The 3 games they have left are Miami, Wake, and UNC. After Miami, I could see them winning out. These are all not give-me games, but I could actually see Duke winning all of them, with the toughest challenges being with Miami, and a rejuvenated UNC team. Wake can always pull an upset, but I can see Duke handling them.
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Duke could lose all three, or win all three. Realistically I see them beating Wake and that's it. Miami should let out anger on them and UNC is red hot right now and I just don't Duke winning in Chapel Hill. They have proved me wrong all season though, so if they win all three I honestly wouldn't be that surprised.
Yes, the only game they actually win is WF. That puts them at 8-4, not a bad season with a bowl game.
I still think Duke is better than most of us seem willing to admit. As of right now, they are looking like a very strong contender for the ACCCG. Stronger than us. Does this mean I want them to go? No. It just means that they might. All I really care about for this season is that we win our games.
Duke is a pretty average team. I mean we played an absolutely awful game and we still should have won. My guess is that they lose to Miami, beat Wake, then lose to UNC. UNC will actually probably be their toughest game since they are playing way better than they were a month ago.
It'll be interesting to see how Duke handles having the pressure on them to win. The program really has never been expected to accomplish anything in recent years, so it'll be interesting to see how the program reacts while controlling their own destiny.
Duke barely beat NC State; the final score is misleading due to 2 consecutive pick-sixes at the very end. They barely beat us, too, and that was because we handed them the damn game. I think they drop one against Miami or UNC (which is playing very well right now with Williams at QB), maybe both.
Clemson almost choked against NC State as well.
There's just something about NC State - we were down by 17 a couple years ago, then we also have to remember the many times that they've inexplicably beaten FSU.
I'd rather not talk about Duke, so that the football gods don't laugh at us any more than they have.
I really can't see Duke beating Miami. Also, UNC has gotten it together and I don't see them letting their pesky little brother beat them again.
UNC will likely need that Duke game for a bowl. 4 wins now with @ Pitt, v. ODU and v. Duke left.
Duke is doing the same thing in the ACC that Minnesota is doing in the Big Ten. If Duke went to the ACCCG to play FSU, I'd be happy to see them earn it. Hey, they beat us. If GT and Miami lose again, we win out and Duke wins out, I think they go, don't they? They'd be my second choice...
Yes they would go over us.
I will always root for us to the bitter tie-breaking end, but Duke absolutely is my 2nd choice this year if not us. They earned it, and their players deserve it (if not their fanbase).
And they would expect it next year, which would make their bitter disappointment taste all that much sweeter.
The thing that is dangerous about Duke is they are riding on a high wave of confidence right now. They're 7-2, they've beaten the formidable Hokies, and they're in control of their destiny.
NC State, while they were in the game, never punched them in the mouth...and that's what Duke needs right now - someone to punch them in the mouth and tell them, "Shut up. You're Duke, and this is ain't Cameron Indoor."
Yeah, even after they've beaten us I can't help but feel kind of "that's cute" about their success this year
Duke... they've gotten in their only win in against Beamer. Let's keep it that way.
Remember, Duke doesn't EXACTLY control their own destiny. If GT beats Clemson on Thursday night, then suddenly we can get to the ACCCG by beating Maryland and UVA, even if Duke wins out.
Fairly sure that is incorrect. If Duke wins out, they go to the ACCCG. Has something to do with the tiebreakers, as Duke/VT/GT would all be 1-1 against each other, so the next set of tiebreakers goes to Duke
A GT win would put them at 6-2 in ACC play, and if Duke and VT both win out they are also at 6-2. The three-way tiebraker goes to the team with the best division record. (VT would be 5-1, Duke and GT at 4-2). We would go.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't this how a 3-way tie is sorted out?
The tie breaker after head to head between the 3 teams is overall record of the teams. So a 2 loss Duke team would win that against the Hokies with 3 current losses
ehhh pretty sure its divisional record. its not a real fair comparison for a conference tie breaker to include out of conference schedule games. the tie breaker if it was overall record would hurt a team with a strong out of conference loss (Bama for us) and would discourage teams from playing tough non conference opponents.
It's division record. I've thought this one, plus every other possible way for us to get there, over the last two days.
http://www.theacc.com/#!/page/ACC-Football-Championship-Tiebreakers
Three way tie starts out with best divisional record, so whoever commented above that Duke doesn't technically control their own destiny is correct. If the Jackets beat Clemson, and VT/Duke win out, then VT goes to Charlotte.
Odds are however, that Duke, or for that matter, the Hokies stumble before GT beats Clemson.
How? Is there a special tie-breaker rule I'm not aware of or something?
I would have to look it up, but in that scenario (Duke, VT, and GT all winning out), all 3 teams would end up with identical conference records.
The next tiebreaker is head to head between the 3 teams, which would go:
VT: W GT L Duke
GT: W Duke L VT
Duke: W VT L GT
So all 1-1. So then it goes to the next tiebreaker. It escapes me at the moment what that is, but VT has no chance at the ACCCG unless Duke drops a game.
If Vt Duke and Gt are all tied at 6-2 then vt goes to te ACCCG because we're all 1-1 in head to head it goes to the divisional record and Vt would only have 1 division loss and duke and gt would have 2 division losses. That's assuming all 3 win out inconference play
Nevermind, reading the rule incorrectly. You might be right, if all are 1-1. I was under the impression however that VT still needs someone to lose in order to make the ACCCG. I would assume that would mean Duke, for whatever reason
How is that because in 08 we had a 3 way tie with Gt and Miami and I'm pretty positive one of them was 9-3 and I know we were 8-4, also all the articles I've read say that it goes by divisional record and the overall doesn't come in to play there
You are right, I was reading the rule wrong.
Even still, VT needs someone to lose. Otherwise, we would "control our destiny" so to speak. If we win out we can still miss the ACCCG, and I am assuming that would be the case if Duke won out. So one of the tiebreakers must snag us
I guess in this case he was correct in that a GT win over Clemson would actually help us quite a bit.
well...we need clemson to lose...you could look at it that way
if clemson beats gt and duke and vt win out vt and duke would have a 2 way tie at the top. Duke wins head to head and goes to ACCCG
if gt beats clemson and duke and vt win out that would yield a 3 way tie at the top. with each team 1-1 against each other the next tie break is division record. Division, being the key word here. We lost to BC in the atlantic so our 4-1 division record would be better than the 3-2 division records shared by duke and gt. Therefore VT goes to ACCCG.
Most likely case is that duke loses one of it's next 3 games and we win out to go to the ACCCG. That's why most people are talking about that scenario. Nobody really believes that GT will beat clemson, but if they did, that would give us a 3 way tie if duke happens to win out.(we would win the 3 way tie breaker)
Basically, we need GT to beat Clemson OR Duke to lose a game. Root for GT and Miami this weekend. Pretty good chance thUgz beat dook and then we just have to take care of business the rest of the way.
Turkey leg for you. This 90 degree November day in Phoenix is messing with me I think
Just to settle this for everyone. If the 3 of us are tied it goes to divisional record and we go to the championship game. As proof I present you with this: http://www.theacc.com/#!/page/ACC-Football-Championship-Tiebreakers
To sum up this entire thread. Only in the ACC can there be a division race with 3 weeks left where NO team controls its own destiny. Pretty funny actually.
#GoACC?
It is funny, but I also think that it makes for compelling late-season football. Sure, every team would love to be undefeated and cruising to a conference championship, but there's also something to be said for these teams busting their butts every week to just stay in the hunt. I think it increases the quality of the competition. It's certainly more fun to watch, and makes me pay more attention to the other games going on.
What I find funnier is that if GT wins on Thursday, all of a sudden WE control our own destiny.
I had a lot of fun talking this week to guys.
Duke does not control their own destiny.
Right now it's GT that controls everything.
GT controls Dukes destiny so, nothing has really changed at all for Duke. They are still not in control.
Well, each of the top 4 teams controls someone else's destiny. Nobody controls their own.
A Duke loss allows us to clinch if we win out.
A GT win allows us to clinch if we win out.
A GT loss allows Duke to clinch if they win out.
A Miami loss coupled with a VT loss allows GT to clinch if they beat Clemson.
A VT loss allows Miami to clinch if they win out.
GT needs VT and Miami to lose.
VT needs GT to win or Duke to lose
Duke needs GT to lose.
Miami needs VT to lose.
And if all 4 lose, that opens up a giant fustercluck that could result in a 5-way tie. Nobody wants that except for Pitt, whose only chance of winning the division is actually a 3-way tie between GT, Miami and Pitt at 5-3, with VT, Duke and UNC at 4-4 (Epic Hokie collapse, I know). In that case, the tiebreaker would fall all the way to #7, BCS Standings. Pitt would need for Miami to be unranked, and for the computer rankings to somehow favor the Panthers, which seems unlikely since Miami is 4-0 OOC and Pitt is 3-1.
UNC has been mathematically eliminated from Charlotte contention. Unless you're talking about the Belk Bowl, in which case you might be right.
I see people talking about UNC being red hot, Miami "handling" Duke after two straight ass whippins', and some crazy tie breaker scenarios. Why isn't anyone giving Duke any love? Those guys have won 5 straight, and looked pretty solid doing it. I would love to see Miami win, I'm just saying that after they kicked our ass - in our house - people are still overlooking them. Maybe it's that "Oh it's just Duke" mentality that got us where we are.
I refuse to give them love because I am a bitter, angry, and spiteful person. I hate losing and I freely admit it. I saw a kid in Wal-Mart with a Duke hat on after the game and smoked him with a trident. It was completely uncalled for, but that is the kind of grudge I hold. Several TKPers advised me to find a friend or a safe house and lay low for a while because I was probably wanted for murder. So I did. After the Boston College game, I went out and found a random eagle on the bluffs out north and I dumped some DDT on its nest. Heinous I know, but sheesh man what can you do? Its too close to bowl season to turn back now. I am all in. ACCCG here we come. Any team in the way must lose and I dont care to whom or how. Merry Christmas, Happy Hanukkah, holy shit where's the Tylenol.
Interesting how high Sagarin rates the Coastal? 2-SEC and 2-Pac 12 and Coastal at 5th. Feels about right given the way that we are all beating each other up....
1 SEC-WEST (A) = 82.92 82.44 ( 1) 7 82.59 ( 1)
2 PAC-12(NORTH) (A) = 81.98 81.29 ( 2) 6 82.32 ( 2)
3 PAC-12(SOUTH) (A) = 81.94 81.06 ( 3) 6 81.89 ( 3)
4 SEC-EAST (A) = 78.50 78.21 ( 4) 7 78.50 ( 4)
5 ACC-COASTAL (A) = 75.90 75.33 ( 6) 7 75.67 ( 5)
6 BIG 12 (A) = 75.46 75.47 ( 5) 10 75.31 ( 6)
7 BIG TEN-LEGENDS (A) = 74.31 75.05 ( 7) 6 74.92 ( 7)
8 BIG TEN-LEADERS (A) = 73.43 73.17 ( 9) 6 73.36 ( 8)
9 ACC-ATLANTIC (A) = 72.48 74.59 ( 8) 7 71.88 ( 9)
10 AMERICAN ATHLETIC (A) = 65.19 65.98 ( 10) 10 65.13 ( 10)
I'm still confused about who's in which B1G division...
Last I heard it was the M's, the N's, and Iowa (Mich, Mich St, Minnesota, Neb, NW'ern, Iowa). I think that is going to change, though, when MD arrives?
Legends: Mich ST. Neb. Minn. Iowa. Mich. N.W.
Leaders: OSU. Wisc. Indy. Penn ST. Ill. Purdue
I know it's been said, but...
why does the Big 10 have 12 teams and the Big 12 have 10 teams?
Even a UVA grad could have come up with names that made sense...
It's because one of them parked in the driveway.
UNC will beat them.
I think UNC wins. They look like a different team and an inspired one with their QB gone. I think they will lose to Miami and UNC.
By the way i think they should change the 3 way tie breaking scenario to a coaches dance off with winner based on crowd reaction
I definitely agree. The UNC-Duke game will be a battle of the mobile QBs, and UNC is definitely playing very well right now. I also think Duke's defense will not have an answer for Ebron. UNC's D has the edge and will overall I would expect UNC to win.
I can see beamer saying this for sure..
Latest lines:
git@CLEMSON -10.5
md@VT -15.0
daU@DUKE +3.0
People seem to forget the fortitude Duke showed coming back from 22 down against UVA and yeah we gift wrapped a win for them a few weeks ago but they didn't make it easy on themselves either, they just made one more play than we did.
What I'm saying is; if Duke wins out and goes to the ACCCG I will be crushed, but that also means they had one hell of a year and they damn well earned it.
Here is the procedure for determining an ACC Divisional champ -
"If more than one team in the same division is tied for the best winning percentage in its Conference games then, in order to determine the divisional champion, the procedures listed below will be followed.
A. TWO-TEAM TIE
1. Head-to-head competition between the two tied teams.
2. Winning percentage of the tied teams within the division.
3. Head-to-head competition versus the team within the division with the best overall winning-percentage (divisional and non-divisional), and proceeding though the division. Multiple ties within the division will be broken from first to last using the leagues tie-breaking procedures.
4. Overall winning percentage versus all common non-divisional opponents.
5. Combined winning percentage versus all non-divisional opponents.
6. Winning percentage versus common non-divisional opponents based upon their order of finish (overall conference winning percentage) and proceeding through other common non-divisional opponents based upon their order of finish within the division.
7. The tied team with the higher ranking in the full Bowl Championship Series Standings following the conclusion of regular season games. If both tied teams are not ranked in the full Bowl Championship Series Standings, the computer ranking portion of the Standings will be used, eliminating the high and the low computer ranking, and averaging the remaining rankings.
8. The representative shall be chosen by a draw as administered by the Commissioner or Commissioners designee.
B. THREE (OR MORE) TEAM TIE
(Three team (or more) tiebreaker procedure will be used to break all ties to identify the Championship game representative. Once a team is eliminated from the tie, the tie-breaking procedures restart for the remaining teams. If the three (or more) team tie can only be reduced to two teams, the two-team tie-breaking procedure will then be applied).
1. Combined head-to-head winning percentage among the tied teams.
2. Winning percentage of the tied teams within the division.
3. Head-to-head competition versus the team within the division with the best overall (divisional and non-divisional) 4. Conference winning percentage, and proceeding through the division. Multiple ties within the division will be broken first to last, using the leagues tie-breaking procedures.
5. Combined winning percentage versus all common non-divisional opponents.
6. Combined winning percentage versus all non-divisional opponents.
7. Winning percentage versus common non-divisional opponents based upon their order of finish (overall conference winning percentage) and proceeding through other common non-divisional opponents based upon their divisional order of finish.
8. The tied team with the highest ranking in the full Bowl Championship Series Standings following the conclusion of regular season games, unless the second of the tied teams is ranked within five-or-fewer places of the highest ranked tied team. In this case, the two-team tiebreaking procedure shall be applied between the top two ranked tied teams. If all tied teams are not ranked in the full Bowl Championship Series Standings, the computer ranking portion of the Standings will be used, eliminating the high and the low computer ranking, and averaging the remaining rankings.
9. The representative shall be chosen by a draw as administered by the Commissioner or Commissioners designee.
http://www.theacc.com/#!/page/ACC-Football-Championship-Tiebreakers
The current divisional records and remaining games for each team in the ACC Coastal Division is as follows:
Tech: 4-1 (1 remaining in-division game - UVA)
GT: 4-2 (no in-division games remaining - done)
Duke: 2-2 (2 remaining in-division games - Miami and UNC)
Miami: 2-1 (3 remaining in-division games - Duke, Pitt, UVA)
Pitt: 2-2 (2 remaining in-division games - Miami, UNC)
UNC: 1-3 (2 remaining in-division games - Duke, Pitt)
UVA: 0-4 (2 remaining in-division games - Miami, VT)
If we take care of business against Md and UVA, and Duke loses one of their two remaining in-division games, we'll be going to the ACCCG. After the struggles of last season, and breaking in a lot of new coaches and starters, who would have thought this was even a remote possibility?
Duke loses it's next three games...I'd place a dime bet on it.