I'm interested in this thread exploring the topic not of the cost of fuente leaving, but the cost, fallout, and collateral damage from him staying.
I think this could be a useful perspective thread.
References and tweets welcome.
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It'll be like when you say goodbye to someone but then you both walk the same way, but for a year.
Mr. Show did an amazing sketch about this
Recruiting tanks like a rock. Large numbers of players transfer almost immediately. Donor funding plummets. Attendance to games probably drops. It really is in both parties interest if he moves on at this point regardless. This has been a complete shit show
Imagine if you don't TKP and/or Twitter. Other than Yahoo Sports/The Athletic/RT reports of Baylor having interest and/or interviewing him, you don't know the depths of the speculation here. I kind of envy them.
he will still be too expensive to fire next year, so if he stays, it will be with some concessions (none likely tied to his own compensation) so they can put out the PR spin that he did this to get something and the 2 sides agreed so they can move forward with no hard feelings. it will be uncomfortable no matter how they spin it, but that is the only plausible way forward if he does come back IMO.
Then we get two weird years? How much longer on his contract ?
IIRC:
current buyout: $12.5M
after Dec 16: $10M
after 2021 season: $7.5M
after 2022: $5M
after 2023: $2M
Wow sad face and awkward
All that cash to fire a him but it only costs another team $1 million to acquire him? π€
And that just goes down from here.
Nickels in the couch cushions.
i believe Dabo's recent deal had a $9M buyout in year 1 if he left, and $50M to fire him. these are always lopsided.
It'll be real awkward. The sort of thing that winning the Coastal and signing a top 20 class (lol, not now) would probably fix. But when the team under-performs and recruiting is poor, then it'll be rough.
He'll fail to win more than 7 games, make loads of excuses and hope that someone will still hire him
It really is a fascinating situation, all the more so because there's been radio silence from VT. What I find most interesting is how Whit will respond. I can't imagine it's the sort of thing that can go unaddressed. What I wish would happen won't, which is Fuente getting canned for cause and we somehow don't have to pay his buyout. But he done goofed up now and I hope Whit has a way of getting the upper hand on this situation.
In a perfect world at this point, Fuente doesn't return.
Agree
I think if he comes back and holds a press conference and says they wanted me but I wanted Virginia Tech, he would be forgiven.
"I listened because moving closer to home is a huge draw, but in the end this is home." - is the correct answer.
And it could very well be the truthful one too.
I'm fine with this but I think he also needs to renegotiate his buyout and make it much, much higher from his side. Show VT, the fans and the players that he wants to be here.
ππ
I know it won't happen but that's what it would take for me to be ok with him coming back.
It's like when you screw up with your girl and you know its gonna be bad so you go outta your way to do something to help it maybe not be as bad.
"Look. I know I shouldn't have been looking at Baylor, but babe, it just made me realize what a special thing you and I have. So special in fact, I don't even need all this buy out money. Take half, no three quarters of it back" - Fuente
Exactly. I understand his reasons for wanting to look at the Baylor job but there are ramifications for it. Since he is taking that risk, in order to win back the trust of the fan base, he needs to do something. A bland apology from someone who doesn't show much emotion publicly isn't going to cut it.
A sensible take, thank you
He's not staying. He's burned his bridge with Whit.
I disagree I think he's staying. We'll see how much crow I eat but it just doesn't make any sense to me
I had hoped this was just internet wonder and/or positioning for resources. But there's an under current saying he burned Whit by secretly negotiating/interviewing with Baylor. He only advised Whit 24 hours before person interview. Plus, he's leaving Whit in a bad spot after he stood behind him early in the season (and have him the resources and leeway time make staff changes he wanted) when there was backing to fire him.
What if 24 hours is all the notice Fuente got and he notified Whit immediately?
I'm betting Fuente knew no more than a few hours before Whit. One rumor though was that Whit found out from media reports. I find that hard to believe but if true would be a major sore spot if Fuente stays.
I guess I'll never know what crow tastes like
FWIW it may not be his decision to stay.
There seems to be a strong contingent of posters on the Baylor boards stating that Fuente isn't their guy and that the leaks have come from Fuente's agent/team. They seem to think there are at least 2-3 candidates that are as high or higher in the pecking order than Fuente (McGuire and Aranda seem to be the common names).
So if I'm not supposed to trust the "leading candidate" part of the tweeter/ "reporter" that started it all why should I trust any of the tweet?
If he stays and somehow manages to frame this entire issue as him just trying to get more resources into the Program and money for Assistants, ect....how long do you think people are going to buy it?
Here's a major issue that has gone ignored in the "VT can't compete because we have no money," argument. Most of the money to Athletics is going to come from Donors. A huge part of getting that money is the HC selling his vision and getting people to buy in (in some ways literally) to their Program. Fuente has not done that well at all. His handling of the Program has been a big part of the problem, just throwing money at it isn't really a solution.
So having him come back, carving (or gouging) money from other parts of the University budget is only a temporary "fix." Fuente needs to learn how to connect with the Fanbase, allow them some access, and make them feel like a part of the Program. How about start by having a Spring Game that doesn't feel like it belongs at a Mortuary? Then, more money comes in, Recruiting budgets increase, and winning becomes easier. But he hasn't done that and no part of his actions here so far leads me to believe he is willing to do that.
This whole scenario certainly isn't going to have most VT fans running for their checkbooks. Its just bad handling all around.
If Fuente ends up coming back, I'd actually give him and the staff bumps in pay for 2020. Conversely, I'd renegotiate that ridiculous buyout and make it known that 2020 is his make or break year at VT.
For this very reason I'm going to wait for the chips to fall before I say anything I regret later. Truth be told though, if this website is any indication, he would have to play this very diplomatically to somehow come out the other side looking good. I think most fans feel like he's done just enough to earn the right to prove himself for another year, but he doesn't have much goodwill built up beyond that. He's not really in a position to be doing cute stuff like this.
I mean, if he gets offered and turns it down, then I think that says a lot about being committed to VT. I would expect the team would rally around that, and this would blow over. If he gets turned down, but its clear he wanted it, that could be awkward. Then again, it may never be clear that's what happened, even to the team. Tough to say. It feels like Fuente didn't think this through, but maybe he didn't have the chance. The timing might have been affected by their interest in Aranda, who wasn't entertaining anything until after the championship game. I feel like Baylor has not decided yet, and this news really was not meant to get out.
I'm super pissed and disgusted by the current scoop by the insiders on 247. Trying to make Fuente out to be some noble crusader fighting for our best interest and trying to leverage more money for facilities and his staff. What a bunch of bullshit and a cover story to save face if he doesn't land the Baylor job. Everybody on D is getting a significant pay bump. His shitty buddies on O aren't getting enough apparently. I'm not mortgaging the entire future of the football program on Fuente holding us hostage. Let him walk if he has the job and move on. This is stupid.
Agreed, teams are built in the weight room and on the practice fields, both of which are strengths of Tech. The 247 is a hack of a sports site that is always putting out controversial stuff. As I posted elsewhere, CJF is demonstrating a complete lack of leadership, trust and integrity, period. This is all on him.
I think he will coach his ass off in 2020. If nothing else to increase his stock so he can move on.
He can either coast through the remainder of this contract or do the best job he can to appeal to another school.
fans will grow up and realize that their nostalgic connection to a sports team many have never donated to is at best indulgent and at worst obsessively toxic and gives them zero right to get upset about a person they have zero personal connection taking an interview, let alone stooping to asinine immature comments like "fuck this guy" and "he can go fuck himself".
That would be great but will never happen. It goes against everything that college football is today.
He has every right to interview and full responsibility to deal with the tough ramifications of it back in Blacksburg if he doesn't land the job.
He is an above average P5 coach overall and an average P5 recruiter. Seems like a good guy and I like him but I won't hate him if he goes since the pay and staff budget differential is significant which means this is an attractive option for him.
The timing sucks but that isn't his fault, and early January is way better than spring/summer.
Pure speculation, but maybe he learned that the job security and fan base unrest here is pretty much similar to most other larger schools and that lessened his attachment and here we are.
FTFY. This attitude goes way beyond college football.
Considering we have 50 year old men that get temporarily banned so they can cool off after a loss, this doesn't seem likely.
I agree that those comments are not helpful.
I also have agreed with your comments that this is big boy sports and he has the right to interview, etc.
I may differ though in that there needs to be an understanding of the toxicity and the optics and the effect on the program.
To use your analogy, in my business, anyone can apply, interview for any other position. If they better themselves, their family, great for them.
But....if in the process, they create toxicity in my office and disrupt, even damage the flow then I'm opening the door and moving them out.
I have been very happy when individuals that are toxic to my office move on to other 'better' opportunities.....problem solved and good riddance.
That may be Whit's play on this......
I agree with your statement that Fuente can explore options at his whim.
But it is hard to argue that this isn't a shit show at this point.
Is it really a shit show though? Or is it just a shit storm on internet forums and Twitter? I mean it is always going to be messy when a coach leaves, or potentially leaves, late in the coaching carousel, but nobody is to blame for that, it's just the timing of the Baylor opening. Do we have any credible information about Fuente handling this poorly? It seems like maybe the leaks are from Fuente's camp rather than VT or Baylor, but we don't know that, and if they are maybe Fuente is pissed at his agent too. The players have been in the dark but that is normal across college sports, especially during winter break. We are all assuming Whit was left in the dark but nothing has confirmed that, just rampant speculation based, from what I've seen, on one person's sources who've been wrong a lot lately with some confirmation by random posters on 247. Bill Roth said some true but hard to hear things that made us mad. In the end I don't see where there is any hard evidence for Fuente handling things poorly and creating a shit show. Certainly there is a shit storm online but that is our fault.
So we kinda agree....
I think there is ample blame to go around.
It's always an opportunity to learn and certainly the fan base is a great part of this.
I would argue that if him taking a job interview creates toxicity whereby the coaches don't want to work with him and the players don't want to play for him then it was already there. Every coach knows how the world turns in their profession. Jobs change a lot.
Players are obviously younger and making decisions to attend based on who the coach is but they too know that coaches change. Hell, even with Fuente remaining there are a lot of new coaches on the staff this year. Some players may not be happy about that either. But it's a fact of the industry their in.
But I do agree that taking the interview can added to toxicity.
I agree, and add that this is all based purely on conjecture on my part.
My hope is that internally the football program is running smoothly and most of this is a tempest in a teacup on the TKP board.
My outlook is this:
VT may not be Fuente's dream job, and that is ok.
I am a firm believer that Fuente knows and understands that VT is ultimately Shane Beamer's baby when the time comes.
But, if Fuente is looking to play the money game and get a newer gig in a location closer to his roots, wouldn't it behoove him to put up results in his time here?
So all of these people clamoring that: "He's not loyal to the program." or "He's just going to leave the net chance he gets.", my response is: "So what". It seems apparent the vast majority of the VT fan base is ready for/wants Shane to take over his daddy's reigns. I'm sure Shane is made well aware that if he has any interest in the VT gig, it's his.
Let Shane continue to get that mad good experience at elite level programs (hopefully while Fuente gets us back into ACCCG or NY6 territory) then when/if the time comes where Fuente wants to move on, Shane is ready for the big whistle.
Now that he's staying, Fuente hasn't/isn't going to drag us into some state of mediocrity which will be irreparable.