This seems to be a common complaint of the fast paced up-tempo offenses. Players get burnt out quicker and get injured due to it. I'm not saying the sky is falling, but it seems to be a legitimate concern after yesterday's injury report.
One thing I know is that we should be able to out play people in the 4th due to the amount of conditioning which is awesome.
I'm also a tad concerned that we MIGHT leave our defense hanging out to dry. Since we have gone away from a pro-style run offense there has been a correlation to our defenses getting worse. Of course scoring more often will certainly help.
Forums:
DISCLAIMER: Forum topics may not have been written or edited by The Key Play staff.
Comments
I am sure we will see some struggles on defense if we go 3 and out a few times but I think we will see more sustained drives as we get more plays in the 5 yard range instead of 2 yards after a huddle. If we can do that, our defense may get more rest than last year.
not worried.. fuente has said many times he's not going to go up tempo just to leave the defense out to dry.
Don't know where I heard it but recently he said offense isn't going as fast as he would like it but no sense in rushing it when depth is an issue
Exactly. We practice fast so when we need to go fast, we can with no issues. It is a lot easier to slow down in the game than speed up without mistakes
If other teams can get to the big games with this offense, I don't have a worry about us doing it.
The ACC refs better be working on their arms-straight-above-head stretches.
I think we owe it to them to get them this kind of regular stretching added to their routine.
As long as it's during our possessions.
The ACC refs better be working on
their arms-straight-above-head stretchesmoving their asses and keeping up with our offense.This concerns me more than anything else. If we go all in and balls to the wall to create a fast flowing offense, the last thing in the world we need is relaxed play by the officials and the guys on the chains slowing us down and the resulting break it would give to the opposing defense.
A very valid concern. ACC refs were horrible last season - some of the worst blown calls I have seen (Duke-Miami ending, UNC-Clemson onside kick, the winning touchdown for UNC against us in OT last year [definitely think he didn't secure the ball]). Clemson and UNC to some degree have currently been the only offenses in the league with a true emphasis on tempo and the no-huddle. The last thing I want to see is the refs slowing down offensive play, but I have come to expect some degree of incompetence from the #goACC.
FTFY
Maybe with Fuente we'll be so fast we'll outrun the blown calls.
I know it doesn't make any sense, but let me dream dammit!!!
We'll score faster than Ron Cherry can say "Givin' him the business."
Injuries are gonna happen, regardless of how we're playing. Exhibits A&B - the last two seasons.
I'm not concerned.
To your first point, there are always lots of players on the mend during spring and summer camps. That is nothing new. We've had quite a number of players hitting injury reports as long as I can remember.
Regarding leaving the defense out to dry: Imagine going 3-and-out. The first play is an inside run for little or no gain. 32 seconds come off the clock as the team huddles and calls/executes the next play. 2nd down is an incomplete pass, stopping the clock, and leading to a 3rd-and-long. 3rd down is another incomplete pass. 6 seconds come off the clock. So altogether the offense burned a whopping 38 seconds on a drive, and is now punting to put the defense back on the field.
Now do that 8 to 10 times in a single game. That is what our defense is accustomed to.
If our new offense goes 3-and-out a lot, like previous offenses at VT have, then yes, our defense will get tired. But I don't really expect that to happen. Will our offense go 3-and-out occasionally? Yes, absolutely. But I don't think it's going to be a serious problem that becomes detrimental to the defense.
Also consider this: Due to the new tempo, and the way the team practices, the defense is much more well conditioned than it ever has been. So if the new offense can manage to avoid going 3-and-out more than 4 or 5 times in a game, the defense will actually get MORE rest than they have in previous years AND they'll be in better shape from the current conditioning program.
As far as I'm concerned, if this offense manages to get at least one first down on at least 75% of their drives (which I don't think is unreasonable to expect) then our defense should be absolutely fine, if not better off than before.
I think people mistake an up tempo offense leads to a poor defense, I think the fear is there, if your offense is up tempo + poor it will weigh on your defense heavily.
But if your offense is strong and up tempo, you can have a strong aggressive minded defense especially when you get teams behind the 8 ball that have to take chances. Im really excited, to see Buds aggressive defense with a hopefully equally aggressive offense.
But just for reference to calm some fears: just look at Clemson, TCU, Louisville, Oregon minus last year, Ohio Stage, Ole Miss - they all run some form of uptempo offense and still have highly ranked defenses.
I think as we can relate, a poor offense, up tempo or not can kill a defense.
I blame Hilgart. Clearly he's a little behind on the times. If he was programming to try to prevent these types of things then nobody would get hurt. After all it's just football.
/s
I think one of the points being made by the OP is that we are getting WAY more reps in practice than usual.
I don't think that there is any doubt that if you run 100 plays, you have a better chance of being injured than if you ran 50.
this is a valid point. Statistically speaking, the more plays you run the more likely you are to end up with injured players.
That being said, I'd much rather run 100 plays at the risk of injuring someone as opposed to running only 50 and then looking incompetent on Saturdays.
Good point. Being tired can also lead to bad technique, which can cause more injuries, but the only way to get in the shape and avoid this is to push yourself in practice. Hopefully with a better understanding of what is expected and more time in the program the team can come out after summer and be shape to lessen that as a factor, but your point is valid either way, and hopefully just a cost of having a much improved offense. Its not like we did not have injuries last year. Anyone else think the new staff is less interested in looking for an excuse to use?
In theory that's true, but I'm pretty sure everyone who has looked at it has found games with hurry up offenses don't have more injuries than slower paced offenses.
Well, I wonder what Cal fans are saying.
Cal is running 500 plays per practice under new offensive coordinator Jake Spavital
Can we all agree right now not to boo injuries of the other team. As a Clemson student, I watched four years of crowd wide booing anytime someone on the other team got hurt "because they are just trying to slow down our offense" somehow forgetting that a violent tackle football game is being played by high level athletes. It got so bad that they would occasionally boo when opposing offensive players got hurt because... they were slowing their defense down?? It was very frustrating to watch as amateur athletes were booed for being legitimately injured, no class.
Another reason why Clemson fans are the worst fan base I've personally had experiences with. Tennessee fans are better than Clemson fans.
This doesn't match my experience. In fact I'd put them in the upper side of good fans. Bad is WVU and Maryland. My sample size is small though, so not saying my experience matches what others have witnessed.
ECU fans
Clemson fans
WVU fans
in my experience. Haven't spent much time around the Fighting Yertles. Also, I had cousins (literally) at WVU so... people who knew me. YMMV
Ecu and clemson fans in my experience have been some of the most hospitable I've ever met. The type of fans that will see you wandering their campus on the way to the game and offer you some fried chicken and a beer.
Let me clarify my position. The older part of the Clemson fanbase is hospitable and friendly. The kids through 30 somethings, are delusional and extremely frustrating to deal with and their five years of relevance has exponentially increased their insufferability.
If you're just walking around the main tailgating areas it's mostly adults and families, the student party/Greek tailgates are usually a little more condensed and secluded, so you will likely avoid the bad apples if you're just casually wandering around the major lots, that's where you will find hospitality from Clemson fans.
The LSU fans who invaded Blacksburg for their game here were among the worst I've seen, right there with WVU. They started the week long occupation of the parking lot fairly friendly, but by the end of the week, well, if you were there, you remember. Then after the game, sour grapes and negatory responses to friendly overtures were the norm. Yeah, they travel well, but they whine even better. Sore losers.
I don't believe there's been any correlation shown between tempo and injuries.
When I look at the defense injury to pace of play ratios, it give me no indication that a 'faster' pace of play causes or a 'slower' pace reduces injury counts. The PAC-12, with the highest game pace of play at 75.33 plays per game per team, averaged the lowest ratio of injury per play for the defense. This is especially interesting considering they play 9 conference games including up-tempo teams Oregon, UCLA, Arizona State and Arizona. On the flip side, the third fastest pace of play conference, the ACC, had the highest rate of injury to the defense per play.
This snapshot of defensive injuries versus pace of play only serves to show that the idea of pace of play causing more injuries to the defensive side of the ball are, in my opinion, random and unfounded. Nevertheless, the numbers ftom 2012 on the offensive side showed 'fast' teams were less frequently injured.
http://cfbmatrix.com/conference-speed-of-playinjury-rate/
Eagles defensive players were complaining about being fatigued and not having their legs under them. Yes this the NFL, but Chips Tempo is the model a ton of these schools are trying to mirror.
Initially I was worried when hearing about all the injuries this spring. The increased tempo of practices and new strength and conditioning program are probably the cause of some injuries. However it's a long time until the football season. Their bodies will adjust as they continue to train. I am really hyped to see what the team looks like in the first game!
I worry a little that the first game might be a false positive. We're playing against a far inferior team which will be out matched in every way. We will look like super stars and everyone will be on the Fuente offense band wagon. I think Fuente/Cornelsen's offense is ultimately going to be very good but it's going to take some time. We might not be clemson/OSU levels of good offensively until sometime in 2017 or 18.
I would love to be wrong and have this offense show up way ahead of schedule but realistically it just isn't likely to blow anyone's doors off yet. Liberty will crumble fairly easily, IMO, but I just don't think we will really have a good sense of what this offense is going to produce for us until we're getting into ACC play.
Nope. Worrying doesn't help. Wishing helps...I wish you wouldn't worry.
I'm hoping that if you run twice as many plays in practice that you'll be twice as likely at game time to run the play properly and without penalties. With the limited amount of time that the NCAA allows for practice, this could be a big plus.