This close to a come back win legacy for BB3 and Tre.

Tre running open in the end zone for a 3.5 count. What a different story this should have been.

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Tough loss. So many chances and a few taken away. Glad we fought back to have the opportunity for the win. Hopefully we can take some positives from it and build. Coastal is anyone's for the taking and we're currently sitting in as good of a position as we could hope for.

God damn, I already watched it live, now you want me to relive it?

Twitter me

Different unique angles.

Wet stuff on the red stuff.

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Same result.

To you from failing hands we throw
The torch; be yours to hold it high.
@BuryHokie #ThanksFrank

You sob lol

sigh

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

Looks like BB could have pulled the ball on 2nd down and scored too.

We were all debating that apparently so were the beat writers. Question was could be beat the safety and could the WR keep the DB blocked long enough.

Wet stuff on the red stuff.

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I thank the announcers that called the game are right. The coaches would not allow BB3 to read and pull. They called a give all the way. This staff tries to control all. They will not give the QB a chance to make a simple read. They need to have some trust the QB will make good decisions. I don't see us winning 6 games this season with this offense. This D is not strong enough to win games without the O putting up decent numbers. I'm afraid this season will be more disappointing than I first thought. I really hate it for the players! These kids play hard and deserve more.

Don't you think that's probably because of QB depth?

But if that's the case, they need a different playbook.

A no-option option isn't an option.

A no-option option isn't an option.

They call that a handoff.

We put the K in Kwality

To be fair, almost the entire time TT was open, BB was running for his life.

It really wasn't all that close, if BB wasn't mobile that play would have been a sack for -8 yds.

yeah i think BB was running backwards with his back to TT when he was jumping up and down wide open

Danny is always open

Here is the problem...1st and Goal three different times and came away empty. 0-12 (includes missed FG). Cannot happen if you want to win football games. Until someone shows me that the play calling was good on those 12 plays and that it was execution error, then I have to feel the play calling was bad. How do you not have a creative play in place, a go-to, something you've practiced dozens of times, that is a high-percentage play you feel comfortable with?!

On the one goalline series where we ran the sweep to Tre on 3rd and Goal; that was brutal. And then on 4th, BB rolls out and it was like a scramble drill without any play actually having been called.

Just brutal.

Love the effort from the players to get back in that game. Major props to the entire team for that. But you spot them 14 points because clearly the crowd environment had them in a bit of a shock early. And then you fail to convert that many times at the goalline.

Got to see some major improvement for us to go win Coastal. I like this team, but I think the problem is, no one can afford to have a bad day. IF the defense has a bad day, the offense isn't going to be able to bail them out. If the Offense has a bad day, the defense isn't going to be able to bail them out. Special teams has to be sound and solid. Everyone has to play well for us to win, and the consistency isn't there yet. Hopefully it will come.

I agree and believe part of the issue is unwillingness to be creative on 1st or 2nd down in almost every short yardage series which doesn't force the defense to have to play with their eyes. This creates a more difficult running environment and we don't have the hogs this year to play full on power football - you have to create some uncertainty with the defense situationally.

I have to think the absence of James Mitchell is partly responsible for the lack of creative play calling. The "next man up" mentality is hard to apply to a player of his talent and I am pretty confident we would have had better success in the red zone with him healthy.

Not an excuse but I do think it is a valid explanation

We should never even have been in this position in the first place. Our kicker missed a 24 yard field goal that was taken almost directly in the center of the field. I'm not trying to go too far down the "butterfly effect" rabbit hole, but if he makes that, the score is 10-24. Later in the game, when we turned it over on downs inside the 10, we would have taken another field goal to make it 20-27. These were both chip shot field goals that every collegiate kicker should be making. The game should have been tied at 27 when Waller made the interception and we would have won the game with another chip shot as time expired.

VTCEE 's point on field goals. Our kicker did miss one- but he made 3 extra points. Why didn't we win the game by kicking chip shots??? You must take points- always. See Bill PArcells- take the win and live to play for another drive. Out D was lights out in the second half, and we wasted the performance.
Frank Beamer would have taken the points and walked out of Morgantown a hero.
I am not going to sit here and question Cornelson's play calling. Our Execution on offense was not up to par, and WVU was on their game- it was their day to be tough. We should have kicked field goals, and worried about our egos for not scoring touchdowns at practice- get better. Never leave the red zone without points!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The frustrating thing about the outcome is Tech should've won by double digits.

Or, if WVU had an accurate QB, they easily could have won by double digits. Their WRs were burning the DBs all day.

Now finish up them taters; I'm gonna go fondle my sweaters.

Yeah that's fair too. When two average teams play, there's plenty of little things that could change the outcome either way.

Even 3 field goals would have won us the game. Coming out ZERO on 3 red zone trips INSIDE THE 5 is the utter definition of pain and torture.

TKPhi Damn Proud
BSME 2009

Correct. This WVU team lost to MD. They are going to win 6-7 games max. They are not as good as UNC, ND for sure- probably not as good as Pitt, Miami, UVA either

Tre ran a good route and was immediately open but the tackle and edge rusher went untouched....BB had 0 seconds to find anyone.

(add if applicable) /s

Unpopular opinion: this is positive news for Corny. The plays were there, the execution wasn't.

1st and 2nd down, BB3 pulls it for a win.

3rd down, Kaleb Smith and Tre are both open, but defenders ran free (not sure if the throwback play is schemed this way, but damn).

4th down, desperation, no win.

Corny's failure: Blumrick package left on the bench. Last drive, 1st and 2nd down, the play was there. If it's Blumrick, we're having GIFtory.

TKPhi Damn Proud
BSME 2009

Serious turd polishing here

Calling it like I see it, but also this:

Corny's failure: Blumrick package left on the bench. Last drive, 1st and 2nd down, the play was there. If it's Blumrick, we're having GIFtory.

If we're going to run a read option, but don't want BB3 running, put in Blumrick. WVU played both QBs effectively. We can't? We did it the week prior with MTSU. Boggles my mind.

TKPhi Damn Proud
BSME 2009

This goes back to Stiney. Who is responsible for coaching execution?

I'm with you man. This one's tough. We had our chances.

TKPhi Damn Proud
BSME 2009

Also- just like we see in the NFL- those RPO's that look wide open often aren't- or they are open once. These teams gamble on tendencies. If BB starts keeping it, they adjust

The next time that BB keeps it on the RPO, he'll be running free like Willis did against UNC in 2018

I will not donate to Virginia Tech Athletics as long as Justin Fuente is the head coach of VT Football. Enough is enough.

Unless the team has a good DE, who can fake a step, then blow him up.

At this point, teams are just committing hard to the RB on these 'reads'. There were multiple plays the other day where the defense didn't even pretend to respect the chance of him keeping it.

I will not donate to Virginia Tech Athletics as long as Justin Fuente is the head coach of VT Football. Enough is enough.

1st and 2nd down, BB3 pulls it for a win.

I'm not convinced those are reads.

I really don't understand why he doesn't keep at least one or two of them a game. It's always a hand off. Is he not that great at reading the option or is he being told not to keep? To keep him healthy? Curious minds want to know

Jack Bauer fears no one. Except Xavier Adibi.

BB has one read. If the DE stays outside, hand it off. If he crashes, keep it. Teams has studied our film and our taking their chances with our RB's running the ball vs. BB running it. So BB is keying that read and handing the ball off. Fuente said that BB was the fastest kid on the team. Our opponents listen to that stuff too.

Yeah as many people saying that these were bad reads...I mean at least the 3 that people keep highlighting the DE and OLB stayed home which the handoff is the correct read. Our OLine isn't really opening up much on the handoff. Look at the mesh on every read you have at least a guy squared to BB.

(add if applicable) /s

French broke down some of them in the film review. Publishing it tomorrow.

Curious to know French's take on the play calling.

TKPhi Damn Proud
BSME 2009

It's always a hand off. Is he not that great at reading the option or is he being told not to keep?

Both are possible. Sometimes the play is designed to freeze/confuse defenders with option window dressing, but there is no real option and the outcome is pre-determined. An example of an offense where this kind "fake read" offense was happening with tremendous success was 2013 Auburn. Many of their read-option-type plays didn't have actual option reads, as they were getting converted CB Nick Marshall comfortable. Some of that, even with an experienced QB, is just to take that aspect out of the play entirely and let the window dressing do its intended work. That was Malzahn's best team, and best offense at Auburn. It's important to note that Marshall WAS running plays with real option reads as well, to complement the predetermined stuff. The mix was masterfully done and executed, forcing the defense to always respect the potential for options, even when they weren't real.

I remember Paul Johnson at half time of a game- not against VT. Reporter asked him why the triple option wasn't working and Johnson looked at him and said, "we haven't run the triple option once tonight". lol. They were just doing " a double" option read, which was getting blown up.

don't worry, it's all a long game. When it's 4th and 36 at our own 18 against UVA in the final minutes, and a touchdown will win.......he'll keep it then.

21st century QBs Undefeated vs UVA:
MV7, MV5, LT3, Braxton Burmeister, Ryan Willis, Josh Jackson, Jerod Evans, Michael Brewer, Tyrod Taylor, Sean Glennon, and Grant Noel. That's right, UVA. You couldn't beat Grant Noel.

Defenses have figured us out offensively. They just don't respect our misdirection and pre-snap window dressing anymore. They know our tendencies and scheme to take them away daring us to adjust, and the problem is that we just don't.

Its damning that, on that last goal line stand, WVU was in the right defense to completely neutralize what we were trying to do on each of our 4 plays. And even if its a passing play and one of our receivers gets wide open, as long as you have some pressure on the QB, its panic city for the rest of the play with BB locked in on the primary target until desperation hits way too late.

I will not donate to Virginia Tech Athletics as long as Justin Fuente is the head coach of VT Football. Enough is enough.

i missed the entire 2nd half and could only watch the updates on the espn app, but how were the plays coming in? Did BB rely entirely on the staff to make the call or did he audible in to something else on any of those plays?

Our offense looked like how it did under Loeffler. That is, hurry to the line, then everyone looks to the sideline to get the play fed over from the coaches, and then snap the ball with 5-10 seconds left on the clock.

The maddening part is that this is also how we operated during the 'hurry-up' offense late in the 1st.

I will not donate to Virginia Tech Athletics as long as Justin Fuente is the head coach of VT Football. Enough is enough.

so what you are saying is the coaching staff saw the defensive alignment, and still couldn't call the right play in 4 tries... great...

Wasn't west Virginia in a similar position at the end of the game when they visited us?

At FedEx in 2017 yes. They actually had a touchdown that would have tied it up, but Grier threw slightly behind Sills, and Sills couldn't hang on.

Marshall University graduate.
Virginia Tech fanatic.
Formerly known as JWillHokieAlum.

they also weren't in an xx and goal position either - i think they made it to about the 20yd line before we shut the door.

edit: they made it as far as the 15 before the game ended.

So let's say we fire Corny this week.... Now what?

You get 1 game against Richmond, a decent team, to get the offense right for a possible primetime game against Notre Dame. Who is calling the plays? Who's getting the offense ready? Williams? Vice? Fu?

We follow that with a huge disadvantaged matchup against Pitt. We could be 3-3. Possibly 2-4. We are now a 6-6 or 7-5 team. Then, at the end of the year, Fu looks Whit in the face and says, I need an OC, but not getting a good bowl game, we have to look on the bargain rack. We get 2 more seasons of Fuball.

Let's say we keep Corny, but move play calling to Fu. That buys us at least 1 win. We're 4-2 or 5-1. We have something on ND, always play them close. This is much more palatable for the fan base. Even if we split the remainder of games, 8-4 or 9-3 arent out of the picture. That's progress.

Let Corn take advantage of opportunities, and we go hire a ballsy OC at the end of the year with some more donations and a good bowl payout.

Demote instead of tear down. We have an awesome locker room. Great kids who want to ball out, not just for us, but their coaches. We don't need to press panic and cause division in the locker room after 1 loss. Just my $0.02.

TKPhi Damn Proud
BSME 2009

Fu is not going to call plays. He said that you can't win if the head coach is worrying about 3rd and 6. He also trusts corn 100%. He would also have to face reporters questions about not moving the ball if his plays don't work. It also sends a desperation vibe to the team. It is not going to happen. So if you fire Corn, you promote Shibest or someone else to play caller and you roll with it. Fuente becoming the defacto OC is not going to happen.

Firing Cornelsen midseason isn't the move. And neither is scapegoating him after the season. Go 9-3 or better and make an OC change, then great. However, answering a disaster of a campaign by replacing Cornelsen shouldn't afford Fuente more time. He should have fired him three years ago when it was clear he was over his head.

Agreed. Fu has run out of time. He either pulls a miraculous turnaround and wins the division (with offensive staff changes at the end of the season), or VT completely cleans house at the end of the season. I also think if Fu can manage to have a decent season this year he may try to jump ship. I think both sides are ready for new scenery at this point.

if Fu can manage to have a decent season this year he may try to jump ship.

I think this is best-case scenario for both sides. Unfortunately, I don't think Fu has been a hot commodity since 2018 and have little faith that what looks like another 7-5 campaign is going to change that. From a financial standpoint, it would make zero sense for him to leave VT for less $$ and I just don't think the types of jobs that are gonna pay more are going to hire him.

Joe makes a great point that firing Cornelson at this point really would be mostly a move to buy more time and Fu's clock is already running out. He's now Capt. Smith and Cornelson is his Titanic and he chance to miss the Iceberg passed a long time ago.

Barring being saved by a desperate, short-sighted AD, I think VTs only realistic choice post '21 will be to fire the entire Staff.

I could see him jumping with a 7-8 win campaign if a job somewhere in Texas or Oklahoma opened up. It may not pay as much but he may figure he would rather jump ship than be canned. He certainly won't be getting feelers from any jobs that will pay VT-level money. Most likely though this just ends in an unfortunate house cleaning for both sides.

As far as Titanic analogies, after Saturday, the entire VT fanbase is the baker sitting on the back rail of the ship chugging a flask of whiskey as it goes down.

Corny's failure to make adjustments is mind boggling. The D-End was going upfield all day and beating Tyrell, the adjustment would have been to release Bb3 or Blacksheer in the c-gap. Made no sense why we didn't take advantage of that, if they want to come upfield let them all day and go right past them.

The other concern is having so many slow development plays, we needed some quick hitters in this game, couldn't figure out why he's setting up Tre on a hand off 8 yards back after everyone move into position. The other weired thing was Kaden Moore shifting left to block when the help was needed at Tackle- I mean you adjust

Hokies, Local Soccer, AFC Ajax, Ravens

We all said preseason injuries would test this team. This is not good on top of Mitchell's injury:

TKPhi Damn Proud
BSME 2009

I don't understand nuances of Left Tackle vs Right Tackle vs any other OL position. I do know in broadcast of last night's NFL game, they were talking about how Villanueva (a major veteran in NFL) had to slide over to RT for first time in career an played awful. Compared it to taking one or two biology classes in middle school and then being asked to give a presentation on mytochondria and literally having no idea what you are supposed to be talking about.

So not surprising that Hoffman would struggle. But you expect coaches to have a beterr game plan and preparation for a critical injury like that. Put your players in a position to suceed, and feels like Hoffman was put in a position to fail.

our offensive coaches can't even put themselves in positions to succeed...expecting them to put the players in positions to succeed is asking for the moon at this point

πŸ”₯β›²

In general (and I'm sure someone like French could explain in much better detail) either Tackle spot requires a higher level of athleticism as you are facing smaller, faster rushers than interior. Leverage and technique can also be different.

Based in what we saw Sat, Hoffman has the skill set of an interior Lineman. Don't think that's gonna change in 1 week or 10...more Fuente nonsense commentary.

If you have a right hand QB, the opposing team is going to put their best pass rusher on his blind side - the left side in this case. Your left tackle has to be better in pass pro and kick step blocking than your RT typically.

although in recent years at the pro level, some teams started lining up their best pass rushers against the worse of the two tackles (usually the RT for the reasons you mentioned) and just began trusting that their guy could win the battle enough times that the QB being able to see it wouldnt matter much. Now all outside OL are getting paid paid for competency regardless of RT or LT just because it's so important

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

To be positive for a minute, here are a few things that have me encouraged:

Holston and Blackshear have been really good so far this year. They look good, they look ready, and they are going to need to make a whole lot of plays for us this season if we want to win the Coastal. Holston did get plowed by that DE though; he was way too upright and on his heels before he even took impact.

I think the defensive coaching staff has the defense trending in the right direction. I think the defense was unprepared for the crowd effect to start the game, but got under control. They were not prepared for the screen passes that we failed to stop and tackle numerous times. I think the D will continue to improve, but tackling has to be better and consistent. I think our pass rush will be fine, I just think Doege was well prepared to dish the ball quickly when we did get pressure.

Lastly, I don't think we've seen the best of BB3. I think he is a good game manager, and a smart player that will limit mistakes. But I think he has more arm talent than a lot of the QB's Fuente has had. I think he is the best overall package we've had at QB during Fuente's tenure. We just need the game to slow down a bit more for him, and he needs more help from his WR's, OL, and of course his OC.

But I think he has more arm talent than a lot of the QB's Fuente has had. I think he is the best overall package we've had at QB during Fuente's tenure.

This part is a stretch. HH was a better passer and a capable runner. BB is a capable runner but has been late on just about every pass, hasn't thrown the sideline accurately enough for his WR to have a chance, and doesn't seem to see the field well at all. I think a lot of times he's the one speeding the game up. He's bailed out of plenty comfortable pockets early frequently. The timing thing very well could be on the coaches and he seems to actually progress through reads some but I don't think he's seeing the field.

(add if applicable) /s

Fuente did also admit that the play-calling had a part in the blame, though of course didn't throw shade at Corn, but he at least admitted they need to be better there as well.

If you don't want to recruit clowns, don't run a clown show.

"I want to punch people from UVA right in the neck." - Colin Cowherd

lip service and nothing more. Until Cornelsen is fired I will refuse to believe that Fuente recognizes he's remotely part of the problem. In fact, Fuente seemed adamant that Cornelsen is part of the solution.

πŸ”₯β›²

I will refuse to believe that Fuente recognizes he's remotely part of the problem. In fact, Fuente seemed adamant that Cornelsen is part of the solution.

Why not both?

Cornelson is absolutely part of the solution, if you believe the solution is firing him and bringing in a new offensive staff

I will not donate to Virginia Tech Athletics as long as Justin Fuente is the head coach of VT Football. Enough is enough.

It'd be a dagger to do it in season though. This is where the coach has to balance results with keeping the locker room, and extending his own career in Blacksburg. Fuente knows 8 wins ain't enough if we're not contending for the Coastal. He knows he'll be gone if the players won't fight for wins on the field (this makes last Saturday so painful, those kids really left it all on the field).

He needs to demote Corn, and either take over play calls, or have one of the other offensive coaches handle play calling. That's the best move he can make right now to right the ship. It'll keep the locker room intact, and we should get the results we want to see.

If he is still here in December, then he can let Corn go, and move on to another OC.

TKPhi Damn Proud
BSME 2009

At this point I'm just going to assume that Fuente is not willing to move Cornelson at all, be it a firing, a demotion, or even just taking over playcalling. The reason I say that is that the time where that could have and should have been done was last December. At the very least that would have bought Fuente a little more time with a fanbase that he already knew overwhelmingly didn't want him around anymore.

The fact that he didn't make any kind of adjustment last year and instead just dug in his heels and doubled down that the staff we had in place was the right one and insinuated that we just weren't smart enough to see how this was all going to work in the end? Yeah, I don't think that kind of move is in the cards anymore.

I will not donate to Virginia Tech Athletics as long as Justin Fuente is the head coach of VT Football. Enough is enough.

He probably saw our offensive stats in December 2020, and said fuck it, something's working.

It's clear, he just doesn't know what it is.

TKPhi Damn Proud
BSME 2009

If Cornelsen was truly part of the solution, we wouldn't have the problems that we have in YEAR 6

πŸ”₯β›²

I dont' disagree, but recognizing you have a problem is the first step....so it was like a half step in the right direction??

If you don't want to recruit clowns, don't run a clown show.

"I want to punch people from UVA right in the neck." - Colin Cowherd

haha now you're just being optimistic!!

πŸ”₯β›²

This feels like when Beamer defended Stinespring by saying he was one of the best X's and O's coach he knew. Yet I kinda believed Beamer, because Stinesprings issues were heat if the moment play calling and not overall offensive design. I don't believe it here.

Yet I kinda believed Beamer, because Stinesprings issues were heat if the moment play calling and not overall offensive design. I don't believe it here.

I'm not an X's and O's guru by any means but from the medium priced seats it really does seem that this is the biggest issue. The concepts and overall design are sound. We've seen the first 15 scripted plays work. We've seen when Fu get angry and says - call plays to move the ball - it works. We've seen French break down the film and point to the other plays in the book that should be called. So, the designs seem to be there. It's just 🌽 not able to feel the game and find any other play besides a sweep to the boundary.

It's an unwritten law that it's my lunch pail. I've issued the challenge. If someone outworks me, they can get it.
Darryl Tapp

I hereby propose that all references to BC be replaced with the 🌽 emoji.

Here is one question. We have all assumed taking away play calling from Corny would fix things. Does Fuente actually know how to call the plays or not have anybody else?

Fuente was an excellent offensive coordinator prior to becoming a head coach.

But, the product we have on the field is not his old TCU offense or the Memphis offense. Not sure where things went off the rails but we are doing less with arguably more talent than both of those places.

I suspect the staff's inability to recruit the D line or depth in the D backfield may have made Fuente slow things down to try and protect the defense a little. But, we are solid on D this year... so... who knows.

Fuente called plays at TCU, and won a Rose Bowl there.

2009 Stats

2010 Stats Along with a Rose Bowl and undefeated season

2011 Stats

400+ yds/gm
5 TDs/gm
Balanced rushing and passing attack 200/200 yds/gm

TKPhi Damn Proud
BSME 2009