That was terrible. I don't know what else to say... It was just so terrible.
Hug here, but keep it constructive.
We lost to Boston College
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Any arguments as to why Logan should still be playing at this point? The mistakes he makes aren't just inexperienced players around him anymore. They're inexcusable, head-scratching, impossible decisions, that a pee-wee football player would make.
2/4 turnovers were his fault. Yeah he lost us this game, yeah he plays bad. But when he is good, there is almost no one better. The taste in my mouth when I say the following is bitter is bitter can be: Logan still presents the best chance to win. 8 turnovers is 2 games, a -4 differential and 4 turnovers in ONE half of football where we give up 17 points is inexcusable. This team is just sloppy, undisciplined, and out of control. If they were presented a win on a silver platter, they would drop that too.
Agreed, I only really blame 2 TO's on LT (although that pick six was inexcusable). Byrn getting hurt didn't help, Meyer definitely didn't step up for him. He's not getting much help, but he still played poorly. Plenty of blame to go around.
The only one where I think Logan wasn't at fault was the Knowles-batted int. Although one could say that if it was closer to the body of the receiver it may not have been batted up at all.
The pick six made me scream. One of the worst decisions I've seen Logan make.
It's football turnover happen. No one expects anyone to never make a turnover. That's like saying you're never going to strike out in baseball. Never gonna happen. To me you can excuse some turn overs like a tipped pass or being sacked from behind when those are the only ones. But if you are making dumb decisions ON TOP OF those that aren't necessarily your fault is when it becomes a problem. It's like a mandatory class that you are allowed one skip. If you skip it for personal reasons non legitimate reasons, when you have a legitimate one it doesn't matter you used up your skip already and you now have to deal with the consequences. Everyone makes errors. The point is on to make dumb ones on top of those that may be out of your control. And I am not trying to argue or disagree with you. I am just so upset right now, I have no idea if I am agreeing or disagreeing with you. Mostly just venting.
And by a "good game" you mean a no turnover game
The problem is that he is only good about 30% of the games. He's a terrible quarterback. It's time for everyone to accept that. Stop making excuses for him
He was a great QB when we had NFL talent around him now that we have high school talent surrounding him he is an awful QB. He know that he's the only player on offense with any talent so he presses and tries to do too much. For the record I'm not defending him, I'm glad this is his last year.
So the lack of talent around him is why Logan decided to loft a pass up for grabs in the middle of the field when the game was tied?
By all accounts, Logan Thomas the human being is a hard worker and a good kid. Logan Thomas the QB is infuriating and continues to make mistakes that a 5th year senior who has started 30+ games shouldn't make.
2/4? I count both fumbles and the pick 6 100% against him.
The first fumble was McLaughlin's fault. Can't blame a QB for fumbling when a DE hits him from the blind-side, that's the Tackle's fault.
Logan felt pressure and probably should have realized he was out of time and had to just eat that, but the line didn't help him on that play. He could have prevented it but it's not entirely his fault.
Yea, maybe to a degree. I didn't time it, but I don't remember the time being that long. Logan was in his 2nd or 3rd progression, but McLaughlin was straight beat on a speed rush. I would still put at least 90% of the blame on McLaughlin.
Agreed. See what Leal can do. If Leal turns the ball over one less time than Logan per game we have a shot at winning.
After this what have we got to lose, put Leal in. Realistically, we keep playing like this and we lose to Md, Mia, and Yikes UVA. Might as well get ready for next season. And no we can't win against fl.st even if we somehow make it to the ACCCG.
Going to the ACC CG would be hilariously awful on many levels. My hopes for this year are as follows:
1. Win 8 regular-season games (I still see MD and UVA as winnable)
2. Go to a mediocre bowl and don't get embarrassed
3. Rebuild for another rebuilding year and mark my calendar for 2015
This is more doom and gloom than I will usually post, but it's just sad and embarrassing right now.
It is pretty ridiculous that if we won out however unlikely, we still would win the division barring a incredible late season surge from GT, Duke, or Pitt.
you're assuming that Miami loses to FSU (a reasonable assumption) and that Duke loses to Miami (also a reasonable assumption) but we don't technically control our own destiny. If we win out we have a chance to win the division, but it's not guaranteed. We need help at this point.
I actually tried to make sure that my comment clearly implied what you are saying by avoiding saying that "we control our destiny" as well the qualifier at the end. Guess it didn't work lol
Why would we need Duke to lose to Miami? Not sure that's the case... But regardless let's focus on one game at a time and not worry about the ACCCG right now.
Without a Duke loss, the Circle of Chaos ensues. We beat GT, GT beat Duke, Duke beat us, and if we hypothetically beat Miami, all of those four teams have two losses. If Duke loses, we have clear tiebreakers over GT and Miami. Without a Duke loss, well...I'm not going to think that hard.
Dudes...Logan really isn't very good. He is frustrating as hell because he shows us the occasional glimpse of badassedness, but then always followed up with a shot of piss vinegar. Like it or not, this is the team that we have been for the last few years, it's the team that we are this year, and it's the team that we will be until Logan Thomas is floating around the NFL somewhere.
Unfortunately, I have accepted it. Can you??
Agreed! Logan is not a quarter back, he is an athlete that the coaches have been trying to turn into a quarter back.He has been pushed into a position with the dream of having a Cam Newton , they have hurt him and will not admit it, that is why no matter how bad he plays they have to back him to cover there mistake. They will place the blame on the running backs, receivers and offensive line, no matter how much they try to cover their mistakes the bottom line is, if your players are not producing than the coaches are not doing their job. Leal should have been given an opportunity last year to gain experience and confidence. What makes Logan so special that he can make mistakes and is never pulled from a game . When the coaches say in their interviews "if your making consistent mental errors we will evaluate the players position". I have watched Tech football for years and I see a decline in the program.
This isn't all on the offense. I know that the turnovers set up good field position for BC, but our defense didn't get any turnovers this game and gave up a huge run to Williams to give them a two TD lead late. If that isn't given up, we might still be playing.
1 mistake by the defense...4 (at least) for Logan...I think I give the defense a pass. They were not the main contributors to this loss.
There were several mistakes by the defense. Exum gave up several plays. I'm not flaming him, but he is NOT the same player as before the injury. The touchdown he gave up in the flat and the high lob pass likely both would've been Facyson picks. One of them (flat) probably would've been housed, as he only had to beat Rettig. I know on the lob that Exum got shoved to the ground, but he still should have been able to close on that ball and at least deflect it. He just doesn't have the speed.
I was surprised we didn't see more of Brandon...Exum just looks average.
The defense didn't get any turnovers? Did you pay attention? BC basically dared us to beat them with our offense. Rettig threw the ball 14 times the whole game. They kept the ball on the grounds in safe hands the whole time to avoid turnovers.
Their gameplan was to keep their turnovers to a minimum and make us beat them on offense, which we can't do to anyone. Their play was pretty ingenious and respectable.
I did pay attention, thank you. On about 5 of those 14 pass plays, there was a chance for an interception. Were you paying attention?
He had 3 incomplete passes. How does he have 5 possible interceptions? The sheer fact that the ball was even remotely caught gives advantage to the offense. There was one should have been interception that game and Exum couldn't hold on to it. There were a couple of "if the dback was two steps forward then he would of had it." but those shouldn't count towards the defenses score card. Their job isn't to bail the offense out time and time again, but to give them extra opportunities. Today the offense shot the defense in the foot.
The point is the defense didn't get any turnovers and they had opportunities. I think the "one or two more steps" should count because those are opportunities for quick change in momentum.
Here's the problem with this game, it wasn't a game in which there were no turnovers and one would of made the difference. We gave up four possessions to their zero. The defense didn't get anything because BC wasn't going to let us. They scored 10 points off of less than 30 yards of offense in the third quarter. That means the offense basically gave them that many points. You can blame whoever you want for this loss, but it comes down to that we're not that good of a team this year and might not be next year until the ship is righted. Get over it, we're still better than half the teams in major CFB.
I never said we were a good team and I'm not blaming the whole loss on the defense or Logan. It's a team game and every team member had a part in the loss. Some more than others, but everyone is responsible for it.
The good: Edmunds, Stanford, Journell (!!!)
The bad: Too. Many. Turnovers. And penalties, and head scratching play calls. The defense looked meh. I can't defend Logan Thomas any longer. He played really well at some points today, but extremely bad way too much.
You have to list the OL as bad. BC was down two starting DL men and they still man handled the OL. I thought the run game would finally open up.
Thomas is a good qb but he is still learning the mental part of the position. If he had the mental part down he would be a great qb.
Yeah he made some absolutely terrific throws, but he is always liable to lose the ball. And without any other play makers on offense bad turnovers kill us.
Turnovers by anyone on the offense will hurt this team. The offense is just not strong enough to overcome any turnovers.
I know Thomas is a competitor bit I hope he works on these mental mistakes. He relies on his physical abilities too much.
I am ready to hear another week of Logan apologists.
But...but...but. Drops? Bad routes? Bad Coaching? Whitfield? The tides? The uniform combos? Illuminati?
It's not his fault he threw across his body, off his back foot into triple coverage. It's not his fault he was carrying the football with one hand away from his body in the middle of the whole BC defense with the game on the line.
Cody thanks for keeping us in the game with your monster field goals. I am ready to move on with Logan. I am impressed with the beating that you take week in and week out but tired of the complete lack of discipline and awareness at some points.
Lack of discipline is what stood out the most to me: penalties, the unnecessary block in the back, the touchback that could have been downed inside the two, players taking off plays. The blame falls on Beamer, who's been tolerating these mistakes for a few years now. He's got the the longest leash in college football, so I don't see him getting forced out, but he needs to figure out how to bring the program back to the fundamentals that made it so successful in the first place.
I only hope that I can live long enough to see VT play an entire game without being called for a blocking-in-the-back penalty on a kick return.
I'm done making excuses for Logan. Done.
2015 can't come soon enough.
I don't know where to start. Well i still can't believe that Journell hit that FG. The run game was bad as always. People also seem to forget that Thomas first year we still had a good running game as well as great recievers. Our D played good but gave up too many big plays at costly times. Thomas can be held accountable for the pick 6 and fumbletoo many costly mistakes. Still a disappointing gamedo I think we are this badno but i do think we keep making mistakes that can be prevented but oh well we will still have a shot at winning the next couple weeks.
Free Mark Leal.
To a good home?
I just don't even know...
I am sitting in a dark room right now repeatedly saying fuck...over and over again...why do you do this to us Hokies, why? With that said, I am planning my food spread for the game next week.
I would love to talk about how we can still win our division and play in the ACC Championship Game (win out and we're in; as long as Duke loses one more game), BUT do we actually think that we'll beat Miami/Maryland/UVA after the last two weeks? Especially when we keep the same strategy, get the same results (turnovers and bad decisions), continue to lose, and STILL say that is our best option? (Rhetorical question) A player that has eight turnovers in the last two weeks is currently our best option? Hopefully the team will magically recreate itself over the next week.
Perfectly said! Saying that Logan is your best option is a sad statement and poor coaching. Logan is not superman and cannot win a game on his own. When the coaches say that he is the best option, than the coaches are saying they have no confidence in other players ,ultimately they are admitting that they are poor coaches. If you listen long enough to the rhetoric you can read between the lines.
4 turnovers = no way we get out with a win
WAY too many mistakes today, this is getting ridiculous.
At least we didn't miss any FGs?....
I'm not a fan of the reworked defensive starters. Bring back what was working. Although is rather go to Nashville for a bowl game than El Paso anyway.
At what point do we start looking at "management" for the misfortunes of this team. There are obviously gaping game day holes that our staff are missing or asking a team to do that ultimately that can not provide. I am not calling for heads, just asking when will the staff start to make changes that are obvious to the non-professional arm chair QB. And I am not throwing all this blame on LT, he indeed has a huge amount to carry for this, but there are just obvious holes elsewhere we keep trying to go down with no luck...
Not for a while yet. We are primarily suffering from a lack of talent. Our QB, while an imposing physical specimen, is erratic with his passes and makes terrible decisions on where to go to the ball.
Our primary RB, albeit young and athletically talented, doesn't seem to have good field vision and is prone to tripping over his own feet.
Our WRs drop too many passes.
Our TE, while he will be very good in time, is simply not strong enough yet to be a reliable blocker in the running game.
Finally, we have an OL that is simply too inconsistent in the running game.
Put all that together, and you have an offense that's ranked in the 100's.
It likely won't get better until the skill level gets better.
Hokiestud, you are on point with your comments! Completely agree. But does our lack of talent, our RB that trips over his own feet (which is sad because it has been very evident the last two games), and all the other very pertinent points not show an inconsistent and almost ill-coached effort from "top management'?
I think we have freshmen and red-shirt freshmen playing and contributing much more than we ever have, which to your point will only grow as the skill level gets better. But as the skill level gets better do we not fall back in to the same trap of masking our inefficiencies as a staff?
I think it's more a case of insufficient recruiting and player development by the previous offensive staff. In retrospect, it's pretty obvious that Frank Beamer waited too long to make the coaching changes that he finally made. We're now paying the price for those shortcomings, and we probably will next year as well. I wouldn't expect any significant offensive improvement until 2015 at the earliest.
But I like the new coaches that we're brought on board and I think that they're probably getting as much out of what they've been given to work with as could reasonably be expected. I think the future will be better.
I won't speak to the whole post, but on the OL: we seem to not have had a decent one for some time now. And that's included years where the OL is largely Junior/Senior based. Again, at what point do say: talent or not, the coaches aren't getting the most out of it?
I guess I'm the only one, but I didn't think Logan played that bad. Up until the second interception, he was putting together a nice game with just one INT that wasn't his fault. The second interception was about as bad as it gets. My biggest frustration is the fact we are putting everything on Thomas's shoulders and WE DON'T HAVE TO!!! Trey Edmunds got six carries today. That is the worst stat of the game, in my opinion.
You win smartest comment of the day. I liked the incorporation of screens to Trey, but he should get a ton more carries.
I thought logan played a pretty good game but once his INT came, it was like a switch went off and flipped back to 2012 logan. But, I will give him credit, he came back towards the end there. I think the issue with the run game is the line can't block well. I don't know what Loeffler is thinking, but he saw what we saw: 5 or 6 BC players in the box and he still chose not to run the ball forcibly up the middle like Stiney would have, and there is probably a reason for that.
The absolute back-breaker was the INT that he threw that was returned for a TD. He was running for his life and instead of simply sailing the ball out of bounds and trusting his defense to get the ball back for him, he lofted a wounded duck to the middle of the field off his back foot.
It was an unfathomably boneheaded decision, something I wouldn't expect from a true freshman QB, let alone a 5th year senior.
Yeah, agree there on edmunds. But damn LT is having a "what the f**k were you thinking" play every game.
Why do we have so little faith in Edmunds?
I don't know about anyone else, but I'm still high on him after his 3 TDs (including the one that Wang screwed us out of).
Williams had 33 carries. Our TBs had 9....9!!!
That BC O-line took care of business though. Looked like a lot of smart tough blocking going on with their runs.
They are Stanford east with the smash mouth running, but just without all the wins.
does anyone else realize that today was Logan's career high in passing yards? 391 yards. correct me if I'm wrong
You are right.
And the most since Bryan Randall threw for 504 against Cuse.
Yup. Lost that game too.
While I agree with you, especially with the lack of Edmunds in the game-plan, the 2nd INT was completely inexcusable. VT cannot overcome easy TDs on returns while the defense sits on the sidelines. The offense isn't good enough.
I am not saying Logan is the sole reason for the loss, because he's the reason VT scored 27 pts. Blame also sits on Knowles (INT lead to BC TD), McLaughlin (fumble led to BC FG), Jarrett (missed diving tackle for BC's 1st TD), Exum (fell on easy INT attempt), Wang (called for holding on a VT TD), Meyer (huge drops on 3rd and 4th downs), amongst others. And I'm not sure who was at fault for the 62 yd TD, maybe bad defensive design, but that was also a huge play at a critical moment. However, Logan's Pick6 was easily the worst play of the game, which, unfortunately for Logan, negates so many of the positives of the game.
I'm with you. LT is what he is. Good and bad. I'm not sold on going to Leal for a variety of reasons (even if it were my decision). More importantly I think it is up to Loeffler to manage the game differently given what we have. and what LT is. He has to try to establish the running game some way or another. Manage the game to minimize LT's turnovers. Pass only 20-25 times and get Edmunds going. .. even if only at 3 yards a carry. Essentially what BC did yesterday and count on our D to win it.
Logan can be good, but he is too wildly inconsistent as a quarterback to be any good at quarterbacking. He will not play qb at the next level. There is no doubt about that unless everything magically clicks in his head. He's so awful mentally - there are just so many bad decisions that he makes that even inexperienced quarterbacks know not to make. And all of those decisions are made 2 seconds too slow. I think we need to start playing Leal more, he deserves a shot after sticking around for 4 years as a backup. I just feel sorry for the guy, because I bet he is one of the most frustrated players on the team watching all of these mistakes and not having a chance to do anything about it.
This was bad. All around bad. The full nine yards of bad. We can't keep Logan in if it seems like he's hurt. When he's banged up in a game he just kinda loses his mind. Unless he's playing Georgia Tech all hopped up on pain meds.
We also need to go to our clutch players in clutch situations. Trey Edmonds had a game. Josh Stanford had a game. Why didn't we turn to them in clutch situations?
It's taking everything for me to not lose my shit and not rip Logan Thomas and Charlie "rock monster hands" Meyer. But I won't. I'm gonna keep it 100.
Josh Stanford, guys. Joshua motherfucking Stanford is the truth. He'll take this team far with a better quarterback in Andrew Ford/Bucky Hodges. I'm excited for the future, guys.
That's as positive as I get. Now to decimate my liver. Wish me luck.
Good luck
It's pretty simple. Don't turnover the ball and we'll beat these mediocre to alright teams yet Logan keeps taking these insane risks and the insistence on running the read/option rather than the power run is asinine.
We shouldn't rush to judgement with Lefty and he should be given a fair shot considering the terrible state the offense was in before in addition to the lack of talent on that side of the ball. BUT if Georgia has another bad season next year (or even finishes terrible) and Mark Richt is let go then wouldn't you want us to do everything we could to get Mike Bobo? He was the preferred choice to Lefty to begin with. In a perfect world Lefty would be shifted to just QB coach.
On a positive note, BIG congratulations to Cody Journell. Hope it finally clicked for him.
That's it in a nutshell. It's hard to beat any team when you turn the ball over four times.
Totally agree re: Loeffler. He made some strange calls last week vs. Duke, but I thought he called a decent game against BC today.
He simply doesn't have a whole lot to work with this year.
I'm laid up with the flu and missed most of the game.
I must be having fever-induced hallucinations because I think I just saw that Tech lost to BC?
it is easier to miss the game by wrecking a car. that's what i did for Duke. Flu seems a bit over the top
I would like to wish everyone well tonight...alcoholic beverage producers all across the land will see a huge uptick in sales and consumption for the Virginia Tech Football Fan demographic tonight
Bull and Bones get ready, I'm coming for you!
one comment I would like to make, is that we really really really should not boo LT on senior night, not only is it kinda disrespectful but it sends a really bad message to recruits. I hope our fan base has enough sense not to boo even if people think he may deserve it we need to stay positive and support our team even through the darkest days...hang in there guys there is a light at the end of the tunnel I know its hard trust me I'm not pleased with this game either but we've got to hang in there, good things will come!
I absolutely agree..booing Logan on Senior Night would be despicable. No matter the results, he still laid his ass on the line for this team and for this University. That is why each player is applauded on Senior Night, instead of only the ones that produced on the field.
Anyone who boos a fellow Hokie, especially on Senior Day (let's be honest, it's not going to be a night game), does not deserve their space in Lane Stadium. Be frustrated if you want. But above all, be classy and realize that if your (generic: aimed at hypothetical bad fans in the stadium, not anyone here necessarily) snarky asses were on that field, you'd be broken in eight pieces and praying for death.
Love that part at the end.
glad you agree, I just hope hokie nation agrees too this guy needs to go out with a win and some loud cheers not jeers at lane our fan base needs to take a deep breath and relax, this is not the first time we've been in this situation
There's a simple solution to alleviate the booing...WIN THE MOTHERF-KING DAMN GAME!!! That being said, show respect on Sr night.
Logan makes great plays; there is no disputing that. He had almost 400 yards of passing and stood in the pocket strong many times. He has been asked to lead this team and to carry this horrible offense. However, his risky/poor decisions are SO detrimental to the team. That is what the issue is. What good would it be if he passed for 800 yards and had 6 touchdowns, if he still throws 7 interceptions. The point is that the outcome of his bad decisions greatly outweigh the results from his great plays. Let's put LT at TE/Receiver (he would be the best TE in the conference) and go to the ACC Championship Game. That would be best for Logan; best for the team.
Trent Dillfer won a Super Bowl.
He's not going to be moved to TE this late in his career. For good or ill, he will be our QB for the remainder of this season.
I agree that this will not happen, nor do I think we would be better if he was moved to TE. But, even though I can't name anyone specifically, we've seen in college football times where players are moved because the back up is better (which is not this situation), leading to a player switching positions. In some cases, the player thrives at the new position. I guess one pseudo-example of this was FSU's Williams, who left spring practice as the starting safety and played RB last night. He looked great with the ball in his hands.
You know it was a bad day when Cody Journell was Bill and Mike's player of the game....
I just can't believe I rushed home from New York to catch the end of.... THAT....
Logan Thomas does one thing well -- he finds was to lose ..
He's also found incredible ways to win.
He's found ways to win before too, some fans just tend to forget that and bail on a player (and a team, judging from most posts today) when they're not doing well. This team isn't playing like they were before the bye week, Logan isn't the only one struggling.
I feel really badly for LT. He's a very gifted athlete and he spent 4 years with a coaching staff that set him up for failure. Loeffler and Co are trying to help him but they haven't had enough time to work with him and get him to a place where he can be really competitive. Wasted talent if you ask me. That being said, this is a rebuilding year for us. We all knew that before the season started. The 6-2 start came as a pleasant surprise but realistically we knew this wouldn't be a 10 win season. We've won some tough games and lost some tough games. That's just how it happens sometimes. This is a disappointing loss for sure, just like last year, but we're overreacting to a degree.
Just show up, root for your team to win and hope for the best. When they don't win don't spend time trashing players/coaches. Next year should be better, and the year after that should be better still. I think that bringing Loeffler in was the right decision by Beamer, even if it came a little later than we would have liked, and I think we'll be trending in the right direction next year, but it's going to take time.
Go Hokies!
Beat da U
probably my favorite post of the day. Don't give up on a player, on the team--just hang in there...some years are harder than others.
I don't think this was supposed to be a rebuilding year. We have lots of seniors on defense and a redshirt senior quarterback.
If anything, next year will be a rebuilding year with a younger defense and a first year quarterback.
Given how many freshmen and walk-ons are starting for our O, and the addition of three new coaches on the offensive side of the ball, that spells rebuilding for me, too.
Yes, rebuilding year is upon us, especially since we lost to duke. The future will require shades, however.
I don't disagree, but how long had we gone with a stud D and a pedestrian O? In my book, this year was a return to normalcy, and with Logan, JC, Knowles, Coles, and some offensive line experience, I expected to have a better year this year.
It already looks like we've had an equivalent year, but I'm still waiting for wins 7 and 8. We get to 8, then the year turned out like I expected
We hired an all new offensive staff to replace a severely defective one and we're starting anywhere from 4-6 freshman on offense. Anyone who thinks this is not a rebuilding year is fooling themselves. Yes, it blows we are wasting this defense this year, but if you haven't noticed, Logan IS our offense, which is why when he makes mistakes it is much more detrimental than if he had RMFW to hand off to.
Man.....I hope the person who down voted this finds the results for a positive crab lice test in their wife's pocketbook.
THIS is absolutely f-king hilarious!
I would suggest to that person to convince his wife to wax. Seriously, it's not the 70s anymore.
Aw man, y'all are killing it right now!
Here's one thing to remember people. We have a really good defense but a pretty bad offense. Not only was the offense badly recruited, but it was badly coached for 3 years. We are an average team, we knew that during the summer. We're 6-3 with 2 winnable games and a bowl game left. This was not supposed to be our year to be great, it was supposed to be our year to fix the problems and rebuild. That's what we're doing, and we got our hopes up too much a couple weeks ago and now reality is smacking us in the face.
Expectations for this team were much reasonable before the season started. After reeling off a few wins we let them get out of hand and now we're being grounded again.
Someone posted game by game drive charts on Reddit. Interesting to see how we looked between the W's and L's. Missed FG's stick out a lot even in the wins. LINK
That's nicely done. The Alabama game looks really sparse
I'm really struggling to keep my thoughts together without letting emotions cloud my thinking, but here goes:
1) To ask the offense to overcome 4 mistakes by Logan is almost impossible to overcome. That pick-six, though, was entirely on Logan. Charley Meyer clearly had rust and had to step in for an injured Bryn. Lot of experts have said that was a dumb decision Logan and film will validate that.
2) The playcalling, especially the read play, is frustrating because it was going nowhere. Trey Edmunds had two touchdown receptions, one being negated by a Wang's hold, off a running back screen. Why didn't Loeffler call it is more the issue, IMO. I think French got to be banging his head in the restaurant because there has been so little run from under the center.
3) The defense had a bad game as well. They had a hell of a time controlling the line of scrimmage, two back to back offside calls, and the Boston College's offensive line did a phenomenal job of splitting the DL wide or sucking them in all game long. I think Andre Williams' last touchdown run was just a back breaker.
4) Cody Journell clearly snapped out of his funk by nailing a 56-yarder and then a 47-yarder. Of course, the reaction would be, "Where was that LAST WEEK!?" I digress.
5) I love Joshua Stanford. I think he has quietly put together a rather solid season and hope he continues to blossom before our eyes.
6) I am NOT going to call for Logan to be pulled. It's not going to happen, people. If you want to try, go right ahead, but it ain't gonna happen. If Logan walked into Beamer's office tomorrow and told him he was done quarterbacking and wants to work out as a tight end, I'll support that, until then, I'm going to continue to support LT3 because he is the ultimate team player and was asked to be the leader.
IMHO, the single best thing about Logan Thomas' career coming to a close is that next year, the read option will hopefully be either removed from the playbook entirely or dialed back considerably. (I'd strongly prefer the former.)
French has opined here in the past that it's not the kind of offense that Scot Loeffler prefers to run and that the only reason he's leaning so heavily on it this year is that, due to personnel limitations, he thinks it gives us our best chance of moving the ball on the ground. I sincerely hope that he's right and that next year, when we hopefully have some better RBs (Marshawn Williams, DJ Reid, maybe Shai McKenzie) as well as a QB who's not 6'6", 250+, we'll see a more traditional running game.
I don't have anything against the read option per se, but we simply don't run it all that well with Thomas
Yeah, that's what French was talking about in his "Seduction of the Inverted Veer." What is happening is the defense around the conference are duplicating what ECU have done and that is to ignore the fake and focus on solely on Thomas.
However, there were a few instances where Thomas made the correct read and the defense overreacted to the keeper.
As for the next incoming class, it is going to be a rebuilding project from ground up. The defense will lose the majority of starters and the offense will have to decide on who will quarterback them. I am still not entirely convinced that Leal will be the shoo-in starter, but that's a whole another topic for another day.
As for running traditional run play, I would love to see the return of the Power I, but the question is, do we have the personnel to pull it off? That's something to consider.
OMFG The shotgun on the 1 yard line where Edmunds had to run about 8 yards to get into the endzone. Then next play we decide to shotgun "sneak". This shouldn't happen. I'm no coach but roll with Big I and bang it in with a fullback leading the way. Used to see it a billion times a game even with Stiney.
That was the strangest thing. I wish Loeffler had used that goal line "jumbo" package he used in UNC's game. I think what Loeffler was trying to do is force BC to overreact to the read play, but in reality, it was just a good execution by the offensive line to keep driving.
The next red zone play where Thomas almost lost the ball was a strange call.
I'm guessing that was supposed to be a QB sneak and LT simply dropped the exchange.
4:20 pm full on drunk thoughts: (see game thread for half drunk thoughts)
1) I'm not going to even comment on the QB play. We've beat this horse to death (sorry Horse). Love it, hate it, accept it, deal with it? What ever your view, Logan will graduate at the end of the season. Don't become a shitty Hokie fan in the mean time.
2) A New Hope: So I've said it and I will say it again, I don't like Cody as a person. But damn! And I feel like a tool for saying this for the first time after his big game, but Josh5 has great potential.
3) The Empire Strikes Back: I've got to give props to BC. They run a Harbaugh, Stanford, 49er offence with many TEs. It was slow yet effective. They are doing good stuff up there.
4) Return of the Jedi: I invite you to a. sober up and give it 24 hours to cool down, and b. Return (get it? Return) to any of your preseason posts, thoughts, and comments about where we might be on offence. We thought the line was a disaster, no receivers, lost Ryan at TE, running back questions. We are seeing the team we expected to see. We MUST have patience and trust in the new staff. I'm not a recruiting guy, but let's give them time to get playmakers before we freak out and scream for everyone's head. Frank made changes last year. Let's give it time to work. Constant change will not help.
That is what we need to keep in mind.
Yeah, I'm disappointed.
But, we are what we are.
I think our kids play hard....it's not a lack of effort.
To me, not trying is inexcusable.
But trying hard and getting beat is part of it.
So, we strap it on and try it again next week.
I thought, before Duke, if we can make it 1/2 with Duke/BC, then 1/2 with Miami/Maryland, and of course beat uva, I am more than satisfied.
I'll have to revise that a bit now.
But getting too down at this point does nothing.
We just have to play to win 'cause there's nothing to lose except pride at this point.
To me pride is way more important than any cup or bowl.
I am excited that we can still win the Coastal! Not what we were hoping for this season, but what can you do? As long as we beat UVA, this season isn't a loss in my books.
How come nobody is blaming the unis?!!!
Blaming
Bottom line: We simply need better players on offense.
We lost this game because of four turnovers.
On the 1st turnover, a better WR catches that ball cleanly and turns it up the field for another 5-10 yards rather than batting it into the air where it can be intercepted.
On the 2nd turnover, a better QB doesn't hold on to the ball too long so that it can be stripped from behind.
On the 3rd turnover, a better QB doesn't lob the ball into the middle of the field while throwing off his back foot under pressure so that it can be easily intercepted and returned for a TD. Instead, he chucks it out of bounds, preserves the tie, and trusts his defense to hold.
On the 4th turnover, a better QB holds the ball high and tight against his body so that it can't be stripped away when he's being tackled.
Aside from the four turnovers, we had at least three dropped passes by receivers, overthrows of open receivers by our QB, RBs who often tripped over their own feet, and linemen who got called multiple times for holding.
We simply need an infusion of better talent on offense. I think it's on the way, plus freshmen like Calvin Kline can get better as they get more experience. But the biggest single improvement we need is at QB.
Don't get me wrong. I love Logan Thomas. He's a great kid, he works his tail off, and he wants to succeed very badly. Sometimes, he can be very, very good. I hope that with a better surrounding cast in the NFL, he can have a successful career and make millions of dollars. But the bottom line for VT is that he misses too many open receivers due to inaccurate throws and he makes too many bad decisions. He's a lot like Matt Schaub down here in Houston. 95% of the time, he's fine. But he makes a handful of mistakes in each game that just absolutely kill you.
I know it's not our style as a program, but I was still surprised that Kendall Fuller was the first 5* since Tyrod Taylor. The state of Virginia produces enough big talent that we should be able to grab some of these guys.
There are only about 20 or so 5* players in the country every year. This 2014 Virginia class with three 5* guys is extremely unusual. Although Virginia does produce a good amount of 4 and 3 star players annually.
A fair percentage of the 4-star kids that we sign would be rated at 5 stars if they were from the deep south and had publicly committed to an SEC program.
I agree Logan is a good kid. Trying to win games with what he's got on offense, but his stock is going down with NFL scouts the way hspis decision making has been the past two years. Can blame that ona combination of new OC, QB coaches, questionable receivers and no run game. But if he has time in the pocket he still isn't going through progessions as he should after starting the last three years. He's actually gone downhill. Of course with his size maybe a team would pick him up as a 3rd string or backup and work with him or move him to a TE. Hell who knows. I just wish him the best of luck the rest of the year and hope he comes around and wins a few more games. Only time will tell.
Not going to defend the Senior leader... Can't wait for this season to end we have such promise with Ford or Bucky. Logan cost us 17 points today & that's it. If this happened anywhere else someone else would start. At this point if it's Leal's team next year give him the reps. I just can't defend Logan anymore. Experiment = Epic Fail. Here's hoping for next year!
We just don't have the horses this year.
We used to be able to get out of games against teams like BC with easy wins because we were superior athletically. The talent just isn't there at the skill positions - WR and RB. We are the least explosive Ive seen us since 97-98. Watch the other top teams in the country and see some of the explosive playmakers they have. We're just very average right now. Good enough to make a bowl, but not good enough to make much noise.
The 6-3 record actually fits this team.
Its time to just enjoy this team for what it is.
Accidental down vote can someone up vote to offser?
Done.
Yep. Everybody had gotten excited when we were 6-1 and ranked 16th in the nation with games coming up against teams we used to beat with relative ease. 8-1 going into the Miami game seemed to be a likely scenario. But the fact is that we simply aren't that good.
This is what happens when you don't recruit a fucking thing on one side of the ball for 3 years or so. You shouldn't have to rely on guys like Meyer to make the crucial late game catches because your best receiver, a walk-on himself, goes down with an injury. That cupboard is beyond bare.
No power running game - our bread and butter that we leaned on all these successful years + playing wide outs that should be on rosters at Richmond, William and Mary, etc. ... just not a good look right now.
An issue I have is: are we running the veer/read option because it maximizes our "strengths" (try not to laugh) or minimizes our weaknesses? Leal is not built to run that sort of system as far as I can tell and neither is any other likely starter for the foreseeable future. Trey isn't have ANY success in it and he only receives hand offs off the mesh when defenders are already on top of him.
I've begun to wonder if they're teaching Leal and the other QBs a completely different system, to the point where they could maybe run a basic playbook now, but the coaching staff has already started the transition to the future with them.
French60Wasp has stated here in the past that the read option is not the offense that Scot Loeffler would prefer to run. He's running it this season because he thinks that, given our personnel, it's what gives us our best chance at being able to move the ball.
Blame Corso.
Running game? Top flight receivers? He has to do it all, because nobody else can (or is willinng) to consistantly make plays. He holds to ball too long, he throws high, he throws low, he is mediocre at the read option at best; but like my middle school coach told me, "you ain't much, but you're all we got."
I was at this game. I am no expert, just a long time fan. A few thoughts:
1. Ten minutes before kick-off, the stands were less than 10% full. Yes, I know the Red Sox parade was going on at the same time, but the VT fans, plus our band, probably outnumbered the BC crowd. I was at the game here last year as well, not much difference. Pathetic.
2. LT, while having a gun for an arm, simply has no touch. It doesn't matter if the pass is 30 yards downfield, or 5 yards in to the flat, the speed and trajectory seem to be the same.
3. On the first pick off of Knowles' hands, the ball appeared to be thrown too quickly, as it hit his hands just as he made his cut and turned around. Rare, I know, as it seems LT often waits too long to get the ball to his receivers.
4. The penalties killed us. Every team gets penalized, but it seemed every one of ours was absolutely critical and either extended their drives or killed ours.
5. Andre Williams of BC is one helluva back and brings a load. He ran through so many tackles today. An offense like BC's (or Stanford's) with a drive blocking line and big backs does not seem to be a good match for our fast but maybe undersized defense.
6. Yes, Edmunds trips over his feet too much, and we seem to try to run Coleman up the gut too much. He simply does not have the size to push the pile. Our running plays are telegraphed and take way too long to develop. It seems as if we are expecting our mediocre line to hold their blocks for longer than they are capable.
7. Josh Stanford seems to be the real deal...made some tough catches out there today. Made LT look good on a couple of those.
8. D.J. Coles takes too many plays off and seems very slow out there.
9. Don't get me started on the pick 6. Awful, simply awful and inexcusable. Also, LT seemed to hold the ball too long on many plays resulting in sacks. And, he never seemed to sense the rush around him.
10. It seems like every offensive play started with Edmunds split out wide, then would adjust to go set up in the backfield. BC seemed to never even put a man out on him out wide. He would start off right behind a WR (I was thinking a sure quick screen), and there would be only one BC cover guy out there on two of us. Mix it up some, let him run a route from there. Make them think and cover him.
11. Did I miss something? Did Kyle even play? I saw Faycson in for only a couple of plays. Exum did not look good, nor did Bonner. Josh Trimble seemed to get a lot of playing time, but I don't seem to remember him in on many tackles...pretty much invisible. No TO's from the defense, and we had our two of our best playmakers on defense on the bench.
And, I'm headed down to FL next week to see some of my old college roommates and we are planning to go to the Miami game. Could be a bloodbath. Sigh...
I noticed the same about Edmunds in motion. It seems completely pointless.
Kendall was out there, and made a few good stops in the run game. Otherwise, fairly quiet downfield, but that's largely because BC only threw a handful of passes.
It hurts to say this, but based on play. Exum should definitely be the backup for Facyson.
Why would it hurt to say? Exum is working back from a major injury and Facyson's play had him on All-American teams at the halfway point this season. You obviously play the better player.
Good post. Agree on all points.
I know that this team is what it is. But that won't stop me from wishing like hell that they were something far better.
tough loss...random thoughts that have probably been covered already...
1 - LT's 4 turnovers are totally unacceptable, but not all his fault by any stretch of the imagination
2 - I'd like to think it woulda been a different game if that ball doesn't bounce off Demitri's hands...I felt like we had all the momentum at that point and an opportunity to go up big if we score on that drive. Demitri has to do better than that.
3 - why could we not block the blitz in the 2nd half?
4 - the pick-6 was just unacceptable, no matter how you slice it. 1 of 2 turnovers that were logan's fault...the other 2 I didn't think were his fault
5 - The turnovers kill me, but LT is also the reason we were in the game to begin with
6 - Journell bounced back very nicely from last week...I think he and Stanford are the big positives coming out of today, if there are any
7 - lets hope FSU keeps our division hopes alive, altho if we dont cut down the turnovers there's no way we beat miami
As a senior officer in a battalion I was in once told the officers in the battalion, " sometimes you have to look yourself in the mirror and say I'm just not that good".
That is where we are right now.
The problem is not LT3. He has proven that when he is not the running game, that he can be a great QB.
The coaching staff, even with the lack of talent, has no idea how to use the players and play to their strengths.
Pulling Stanford out on 3rd and 4th down plays with the game on the line, makes no sense.
Not at least trying to get Edmund's going after he proved he was hot.
Running every first down for 1-2 yards with a slow developing read. Hey Scott, it doesn't work.
Cline was open way too often to not get logans attention and tell him, get it to Cline.
The blocks in the back that happen every time the Holies move the ball a chunk.
The play calling is just as vanilla as last years coordinators, and we are seeing the same results.
This game was lost when BC decided to run their bruising back most of the day.
He wore down that defensive front and their blocking was crisp.
If BC can get backs like that, there is no reason tech does not have someone like that.
Logan Thomas has been the offense for the past 7 weeks. He has had the ball the majority of the time, and will make mistakes.
I was at this game, and LT was beat up. Jarrett also was beat up. Coles was beat up. Losing Byrn hurt bad. The o-line was gassed by the beginning of the 3rd.
Their needs to be better conditioning, and they need to stick with what is working.
There is no way we have a chance against Miami if we keep playing this same offense. It doesn't take a genius to figure out that if you rush 4 and consentrate on Thomas, you will win the game.
In the prose of Andrew Beyer I can only offer the following after yesterday. When Historians are chronicling examples of the folly and perversity of mankind during the 21st century, they will start with this list:
1. Dick Cheney's Vice Presidency
2. Logan Thomas playing QB for Virginia Tech
I'm finding it impossible not to both admire and be frustrated with LT. The guy is a warrior and tries to do everything possible to win the game. Which unfortunately is the key to both his success and failure.
Everyone wants a quarterback who is consistently good and occasionally great. We only get occasionally great, as evidenced by the few long touchdown drives we've had this year.
I think its time to get Leal ready for next season. He can't do any worse then Logan has done the last two games.