Not sure about you guys but I grew up a huge baseball fan. My Dad was a Baseball fanatic (even played for the Academy and had offers to play for Stanford) and I grew up going to major and minor league parks all over the country. This was in the 80's before all the fancy scoreboards so I learned how to track all the stats by hand and appreciate the arts of pitching and at-bats. I still love all that great stuff but the stuffiness and sturborness of baseball is starting to get to me. Yesterday Bryce Harper got beamed with a 98 mph fastball for a homerun he hit in the 2014 NLDS in which some scrub reliever did not like the way he celebrated after HITTING A HR IN THE PLAYOFFS. Now I am the first to admit that I am getting older and want people off my lawn (just last month passed out of the year of 37 jokes, very sad for us Kevin Smith fans) but these out of date rules of trying to hurt someone for flipping a bat or not sprinting around the bases just drive me nuts. Thoughts?
On a side note the Junkies were hilarious this morning talking about the fight itself and how Strickland got in a good Jab and missed on his power punches and Bryce missed his Jabs but landed 1 of 2 power punches.
http://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/19492344/bryce-harper-washington-nati...
Comments
Still a huge baseball fan. Not a fan of show boating and a spikes up slide into the 2nd baseman's shins. I like brush back pitching but not head hunting.
Red Sox fan?
Uh no. They are half of the best rivalry in sports, just not my favorite half.
So you're an Orioles fan then?
LOL
I agree with you completely. Enjoyed the sport as a kid, don't even bother watching now. These stodgy-unwritten rules are ridiculous.
The throwing at a batter for improper celebration is crazy. Someone is going to get seriously hurt or killed by that crap (wonder if a pitcher will get charged with assault). If you don't want my celebration for a huge home run..I don't know, maybe don't give me a ball I can hit to Venus.
I thought the Harper situation went as it should have. Harper should not have been thrown at and he should have charged the mound and knocked the snot out of the guy for doing it. All was right in the world of unspoken rules.
You know the pitcher deserves it when the catcher doesn't even make an attempt to chase down the batter. He just stood there like, "this is on you."
...and that catcher is Buster Poisey. He knows a bit about the unwritten rules of baseball.
Also interesting he didn't do anything to stop the brawl.
See "Values Career" after his history of injuries especially the collision at home plate in 2011. Same thing with Madison Bumgarner after he got in a recent accident and had severely bruised ribs. It didnt stop the other Hunter from getting involved as he dragged Strickland off the field while nursing a bum groin.
Other speculation is out there that Strickland asked Posey to stay out of it so he and Bryce could get into it. Who knows. It made for an exciting twenty seconds of baseball.
I've been coaching baseball at the Little League, Babe Ruth, Senior Babe Ruth, and AAU level for a long time. I love baseball, the unwritten rules of conduct & etiquette, and the "game within the game".
Brushback pitches at the pro level play a similar role to the enforcers in hockey, where the players themselves take care of business separate from the coaches, umpires/refs, and the league. But no, never should a pitch be thrown at the head.
Intentional hitting of a batter 2 1/2 years after a made-up infraction is so bush league it's an insult to bush leagues everywhere.
I'd literally ban Strickland for the rest of the season to solve the problem once and for all. I'm guessing these entitled athletes would see losing a season's salary as a determent. Or if not, maybe they should be criminally charged with assault. Either way, MLB and baseball fans everywhere wouldn't even know a middle reliever like Strickland was gone. But I bet his fellow bullpen pitchers would notice.
I don't have a problem with brushbacks either. I do remember when it was done with something off speed or not a full strength fastball. It sends the message that you weren't happy with something the other player or team did, without the intent to hurt someone. Even if you miss with the brushback, you don't hit the guy with something that could do damage. How many times have we seen a guy get plunked for hitting an opposing teams player?
This situation was different. Strickland threw a 98 mph heater right at Harper. That, to me, exceeds the bounds of the game. He wanted to hurt Harper. If the pitch had gone higher, it could have done serious damage. And then the jabroni fought against his teammates trying to get him off the field. Dude is bad for baseball.
If he wanted to hurt him he wouldn't have thrown it right on his hip.
Who knows what's in those Gatorade bottles, anyway?
I personally have liked baseball more the past few years, especially the playoffs. Cubs just won their first Series in everyone's lifetime, the Yankees and Red Sox aren't shoe ins for the ALCS, and we have some really good young players to keep an eye on. Seems less stuffy and more exciting to me.
I never thought I'd hear exciting and baseball in the same paragraph without a hefty dose of sarcasm.
I grew up loving baseball, especially great defensive plays. I understand why people don't love baseball, but I personally don't need to see a home run to find excitement, just like some people need to see a touchdown to get excited in football while most of us are excited the entire game.
You must not have caught any of this years WBC
I'm with you vtdirk12. Maybe it's because I'm forced to like baseball since moving to St. Louis, but looking around the league, there is a lot to be excited about. Even the Yankees are fun with their new homegrown talent. Every time Aaron Judge is at the plate it's must-see-tv.
As for the unwritten rules, I hate them. But it seems like these conversations, where we discuss how stupid those "rules" are, happen more often these days. And I think that's helping make the game less stuffy. Just the other day there was that incident where Manny Machado got beaned by a Red Sox pitcher and Dustin Pedroia was seen saying to Manny something like "I didn't ask for that." So when the players start standing up against the stupid unwritten rules, that's when I feel like they'll start fading away.
This is also another chance to post the Joey Bautista bat flip from the playoffs a few years back. Keep doing your thing, Joey Bats.
Battista is a complete douche. Odor clocking him square in the jaw was one of the best things to happen last year (outside of my Cubbies finally winning).
Rangers fan here. Would just like to formally endorse any and every instance of Bautista getting punched in the face at full force.
PUT ON DA REPLAY
Somehow this gets more gratifying each time I see that punch connect.
I love playing baseball (even in my 40's), I love coaching baseball for kids, but I can't stand watching it on TV. I think the only thing worse would be being forced to watch golf.
*cars driving in circles that can only turn one way
The only thing worse than watching golf on TV is watching golf in person.
I used to feel this way. If you ever get an opportunity to go to The Player's Championship at Sawgrass, do it. Especially hole 17 on Sunday.
I used to HATE watching golf on TV. The list of things I would watch before golf was LONG. That is, until I started playing golf. I gained a newfound respect for golf once I played it, definitely a humbling experience. I now love watching golf on TV and watch all the major tournaments. Going to see The Masters or some major tournament in person is on my bucket list.
via GIPHY
Bryce Harper as a whole is a loose canon. Pitcher shouldn't have thrown at him, but Bryce should have taken his base and just been "come at me brah". Kid has a lot of growing up to do before he is considered one of the best in my eyes.
You note it was wrong to throw at him (which I agree with)...but he needs to grow up to "play" a game? Then should take his medicine for getting hit with an object thrown 98mph at him?
Question for all who think this is okay...Why can't the batter throw his bat at the pitcher?
Your opinion isn't going to go over well on this page, but I'll just say I agree with you. The kid has always been a hot head. He got plunked on the thigh and he charges the mound throws his helmet at the pitcher and throws multiple haymakers at his head. If roles were reversed, I'm guessing the opinions on here would be a little bit different.
Agreed, but a rock thrown at 98 mph can break bones or even kill them if it hits his head.
And that's why you aim for the thigh. Sends a message but the only injury you're really going to see is a bruise.
I think it's just a bad look to throw a baseball that fast at a baby
How does that statement make any sense? The closest thing I can conceive of would be if Scherzer intentionally hit Brandon Crawford because of a homer hit three seasons ago and Crawford charged the mound. That would be extremely out of character for Scherzer but if he did do that he'd deserve to be charged at.
How can you not think people being Nationals fans and the fact that it involved Harper greatly influenced their opinions on the situation?
I didn't realize this was a Nationals' fan board.
I would guess plenty of the folks commenting are fans of other teams. I realize there is a strong VT presence in DC but still I'd think off the top of my head there are more Yankees, Cubs, Red Sox, Braves, and Orioles fans.
This board is overwhelmingly in favor of DC sports, be it Nats, Skins, Caps, Wiz, and O's (pre-Nats holdover), and to a lesser extent Ravens.
Its the reason the NHL Playoffs thread died the second the Caps got eliminated in the 2nd round. Its also why the NBA Playoffs thread never really got underway. It just is what it is
Well regardless I fall into the" not a Nats or Harper fan" category and think Strickland hitting him was bush league. Three seasons ago and the Giants won that series and the World Series and you retaliate for something pretty minimal. Most neutral sources I've read seem to agree with that thinking too.
I think it's funny he held on to it for that long. The only Busch League thing that happened was Harper's helmet throw. You have to throw it by the ear flap.
I loved Harper's response after the game about it. He said something along the lines of He has a World Series Ring to look at anytime he gets upset about this, I would trade places in a second. He has a ring and we didnt make it past the first round. Dont understand holding a grudge like this after that.
Yep. If the situation was switched and the Nats won the WS in 2014 and were sitting in last place in the division this year, I think fans would be wondering wtf a relief pitcher is doing holding on to a perceived slight rather than focusing on fixing the current issues.
If you think he's hated now, just wait until he's probably a Yankee in a couple years.
Statistically, he is on pace to be one of the best in the history of the sport, so your opinion on that matter is pretty meaningless, whether you like his attitude or not.
And I'm not biased, I'm a Braves fan so there is no love there.
He's statistically tracking to be a very good player, but "one of the best in the history of the sport" is stretching it. He's an all-star right now who could one day become more. Mike Trout is the player that is tracking to be one of the best, if not THE best, ever. But he's in LA so nobody on the east coast knows/cares.
There is also a very good argument that can be made for Manny Machado being the best player in the battle of the beltways.
Both of them have been hovering at 99th+ percentile for large portions of the last few seasons in many categories. They are both on track to be some of the best ever, people just don't like Harper because he is Bryce Harper. Trout is easier to like because he is so quiet and humble.
Harper's career is more similar to Andrew McCutchen, and based on WAR he's behind Manny Machado. His great 2015 season also looks like an outlier based on BABIP so far in his career (likewise, last year was extremely low, right around .330 is probably about right for him). Mike Trout is on pace to rival Babe Ruth for the greatest player of all-time. At his current pace he could be at Ruth's level by the age of 41. Unlikely he'll reach that, but if this season has been any indication he isn't even close to his full potential yet. And his team isn't good. Comparing the two, or even putting them in the same category, is not fair to either of them. It's not that people just don't like Harper, it's that he isn't nearly as good as people think but he gets talked about as if he's on the same level as a once-in-a-generation talent.
Similar to how people talk up Derek Jeter's defensive abilities, but in reality Starlin Castro is just as good of a fielder (and as a Cubs fan, that's hilarious).
You may have laid the curse on Trout. May miss the rest of the season after tearing a ligament in his thumb. Ouch, already had to be hard for him playing on such a trivial team, now he has to watch that team while he recovers.
Loose Cannon? He's been suspended once in his career for coming back onto the field after a walk off win when he had been ejected for arguing balls and strikes......hes really a hazard out there.....
I'd say so, he could have hit the first baseman with that helmet throw!
Well, getting suspended in baseball is pretty rare. Bryce has been ejected 10 times, which is actually a lot for as long as he's been playing.
Harper is a bit of a hot head, but he'd done nothing to deserve a fastball to the hip. Batters should just start bringing their bats with them to the mound when a pitcher intentionally hits them. Put an end to that practice right quick.
A ball to the hip area is a HELL of a lot different than taking a LETHAL weapon with you to the mound. If a player were to take a bat with them during a charge to the mound that would HOPEFULLY be the last time that player was employed in baseball.
I don't agree with hitting him THREE years after the incident but taking a bat with you should NEVER be an option.
What about a bat to the hip/butt/back of a pitcher? From some comments in this thread, taking a bat to that area wouldn't lead to the hit being LETHAL. I find it a bit odd that you see a bat as a LETHAL weapon, but not a 98mph fastball. Technically, a pitcher takes a LETHAL weapon with them to the mound every time they go out there to pitch.
FWIW, the only MLB player to ever die from an injury received during a game was Ray Chapman who, way back in 1920, died from being hit in the head by a pitch.
they also didn't use batter's helmets back then. Incidentally, that event is why we have batter's helmets now.
Here's my feelings on baseball...I don't like telling players how to celebrate and enjoy the game. Baseball is emotionless and that's going to cost it on the long run.
If you want to watch joy in the sport, watch a game in Central America or Japan...the players and fans are having fun and it's a party.
Reminds me very much of a couple toddlers in the sand box blaming each other for "starting it".
DOES NOT!!
MOOOOOMMM!!!
VTGM ain't dealing with our shit anymore. Go ask your father.
There needs to be stiffer punishment for any pitcher that intentionally throws at a batter.
Players should never charge the mound - because baseball fights are bad and no one looks good doing it.
Kyle Farnsworth looked good. Know your opponent, especially if he played college linebacker.
Nolan Ryan looked pretty good for a 46-year-old man here... Robin Ventura, not so much because he got his wig split by a 46-year-old man.
Nolan Ryan=bad mofo.
Hopefully we can all agree.
No question.
Who else in history threw a 98-mph fastball as the last pitch of his career? At age 46? With a torn elbow ligament?
Excellent pull!
Nolan writes the book on mound defense here.
And watching Bo Jackson effortlessly move the pile is a great joy.
Ventura was kind of a punk as I recall and should've taken his cue from Izzy Alcantara:
The way I understand it, Ventura really didn't want to go after Ryan. You could see how he only halfheartedly charged the mound.
Interesting. Definitely see where he hesitated and was looking over at the bench. Why'd he charge then? Gotta' be something major to charge a future HOFer like Ryan.
It wasn't an isolated incident. It was the result of a three year feud. Great writeup below.
http://www.thepostgame.com/blog/men-action/201404/nolan-ryan-making-pitc...
The Rangers used to include clips of the fight during a pregame montage. In 2012, Robin Ventura took over as manager for the Sox, and their first game was opening day in Arlington. Lots of buzz, lots of people talking about the brawl, and then the Rangers went and removed the fight clip. All wasn't lost though, since the Rangers handed Ventura the first loss of his managerial career that night.
as a former pitcher i understand guys getting pissed when a guy showboats on a homerun. I hit a batter or two in my day as well, not saying it is/was right to do. bottom line if u are gonna drill a guy be ready for him to charge. do ur thing Bryce.
Baseball is a game I like to play, but I can't stand actually watching it in real time anymore (except in person).
Is it me or if someone is 2-2 against you lifetime with two homers, wouldn't the best way to vent your frustration be to actually get the batter out? If Strickland's beef was his reaction after the two homers, then the simple solution is to not allow a homer.
I think if he could pitch in a way that reliably avoids giving the batter a home run, wouldn't he have done that the past two times? I'm no baseball guy, but that ranks up there with "well, if you're tired of losing, just score more points than the other team."
Yeah, I get that side but Strickland is actually a really good pitcher (his ERA this season is 1.06) now and much better than he was in 2014 (granted Harper is a ton better now than back in 2014 as well) and should be easily capable of getting Harper out from time to time.
I guess what I'm saying is I really don't understand why throw at someone merely because they have owned you in the past. But Strickland has had some anger issues in the past, he gave up a home run in the World Series in 2014 and started screaming at the Royals' Salvador Perez, who was on first at the time of the homer, and Perez had absolutely no idea why he was being screamed at.
I have no problem with pitchers plunking guys in the hip if the player had done something in the past. Harper stood and watched his HR which is considered bad sportsmanship. The pitcher held that grudge for a while and took action and left him a bruise. Harper throwing the helmet and charging the mound with the intent to break the guy's jaw was more out of line by far than the HBP in my eyes. There is no reason to charge the mound throwing punches unless he threw at your head on purpose.
I have no problem with the Bautista bat flip for hitting a huge playoff HR, but I also have no problem if he got one in the hip for it.
I don't think you've been hit by a 98 mph fastball, anywhere on the body.
Nope, not one going 98, but I can promise you it left a bruise.
i stepped in against 92. i couldnt fathom getting hit by that much less 98.
If someone being slightly "unsportsmanlike" makes the pitcher want to physically, seriously hurt a person then that pitcher has some anger and emotional issues and probably isn't in any kind of state to play a competitive sport. Even more worrisome that he held onto that anger for years afterwards, if this were any other sport that person would be labeled a lunatic and a threat. But because it's baseball he's just enforcing some unwritten rule that assault is more acceptable then showing emotion.
And on top of that what Harper did originally is only unsportsmanlike by baseball's inane rules, celebrating a big play is perfectly fine.
If you go back and look at the two homers that Harper was "unsportsmanlike" about, they aren't even that bad. The first one he paused for maybe 2 seconds at most. If that's the unwritten rule and you can't let go after 2 years, maybe you have some anger problems. The second one was barely a fair ball, so Harper was probably watching that one to determine if it was fair or foul.
Not like any of this matters since intentionally beaming a 98 mph fastball at someone has no rational thought behind it.
Most of the animosity likely stems from what Harper did rounding the bases on the second one rather than how he looked at either of them. Strickland stared Bryce down going around the bags on the first one, so on the second one Bryce stares in at Strickland as he rounded every bag and it even appears he said something to Strickland as he went around second. Regardless, none of it warrants holding on to for three years especially since you ended up a world champion.
Who stares someone down after giving up a bomb
Baseball is already unwatchable for how slow it is, especially watching it on TV. Now going to a game is fun where you can chill with your buddies, eat dogs and pound down a couple cold ones, but watching it on TV is unbearable IMO.
So saying that, bring on the bat flips, the intentional throws at hitter (below the shoulders), the bench clearings, the stare downs, the back and forth jabbering, etc..... the more the merrier!
I mean if it's a team/player I like doing those things I won't see a problem with it. If it's a team/player I don't like, I'm gonna see them as disrespectful punks who should get what's coming to them.
So I guess I'm incapable of seeing this rationally. But I don't care. Being a sports fan isn't about being rational. It's one of the few places in life I think we should leave room to be irrational.
Does anyone else thing there should be less games? I'm not a baseball fan at all, but I don't understand how people excited for any one game when there's 160 others. Division rivalries are cheapened by the fact that the teams play twenty some times each year.
I agree. I think having that many games makes each game essentially meaningless. When any given game doesn't seem to matter I can't bring myself to watch one unless it is one of those "baseball holidays" like opening day, Memorial Day, or July 4th.
I love the length of baseball season. It's the best sport for figuring out who the better team really is. Contrast it with the Hokies football season. You get one chance against the teams in your conference and if you win you're the better team. Then the other team gripes about the rain or something, but you still own a tiebreaker that factors into insane scenarios. In baseball, you play your divisional rivals 19 times. Say you go 12-7 against that team, and no one can complain about the weather. You're statistically better.
The length of the season means you don't get too high or too low with any given outcome. My team might get shelled one night and then come back the next and beat the same team. For me, that makes baseball more enjoyable. My team's season isn't shot after one bad performance, fluky injury, etc. It allows me to relax and enjoy the game more.
solution: have the football season start in March and run til January. This is completely tongue in cheek because, unlike baseball, more than one player per team actually has to exert himself physically and everyone has to play each game instead of that one player taking five games off between appearances.
The long season isn't what kills it for me, its playing 76 fucking games against the four other teams in your division.
Especially when you're in a shit division and the only games that matter are against Houston.
From a bettor's perspective I can completely understand this. I put most of my action in the NFL because the season length (in addition to more valuable data based on roster familiarity, the infusion of prop bets, etc. I made a killing a few seasons ago betting the over on Phillip Rivers interceptions every single game haha).
Also helps with NBA. But I just simply love the adrenaline of college sports. However I NEVER put anything on the Hokies as my personal rule of thumb. Baseball is a no go though.
More bat flips. That's it. Bautista bat flip was amazing. Still love it.
If you don't want to get bat flipped on, don't give up a home run. Simple.
wythevillian92 better watch out the next time he's at the plate.
Not sure why I was getting downvoted. But feel free to hit me and I'll take my free base.
Sensitive Rangers fans?
Pretty sure I'm the only Rangers fan on the board. And I wouldn't downvote an (INCREDIBLY WRONG, BAUTISTA IS THE WORST) opinion.
Baseball is boring?? Doesn't get any better than Phillip Wellman blowing his gasket.
Also, leg for the Junkies reference. Been listing to them for close to 20 years.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TGZUKHtW7vg
I've been hit by a 90+ mph fastball and let me tell you, it incites some kind of rage, especially when you know it's intentional.
One game in HS the man before me got brushed back several times the at bat before me, and he was the one they wanted and missed. He walked and the first pitch to me was at my head. I made it half way to the mound with the bat in hand before my gigantic coach (former Old Guard, now just large human being of a coach) got between me and the pitcher. I have no problem with what Harper did.
The whole concept of intentionally hitting a batter is absurd to me. A 98 mph fastball can potentially break bones, whereas a bat-flip after a home run maybe bruise an ego, and even then, only if your ego has the skin of a 93-year-old hemophiliac.
The only thing I didn't like about Harper's reaction is that he isn't a particularly polished fighter. I would've liked to see a few more of his punches land cleanly.
CM Punk was a guest on various MLB Network shows today. He remarked that the lack of fight training by the players is what makes moments like these worth watching.
He also said that someone one day should go for the double-leg takedown, but that's another matter.
Haha true. Kind of like Charles Barkley saying he knew if he just held off Shaq long enough, the whole thing would get broken up. Football is tops in America because of the constant conflict, imho. Sports where you have to manufacture fights are just not exciting for me (I'm in my late 20s tho) that's why MLS soccer is so lame to me even though I played it through high school. I put baseball in the same league with soccer, and I can strangely watch golf with enjoyment. I guess it not being a team sport and it being just a part of summer...
Factors like fantasy football came first for a lot of reasons, but I really think it's the head smashing in football that make it America's favorite past time.
I'm okay with everything that happened. If you are going to show up the pitcher or throw at the batter then you better be ready for the repercussions. The idea that it's some heinous crime to plunk a batter is laughable. That being said I would have liked to see the pitcher go for the K or Harper just decide to hit another dinger off him next time he had the chance but it is what it is.
Full disclosure, baseball fan here.
1. season length is ok, maybe cut up to a dozen.
2. if you choose to plunk somebody, they may choose to retaliate by coming out to the mound.
3. all pitchers should have to bat.
Regarding #3, nothing chaps my ass worse than having a gutless AL pitcher (Barnes) throw at the head of your star player. He might reconsider doing this if there was payback in kind.
YES!!! I'm an O's fan, but growing up watching the Braves makes me appreciate the fact that pitchers should have to bat, period
I go back and forth on this one. First, you would have to change college baseball, the developmental and minor leagues so pitchers get used to hitting. Right now, the only time in the minors that the pitcher bats is in AA or AAA and both clubs are affiliates of an NL team. I feel like it's unfair to ask an NL pitcher to bat if they really don't have much experience doing it.
On top of that, you would lose an entire class of player that made their living being the DH; David Ortiz, Edgar Martinez, Harold Baines, Paul Molitor, etc may never have been.
I would rather watch Mark Trumbo bat than Ubaldo Jimenez.
Then too, I'd rather watch Ubaldo bat than pitch.
Excellent GIF choice. The presentation of the bashed phone from AJ to Ortiz was one of the funniest things I've seen.
Every time he's on the mound:
I was actually at the phone bashing game. It was so confusing because the Red Sox were up by like 7 at the time.
We were at that game too. From the monitors I remember he about took Dustin's head off as well.
Too soon, man. Too soon.
it's 5 o'clock somewhere.
Oh, are you saying it is too early to give up on Ubaldo?
Nah, I definitely think Ubaldo could step into the closer role with Britton on the DL /s
I'll be so glad with this season is up and we jettison Ubaldo. Idk who will fill his spot or it they'll be any better but they can't be much worse
Angelos opens the wallet for offense, not pitching. It's been a thorn for years. If not for Bundy, I hesitate to think where we'd be. May was a dismal month. Our offense is (and has been for several years) very streaky. Without better starting pitching, I think our ceiling is as a wild card.
I find it ironic that so many say they used to love baseball but can't get into it now because of pitchers intentionally hitting batters. I hate to break it to you but you must not have loved baseball that much because the players have been policing the game of baseball forever, and it used to be universally accepted.
Batters are intentionally hit much less often in 2017 than they were in 1980. There are two major differences:
1. Pitchers don't know how to throw at batters today, which leads to guys getting hit in the head and the knees. Which leads to fights and/or more guys getting thrown at. Strickland looked weak by throwing at Harper in relatiation for 2014, but he actually did a good job of throwing at Harper without hurting him. A fastball in the ass cheek isn't going to injure anyone.
2. Each time someone is hit intentionally today, it becomes a highlight. If Wade Boggs took one in the thigh in 1985 after sliding into 2nd with his spikes up, he dropped his bat and went to 1st and the whole disagreement was left in the past. That wasn't worthy of a highlight on the nightly news. The fact that it's on ESPN every time someone gets hit today makes it seem like it's happening more than it ever has.
Anytime you get hit with 98mp fastball, anywhere on the body, there is a chance you could develop compartment syndrome. A very serious and unfortunate post-injury complication. You may recall this threatened Dyrell Robert's entire leg during one season of his time at VT. It's definitely part of the game, but it's ridiculous to pretend like it's in any way "not a big deal" to receive a crush injury with that much force. The human body was definitely not meant to be casually struck with what is essentially an apple-sized rock at almost 100mph.
Brian Regan will always get an upvote from me.
I mean hell, if you want to litigate the sport like that, you might as well use a pitching machine
Just pointing out a fact. I don't think it's going to stop nor would I campaign for it to, but we have a lot of tough guys on here acting like it's not a big deal to take a rock to the leg at 98mph. It's a stupid childish practice and the unwritten rules of baseball are stupid, but it's not like it's going to stop.
I'm not a tough guy acting like it's not a big deal to take a rock to the leg at 98mph. But I've taken fastballs in the low 90s to the thigh and the back and it hurts like hell for a little bit but you get over it. I never said Harper should have thanked Strickland for hitting him with a 98mph rock.
Tough guys comment was moreso directed at the people who slighted Harper for retaliating as if you should just be okay with getting dinged like that, especially for something that happened two years ago. I'm guessing you played a good bit of baseball to get to a point where you could be facing a 90mph fastball multiple times, so respect there.
Touch. I have no problem with Harper retaliating (despite me also being a Braves fan and despising him) but next time he charges the mound he better know what he's doing. You can't throw the helmet, especially at the innocent 1st baseman. And those two overhand-baseball-throw haymakers were just begging to get himself knocked out.
Edit: I have literally edited the first word "touch" to read "t-o-u-c-h-(e with an accent)" like 5 times but it won't change when I post it and I'm giving up now
Oh, he didn't throw at the 1st baseman, he just sucks so much at helmet throwing he looked like Carly Rae Jepsen throwing a ceremonial first pitch
I can't get accents to show up on here either, I feel your pain. edit: touché :)
You need to use actual HTML, e.g. touché, which comes from typing: touché
Awésomé.
I will concede that there could be potential injury involved. And there is always the risk that the ball doesn't go where you intend and it hits the batter in the head, elbow, knee, wrist, etc. but the vast majority of the time a baseball to the butt is going to sting like shit and leave an ugly bruise but won't cause any serious injuries.
I'm definitely part of the old school way of thinking on this. You better not throw high but I think hitting guys is just part of the game. The thing I don't understand is the dozens of comments I've seen on several different platforms (since the Harper fight) talking about how they used to be big baseball fans but can't watch anymore because the players' policing of the game has gotten so out of control. That makes no sense.
Yeah, the serious injuries to the thigh are uncommon, the issues are always with the areas you mentioned head, elbow, knee, wrist as those often result in serious injuries or broken bones. I don't expect it to stop, though and it's not like I'm not going to watch baseball as a result.
I'm definitely not very old school on this, I am not a fan of the unwritten rules or the lack of celebration allowed in the sport, but I don't care nearly enough to die on a hill over it. People just have varying opinions on those and most people are pretty firm in their stance.
Yep. I don't have a problem with players policing the game, because as we've all seen throughout the years at every level of every sport, the leagues as a whole are completely incompetent and unable to do it themselves. And when they do try, they make a complete mockery of the process. Its why I never really minded a tough guy on NHL rosters who ensure players on his own team are protected by making it clear that if you take a dirty run at one of his teammates, you're going to personally answer at the very least to his fists, at least until the NHL started cracking down on dirty play.
But that said, as a pitcher if you're going to do this, and you're going to send that message, you better have enough control of your pitch to make sure you hit the guy in the thigh. If you try this and the pitch comes up around the hands or head, your ass needs to sit for a long while.
I played baseball growing up and am overall a fan of the game. I have two points to make.
1. Baseball on tv is UNWATCHABLE. Its too damn slow. Pitchers take too long, batters calling time out makes it worse. That being said nothing beats going to a stadium and just enjoying the atmosphere.
2. I don't care if people are throwing at batters as long as there is a recent cause and effect. If somebody slides spikes up then yea maybe throw a brush back pitch. But you have the accuracy to not hit him, no sense in putting a man on base because you don't like him. Wanna piss off the batter? Strike him out after you throw some chin music.
As someone who has been around baseball my whole life, I can honestly say that I have no problem with this situation. The pitcher intentionally threw at Harper and Harper charged the mound in a feud that has been going on since 2014. Baseball players have long memories because they are times to set the record straight and there are times not too. It was in the 8th inning SF already down by 3 runs. Strickland felt it was necessary to hit Harper (I personally do not feel that it was justified but he did). Harper also did the correct thing for charging the mound on a clear intentional 98 mph fastball to the hip. So all in all this was handled correctly when considering the "un-spoken rules" of baseball.
The reason I like the "un-spoken rules" of baseball is because it helps to keep players in check. Does it work every time? No, ex: Jose Bautista. However, it does help it from becoming the next NFL with players doing absolutely ridiculous, uncalled for celebrations which in my mind take away from the integrity of the game. In baseball there is a saying. "It is a game of those who are humbled or those who are about to be." The reason is, is because you could go out one game and win 15-0 and then come out the next game and lose 0-15. When you get destroyed in a loss you hope the other team at least acts respectable, and not rub it in your face. That's part of what makes baseball, baseball. So when pitchers stand up for themselves or their teammates when someone does do something disrespectful, I got no problem with it. I think a lot of people who are against the "un-spoken rules" do not understand this side of it. However I will say if players policing each other results in a player getting injured then you are doing it wrong. It's all meant to send a message that you did not appreciate that players actions, not injure them. Just my humble opinion.
The NFL is already the No Fun League, we have very different interpretations of the value of celebrations. Sports are an emotion filled experience and celebrating is a part of the game, I don't think it takes away from the integrity of the game in any way shape or form.
I hate to quote a Miami Hurricane ever, but as someone in "The U" said (and also Cam Newton, later in similar fashion), "If you don't want us to dance, don't let us in the endzone."
I get that but at the same time in baseball is different. The pitcher is not going to hit his spots every time (for a lot of pitchers it's actually rare that they do). My point is a player can get lucky and get a hanging breaking ball over the middle of the plate even though that wasn't the pitcher's intention. Hell even Max Scherzer gives up a homerun every once and awhile. The pitcher can throw a great pitch down and away and the batter can still golf it out of the park. So for that it's a little different than football. The point is that it happens to everybody in baseball so to go and celebrate in a ridiculous fashion is uncalled for, in my opinion. And that opinion has been the prevailing thought in baseball which is why these "un-spoken rules" exist.
Maybe I'm wrong, but I thought I heard that this was the first time since giving up those two HR in 2014 that this guy had pitched to Harper. If so, that seems like one pretty lame feud.
Yeah I think you're right but if I remember correctly there was some off the field comments that were made by both sides which inflamed the situation as well.
It actually was only 2-0 and the Giants need wins way more than they need a loose cannon pursuing a personal feud. It became 3-0 when Harper's replacement scored after the "brawl." 2-0 is not hard to come back from, hell, the Giants loaded the bases in the bottom of the inning. A single there ties the game, but not when its 3-0. Regardless, it wasnt a team on team thing which is why if I was the Giants I would really evaluate how important Strickland is to their roster. I have seen plenty of relief pitchers sent packing for much less.
Back in my day, when you got down 0-2, you knew the catcher was calling a fastball up and in next, and you thanked him for it.
MLB needs to get on Korea's level.
In both bat flips:
and brawls:
So...MLB handed out the suspensions: Harper 4 games, Strickland 6 games. Here's the hypocritical part (or confusing, stupid part). If Harper just takes his base...does Strickland still get 6 games?...nope (probably none or 1, max). So Strickland gets 6 games because Harper charged the mound. All Strickland did (beyond the plunk) is fight back when Harper charged him.
6 games for a pitcher equates to a lot less than 4 games for a position player though. At most, Strickland misses 4 or 5 innings that he would have otherwise pitched in, and Harper misses a full 36 innings
Starting pitcher? Yes. But if you're a reliever like Strickland, there's a decent chance that he could have seen action in at least 4 of those games.
Not quite. Strickland hasn't pitched in more than 4 games in any 6 game stretch this season. Then, in 10 of his 21 appearances this season, he pitched less than 1 full inning. Conclusion: Harper's suspension is the bigger punishment.
Major League Baseball released a statement that they assessed Strickland as the instigator in the incident. In my opinion, much like they do with hockey, Strickland as the instigator should be assessed the larger suspension, also considering his teammate, Michael Morse ended up on the 7 day Disabled List for Concussion Protocol so I also feel that Strickland shouldnt be allowed to pitch again until Morse comes off the DL.
As to many of the responses here, one thing I would really like to see in baseball to at least somewhat balance out the severity of the suspensions is to assess it as an innings suspension and prorate the reduction of the suspension by the average innings performed per game or some similar formula. This would help to balance the impact of an everyday player
That way if Harper is assessed a three game suspension which is what he got based on the appeal, then if he has averaged 7 2/3 innings played per game across the season, then he would miss three games and a portion of a fourth. As with Strickland, as was noted, he has averaged 1 1/3 innings per game appeared in, then his suspension at six games would mean significantly more. He would essentially miss a third of the season at 54 games. Worst case if you want to adjust it slightly differently, than approach it by reducing it by any inning not being thrown by the starter. If the starters average during his suspension 6 innings per game, than his suspension would be reduced by three innings per game on average, meaning he misses 18 games, which seems more reasonable as a one to one suspension impact wise. Rule on starting pitchers is that there suspension is reduced 1 game every 5 games since thats the seemingly standard Starting Rotation in baseball these days.
One other piece of this to protect the teams and the integrity of the game, I think that teams should be allowed to call up a minor leaguer while the suspensions are being served. It comes down to injury risk of other players, livelihoods of the tweener players and a few other reasons. By tweener players I mean those handful of guys that are on the 40 man roster that might have to be released to make room for another starting pitcher for the rotation if a starter is gone for suspension. Not really fair that someone fighting for their career should be punished by losing their job because one of the starting pitchers went on a plunking binge. Also may not seem like a big deal to have to manage a team 24 players against 25 for the duration of a suspension but the strategy of using pinch hitters and pinch runners all gets impacted by a suspension if they cant be cleanly replaced.
Anyway, my two cents.
But really, I like the thought process here
If you put in your two cents, and a penny for your thoughts...who's getting the extra penny?
UNC? IPTAY? The IRS? Nevin Shapiro?
Bitcoin
I also agree that baseball is outdated. Glad to see that there are kindred spirits up in here.
What would you do to make baseball "up-to-date"?
- The ball is attached to the field by an elastic tether, though powerful hits have been known to break it.
- A billboard just beyond the reach of the tether triggers an "automatic win," called a "grand slam blern," if the ball enters a small hole in the centre of a sign. Previous balls have been known to escape from Earth's atmosphere.
- It is like baseball, as in, there is a pitcher who throws the ball for a player to hit across the field to get a "home run".
- If enough balls go into a small hole in the center of the field, third ball lock, a pinball-style Multiball, is initiated. At this time dozens of balls are shot at high speeds into the field, (via hidden pitching machines that come out of the field) causing frenetic action.
- At the time of the multiball, the batter mounts a type of Tron-esque motorcycle and drifts over the bases, which; subsequently flash twice and explode. This may be the jazzed up version of a home run.
- Relief pitchers are conveyed from the bullpen to the pitcher's mound by means of a giant tarantula.
- Traditions of the game include aluminium bats and the 7th inning grope.
- Steroid injections are mandatory.
I can't actually claim credit for this, I pulled this from here:
http://theinfosphere.org/images/cache/5/53/Blernsball.html#Rules
And for those uninitiated:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Leela_of_Her_Own
Also, we're going to have to retire all the whole numbers and give all the players fractional numbers.
It appears you are looking for something like this...
I played way too much of this in the summer as a kid.
For those like me that still really enjoy baseball, I highly recommend the documentary "Fastball" on Netflix.
Three-years is a long time to hold a grudge over something like admiring a home run. I can just imagine Hunter Stickland lying in bed at night before he falls asleep saying the names of all those who have wronged him while he plots his revenge...... "The Hound, Cersei Lannister, Bryce Harper......"
...Pat Narduzzi
...Matt Ryan
Well baseball just got a bump.
I'm definitely going to hell for that
"A shot in the arm" as it were?