Is killing our offense. Logan had no time at all today to throw, but it looked like we were getting decent yardage on the ground. We need to commit to going North South on the running game and it will open the offense up.
If I see Coleman run an inside zone on short yardage again I am going to lose my mind. Edmonds is the only RB that should be doing that!
Forums:
DISCLAIMER: Forum topics may not have been written or edited by The Key Play staff.
Comments
I actually thought the pass protection was decent today. Thomas just held on to the ball for way too long. Maryland was only rushing 4 most of the day so the coverage down field must have been pretty good. I don't know if Thomas just wasn't looking to his check down soon enough or if it wasn't there or what. I'm sure French and Mason will shed light on that. To me, though, I thought Thomas, more often than not, took a sack after holding onto the ball in the pocket for more than 4 or 5 seconds.
Too many instances where the pocket collapsed immediately, though. I think most of the sacks were on the O-line, but I'll wait to see what French says about that in the film review (assuming he goes through the O-line like usual).
He was taking sacks instead of throwing bad passes which sucks are yardage situation but overall keeps us in the games. Stewart confused the shit out of our offensive line and was getting pressure from the inside and the outside. Logan had no time to make his reads.
Logan didn't have a great day and it was most definitely because of the Oline. He did not have 4 or 5 seconds most of the time. Our oline got blown through today repeatedly.
You're right. Logan did not get the ball out quickly enough. Most sacks were "coverage" sacks. IMO, I felt Logan looked confused. He couldn't read the defense before snap, he couldn't find the open receivers, and was extremely slow going through his progressions. However, it should also be on Loeffler to call passes that get the ball out quickly.
There was twice this game where on 2nd and 1 we ran the read and Logan handed off to JC going towards the sideline instead of keeping and running forward for the first down. Both times the drive stalled after we failed on 3rd down. That is just absolutely inept.
Those playcalls killed me a little inside.
Haven't rewatched the film yet, and my experiences this season has been that my opinion of the game often changes drastically after actually finding out what happened... But...
The play calls again focused too much on the perimeter run game and the running back rotation was unproductive. Part of me wonders if Loeffler didn't just stumble into the rushing success against Miami, rather than plan for it. I mean, it wasn't until the 2nd quarter that they started pounding the rock, and only after a couple of ineffective drives to start the game.
There has been some real simple tweaks that Loeffler, Grimes, and Shane could have done in the running game all season long to improve it that isn't being done. And it's really confusing.
You think that, sometimes, Loeffler and Shane aren't on the same page when it comes to the RBs and the playcall?
There are some plays that we'll throw out there that should never involve Coleman. We saw a few of them today.
I thought we didn't run the ball enough either and some of the play calling was questionable..like JC on 3th and 1. Everyone was saying after the Miami game how much the offensive line improved but they really didn't improve. It was actually Miami's defense that was bad...Duke rushed for 358 yards today on Da U. That's right...DUKE.
Wow.
I didn't realize how not "back" da U was this year.
So basically, we really did beat a bad Miami team.
I didn't think the offensive line improved after Miami. I thought we put the offensive line and the RB's in position to settle in and shoulder some of the load against Miami. We didn't do that today.
We again, asked Logan to bear the responsibility for our offenses success - in my opinion almost entirely. For three straight games, asking Logan to do pretty much everything out of shotgun or pistol didn't work.
I am dissappointed because, yes, the oline did play poorly at times today, but also because I thought we found some balance.
*sigh*.... The lack of a running game didn't kill us today. 3rd downs did. We were 4/16 on third downs. A good amount of the time, we were in 3rd and short-ish (2-5 yards). But when you can't pick up a 3rd down either with the running game or because your QB is getting smacked as soon as he drops back, your offense is going nowhere. For the most part, I thought Loeffler called a good game. For whatever reason, we just didn't get the job done. Life lesson for today: sometime stuff just doesn't work. Deal with it, learn from it and move on.
Interesting: I think we are talking apples and oranges here. If I am understanding the OP correctly, he was talking about having more a commitment to the run game with Edmunds (using more of a power set I assume). With a RB appearing to be averaging around 4 yards a carry this game, leveraging Edmunds' skills sets to wear down the UMD D could have been pretty useful. They had little depth with injuries and it appeared we stepped away from something that was working with the run game. I will reserve judgement around how "effective" the OC is until next year or the following, but there were quite a few calls today that were "headscratch" calls which makes me wonder are we really leveraging our skill players to their greatest potential?
I thought we did a good job of getting Edmunds touches, but those 3rd down conversions (or lack thereof) were killer. Him getting 5-8 yards doesn't do us any good if we can't get those last few to convert. If we do convert those, then we end up having a drive like we did at the end of the Miami game, with one running back chewing up 50+ yards. Just watching live, there were very few decisions today that left me scratching my head. I think we just didn't execute, for whatever reason. I'm definitely interested to see the film review(s) this week to see just where things went wrong.
The simple fact you wouldn't line up and run the ball from the 1 on second down tells you all you need about the faith in the backs and oline. We still scored but that does nothing more than gloss over simple flaws with this team it's been that way all year.
I disagree with that. For years Hokie fans have called for us to be more exotic in the red zone because running it 3 times in a row had become too predictable. We mixed it up and we scored.
We were told this team was going to be toughest team and not get pushed around like they did last year. This team got bullied by teams that were tougher mentally and physically. Those three teams that were tougher than us were duke bc and Maryland. I'm sorry but if you get bullied by any of those teams I'm not sure you should be starting at VT, but maybe I have unrealistic expectations for the program now.
We were never told that this was going to be the toughest team and no one said anything about getting pushed around last year though? And, did you downvote me for disagreeing? I thought I had a decent point. Moorehead said he wanted to develop the toughest oline in the ACC. Our guys are a hodge-podge at best right now and some of them are really inexperienced. Your expectations for this team are about where they should be in 2-3 years. If we're still getting beat up like yesterday, we got problems.
We got flat-out outplayed by a team that was really hungry for a win.
Moorehead is WR coach. Grimes is o line.
ah, right. I don't know why I said that. I am confused why (aside from me misspeaking) anyone would downvote my opinions on this particular topic.
Because sadness.
Dude it's a single downvote. No need to get bummed out.
words spoken against Virginia Tech are not appreciated
Yes lack of third down conversions did not help, but why on 3rd an shorts do you run Coleman up the middle? It looked like the O was actually getting push enough to run the ball.
The only play from under center was in the red zone and we ran a play action pass where Logan got sacked.
The offense needs to be dedicated to running the ball for at least 30 plays a game and from the shotgun at all times. It's seems that once we have success running we go back to the pass.
You're 100% right that sometimes stuff just doesn't work.
But I remember texting a friend when we had like 2nd and 2 and we decided to run Edmunds down the line to the outside, then on the next play we run him to the top of the formation, again to the outside. Neither play went anywhere. Instead of trying to plow up the middle and force our way to 2 yards, we avoided the middle of the line. That's something that bothers me a bit, because 'tip of the spear' doesn't translate in my mind to what we're doing.
Might just be a matter of the situation that was inherited. Hopefully this will change over time.
I was thinking there must have been something going on in the middle of the line that I could not see from the stands.
based on how I viewed the game, the line was not in sink at all. there were many plays where d-line stunted and the hokies would pick up one and leave the other for a wide open route to the qb. edmunds has been showing some great leg drive latley, if he had any help form the oline and same goes with logan the outcome of this game would have different. All games are won in the trenches with the big nasties. Ours did not play well at all and we should be glad it was that close of a game.
#105 in 3rd down conversion %
#100 in total offense
#111 in rushing offense
#115 in red zone offense
#11 in time of possession (defense)
Out of 123 total
Enough said
One thing I did notice. Once or twice that bootleg we talked about lst week, was open and Thomas went to a deeper WR unsuccessfully.
Didn't he hit Coles (IIRC) for a TD on a rollout/bootleg?
Maybe but, it wasn't early on when that play would cause their D to play honestly, to help the run game.
He did.
FWIW: Trey had 16 carries for 61 yards (3.8 ypc). As a team (including sacks, I'm assuming, but still), we had a 1.4 ypc average. So, both from watching live and from the stats, I don't see a lack of commitment to the running game, but a lack of execution.
I see a lack of commitment, Trey was supposed to be our workhorse going into the season. at almost 4 yards a carry, why is he not breaking 20-25 carries per game? I agree VTfootballgrad. its not that we dont HAVE a running game, its that we abandon it, right when we need it most
Did you see how the interior of our line was getting manhandled today? It's very difficult to run when defensive tackles are two yards into the backfield at the start of every play.
This team just isn't built yet to pound the football and win doing it.
so they were getting manhandled and Trey was still averaging 4 yards a carry. I guess we'll have to wait and see what French has to say in his review. This team just doesnt make sense.
Unfortunately, you're living very dangerously if you're assuming you're going to get 4 yards every play and just running play after play.
you're living very dangerously when you're throwing it as well. Woody Hayes said it best. only 3 things can happen when you pass, and 2 of them arent good.
I agree with you- I'm merely saying this team isn't capable of lining up and just pounding the rock over and over, and winning the game.
3 things can happen even you run too: you can lose yardage, fumble it, or gain yardage. I would say onlyone of those is good too.
3 things can happen if you argue with someone on the internet:
You can make them look like an idiot.
You can look like an idiot.
You can waste valuable pr0n viewing time.
Only one of those is marginally good.
It wasn't the interior of the line - it was Wang. He got manhandled all day. (And I'll be waiting for the ubiquitous Wang liners).
We should line up under center and punch the ball for at least 30 carries. Trey should get the most touches and Coleman spelling him occasionally. It seems like we split the carries between the 2.
We are getting away from the run when it has success and that's what I mean by lack of commitment to it. We are so quick to go back to the pass that we never let our RBs get into a rythem.
I would love to see us run the ball 3 straight times on our first drive.
With the way our line is playing, that would result in a punt.
If that's what you would love, then I guess you'd be happy.
**EDIT**
If you disagree, say something. Don't just downvote.
Keep in mind Edmunds is a r-Fr and there are other talented backs on the roster. It might be a tad unreasonable to expect him to carry a Tyler Gaffney-esque load. 16 carries seems just on the lower end of just right for what the coaches want from him (18-22 carries/game).
idk mang, 16 does not look like 18-22.
The play calling by Loeffler in the second half got way too cute. What is he doing calling a 30 yard fade pattern on third and one? Well he is no dummy. If you look at the play calling, I think Loeffler gave up on the offensive line. He gave up on their ability to run downhill. He started looking for quick strikes and was passing in short yardage situations. Loeffler is saying with his play calling: the Maryland defensive line is killing the weak VT offensive line so I need to try to win this game with finesse. Guess what. It did not work.
I can't say I disagreed though. We need to face it: our team is mediocre this year. Maryland outplayed us, and as a result we tried to make it up, and then they outplayed us some more.
That wasn't a 9 man protection, Logan had other places he could have gone. He PICKED the low percentage throw.