For higher-level discussion of VT recruiting trends and broader conversation regarding the overall college football recruiting landscape and other schools' classes and commits.
The other monthly recruiting thread is used to share information regarding VT-specific targets, including PWOs, scholarship offers, visits, camps, and general news pertaining to those targets.
[1]. Please do some digging to share original content (e.g. embed the original tweet, not a link to another post/website with said tweet), add context / relevant information and respect the Community Guidelines.
[0] If someone would like to make this thread from month-to-month, let Joe know, he is apt to forget and pressed for time. Or simply copy the boilerplate and start a new thread.
Comments
I hate that UNC is doing better in recruiting than us even with a history of putting out a crappier football product. It's frustrating to see that change happen so quickly under Brown, especially in regards to them dominating the state of North Carolina along with Clemson, while we're still struggling to reestablish our presence in Virginia.
There. Someone had to say it.
I've been waiting soooo long for someone to finally say it like it is! /s
Are they really dominating, or is it just for clicks and add revenue for 247?
It is impressive how quickly they have turned around recruiting and completely locked down NC, which had recently become the "whoever we want" grounds for Clemson. Obviously, Clemson will still take top guys from NC, but it will be a tougher fight. They currently have 6 of the top 15 in NC, have 100% CB's for three more, and have a legitimate shot with the rest of the top 15. They won't get all 15, but they could realistically keep 9-10 of their top 15 in state. They have blue-chips all the way to 18th in NC currently.
UNC "dominating" the top 15 in NC is nothing new.
It's pretty easy to "turn around recruiting" when you win and have the ability to sell PT. UNC has both of those going for them right now in NC (compared to NC State). They also have built in UNC basketball fandom that gets them in the door with these kids. To me, this is nothing new.
I also think Mack is in love with recruiting rankings. When he started recruiting to rankings at Texas, that's when it started to go down hill for him. Who knows, maybe these guys will all turn out to be starters and contributors. But I see a lot of talent that UNC isn't recruiting in NC that look like better athletes and players on film, but don't have the star rankings that some of UNCs commits have.
Interesting. They have 6 of the top 15 this year already (Mack 2021), 6 of the top 15 last class (Mack 2020)
But... then we get to 2019 - only 3 of the top 15 (the best of which was Sam Howell, who was flipped by Mack shortly after his arrival and before NSD).
2018 class - 3 of the top 15
2017 class - 4 of the top 15
2016 class - 0 of the top 15
This statement doesn't hold up in my opinion, at least in recent memory. Mack has brought a clear improvement in-state.
You'd think so, but it has never really worked for us. We haven't had a top 20 class since the mid 2000's. Mack has a top 20 class in 2020 (first full cycle) and currently has the 4th ranked class for 2021.
It's 2020, there has never been more money, camps, paid staff, film available, and coverage devoted to covering recruiting. Recruiting rankings are accurate in general terms, despite there always being specific examples where they are not so accurate. It seems like a stretch to me to suggest that entire scouting of NC is just totally off base right now.
Understood, but the exact opposite is said of VT and their recruiting. To me, it seems like you can't have it both ways. VT's recruiting is way off base because it doesn't have star power, yes?
Mack's problem at Texas wasn't recruiting rankings, but total evaluation failures. He recruited both Johnny Manzel at safety and RG3 at cornerback, even when his assistants wanted them at QB. That doesn't seem like someone worshipping Rivals/247 to me. It's too early to say for sure but it doesn't seem like Mack is doing dumb shit like that. I agree that some of UNC's recruits seem to be overrated, but if they get a majority of NC's top 15 then they will get more hits than misses.
Its the air jordan logo
Thanks for creating this thread gobble gobble chumps!
You're welcome. I think I'll plan on creating both threads monthly to help separate out news from analysis/opinions and to help keep load times down.
is this the thread where we can bitch about people messing up the other recruiting thread?
Precisely. No more noise is allowed in the original.
Get ready, this thread will turn into an argument about hot dog water in about 2 hours
do you mean sandwich water
My concern is not UNC recruiting, at the moment at least. It's annoying for sure, but I don't know that they are beating Tech head to head for mutual top targets. I'm more annoyed with WVU for snagging Milum when Tech supposedly led for him. That seems like more of a recruiting blunder to me.
My bigger concern is that this is a put up or shut up class, and while visits are nice, Tech seems stalled out on positive momentum for the 2021 class. We've all geeked out before when top prospects have shown Tech love, but it's been Lucy-with-the-football most times, so I'm not going to sit here and put a lot of stock into a load of Texas kids tweeting back and forth.
What UNC IS doing, that I wish Tech could, is building a momentum snowball. It's been said that the 2020 class was so poor because "resources were focused on 2021". It's been said that "well, we couldn't expect much with Bud leaving and guys like Zohn and Mitchell throwing in the towel". These excuses are gone, and supposedly, this staff has been assembled to place a renewed emphasis on recruiting. Most top 25 programs, when they make these moves, see immediate dividends, more or less. I'm not seeing that yet with Tech, and given the track record of the recent Fuente years, and my overall feeling of stalled program momentum, I think it's understandable to be anxious about whether or not this staff can actually get it done for 2021.
Well said.
Momentum is partly our responsibility as well. Nobody is excited about football it seems. Personally, I can't wait for it to get started. But, I will admit that I am nervous for the staff because they have to close on a solid class and they have to deliver results on the field this season. A lot of pressure. But, pressure makes diamonds.
Not sure which thread this is supposed to go in...but we need to offer this kid.
Zaxby's and Bojangles are definitely the fallbacks here. Popeye's has to be the frontrunner, no?
Popeyes is Clemson. It's really good, but pretty new to the scene. And something new all the time, the fries are great but you're thinking "I'm not sure I should have this in my mouth....just like Clemson."
Chick Fil A is Bama. It's high hair and "My Pleasure" but they will gouge your eyes out and call you 'hon on the way out.
Cook Out is LSU. It's straight forward, it's hot, it's got killer milk shakes. Cook Out speaks in a gravely voice.
Bojangles is PSU. It's solid but it's not sexy. It's good on a Saturday morning to recover but it's not the Friday night that you are recovering from.
Zaxby's is Tennessee. It seems like a good idea. It looks good on a TV. But then you get there and it's got ranch in Crystal's bangs, a guy named Randy took a bite of your sandwich before you got there and there are two teenagers from a church group making out in the family bathroom.
We're Hardee's aren't we?
Yeah, used to be hot a decade ago. Kinda gross. A lot of brand confusion.
He must not have had a Raising Cane's offer. /s
Does this class need to be the best we've ever pulled in?
No. But we do need to get a coherent idea of a recruiting strategy with the new coaches and see movement towards the positive.
I don't expect us to pull in recruits like I do on NCAA 13 on Freshman difficulty, but I, as would most among the Orange and Maroon faithful would like to see us land a few higher rated recruits that do pan out and enable us to get back to the winning ways of old.
Steady improvement, year by year, until we reach a level of competitiveness among the top tier teams should be what we expect.
Fuente stated the 2021 class would be a full class and the goal was to sign an "elite" class. How have the Hokies progressed on that front since signing day? Tech is seemingly positioned well with some marquee recruits, and have got them to visit. However, none of them have committed (publicly) to Tech, whereas a top offensive tackle target, Wyatt Milum, opted for West Virginia. That's a very cut and dry assessment, about 6 weeks removed from national signing day.
Ideally, the Hokies lock up some of high priority and blue-chip targets over spring and summer, and carry that momentum through the season.
I think we will learn a lot about how to reset expectations for this for this class after that big OV weekend we've got multiple guys signed up for in June 19th-21st with DD. I assume we will try to get a few more key guys locked in to that OV date before we get there as well.
If we knock that out of the park and land some of those big guys heading into the summer dead period I think that we can resume our big expectations heading into the season. If that weekend turns out to be a dud then we may need to recalibrate.
"Elite" can be a very subjective word. The staff has stated publicly that they won't rely on recruiting rankings and will do their own evaluations. So a class ranked 30-40 can still be claimed to be elite if the staff really talks up the evaluations and scheme-fit. It's just like when they say the goal for this team is to win "championships." That can mean a lot of things, so expectations are carefully couched in vague terms.
I agree, the staff doesn't care about stars even though "elite" means stars to recruitniks. Overall though, Milum was offered back in 2018, has been hosted on campus countless times, and Tech had been after him hard. I'm not in the meetings, but it's hard to argue he wasn't an "elite" target for the Hokies.
Want momentum? Want wins, and feel goods? Get the 3 stars we're losing to NC State, Wake Forest, UVA, Eastern Michigan, Little Sisters of the Poor, Devry, and East Misssssipi CC.
These were the recruiting wins we were getting for years that have tapered away. We're not just missing out on 4* or top talent in VA, we need these middle of the road guys that fill our roster. They're packed with diamonds in the rough, coachable projects, and surprises --- read: Kam Chancellor --- that make an impact.
In other news, this guy currently is the entirety of Bama's currently-49th-ranked 2021 class
Something tells me that come ESD they will be fine.
yup, i agree. point being that there's a lot of time, and the order of the teams in the recruiting rankings is very very fluid. all it takes is one or two decommits and there goes your top-5 or top-10 class in any given iteration of the rankings
So maybe someone else has brought this up, but considering all the talk about UNC and Mack Brown, I gotta ask what the shelf life of a 68 year old coach is. And he'll be 69 in August. That means, depending on redshirt years, when this coming freshman class is seniors, he'll be 73 or 74. VERY few coaches even last that long (as coaches anyways). Even if other schools aren't using the negative recruiting against him, it doesn't seem like it would be more than another year or two before other coaches really start bringing that up. And then the recruits should worry about any of the rest of the staff being there. I'm all for keeping Mack in there as long as possible because I think, sooner or later, it will really start hurting them on the recruiting front.
Mack is the figurehead. They've established an elite recruiting staff there that can survive coaching turnover as long as they remain together
If Mack turns the reigns over to a young energetic coach who keeps the rest of the staff, or at least the main recruiters, around, they aren't going away anytime soon.
But how often does that really happen? I know it does when there's a fairly experienced coach, but I'd think the negative recruiting would focus on that there isn't any sort of guarantee it would play out like that. As a recruit, it would have to feel like a shaky proposition going there, at least I'd think so.
Edit: even if there are really good recruiters on staff, if the team underperforms, seems like it'd be more likely the administration would look for a new coach outside the program. Like Miami - good recruiting, no sustained performance = new coach.
He has already lost 2 guys from his initial staff there. Not even Saban is hanging on to elite staff these days.
If it starts hurting them a couple years from now plenty of damage can already be done. UNC snagging up talent and winning football games during OUR window that we need to be snagging up talent and winning football games will affect us now and down the road.
We have all discussed how the 2011 or 2012 class completely wrecked the final Beamer years and how tough that was to overcome. We just signed a 72nd ranked class while UNC landed a top 20 one. If we don't have a great class to recover and UNC again has a top 20 class (top 4 currently) that will affect the next 3-4 years at least. It's not doomsday, but we overlap with UNC in recruiting and we share a division with them on the field, that makes them very relevant to us right now.