#Hokies to play Marshall in Huntington in 2023 and in Blacksburg in 2024. Could Tech be dumping ECU from those years' schedules? https://t.co/2OlO0flUNU— Mike Barber (@RTD_MikeBarber) November 26, 2018
Forums:
DISCLAIMER: Forum topics may not have been written or edited by The Key Play staff.
Comments
Hopefully there is a complex (secret) agreement in place that promises Marshall future games and a $500k check, in return for them tanking the game this weekend.
I'd imagine Marshall's tanking would look something like this.
If they did that just to fuck with FSU fans, I'd be all for it
Stupid
The shove or the dive? One could say the dive is indicative of UVA's usual football performance: Act tough but fall on your ass when it really gets tough.
If I recall, they didn't call a foul on that play, did they?
That was a serious flop.
Was still not the right thing to do.
The push. UVA will always be bitches. We don't need to stoop down to them
Here's our current non-conference slate for those years.
2023:
Home: ODU, Purdue
Away: Rutgers, ECU
2024
Home: ECU, Rutgers
Away: ODU, Wisconsin
So, we're either replacing ECU or Rutgers.
Rutgers? More like Buttgers, AMIRITE?
This joke will never not get an upvote/turkey leg from me.
Yea some of these OOC games are note really desirable: Rutgers, Maryland - the Big10 schools with the WORST fans. What about an Indiana or Iowa or someone new in the Big10 instead of those schools? Or hell, why not someone in the SEC: Tennessee, Vandy, USCe,?
ODU, Liberty, and ECU all fall in the same boat for me. Give me UNC Charlotte, Richmond, and App State instead.
Indiana is the lol of the B1G.
Tenn? No.
Was trying to think of B1G schools that would be 'beatable' year in and year out - other than the asshats from Maryland and Rutgers.
I think we're doing pretty decently with the Big Ten. We've already done Ohio State and half of a series with Purdue. Plus, we have Penn State coming up. We would have had Michigan, but they got scared and ran off. We might have Wisconsin if they ever stop changing the dates.
Why not pick the weaker teams that are close by? We still get the street cred of playing P5 teams.
That's probably more on the SEC teams. They like to load up as many home games as possible, and you can't do that with other P5 schools on your schedule. USCe already has to deal with Clemson on a yearly basis, so they probably aren't looking for any other good ACC teams to play until Clemson trends back down.
Rutgers can't have the worst fans because that requires Rutgers to have fans
Still more fans than UVA had at their spring game
Is it possible the scheduling of these games (Rutgers and Maryland) predates their moves to the B1G? Regardless of conference we had played these teams in the past and that seems to hold some weight.
We signed the contract with Rutgers in 2015 and Maryland in 2016 (per TSL and Google). Both those schools had already joined the B14G by then.
Maryland came from the ACC. We aren't in the habit of schedule our own conference mates as non-conference opponents.
Yeah, I remember that part but some of these games are scheduled WAY in advance so was wondering if it was left over from our last years in the Big East.
a.) Scheduling a game 25 years out is a bit excessive. Outside of the Notre Dame games that go through 2036, the latest game we have currently scheduled is 2031, which is 13 years from now (and was announced in the last year or so).
b.) Such a contract would have been voided as soon as we joined the ACC (for an actual example, look at Pitt who joined the ACC halfway through a home-and-home deal with us). There was no reason to think Maryland was leaving the conference when we joined.
I don't know... It seems like we scheduled ECU for the next two millennia back in 1990 or something.
We played them almost every year from 1987 - 2000, but the current ECU series started in 2007. Overall we are 15-7 against them and 7-3 (with one forfeit) from the current series.
Source
Would be nice to keep Rutgers...presence in North Jersey helps. We get some great players out of dirty Jersey.
Yeah, I don't see us dropping Rutgers. Makes no sense to have 3 G5 teams on the schedule in those years.
I think your Home and Away need to be reversed for 2024, unless we're playing RUT(S)gers and ECU away two years running. TSL has ECU/RUT(S)gers at home that year, with ODU/Wisconsin away.
Dammit, it's what I get for changing up the list halfway through. Fixed it.
And here I thought I was the only one who calls them that.
I hope we keep Rutgers. There are a lot of Hokies up this way and I'd love to have a game essentially in my backyard.
Jersey Hokies!!!!
darn tooting
Oof, 2023 is looking pretty weak.
From the linked article:
I like one of those sources better than the other.
I won't celebrate until I see them off our schedule permanently going forward.
We're still scheduled to play them every year from now until 2025, except for 2021. That's still 6 more games, which drops to 4 if those are canceled. Still 4 too many.
Another thing that bugs me. The ODU series. This year showed how stupid an idea it is to have them on the schedule every year, and yet here we are. ECU 2.0 with a team that already humiliated us on the national scene. 2019, 2022, 2023, 2024, 2025, 2026, 2027, 2028, and 2031. Yeah, I'm sure that's not setting ourselves up for the same frustrations all over again.
Oh, and look at that, @ Liberty in 2022. Yeah, no, want no part of that. Not only for visiting a place we have no business playing in, but helping out THAT program right now? Nah, hard pass.
I'm worried that these ECU games would get pushed into 2026-2027 (pushing other games) or into 2029-2030 (the first years we don't have four non-conference games scheduled).
FTFY.
ODU is going to become annoying, but I understand the thought process of wanting to make a presence in that area. Obviously, if that game becomes as (sadly) competitive as the ECU series was it's going to backfire on us.
Scheduling Liberty was shameful. That program should not be allowed to share a field with any P5 program, much less with the Hokies.
Yeah, but we didn't need to extend the original 2-and-1 deal with ODU by four extra games, and then four more games on top of that before the first was ever played.
This. A thousand times, this. Liberty had to schedule New Mexico State TWICE to fill a schedule. Virginia Tech should play no part if helping a program that pathetic live. I don't ever care to see them on the schedule again. I don't care if we never win by less than 60 each time we play them. I don't want to. It's a bad program, it's a worse school, and they're a blight on our schedule.
(no offense to anyone who went/goes to Liberty - I'm sure it's great, I just harbor some harsh feelings about the way they operate)
The way they operate?
I'm under the impression elaborating on that would violate the guidelines regarding politics and religion.
Plus, they employ Ian McCaw.
you don't even need to start on the religious stuff to have ample ammunition against them. For instance, they offer jobs to all graduates as a way to "help" them. What it really does is give them an ample pool of prospective employees who aren't worth a lot so they can artificially push down salaries across the board. Until I met liberty professors, I never knew that you could be a full time professor, and still need your spouse to work to raise a family of 4 despite the relatively low cost of living in Campbell County.
Or you can go into their online program and its inflated numbers for students. I know a guy in admissions and he straight up told me that anyone who has taken an online course ever from liberty is considered an active student because online students tend to be on and off again so they can get away with that fuzzy math. So you get crap like this:
Painfully accurate. I think those of us that live in Lynchburg can easily attest that the bottom dollar is all LU cares about. In their mind if that means hiring a guy who covered up rape, so be it.
Liberty went to Baylor and few years back and smacked them in the mouth. I don't take them lightly.
I'm hoping one day soon... VT football- we of the ACC with conference titles, record bowl appearances, the nations best fans, Enter Sandman, and football budget 4X that of ODU, etc. Is good enough on both sides of the ball, without needing 5th year seniors on the OL and in the defensive backfield or 5 star players all throughout the Offensive depth chart to beat mighty ODU easily every time we play them. That's my hope... is that somehow we can build the program to the level that the average VT team without Michael Vick at QB and Jason Worilds at DE can beat mighty ODU EVERY FUCKING TIME WE PLAY THEM.. and not worry about this damn series being on the schedule. Just beat them and move onto the next week. Most good P5 programs would do just that.
I 100% agree with you... but sometimes shit happens. Alabama was tied with Citadel at half this year. Michigan still gets shit on for losing to App State.
Kinda funny actually, there was a thread on r/cfb recently asking what people thought were the biggest upsets in college football history, and I scrolled through the whole thing and didn't see VT listed by anybody. And that game should be fresh in the minds. I was surprised, but I don't think this years' fiasco is going to have the lasting appeal to the neutral fan that Michigan-App St. did. Probably because we've proven that we're just not good since that loss and nobody cares about us anymore.
And to think, some folks (VT and UVA fans included) thought the ODU loss was worse than UVA's loss to UMBC.
I love Virginia Tech but realistically we're mid tier on the totem pole. Michigan is Michigan and some football commentators are questioning whether this season is a failure for Harbaugh...
I work with a Michigan alumni who likes to grumble about the fact that the Harbaugh is 0-4 against Ohio State and only 2-2 agains MSU.
It's funny. I looked at the schedule over the next 5 or so years and thought "damn we've got a shot to make some moves", while others have looked at it and gone "oh shit I want no part of ODU, ECU, and Liberty". If we can right the ship and develop these young guys, our conference schedule is nicely set up these next few seasons. The panic button is getting worn out on here these days.
I hate it when you make valid points but the reasons you stated above are exactly why I don't donate to get my season tickets. Not paying for those shitty games...
So the schedule should be a 1-AA team, 8 conference games, and 3 open dates?
They have to play someone and there's a high likelihood whoever they play will be annoying as hell. And no, they aren't going to schedule all P5 teams.
Rotate who we play. Stop with this 8-10 year scheduling agreements with clearly inferior teams from lesser conferences. We became their annual Super Bowl where they are able to gain enough intimate knowledge of us to quickly have the game at rivalry status where the playing field is leveled regardless of on field talent. We did this to ourselves against ECU and now we are setting ourselves up for the same against ODU. It's a stupid short term scheduling solution that brings long term headaches.
Bring back games against directional Michigan, Ohio, Florida A&M, USF, UCF (when they were bad) etc. We can accomplish the same kind of schedule while not playing the same exact team every year.
"We became their annual Super Bowl where they are able to gain enough intimate knowledge of us to quickly have the game at rivalry status where the playing field is leveled regardless of on field talent."
The last two games against ECU VT beat them so badly that ECU used a hurricane to get out of the game and get in this position. The losses have more to do with not taking these teams seriously than anything else. And no, ECU isn't a rivalry, no matter how much ECU fans claim it to be one.
The losses also had a lot to do with ECU stupidly firing Ruffin McNeill and bringing in one of the most under-qualified head coaches in football in Scotty Montgomery. That team in general has been an unmitigated disaster ever since that event. I have no doubt the scores would have at the very least been more competitive, if not close, had they not gone and volunteered as tribute like that.
Bingo. It's not that I am affraid we are playing ECU or ODU or Liberty, but propping up those programs, making it their annual "game" and playing them so much they learn our calls, schemes, etc. does nothing for VT except save us money- which sucks that we are in that position in the first place.
The Thundering Herd to replace the Plundering Turd! I like it!
That's just a sh*tty joke.
It's some funny shit though.
People in high places are still extremely unhappy with how this played out and with how much money was lost by VT and Blacksburg. There seems to be a push to end this series once and for all.
As there should be.
They should be. The rest of the country looks at us like we're stomping our feet over it because we weren't "concerned about the safety of the players" and all that bullshit but hey, Roanoke has flights to Orlando every day. Could just as easily have played the game then flown down there anyway instead of going there before our game. I'm sure our equipment guys could have even let them use our facilities to wash jerseys and such before they left. I guess I'm not saying anything that hasn't already been said here 1,000x.
TL:DR - FK ECU. Get them off the schedule.
Well... Yeah... I mean I think our average gate receipts for a game like ECU is around $4m-$5m and that's before parking and concessions. We had to refund all that, and then we still had to apparently make the $500k payment to ECU for having the game on the schedule. And now we're playing this game with less than half price tickets in a stadium that will likely be at most 3/4 full at its most optimistic prediction, while paying another school $300k to come.
For a school that isn't shy about telling us fans and donors how much money it doesn't have, this should leave our high ups royally pissed.
I don't know how to feel about bagging the ECU series.
This year was the first time the Hokies didn't play ECU in awhile, and the rails fell off.
It's possible that some small portion of the time/space continuum is kept in order by our scheduling of ECU in football for all eternity.
I'd like to think the rails fell off because ECU screwed us and threw us out of a rhythm which led to the ODU loss and the rest of the downhill...at least thats what I tell myself to make me feel better.
I know y'all don't want to hear it, but this season's woes were clearly caused by the lack of nooners.
More nooners can help a lot of peoples woes.
Sorry fam, Hokie Club won't get a dime from me until Liberty is taken off the schedule, Ian McCaw is fired as their AD or somehow McCaw is proven beyond a reasonable doubt to have no culpability in the Baylor situation.
I can't even be mad at this take.
I'm somewhat in agreements here, but my big issue is that we're playing them in their house. Can't seem to get over that.
Agreed, 100%. They are not worthy of hosting us.
However, tailgating on their "dry" campus should be fun! I wonder how long it will take to get kicked out?
I'm thinking that everybody has an arbitrary set of rules for their giving, but if someone is a fan, they should financially support their team.
Don't donate to Liberty, I get that. Don't donate to Virginia Tech because they don't do everything you want them too? Nah, it's a little to simplistic for me.
For me, VT is a cause worthy of support. They're the good guys. But let your conscience be your guide.
I realize I'm taking a reductionist stance. I don't want Virginia Tech to be in business with an individual who was at best ignorant to a rape culture or at worst an accessory to rape. I don't want Virginia Tech to be involved with a supposedly devoutly Christian university who hired McCaw and did it with an arrogant moral presumption. There are plenty of football reasons why we shouldn't do this (why help an upstart program in the middle of nowhere become an in-state rival is beyond me) but that pales in comparison to the moral implications.
Just because I'm unwilling to donate to the Hokie Club doesn't mean I don't love Virginia Tech and by extension the athletic programs. I still watch the games, I'm still an active member on this site and still support the program in other non-monetary ways. But I don't want our university to be in bed with a bunch of sanctimonious douchebags and this is my form of protest. I have no problem with others feeling differently than me.
If VT refused to play any football program that was associated with any individual who had at some point been accused of moral impropriety, they wouldn't be able to schedule any games. And if every athletic donor had that criterion for donations, there would be no football, for good or bad.
However, every person has to choose for themselves how to support their team. Time and money are both forms of support, and I know for a fact that you are a supporter of this team. So, as a fellow supporter, thanks for that, and Go Hokies!
I would be so damn happy if this was the first step in getting that whole shitty series dropped.
Looks like I'll still be not paying the Hokie Club until 2025.
The check is ready with a blank space in the number field, someone will have to find that quote of mine where I said how much I'd pay when this God forsaken series finally ends.
Though i do think I also added Liberty to this deal as well, so that might hold things up.
I'd also like to not play Wisconsin but I'm not going to hold that one over the administration's head.
I think Wisconsin's doing their best to help you out with that one.
We didn't play ECU this year, so you could do a one time donation...
Though we still paid them, so I can see the technical problem with that.
I'd also like to not play Wisconsin
Why?
I want to play them so badly. Great fans, sweet looking stadium and Madtown would be an epic place to go to an away game.
The fans I know who went to Wisconsin are the worst sh!t people I know.
This is the core reason that I don't want to play them. Secondarily, that they keep on pushing the series back. I think we were supposed to play them two decades before our currently scheduled matchup, no? I legit don't remember how many times this has been delayed because of them. Just cut our losses at this point and say to hell with em
I can't remember if it was just announced while I was in college, or originally scheduled to start while I was in college. At the rate we're going, my kids might be students by the time we play them. (My oldest is in Kindergarten.)
Seriously though, it is possible that the team that finally plays those games wasn't born when that contract was signed.
Because that's a really long ride in a trailer, maybe?
My dad went to wisconsin back in the early 80s so would be cool to play
Gritty sucks. Lets go Rangers.
Oh, and prerequisite lets stop playing ECU please post.
WHAT DID YOU SAY ABOUT GRITTY?
BREAKING GRITTY NEWS
With the firing of Ron Hextall, the Philadelphia Flyers are considering up-and-coming mascot Gritty their top choice for the open GM position.
can Gritty coach the team too please
This.
I also blame the rise of Gritty for a shitty Hokie Football Season. The timing is just too suspect.
We lost to ODU before Gritty was announced. The season was already a mess by the time we learned of Gritty's greatness.
Dropping ECU would be a damn dream come true.
Eh, I don't so much mind if we play them, I just don't want to play them EVERY YEAR.
Mix it up a little. I do think them cancelling our game this year bumps them down in terms of scheduling priority. The impression I have is that they didn't properly coordinate that, so I'd have no problem if our schedule of future games were, ahem, reviewed.
Maybe we can make a GoFundMe to cover the cancellation fee for Liberty
#GivingTuesday
Perhaps some of you can become our AD since it's clear you have a good grip on what scheduling should look like, who we should play based on ethics, and how season tickets should be allocated.
Scheduling is difficult. So is raising funds. Many of you won't donate to Tech because they are going to play Liberty a few times yet you will also complain when Tech can't get over the hump in recruiting etc. Makes a lot of sense. Would you also not want to play OSU since they knowingly employed a coach who beat his wife. Or Penn State since Franklin wasn't exactly supportive of the rape situation at Vanderbilt.
I applaud your hatred of those situations. However, My point is that you shouldn't punish our school and our student athletes because of people at other schools. Let's just plan to beat them badly when we do play these schools.
Crossing off the "Condescending 'why aren't you a ____ if you think you are so smart'" Bingo square.
Between knowing how to fundraise, call an offense, schedule, and recruit better than anyone at Tech, a TKP led football program would be a dynasty. We need to get them in contact with Whit so they can be brought on as "Quality Control" coaches.
Fair point but playing a game at Liberty is the stupidest thing in the history of stupid and and and and
An aberration is different from a trend. An incident is different from a culture. The only other situation in college football that's comparable to what happened at Baylor was Sandusky. If Tim Curley became the AD at ODU, I would want Tech to cancel their series with them as well. I don't think I would the feel the same way about any other ADs in the country.
Their current AD aside, the school is still a joke. Even if they fired their AD tomorrow, I still wouldn't want to play Liberty. They are a fake school who doesn't deserve to be on the same field as us. Anyone can get into Liberty and buy their degree; however, getting into and graduating from VT means something. I don't think we should lower ourselves to their level.
You could almost say the same for uncheat
I would say almost all of their programs are a joke, but they do have a decent nursing undergrad and grad school program. But other than those few programs that have to follow the strict accreditation guidelines set and continuously follow, they are a degree mill, and they don't even hide it.
My wife who just busted her ass for three years for a JD, passed the bar, and had full time employment at a law firm two days after graduation (contingent on bar passage, obv) would like a word.
I'm all about hating on Liberty, their president, their political chess game, their athletic department, and their online program. But there are plenty of people who bust their ass there just like at VT, UVA, JMU, ODU, etc. Obviously this is personal and I'm biased, but this kind of attitude about how people at LU buy their degrees is just as bad as when UVA loses and they turn around and say their grads make more money.
My fiancé (VT_Warthog's wife's best friend) also just got her JD from Liberty, recently passed the VA Bar Exam, and was employed right out of law school. She also worked her butt off and I couldn't be more proud of her. She takes pride in the education she received there and the opportunities the school allowed her to earn. She clerked in the United State's Attorney's Office in Washington D.C., beating out hundreds of applicants from 'prestigious' law schools all over the country. She received numerous academic scholarships so she could afford to go to law school in the first place. Liberty made that happen for her. Their "fake school" beat out George Mason and University of Richmond and tied with William & Mary in VA Bar Exam passage rates this year. (http://barexam.virginia.gov/bar/barstats.html)
I was born and raised in Lynchburg, VA and I've never been one to defend Liberty though I think they do an awful lot more good for the community than bad. I, like VT_Warthog, think it's an atrocity that they hired Ian McCaw as their AD. I can also understand why many dislike them for their adamant political stances. Additionally, I can definately see the case made for them being money-hungry with their online programs.
However, having first-hand seen the rigor and effort that my fiancé put forth while in school and the successes she's already had in her young career, I disagree with your claims. I am a proud Virginia Tech alum like many of you here, but I am ashamed that we would ever lower ourselves to making these assertions about other schools' degrees. It's really low. For one, their academic rigor has nothing to do with playing them in football and two, it's the type of arrogance that we despise many UVA fans/alumni for.
Well said.
For the most part, colleges use the same books, teach the same stuff from those books, test similarly.
Universities teach subjects and research methods, introduce you to people with similar goals, and test your ability to set an academic goal and achieve it.
Your points about the JD program are well received. My comments come from the recent grads that I've hired. Big schools, private schools, online schools, etc...I always thought they were all the same as long as you got your degree. But after hiring recent grads from varying places, I quickly learned my lesson. For most programs (JD and a few others are the exception), Liberty is a degree mill and unless I personally know the person, I probably won't hire another Liberty grad because of how poorly I've seen them perform. In addition to poor performance they are very entitled, do not want to listen to constructive criticism, and work poorly in team settings. My comments were not based on myths, but rather on first hand knowledge over the last 10 years.
I'll agree with you with regards to their online programs for sure.
I work with Tech grads who fit this description to a t. People like that come from every school. That's more a product of their character than their education. I'm not sure if you are hiring residential grads or online grads, but if you're hiring grads from their residential programs who are accredited then I don't know what to tell you. You don't offer shoddy degree mill programs with someone like the ABET board breathing down your neck.
Again, I don't always defend Liberty. Ask EPW, I'll take my shots at LU more often than not. But when you live and work in Lynchburg you see every angle of LU.
I hear you, but my partner lived in Lynchburg for 3 years before moving to Roanoke. I've seen more of Liberty than the average non- Lynchburg resident and I still stand by the fact that I would rather VT not ever play LU.
That being said, I still donate to the Hokie Club and will continue to do so. Our athletes need support to grow and should not be penalized for our AD's decisions about scheduling.
Glad your fiancee and VT_Warthog's wife have found success, but it sounds more like they are highly motivated students than Liberty having a great program. Liberty Law is consistently bottom quartile in rankings like USNWR. (aka "not ranked" status)
some non-anecdotal characteristics from ilrg.com 2017 rankings:
Liberty Law is #136 in Employed-at-Graduation rate out of 159 reporting schools.
Liberty Law is #170 in Employed-after-10mo rate out of 196 reporting schools.
Liberty Law is #190 in Bar Pass rate out of 196 reporting schools.
I respect the hell out of you for simply googling law school rankings but the numbers they show for LU aren't even close to being accurate.
With that being said I'm not going to get into a pissing argument on a public forum over my wife's education.
Welp, I'm glad our significant others weren't part of making any of those three rankings as low as they were in the article you Googled, especially considering they weren't even part of the 2017 class.
Thanks for digging those stats up from a year ago though; that really stayed inline with our points being made. Pretty sure I never said they had a great program, rather that she was happy with the education she received, was proud of her school, and is doing really well so far early in her career. My central focus was in regards to the fact that it's not a degree mill school (certainly not their law school), not that they have a "great program". However, since you brought it up we can look at the most recent results:
"Liberty University School of Law 2018 graduates posted the highest bar passage rate among first time test takers in school history, with 95.65 percent passing this year. The Liberty Law Class of 2018 took the bar in 15 jurisdictions, achieving a 100 percent pass rate in all but Virginia, where the rate was 88.24 percent. The national average for first-time Bar Exam takers from American Bar Association (ABA) accredited law schools in 2017 was 75 percent. The number that same year was 59 percent overall, 64 percent among all ABA accredited law school graduates." (Link: http://www.liberty.edu/news/index.cfm?PID=18495&MID=295372).
These numbers are even skewed because LU has a much smaller law school than many others. All of two people failed the Bar Exam from their entire 2018 class, both taking the VA Bar, which is why it was 88.24%. Another fun fact is that in the last five years, the school has twice scored higher than none other than LOLUVA in overall Bar passage rates. They've consistently been right up there with the best law schools in the state as highlighted from my OP about who they beat out this year.
Apologies if this was abrasive, but I don't know why you felt the need to butt in and cobble together a few stats from a year ago to bash their law school. I felt obliged to reply. Again, go at their AD, football program, and various stances all you want, but stay out of bashing an in-state school's academic reputation that you probably know little about.