OT: European Super League announced over the weekend

Not sure how many are following this, but it is probably worth a discussion.

Over the weekend, 12 of the largest franchises in soccer announced their intention to band together to create a European Super League that will be a midweek competition that will effectively supplant the UEFA Champions League. The intention is to create an annual 20 team competition where teams are invited in to participate over merit based on their performance in their domestic league. But here's the rub, only 5 spots will be available to outsiders. All 12 'Founding members' as well as 3 clubs that are still yet to be named, are going to be permanent participants in this competition and will not be allowed to be relegated out of it.

These teams are as follows:

Real Madrid
Atletico Madrid
Barcelona
AC Milan
Inter Milan
Juventus
Arsenal
Chelsea
Liverpool
Manchester City
Manchester United
Tottenham Hotspur

This has understandably ignited a firestorm of blowback throughout the European soccer community with numerous supporters groups already condemning the move as a money grab from owners who do not care about the centuries of traditions that exist within the soccer community.

UEFA and FIFA have already come out with strong statements against this, going so far as to already say they are exploring options to bar any player who participates in this league from representing their country in international competition.

There has already been pressure put on the Premier League to sanction heavy penalties against the named teams to effectively prevent them from representing the league in the Champions League after the season.

To put it in a light that we understand here in college football, it would be like if Alabama, LSU, Georgia, Auburn, Texas, Oklahoma, Ohio State, Penn State, Michigan, Nebraska, Clemson, Florida State, and Miami got together and said they were creating an annual competition to play for their own National Championship every year while still partaking in their conference play. It not only blows up any semblance of tradition that the sport once had, but it completely invalidates the efforts of every other team in the sport.

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IF this ends up happening it will absolutely destroy football as we know it. I can't really give my deeper thoughts on this without obliterating the CG, but suffice it to say I am not a fan of this.

If they can't play for their national team if they participate how many players would want to do this?

Well what sucks about that potential outcome is that you're hurting the wrong people with this. The players being stripped of the right to play for their countries in the upcoming Euros or other tournaments for a decision they had no say in is all kinds of backwards.... Again, I want to say more, but can't deep dive this one too much.

If they are employed by the team, they might not have a choice.

"I have a PLAN. You just need to have a little goddamn faith, Whit. I just need. more. MONEY." - Justin van der Linde

Or just go on strike. I can't see how any of them would go for not being able to represent their countries at the World Cup. You would think that would be the deal breaker.

Demand transfers, score own goals, sit at midfield. I mean you can't force people to do anything. They are so talented at that level, making money is never going to be the issue.

I saw a point on the Athletic posted that said the players increased demands for higher salaries (in particular the past 7-10 years) is what is driving this action, given there is no salary cap to keep the balance of money in the owners pockets.

High stakes poker for all including the players - take the USMNT. Do you want the chance to play with and against the best in the world and make millions of dollars or go to a second tier league to play in a watered down World Cup (aka the Olympics). Tough choices for 20 year olds.

Players' salaries are definitely increasing, but this is on the owners. If certain player's salaries are too high, then don't buy them. It's purely greed from the owners. Salary caps are purely a mechanism to keep owners from making dumb decisions (or too many), and ensure they make money.

Salary caps are purely a mechanism to keep owners from making dumb decisions (or too many)

:: CoughFireSnydercough::

Its a great question and you also have to consider if its a long-term ban (once you agree to play for Real Madrid, you're always banned) or moment in time ban.

But take the top USMNT players in Europe (Pulisic, Reyna, Dest, etc.). In your early 20's you have a choice to make millions now, playing on one of the top teams against the world's best competition or you can play MLS (or some watered down Championship EPL) and play for a World Cup every 4 years (against watered down competition). What is your choice, knowing most of these guys chose to leave the US in their mid-teens to train / play against the best competition.

I only follow national team football, but this will be a disaster for the concept of promotion-relegation leagues. There is no benefit whatsoever.

Never Forget #1 Overall Seed UVA 54, #64 UMBC 74

As a united fan this shit enrages me. Nothing but about the money, if they were using their power as the big clubs to fight against the death grip FIFA and UEFA have on the game I could maybe get behind it but nope they couldn't care less. The heads of this group are no surprise Perez has long wanted this and the american owners of Man united and Liverpool are both the same ilk. How Spurs and Arsenal are part of this kind of caught me off guard but it isn't a surprise I guess with Levy and Kreonke as well. Surprised Newcastle and the shit head Mike Ashley havent tried to weasel their way in.

The only hope from here on is that enough clubs will reject it and that UEFA and FIFA call these clubs bluff and hit them hard as hell. I'd love to see massive fines, point deductions, banning from competitions all of it.

Saw Ander Herrera release a nice statement hopefully more clubs and players and maybe even coaches will stand up against it but alot will mostly be silent in fear of losing contracts and potentially hurting their careers. Curious if the rumblings Jose got sacked after a big bust up where he refused to send players to train yesterday after the news broke are true or not.

Directions from Blacksburg to whoville, go north till you smell it then go east until you step in it

Rumor has it that Klopp has informed Fenway Sports Group that if Liverpool really does move forward with this, he'll immediately resign as manager. He has been on record speaking out against this Super League concept from the first moment it was leaked back in 2019.

"I have a PLAN. You just need to have a little goddamn faith, Whit. I just need. more. MONEY." - Justin van der Linde

Really? Had not heard this but good on him for taking a stand.

Yep, that's the hot rumors on the socials right now. Both him and Pep from Man City are rumored to be in that same boat where they will resign if this goes forward.

They've both been on record against this from the start

"I have a PLAN. You just need to have a little goddamn faith, Whit. I just need. more. MONEY." - Justin van der Linde

Good stuff here-but the idea of an ESL has been around for over a decade, if not more. No surprise Perez of Real Madrid is in charge of it, they're in the middle of a two-year renovation of the Bernabeu that's gonna cost hundreds of millions Euros, gotta pay for it somehow (though I'm pretty sure they already had it funded before all this became public).

It's basically an "Americanization" of European football in that there is no relegation and only the biggest teams participate. I think, eventually, the national leagues, UEFA and FIFA will win out and the current system will remain in place-there is just too much backlash from pretty much everyone for it to work currently. But in another 5-10 years, who knows.

However....sorry Pep, but the grounds in the Fourth Division (League 2) are definitely not full. Average attendances hover around 2000 in grounds that can hold at least 6000-that's exactly nobody's definition of full. It probably is the world's best attended fourth division-perhaps that's what he meant. That said-there are currently three League Two teams that used to be in the EPL: Bradford City, Bolton Wanderers and Oldham Athletic. Only in England.

Honestly talk of this Super League is complete rubbish. I absolutely hate the idea, and I am truly heartbroken that a team like LFC is even apart of this. I know FSG is an American based ownership, but the ideals of Liverpool are spat upon with their support of this venture.

If this is a bargaining chip to pull in more domestic money, then this is the worst game of poker ever played. I absolutely love the game, but this will destroy it. Derby's will become less important, merit based play will be gone, the EPL and other domestic leagues will truly suffer from this.

I honestly feel for the managers and the players who might have to give up international play if this goes through. No player will sign for one of these clubs if they desire to play for their country over the course of their career. Then what? The clubs get sub-par players, and the ESL, will suffer and die under the weight of sub-par performances. It's just bad all the way around, and I hope that the city of Liverpool (and others) fight tooth and nail so that their clubs aren't stolen from them by money hungry owners. I'd be so pissed if we lose Klopp over this BS. If YNWA means anything to our club, the fans, the players, the managers have to stand up against this gosh-awful idea.

โญโญโญโญโญโญ #YNWA

Would be curious to see who would call the others bluff there but honestly I could see Klopp go through with it before the owners would back out as Klopps been there a good while and won it all so maybe they wont be as worried about losing him.

Directions from Blacksburg to whoville, go north till you smell it then go east until you step in it

Dreams can't be buy

Saw this from Bruno Fernandes and it gave me a wry smile, hope more players speak out against it.

Directions from Blacksburg to whoville, go north till you smell it then go east until you step in it

The amount of backlash they are getting for this makes me want to say it won't happen, but the almighty dollar rules all so I guess never say never. It feels like what a lot of people have proposed for college football, with the top P5 teams abandoning the NCAA to form their own league. I don't think it happens but the fact it has come this far to an actual proposal from just rumors makes me think it might actually happen.

Its similar to the P5 splitting away from the NCAA, but actually worse. A similar concept to that would be if the Premier League, La Liga, Serie A, Bundesliga, and Ligue 1 all split off to form their own soccer union and held their own european title. It would absolutely suck and lock out a lot of 'mid major' teams like Ajax, Club Brugge, Porto, Benfica, etc, but for the most part would have minimal disruption overall.

This current concept would be as if they hand picked only the high rev schools, like the ones I listed above, and locked everyone else out. Oh, did you notice that I didn't list anyone from the Pac 12? Yeah, that's because the Bunesliga and Ligue 1 aren't included in this venture. And really, leaving the Bunesliga out would be like locking the ACC out of any future plans of college football competition going forward.

"I have a PLAN. You just need to have a little goddamn faith, Whit. I just need. more. MONEY." - Justin van der Linde

Well the one thing I'll say is the Bundesliga is run a bit differently and its no surprise to see them take a unified stand against this completely. They have certain moral ideologies that make this kind of thing a huge issue and hopefully some unified stand from the leagues can help shut this down.

Directions from Blacksburg to whoville, go north till you smell it then go east until you step in it

as of right now it's basically who is going to blink first, the clubs or the associations. remember that they still need to find another 8 clubs to make their 20, and they need to find another 3 "founding members" after already announcing 12. There won't be a German team that joins, and likely won't be any French teams either. So who does that leave?

associations saying "alright then, go on and leave us", clubs saying "alright then, go on and kick us out"

the most likely scenario is that associations try to leverage for a cut of the broadcast money from the clubs, and clubs try to leverage a bigger piece of the (edit: UCL) pie from the associations.

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

I'd imagine they'd find it difficult to find some volunteers of a high quality as many of the teams at the top that are being left out will likely see this as an opportunity to legitimately have a shot at serious hardware with these giant clubs out of the picture. Shit PSG by default would win the CL this season and if you DQ the prem clubs involved would anyone actually get relegated? West ham would finish second a Leciester would win the league it would be bonkers.

This feels like an extreme bluff for more tv rights money and thats about it. Saw a tweet from the Men in Blazers that its scary to think that this now makes the Qatar 2022 thing look menial.

Directions from Blacksburg to whoville, go north till you smell it then go east until you step in it

Yeah I've heard that one outcome of this is that the ESL gets tabled in exchange for more broadcasting control to the clubs, particularly with the UCL.

Disgraceful from these 12 clubs. UEFA, FIFA, the EPL, Serie A, and La Liga should do as much as possible to stop this and punish these clubs.

Lots of potential actions to take that I've heard including clubs being expelled from their domestic leagues, players being banned from their national team, etc. One of the most interesting ones I've heard is countries banning foreign players from signing for these clubs (i.e. don't grant work permits). That could really kill these clubs if they go through with it.

As something of a casual soccer fan, I don't really understand the backlash, nor do I understand the authorities by which these teams and players would be kicked out / banned from their current leagues & national teams.

the proposed structure here sounds like a mid-week league that would operate /in addition to/ their regular domestic league schedule. Not instead of.

The only that suffers here is the Champions League (tournament?) that always seemed like a half-effort at creating a venue for pan-European competition.

As a fan of team that has done decent to well in EPL the last 6 years I'm not sure if I'm offended they didn't get a call or happy they got a call and turned it down for those last three spots. Not sure King Power need any extra revenue but would at least like to see them get some respect.

Wet stuff on the red stuff.

Join us in the Key Players Club

Is it me or have we entered a "post-sports" world? Sports stopped being about the competition and became all about the money quite awhile ago, this proposal simply being the latest (and most high profile?) example. You'll have to forgive me, I don't follow international soccer even a little bit.

I just wonder as we ultimately come through on the other side of the pandemic, if there arn't just a lot of people that either already didn't care about sports, or have now realized that they thought they did but have not been watching and they don't feel like they are missing anything.

March Madness #s were down
NBA ratings are down
NFL ratings were down
I don't even know about baseball but imagine those ratings are taking a hit too

In all, about 34% of people said they were watching less sports. It feels like more of a continuing trend than a blip

Baseball took a huge hit when the players struck for a year and there was no baseball. During that year it went from being the national pastime and sport to Football replacing it. I don't think it has ever really recovered.

Yeah, I used to be able to watch any sporting event but now I practically only watch my favorite teams (plus big events like March Madness, World Cup)

regarding competition ... wouldn't this league be more competitive than any of the domestic leagues by bringing the 'best of the best' together on a regular basis?

If it only did that. Take for example just EPL, Tottenham, Liverpool are not the best teams in EPL. Long term and it can be argued Chelsea is at the same level as a few other clubs the last couple of years.

Wet stuff on the red stuff.

Join us in the Key Players Club

I think this is going to come down to FIFA making a bold stand (or not). UEFA already is the super league and doesn't want the competition telling it how to split the profits. FIFA and the league are going to have to decide if they can stay alive with potential for watered down talent.

Play it out - they ban all players from all ESL teams from the leagues, CL and World Cup. ELS and JP Morgan say, we don't have a work cup to play for but we have a billion dollars to spend on 400 players and the best players move to the ESL. After 2 years only one of these sides is sustainable - do you want LC winning EPL every year against Wolves and PSG winning every CL cup? The World Cup becomes Olympic Soccer and FIFA loses billions. International competitions will become U23 games until someone wants to get paid. I think it all comes down to who owns the talent - that is the winner.

I'll be the black sheep and say I like it. So much better than watching city beat up on norwhich or west brom or whoever. Just like I can't stand when Tech plays FCS schools. I think they should add a couple other high profile teams to this league if they can like Ajax, PSV, Porto, Benfica, sporting, and wish the German and French teams would join too.

Removing features to get people to sign up for your service is something EA would would do.

The thing is, Tech loses to FCS schools...

โญโญโญโญโญโญ #YNWA

Even less reason for us to play them

Removing features to get people to sign up for your service is something EA would would do.

Spoken like an outsider who doesn't respect the traditions and local history of the league and club that they bandwagoned onto. The only people who I can imagine supporting this travesty are some outsiders (American and Asian markets)

You don't realize how much this hurts the local people in Europe. This is a disgusting slap in the face to the tradition and history and the merit based qualification of European football. Teams like Arsenal and Tottenham getting free 23 year qualification to the Super League when being less deserving than a dozen other uninvited teams is a joke. Leicester and West Ham are doing better than 4/6 of the English Super League teams ffs.

How would you feel if Alabama, Notre Dame, Penn State, Texas, USC, and Clemson started an 8 team playoff. Those 6 schools get free invites for the next 23 years and other teams can qualify for the last 2 spots. Except it's actually worse than that because even European football has more diverse semifinalists than the CFP, Europe has a more fair merit-based approach than college football, etc.

I hope they bring the hammer down on these 12 clubs, they deserve all the sanctions they can get

Edit/Added:
All they have to do is have fair qualification to make their league widely supported. But of course, they won't do that, because the Super League not about having the best teams, it's about giving security to the rich teams

Can you stop saying "outsiders" in the pejorative? It makes most of us care even less about teams on another continent trying to make more money for themselves.

Seriously though, winning this league, or the Champions League, or the Super Bowl, or the CFP, or the World Series are all equally irrelevant in the scheme of things. But plenty of fans of teams that will never win still get fired up and support their teams. With all of the history and tradition of these clubs as you mentioned, are you suggesting that fans will just stop supporting them even if they can't win some totally made up, means nothing "super league"?

I don't mean to make being an "outsider" a negative. I'm an outsider too, there's nothing wrong with it. It becomes a problem when you start to support things that hurt the locals themselves. They are being metaphorically colonized in a way. Bought by foreign billionaires who are ruining their traditions in favor of making money from overseas markets.

Again - There's nothing wrong with foreign fans or foreign owners - as long as you have respect for the club and city too. I don't mean to imply that there is something wrong with that.

How would you feel if moves were being made to strip away Virginia Tech traditions and history, potentially hurt the local economy, etc, to potentially appeal to markets in other countries? I'm just empathizing with what they're going through.

even if they can't win some totally made up, means nothing "super league"?

You can say it means nothing until it consolidates all the revenue and forces some clubs to go bankrupt after 100 years

How would you feel if moves were being made to strip away Virginia Tech traditions and history

Uhhh....no thats a thought for another day...

Thats the rub though, isn't it. Its not even a hypothetical, as there is no demand outside of a few areas in Virginia for more Hokie content. There is significant demand in markets outside of Europe to watch these "top" teams play each other and be showcased more. Whether or not you or I think they are the "best" is completely irrelevant.

I get it, its the same reason that fans of NFL teams complain when they lose a home game to have it played in London or Mexico City. Because the NFL (and its owners) knows their growth markets are not just the US at this point in time any more. The promotion/relegation aspect doesn't exist in US sports leagues, so that nuance is going to be lost on most people.

NPR/BBC did a great piece on this story just a couple hours ago and spoke with a business professor that runs a big soccer/economics blog (I think at the University of Michigan, but I forget exactly). He discussed how the owners of these big clubs re clearly thinking about their own finances and how many of them need to generate additional revenue in order to be able to maintain club ownership. He specifically mentioned the American and Asian markets as driving that demand.

So I'm not really sure you can fault them for looking at this option. To go back to your initial question, that would be like us complaining if Virginia Tech was actually in the position to join a "super league" of some sorts to guarantee better revenue, but us as fans saying no because it might hurt other teams that are not us.

Regarding the quote, if you read the rest of my sentence, I'm talking about the power and interests of local fans being stripped away specifically to appeal to the money of people halfway around the world.

And that's what this is. Billionaires from other countries bought these clubs and are hurting the locals who built those clubs, to make some extra money from other foreign markets.

This is some colonization type stuff

I got what you were saying.

Is this really that different from "Billionaire NFL owner moves team to new city because residents don't want to publicly fund new stadium"?

It's the nature of the beast at this point, these teams/clubs/franchises have become so valued that the only people or groups that can afford to own them are usually people with extensive experience in squeezing every last cent out of any given opportunity.

I'm not disagreeing with you, and I'm not saying that it's a good thing. But it's certainly where things are right now.

At least in this instance there is something that groups like FIFA and/or UEFA can do to make it a very high price to pay. If the top 12-15 FBS teams decided they wanted to start their own league where they only play each other and name their own champion, there is pretty much nothing that could be done to stop them.

Is this really that different from "Billionaire NFL owner moves team to new city because residents don't want to publicly fund new stadium"?

It's never been like that in European football and that's what has made it so special. That doesn't happen, they don't move clubs like "franchises." You can't just buy your way into the leagues, you have to start from the bottom league and win your way up. Most of these clubs have been around for ~100 years and are deeply ingrained in the cultural roots of these localities. Also, unlike in American pro sports, every city/town has its own pro team - there are hundreds in these relatively small European countries. It's very feasible that hundreds of smaller clubs could be forced into bankruptcy by consolidating all the profit in the select few rich clubs, several of which aren't even that good.

This idea that 15 clubs can be permanently secure in the Super League and they can rotate the other 5 out is just insane. Everyone outside of those 15 clubs is just at a massive disadvantage, they'll never be able to compete. This is invite-based not merit-based.

Bruh, just because Man city is playing some extra weekday games literally has no bearing on the financial success of a team in the third division. What a ridiculous argument

Removing features to get people to sign up for your service is something EA would would do.

a cut of broadcasting money goes to the English FA as part of the UCL structure. FA pays out to teams based on their league table finish. Less money in the pot means less money to pay out. If the ESL kills the UCL, that's hundreds of millions going directly to the clubs involved without having to share further down the pyramid.

Closing the competition means a club like Leicester is almost never going to be involved... They were in the League One as recently as the 08-09 season and were playing in the UCL in 16-17, having won the league. They even made the QFs that year. 8/24 of the teams in League One right now have appeared in the premier league at some point of their existence. Manchester City was third tier as recently as 98-99

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

I don't think the teams joining the ESL wanted to stop participating in the FA cup or UCl

Removing features to get people to sign up for your service is something EA would would do.

The ESL is a direct replacement for the UCL as far as those 12 founding clubs are concerned.

The FA Cup just one competition sanctioned by the English FA, the league competitions are another. The FA is the governing body of the sport in England.

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

Interesting that you call my argument ridiculous when yours is simply calling me wrong with zero logic or evidence...

Yes, it does affect the other clubs. It has massive ramifications for other teams in the first division, second division, third division, etc.

The 12 teams are essentially paying themselves massive sums of money, which will destroy any semblance of competition, hurting all the other clubs in the top domestic leagues, and that will trickle down to the smaller clubs too.

The concentration of wealth in the hands of just a few owners decreases the economic opportunities available to all other clubs. They aren't printing money. There is (more or less) a finite amount of money in the sport and the more that stays with 12 teams, the less goes around for everyone else.

This is already happening to an extent - lots of 3rd and 4th division clubs have been going bankrupt in recent years. If the super league comes to fruition, i'm sure many more will.

Thankfully, some cracks are showing and this thing might fall apart.

It's the nature of the beast at this point, these teams/clubs/franchises have become so valued that the only people or groups that can afford to own them are usually people with extensive experience in squeezing every last cent out of any given opportunity.

This where the German ownership model comes in handy

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

the Super League not about having the best teams, it's about giving security to the rich teams

This, 100% this.

This Super League is about the big money teams keeping all the big money for themselves during an age where the big money teams aren't exactly producing at the level that deserves it. Like, really, Chelsea, Man U, Barcelona, AC Milan, Real Madrid, etc... How shocking you all are at being willing participants in locking yourselves into a money grab like this when your own prestige is trending away from UCL contention. Of course you're willing to stab your domestic competition in the back right at the moment where you're no longer the bell at the ball.

"I have a PLAN. You just need to have a little goddamn faith, Whit. I just need. more. MONEY." - Justin van der Linde

Yeah I feel like they are threatened by teams like Leicester City and Atalanta taking UCL spots away from them (aka earning them with far less resources)

So?

Removing features to get people to sign up for your service is something EA would would do.

How would you feel if Alabama, Notre Dame, Penn State, Texas, USC, and Clemson started an 8 team playoff. Those 6 schools get free invites for the next 23 years and other teams can qualify for the last 2 spots. Except it's actually worse than that because even European football has more diverse semifinalists than the CFP, Europe has a more fair merit-based approach than college football, etc.

The year is 2038. Nick Saban retired after winning the natty in 5 of his last 6 seasons, and has been gone fishin' for 12 years. Bama just hasn't been able to maintain its dominance under its next head coach Dabo Swinney. They've topped out at 9-10 wins per year, but have never been undefeated in that time and Swinney hasn't managed to get over the hump and win an SEC championship game. He signed a lifetime contract with Bama so he's set to keep trying, though. And ever since he left Clemson, they've been a mess, too, having been supplanted by FSU as the top dog in the ACC Atlantic Division and just happy to scrape into bowl eligibility every year. Both teams have been part of the playoff for the last 12 years, and both teams are guaranteed to be part of the playoff for the next 6 to boot. Just last year, in 2037, Oklahoma, Ohio State, and Washington all went undefeated, but only two of them made it to the playoff. Washington got left out -- The Collegiate Super Playoff Selection Committee issued a statement that said "too bad so sad, get rich, better luck next year".

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

Collegiate Super Playoff Selection Committee

Brought to you by ESPN, the worldwide leader in manipulating sporting culture

"I have a PLAN. You just need to have a little goddamn faith, Whit. I just need. more. MONEY." - Justin van der Linde

the analogy breaks down a bit when you account for the fact that the this theoretical Super Football Playoff would be conducted in addition to the College Football Playoff, not instead of it.

The teams in the ESL would not be playing both. Fortunately, it all crumbled to bits anyway

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

Oh and you've been a fan since the club was founded? Quit gate keeping

Removing features to get people to sign up for your service is something EA would would do.

We already have arbitrary conferences. The sport has always been the haves and have nots. It doesn't matter how competitive UCF or Boise, or Houston or Memphis or whoever else is, they will never get a shot at the title. And honestly, as long as we're in with the haves, I couldn't care less.

Removing features to get people to sign up for your service is something EA would would do.

Sounds like you just described.... ๐ŸŽต๐ŸŽถ the chaaaaaaaammmmpioooooooonnnns ๐ŸŽต๐ŸŽถ league

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

So your saying you want to continue the champions league...

Not to rain on the parade its a good thought but most of those teams you highlight as value adds have refused the invite to the league and the german and french teams wont be joining in any form as they wont support this idea.

Directions from Blacksburg to whoville, go north till you smell it then go east until you step in it

EUROPEAN SUPER LEAGUE...it just means more.


it just means more

...money

It (brought to you by Pepsi) just (sponsored by Buick) means (presented by Wells Fargo) more (powered by AWS)

As a non soccer fan outside TEAM USA I kind of like this idea. To use your football analogy Bama and Clemson should not be beating up on little sisters of the poor for half the season. Outside of Navy and in the past the Hokies the only other college games I watch are when two of the blue bloods play each other as those are entertaining games. 70-3 blowouts are pretty boring (I guess that is like 4-0 in soccer terms?). The best should play the best. The one idea I do like from international soccer is that the best teams in the lower division can move up if they kick ass and the worsts teams in the top division get moved down for poor performance.

I can imagine no more rewarding a career. And any man who may be asked in this century what he did to make his life worthwhile, I think can respond with a good deal of pride and satisfaction:
โ€œI served in the United States Navy"

The best should play the best.

sounds like you just described the uefa champions league

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

They already have a more fair and better version of this: The Champions League. The best teams from each league the prior season get to play each other in a tournament / season

The Super League is intended by these 12 clubs to replace the Champions League by giving security to the richest teams and making it as hard as possible for smaller teams to compete.

The idea is that they still play in their domestic leagues, although the domestic leagues might expel them. And by the way for your "little sisters of the poor" analogy: Leicester City and West Ham are both higher placed in the Premier League than 4 of the 6 Premier League teams founding the Super League.

This is not a league of the best 12 teams, it's a league of the richest 12 teams who are threatened by smaller budget teams that spend money smartly instead of spending it like it's coming out of their asses

The one idea I do like from international soccer is that the best teams in the lower division can move up if they kick ass and the worsts teams in the top division get moved down for poor performance.

And the worst part of Super League is that they are trying to get rid of this by giving automatic qualification to the 12 founding clubs for 23 years! (which are not even the best 12 clubs in Europe).

The principles of sports as a whole are merit based, which is threatened by this league. Teams should have to PLAY their way in, not PAY their way in

Oh it gets even worse because the teams from Milan aren't even all that rich anymore. PSG and Bayern are far richer. Then again, similar things were said when the Champions League was created, so perhaps we've got it all wrong from the off.

You are correct, Juventus and Barcelona also have massive financial problems. The owners are all hella rich tho. But yeah most of these clubs have irresponsibly spent money and they are desperate for cash now. They are going to get $3.5 billion just for joining this league, where they can continue to spend money they don't have

Of course the normal solution would be to spend money wisely like the other smaller clubs

Good point and we haven't even gotten into the farce that are Financial Fair Play regulations yet. Sheesh, this is such a shit show.

If you want the best to play the best, then of course you want a merit based competition where the only way to compete is to literally earn your way in by finishing high enough up in your domestic league's top division to qualify, the levels of which are negotiated in advance so there is no ambiguity toward it when its decision time.

Which, if that's what you want, let me introduce you to the UEFA Champions League

"I have a PLAN. You just need to have a little goddamn faith, Whit. I just need. more. MONEY." - Justin van der Linde

This is less about improving competition and 100% about wealth distribution. The big teams drive the majority of revenue across these leagues, and most of them reinvest that wealth into their squads in order to continue to build better teams and create more money. Those teams are tired of sharing a disproportionate amount of that revenue with non-revenue generating clubs at all levels (and likely with a corrupt UEFA commission). They have been threatening this league for a decade and UEFA dared them to pull the trigger, hiding behind the sanctity of the game. Now UEFA needs to wake up and respond else this is going to actually happen. And responding with punishments and bans is only going to accelerate the move. Good luck putting on (or selling to BBC/NBC) a CL, FA Cup or World Cup without 150 of the best players in the game. They do that in the US and call it MLS - good luck with that.

I am fine with these teams doing what's best for them at the cost of the UCL. None of the other schedules need change, the 15-20 teams in the Super League forfeit the opportunity to play in the UCL and the ESL schedule gets integrated like any other. The UCL might be a bit more watered down but it actually creates opportunities for teams that might never play in the UCL to make it. The only problem will be the UCL will then get dominated by Bundesliga and Ligue 1 most likely. Sorry, have never been a fan of the monopoly UEFA has had thanks to FIFA.

This is a take I dont disagree with but if it was done in a more sporting/fair manner for the game where you actually get rewarded for your seasons body of work and not your pocket book I could get behind the idea.

The bigger issue for the ESL with UEFA in full flight mode they are going to do everything in their power to keep these clubs and players out of their competitions to try and leverage their power there. Better get used to a Bayern PSG final most years with the odd mismatch here and there. Maybe Unai Emery will finally level up and start dominating the CL like he does the EL.

Part of me thinks the only reason PSG arent in on this is that they see the opportunity to be the dominant team in world football with the possible sanctions coming.

Directions from Blacksburg to whoville, go north till you smell it then go east until you step in it

PSG not being involved seems surprising on the surface but then you remember who owns them and you remember where the next World Cup is gonna be and you connect some dots to realize it's probably in their best interest to stay away for now

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

I believe PSG ownership also hold the TV rights to the majority of UEFA competitions in several European markets. They got stuck and froze up due to conflict of interest.

Some things need to be cleared up. UEFA and PL are not kicking teams out or relegating them. EUFA and FIFA won't ban players. Why? because their TV partners would never back them. England without their 6 biggest brands? Euros or World Cup without those nations' best players? TV partners and sponsors would pull money so fast their heads would spin.

Also, the amount of misinformation that is out there right now is unreal. The SL will have solidarity payments down through the pyramids (more than CL provides). This all came about because UEFA refused to do things to maximize commercial potential for its member clubs, so they took it into their own hands.

The lack of relegation sucks, I get that, but this is just the next step beyond what UEFA had already been doing slowly for years by adding more and more "brands" to UCL via expansion and forcing more and more actual champions to have to go through playoffs and qualifying. Is a 3rd place club from England jumping right into the round of 32 "sporting"? Those changes were all made to ensure the top brands in Europe were in the round of 32, not to keep soccer "pure" or "fair".

I am curious to see who the next 3 are and how they handle the 5 qualifiers. I think they still want to be inclusive, they just needed the stability of membership to maximize commercial potential for all involved (even down stream via solidarity).

I don't have to take this abuse from you, I've got hundreds of people dying to abuse me.

The eight additional teams are just an attempt to extend a mini tournament into a league and a feigned attempt at inclusivity. If the twelve teams want to create their own league then just leave it at that number. The payroll of these teams are only going to outpace other teams at an ever accelerating and widening gap. To think that any other team would be able to play against them and compete is a farce. You would need to make massive one time payouts to the upcoming teams for them to compete for a year and the odds are so low that they stay in the league that trying to sign quality players to one year contracts just won't make sense.

On the surface, heck yeah!!!! Top clubs can go off and be whatever they want to be...in a peepee measuing league. Top tier talent against top tier talent, EVERY week!!! That sounds intriguing. Not to mention the money, oh, the gobs of money to be made....

And that's where the answer is. It's all about 12-15 owners, rich guys, wanting to get richer. And measure themselves against others similar to them. Entitlement at its best. Why should they be limited on what they can spend, or how much a player is worth, or how much revenue they make from the tv contract? They are elite because they tell themselves that. They don't want to compete for that money...they want it just given to them. It's not about the players. It's not about the leagues they are in now. It's not about Champs League. It's about them, the greedy owners, just wanting more. They don't want to play by current rules. Ultimately, this leaves all of us in an awkward spot. We now KNOW what they think of themselves. We know where the domestic leagues stand on this issue. We know that CL will most likely announce some additional "improvements" like the expansion of team from 32 to 36 and group play from 6 to 10 games. And while this was a valiant effort by these clubs that raised their hands, we know this won't move forward...

To you from failing hands we throw
The torch; be yours to hold it high.
@BuryHokie #ThanksFrank

On another front, I believe the players that may get wrapped up in this should not face bans or penalties from FIFA and UEFA such as being banned from playing in the Euros and World Cup. The clubs OWN these players, and they have little say on what happens, or the decisions the owners make in regards to grabbing money. There's no reason to punish them or their country's team because of a few owners. (Although I do understand the threat in order to get backing against the league...)

To you from failing hands we throw
The torch; be yours to hold it high.
@BuryHokie #ThanksFrank

An excellent segment from James Corden last night regarding this development. Highly suggest you listen to get an understanding of why there is so much backlash against this.

"I have a PLAN. You just need to have a little goddamn faith, Whit. I just need. more. MONEY." - Justin van der Linde

That was a great piece by him. Especially bringing up that this "super league" isn't actually taking the most talented teams out of EPL or Europe s a whole, just the ones with money.

Wet stuff on the red stuff.

Join us in the Key Players Club

Extremely well done tirade. Hit the points that I was explaining to Mrs. Smlltwnsthrnlwyr last night.

Would be an absolute travesty if they're allowed to get away with it. Can't help but notice that a number of the teams involved are owned by American groups who seem to want to bring the same level of financial control and stability that they enjoy in the U.S. to a decidedly non-US sports structure.

Old sigline: I've been cutting back on the drinking.

New Sigline: lol it's football season.

by American groups who seem to want to bring the same level of financial control and stability that they enjoy in the U.S. to a decidedly non-US sports structure.

You mean, Americanizing it...with NO regulation, NO infiltration by other teams permanently, NO sharing across tiny little clubs that aren't on the same level...that? Bingo.

To you from failing hands we throw
The torch; be yours to hold it high.
@BuryHokie #ThanksFrank

So, to be clear, I agree with Mr. Corden. I strongly dislike the idea of the Americanization of European soccer. I can see how my previous comment may come across as understanding of or favorable to bringing

the same level of financial control and stability that they enjoy in the U.S. to a decidedly non-US sports structure.

I don't like it.

Although I'm not sure that you disagree with me. I don't think I'm tkping hard enough lately?

Old sigline: I've been cutting back on the drinking.

New Sigline: lol it's football season.

I agree with you. Post above didn't require a /s, but maybe could have had one. More cynical than sarcastic. But I agree with Corden for the most part. (I don't believe it will kill domestic leagues...they will continue, and might actually be more competitive without the big deep-pocket bully waving their checkbook at everyone...but who knows.)

To you from failing hands we throw
The torch; be yours to hold it high.
@BuryHokie #ThanksFrank

Yeah we're on the same page. I don't know. Apparently I need to get out more.

Carry on.

Old sigline: I've been cutting back on the drinking.

New Sigline: lol it's football season.

To you from failing hands we throw
The torch; be yours to hold it high.
@BuryHokie #ThanksFrank

Perfectly said with the exact amount of ๐Ÿ’” that I feel...even 24+ hours after it was announced.

โญโญโญโญโญโญ #YNWA

I'm not a huge soccer/futbol fan but I figured you guys would be happy to see this.

It's an unwritten law that it's my lunch pail. I've issued the challenge. If someone outworks me, they can get it.
Darryl Tapp

Backed up on the news that UEFA was looking to kick the 3 clubs that signed up for the Super League out of Champions League, IMMEDIATELY.

To you from failing hands we throw
The torch; be yours to hold it high.
@BuryHokie #ThanksFrank

That we are!

And supposedly, Man City is right behind them. Not surprising that two clubs with insane amounts of money behind them, are the first two to back out, as well as the fact that they are both semi-finalists in this years CL. Happy to see it regardless of the reasons.

Edit:
Looks like Athletico Madrid and Barca are backing out too

โญโญโญโญโญโญ #YNWA

I am SHOCKED that LFC isn't one of the two clubs to pull back from the ESL...I'm gutted FSG did this in the first place considering the lip service we get from them about keeping it a "local" club (I know, I know). They'd better make a statement soon the backlash has been strong in the city the last couple of days.

It may have been said, but it probably comes down to the ownership structures. Chelsea's (Abramovich) already has all the money in the world, and is more in this to win/for status. Liverpool's (FSG) is in it for the money more than anything.

Kop I wonder if Lebron's recent partnership has anything to do with the club's hesitancy to back away from the ESL? This is tin foil hat stuff, but what if the only reason LBJ put forward the boatload of cash, was because he caught wind of this ESL effort? Almost like insider trading. Backing away from this crap-ton of cash would potentially damage relations with a major investor.

โญโญโญโญโญโญ #YNWA

Given LBJ's well publicized relationship with and focus on the Akron community, I doubt he was just in it to make money screwing over Liverpool fans, a working class city just like Akron. Also, LBJ has like a 2% stake in the club; I doubt they consulted him before making this colossal mistake.

He has a bigger share,

https://www.thescore.com/nba/news/2144791

I can see him doing it for the money, he's a business man, I wouldn't blame him for signing on for a bigger share with insiders information that the value of the club would increase due to this league.

I'm grateful the club stepped away though. If Klopp doesn't want to stay, FSG out!

โญโญโญโญโญโญ #YNWA

Reports of City and Atleti pulling out as well. Barca have backtracked partially, saying they won't go through with it until the Assembly of Members approves it. Clubs like Real Madrid and Barcelona cannot be bought by individual billionaires or state money, as they are socio-owned. Ideally they would let those owning members have a say.

edit: new report that the 12 members will meet tonight to discuss disbanding it lol.

I believe I read (and remember) a similar proposal in 2014...which was under the auspice of pushing the CL's hand to distro more money, and make it a bigger deal. Changes were made then. And changes are being made now. It's not going to form. My only hope is the players of those clubs don't get caught in the jet wash of this circus.

To you from failing hands we throw
The torch; be yours to hold it high.
@BuryHokie #ThanksFrank

PETR CECH YOU LEGEND

Directions from Blacksburg to whoville, go north till you smell it then go east until you step in it

CHRISTIAN PULISIC SAVED FOOTBALL.

Another white bronco? The first one didn't go too far.

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

As a Liverpool fan this breaks my heart, he did a great job of making United a shell of their former selves. Godspeed, sweet prince.

As a long time sufferer of the felliani deals and such I cant say how long I've waited for this news. Now I hope the glazers follow suit and get out and let someone who cares for the club to come in but thats just a pipe dream sadly.

Directions from Blacksburg to whoville, go north till you smell it then go east until you step in it

If this thing actually falls apart, it is going to be interesting to see how Perez and Agnelli and co will respond.

More importantly, it will be interesting to see if sanctions/punishments for the clubs involved, especially the main clubs that started this (Real Madrid, Juventus, Liverpool, Man U)

It would be ridiculous to only punish some of the clubs.

I just saw a report that Agnelli just resigned though for the record.

I think the harshest punishments should be on the ones who spearheaded this movement. However, if guys like Agnelli and Perez leave, i'm all good with no sanctions for those clubs since it's not really the clubs fault

Seems like Juve have denied Agnelli leaving for now. - lots of conflicting reports. Too many reports to keep up with!

Looks like I picked the wrong week to stop sniffing glue

Directions from Blacksburg to whoville, go north till you smell it then go east until you step in it

Yeah Horncastle said at the very least Juve are denying he resigned.

Personally, I think all the English clubs involved should be docked (checks Premier League table...) 30 points each. And while, yes, this would have the benefit of putting Leicester City, West Ham, probably Everton and (hopefully) the Villa in the Champions League next year, it would have the added benefit of putting Arsenal in the relegation zone, which lololol.

While I would be a bit pissed to see united out of the CL seeing arsenal relegated would be almost, maybe, I guess worth it?

Directions from Blacksburg to whoville, go north till you smell it then go east until you step in it

I was against this until I realized Arsenal would move into the relegation zone. This is a fine idea.

And they could still win the Europa League and thus qualify for the Champions League. Imagine a club getting relegated to the Championship and playing in the UCL. Barnsley away on the weekend and Real Madrid at home on a Wednesday night...almost want it to happen now

VB born, class of '14

No joke, the next Real Madrid president could be Rafael Nadal.

Now that would be funny...let's make John Oliver Liverpool's next chairman then.

"I have a PLAN. You just need to have a little goddamn faith, Whit. I just need. more. MONEY." - Justin van der Linde

Lasted less than the XFL. I'm impressed๐Ÿ˜‚

Tears in my eyes
Chasing Ponce de Leon's phantoms
So filled with hope
I can taste mythical fountains
False hope, perhaps
But the truth never got in my way
Before now, feel the sting
Feeling time bearing down

Hey now, had COVID not hit, the XFL would have been a nice success story last spring. I was ready to get a Cam Phillips Houston jersey.

TKPhi Damn Proud
BSME 2009

Very true. It was catching on in popularity for a lot of people I knew.

"Oh my Captain..."

Love Hendo, so proud he organized a meeting with all the EPL team captains. I'm on the fence if I want FSG out after this, it all comes down to if Klopp is willing to stick with us. If he isn't willing to stay under FSG (which I wouldn't blame him) then it's FSG out.

โญโญโญโญโญโญ #YNWA

Ordinarily I'd agree that I'd want FSG out for this stunt, but considering where they've taken us since they acquired the club in 2010 I'll give them the benefit of the doubt. Administration (and nearly certain extinction) was a very real possibility if you remember.

I know, I'm riding high on emotions, I know I'd hate if an ownership group came in and ruined it all...

โญโญโญโญโญโญ #YNWA

RIP superleague lol

VB born, class of '14

Well that didn't last long

Directions from Blacksburg to whoville, go north till you smell it then go east until you step in it

It is quite striking that the Germans, who attempted to take over the world multiple times stood up to the European Super League.

To you from failing hands we throw
The torch; be yours to hold it high.
@BuryHokie #ThanksFrank