't remember exactly) and I yelled 'OOOOO!!!!' during the national anthem, and no one else did. I was so confused and embarrassed.
A disrespectful habit traced to Baltimore Orioles fans. They make the same exclamation during the Anthem.
Equal. I have zero respect for anyone who messes with the national anthem and I'm constantly ashamed that it's a thing at VT sporting events. Apparently it's from Baltimore, but it needs to stay there and then go away. Have some damn pride in your country.
Same goes for Capitals fans yelling "Red" or Barves fans yelling "Brave(s)". Stop.
Good thing about having Freedom in this country is that you can choose to sing it anyway you like. It's not NOT having any pride in your country or respect - in fact, you're using your constitutional right to do so.
No one is arguing you don't have the freedom to disrespect the National Anthem.
I'm arguing what OP and you constitute as disrespect isn't at all. It's just both your narrow minded views of it which make you believe it.
Your syntax has the smooth flow of driveway gravel in a washing machine. Enjoy looking a fool and be well.
lol uh.....ok....
It may not be intended as disrespect, but it definitely shows a lack of respect and irreverence towards the national anthem. Besides being simply annoying.
I'd have to disagree, but we can leave it at just that.
Having read your comments above, it was self-evident you'd disagree with at least part of that. But I'm not sure how you can justify the "O" yell (or any other yell for that matter) as being irreverent. It's obnoxiously yelling out one syllable to call attention to your sports allegiance during a song meant to signify one big thing that draws us all together. It's tacky. It's cheap. It's the very definition of irreverent.
....like I said, we can just agree to disagree.
I'd much rather have an actual dialogue. I've stated my opinions and spelled out my reasoning. Maybe I'm wrong. But you have yet to justify your position, so how will we know? You stated above that the first amendment gives the right to free speech. Well, the reason behind that is for the free exchange of competing ideas which work for the betterment of both parties. You're not holding up your end of that.
I could, but I really don't care to change your opinion on the matter. Nor would I really. The best thing that could come out of this exchange is mildly passive aggressive insults for 20 more replies. The worst is a ban from TKP, which I don't want to risk.
In any case, "holding my end up of that" just to spell it out for you isn't my highest priority in life at the moment. I'm just going to continue to either sing or not sing, sit or stand, for the national anthem, and there's nothing you can do about it.
So you're conceding that you have no counterargument other than "passive aggressive insults," possibly up to the point where you'd get banhammered. That's telling. As is the fact that you claim not to have the time to hold a reasonable discussion, yet you continue to post comments that add little to nothing to the conversation. Disappointing really, because thoughtful discussion is one of the highlights of this site.
Whatever floats your boat man. Be at peace!
Yeah, and you have a fine Navy day.
Mom? Dad? Do you think this discourse belongs in a thread of it's own, being that the title is regarding "Paper Airplanes" and not "Plus Liberal Interpretations of the National Anthem"? Just sayin...
Eh, flamed out anyway, but there are mentions of various annoying behaviors throughout the thread. This one just went longer.
Actually, this entire article / post probably should be deleted haha. Getting to be too much a UWS type of post.
What happened to AXD1985, Champion of the First Amendment? You can't have it both ways, arguing for freedom of speech as a reason to allow the O shenanigans, and then argue for the deletion of an article you don't like.
Side note: what's the UWS acronym? Google turned up nothing and I'm curious.
Boy you just can't let it go can you? lol.
You left a pretty wide opening, and my point is valid. If you're going to state an opinion, you probably ought to stick with it and be prepared to defend it.
You claim you want a reasonable discussion with this dude, but all I see is you trying to bate him into an argument that he clearly states he wants no part in. Sooo yeah.... Just let him be, man.
Well, I'm sorry you see things that way. He stated an opinion, I stated a differing opinion, he kept trying to get the last word in without actually offering anything to the dialogue, so it's hard to believe he wanted no part in the discussion, or that your version of who baited who is correct. He just didn't want to have his opinion challenged, though he had no issue challenging that of others. Then he got hypocritical, so yeah, I called him on it, because it undermined his entire argument.
I think your giving HT a bit too little credit and too much Grief. He was pretty tame all throughout, had a position, stuck to it, and nobody laid out any thought out counter points besides, "Yea well thats just like your opinion Man" level stuff.
Whatever else he may be (acerbic, blunt) he is still a Hokie and an Ensign in the Navy, if there is anything he should be ok with discussing pointedly and faithfully, the proper level of decorum and dignity while the National Anthem plays is one of them.
Bitch Rant 3: Really no one has ID'ed their posts as OT! Dismiss them all!
And we have the freedom to tell you to be respectful.
Alright guys let's take it easy. Remember, the enemy is out there, not in here.
Being from Baltimore, I do, and will continue to say "Oh" at sporting events. If you knew me, you would respect me for the person I am, and not for what I say for a half of a second during the national anthem. For the record, I have a lot of damn pride in my country.
Heck, I'm not even a Baltimore fan at all and I agree with this statement. You can't judge patriotism or anything based on a single minuscule action.
My stance on the matter hasn't changed. It accomplishes nothing but sending the message that your sports team is more important than the national anthem or the US.
No worries for me man. I can respect your view even if we disagree.
Not trying to change your stance, to each their own. A Baltimore fan might look at it as a group of people sharing a common interest and showing some O's pride while standing and singing proudly for the USA. I didn't know you had to choose one or the other. At the end of the day, it's just a game... I think we all know that our National Anthem and country are more important than any sports team.
People in Baltimore are probably also especially proud of the National Anthem since, after all, it was written after an attack on Baltimore.
Exactly... no disrespect intended.
Edit: can't spell
I think it's fine in Baltimore, and fun in Camden Yards.
I don't quite understand why non-Orioles fans would do it anywhere else, though.
I am only speaking for myself here, as an O's fan, but I think of it as kind of a roll call for away games. How many Baltimore folks are around. My favorite was before the Bama game in 2009, there was a great "O!" at the Braves game on Friday night because so many Tech/Marylands were there. Same with away stadiums when the Ravens are playing. I am always listening to the TV for the "O" to see what the support looks like for any given game. For me, it's like listening for a "Let's go Hokies" or "ACC" chant at an away game.
Oh, I get why Orioles fans do it. I just don't know why other people do it.
I learned the last 4 years in the student section that probably 90% of the students yell it. I look around and about half of those people are Nationals fans. I even asked a couple of my friends why they yelled it if they weren't O's fans and they responded "Cause it's funny." I can't understand at all how that is remotely funny. I understand it if you're an Orioles fan, but, "being funny?" That confuses me.
It's just a song. Blind nationalism is silly.
Not to mention dangerous. For reference, see World War I and II.
My nationalism is only color blind. I don't see anything but red, white, and blue.
well that narrows it down
yeah he must be french...who knew?
Geez...
OT: 13 it is just a thing. They stand and salute the flag and show support of their team at the same time.
Messes with the national anthem? You take a song of pride in your country, and then you emphasize a word to show pride in your team (of which many teams are symbols of people's home).
We're a country that prides ourselves on being a melting pot, with different cultures, traditions and own ways of doing things. And just like we watch singer after singer put their personal touch on the tune of the national anthem (with no one picketing), I don't really see anything OFFENSIVE about people putting their personal touch on it as well. Embrace it!
'Merica
Except for Nickleback, I will picket against Nickleback. And maybe Bieber. We should close the border from Canada.
Can we keep Elisha Cuthbert? And Eugene Levy?
OT: NO! I fish up there!
During the ohio state game, i'm guessing it was an "o-h-i-o" thing because it was louder than the standard orioles "o"
That's a thing? Wow, glad I didn't hear it. Least we can do is give our country two minutes of not cheering for our schools.
I do this. It's from being an Orioles fan as a kid. I always yell "RED" which stems from my loves of the Caps.
I haven't been to Lane since 2009 so I can't comment on the paper airplanes (other than saying it's super shitty and should definitely stop).
But I did just buy tickets to the Purdue game on Saturday, and when I was checking out, they gave me 4 options: 1.) print a PDF, 2.) save a PDF to my phone to be scanned on game day, 3.) save it as a file for Apple Passbook to be scanned on game day, and 4.) Will call.
These are all wonderful options, and if another school is doing it, I don't see why we can't.
Student tickets do not have these options, and I have no idea why that's the case.
Maybe the scanner can't read them?
I bought tickets for the Furman game and I had the option to save a QR code to my phone and just present that at the gate. I can't imagine why they wouldn't make this available for every single ticket, but especially student tickets.
Through the school? Or ticket website? If through ticket website I would not trust it to work.
Sitting?!? QUIET?!?!
"...with her two young daughters." Believe you me, I was plenty loud for all three of them.
Probably during one of the many ESPN3 timeouts.
Please, Whit... I don't care if you hire Lane Kiffin as our next baseball coach, just stop the freakin' paper airplanes.
Just don't hire him as the football coach...
#NoLaneInLaneEver
My personal fave reaction: HHHHHHHHHNNNNNNNNNNNNGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHH
Paper airplanes, the "O", the wave, there are probably a few other things that are equally as annoying that need to be eradicated.
I had some douche canoe behind me at the OSU game ask why no one had started the wave yet. This was pre Brewer injury, too. It was still a game.
Same guy constantly spewed football terms to look like her knew what he was watching....I guess. "Fly route! Hitch route! Wham block!"
Hell, I can say beaver, bear, and squelch, but that doesn't make me a truck driver.
Yes it does. Congratulations.
Douche canoe. That's funny.
Found this for you GoKartMozart. It's a douche, in a canoe. Close enough?
via GIPHY
Very nice!
Seriously Mr. Babcock, I hate the paper airplanes so much. I have tried polite requests, diplomatic discourse, and angry arguments, but the kids (and some *are* kids, not students) still throw the dang things. I know this issue is likely low on your list of concerns, but it would improve at least this fan's experience. Your time and attention is appreciated.
But yeah I know this is what we're doing right now
As one of the tweets indicated above, drunk college kids could do far worse. Is it wrong? Yes. Will anyone be able to stop it without a major change to ticket distribution? No. But I think an email from Whit reinforcing that any airplane tickets caught will result in forfeit of any remaining games could be a decent first step. The only problem is, even if said kid forfeits his/her remaining season tickets, there are other ways to get hands on tickets. Not to mention, wrongfully accused victims of appropriated tickets.
I agree that the only way to stop this is to cut it off at the source but I don't think that requesting an overhaul in the entire process mid-season is the right way to go about it. There has been interest in a digital system for several years now but I have seen no incline from the powers that be that it has ever been considered.
We're already having issues selling and giving away tickets. You think banning people who may or may not have thrown those airplanes is a good idea or going to happen?
Miking the Marching Virginians is really annoying too. Add that to the letter.
That was my biggest qualm from the OSU game. Oh my goodness they sounded awful mic'ed! Coming from a music guy, when all you can hear is trombone and cymbal, you gonna have a bad time. That combined with the delay from the rest of the band that was already audible just ruined the whole experience.
Solution, either put some money into it and pay a sound engineer to correctly mic the band or do away with it forever. They've got over 350 instruments for a reason. This isn't UVA's band.
+1. Get rid of the cymbals, all you need is trombone.
But seriously, the phasing that I hear from section 20 makes anything they play almost unrecognizable. Poorly done.
Not that there's anything wrong with trombone! But lets be honest, how often do they actually have the melody for more than 3 bars?
Not nearly often enough my friend.
Leg for "phasing." Haven't heard that term since high school.
Former band director, DCI and DCA alumni, they will never do whatever they are trying to, live sound flows like time. Some of the phasing happens in college bands. The acoustics of where you are vs where sound comes from is different stadiums can destroy your sense of time.
Also - I love the MV's but UVA's band smokes ours.
Actually, that was in Ferg's letter to Whit last year...didn't help.
OT: Did a paper airplane fly into a trombone?
Okay humor me here. The airplanes are annoying. I agree. Te tech needs to improve so smart phones can be used. The issue is every student has extra tickets from printing an extra so their fried can sneak into their section.
You're also asking Whit to police 18 year olds who are drunk with an understaffed police force. It is a huge task.
Let's give the students credit. There's been three years of subpar Hokie football. I know that won't be popular here but it's pretty true. Students stayed through the OSU game when a lot of other fans left. They showed up to a firman game that was a snoozer if you aren't a die hard.
I agree the planes suck. They are not however harmful nor do we resort to throwing bottles, batteries, or other foreign objects. I just think potentially getting college students in trouble with the law is way over the top.
Not meaning to be offensive, however, are you drunk?
On a smart phone at an event. Wish I was drunk.
Yea I agree it's not a job for law enforcement but Rhino event security should be dealing with it. You station one member behind each student section and just watch it's really no that hard to do.
That would be the fastest way to turn the student section hostile. If the students think that they are going to be liked out any second then they will stop going. Student ticket sales are already down and they are some of the loudest fans we get. I think people just take game day so seriously. Someone below wants to nix the Hokie Pokie. That was always something I loved. It's embarrassing as hell but I did it every damn game because I love my school and team.
I think we should focus on the field and take the good and the bad that our program is. It's the only one we have.
Rhino has no idea wtf they are doing. I bought a student ticket from another student located in the north end zone along with some other guest tickets in the same row. For some reason they singled me out, asked to see my ticket and Hokie P and since the names didn't match they made me leave my seat. I pulled up the Hokie Tickets website, highlighted the part about it being legal for students to sell tickets to other students, and went back to my seat. They came back trying to kick more people out, so I showed them my phone. They didn't say anything, but they left us alone after that.
I also went up to a cop after they asked me to leave my seat to see if he could help me out, but he told me that whatever security says goes and to "get the fuck back" and "get the fuck out" of his way.
Over all it was a very pleasant experience. 5/5
Law enforcement is not at the game to be ticket security. If requested by Rhino or Lane staff they will step in to remove/arrest someone. Their function is to prevent and arrest violations of the law and to provide people with a safe to watch the game.
That became wildly apparent after I talked to him. I didn't complain to him nor was I drunk. I approached him because I wasn't sure where to turn and he literally told me to fuck off.
Law enforcement was pretty edgy all last week. I was handcuffed at the concert before the OSU game because they thought I stole a VT flag and was parading it around. It was Christiansburg PD who cuffed me and told me "You fucked up." Then VTPD who came over and let me go.
Overall: 8/10. May do it again.
Oh man, that's pretty crazy haha
Good guy VTPD to the rescue.
Yeah, I got singled out and they made me show my ticket going up the walkway to section 13 for the Furman game. People streaming past while I fished in a pocket for my ticket. I complied but I'm sure I had a confused look on my face.
It could be a lot worse. When I was a student at Tech the thing to do in the student section (and keep in mind the North stands didn't exist then, so there were a lot more students in that area) was to throw all the HARD plastic cups down to the front of section 3 and make a huge cup train up the stands. Trust me, getting hit in the back of the head with one of those cups was much worse than a paper airplane!
Yup, the cups were flying high after 92. When we scored a TD, the cups would get tossed towards the field, along with pizza boxes. The more we scored, the more cups went flying. When we had over 40 points, it was dangerous in the stands.
It's one of the most feared traditions of Lane. Per Urban Meyer:
"First off, it's my first time here in Blacksburg. My friend, Frank Beamer, he's got a heckuva place here. That was a top-10er, maybe a top 5-er as far as the emotion, the crowd. The buses coming in today, I had high expectations cause I talked to some folks that had played here and it certainly didn't disappoint. The paper airplanes terrified my team and allowed the clearly superior Hokies to claw their way back, but fortunately the stands ran out of paper and we were able to pull out the result."
I may have paraphrased the last sentence, but he was thinking that.
Also, stop with the Hokey Pokey. It only detracts from the fan experience.
Whoa. Leela threw me for a loop on that one
I think Whit / we have bigger issues to deal with rather than trying to control 18 year olds and their actions. I'm the same year graduated as the author of the letter and it doesn't bother me at all.
Let's prioritize real issues guys, not cosmetic ones.
Not disagreeing with you on the prioritization or issues but if one of those aero-engineered vellum flying crafts reaches the field, it can be a penalty on the home team.
Really? Now that I did not know. Is it like a 15 yard penalty or something? Also, source?
I haven't heard about it in regards to paper airplanes, but i have heard of it in regards to throwing bottles, cups, etc.
I read somewhere that VT is delivering medical supplies by drones these days. Maybe we can weaponize them and vaporize the paper airplanes.
#InventTheFuture
Weaponize the medical supplies? I like the way this is going...
Reading comments on here with this in mind
*EDIT: The whole sequence really is necessary as the comments continue
The paper airplanes always remind me of that one basketball game back in 05-06ish when they did free mini Frisbee giveaway night at Casell. What a horrible idea.
This may be the most "get off my lawn" thing ever. As for me....
Welcome! Love the gif. Love and 100% agree with and support the username. Hope to see more posts from you.
And also, can somebody explain to me just how the frick someone can hate something more than LOLUVA!? That is illogical.
Out of State student with no connections to Virginia schools prior to Tech. Also attended when there was no threat of UVA ever beating us. To us, UVA is nothing more than another Wake or (previously) Duke. Fun to laugh at, but don't really have deep hate. Miami gets much more hate from me than UVA.
Paper airplanes suck. Something we can all agree on. Fine.
Writing a letter whining about it on a public forum? Threatening to make the problem worse if you don't get your way? I feel like I'm on a UVA message board right now.
The solution is easy. Drop off any student tickets that are found folded into a paper airplane after the game and let the administration cancel that student's tickets.
The students could be doing way worse things at the football games. Just be happy that they're at the game cheering (part time, at least).
It would appear that not everybody agrees that paper airplanes are bad.
More like not many care enough to solve it, which would be a huge hassle.
Not everyone agrees they suck, which is part of the problem BUT an opinion people are rightfully entitled to.
The paper reams piece was satire.
The solution you offer is easy, but is not one being undertaken by the administration. And honestly, I don't even know that canceling tickets is necessarily a fair way of handling it. People act like assholes sometimes, but I'd much rather address the behavior than restrict a student's rights or access to tickets. Last year I suggested having identified/ proven airplane throwers assigned to help clean the stadium after games. Something as simple as a warning email would even suffice. Just a reminder that throwing things on the field is prohibited to deter the behavior.
And how do you go about enforcing the stadium cleanup? Who's accountable if that person doesn't show up or does a poor job? What's the next step of punishment?
And if you just stick with warning e-mails, what happens on the second or third offense?
There has to be follow through on any threat or punishment, otherwise, people will just keep doing it.
As much as I hate the airplanes, anyone who is serious about cancelling tickets if they end up on the field is off their rocker.
There's numerous scenarios where that piece of paper ends up in someone else's hands and is thrown on to the field without the knowledge or consent of the season ticket holder. I would be livid if I went to a game, misplaced my ticket and was no longer able to attend because some drunk asshole found it and decided to throw it on the field.
I agree with you that it is not the best solution and would like to clarify that a first offense should maybe cancel their ticket for the next game and not the whole season. However, it is the only cost-effective solution that I can think of. I think people would be more careful with their tickets and who they sell them to. Additionally, you would maybe reduce the number of people in the NEZ printing off 10+ copies of their tickets so that their friends in the East stands can get into the NEZ.
This way also allows the whiny
UVAVT fans that have such an enormous problem with them feel like they're part of fixing the problem.The real problem happens when you do have to sell your ticket though. If you can't go to the game you want to sell your ticket. If you don't 100% trust the person you're selling it to (who's probably going to be drunk at the game), do you still sell it? Would you rather have that ticket not used at the game at all? IMO losing future tickets when you aren't responsible for the offense would end up with even more empty seats.
There should be a system where you can release your tickets to games that you're not going to attend. You're not supposed to sell the tickets over face value anyways so worst case you lose like 10-12$ (I forget the cost of season tickets now). I mean that's less than ideal but it allows Tech to redistribute your tickets and also put some good seats into the lottery system (because nobody wants to sit at the top of the SEZ).
Its like 11$ but as a college student 11$ pays for a few days worth of meals. Why shouldn't the student be compensated for the ticket that they reserved in advance by buying season tickets?
It's a fair point but what would your solution be? Obviously paperless tickets solves the problem entirely but that costs a lot of money. Being able to transfer tickets to another person would solve the problem but that relies on an online system. I'm not suggesting that my solution is THE solution but I think it is a feasible solution that could be implemented with low cost almost immediately.
Easy solution would be no student tickets. First come, first serve with your student ID. Once the limit is reached, no more students. 15 minutes after kickoff, gates can be opened back up to fill empty seats by students only. The goal should be to get as many students into the games as possible. While our recently lackluster basketball program isn't the best example due to fan apathy, this "standby" system has already been implemented by them.
Fine but basketball does have season tickets. I love the idea of the standby line and used it many times for basketball games back in the day. However, I don't think you can get rid of student tickets entirely. I'm the kind of person that gets incredibly stressed out about being early/getting good seats for events in my normal life. I didn't have the time in undergrad to camp out and wait overnight to get in line to get into the game, so I wouldn't want to have my ability to get into a game and get a decent seat based on who has the least amount of things to do in the hours/days leading up to big games.
Only issue I have with this is what about students who want to bring friends to a game who don't have student IDs?
There were several games when I was bringing in friends who weren't students at VT. They were either, friends from home, friends from other universities, siblings, or, on one occasion, my dad. I would ask a friend who couldn't go to the game, or wasn't interested in going, to put their name in the lottery for a ticket. If they got it, I'd use their ticket to get my friend/brother/dad in. When we signed up for group season tickets there was always at least 2 or 3 people in our group who, for whatever reason, wasn't going to a particular game. I'd use their tickets to get people in. Part of the fun of going to a football game, especially at VT, is being able to share that experience with someone who doesn't have easy access to it. My brothers all went to a small school that didn't have a football team and they thoroughly enjoyed their experience sitting in NEZ when they came. No way that would happen if they had to furnish a student ID to get in.
Using a student ticket for a non student is a thing of the past now or is being turned into one at least. Student ID's are being checked and I know Rhino the new security has been put on notice for this.
The whole point is you pay a fee as part of your tuition and fees for YOU to be able to go to the game. Part of the ticket has a stipulation that you have a valid student ID. Sure, it would piss some people off if they couldn't sneak their friends in but the point is that it's a student ticket, not a "bring whoever you want" ticket. If it's all about going to the games for the experience, why aren't all tickets free? Kinda undermines the entire premise of selling tickets if they are just being given courtesy/student tickets so they don't have to pay. And then people want new coaches and to pay more money to keep existing coaches but aren't willing to shell out $60 to go to a game. I appreciate that you want your friends to enjoy the game. It certainly makes it more fun. But there are plenty of tickets for sale that they can go to so that the students who didn't win the lottery can go instead of sitting at home so people who don't even go to VT can take up their seat in the student section.
Allowing students to use a pdf on their phone would be a huge improvement. In my experience printing tickets was always a hassle and would have been much easier to show up to the game with a screenshot on my phone. Going back to traditional tickets picked up from the office in Cassell a few days before the game as is done for lottery tickets could be an option as well. As I understand these options were considered, and the paper tickets were chosen as the best.
I think that using a PDF on your phone would be a very reasonable solution. They do that here at UVA (I'm a graduate student here) and I've never seen somebody have a problem with that system.
I'm not a fan of picking up tickets from Cassell because that was always such a pain to get to during the day (for basketball tickets, when I was there).
Don't look now, but I think there's civilized discourse taking place in an attempt to find a solution to something...and it's happening in an Internet comments section!
/Rand Paul gif
Congratulations? I'm not sure what you want but your "letter" reflects poorly on those of us that are capable of initiating public debate without using inflammatory writing and/or empty threats. You are clearly the most important person at a Virginia Tech football game so please do let us know if you have any other problems that you'd like us to crowdsource a solution for.
I mean, I was actually applauding that people were taking time to make thought-out and reasoned arguments here. None of what I said in the comment above was sarcastic, except for the humorous need for the Rand Paul gif. I'm genuinely glad it's being talked about. I'm sorry you thought I was implying anything different.
Dammit, both of you
Cancel the tickets? So if my ticket falls out of my pocket, and another student decides to fold her up and let her fly, I lose my student tickets?
I don't think first offense should be loss of your season tickets. I do think that people would be more careful with their tickets though.
I never thought I would see the day when VT fans would bitch and moan like UVA fans. You want a Zima while you write a letter about how mistreated you were?
lol exactly - in your 50 yard line seats, no less.
I don't like the paper planes any more than the next guy. But it's going to be virtually impossible for Whit to stop those antics this season...and probably for a few seasons. He's spending money to make money and he's more concerned with investing in tangible things that could lend themselves to more revenue for VT Athletics. Putting money into overhauling the ticketing system is an unrealistic venture in that regard. I do believe that getting rid of the paper tickets is the best way to mitigate paper airplanes, but I don't think they will be completely eradicated from the stadium for many years. I'm willing to bet that every single fan in Lane could find something about the experience that they don't like and there just isn't a way to 100% satisfy all 66000 fans. My only advice is to be thankful for the aspects of the fan experience you do like and try not to let those less favorable aspects ruin your afternoon.
Your ideas are intriguing to me and I wish to subscribe to your newsletter.
I think you totally nailed it.
+100000000000000000000000000000
Other than winning games, of course!
"You can please some of the people all of the time, you can please all of the people some of the time, but you can't please all of the people all of the time."
I do think a paperless ticket app would cost time and money to develop, but it could also pay for itself over time. Potential money making features include: peer-to-peer tickets sales among app users which Tech could charge a nominal transaction fee for (less that other providers for an overall cost savings) and advertising opportunities. Also, it would provide direct access to fans to remind them about season ticket order deadlines, Hokie Club deadlines, upcoming Hokie Club events, etc... all of which could both save and make money.
Hell, they already have the gameday app developed and available. They could just add a tab for tickets.
I do not disagree with any of this. I think an app would be great. Is it something that can be done this season? No. Is it something that we could hope to have rolled out by 2016 or 17? Maybe. I think the idea has a lot of potential and if Whit could find someone who could run with it I think it could be a really successful program if done correctly. At this point, however, I think all we can do is hope and dream. until something changes, just try not to let the paper airplanes ruin your day. (I'm using 'your' figuratively, not directing it at any particular individual)
If I recall correctly, student season tickets were issued on a card that was scanned as we entered Lane. I think it was my senior year that they changed over to the paper tickets? I could never figure out why they made the change over to paper in the first place. The paper airplanes are the worst. I hated them as a student and I hate them as an alumni.
You make an excellent point. Hopefully Whit will be able to address the problem; it's not something we're going to be able to police ourselves. But until then, all we can do is support our team and encourage Hokies Respect....
When I was a student (03-07) we had traditional paper/ cardstock tickets. It was after I graduated but I thought it was only 1 year where they used the cards, which were the same as how they did student season basketball tickets when I was a student. I think they had problems with people losing cards and them being unable/ difficult to replace, so they did away with those and shifted to the print-at-home form.
You also can't give them to a friend or sell them if you can't make it to a game.
Most of these paper airplane pilots are 18 or 19 year old kids having fun at Lane and could be apathetic & sitting in the dorm or doing something else on Saturday. They do not bother or offend me or my game experience. Nor do I find the ooooo at the national anthem disrespectful or offensive ( USAF Vietnam veteran) . However losing a home game is the pits. Lighten up and enjoy game day at Lane!
"If you don't get rid of paper airplanes, I'm going to make more paper airplanes." ..................k
Looks like Lane Stadium isn't the only place infested with the inhumanity of paper airplanes interfering with sports:
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+1 for any Jonny Gomes gifs.
In all fairness, that soccer airplane had a pretty remarkable journey.
Get rid of paper tickets altogether. Paper airplanes at games are embarrassing.
Ya herd it straight from the horse' ass. I mean mouth. Sorry, incorrect orifice.
you have serious issues with your overt fascination with poop/ass. it's getting creepy.
So do a lot of people in Northern Europe (ie: Denmark, Norway, Sweden, Netherlands, etc).
Granted, I wasn't insulted or mocking him. Just screwing around. But don't be mislead. I have other hobbies and interests as well.
C'mon, man. Everybody poops.
Eh, either one. I speak out of both often enough.
And when all of the law enforcement and event security are tied up taking care of the paper airplanes, something major could happen in the stadium -- like some big fight or some idiot jumping off the back of the stadium. True, that stuff doesn't often happen, but Murphy's Law would guarantee something like that happening when everyone is tied up with many smaller offenses.
The simplest solution is to walk up the stands, say "Hey, don't throw stuff towards or on the field and don't make me come back up here", and then walk back down... just as he did when he spoke to Jeff.
Sure, and then get in a fight, which would then get the attention of the officers.
Without going into specific numbers there are WAY more than enough officers in and around Lane at games to handle almost anything. If officers are dealing with an issue that requires that many officers to deal with the game will be postponed because a riot is breaking out in the stands.
I both hope you get your wish and paper airplanes are banned as well as laugh at the thought that this would require two open letters, sent to the AD and posted on TKP.
Yeah so Paper Airplanes are not a problem toward the south end of the East stands, nor are they a problem in the West stands, nor the South Endzone (Although the potential exists should students ever sit in their upper level SEZ seats). I suggest you call the ticket office and ask to have your tickets relocated to another area that isn't in front of a student section. Better yet, pony up for some indoor club seats where you won't have to worry about anything - paper airplanes, bird poop, rain - from falling on you from above.
You know it is littering. So let's make sure we revoke season tickets from everyone that leaves a plastic cup or nacho tray at their seat. Let's also install paper detectors at the entrances, because we know these renegades won't stop at making airplanes with only tickets. Seriously, I'm embarrassed that fans have to do this to be entertained. I'm also embarrassed that open letters are written to athletic directors in an effort to stop something that would have otherwise not gotten more than a sideways glance from me.
Seems to me is that they could randomly eject people who throw paper airplanes (Every 5th observed infraction?). Or even just point out that it's rude behavior, similar to operating a cell phone in a movie.
The practice would stop soon enough.
The cops are more interested in stopping fights, I guess.
Never figured out how to link to the exact comment but this is my post from the original post about paper airplanes here: LINK
I still feel it's applicable. Never experienced it, but I know traditions change over time. It could be something REALLY cool, rather than symbolic of apathy. Needs student leaders to lead the charge for that kind of change though, or Whit introducing the idea.
Link to Comment
Nit pick: Key Plays are on third down when we are on defense, not offense, so the noise factor is supposed to be a good thing.
read down on that link. as per hokie sports the key play started as a thing we did on offense NOT defense. now it's changed for the better, which is the point. traditions change and can begin from something other view as annoying. just give it meaning and context
You can click the little hashtag (#) to the right of the time stamp
Damn!! I was so excited to finally use my new toy at the next home game...
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Guess I'll have to think of something else to get on TV
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If you actually want something to change you should email someone in the athletic department about it, especially if you are a Hokie club member, instead of posting an open letter.
Sorry if I may offend you but I always considered open letters selfish and attention seeking.
It always comes across as an attempt get people to pay more attention at what you being mad about something rather than going directly to the source, keeping it professional, and not seeking "yes" men.
There is no way other then coming across whiny in an open letter.
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Sounds like a better place for it would be a fan site on the Internet.
I think we are going about this all wrong. What's embarrassing is the QUALITY of the paper airplanes. We have a top notch aerospace engineering program. There should be lines on the tickets to help guide everyone in how to make the perfect paper airplane. This way, the announcers don't say "wow, this stadium sucks, they're throwing airplanes?!!" They'll say "5,000 aerodynamic works of art are raining down on the visiting team's bench"
#suckitGT
paper airplanes> that damn clanga bullshit that Miss St has..
PS--> liked the idea of pom poms as it gives the kids something to shake/play with.. Also looked good in stadium and from what i've heard looked good on TV too.
I was pissed I didn't get a pom pom just cause I'm not a student.
think i saw a club at VT provided them so limited budget but it looked good.. Imagine it around the whole stadium and it would look absolutely boss.
1 thing I envy about the SEC schools is they seem to have the fan engagement thing figured out thats for sure. Bama. Ole Miss, UF, LSU, ect ect..
Choppin wood by the JUGS's picture Choppin wood by the JUGS | 2,846 | 3 hours 6 min #
paper airplanes> that damn clanga bullshit that Miss St has..
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No kidding. I was at the Miss St vs LSU game on Saturday. It was LOUD!
The good was that LSU won it. The bad was that the game was close enough to the last play that the bell-ringing went on until the last second of the last play.
The smart fans supplemented their cowbells with earplugs.
My daughters were in the cheering camp before the game and with the team walk, which was very cool. They wore their cheerleader uniforms to the game, and usually do each game.
They wanted the pom poms too.
I can't hear you over CLANGACLANGACLANGACLANGA!
This is my biggest gripe with Lane experience, has been for years. Why on earth can we not afford to give a promotional item (towel, poms, whatever) to the ENTIRE stadium at our biggest primetime games of each season??
All I ask is that when we have THE game of the week, like the OSU game, why can't we put our crowd on par with the SEC? Show the world we mean business. I personally know we are on par with them, because I've experienced both regularly. But for those watching on television, you have to have the visual to go along with the noise. There is nothing like seeing an entire stadium all shaking poms to the fight song or rally-toweling together (i.e. sandstorm at USCe, which is pretty cool in person, too).
While I appreciate the effort for the OSU game, I would have laughed at a stadium with only a couple of sections of pom shakers for lack of funds. It's ridiculous. If you're going to do it, commit. Give them to every single person coming in.
I think we can afford that for one game each season. Should be a line item in the athletic budget.
//rant over
Honestly, its not going to stop, so I don't get the point of this post... again. You are always going to have new students, and it only takes one person to do it to start a huge domino effect. Sure the gameday staff can watch people for doing it, but too many students vs. too little staff.
Well how about punish students with the names on the tickets? Never going to happen. Too many tickets just left on the ground/seats or students copying their tickets so their friends can escape South to sit in West.
We can bitch/rant/complain/whine/etc. about the paper airplanes, but it's never going to end unless they come up with a better way of ticketing service, such as bar codes on phones to scan, but that's probably not feasible. can't force a student to get a smart phone just to have access to tickets. Until then, those planes will continue to be a flyin'
How about a twitter shaming, like TOTS did with the outstanding bar tabs?
I usually write a short note on my ticket to Frank or Bud about what plays or ideas I want the team to run. Then I fold it up and throw it. I actually think they listened to me one time. /s
Damn, didn't know this was going on. '08 grad here, have not been to a home game since 2012.
How things can change...
Started after they stopped giving out tickets and started making you print them yourself. Now with phones that can be scanned, not sure why it continues, but I've never seen many except during breaks on field. BTW, this is not isolated to lane, occurs at other stadiums too.
For those who it really bothers, I see what you are saying, but the west side sees much less airplanes. It's worse in blow outs too
So it seems like this may be getting blown out of proportion a little then?
I will say this. If it truly becomes a problem, I have faith that the Athletic Dept will deal with it properly.
Are we really talking about paper airplanes? Wonder where my old paper airplane book is these days....
But seriously, though....
If the airline industry can successfully and effectively adopt an electronic or mobile ticketing system, I don't see why we can't do the same for football.
It's not as easy/affordable as you make it sound, IMO delta is the only airline who has done it right, but overall, I agree. Sounds like a great capstone project for some CS majors.
One salient point I forgot to add: the move to electronic ticketing would also prevent assholes like this guy from profiting at the expense of the Athletics Department. It would also prevent him from screwing my friends out of their money on game day.
Last game my 9 year old daughter got scared because an airplane hit her just under her eye. It was enough to scratch her skin. If it had hit her in the eye, there would have been damage. What's the old adage? It's all fun and games until someone looses and eye.
I was hit in the shoulder, back of the head, cap brim and cheek. My daughter was hit a little more than I. My 6 year old was hit twice in the head. She started crying and took effort to get her calmed and she hid behind my wife the whole second half.
It's like getting spitballed by the jerks in the back of the class.
Tell me, is this how I'm supposed to spend my entertainment dollars and suspend my problems of the day/week for some relaxation? Shielding my young daughters from flying objects?
To those that advocate airplanes as not a problem, provide your address so we can periodically throw some incredibly harmless eggs on your house a vehicles. Hey, if it's fun for me, no problem, right?
No further clarification needed.
except throwing eggs at a car or house can be considered vandalism and is punishable by law/police..
I get your point but that was a bad example..
I agree but, the point stands.
both are "harmless" one is a misdemeanor, the other considered funny and you are ostracized as an old fogey for not letting the 20 year old kids have their fun.
100% agree.. which is why I loved the Pom Pom idea.. If we could expand that for the whole stadium it would solve lots of problems. I didn't see many airplanes vs OSU and I definitely didn't see any pom pom's being thrown.
If you want to waive it and shake it you can, if not you can take it home and decorate with it ect ect..
Hitting someone in the eye with a paper airplane would be considered battery and would be punishable by law/police.
Yes, if you could prove beyond a reasonable doubt who threw it and that they intended to hit you, which seems extremely unlikely.
How long until VT has ushers peddling orange and maroon versions of these bad boys below the student sections on Gameday?
While I agree with most of the disdain for paper airplanes, I would like to encourage some perspective.
The athletic department has made SIGNIFICANT strides in the past year.
I could go on and on. Sure, at the OSU game we had some trouble with the Screen and the Skipper going off (much higher priority issues than the paper airplanes btw), but overall I'm extremely happy with everything Whit has done. Have you seen how Texas's (now fired) AD was alienating their fans? And you want to talk about Paper Airplanes? Really?
Yes, we are talking about things people throw at other people during a game.
Things that made it hard for me to stay in the stadium because my young kids were getting hit by them.
I understand if it does not bother you. that others cannot understand why someone else wouldn't be bothered by that, does not make it ok.
So a paper airplane is in danger of keeping you from the stadium?
Spending hours tending to my small kids to get them to stop crying is what would keep me from the game. All because somebody thought it was funny to make them cry by hitting them with flying objects.
I could always spend the game sitting next to you with a crying kid or 2?
Would that be pleasant for you? I suspect it was not pleasant for the people around me.
Out of respect for their game experience, I was going to leave with the crying one. We got her calmed and we could stay but she hid and did not enjoy the game as usual.
Hokie Respect.
I know this is going to come off as unemotional; that's not the intent, I apologize in advance, but between the unlikely possibility that someone actually gets hurt from a paper airplane, and the difficulty it takes to stop, this is, and should be, a low priority issue for our athletic department.
I agree, it's not easy and I don't much expect anything to be done by authorities.
However, I think building an atmosphere that condemns the action may have some small impact to prevent it.
Social pressure is not a small thing.
I don't think it's all that difficult to discourage childish behavior. For the most part, you can just point out that it's childish.
That's what I am doing.
Pointing out that it is childish and negatively impacts others.
Those that condone the behavior should be ashamed of themselves.
Yes it is childish and should be shamed. Unfortunately, unless it's a really crappily made airplane, the person hit will not be that close to the person throwing it so shaming has to come from their peers rather than the offended party.
So students, take note: if you're throwing paper airplanes, you're an idiot. Don't be that guy (girl). If you want to improve the fan experience, come up with the next fun chant. Be a clever fan, not an idiot.
bingo.
Thanks.
The students doing this are the culture. They don't GAS.
OT: How long is this thread?
Okay, let's keep it civil. I understand your girls are upset after being struck by paper airplanes but that's what students are doing. If you think it is clear and present danger, write a letter to Whit as he has small children, Shane has two young daughters, the list goes on and on. From your previous post, it sounds like you may have the worst luck in the world as something like 6 airplanes hit you in rapid succession. If you think it is not a safe environment for your girls, see if you can move to south or west. East and north by far have the most students in them.
I really want you and your girls to have a good game day experience. I know Whit does as well. I've talked to him multiple times about it (I used to work in the VT admissions office). But there are some things that are out of everyone's control.
I totally get where you are coming from, but I think your venom toward the people throwing them is a little misguided. I highly doubt that whoever threw the airplane that hit your child thought it was funny/was actually trying to hit them. But other than that I feel for your predicament.
I find it hard to believe that the folks who throw them don't get a kick out of hitting people with them.
Sure, when it hits someone harmlessly in the back I bet they chuckle to themselves. But if it hits a kid I have to think they aren't evil and regret throwing it.
But my point is upon release, they see two alternatives, it hits someone or it makes it to the field. To them, both would be considered amusing and wins. They don't consider WHO it might hit.
I'm not saying they were trying to hit us but, you better recognize that the odds are you are hitting someone rather than the field.
They are not being respectful of the experience of others and therefore are rude. To the point where I was about to choose to leave in order to be respectful of others around me.
I choose to be rude back. I want to foster an environment where it's known it's not civil to do this.
Can't do that sprinkling powdered sugar on it.
If we were going to eliminate things that made children cry, Lane would have an incredibly sterile environment. I have seen kids freak the f out before at the most trivial of things. Its annoying as hell for those around you, but being the person everyone hates because your kid is throwing a crying fit in public is part of being a parent. Your kid is your problem, not ours.
Look, I sympathize, but at a certain point, its a paper airplane. Who cares.
I don't want to make it sterile. There's a logical fallacy there in your argument.
I want to get rid of childish, immature and irritating behavior.
I give reasons why.
You tell me throwing objects is ok because a crying kid is my problem and because its annoying I shouldn't bother you with it.
But then you also call me out as a wuss because I was going to leave the stadium with the crying kid.
I think your position lacks clarity and consistency.
Blast is right. Some of the music and videos they showed were ridiculously loud. I was on the southern 40 yardline near the top of the East stands and it was uncomfortably loud at times. It just seemed like it was way louder than necessary since the times it was played was during breaks where noise was not an issue.
Really?! I fucking loved it! At the end of one of the time outs they started playing Can't be touched by Roy Jones Jr and my entire sections lost it. I was in east 27 maybe?
I was in 31 and I don't mind loud music but some of the clips they showed and some of the music was just blaring. Maybe it was the acoustics of where my seats were with the top of the stands and the lights but it was painfully loud at times. Other people around us were saying the same thing.
I was also told that the video/audio person in charge of feeding music/video was doing so for the first time. Probably won't make it up for any other games this season, but I'd expect improvement as the season goes on.
Made me think of this tweet
This may very well be the best thing I read all day
isn't their a family section in the stadium as well?? I know at many NFL stadiums there are No Alcohol sales and Family Friendly sections..
I'm aware these probably are not the best seats so that could hurt as well.. but it could be a safer place?
Top of the South stands are pretty empty of rowdy fans (or many fans for that matter)
The paper airplane issue is an issue but not worthy of changing anything outside of the issuing of paper tickets. For students, all they need to do is ship actual season tickets to them or go digital. They can even do a will call at cassell for student tickets through the week before the game like they did with the lottery before.
Jesus, what a colossal waste of time and effort. It's a paper airplane....get over it. There are plenty of things to worry about that actually matter.
If it doesn't matter, then it's not so difficult to ask people not to be rude to the other patrons.
After skimming the comment section this is how I felt
My kids won't go to the games when it's really cold out. Can you add that to the letter please?
Just to add some fuel, I've been to a few Purdue games (both parents are grads) and apparently it's a Big-10 tradition in the stands for students to toss marshmallows. (Bad for the tuba section, trust me.)
I couldn't find a video from Purdue, so I'll post this one from ND:
Even though the paper airplane thing is annoying; I would rather get hit by a paper airplane than a half bitten, sticky, marshmallow.
This thread is like complaining about rain. Nothing you can do will stop it so quit wasting your time. They are annoying, but so is the drunk play by play guy sitting behind me.
I did get some satisfaction watching a fail. Someone threw a plane and the wind caught it and redirected it back in their face.
Pointing out boorish behavior isn't a waste of time.
I see it more akin to having a video to instruct bozos that it's time to turn their cell phones off before a movie. It shouldn't be necessary, but it helps.
A leg for you!
OT: NRH Musky guy?
Mostly smallmouth. The one in my profile is 22 inches and 6.8 pounds. I've caught a few musky just by chance. I've floated the river from Claytor Lake all the way to Pembroke. There's no place I'd rather be.
Fishing my first tournament in Claytor this weekend....never fished it before. Willing to share any tips?
Honestly I'm not much on lake fishing. If you need any tips for the river I'm willing to share any knowledge I have.
If you are putting in at the State Park I suggest going right across the lake
from the swimming area of the SP. Always had good luck there on that bank.
Watch out for trees down in there though. Good Luck!
I'll never understand how you people always take "paper airplanes" and extend it into "students are bored and don't care, they should all be ashamed."
It takes like 10 freaking seconds to make one and throw it. You're telling me you can't find time during a football game to fold a paper airplane without missing a play? It doesn't "distract from the game." Almost all students love it when one is thrown, the students that hate it are definitely a vocal minority. It would suck if one made it to the field of play and resulted in a penalty but that is incredibly unlikely. In four years as a student the farthest I ever saw one go was the back row of the sideline.
This comes up every year here and just always comes off as this really whiny, self-entitled thing with our fanbase. They're freaking paper airplanes. They're not hurting anybody. You're at a public place with tens of thousands of people, everyone is going to have things that annoy them, but as long as nobody is getting hurt there's no need to start petitioning the athletic department. And honestly, if you're bringing your family/kids to a game and getting hit with a paper airplane is a big deal to you, you probably shouldn't be sitting that close to the student section (hardly a family friendly part of the stadium) in the first place.
One made it out about 10 yards onto the field last game. Somewhere about the 20 yd line IIRC.
A couple made it out last season.
Miami Game 2011 one made it out of the east stands and almost landed in the Miami huddle. Felt like the whole stands was cheering it on.
Please don't let recruits find this.
My son started throwing paper airplanes during a game. I paused it and sent him to his room until he felt like he could behave himself. That is how the problem gets solved in Lane Stadium 1475 Miles West.
Whew, I finally made it to the bottom of the comments! That's a lot of damn comments about paper airplanes, cell and WiFi (kinda wish I'd skipped over that section because I just got pissed off), and yelling "O" during the National Anthem. After we solve this issue, maybe we can move on to solving the immigration problem. But seriously, I think the best way to solve this is through education. We need to teach the students how to make a paper airplane with a blunt nose rather than a pointed nose. That way, when it hits someone, and it will, it doesn't leave a mark. There problem solved, we can all move on and go to bed. Thank you, and good night. s/
"Insert appropriate GIF here" (If only I knew how...)
PS - In all seriousness, I can totally relate to one hitting a kid and it hurting. Worse yet if someone were to get hit in the eye. It's not all fun and games.
Edited: Forgot the sarcastica thing. Hope I got that right?
There's really only one thing this thread is missing.... an Emma Watson gif....
Holy moley, we are one angsty little fanbase.
To provide a solution to the issue, here's an idea.
As I understand things, the students are now printing their own tickets. Said paper tickets have their name on them. Hold a contest between first and second quarter for the closest to a point on the field...say the center of O in Hokies or something in the endzone. This will encourage (not fully require but at least encourage) the students to hold onto them until this time. And if you don't throw at this time, you can't win. Make the prize season tickets for basketball, or a team signed football or helmet, or a $200 gift card to a place in town, but at least something of decent value that will make throwing them all at the same time an incentive. This ensures that those in the stands can either take cover or at least know when the airplanes will be coming down towards them.
This would take a negative an turn it into an event. Fans that don't like it can be prepared. And all the paper should come down all at once!
One problem with that. They need their tickets to get back to their seats sometimes. Especially in the North Endzone.
Then do it between 3rd and 4th quarters. Keeps students at the game at least that long, and they have it until then.
3rd Quarter Stretch/Hokie Pokie. The best time would be after the game due to considering how they might clean them up quick enough to get the teams back out there. But would anyone wait around for that since it'd have to be after the field is clear of players? Great idea, but it'd require some additional changes.
Not a bad idea. what about duplicates though? Kids might print 4 or 5 tickets off and get a few practice throws in before the real deal
Pick them up, and it will have their name on it. If one is thrown early, they are not eligible for the prize.
And like I said above, twitter shame them for premature planing.
Someone can work out the details, but at least its an idea to help curb the randomness of the occurrences.
heck, what says the paper has to have their name on it? Maybe they'll just bring blank sheets? Or a class syllabus or something. I like your idea, I'm just trying to think of the holes that students will shoot in it
In order to win, it will have to be their ticket.
yeah i'm talking about their practice throws...could just be blank sheets. Nobody could prove where those came from. then for the actual event, they'd throw their tickets.
I've got to believe that the number of students who will pack in extra paper for practice throws will be a whole lot
lessfewer (dangit) than those who are throwing their tickets now.Someone write an open letter to whit with this idea cause that's sure to get it noticed and implemented
done. just emailed Whit.
I guess I don't get this. Seems to me that this would encourage even MORE paper plane throwing, create a bigger mess to clean up, and provide an even bigger reward for boorish behavior.
How many actually make it to the field? Very few.
What's the issue with the airplanes? They hit people at random times. This would be all coordinated and done at once. While 50% of them, maybe more, may not even make it 4 rows; that means they stay in the student sections all together. The rest might find their way out, but the "public", or should I say non-student attendees would be prepared as they are ever going to be for the paper airplanes. They can go to the bathroom, get a drink, or keep an eye out for any coming their way. This would eliminate the having to play defense of planes coming their way for 4 quarters. And I'm not sure a bigger mess is that big a deal. It is a mess after games; adding a few more pieces of paper isn't going to make that much of a difference.
As for rewarding boorish behavior, what's boorish about a coordinated contest? The B1G throws marshmallows during games. I would think that paper is much easier to clean up than thousands of marshmallows in September.
Maybe more would be thrown, but it would be for a 30 second period. Not 3.5 hours.
You want a paper plane contest? Hold it somewhere else, and let the participants clean it up.
This is just a bunch of people throwing paper airplanes at a football game. Most of it is just more litter in the stands. A big part of the payoff is hitting other patrons.
I'm not seeing how this is a solution, as it just encourages more of it.
Dear OP,
I see you've tried this before with similar results. You, sir, must be a scientist.
Sincerely,
hokie07ME
I was a marketing major.
The first rule of marketing is: "any publicity is good publicity."
via GIPHY
Also not a great scientist. See, I would have convinced someone else to pull the lever and observe the consequences like a true scientist :p
true, but then you'd be introducing all sorts of new variables. If it didn't happen with another subject, you might lose sleep wondering, "Maybe it only happens when I do it"
that's exactly it though....keep getting all sorts of different people to pull the lever and observe what happens each time. I can formulate my theory based on a large data base. If I keep pulling the lever myself expecting different results, well, that's just insanity! Insanity =\= science
Hows about this. At the end of the game, as they leave, the students fold up their tickets and stuff them in boxes on the way out of the stadium. Before the next game, a drawing is held, and umpteen winners will be randomly chosen to receive some manner of prizes, from a free taco to a VT hat or something. Get creative, and generous enough with it to engage those inclined to plane with the notion that they just might get more out of it if they don't throw it. Then, recycle the paper and nobody has to go around picking up your litter. Just a thought.
So long as the odds and prizes were good enough, I can see this working. Crappy prizes/no chance to win and people would rather throw a plane.
Yep, that was my point. Gotta incentivise good behavior these days.
Get off my lawn! In my day we would never do anything so juvenile! Declension!!!!
There will always be things that college KIDS yes I stand by KIDS (final stand before the "real world") will do to piss people off.
Revoking someones rights to attend a game would be counterproductive to those of you who complain about student attendance levels when you aren't complaining about paper airplanes.
Of all the things to complain about when it comes to the student section, you guys feel like paper airplanes are where students cross the line?
Rowdy drunk students? That's ok, even though they can be a real nuisance.
Fights, throwing things at the opposition? Those aren't issues that deserve an open letter.
But no, someone taking 10 seconds to make a paper airplane and throw it to the enjoyment of other students is just too much. It completely ruins the game and should be banned. Students are worse fans for taking the 10 seconds to make one instead of focusing on the game.
This might be the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard.
Hypothetical here- GT is undefeated when we play them & we have 1 loss. Who has the most paper airplanes?
You sound like a former-serious-fun-slaughtering-RA/fun person in general.