Hate to make yet another post for today but phew I need to put this somewhere
I'll start with the good!
1) there were times where our offense looked unstoppable against a competent opponent
2) I thought our oline blocked the best they had all season (I swear every bowl game I repeat this sentiment...maybe french is right and practicing all offseason against a gimmicky defense starts us off slow?)
3) our running backs had a terrific game, tons of effort
4) everyone there go ahead and pat yourselves on the back.... we were loud in the 2nd half and it was fun (#humblebrag)
5) the wide receiver blocking seemed pretty good today, someone with a more trained eye please correct me if I'm wrong.
6) special teams. Shout out to the kicking game and punt returners. They took some licks a few time and held onto the ball...kudos
The bad...
1) drops...how did we have 6 drops (possibly more?) In a fucking bowl game. At this point its unacceptable, haze needs to make several of those catches, a bit more forgivable for king but my god, that shocked me today I thought we left a ton of yards on the field and ended some drives sooner than we should have
2) dax holifield seemed to have a rough game. I counted at least twice where he seemed to have a breakdown and at least twice where he was outrun to the edge where we shouldve had a loss of 2 or 3 and instead they got a gain of 4. Huge against the triple option
3) the officiating....I dont usually blame officials but my god that was horrendous. A bullshit PI on an interception, a ridiculous "he called him mean words" penalty on the first drive, a missed OBVIOUS AS FRICK hold, a terrible early whistle on what became a fumble, 2 absurd targeting calls (one for and against) etc....this was some sugar bowl level piss poor officiating. I dont understand how there is zero review policy on officials and zero repercussions for just being general shit at their jobs in all sports. What would be wrong with a review process?
4) hooker had a decent game but man he missed on a few gimmie plays hopefully an offseason as the obvious #1 (Fuente please dont do this competition crap) with #1 reps is enough to build some chemistry out wide.
The ugly:
1) Cornelson.....how do you have literally an entire month to plan and have that first drive? I thought he had high moments and low moments. It wasnt a disaster (I think many of you forget ocainspring and were miles ahead of that) but there are points when he loses the pulse of the game. I think he needs a co-OC to help him. There are times when hes brilliant and maddeningly shitty points too
2) the conservative calls....I dont know why coaches are still conservative when statistics consistently say: stop being bitches. Like seriously, how do teams not play more aggressively with the amount of money and advanced analytics poured into it. Fuente absolutely deserves some blame for this
3) time and time again we seem to shoot ourselves in the foot at crucial times. We seem nervous and I dont know the cure. Outside of miami I cant think of a clutch drive under fuente where our boys nutted up and got shit done when it needed to be done. I honestly dont know the answer but we had a chance to put this game away probably 8 times today and failed every chance... its frustrating and I dont know who to blame. Be it a kick out of bounds, blown assignments, drops....we dont seem clutch at all
Conclusion:
I think what's so frustrating about this game was it was absolutely winnable. And we just didnt. As mentioned before we blew probably close to 10 chances and I'd ANY of those go our way the conclusion to the season is "we gutted out a bowl win over a gimmicky team. Good for us" before coming into next year as the obvious coastal favorite. I see signs of a phenomenal team. Were REALLLLLY close to being a really good offense, and our defense pulled its shit together late this year. I have no idea how to feel next year. Fuente absolutely has earned another year but I think next year will be super telling about the future of this program
Comments
Hazelton and Turner both had easy drops, almost as if they were afraid of getting hit. Their d-backs were bringing the heat when they hit and it paid off on those drops.
Sure but that's something a D1 receiver (particularly when this was hyped as our most talented position preseason) should be better at. They seem to have regressed tbh
And if they're thinking about the NFL no one who matters literally cares. Do you think a NFL scout is going to say "Pass on this kid because he didn't want to get hurt in a meaningless game and lose the chance at millions of dollars?" No, they just care about the other games that they looked good in. People need to face the music that CFB is a farm for the NFL and the guys playing might actually care about the school, but when that much money is at risk priorities change.
What does that have to do with anything? None of our wideouts are going pro, and they all look worse than they did this time last season. Not just in the bowl game but over the last few. You know what an nfl scout will absolutely blast a player for? Drops.
Besides I dont think any of these guys currently look like 1st round picks and those are usually the guys that can get away with that. Not borderline players like haze
You can pencil in a critical drop for TT and Haz in just about every game. You can pencil in Dax blowing an assignment or not being able to get off a block by someone 25lbs lighter than him each game. You can also pencil in all three of these guys for putting out a new highlight real of themselves on IG or Twitter every other day. We have some Social Media All-Americans on our team who have only proven to be average football players in a weak football conference.
They're all young players (except haz). It'll get better with time. No need to yell at them to get off your lawn.
Sure. They don't have to get off the lawn, but it's ok to mention that they had critical drops that were likely game changing (for the worse).
Oh, totally agree the receivers left much to be desired. I think the 'social media all Americans' Was a tad unnecessary though.
Agree with all the good, bad and ugly points. Agree that it's okay to point out the shortcomings/mistakes when they get the credit for good plays as well. If they are really ball players, they'd be the first to point out their mistakes and work harder to correct them and improve.
I noticed multiple plays where it appeared our skill players weren't interested in blocking much. Not naming any names.
Posts like this is why i tried to avoid this site for a little bit after the game.
Lol.. nothing about the 19 play 8 minute drive to lose the game. Awesome
Cut me a break man I just walked over a mile back after the game. Completely agree, sorry it wasnt up to your standard
come on man didn't you know this was a global warming peer review???????????????????????????????????????
i'm mostly just being silly but also you should tkp harder
I feel like its a worse look to actually remember and be salty about a comment fron 2 months lol. Who has the time for that?
nobody's salty. it's just sort of informally entered the tkp lexicon as a joke for situations where one commenter wasn't intending to be exhaustive or entirely accurate and another commenter holds them to that standard.
Nothing about the defense at all. That is a glaring (and understandable given it's Buds last game) omission. I think we are extremely weak at defensive end - how many tackles did they have? Any disruption? I'm hoping this new guy from Texas is as advertised.
I think this had a fair amount to do with the lack of a dline coach. Really hope jham knows what hes doing
Man I gotta tell you - regarding Dline I think it is a talent thing - we've been spoiled over the years to have some really active/disruptive defensive ends - not so much this year. I hope someone will dig up the productivity stats for the defense.
I'm too lazy to do any real research, but the broadcast mentioned that in the 24 years Foster was DC (damn, I had to correct myself to write that in the past tense) VT was #1 in the country in sacks.
LBs and DBs get sacks too, but I think most teams get most of their sacks from the D Line, including us. So yes, I would definitely agree that we were spoiled to have had absolutely one of the best defensive lines in the country for a quarter of a century.
DC aren't you like the king of the shitty/vague/nonsensical OP?
Ugly is a player throwing a punch and not being punished by his coaching staff.
Forgot to add this, also didnt find out till about halftime. #stayclassywildcats
Also forgot to mention kentucky fans chanting sec is the equivalent of "my dad can beat up your dad"
and as mentioned above the last drive and not being able to get a crucial stop. As soon as haze dropped the ball I was worried and as soon as they got the first first down I was panicked because I knew they were going to be pushing on 4th down
kentucky fans chanting sec is the equivalent of "my dad can beat up your dad"
except they cant, at least they didn't last time they fought I guess we will see again jan 13th.
Seriously. The whole "it happened earlier than 60 minutes before the game" is such a weak excuse. Oh so it technically occurred outside the context of a football game? So it's not a personal foul... just assault. Cool.
exactly. where were the police?
completely ridiculous
Stoops letting that slide is a perfect example of why I don't want VT in the SEC.
What is the exact story behind the punch? Is any of it on video?
Nevermind.
Most disturbingly, what the hell is in that UK coach's mouth!?!?
Chicken tender!
I really want this to be true š
It is! It's all over twitter.com! It's a chicken wing or tender or something.
Haha I see it now. He has a can of soda in his hand too. Guy was just trying to enjoy his lunch and then this mess started.
You know in his head he's thinking, "C'mon guys! I'm trying to eat!"
Hard to tell if that was an actual punch or just a playful love tap.
I'm not sure what the definition of a love tap is. But he was running his mouth and hit him hard enough to knock his headphones off. I don't think he broke his jaw but I don't think it should have went unpunished. I'd like to think that if one of our players did this they would be held accountable somehow.
RedactedToo salty.
Win at all costs? No.
But if you can rattle your opponent enough to get him to do something stupid? I have no problem with taking advantage of it.
My favorite part is Willis in the background.
Did anybody else comment on the fact that there are 2 guys with their shirts off? Everybody else is wearing long sleeves, some are wearing jackets and hats. He was trying to look intimidating (to other football players - probably not that impressive) and most likely trying to really start something. Also, he's pretty tough when there's the rest of his team to pull them apart. What a douche.
Yes I was just thinking we needed another topic on this game.
Dont like it stay off the site man, of course people are going to want to discuss the most recent game
If we are still hovering around 7-8 win territory next year with Fuente's guys and program fully installed and in place, we've got to move on. I'm accepting of Fu and Co. because we really don't have a choice right now and he did earn another year. But there are so many warning signs that they just don't get it and aren't going to get us back to playing football at a nationally competitive level. Like you said, something is just missing. On paper we have some talented guys, but we just aren't clutch and frankly don't really know how to win that well.
Program fully in place? Did you somehow miss that Bud Foster retired and there's a new DC? That's not a "program" in place.
I could be wrong about this, but I seriously wonder if part of the offensive play calling is to keep our offense on the field and keep theirs off. I've seen enough drives where we score in like 2-4 plays and we look brilliant, then there's the long, drawn out drives where we look good but not great.
Your first ugly point is on Cornelson and the first drive? The same drive where receivers weren't catching balls and Hooker was erratic..
Yeah, calling out the first drive doesn't make sense. The drops and Hooker's terrible throws (mostly) were more to fault for that shabingus than play calling. Hooker was really bad on the first drive and I actually thought he was hurt.
Again this comes to preparation on the OC, how were we not more prepared to execute. Players deserve some blame absolutely but coaches do as well and I mean I absolutely noted both drops and hooker being off target what more do you want me to say about that?
How is this an excuse?
Hooker has a QB coach (hey! Also Corny) he's been working with for 3 years. If he's incapable of making those throws at this point, we should consider coaching as well. players need to be prepared and should be able to execute, especially having been in the program for so long.
Except those are throws that we've seen Hooker make in other games.
We can very easily conclude that he came out ice cold when he started the game. That's not on the coaching, and it happens to everyone every now and then.
Crazy that having the team prepared to play and capable of making the plays you're calling somehow has nothing to do with the coaching staff now.
Sorry, but the coaching staff can't make 14 catch the ball when he was wide open. Sometimes it really does come down to execution.
Or, as your beloved St. Frank of Beamer used to say, they were one block away. Even he understood the players have to execute.
Your post is nonsensical. We were talking about QB play and execution. HH wasn't on target at all at the beginning of the game. Not ever talking the drops specifically.
Beamer needed to retire after the Michigan game, so you're not going to get much from me on that at all, but given your "one block away" comment, Fuente basically said the same thing in the presser afterward. How much better off are we?
Your posts that continually blame coaches for every single bad thing is nonsensical. They aren't blameless either, but no coach is. The players do have to play to their potential for coaching to succeed. If the coaches knowingly ask the players to do something outside their capability, then yes it is on coaches. The first drive however was filled with missed opportunities on very routine plays that was only saved by repeated defensive penalties.
via GIPHY
So if Hooker can't make those plays, it's Cornelson's fault? Uh, okay. Cornelson's not throwing the ball. If Hooker isn't making those plays now, the only thing Cornelson can do is put in Willis or Patterson. And yeah, Hooker has been around a couple years, but a few bad plays at the beginning of the game isn't worth going crazy over. This is also Hooker's first season starting, and real game experience counts for a lot more than practice.
Who gets credit for the successful quarterbacks under Fuente/Corny?
The quarterbacks. Everybody knows Fuente and Corny can't coach. /s
Geez. So is your version of a good coach when players make every throw perfect. Not many Drew Brees walking around. Hooker has developed immensely from when he walked on campus. Does he have things he can improve (accuracy on certain throws)? Yes. Has he improved a ton? Hard Yes.
True/false thinking in regards to coaching and execution is ridiculous. My test will be if he improves next year and is more consistent in the areas where he is sometimes inconsistent this year. He will have to beat at B2 as well - meaning he needs to improve to win/retain the job.
The bad; I'm apathetic. I texted my family before the last Kentucky drive, "we've seen this how many times? Winnable game. Lost chances. We'll lose by one point On the final drive." Here we are. I wasn't mad about it. It's happened too many times to be mad about it.
It reaches a point where there's no real reason to tune in. Ya, some of the players seem nice. Not much access to them. Ya, the offense can score sometimes, but there doesn't seem to be much identity behind it. Bud Foster, our great hero, I appreciate all his work. Didn't seem like his head coach could muster up much to say about him. Can't speak the words. Ya. We know.
I've been apathetic for most of the season. We win, great. We lose, great. I'll watch, great. I don't know what's going to bring more passion for this program back to me, but the current trajectory isn't it.
I took a half day from work to watch this game at the house. Next year I won't bother to do that. I've seen this 13 act play each season one too many times, and my apathy just keeps growing.
Bright side is we didnt lose by 1.
Forever thankful
Same here. If you'd told me 10 years ago I'd become disinterested in VT football, I'd have thought you were on meth
Meth is the wrong drug. I don't do drugs, but I don't feel like meth isn't the correct drug?
Opioids?
I dunno. We should start a support group on this thread. Let's figure this out.
I'll start. My name is Adam. I want to quit my VT apathy.
Hi Adam, thanks for sharing.
Also, it could be meth.
I just got home and missed the entire game. Two things after looking at the stats:
1) We lost the TOP by a ton. You knew I was going to bring this up.
2) McClease must have gone off today. He averaged more than 11 yards per carry. Some cajones on that guy.
Tbf we probably could have won by 20 and still lost TOP against that team.
McClease played like a guy with nothing to lose. Absolutely balled out.
he's played great in every bowl game
30 points was the most anybody scored on Kentucky this year.
Mcclease looked Great. Hopefully he'll come back for one more year then be ready for NFL.
Hooker was off on some of his throws and our best receivers missed some catches that they should have made, but Hooker made great choices with the ball during a very tense game. (No turnovers!)except the last play
It'll be a crowded RB room with the addition of the JuCo guy, Kansas transfer, and Holston returning from injury.
Mclease has really improved - that said, he has little chance of making it as an NFL running back IMO.
You lost credibility when you blamed the first drive issues.
I mean how so? The execution was piss poor the players were off que, for a month of preparation on a guy whose job should frankly be on the line (corny) that was really bad
I'll give credit where it's due the next 3-4 drives were great before the half (I might be misremembering one here) and that's why I think hed be a great co-oc or qb coach or something where he can have some input but now all but there are points where it just looks like our players either have no idea what they're doing or just running into the teeth of a defense
I mean frankly I didnt hate the play calling on our last drive (not the 15 second the other one). We ran a play wed been setting up with the motion most of the day, kentucky defended it well. We ran a qb power I believe (?) Netted like 3-4 yards and then a hazleton drop which....my god may have been the most frustrating part outside of the officiating
Corny can't throw for Hooker - Hooker needed to get Hooker ready. The plays were there, the throws were not.
Bingo but he must accept some of the blame. I seem to remember them discussing how they scripted the first drive and in years past it always looked sooooo good. This game it looked like the players hadnt started practicing until yesterday. That execution was uuuuuuuugly and he deserves some of the blame for it, that being said he had some absolute bright spots afterwards I dont think this game is as much on him as it is on fuente tbh
My main takeaway from this game is that I am not going to bowl games for the foreseeable future. Bowl games are a time to get creative; try new things, be prepared, play loose, play to win the game. We have done none of those things the last three years, and some might even argue the last four given the first half against Arkansas (that Arkansas team was notorious for blowing first half leads, so I don't give us too much credit). Beamer eventually figured out bowl games winning his last three of four (could have been four of five had it not been for PAC 12 officiating), and he won two after the 2008 and 2009 seasons.
I disagree with a few of your points.
The Ugly:
1) The officiating was ugly, not just bad. There were multiple blatant holds that sprang the WR runs that were not called. They constantly gave UK help spotting the ball and screwed us. TT caught the ball on the sideline, stepped directly out of bounds, and they marked him back a yard. Add to that the fact that the Center Judge protected the WR every time he was tackled and helped him off the ground while constantly yelling at our guys to get off him.
The last drive was horrendous. On the first 4th and 1, the ball went through the receiver's arms, hit the ground and was called a catch. The officials let it stand. E$ECPN showed one replay after it was over, realized it was bad, and never mentioned it again. On the next 4th and 1 (even though the WR was tackled 2.5 yards short of the LTG on 3rd), Tisdale stripped the ball and was lying on the ground with it. The officials apparently said his forward progress was stopped so the play was dead, yet still marked the spot 2 yards forward where the WR fell down after his OL pulled him forward. How exactly does that work? And finally, on the TD, the slot receiver was covered on the left side of the formation, ran into the end zone, and yet (shockingly) no flag was thrown for ineligible receiver down field.
2) The LPD gave up 233 yards rushing on 34 carries by a WR lined up behind center. Our DL got little push on the outside to help contain the WR and force him back into the middle where the help was.
3) There was a WR playing for UK who should have been at central booking for assault and battery. The officials, UK coaching staff, UK AD, and Charlotte PD are all complicit in letting him play. The excuse that it was outside of a 1 hour window before the game was a cop out. Video of his crime was shown on national TV, multiple times.
The Bad:
1) Our D. We've got some good players and some just okay players. Our LB play is 50/50. Ditto the DL. We really need to improve in this area, FAST. We are way undersized on the DL, and recruiting misses by CBF and CCW have come back to bite us HARD. This crap of trying to turn a 250 lb DE into a DT has to stop. We have QBs that are taller and heavier than our DEs. Too many guys take bad angles and don't maintain their gaps. And we tackle for crap.
2) Alligator arms at WR. We have one WR that will not make a play if it's anywhere near the hash marks and there is a defender within 10 yards of him. One play cost us a first down. Another cost us a first down and burning another 3 minutes off the clock in the 4Q.
3) Not having a big RB hurt us too many times today. Run DMC did a terrific job, but we REALLY needed a Suggs, Imoh, Ore type of guy. Trying to do the job with the QB scrambles into the boundary killed us when we had momentum.
The Good:
1) We put 30 points up on a Top 25 D. And we put up over 200 yards rushing doing it!
2) We only punted twice all game.
3) Brian Johnson was money.
4) McClease.
I keep seeing people blaming Fuente and Cornelson for this loss. Do what you want. There are several times I disagreed with the play calls, but for the most part, I thought the O did enough to get the win.
However, as dcwilson has so (un)eloquently pointed out, we gave the ball to a WR at their 15 yard line when we had a 6 point lead, and couldn't get a stop. Yes the officials aided them with questionable calls. All we had to do was stop them, and it's game over, Hokies win. That's on the DC. If you can't admit that, you probably won't ever admit that not everything can be blamed on Corny and Fu.
I'm in complete agreement for the most part. I mean some of the coaches deserve blame for bad execution but as I said somewhere we seem to forget how had ocainspring was. I completely agree that these small DEs arent working anymore and I agree with Jhams adjustment
Where we disagree is that I think fuente shoulders some blame for today. The conservative play calling is infuriating. We twice went for it on 4th down and converted and that field goal to go up 6 was just screaming for a fake or just going for it. Dont even get me started about the end of the 1st half possession. I also am noticing a disturbing pattern where come crunch situations we melt down at some fucking point at some position. Like one game it's the linebackers one game it's the receivers one game it's the dline....whatever by and large we are capable of performing at all levels and just dont. Some of that blame has to fall on the head whistle and coaches
I'll never understand why something wasn't done about this.
Whether he was on the field or not we should have won.
Ask the guy who got hit why he didn't press charges.
Pressing charges would be SOFT unless he suffered an injury.
Lol... what's soft is having your opponent willingly bend over the barrel right in front of you (by punching someone on camera) and doing nothing about it. Only suckers take that kind of prison yard ethics bullshit seriously in the real world...
Winners take advantage of the opportunities presented (then go home and fuck the prom queen).
I'm not saying pressing charges is the answer... but to do nothing and allow Bowden to play in that game..? That's soft if you ask me.
Pressing charges and winning is less soft than doing nothing and losing the game.
Whit looked pretty pissed in the video ESPN aired with most of that anger directed at the Kentucky AD. Ultimately we had no power to do anything other than win the game (and maybe take some extra shots at Bowden).
I also disagree with your definition of soft. Idiotic, immature, and unethical are not the same thing as soft.
And pressing charges would have gone over great in the media. I doubt that would even DQ him from the game. It would still be the AD's call.
It would DQ him from the game if he was sitting in a jail cell at the time of the game. Not sure how long it would have taken to get him out on bail, but it's Kentucky, there's no way they bench a player for crimes. They're a lot like FSU in that regard.
"the investigation is still pending"
The appropriate response from the Kentucky coach should have been to let him sit part or all of the game. Number of NCAA coaches who would have done that to the player their entire game depended on (assuming they weren't on film standing next to him when it happened)? I don't know, zero?
The appropriate response from the ref should have been disqualification.
The appropriate response from us was to call him out on it, and beat him on the field of play.
The appropriate action for him was to apologize. Not just to Kentucky fans, but to the player he struck.
At this point, might as well let it go. It's over. Onward and upward.
Best would be to win by forcing him into a turnover to seal the win.
I was certainly hoping for that. That would have been a Festivus miracle.
Rumor is that it happened but nobody noticed.
The Festivus miracle would have been the refs getting the call right.
1. "Only suckers take that kind of prison yard ethics bullshit seriously in the real world"
This doesn't square with our Lunch Pail mentality. I can't imagine Foster and our team not wanting to beat this guy on the field.
2. "Winners take advantage of the opportunities presented (then go home and fuck the prom queen)."
There is such a thing as the court of public opinion and we would get roasted. Nobody is going to buy our brand of toughness when we go out of our way to avoid playing tough opponents. This might work in high school but people eventually figure out what you really stand for.
3. "Pressing charges and winning is less soft than doing nothing and losing the game."
You know what's even more embarrassing? Pressing charges and losing. We'd be destroyed in the media!
Hard to disagree with #3. As for 1 & 2... we'd have to know each other better to honestly discuss my thoughts on these responses... and there would need to be alcohol involved. But I would hope "lunch pail" has nothing to do with the kind of "snitches are bitches" ethos you seem to be referencing or worse... if lunch pail means working hard at the expense of working smart... it may be time to move past it.
Edit: You may have an argument re: public opinion as it relates to recruiting but I think that could be handled... everyone else will only remember who won... if that.
Fair enough. We have different definitions of working smart. Personally I prefer to settle disputes in a way that exhausts all options within my control, and I try to preserve the time of law enforcement and avoid lining the pockets of lawyers until absolutely necessary. Cheers and go Hokies.
> Winners take advantage of the opportunities presented (then go home and fuck the prom queen).
LMAO. This is one of the dumbest things I've seen someone write on this site. You sound like the high school bully in a bad pre-teen romantic comedy. Please tell me this is a joke and you don't actually talk like that?
The idea that you would want to press charges for that is also hilarious lol. You really don't seem to be in touch with the culture of football at all.
It's a quote from Sean Connery in "The Rock".
Well I'm embarrassed he even used such a terrible quote to describe the situation lol. If we pressed charges against a player for that, which we don't even know if he connected at all from that angle, we would suddenly become the most bitch made program to recruits. Good luck to us ever getting people to come play here.
I agree on the pressing charges, but someone should have called him out for acting like a punk. Absolutely no class and if I was a coach and that was my player his ass would have sat for at least a half.
He did get called out, and ended up apologizing (after the game, of course), even if it was to Kentucky fans instead of the player he assaulted.
I haven't seen it mentioned but I noticed Hoyt playing at Center most of the KY game when freshman Bryan Hudson had been holding down that position most of the season, even winning an award. Anyone know why Hoyt played and not Hudson? Any story there?
nm
Thanks for the paywalled link. Can we get a synopsis?
From Roanoke Times, on why Hudson didn't play and Nester didn't start:
"You know, those two freshman linemen are just, they're at the end of the year," Fuente said. "They're not injured and out, they can play, but they're true freshman guys that were at the end of the year and those things kind of took a toll on them."
While Fuente rarely discusses injuries, he offered some details about the physical beating Hudson took this year.
"Bryan has a broken right thumb and it's been broken for a while," Fuente said. "He's been trying to handle snaps, his ankle is banged up."
sorry about that. some of their stuff is paywalled and some is not.
Ugly: Foster, whom I love and believe is the GOAT, unfortunately showed again that his defense just cannot contain a mobile QB. It's his kryptonite, unless Kyle Fuller is playing.
Bad: Most of the offense seemed to be ready to move on from the season and our play calling was sporadically good at best.
Good: lots of staff turnover with a young staff and young team. We are either gonna be damn good or we're going to have a new head coach after year 6. From the beginning I have maintained VT was a 6 year rebuild and it seems to be coming down to that exact timeline.
At the time Fuente was hired, curious as to why you thought it was a 6 year rebuild, specifically? You couldn't have predicted certain players leaving, Bud retiring, etc. Were you just guessing? or did you think the program was in much worse shape than appeared? Fuente turned Memphis around in 3 years- a much bigger rebuild.
at the time I lined out specifically why I thought 6 years so I may be a little off from what I originally said but basically I felt that:
Years 1 - 3: Would be the last remnants of the Beamer Era
Years 4 - 5: Would be the Beginning of the Fuente Era, a young team basically
Year 6: Would be a fully Fuente recruited and coached team that was loaded with upperclassmen that knew the system. If he can't win with in this scenario then he would be gone.
didn't have anything to do with players leaving or Bud retiring because I had no idea. It was just the fact that I have always believed VT is a long term build. Because we have history, standards and expectations. Didn't mean that we were in worse shape but that maintaining expectations would make the process slower.
Your point about Memphis highlights my thoughts. Got to remember Memphis was a dumpster fire. No history, no tradition, never won anything, no expectations. nothing. It was a shit job at a shittiest program. Fuente did a hell of job there. Nobody can take that away from him. But he was able to completely wipe the slate clean and build anew. That's a different process than trying maintain a history. 3 years was perhaps a bit of luck as well but still in many ways easier to do things with little repercussions at Memphis. For example, starting a young QB over a senior. That was universally disliked at Memphis but he did it because he wanted his guy to have experience faster. That meant going through a terrible year on a gamble in hopes for a payout later. It was the right decision but can you imagine VT going 3 - 9 on a decision to start a young QB? That's just not going to happen. It's a totally different process.
Nailed it.
I totally agree! I don't know why people think a coach can come in and automatically have success early on. If they're good coaches and already have good recruits, it's much easier. If you're changing systems or playing styles, it's harder, because you have to go recruit differently, which makes the progression look like what you laid out. Yes, he turned Memphis around in 3 years, but probably easier to do in the AAC than the ACC. And don't forget that Fuente (and CORNELSON) coached us to a 10 win season their first season and had us in the ACC championship game, where I'd argue we did better (at least on offense) than either of the teams in the playoff (just in the ACC championship game against the eventual national champions), not comparing the whole season.
I think that's the single biggest problem we faced in terms of expectations and your timeline is people assumed we would win 10 games a season after that first one rather than recognizing the rebuild that was going on as you detailed.
Hate to break it to you but there will 100% be a QB competition. A lot of people feel that BB is the best QB on the team
I'm OK with that.
Best to go ahead and think someone will transfer out then.
There may very well be a transfer but why would open competition cause somebody to transfer versus knowing you are on the 2 or 3 or 4 deep? I guess JJ sort of fell into that mold but he would have done the same thing if he was told beforehand that he was at best 2nd string. So, if it happens it happens but the best player must play. For as dramatically different this team looked under Hooker, he still has loads of room for improvement or could be at risk of being passed.
Yes, to be clear I'm fine with it. The competition is a good thing and if Burmeister is the guy then let's get it done.
On the other hand, this season has told me not to take the QB depth chart at face value.
"A lot of people" say a lot of things these days, but those things are not always true. A lot of people liked Willis, too, and thought he was the best QB on the team.
I'm fine with the competition, think it should always be that way, but hope the result is better than our last off season QB competition.
That's good. Competition is good. One thing I do know is that this offense needs a dual threat QB for it to work, so if BB is that guy, great.
Looking forward to seeing what he's got. I'd heard Fuente was really excited about him when he signed, to the point that I thought he may start versus BC if he was eligible.
Hmm... That is very interesting.
It was going to take a Duke like performance for me to lose my excitement for next year's potential. I'm not saying there aren't negatives and i don't blame people on here for having a more negative outlook, but it's just not my style. Corny/our offensive mindset and conservatism frustrates me at times, but we just hung a season high on a top 20 defense and were a couple drops away from putting at least 40 on them.
1. Entire offensive line returning plus Brock. Guys like Nester and Hudson should take big jumps with a full offseason and the experience they got this year.
2. Essentially the entire defense returning including our 2 All-ACC caliber corners that didn't even play in this bowl game.
3. Essentially the entire receiving core returning plus Payoute and Bowick added in after redshirting.
4. Our incoming and returning backfield. With whatever happens at QB, i think it will be the best situation we've been in at that position since Evans took over. At running back, it looks like we'll have plenty of weapons to run behind what should be the best offensive line we've probably had since at least 2010.
This is exactly how I feel and I know that this is not a popular opinion any more. I love VT football. My wife becomes a football widow on VT gamedays. There have been lots of ups and downs. I think that Fu is a good coach. And I always fall on the optimistic side. This site used to be much more optimistic. It has gone the other way. It is hard sometimes to even log on because I don't need another place where all people do is argue. There is enough of that everywhere else. Can't wait till August. Lets Go HOKIES!!!
I disagree with your point on the targeting fouls. If they are going by the letter of the law, both were correct. The one on Conner was correctly waved off because the contact was incidental (if anything, Bowden iniated contact by lowering his helmet). The Kentucky dude LAUNCHED himself into the VT player (just can't remember who right now) and hit him in the chinstrap with his helmet.
Personally, I'm old school and wouldn't have called anything on either play, but they got it right by the new rule. If you don't like those calls, you don't like the rules... not the refs fault.
As far as your take on analytics...Analytics actually sometimes calls for a conservative approach. If you have 3rd and 10+ in your own territory, Analytics would more than likely call for a draw play and set up a favorable punt, rather than trying to air it out. See the last interception HH threw vs the Hoos.
I do agree that the game was winnable, and if the Hokies take care of what they can control, it's probably a pretty comfortable win.
The refs were atrocious. The Kentucky players were too. I was almost as disappointed with this loss as I was with the UVa loss. Those guys were punks, with Bowden being the head punk. That guy will never make it in the league with his obvious personality issues.
I agree. Also...
I'd like to see more consistency in performance, and more discipline among VT players. I don't know why, but they seem less disciplined than what we had under Beamer. Or maybe it was just that it was the first bowl game a lot of our players were starting in.
I'd rather see less trash talk, and more cold performance. You want to mouth off? Catch the ball instead. Really mad? Make your tackle. Kentucky players are being assholes? Throw a catchable ball to one of your receivers.
We should have won that game, and the loss isn't on the coaches. It's on the players.
Cold. Stone. Performance. Let's have some more of that next year.
The #3 rushing offense in the country ran well.
We scored and moved the ball well against the #24 defense in the country.
We had drops but also won the turnover battle, despite my opinion we should have won it by more.
It was close at the end and noone gave up in a very physical game in which it seems the other team was intentionally trying to be intimidating.
I could have enjoyed it more had the game ended 1 minute earlier than it did.
Or 5 minutes later. Even Kentucky couldn't have burned that much time off the clock, and our offense deserved an opportunity to win it.
Here is some more ugly for you, this coming from Ky HC Stoops.... hate talk
Wow. I assumed it was only Stoops saying, "we don't take shit from nobody" and that would be the worst so no big deal... but the end of that video is really something.
Definition of poor sportsmanship.
This is why I'm a VT fan and not a Kentucky fan.
Maybe it's just me, but I think letting him play after the punch shows worse sportsmanship than saying "we don't take shit from nobody." And the things said after that in the video that shan't be repeated...horrible as they are, it doesn't sound like Stoops saying that, but the players. Still, fuck Stoops for not coming down with any discipline whatsoever. Really shows his stripes.