Scott Frost has been fired at Nebraska, the school announced.— Pete Thamel (@PeteThamel) September 11, 2022
So it begins!!!
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Scott Frost has been fired at Nebraska, the school announced.— Pete Thamel (@PeteThamel) September 11, 2022
So it begins!!!
Comments
I mean, who didn't see this coming? I wonder who they target.
Justin Fuente
I mean he can't really do much worse
That's the most ludicrous crap I've ever heard
I mean a lot of people make him out to be the worst coach ever, and sure he had a couple absolutely abysmal years recruiting, but he won 27 more games than frost with the same number of losses. Fuente eould be some to hire if you wanted some one with P5 experience. Fuente only had one year with a losing record in conference games (his 2nd year at Memphis). Frost only has 1 year with a winning record in conference games ( his 2nd at UCF). Frost only has ever had 1 winning season.
Fuente was mediocre, but he's a Midwest guy and if he can come to the conclusion he had to many yes men instead of coaches working together then he might do well somewhere, but mediocre is far superior to anything Nebraska has seen in years.
I think it depends on if he takes Corny with him. Don't forget that a lot of Fuente's wins were on the backs of a fairly small handful of players. What does Fuente's record look like without Evans and Herbert? Can Fuente recruit to Nebraska? Would it be easier for him to recruit to a bigger city like Lincoln? Who knows.
What if he actually succeeded there (with or without Corny). If he succeeded without him, seems like it would be obvious Corny held him back. If he succeeded with him, I guess just not a good fit at Tech?
Regardless, I think this is a long shot. My guess is he winds up an OC somewhere and works back to HC, assuming he does well, and stays in the Midwest.
Or he made mistakes at VT and learned and grew. I expect Pry to make mistakes and learn from them and grow in his role. Doesn't mean he was a bad fit, it means it was too earlier in his career.
He also had 6 years at Tech (that he could have learned from year to year, but didn't seem to) and was previously a head coach, so not the same as Pry.
I think he meant Justin Fuente couldn't see that coming :-)
I mean, we already know he brings his own Corn. Seems like a perfect fit.
My message to Nebraska if they do hire Fuente...
Maybe it didn't work out for us because we didn't try it with butter
Imagine Corny going to coach for Nebraska..... they'd be Corn's Huskers.
Or Huskers' scorn.
You joke but I'm seeing a lot of Nebraska fans saying they should get him
Yikes
Those who do not learn from history something something...
Remember they ran Pelini out of town for getting 9 wins a year
After giving Frank Solich the boot for having the nerve to only win 10 games per year.
Fun fact: Jimbo Fisher is 35-15 after 4+ years in College Station.
Kevin Sumlin was on the hot seat after going 36-14 over the same number of games.
To be fair...Johnny Manziel single handedly won about 20 of those games.
via GIPHY
Jimbo after getting aTm to agree to that insane contract
With the cash they have and the time of year, I am willing to bet they overpay someone to pull them away from a program. The hot coach would be Huff but I just do not see him leaving until an end of a season to see what his options are.
Given the difference in tv deals, I would have to think any ACC coach except Dabo would be interested in hopping over to the Big Ten.
I like Pry, but seeing Huff stick it to ND reminded me how bad I wanted him. I think he is going to be crazy successful.
I think cfb may have passed brasky pants by. only person i think could fit there from xs and os is caldwell, but hes definitely not a culture fit.
I was pretty surprised they brought him back to be honest. This is really early, but I think there was no doubt he was getting fired after this week. No sense letting a lane duck coach hang around the rest of the season and tank your recruiting.
Lane duck coach...
I see what you did there.
Matt Rhule to 🌽🌽🌽 please
Not sure what happened to other thread. But here is repost.
Imagine having so much money as a program you don't even wait 20 days to fire someone when the buyout drops from 15 million to ONLY 7.5 million. That's 375,000 a day difference.
That is definitely a staggering amount of money to eat for 3 weeks difference.
First thing, without the new TV deal I don't think there's any chance Nebraska pulls that trigger.
I do, though, think there is a psychological component to it in regards to the players. If you keep an obviously lame duck coach around an extra 3 weeks just to save money, it's got to leave an impression that saving money is more important than winning. Essentially, the school's bottom line trumps the interest of the players. Particularly in the Transfer Portal era, I can see where that could be harmful to keeping key players in the Program.
I thought much the same about VT in 2021 and Fuente, when everybody and his brother knew he wasn't coming back, and the team just kind of stagnated and then we were left with essentially bits and pieces to put together for the Bowl Game after a mass exodus.
Honestly, that's a really good lesson.
Don't necessarily disagree, but in the days of six-figure NIL deals for 17 year-olds, football staffs the size of small armies, and facilities to rival Luxury resorts, if you're not keeping up, then you're just falling further behind.
Bama, Ohio State, TxA&M, ect, ect are all going to keep pushing the envelope and that has been a successful approach for them.
Is that same approach wise or even practical for VT and similar Programs? eh....maybe not. As a fan and alumni, do I want to see VT compromise other University priorities to go all-in on Football? No, not really.
But Nebraska envisions itself as a Program that belongs in the same category as the "Elites." I think the perception that they are trying to save money by keeping a Lame Duck could be damaging to that.
It will be interesting to see in a few years if recruiting had changed with the NIL. I think the transfer portal is a bigger issue than 17 year old getting a couple hundred thousand dollars. Bama, OSU, Texas, A&M, OU, UGA, UF, USC have been getting to top recruits for decades. When is the last time VT won a recruiting battle for a blue chip recruit with one of those schools (I can only think of Doug Nestor). VT has had five 5* recruits all time, most of those programs can pull than in a single year (not every year, buy most have big years recruiting). I don't think the NIL will change recruiting like people think becuase the players were going to the schools with booster money anyways.
Now what happens when we get a Darren Evans type at VT, he breaks out and needs money for his family? Now some other program can come in and offer him a great deal to play for them and he can stay in college another year to improve draft stock. That's what really sucks for the fans. Great for the guys in Darren's situation though.
this is where the damage to what is college football will come in. It will hamper the middle range of teams that are capable of having a great year or two every now and again.
I agree that it won't change where top recruits go b/c the guys who were going to go to Bama were going to go there regardless of any NIL deal. that just helps secure it and maybe increases the fighting between the blue bloods. It's more of a can Bama get said 5* or will OSU get him. It won't be can VT get the 5* or will the NIL at a blue blood lure him away. He already wasn't coming to VT unless it's just been a dream school of his growing up or family ties or something.
But you also have kids in these programs jumping into the portal and going where they get to play - one example being JT Daniels leaving UGA for West Virginia. Georgia and Bama lost a number of kids to the portal. It's a challenge for the big programs too.
Well JT did start out at USC til he got beat out there, then transferred as you stated. He was one that was going to go for PT as you also said. Good Georgians think alike.
And now we get to see him in a new way on Thursday. Hope he likes the sound of Enter Sandman turned up to 11.
The lavish over-the-top buyouts are dumb, but maybe players see it differently. But, I'm guessing most college-age football players are indifferent to the buyouts as it does not directly relate to them or any compensation they could receive from NIL.
And Jimbo's buyout at TA&M is something like $90M, so I don't think they'll ever fire Jimbo even if he loses every game this year. One of the worst contracts of all sports all time, but I digress.
Yeah, but who coaches out the rest of the year? Does keeping one of the coordinators around solve the (immediate) problem? Do they have an out of work HC in mind they could bring on right away?
Yea! What happened to the other thread...the first one to come out with the breaking news?!?!?! There's a conspiracy afoot...
i refreshed just to make sure i didn't double post and then posted. the tweet was <5 min old when i did, didn't ever see another thread. maybe a different mod could chime in on this
I deleted the other one. Yours was first by a minute or two, but had an actual embedded tweet and had garnered more comments that were more diverse in nature. The other thread had basically one thread/subthread talking about the same thing. Rather than leave two active coaching carousel threads, I left the one that I thought had more value to the community.
Oh dangit, I thought mine was first. I submit to the faster poster.
I get it. It's a lot of turmoil for the players. You have a decent roster, an established OC, and an interim with ties to the school who you may want to give a shot.
Personally, I think they swing a big. Matt Campbell, Mark Stoops, someone like that.
campbell would make sense -- they should absolutely go shopping in the "Semi Power 3" for a coach instead of looking for G5 (obv FIckell is a good hire but i don't think he'd go). Hard for me to see anyone from SEC going there -- esp Stoops who has a great gig. He can top out at 9 wins and they'll be happy with him bc basketball is king at UK
They are playing the long game. It's smart. Alberts just told the world that we are a football school and won't settle for losing to Ga Southern. Period. That will resonate with fans and recruits for years to come. Whit should have fired Fu after the ODU debacle- the next day. Yeah, the rest of the year might suck and you might lose a few recruits, but the message is much more important. Alberts will not tolerate losing to Ga Southern- period. Does not care about the buyout. That is what football schools do.
The list of schools than just write off 7.5 million instead of waiting 20 days isn't that long. Not even the entire Big Ten nor SEC can do that.
So were we supposed to fire Pry after last week?
Every situation is different. If Frost had Fuente's resume leading up to the Georgia Southern loss, he'd still be there. The dude had 15 wins over his first 4 seasons, let's not act like they cut ties at the first sign of trouble and sent a message.
Edit: To clarify, I'm referring to Fuente's resume pre-ODU.
Ah yes the long game of showing just how serious you are by allowing Frost to coach two games this season. That's a brilliant strategy by Nebraska. Nebraska, where football matters except when we hire coaches that have terrible records like Bill Callahan who has as many winning seasons as losing seasons in CFB, or Mike Riley that has 1 more winning season that he does losing seasons, or Scott Frost that only has had 1 winning season in his career.
When they fired Solich it was for football reasons, and lots of people understood, but you don't fire Solich for Bill Callahan. When they fired Pelini everyone understood why, but you don't fire him for Mike Riley.
What Nebraska did today was just another step in their long list of how not to running a football program. They are just admitting they don't know what they are doing and most likely will make another bad hire.
Que Fuente to Nebraska.
I'm really shocked they fired him before the buyout dropped. It wasn't that much longer and losing more games isnt going to hurt them more than they are already hurting at this point.
Edit: what Fireman said
Nebraska seems like a great place for Urban Meyer to take over and sink the program even further than it already is!
Urban, for all his damning characteristics, is as good of a college coach as there has ever been. If he went to Nebraska, you best believe they wouldn't be the absolute train wreck they've been for the last 10-15yrs. Not saying he'd take them to the top by any means, because *damn* but they'd see a division title in his time.
Correct- in a sort amount of time he would have a bunch of 5 star players on that team and they would be blowing out all teams not named michigan or ohio state. Quickly.
Not sure if Urban will be better or not in the NIL universe. He was really good at getting the illegal benefits to his players when hiding them. Now when it is all open and upfront that could affect his game.
I had wanted to post what the over-under was for Frost lasting the year. Did not think the trigger would get pulled this fast.
Scoot Froost him right out the door
how much did frott scost?
15 million dollars
Come on, Huskers. It's just too perfect.
I'm just stunned at that gif. WTF is that?
Its one of the Children of the Corn all grown up.
It looks like it would be something out of a live action adaptation of a cartoon that aired as a made-for-TV movie on FOX in the mid '90s.
I am honestly sad for Frost. Imagine if you fail at your dream job.
This is why I'll never accept my dream job, failure, or just hating it would suck a lot
I mean, if I got laid 15 million to get fired from my dream job of doing nothing I'd be pretty alright
And now he can't fix it after this response.
FTFY
But at least he got to have his dream job and make a LOT of money failing at it! Most people don't ever get their dream job.
I'll take a cool 13 mill to be told I suck at my job I should just retire
Can I upvote this $15,000,000 times?
Sure. Please send payments to my Venmo for each additional upvote. I'll see that it gets sorted out.
that's only enough to cover my Beard. that'll be another $15,000,000 for the rest of me
Wait. So the Beard has a beard?
not a beard.
A Beard.
THE Beard?
The Beard has a Beard. Or is it The Beard has The Beard? We need a meme to answer this I think.
I can't resonate with anyone feeling really bad/sad for Frost. Yea it would suck to fail at your dream job, but to be paid 15 million to be fired? Sign me up! Anyone with a brain would take 15 million to get the can... People get fired all the time. Does it suck? Yes... but such is life. A lot of people (if not majority) get fired or let go from jobs they enjoy for multitude of reasons, and only get a couple months worth of pay. Some reasons being out of their control. But do I feel sorry for him. lol no. He probably went out to the nicest steak restaurant with his family that night, and planning a month's long vacation. Scott Frost will be just fine. He'll find a new gig next year most likely, even if it's a coordinator position or a smaller school coaching job.
Is money everything? No. Does it buy happiness? Not always (but I could argue it's a whole lot closer to yes than no)... Does it make life much more easier and enjoyable? Fuck yes.
"What Time Do You Want Me To Leave, And What Door You Want Me Out Of, Brother?" - Coach O
Yep- his main job is to win football games. When you blow 2 14 point leads to northwestern and lose to Ga Southern, you get fired. he was well below .500 at a football school. If he doesn't win his division this year, Jimbo fisher is going to be fired too- and he wins .700% of his games. Thats life
How much is Jimbo's buyout? Not saying TAMU boosters wouldn't pony up. But didn't he sign a ~$100mm contract?
He was extended in 2021, $9m/year for 4 years, 100% guaranteed. So $27m buy out?
I don't think you fire him now, just because that class of 22 recruiting class is soooo damn good. If he gets 8ish wins this season, and 10ish wins next season, he's fine.
That was a tack-on to his existing contract, and his buyout is for the entirety of the contract, so I think it would be a little less than $90mil now, unless he has an automatic re-up.
Source
Pretty sure it's the remainder of the contract; TAMU is not going to fire him, then pay him a second time for coaching the 2019 season.
Edit: Whelp, I was flat out wrong about this.
Right, the entirety of the remainder of the contract, so the 4-year extension in 2021 put it at $95 mil for the next ten years, so now he's at $95m minus whatever he's been paid since then.
So, still a shit ton of money.
*checks calculator* Yes, I believe that's right
Not sure what you're wrong about? Unless it isn't a buyout based on how much time is left but rather more like a penalty for firing him early that doesn't translate to direct year to year salary for what he has left.
Because you're right, they're not going to pay him again for coaching the 2019 year.
They had calculated the buyout as just that 4 year, extension without accounting for the fact it was topping up the original 10-year deal to make it another 10-year deal.
A lot of money either way, though.
Universal truths:
Alive is better than dead.
Winning is better than losing.
Rich is better than poor.
100%
I've never understood people who strongly believe money doesn't buy happiness... Do you need a car to get to work? no but it sure does help. Do you need running shoes to complete a marathon? No but it sure does help. Do you need a bed to fall asleep? No but it sure does help.
I can keep going, but as you said... better to be rich than poor.
I think it's more so that once you meet a minimum threshold for quality of life, there is diminishing return on "happiness" as money scales. There are plenty of miserable rich people... mo money mo problems
eh
Money doesn't buy happiness. It buys things. I'm never going to try telling anyone that "better to be rich than poor" is wrong, or false or anything. But it's not because money buys happiness. I've seen people with next to nothing who are much happier than folks who have way, way more than they need. I've also seen miserable poor people and happy rich people. Money has 0 impact on happiness, either way.
The point of "money doesn't buy happiness" isn't that "money isn't good" but rather "happiness isn't bought"
You may well be right but I have to laugh when rich people tell us plebs that money doesn't buy happiness. How about you give me all your money then and let me find out for myself?
Money doesn't buy happiness, but it does remove some of the reasons for being miserable. While also likely adding others.
As the great Kanye West says "Having money ain't everything, not having it is"
Once you get past the basics and the nice to haves, Money brings you margin for error. It does not bring you fulfillment. But having a greater margin for error means it's easier to roll with the punches.
this is fair
Money is absolutely a useful tool and in the right hands it can go a long, long way. In the wrong hands, it can lead to a lot of pain. The relationship between money and happiness is not correlated. At. All.
But having money, especially in our society, is a big security blanket. Our culture and economy put so much emphasis on money that people believe they need to have lots of money to be happy (or, at least, to buy things to make themselves happy). And our economy is driven by people buying things (mostly, things they don't need) so ads are cleverly designed to influence people into buying things that will "make them happier" and, thus, people believe they need money to buy the things that the ads tell them they need to be happy. So, of course people who have no money think that money is everything. Because, to them, it's the only way to get the things they've been told will make them happy.
We're led to believe that everything revolves around money (and, I suppose, there may be some truth to that). But money does absolutely nothing for your actual happiness. Whether you have a bunch of it or none of it has no real bearing on whether you're happy or not. There's happy poor people and happy rich people. There's miserable poor people and miserable rich people.
I think we're too focused on material happiness. The one thing money can buy is freedom. Financial security is one of the best things you could have. Rich people don't have to work a normal 8-5 their entire lives just to be able to have enough money to make ends meet with in retirement. Money gives you the opportunity to decide what to do with your life without anyone telling you what to do or how to do it. That absolutely equates to happiness.
This - Money means that when you make an honest mistake and get speeding ticket, instead of spending 5 hours showing up to court and hoping that the cop doesn't show up, you can just pay your $200 fine and be done with it. It means that when your car breaks down, you can afford to fix/replace it instead of driving it around for a month hoping it doesn't die. It means that when you're exhausted after a weekend of taking your kids to 15 different little league games, you can pick up dinner instead of spending an hour or 2 cooking. It means if your employer does something that doesn't jive with you, you can leave them behind instead of being forced to put up with it.
I could go on and on, but I completely agree with you.
Imagine if William Wallace had money back in the day.... we would have never been able to enjoy the movie Braveheart.
Some forget that the saying is NOT that "MONEY is the root of all evil"; it's "the LOVE of money is the root of all evil".
Also "happiness" is a temporary state of affairs. "joy" is an attitude and eternal. To me having money gives one the opportunity to help more other people in less fortunate circumstances. I could have far more wealth than I do, but choose to help family, friends, and even some strangers in need. Being able to do that makes me wealthy in way more meaningful sense than money.
Late to this comment however I cannot leg this enough.
You my friend imo have figured out what most will never figure out.
He has a pretty reliable source.
Actually, it's the love of money is a root of all kinds of evil (though I acknowledge some translations may be what you wrote). That is, there is evil rooted in things not money. Otherwise, I agree with your post which was very well stated.
As my grandmother used to say in broken English "money not everything". As my grandfather used to say in reply... "no money no funny"
A college kid wrote home to his dad "no mon, no fun, your son." His dad replied "too bad, so sad, your dad."
I prefer Anthony Jeselnik's story about his grandma and him needing money.
While it may be better to be rich than poor, the less fortunate (financially) have a mixed blessing in believing that money will solve all of their problems. They say the wealthy have to worry about everything except money.
Winning beats losing
Losing beats getting stomped
Getting stomped still beats not playing
This haiku is bad
Syllable pattern is wrong
Awarded no points
The moderator is right,
It's not even worth trying to fight.
But while your haiku
Will simply not do,
My limerick is pretty dang tight.
It wasn't a haiku.
It was the "Rules of Competition" that was given out during academic team competitions in college.
Man this haiku is even worse lol
LOL!
I am not so sure
About the last statement you made
Still musing this one
This. I think it's actually creating bad incentives. Not that I think Frost was trying to get fired, but when in the back of your mind you have a $15M parachute, how does one react? I don't know, but it's got to have at least some demotivational effect. How could it not?
Think about Jimbo Fisher. If he gets fired this year without cause, he get's $95M. Why on earth would he try to win another game? You can't be negligent and derelict, but why not do barely enough to perform your job, get fired, and live in a mansion in Miami for the rest of your life? Or, why even stress whether you coach another game in your life? I'm sure he loves the game and coaching, but I imagine he can find something else to love for $95M.
That is a very interesting and smart point you make. Some people will say for the love of the game or one's self pride, but no way someone's pride or love for the game would turn down that kind of money to keep "working"
Why would he try to win another game? For the same reason Fuente was trying to win games despite everything. When you eff up bad enough, nobody wants to hire you. Working 10 more years for 7 million a year beats a $15M buyout any day of the week if nobody wants to hire you after you collect the $15M.
That particular comment was about Fisher, who signed a $95M guaranteed contract. In regards to Frost, I think the buyout can creep in as a disincentivizing factor that can potentially affect how one coaches.
And honestly, when things are going south as they were in Lincoln, I can easily see a $15M parachute being disincentivizing enough that he can think to himself, "yea, a house on the beach in FL for the rest of my life has to be better than this."
Will Frost work again? Sure. Does he ever need to grind again to make money? No. Will he grind again? Depends on what his personal goals are.
I don't think buyouts create any disincentive to win or succeed. To get to a head coaching position at the D1 level (and especially at the P5 level) you are typically extremely competitive and hate to lose/fail. The buyout is there as an insurance policy, but I don't think many coaches think "it doesn't matter, I get $15mil even if I mail it in" except at the very, very end (e.g. when Whit told Fuente he wasn't coming back next year, or maybe a game or two before.)
No joke! I'd like to think I would handle it like Coach O did!
He knew they were crazy when they hired him. Glad he has a sense of humor.
But seriously, even in my 40's I could retire off that amount.
what are you spending every year where you couldn't retire on that in your 20s?
Happiness?
premiums and co-pays
Preach. Someone gives me $17m to fire me, I'd never work another day in my life (aside from in the brewery that I would open)
Roadside bbq stand here
Time to open a bookstore with a liquor license
Tequila Mockingbird
I'm also fond of "Last of the Mojitos" and "Ale of Two Cities"
One Fish
Two Fish
Drink Like
A Fish
I HAVE THAT RECIPE BOOK
I happen to like Rye and Prejudice, Love in the time of Kahlua, Remembrance of Things Pabst, The Lime of the Ancient Mariner, and A Rum of One's Own
whynotboth.gif
With a windfall like this, I'd go with either (1) ice cream or frozen custard stand or (2) one of those little push cart grill things for street vendors as my semi-retired/keep from being bored job.
I'd eat all the inventory and go broke.
Mack Brown ain't careful he'll get fired after going 3-0
Has to be tough to fire a QB who won you a natty. From my life experience it's never good to double back though. Usually when you exit a room and come back you hear people talking about you or eat a fart lol.
Wonder if Nebraska will make a move for Fuente or Urban to "finish" out the year as an interim coach.
Nebraska can be Iowa. No reason they can't. Win 8-10 games a year, be physical, tough, don't beat themselves. That clown Callaghan messed them up for decades. Pelinni wasn't terrible, but they lost their identity years ago. They need to get a tough nosed coach in there- not a nuheisel or fuente type
Let's be honest, there is probably a minority there that would love Pelinni back. He always had at least 9 wins.
Every job opening I see I have yet to even see Fuente's name on any of the lists which should tell you where his stock is at the moment.
Not just that, but you can't even find his name in a Google news search. The guy has vanished off the football world.
To be fair, if you just scammed an entity out of millions of dollars, you'd lay low for awhile too.
Coaches get fired all the freaking time for poor performance and get buyouts. We just haven't had to deal with it because we had a really good coach that stuck around for 30 years. If you and others don't want to have it happen again here, everyone should pony up a lot of donations so the next time we get a really good coach, we can afford to pay him what the competition offers.
We bitch and moan about having to pay Fuente, but the fact is he won 6 games. Some schools have to buy out guys on the tail end of a couple seasons where they win 2 or 3 games. And then they get another not good coach and buy him out after 3-4 years.
I actually think Fuente can be a decent head coach. He was in over his head here at VT. I think he underestimated what was needed to sustain success and engage the fan base. He'll need a specific situation, more of a backbone (he can't keep dead weight around on the staff) and someone on staff who knows how to manage a roster. , but I think he could succeed somewhere.
I don't hate the guy, I just think he was a failure here in Blacksburg.
He needs to be an NFL assistant. He's not a people person. In the NFL is all "ball" and he can try to draw up plays etc. He's a football guy, not a people guy. The days of woody hayes, joepa, and Bo Schembeckler are over in college football. the head guy has to be a salesman/CEO. Could he win games in the G5 as a head coach? sure
I honestly think Fuente's next job will be as an OC.
Agree and I think Coordinator is his ceiling at the P5 level.
He did a terrible job at fan and media engagement during his entire tenure here. His lack of success in Recruiting was only eclipsed by his inability to retain players in the Program which was staggering (and mostly pre-NIL). You have to be able to have a persona that people can identify with to be successful at this level.
Beyond that, I really question his aptitude at Talent Evaluation. The Roanoke Times had a interesting story after his firing about how he slow-played Greg Dorch (who is now in the NFL on a 53 man). He told him he "recruited differently"..it was laughable.
Fuente's "best" WR recruit couldn't make it past OTAs on an NFL Roster.
That's just what I can come up with off the top of my head.
This Program was so broken under Fuente, I just cannot imagine how he could make it work as the HC at another P5.
Not starting an argument bc Dortch was all-conference and good player and obviously talented -- but he was undrafted, bounced around 4 practice squads for 3 years and probably still would be if the cardinals didn't have injury/suspensions at the top of their wr depth chart. obv you can't plan for that and can only take the opportunities you're given, but career trajectory is razor thin margins from being similar to Tre's and his major differentiator in continuing to hang around practice squads is likely his abilities as a PR, not as a WR.
but either way, woof boy in looking back at Fu's WR crootin
The best example is Malik Willis. Fu said he couldn't play QB, and he was drafted as a QB in the 3rd round of the draft.
I'm surprised he's not at the Alabama School for Wayward Coaches already
this.
Anybody wanna speculate on Marcus Freeman? Yikes! If this guy doesn't get it together fast at ND, he will be toast. Remember when he was on our long list?
This year could be rough, but if ND let's him stick around for a couple years he'll probably be fine. It's become apparent that Kelly bounced at the right time with not a lot going for them on offense. And Freeman is out recruiting what Kelly was doing at ND.
They had to know they were committing to Freeman for the long haul when they hired someone regarded as a rising star. Gotta give him some time to grow in to it.
As someone who spent a decade living near South Bend, I'm not convinced the fans there have the patience for anything short of some mystical half Jesus, half Nick Saban, half Lou Holtz super coach.
Oh you mean this:
Sounds like a Super Shredder to me
The Omaha World Herald should have thought about the success rate of coaches before publishing this...(credit to /u/blackcat_1824)
Wow. That is some serious delusion. I saw something similar a few years back where an ND writer made this huge fan fiction piece on Urban Meyer getting hired by ND instead of Florida and Tebow leading them all the way. It was stunningly ridiculous.
To be fair we did have an empty trophy case for years that was reserved for a National Title Trophy. We got raked over the coals by other fan bases for that. We of course thought it was not and would be filled sometime in the 2000's what with our O&M glasses and all.
Homerism aside, that was a very attainable goal for a while for the program. I think for several years we were within grasp of a natty and it served as motivation for the program. We were like that blue collar school that built from the ground up and took the nation by surprise, and ESPN loved our story. I agree though it got pretty lame after it became clear our standards had fallen to non-title level and the program stagnated. But writing fan fiction about wins that never happen and quotes that were never made, that's next level.
No. 2 Texas, No. 3 USC, No. 4 Florida
This is all I needed to read to know they were living in the past
You know, I've been staring at this thing for a while and every insane sentence in it, but I can't get over how, even in their wildest fantasy, they were still on the outside-looking-in of a four-team playoff.
Cue the "you're not the manager even in your own fantasy" scene from The Office...
an amazing bit
Bronco will unretire. Strong #sauces
Nebraska makes way too much sense, but keep an ear out for his name.
Nebraska should really go after Matt Campbell from Iowa St. The guy knows how to get some talent (not a ton) to an underfunded place like Ames and develop. They need a guy who can do more with less especially given their disadvantages compared to where Nebraska wants to be.
Bronco to Nebraska makes zero sense to me. Nebraska can pay $8m+/year. It's not an 'easy' job like LSU/OSU/Bama, etc, but they have 25 blue chip players on roster. They have a rabid fanbase, a supportive athletic director, and all the infrastructure in place to compete in the top 20. Why would they settle for Bronco?
optionoutcome)Hell, I'd take Fuente over Bronco.
Edit: two phrases
I would not take Fuente over bronco. Thought bronco was actually doing a good job with the shit he has and has to deal with at UVA. Thought Fuente did less with more tbh
Bronco is weird af and completely unorthodox. But he got more mileage out of UVA than anyone else could have realistically.
Unorthodox? You're telling me this isn't a typical conditioning drill in football?
Nah, completely normal.
Words fail me..and I'm a pretty decent writer!!
The difference is the kids probably had fun during that drill. They probably didn't do it regularly and breaking up a set of normal drills with an event isn't a bad idea.
Not in any situation IMO.
Bronco got a whole lot out of a whole lot less than did Fuente. Beyond that he started from day 1 building culture, something Fuente failed to do his entire tenure, and actually built said culture. Additionally, he didn't have near the problems managing a roster like Fuente did. He's better in every single way with recruiting being a wash since Bronco actually went after kids to fit that unique scheme despite their low * rankings.
EDIT: Well, he couldn't beat Fuente regularly, so I guess he isn't better in that way. However that's more a LOLUVA thing than a Bronco thing one could argue.
What about Fuente with a different OC? Just curious, not advocating for it.
I'd argue that Bronco was better because he was willing to hire better coordinators. Fuente's failure was his devotion to coaches who were in over their heads. Or his failure to recognize such. Either way, part of being a good coach (or a good leader of any organization) is being able to surround yourself with great talent. Fuente didn't. And he lost his job as a result.
I mean, I'd say that's definitely true for Corny, but JHam got Foster's recommendation and was only the DC 2 years, which I think most coaches should get at least 2 years to prove themselves. So small sample size, and wonder if Fuente would be as loyal to someone else he didn't have the same relationship as with Corny. Like I said, not advocating for it, just wondering if things would be different without Corny. I mean didn't they get rid of a number of position coaches on the O over time? Or did they all leave for better jobs (which is also hard to imagine)? (And also ignoring departures due to recruiting trip scandals).
I think Fuente thought hiring JHam would buy him some good will with the fans.
I can't think of a lot of offensive turnover. Galen Scott, who was fired after that scandal with him having an affair, was a defensive guy. Holmon Wiggins was hired by Bama and how could anyone turn that down? Zohn Burden was fired but he was a holdover from Beamer's staff so Fuente didn't really have any connection to him. I can't think of anyone else off the top of my head - I may be missing someone. I think the core guys who came with Fuente stayed with him, for the most part. It was pretty obvious, I think, that Corn was the real problem. Not only was he the much maligned OC, he was the QB coach who thought Braxton Burmeister was the better option over Hendon Hooker. Corn couldn't recruit. He didn't develop his QBs. He couldn't break down film. He didn't game plan well. His play calling left a lot to be desired (though, in fairness, this can be said for about 99% of OCs - even the good ones). He really failed to make in-game adjustments. Our offense didn't develop or evolve at all while he was here. His passing structure neglected entire swaths of the field, making his offense easier to defend. Like, I don't think he did anything well. He was just riding his buddies coattails and picking up a nice paycheck for, essentially, just spending a bunch of his time at the facilities and showing up on gamedays.
And yet there was the 2016 season and how they used Herbert. They did so much bad, but they did do some things well.
Eh, doesn't matter, not a very productive thought exercise one way or another. I prefer looking forward...
Not to mention, his former OC is killing it at Syracuse.
Bronco Mendenhall won at BYU and turned UVA back to respectable with largely 2-3 star players. Neither place is easy to win. Both take leadership and vision, which Bronco put in place. He is a much much better head coach than Justin Fuente- who was handed a sold out stadium, Bud Foster, and a winning program at a football school- and he fumbled it famously. No contest.
100% Bronco doesn't need to rehab his image or take a coordinator position. Im sure some p5 would reach out to him in the next year or two, whether or not he wants to coach again I don't know, but he's going to be in the running for HC job.
Mendenhall had exactly 2 decent seasons at UVA. 2018 (8-5) and 2019 (9-5) then went back to .500 records for 2020 and 2021. Not sure how 5+ losses per season is some kind of great success story
Think lolUVA would love 6-6 more this year.
For Nebraska, if not Chadwell then someone in that mold who is going to run Power I/Triple Option/RPO. Nebraska is perfect for it and needs to run something unique to be competitive. Running the same stuff as Ohio St and Bama and expecting to compete is unrealistic. The deterioration of that program coincided with the move away from Triple Option.
I don't really agree with this take. Nebraska didn't fall off because they stopped running the triple; it was because (1) strength training became common everywhere, whereas for almost two decades they had the premiere strength program in the nation, and (2) their famed walk on program was destroyed by the nationalization of recruiting (similar to VT).
However, if Nebraska is willing to spend like Bama and OSU (I believe they can), and hire a quality coach, I see no reason why they need to 'out scheme' everyone. They can get 5-stars to Nebraska. They can afford to pay an analyst army. They just need to make the right hire.
You forgot bad coaching hires in which 3 out of the last 4 head coaches were previously head coaches and those three had as many winning seasons as they did losing seasons prior to the Nebraska job.
Nebraska ran the only decent coach they have had in the last 20 years out for only winning 9 games a year. They deserve what has been happening.
Same thing to GT. Chan Gailey never had a losing season at GT. They went to a Bowl every year. Chinballs won bigger but also lost more.
I've always said I understand why they fired Solich, but I don't understand why you fire Solich for Bill Callahan. I understand why they fire Pelini, but I don't understand why you fire him for Mike Riley.
If you're talking about Pelini - he was very 'Seth Greenburg' in the sense that he was a dick to everyone in the athletic department, as well as fans (unlike Greenburg). There's a reason why he wasn't able to get an FBS HC job after getting fired.
Regarding GT... PJ was falling off - his last three years were almost identical to Fuente's last 3. He refused to put any effort into recruiting. He had to go. I don't pretend to know much about the Chan Gailey era, but looking at sports reference I see that he had one season in 6 years with more than 7 wins. Before him, George O'Leary went 4 straight seasons with 8+ wins, so I get why fans would be done with Gailey after 6 years.
I almost completely forgot about George O'Leary. I recall the scandal when he left for ND, apparently lied on his resume, and lost the job before he ever coached a down there IIRC.
Herman gone from ASU: https://twitter.com/ASUFootball/status/1571609646842118144?t=kgu8D25dPS0...
Horrible fit from the start.
I guess he didn't play to win the game.
We all made fun of it when it happened, but during the second year of Herm's tenure, it looked like we were all wrong. If he didn't (a) break the covid recruiting rules and (b) throw all of his assistants under the bus, he'd probably be getting 8 wins or better per month.
That said, initial reports suggest ASU is going to upgrade big time.
IMO Herm was a damn interesting experiment that unfortunately went off the rails more than stayed on track. I'm very curious what direction they go with their next HC.
My money is on Tom Herman
I wonder who ASU can get with the NCAA still investigating on the recruiting practices.
Fuente.
Color me shocked. /s
Nebraska keeps it going and fires DC Erik Chinander. I wonder what the o/u is on how many of the coaches originally on the 2022 staff survive the season.
Looking back this guy is to Frost as Corn was to Fu. A guy he brought on that wasn't getting it done, but he refused to let go of.
Having your best man as a bad coordinator you don't let go of will get after you
Herm Edwards out at Arizona State, RB coach Shaun Aguano takes over as interim hc
"Aguano - collect the whole set!"
Collins out at GT, AD also likely to be let go.
Just saw that. Wonder who they bring in.
I gotta say, transitioning from the triple option was never going to be easy.. They should've come out of pocket the first time and made a splash hire.
Prime Time
For our sake, please no. If he can make it work at Jackson, imagine what he could do in downtown Atlanta?
Unfortunately for Collins, his best players kept hitting the portal. Sounds familiar, no? Recruiting wasn't going anywhere. And results showed on the field.
Hell, Hawaii lost half their roster to the portal last year. They are the worst team in CFB.
Ain't no way anyone can win when no one's there to play.
Coaches need to take care of the players that get on campus. The transfer portal is holding coaches accountable to their recruiting pitch.
That's a major point. It will be even harder for new hires to gain traction for their program unless they have a net positive each year in the portal. Pry made a point about this when he was hired. He at least knows he has to be successful there. But if the best players leave each year and the incoming talent are 3-star rehashes, VT is going to fall into GT mediocrity trying to recover from Fuente's mishandling of the roster.
Think we are already there my guy...hate to say it.
GT level's of mediocrity is well below VT's at the moment. I know GT has had more difficult football schedules over the past 3 years, but they have won 3 games each season. VT may only get 3 or 4 wins this year, but whether or not they improve the next two years will define whether they're at GT's level of mediocrity.
And they will fall to GT's level if they lose players like Smith, Thomas, and King in the portal. The defense will have a lot of graduates and the loss of anyone on that side of the ball will also be dire. VT can get much much worse.
I see what you're saying, I just think we're basically already there. Things can always get worse, but I don't really categorize mediocrity or poorness, you're either good or you're not and right now, we aren't.
At a team level, yes. At a program level, no. VT is investing in football, improving infrastructure. GT is pretending the arms race does not exist.
I think we're also mediocre from a program standpoint, as much as it hurts. We can acknowledge the arms race and make changes, but we're still way behind the 8 ball. We were dipping to mediocrity in the last Beamer years, Fu nose dived us even further.
We're no where near GT bad though - there's a reason they're ousting their coach AND AD at the same time. And it's not because of just one hire.
ok, so we're not GT bad..... yay?
And they are 2-0 in games played since this was announced. Talk about impact.
Paul Chryst out at Wisconsin!
Yeah seems like a lot of that fan base is looking to move on from the ground and pound to a more dynamic offense.
Let's get Rudolph on the phone with any and all OL who want to transfer.
Yes indeed.
All the o line recruits
Plz plz plz
Wisconsin is tied for 58th in rush offense this year...do we want them? Well they would be better than what we have...
That is several orders of magnitude better than what we have currently, so yes haha.
In the last 2 recruiting cycles, Rudolph recruited one 5-star, three 4-star, and one high 3-star OL to Wiscy. Most from Midwest, so I have no idea if they want to come to VT with Rudolph, but yes, definitely yes, you want as many of those recruits as possible!
A lot complaints from Wiscy fans about recruiting, but OL recruiting was not one of them. And Rudolph was the main recruiter on all of them.
We want em. We should want any player from a P5 conference that comes from a school of Wisky's caliber or higher. We should be spamming the transfer portal selling any guy looking for a new scene or playing time.
#pillagetheportal23
I think the answer is yes. If we are truly trying to transition to a power run program similar to what Wisconsin used to have, then Rudolph, who recruited them and had them in his system, would know what would fit here.
Did Wisconsin change their O-line philosophy after Rudolph left? If so, that might explain the drop off.
Interested to see what direction Wisconsin goes here.
UW is a good but not great job. It's arguably the 5th best B1G job right now, but will drop to 7th very soon.
The big, lumbering running attack has really been their identity for the better part of 30 years.
Reinventing yourself seems like a great idea in theory but is alot harder in practice.
One imagines Leopold will be the "hot" name for every P5 job, they also could choose to keep it in-house with Leonhard, assuming there is mutual interest.
Leipold grew up in Wiscy, played and coached at Wisconsin-Whitewater (where he built his D3 Dynasty). He GA'd at both Wisconsin and Nebraska.
Godfrey (on SZD patreon) says he has 'triple sourced' that Leipold would choose Wiscy over Nebraska, but, if the Interim (Jim Leonard) wins 6+ of the remaining games, the job is probably his.
EDIT: This is where TV deals will make the biggest difference. P2 teams will be able to (a) lure good coaches away from M3 (middle 3) or G5 teams, and (b) fail fast - if something is not working, they can course correct (relatively) quickly, whereas the rest of us will have to be patient and get creative.
Less than one year after getting an extensions
Ouch, think about the buyout.
They're in a position where they can easily absorb it because of the tv contract.
Karl Dorrell out at Colorado.
what we are seeing now is the realization that the Early Signing Day will absolutely handcuff a school that waits to make a move. We felt the full brunt of that last year and schools have pivoted to making these moves earlier to try and salvage some kind of recruiting class.
Early signing day was a good idea at the time, but pointless in the transfer portal era.
Flexibility is key for athletes and programs at this point.
I'll one-up you a bit.
Early Signing Day was always a bad idea. Beyond the fact that it completely subverts the regular season schedule, it also leads to kids committing late in their sophomore or early Junior seasons.
Lots of incomplete evaluations, and thus more misses either thru lack of expected development, growth, subpar competition or a combination of multiple of those.
In fact, you can make a reasonable argument that early Signing Day is a big reason why the Transfer Portal exists.
It's a shame Brian killed a kid Kelly can leave a few days after or before ESD, but the senior has to go through another round of recruiting. Or, he'll have to wait for the transfer portal after getting to ND. Great for BKKaK, terrible for the recruit.
FTFY - Killed a Kid is his middle name!
Cui bono?
The two revenue sports are, and have always been, about a select few making a shitload of money off the efforts of the athletes. Sometimes the athletes get rich too, but this is a byproduct of a system built by, and for the benefit of, the elites who run it.
I think we should get rid of signing day all together. Scholarship Offers should be like job offers; recruits are given a formal offer and an expiration date. They accept the offer at any point by signing their letter of intent.
And it could help with the committable vs. non-committable offers problem.
It's better for everyone (except bluebloods who are lazy at scouting):
Yeah I never really understood the whole "You can only make it official on this day!!" idea. You want to officially commit then commit.
Paul Chryst out at Wisconsin. Whew. 16.4M buyout announced during the Packers game strategically
Edit: Already drinking cheers.
They did what we should have done after Duke.... Or Liberty... or ODU....or the Hail Mary to lose to GT...
Lots of good jobs for Matt Rhule to 👀 into...
Dear eight pound, six ounce, newborn infant Jesus, don't even know a word yet...please let Rhule get fired and leave Carolina forever. Amen.
Really damning piece about Paul Chryst in the Athletic today:
He went a significant amount of time without a recruiting department, made some bizarre hires, didn't fire anyone, didn't scout well, lost in-state lineman. Sounds like Rudolph got out at a good time.
Perhaps the most damning quote of the whole piece:
I thought Wiscy was being unreasonable, but after reading this, they definitely weren't IMO.
Huh, all their best recruits were Rudolph's too. It's probably at least part of the reason he felt so undervalued there.
Not gonna argue with the bulk of that, but if anyone seriously believes Caleb Williams was seriously considering Wisky is not being realistic. Placing any blame on Chryst for that is ridiculous.
He was going with Riley from Day #1.
LOL, yea. Caleb's thought process: Do I go to Wisconsin where the average high temperature is around 40 degrees in November and December and play for a team that has an offense that is oriented around running the ball, or do I go to USC where the average temperature is 70 degrees in November and December, has a history of being QBU, with one of the best offensive coaches in the nation, and oh, I already know the system and it has made me ultra successful?
Hmm...
Re-seeing this thread about Caleb and Wisconsin seems even more crazy now as Caleb is about to win the Heisman, making it 8 Heisman winners for SC (err, 7 with one vacated because Reggie Bush got an endorsement). Eight would put SC as the school with the most Heisman winners, but they will end up "tied" with Ohio State, Oklahoma, and Notre Dame at 7.
TBF, Wisconsin has had two players win the Heisman.
Would like to enter Stu holt into the carousel please
Is that how this works?
Without the punt block on the botched snap, ST was a hot mess today. Punt team looked completely out of sync the entire game.
I really really don't like the new punt formation
I really hated it when I found out Shibest used the swinging door formation but he had some to rated units at Memphis and did well at VT too, we had a lot of blocks in 2016. But this is just wierd now. Players didn't even block guys. I'm not sure what's supposed to happen.
Rhule is on the market for any college program desperate enough for him
I know he bombed in the NFL, but he has a strong record of taking over rebuilds in college - He transformed both Temple and Baylor. Would be a great fit at Nebraska, could be interesting at Auburn.
You don't have to be 'desperate' to hire him.
Yes, his specialty has been dumpster fires. Let's see if he can elevate an actual good situation.
There are two dumpsters burning in Nebraska and Auburn
I think Nebraska is a great fit for him potentially. I don't think Auburn is as good a fit.
Both locations are shit in the grand scheme with overeager boosters and fanbases who will hate your guts after the first loss.
That said...Matt is about to get paid some serious moola.
and to add to this, just because a coach can't make it in the NFL doesn't mean they are total garbage. IIRC, Saban was a pretty bad NFL coach. (sidenote, not calling Rhule Saban or even close. Just using Saban as an example of a guy who didn't do well in the NFL but was fine in college.)
A good 70% of NFL "coaching" today is who your QB is. You don't have one, you won't win. If Rhule had Justin Herbert, he would be winning. Most NFL coaches are just OC's/play callers in disguise now anyway. Andy Reid, Shannahan, McVay, etc.
I have no idea how much of this, if any, is true. Either way, it doesn't really change the point. A good coach can flounder in the NFL but be fine in college. I would have loved if we hired Rhule in 2016. I think he would have gotten us more competitive than Fuente by pretty wide margin.
Andy Reid is totally "head coaching" here with this play sheet.
I'm not disagreeing with you. I just don't see how this is at all relevant to my point
Chip Kelly doing things at UCLA now too.
I'd love to have him as head recruiter. Of course, the idea of him on a college staff and not the head coach would be more than a little awkward and I doubt he would settle for less than a HC job if he was interested in returning to the college ranks.
How about a job as Coaching Quality Assistant? Give Pry define help in adapting to the role, maybe do a little offensive analysis...
Or some school will give him 9 milly a year over 5 years to try and resurrect their program
I was thinking from now until the end of the year
Charlotte fired Will Healy
Yep pretty crazy. And sorry not sorry, I will not give up this chance to say "I told you so" to the people who wanted to hire him here.
He's going to become someone's WR coach and kill it in recruiting though. I still think he's a good coach, just wasn't fully cooked yet. Definitely wasn't ever going to be considered for a P5 job unless he turned Charlotte into UCF vol 2
Also, look out for Phil Longo's name to be mentioned as a replacement.
Right now we know he's a decent offensive mind and an average to slightly above-average recruiter. But as an HC he cratered this Charlotte program. He never got the defensive staff right and didn't develop his players (also I question his evaluation of talent since they way under performed their ratings).
Really don't think Phil Longo is the answer either (although he's great as an oc), would be interesting if they go that route. I think they should go retread, someone who can do the little things right and build the program from the ground up. Someone who has more than a few years as a head coach, or an Elko type with several years P5 coordinator experience
Justin Fuente
Jokes aside that might be a good rehab gig for him
He was able to pull some talent from NC but I think a Midwest program would be better for him.
Agreed. That's the type of job he needs to take if he ever wants to be a head coach again. Nevermind his W/L record at VT... the other rumblings about him aren't going to ring his phone in terms of P5 HC gigs.
Really hope they don't go after Mike Minter for this job. Don't think he'd be their first choice, but could get down to him.
He needs 2-3 seasons of success at Campbell. So far it's been average to below avg. The recruiting class from last year, and some decent results this year are working for him.
The only surprise is that it took this long.
They waited to hire a new Athletic Director. Once that hire was made, Harsin's firing came swiftly
For sure. But the whole situation has been a mess for awhile. While its no surprise Harsin is out, I guess it is a bit of surprise it took Auburn this long to sort things out. Boosters have been fighting for control for like 2 years now.
FTFY
Booster got their way, Harsin is taken care of by his buyout and will probably get another job as soon as he wants one. Heck, Boise might want him back.
In a nice move, the AU President fired Harsin before the new AD is announced. Nice to let the new AD come in with a clean slate. New AD supposed to be announced later today, coming in from MSU-Hail State, former MSU baseball coach I believe.
This is the most fascinating open job IMO. I would love to see Deion or Lane at Auburn - just for maximum entertainment value - but I don't know if either is a fit. I just hope they stay away from generic Saban Assistant - Again, for entertainment value (no, Lane is not 'generic' Saban assistant).
Joey Freshwater is certainly one of a kind.
I sorta want Primetime at Auburn, but I don't see that happening.
Maybe they'll hire Fuente - I hear he's available.
I'd love to see Fuente as an OC at Auburn.
you and me both, brother
TBH- they kind of just fired Fuente. A lot of similarities between the Fuente and Harsin shortcomings and failures. Beautiful thing is they are both always right, even when the ship is sinking.
The mount of money Auburn has already paid out or is contractually obligated to pay out is more than most teams earn in a year from media rights.
The question is how many coaches are currently being paid by Auburn?? They have to still be paying off the last one before Harsin aren't they and maybe the one before.
Combined payout obligations to Gus and Harsin are big, but not by SEC standards Jimbo, Saban, Kiffin and Kirby. I'm pretty sure they negotiated Gus' down and Harsin is "only" $15M. Chump change for the Yella Fella- Jimmy Rayne.
Gus is also working and a lot of times the buyouts are the difference in salary so assuming the buyout was $21.5 mil (rounded up) and he had 4 years left (7 year extension in 2017, fire in 2020) that means they owed 5.4 a year, minus the 2.3 Gus makes now gets you 3.1 mil a year, and only 2 more years so potential they only owe gus $6.2 mil more
$37 Million total buyout for Gus and Harsin. No offset for taking another job. Big money alum handle that at AU, and the next contract. They have the resources for coaches, buyouts, facilities and NIL. Problem is those same rich Powers That Be also want to meddle with the program a la Danny Snyder. Lotta potential there but prone to being a dysfunctional mess. The effort to fire Harsin for cause last winter was a cluster that handicapped them even further.
41.5 million just for the head whistle. Not including the millions more for everyone else on those two staffs.
That's nuts. Eventually it has to come to a head right? Or do they truly have unlimited money.
Tim Cook is an alumnus. Maybe a Rothschild or Rockefeller too.
It is just hard for me to believe that a good business man wants to continue to light money on fire. This is also coming from someone that is not the CEO of apple lol.
This was no real surprise at this point. Harsin seemed like an odd fit from the start.
Here's a question...who would really want this job???
The last 2 coaches were fired after being #1 objectively successful in the most competitive division in CFB and #2 fired after ~18 months.
You have a lot of resources but are beset with overbearing boosters, a fanbase that makes literally any other look sane, constant expectations to meet or exceed your neighbors (UGA and Bama) and you have next to zero time or margin for error.
Seems like a "thanks but no thanks" situation unless you are looking for an assured PayDay - which it seems Auburn is more than willing to foot the bill for repeatedly.
Any competitive coach should want that job. If you want to compete at the highest level, Auburn is that. Beat Bama twice out of every 5 years, don't lose head scratchers to USCe and Missou, and they will build a statue for you. It's the best opening in football hands down.
Maybe...but how did they end up with Harsin in the first place?
There's no way he was their first choice...Boise St. to Auburn??? Totally different requirements and expectations.
Malzhan beat Bama more than just about anybody and he was on the hotseat every other year and generally hated by the fanbase.
Maybe they'll come out with a great hire this time but I'm not sure that they haven't made that job so toxic that it's one to avoid.
Gus Malzahn has never had a losing season. He beat Saban more that any other head coach not named Tommy Tuberville. His last two seasons he only had one loss to a unranked team. He won coach of the year, and SEC title, he was OC when they won the National title amd he isn't getting a statue.
It's a terrible job, you will always be little brother to Bama. Beat them ten years in a row and you're still lil bro. The boosters are insane, like I wouldn't put them past signing guys to NIL deal that you aren't recruiting and then being pissed when you don't take their guy.
Nick Saban walked in yo Tuscaloosa with a national title ring and still had to knock heads to get everyone inline. And Auburn boosters are 10 times worst than Bama's. The boosters will actively undermine you.
And if some how you win a national title they will fire you two years later.
The only thing appealing about this job is the pay check you get when they tell you to leave. It's the worst job in the SEC.
Florida might argue with you from their expectations.
Yeah that new money will get you every time.
Malzhan was hated because he ran QB powers on 3rd and 8 like Fuente. The offense sucked- and he is an offensive guy.
Fuente didn't win a title though. Or have the record Malzhan had.
If Fuente had won us a title, would we criticize him for running on 3rd and 8, or would we be like "if it wins titles, I don't care."?
VT is different than Auburn. Pretty sure four straight coaches have won or played for natty's at Auburn until Harsin came and broke the streak.
Also, Gus didn't innovate, which is the problem. He ran the same system for 8+ years, even after other teams figured it out.
I understand they're different and that's kind of my point. I understand Auburn not liking him, but pointing out that it's for the same reason we didn't like Fuente leaves out the whole national championship thing. We didn't like Fuente because of going 3rd and 8, we didn't like him because he wasn't successful with it. If Fuente had won a championship doing that, I don't think we would have been complaining about it - that was my point.
It's not that Auburn 'didn't like him' - he refused to evolve his offense over 8 years, even after most of the league figured him out.
Did they really figure him out though? He went 9-4 in 2019, the season before he got fired. That seems pretty good for having been "figured out." I think the expectations are just, "you better be playing for a Natty every other year" at schools like that. I get 2020 sucked by their standards, but that was one down year with the 4 years before that having won at least 8 games each season. And that's playing Georgia, Alabama, and LSU every year. And don't forget, 2020 was the COVID year, so we have no clue what type of roster he was playing with for any of the games that year. So, again, I wonder if he was really "figured out."
For the record, in 2019, the 9-4 year, he lost to Florida, LSU, and Georgia in the regular season, but beat Alabama. Then lost to Minnesota in their bowl.
Time to bring the Lane Train to the Plains.
Weird signing bonus, but here you go...
better signing bonus than I've ever gotten for a job...
I thought Harsin was a really good hire at the time. The guy has a history of winning in creative ways. Take that creativity and combine it with SEC recruits, and, in theory, you should see success. Similar hire to Gus IMO - offensive innovator who brought a new system to the SEC. Harsin wasn't willing to do what needed to be done off the field - recruiting suffered, boosters revolted, etc
As far as who would want the job... I bet Lane Kiffin would want the job. I bet a lot of coaches would take the job. You go through shit for a few years then get an 8 figure buy out.
No sauces, but tea leaves tell me it could well be Hugh Freeze to Auburn. So sorry our Liberty friends. With Cadillac Williams as interim, Freeze to AU, and the legions of 4&5 stars at AU every weekend, that program could get turned around real quick Pardon my speculating...
I just don't see it. Hugh Freeze and his agent keep throwing his name out there, but there has been no actual smoke for him heading to a P5 job.
Godfrey fron Split Zone Duo has been saying this and backing it up for a couple years now and it's still the case.
Hugh Freeze only coaches Liberty for the scandals.
This is the early hatin' on right?
Never too early to hate on Hugh Freeze.
Freeze just signed an 8 year extension. With the school actively in talks with the other conferences, there's a good chance he'll be a P5 coach again without having to change schools.
There is very little chance Liberty goes to a P5 Conference in the next 8 years. BYU had a hard enough time getting into the Big 12, and they've at least got the history and fan base.
Liberty officials have visited the B12 and the ACC since the last conference shakeup.
BYU will be in the B12 with Baylor and TCU.
We're already in the ACC with ND, Duke, Wake, and BC. In fact, Liberty fits more with the ACC than any other conference.
The conversations are real. Does Liberty add actual value? Don't know yet. May be why no one has pulled the trigger outside of CUSA. But if I'm a betting man, they'll be in a P5 conference in the next 5 years.
I have not seen anything about Liberty talking to either of those conferences, so maybe I'm wrong, but I'd like to see those sources.
Liberty just doesn't bring anything that Power 5 conferences are looking for. They don't have the cachet, they don't have the fanbase, they don't have the market, they're football team is pretty good, but how sustainable is it once Freeze leaves? They have a lot of money, sure, but they don't have enough to pay the other schools $10mil a year. The only reason they're in the C-USA is because all the good schools left. It's a really bad conference!
Source?
Most of the country also doesn't hate BYU
Goes to show not many people are very familiar with BYU.
Provo is one of the weirdest places I've ever been. The people are so "nice" it's almost creepy and don't get me started on the way they name the roads out there. Total twilight zone shit.
That south park episode is 1000% accurate
Also, The Book of Mormon is one of the greatest things I've ever seen. So accurate IMO.
Nice in quotes is right on. I've heard it's very hard for non-Mormons who live in these communities. They're nice to your face, but you aren't really part of the community, their kids can't play with yours, things like that. They're nice to non-Mormons, but not welcoming.
On the flip side, in my experience, SLC was one of the most fun places to go out in my 20s. The liquor laws take a degree to figure out, but everyone that was at a club, lounge, or bar was there to party and everything had a speakeasy vibe since it was so taboo.
As a (the?) Mormon member of this community I can confirm that I am only nice to you people in my comments here. I write mean things about all of you in my journal at night.
It's going in the spreadsheet
also a good time to proactively remind the community that it's easy to paint with broad brushes when it comes to people groups but we're very possibly talking about a fellow TKPer when we do so
This was a hilarious comment.
Most of us deserve it anyway. Hopefully one day you will post your burn book.
Hello there, you're not alone.
I'm familiar with the BYU of today, without getting into CG's BYU is at least steadfast in their ways, Liberty is more fluid in their determination of things
I'm very familiar with the LU of today, the removal of J. F. Jr. as President has reduced the fluidity at LU and made them more "steadfast" as in the past. Many of LU's problems can be traced back to that dirtbag, J.F. Jr. including the hirings of McCaw and Freeze. I have no basis to compare it with BYU though as I have no knowledge of BYU's policies or practices. I generally support LU except when they versus VT, but was tremendously disappointed by the personal and professional actions of J.F. Jr. Good Riddance.
He'll leave and Liberty will hire Art Briles
exactly. Liberty has 0 shame and they will hire anyone who can coach football regardless of character. In fact, they'll probably continue to hire questionable character guys since most other places won't take them and save a few pennies (not that they need to) in so doing. I hate Liberty and it's not because they're a Virginia school with which VT must compete. I hate Liberty because of the blatant hypocrisy and unabashed behavior exhibited by their brass.
I don't necessarily care if they like to put a chair in the corner and watch, that's up to them. But it bothers me to no end that they actively preach against that kind of behavior but do it anyway. The holier-than-thou attitude combined with the do-as-I-say-not-as-I-do bullshit is what really pisses me off.
Everything that has been reported says that ADs don't want to hire Hugh Freeze - not because he's scum - but because they can't trust him. He's going to go out and do stupid shit (for example: text someone alleging sexual assault against a coworker). No AD is going to hire someone who is going to leave them out to dry.
It looks to be a two horse race- Freeze and the Lane Train, with most seeing Lane as preferable. Sentiment shifting to the practicality that Lane may not work out, and Freeze would be a solid fit with his SEC experience, and strong interest in Auburn and his high motivation to make good on second chances. Mixed perspectives, but he's done his penance at LU, and I think even Auburn ends up putting winning ahead his indiscretion from the past. It's worked for them with Bruce Pearl. Also, so much donor cash rolling in after the Harsin firing they will pay about anything if they think it will get them back to winning.
To me Lane moving from Ole Miss to AU is a lateral move. I think lane's personality fits more with Ole Miss as opposed to AU but what do I know. Plus at AU you're on the hot seat the day you get there.
I hope freeze gets it. We don't need him being a good football coach at LU who we constantly play and somehow can't seem to beat.
I'm with ya. At Ole Miss and Auburn, you still have to play Alabama and LSU every season. The difference is that Ole Miss won't fire you after you lose to the Tide twice.
From a recruiting standpoint I don't see a huge difference in terms of opportunity.
Boosters are way more sane at Ole Miss. Still crazy, but nothing compared to Auburn.
Where is this coming from? Most articles that list a "top whatever" for the job are thrown together by journalists who are told by editors to put together a list.
I'm fine to eat crow on this, but I really doubt Freeze is actually being considered for the Auburn job.
Yeah no way, the AD at Auburn was digging up dirt on Freeze back when we was at Miss St. I don't buy it at all
Circling back:
To be fair, most reports say that Freeze wasn't being seriously considered until Lane fell through. Sounds like they named him as Plan B just so they could say they had a Plan B. All the Auburn folks I know are upset about the hire, and prepared to be more upset as soon as they learn the contract details.
To be faaaaaaaaaaaaairh!
Yea the most recent SZD patron Coach carousel podcast seemed to indicate as much. But, I got a little overzealous posting a couple weeks ago.
Yea, echoing above, I haven't heard anything reliable about freeze getting this job.
If Auburn is smart and really does want Freeze, tack some moral clauses into his contract. If he is truly on the straight and narrow with his second chance great, if he isn't you aren't looking at a 25-45 million buyout.
So, since its Auburn, they'll give him a $20 million signing bonus, a buyout where they sign over the university to him and a 20 year contract
These things are mutually exclusive
If I were Hugh Freeze, even if Auburn came calling I'd say no. Coaching at LU is a perfect combination of getting paid and easy strength of schedule. He's basically getting paid the same as Pry is now to just play schools that Liberty can mostly outclass in all aspects, with like 2-3 challenging games a year tops. Maybe he could get 8 million at Auburn or whatever, but who cares when they might fire you after two season?
He makes almost $1 mil more than Pry ... so not really the same.
True for now, but Pry gets a nice built-in bump after his first two seasons that will have him even with Freeze.
So whos's hiring Mike Elko away from Duke?
Us?
Rumor mill saying it could be CJF to UAB. Step up or a step down....
Step up from sitting at home.
I don't think there is a step up from being paid to "sit at home".
Seriously. There is no step up from living my dream.
If true I'm curious what coaching staff he assembles. Surely Corn is part of a CJF package deal, right?
Corn's scheme, and I use that term lightly, might work at UAB but just like it did here when it's so predicable it will get found out rather easy.
Also if Fuente goes right back to Corn he really is that dense
The weird thing is Fuente and Corn can win with the right players. See 2016 and 2020 (that was the year we had Herbert - we may not have won as many games as we could have because of all the COVID weirdness, but they got a lot of mileage out of Herbert is my point).
I still maintain that they CAN win, just don't know how to identify and/or recruit the guys they need to win. And since they can't do those things, it's more likely they WON'T win. Granted, stepping down in competition level is another unknown.
It would be really interesting to see if he kept Corn - if he's smart with the buyout it's not like he needs the money, so he might like coaching with his friend again. Who knows.
Bill Roth will tell you UAB is a better job than VT. People on this board will tell you that since they just added safe bleachers to their stadium and have a 40 yard car port as an indoor (its new though) that their facilities are better than VTs. So maybe it is a step up. They probably have more "resources" too with that old Birmingham money. Their AD is also probably more committed to football than ours. I wish this was sarcasm.
Big picture, Fu was right that the program needed more commitment to resources for football. But I do think his tell-all interview came away as a bit of a poor attempt to exonerate himself from his failures and try to get a new job. We had the resources to be better and recruit better than he did at VT, he just had no idea how to actually run a P5 program. I said right after his Baylor fiasco that he was going to weaponize resources to try and excuse his sorry coaching job, and that's sure enough what he has done. Good luck to him but glad he's going to run somewhere else in the ground now.
Some guys are good at coaching and can win at one of the top 20 all time programs in terms of wins, bowls, etc. and went to 25 straight bowls and won 7 conference titles in 15 years. Some guys make lame excuses.
And no one can convince me that the Baylor flirtation was truly about frustration from not getting the resources he needed. He was trying to get out of Dodge before he got fired and failed miserably, but of course he spun it the other way and that he turned Baylor down. Just some very poor passive aggressive almost manipulative vibes from him.
If there is anyone that thinks football does not stir the drink at VT athletics in all aspects, they are 100% wrong. Flat wrong. Whit put a contract on Robey's desk that was the same as the guy that left and gave him 15 minutes to sign it. He went on the cheap with Kenny Brooks and got a horseshoe up his ass that it worked out. He has given zero legit resources to women's LAX and did not make any serious counter to Buzz Williams. He hired Wofford's coach to coach an ACC basketball team because he was from Radford and would take much less total money than Buzz was getting. Football has been king at VT since the mid 80's make no mistake. It's 100% king today- but we are losing, so message board dudes don't want to say the coaches suck- its easier to pretend there aren't resources. Having said that - I have been very vocal about our JMU level Nike Deal - which is an absolute fucking joke that Whit needs to get serious about and fix- that resource does in fact suck.
I'm not sure what you want out of the Nile deal, the ones who get big deals are national brands.
If the Nike deal pays for all of your uniforms and training gear and VT breaks even for every sport, that's a huge win.
We have the second worst apparel deal of all (public) ACC schools (behind GT). I think it's reasonable to want better.
I just want Nike to actually make and sell apparel for us again. It's almost impossible to find anything quality made for VT anymore, and my wardrobe could really use a refresher.
I'm 100% certain NC States deal pretty much just covers the cost of uniforms and apparel for their teams, again I think the days of making additional money on top of that are pretty much gone unless you have a national brand.
Nike is paying UVA double what we're making. We should be making more (but, if we want to stay with Nike, not much).
I think you are wrong here. (NC State just resigned with Adidas). The initial deal was signed in 2016 for 6 years. From a 2016 release:
I hate to say it, but UVA has national titles (BBall, Baseball) and probably other ones I'm forgetting.
Them having a better apparel deal isn't shocking? Double is a bit much though...
To be fair (and I hate it) UVA has 31 NCAA championships.
I just died a little inside
Totally reasonable.
Yea I guess. And to be fair, I think that, because of shoe culture, basketball might even be more valuable to Apparel companies than football (I don't know this to be true, just speculating).
Don't forget Lax, bro
Why can't we have a nuanced view on this? VT fans had top 25 expectations during the Fuente era. VT football (at the time) had top 40-50 funding. UAB has top 75-100 resources/funding. These aren't hot takes.
Because Fuente got his ass kicked on the field and in recruiting by teams with said top 75-100 resources/funding. When Deloitte loses a deal to Booz Allen.. ok... when they lose one to Joe's consulting, heads fucking roll- because the reason/excuse would be lame. Also, there are people who follow VT football that will look you in the eye and say UAB's a better job/better facilities. It's the fashionable lie.
Eh not crazy about the analogy, but I agree with the gist of what you're saying. Small companies win deals over big companies all the time for a myriad or reasons that don't necessarily mean the bigger company's proposal was bad.
For sure though, Fuente was getting his ass kicked by programs at or less than us in terms of resources and prestige. And I do think it's underappreciated on here that VT has additional advantages that money can't buy like prestige and a devoted fanbase. I don't know if we have it anymore, but when he first took over VT we absolutely had cachet that programs like UNC or Pitt didn't. Similarly, losing to Liberty was my final straw because there's absolutely no reason we should be regularly losing to non-P5 teams, especially in state.
No one is defending Fuente here. If Fuente has success at UAB (or a similar level school) no one will be saying that UAB is better resourced than VT.
Two things can be true at once:
Again, not sure why this is difficult to grasp.
Do you need a nap or something?
It might not be sarcasm but it's not rooted in truth. I am squarely with you that VT is making the appropriate investment in facilities in a way that doesn't cross the line into stupidity/arms race territory.
That said... this is nothing more than you constructing a convenient straw man argument. Nobody is saying that. Nobody on these boards is comparing our facilities to UAB's, let alone saying UAB's is better.
Come on, man
Came to see if there were any potential folks coming on board or being part of the adjustments at VT, like Will Healy helping the offense for example.
Feel like I've heard rumblings that Pry will be making some changes this off season.
Haven't heard nor would hear anything, but I would not bring in Healy to help the offense. If you look at Charlotte's their's is on par with VT or worse.
He'd be a recruiting only hire, and he wasn't great at that either at year 1.
I don't have any sauces but I think it's highly unlikely Pry makes any changes to his coaching staff. If he did, though, that would be the first real sign that VT intends to play big-boy football
I think they'll be some shuffling of support staff or something similar, but I would be shocked if we make moves at the OC/DC level
1) Marve called the game and why was he not calling the games all year? We want more of that
2) That fake was amazing, Stu was one tackle away from a great ST game.
3) Offense has a lot more work to do but reshuffling after one season where your Oline didn't know what to do for most of the season is maybe not the time to break up the team, let them work and get adjusted to each other. Then reevaluate next year.
Agreed. We all think most positions underperformed this year. Canning people after one year of new system, new players, etc would just be setting ourselves up for failure again (see Auburn). However, if there isn't sufficient improvement by next year at this time the headsman's axe might (and maybe should) be swinging.
Stu Holt should be fired. Yes, after 1 year. Get rid of him. You can find an ST coach that's unit doesn't look like ass every week. You really can. He also did a shit job coaching running backs. There are MAC ST's coaches that are much better and cheaper. He should seriously be fired. Fucking liberty returns a kick, on the bus to Pittsburgh our punter forgot how to get the ball in the air, etc. Fire him today. That's an easy one. The rest of the staff I'm ok with chalking it up to a transition year. Holt? nah. Terrible.
I completely agree with this take. ST is one facet that is easy to replace a coach without having to start from scratch. The regression our ST took this year was evident and cost us field position in plenty of games
For anyone wondering if this is legit, CBS sports just named him as a source.
Edit: this is getting refuted by Ole Miss and Lane Kiffin
The Lane Train is on the move!
Stupid decision in my eyes. Auburn boosters are going to be gunning for your head after a single mediocre season.
Or before
But you get paid - I bet he gets $8m+/year with a huge buyout. You can win a national championship - Auburn has played for a Natty twice in the Saban era, which is insane. They're about to launch a new NIL program that is rumored to compete with anyone.
Why wouldn't you go to Auburn?
You'd have to live in Alabama?
Considering he already lives in Mississippi I don't think that's going to be the deal breaker.
Esposito scores on the rebound.
Yea, but football coaches work 80 hour weeks. They don't really see anything other than the facilities, the inside of private jets, and the inside of recruits' homes.
Auburn is pretty close to Atlanta. In many ways, more attractive than VT in terms of proximity to a metropolitan area.
A whole lotta coaches would love to reside in AL. Auburn is a great small college town, great school, great facilities-brand new football facility, and tons of resources including a huge commitment to NIL funding. Very attractive to anyone that fits SEC competition and culture. Big money alum are brutal but you're paid to win.
That's a spicy meat-a-ball
For what it's worth, Sokoloff broke the Miss St AD --> Auburn story
I mean fair, but Lane came out swinging at him
Lane is totally the type of guy to come out swinging like this and be sitting at the Auburn press conference next week.
And that's why we love Lane ... at other schools
But is that the official official Lane Kiffin?
It has a check mark. :)
I don't doubt that it's actually Lane kiffin but I think the joke is that any old schmuck can buy a check mark now
Please laugh
He is going to bounce from SEC school to SEC school until he gets offered the Bama job. That much is obvious. And he won't beat Saban at Auburn until he can replicates Saban's Process (cheating) to get 8 of the top 15 recruits in the country every single year.
Yea, that's how Nick Saban started doing it. But, the last 5 years or so he hasn't had to cheat at all. He just needs to point to the number of Bama players that have been drafted.
It's not so much about cheating in recruiting anymore. Now, it's largely about whose got the biggest NIL bank account to win the bidding war.
Dang, they can negotiate a little of that $34 mil my way if it's an issue.
Good hire, I think. Obviously any and every hire can fail, but I think he checks all the boxes that Nebraska needs. He has experience coaching up players, correcting culture, recruiting, etc.
It's official. Solid hire.
👀 Looks like Lane wasn't lying.
Or he is and pissed off Auburn so they said bye 🤔
He was just trying to get paid by Miss after tanking this season, and they bit 🙄.
Ahhh tru
Auburn boosters just want someone who they can actually fire for an affair with a staffer this time.
This is pretty funny. I laughed.
Watch Fuente get the Liberty job if this is true
Nah I think he goes UAB or holds out for another opportunity somewhere Deep South or Texas/plains. He seemed to really struggle with recruiting the mid Atlantic.
Memphis could open
Winning at any cost, including your morality.
What piece of trash will Liberty end up signing this time?
Art Briles
This checks out.
Jabba the Hut.
Another example of how Auburn boosters are out of control.
Hahaha fuck liberty
Wait, are Liberty fans seriously that shocked and upset that a coach would bail on them for Auburn?
Holy crap talk about a complete lack of self awareness and perspective
Not to defend LU fans, but it could be because their "ranked team" is getting beat for the third week in a row and they don't like the coaching right now.
Reminds me of ECU fans thinking Ruffin wasn't good enough
I still can't believe they fired him.
It is like their coach isn't adequately preparing the team. I wonder if Hugh is being distracted by something else going on his life.
More like they thought that he was their piece of shit forever and ever because he's a horrible human being. They underestimated the SEC need to win.
Auburn going to hire a guy who lost to UConn, 3 win VT and New Mexico St in back to back to back weeks.
I wish I could say one of these things is not like the other but well ... let's go off season!
Not sure AU pulls the trigger, but same guy beat Saban and Bama twice. Coaching SEC talent ain't like coaching Liberty talent
And when it's time for him to start ironing out the details of his next contract, Auburn will go on a losing streak too.
Willie Taggart out at FAU... Our win in Tallahassee keeps looking less and less impressive. 👀
The simplicity was certainly lethal...for his coaching career.
If you get a nice buyout I think his lethal simplicity might be worth it
Tank all the way to the bank!
Maybe, but doesn't make beating them in Doak any less fun.
Shaw quits at Stanford. He could not adjust to the rapidly changing CFB landscape. IMO.
It's a Stanford thing, not a Shaw thing:
Sounds like Stanford would be a great addition to the ideal traditional ways of the current ACC
The ridiculous ACC/PAC 12 merger was actually seriously discussed. Thrilling cross country games to play Stanford and Berkeley! ACC presidents would love that though.
I considered Shaw and the school as one.
The crazy thing is, Shaw has been at Stanford for 15 years. Before that, he was in the NFL for 20 years. We've all forgotten he's an NFL guy first. Will be interesting to see h what he does next.
Someone get Matt Rhule a laptop with a webcam that interview on GameDay was horrendous.
Video for anyone who hasn't seen it. So much wind noise, what a terrible idea.
While I have my thoughts on Harbaugh, I would love for Pry to build this mentality and culture
The coaching carousel is heating up fast. Fickell likely to Wisconsin, Freeze to Auburn, more jobs opening up with caches being fired. Going to be a fun 2 weeks here.
Transfer Portal entries going to go crazy
Wow Fickell to Wisconsin? Thought they were just going to roll with Leon Hard.
Fickell to Wisconsin is interesting mostly because I'm just curious what appealed to him about it. Not saying Wisc is a bad job (it's a good one), but Fickell has had some other good places come calling the last couple of years and word out of his camp was he was pretty adamant about staying at Cincy. Maybe he saw how the team performed this year (down from their recent highs) and just decided to get out instead of risking his name cooling off?
My wild thoughts; with move to Big 12 he would be outside his comfort zone of Midwest for recruiting he thinks, he wants the an OSU job and hopes doing well at Wisconsin will lead to that offer when anOSU fans tire of losing to Michigan.
OSU fans are probably ready to fire their coach already.
Yes, yes they are. And they want stroud to transfer or enter the draft. Talk about an entitled fanbase.
Unpopular opinion, but I think Ryan Day is one of the most under achieving coaches in college football. He's one of three teams with an 80%+ bluechip ratio and he's won a single playoff game in 5(?) years. The other two programs with a similar roster? Bama and UGA.
Not saying he should be fired, but the complaints are warranted.
Update with a hotter take: Ryan Day is now the 4th best coach in the B10, behind Harbaugh, Rhule, and Fickle.
I think, in general, Ohio State underachieves for the way they recruit. Sure they win the B1G usually, but they usually get smacked by a team they should steam roll and then make an early exit from the playoffs (the obvious exception being 2014). I think they've just finally been exposed to being a well-stocked finesse team playing in a weak conference. Just my opinion.
Totally. But I look at that kinda like I did with Fuente. If the scheme is bad, it's only the HCs fault if he fails to acknowledge it and make the required staffing changes to fix it.
I agree with this. I also think that he recognizes that with the B10/SEC moving to the P2, the Cincy job was still, and would forever be, second tier.
My guess is Wisconsin is actually going to try and step up and compete with Ohio St, Michigan and USC. I suspect Fickells contract and assistant salary pool will be very comparable to the other big schools in the big ten.
Fickell is taking a step down, because I hate Wisconsin.
Auburn is shooting themselves in the foot. Should have gone with Cadillac.
I bet Biberty goes for Art Briles :D
Caddy is a great man and a great Auburn man, but no prior head coach or coordinator experience. AU needs to retain Caddy, "his seat don't dictate his service", and hire a proven HC. But no telling what happens at that soap opera.
Tulsa just fired their coach. Wouldn't be surprised to see Fuente land there (born and raised in Tulsa).
Tulane job could be opening up - lots of rumors that GT is hiring Willie Fritz
Lots of Twitter commenters slamming the hire clearly haven't 1) watched GT the past few years and 2) haven't watched Tulane at all. This hire terrifies the heck out of me, not that I expect him to lead them to the promise land, but this is probably the closest they can get to a modern day triple option without hiring one of the academy coaches
Remind me why I should be afraid of a 62 year old coach that will be getting his first P5 job that went 2-10 in his 6th season caoching his current school? He will behandcuffed in recruiting by his university's standards. He's going to be older than Paul Johnson was when he retired.
Not say he would do this, but it is in Fritz's own best interest to tank and get fired with a good sized buyout. A couple season at $5 mil wirh another $10 mil buyouy and he can retire on that sweet P5 money.
Did you watch our team play this year? As far as I'm aware we should scared of a team even if they hire my toddler to coach.
Again - I didn't say he was going to suddenly compete for the ACC, just that it's an interesting hire that runs an offensive system that could help account for the talent and support deficiencies that program faces
I did watch our team and GT didn't need a permanent head coach to beat us.
I wouldn't say you should be afraid of Fritz, but it's a good hire for GT.
This is part of the argument in support of Fritz; Tulane is very similar to GT:
Any problem that can come up at GT, Fritz has encountered at Tulane.
I don't think Fritz gets them to an ACCCG, but I do think he gets them back to consistent bowl eligibility, and can act as a bridge to the next coach.
Seriously depressing if you're a GT fan. The admin hires a coach that can probably do about as well as you can expect for a school that deemphasizes football, which is entirely the admin's choice lol. "Let's get somebody who will have to scrape and claw for everything because of the situation we create!"
For real. My wife and her family are GT season ticket holders. I have a ton of friends who are GT fans, many of whom are well connected. They are all, in general, upset with the changing college football landscape, because they know their schools' leadership is going to actively convince donors to send money to the university over NIL, for example. Jamyr Gibbs leaving just because they didn't win enough was pretty devastating.
I feel for them - GT has a passionate and underrated fanbase, and a lot of potential. But, at this moment in time, the university is doing the bare minimum necessary to compete in the football arms race.
I mean, given the financial reality we are being faced with right now, I can definitely see a situation where we pivot as a university to fundraising for academics while allowing athletics to die on the vine if we cannot get into a situation where we are long term forced into a conference without a competitive TV deal. There's little sense trying to catch up if you have no hope of even reaching the revenue floor of your competition.
Agree. The ACC is going downhill fast. Just look at the conference championship game - the irrelevant bowl with both UNC and Clemson coming off embarrassing losses and both blown out by an 8-4 ND team that's sort of in but sort of out of the conference. Ratings for that game will likely be terrible. I can see us seriously deemphasizing revenue athletics in the long term if we can't make the jump to the B1G or SEC. So much is going to depend on what ND ends up doing - if they break away from the ACC to go all in with the B1G, GoR be damned you better believe some schools are going to be finding an exit strategy if they haven't been already.
I can't see VT doing that. IF there's a super league featuring the top 30ish schools, I could see VT not getting a spot, and deciding to compete at the next level (kinda like App State in the FCS/G5). I can't see VT giving up to the degree that GT has.
Going to make AAC championship interesting.
GT wants to remain mediocre? Tulane had a great 2022, but his record there is so meh...
2016: 4-8
2017: 5-7
2018: 7-6
2019: 7-6
2020: 6-6
2021: 2-10
2022: 10-2
Overall: 41-45
How close was he to being fired in 2021?
This is really awesome for modern day Tulane. Tulane barely wants to have a football program and he's consistently dragging them to bowl games.
This is a really good hire for Georgia Tech since they don't really want to spend a ton on athletics. He's a coach who can make more with less.
This is what sucks about GT and the hire. It's a waste of that potential to be in Atlanta in a P5 conference and have no dedication to football. With the right amount of support, they could build a top-end football school to compete with SEC schools. Oh well, goACC.
I'm sure there are examples to the contrary in terms of some of these factors im about to list, but I'm just not sure Georgia tech as an institution is really as attractive as people think it is, even with the Atlanta pull. It's a hard school to get in to, I imagine it's no cake walk once you are there, the guy/girl ratio (I know I know) is like 65/35 (or it was about a decade ago). It's always going to be little brother to Georgia and it's in a state poached recruiting wise by surrounding powers. Even if they threw the kitchen sink at the program money wise, I don't think they elevate much beyond the Paul Johnson years, which for them were pretty good
They have 4 national championships in football.
Yeah but like, that was decided by newspapers. Fake news. /s
I was hoping someone would bring that up tho
Yea, GT doesn't really connect well with the A-town vibe and culture. But, idk, it's one of the most desirable cities in the south. But, I guess you could say the same about UMD and its proximity to DC, and it also can't get develop a top tier football team even in a more desirable conference. I guess city only matters so much, and maybe only matters when it's Miami or LA. Or maybe it's just desirable schools that happen to be in a desirable location for 18 year-old recruits.
I long for the days of when VT can actually beat GT consistently in football. Hopefully those come back soon
Dear God, please, YES!
So 2010-2014 where 3 of the games were one score wins and one of them went to OT? It's not like VT ever dominated GT for any length of time.
Yeah I think for about a decade, the GT-VT series was one of the better and most competitive in the ACC. The chess match between PJ and Bud was great.
Whatever. I just want VT to beat GT every...damn...time.
I'm tired of my sister correcting me when I say "Tech", because we lost the game and "Tech" means "Georgia Tech" in my family for the next year.
What is our record in the series in the ACC against coaches not named Paul Johnson? 5-2.. we do that the next 7 years and its 10-4... i.e. beating them regularly in football. CPJ is a much much better coach than Justin Fuente. That's why the series is more even than it should be. That's a coach K vs. James Johnson type deal there. I hope- as I said in my OP, that we can beat them regularly in football again.
I don't think CPJ is analogous to Coach K in any context. And, as much as this site likes to bury CJF, he was a better coach than JJ was. CPJ was a better coach than CJF to be sure, but that analogy is hyperbole.
Sure a little hyperbole but CPJ won like 70% of his games over his career, and didn't need to snap the ball to beat Justin Fuente. Fu was 100% afraid and psyched out by him that he admittedly coached differently. Don't think Fu was scared to coach against Geoff Collins, etc. But yeah, CPJ is not Coach K.
GT is CRAZY for not hiring Jamey Chadwell! I was dreading his offense running all over us next year. Don't know much about Fritz, but happy we won't be facing a Chadwell offense regularly...for now.
I've got some bad news about the Fritz offense...
Supposedly Chadwell can't interview and is significantly too redneck for ADs/Presidents to be comfortable with. But I'm a huge Chadwell stan, I really want to see him in a P5 gig.
Lol, too redneck to interview? Sounds like my kind of guy.
Feel like there's at least 2 checkboxes to coach in college football
Say something about God in your life
Bit of a redneck country drawl, not you Brian Kelly Killed a Kid
Winning matters, too, but this is a culture driven industry.
Filled Positions:
Nebraska: Matt Rhule
Wisconsin: Luke Fickell
Arizona State: Kenny Dillingham
Charlotte: Biff Poggi
Auburn: Hugh Freeze
Georgia Tech: Brent Key
UAB: Trent Dilfer
FAU: Tom Herman
Texas State: GJ Kinne
Colorado: Deion Sanders
Liberty: Jamey Chadwell
USF: Alex Golesh
Coastal Carolina: Tim Beck
Cincinnati: Scott Satterfield
Tulsa: Kevin Wilson
UNLV: Barry Odom
Louisville: Jeff Brohm
Stanford: Troy Taylor
Western Michigan: Lance Taylor
Open Positions:
Kent State*
Navy*
North Texas
Purdue*
* - Opened this week
David Shaw got fired? damn
All reports (even those from insiders) are saying that he resigned, and Stanford would have been willing to give him more time if he wanted it.
He quit. 15 years at Stanford, 11 as HC, and no real change in the program's direction. In fact, the past few years, you could say it's gone down.
Then there's the change in college football. Can't use the transfer portal cause of Stanford's rules on transfer credits. NIL doesn't exist at Stanford. Admin would rather shut down sports than to keep paying for it.
That's hyperbole. More accurately, Stanford wants all sports to compete at the same level, whether it's football or fencing. They invest heavily in all of their athletics, and don't want any one sport having an outsized impact on the athletic department.
Realistically, the money sports finance the rest (Football and Basketball). I guess they are private and get a ton of donations but who really cares about Fencing.....
Stanford ... duh /s
He resigned.
Add UNLV to the open positions list, Marcus Arroyo has been fired.
Whoa Godfrey just said UNLV was safe too lol
biff poggi is an interesting one, went 20+ years in high school ranks to a couple years on staff at Michigan as AHC (but no real position) and now HC at Charlotte.
Biff Poggi sounds like a name George Lucas came up with for some rando that runs a Cantina on Alderan.
Yes, definitely a Star Wars name
"Biff Poggi" anagrams to "Big Off Pig".
And I think he was an investment banker or something before being a high school coach? He's coaching for fun, not money. BUT supposedly he was Harbaugh's right hand man - convinced him to fire coordinators, change recruiting styles, all sorts of stuff.
Definitely a fascinating hire.
Filled Positions:
Your Mom
Open Positions:
Also your Mom
Fuck you Shorsey!
Kinne will probably have his choice between Texas State and Tulsa (his alma mater) so that one prob isn't a done dealI stand corrected. Interesting choice there not to choose the alma mater but imo Texas State has a higher upside.
Can we get this in table form so it's a bit more digestable?
Thanks, the table is easier to read. Now you get to keep it updated!
Ryan Walters to Purdue
Memphis is not opening it's coaching search:
Makes sense, they were actually pretty decent this year. Lost several very close games
Not an HC, but sort of relevant:
Nice of jumbo to create a scapegoat for their offense when everyone knows he runs the show himself anyway
He should replace him with the other guy at Memphis who was Co-OC's with Dickey. Clearly that guy was the true brains behind the offensive success
Per Bruce Feldman on Twitter, Freeze to Auburn is a done deal.
Hypothetical Incoming. If you could scrap everything and hire Deion Sanders would you do it?
Depends on what coordinators he would bring with him. I think he's all razzle dazzle, but he also convinced the number 1 overall recruit to spurn Florida State for Jackson State. In college ball if you get the recruits, you can win most games.
Still would be a no for me atleast for the time being, the fact that at the moment atleast that colorado is the one place we know chasing him would suggest many are still cool on him for now. Personally as a player loved him but the whole persona throws me off personally and I guess recruits love it but to me I'd rather a genuine x's and o's guy with some good recruiting support staff. Pry gets VT and Sanders to me would use VT more as a stepping stone to better things. Also on recruiting its one thing to recruit the talent and a whole nother ball game to get the talent to work on the field just ask Jimbo.
It could never happen, but Neon Deon coaching The U send like a match made in heaven for everyone who hates or loves the Canes.
Interesting question... I wouldn't think he's a fit at VT, but I also don't think he's a fit at Colorado... I honestly have no idea.
I would probably just say yes because it would immediately make us nationally relevant - Every sports talk show would at least mention it - right now VT is an afterthought for the majority of sports media, and at least half of college football media - hiring Deion would immediately change that.
But I could also see it failing spectacularly.
Oh HELL nah! Keep that prick a 1000 miles from our program. We would be under sanctions within 5 years. He has so much baggage I can't see why any non desperate AD would touch him.
As bad as we did this season, it COULD get worse with sanctions. I think we'll do better next year, but sanctions seems like it could put us perennially in the cellar of the ACC and probably doom any chance of us going to a better conference in a realignment.
My dude I wish that were true but the NCAA is such a toothless dog that it wouldn't surprise me at all if Dion never sees a sanction or penalty going forward in his coaching career. It's a lawless land out there now regarding NIL and what's being done with it.
Yeah they'd wait til he leaves then death penalty the school when he's sitting pretty back in Florida somewhere
Yes.
Darrell Dickey (OC) gets canned at TAMU.
Misery loves company:
Looks like not willie fritz after all
Outside of Dabo has any interim mid season coach elevated to permanent worked in P5?
Do you consider a natty followed by an immediate flop a success? Coach O sure was entertaining if nothing else at LSU. Go Tiguhs!
Ryan Day has done pretty well
Day covered while Urban was suspended then Urban came back.
Interim head coach, acting head coach... What's the difference really?
Interim is when the previous coach is fired, retires or leaves early during a season and someone else has to take over. Acting head coach steps in when the current coach can't coach that game, suspended, sick etc. like Shane was for Frank in the bowl game.
okay and what's the difference really? How is Ryan Day being acting head coach for three games to start the season and getting the job at the end of the year much different than if Ryan Day had been interim head coach for the last three games of the season and then gotten the job at the end of the year
What's the difference between Associate Head Coach, Assistant Head Coach, and Assistant to the Head Coach?
One of those titles specifically means "dude who takes over if the head coach can't coach."
The biggest difference especially in Day's case is Urban was still around to talk to, get ideas from, keep his same game plan and style. A fired coach you fill in for isn't going to still have an office down the hall.
Bill Stewart @ WVU
EDIT: you said "worked" sorry nevermind
Dabo and Ed Orgeron are the two that come to mind immediately (both won nattys). Let me think on it.
Edit:
After researching, it's pretty uncommon for the interim to get the head job. This 2015 article from Football Scoop reviewed all interims that coached at least 2 games from 2008 to 2015, and found that only 1 of 19 (Dabo) got to keep the HC role. I know that coaching searches today are hardly analogous to those of 2015, but I imagine the numbers are similar.
One interesting case I found - Michael Locksley was the interim for UMD in 2015, left for Bama, then was hired by UMD in 2019. Not the same, but interesting.
Clay Helton coached most of 2015 as interim when Sarkisian was having his alcohol issues. He took over as head coach after the season in 2015. I see that article was posted just before Helton was hired, but there's another example. Helton had little success the next 6 seasons, at least for USC's standards.
Pelini was the same at Nebraska and should have been hired after he was the interim, but no they had to make a worse choice.
TIL!
I mean, I thought Fritz was all but done. Wonder what happened?
His SAT score wasn't high enough.
/s
He found out the players have to meet GT's academic requirements?
It's not like Tulane is the university of Phoenix or anything
Looks like Fuente is missing out on UAB in favor of Quincy Patterson's biggest fan.
https://footballscoop.com/news/sources-uab-coaching-search-trent-dilfer
What an awful hire for a program that has a ton of upside. Really wondering the logic behind this one
Thamel tweetin it too -- please let it be true so he's off TV....
Dilfer can flash his superbowl ring at the recruits. I audibly blinked at this, does Dilfer have ANY coaching experience?
High school babeyyyyyy
Hopefully he introduces himself as Coach DILF when he says hello to moms on the recruiting trail. /s
That is one of those hires you just know is going to be awful...Kind of like a Herm Edwards type hire.
This anti jet sweep bias is disgusting.
Looks like Neal Brown lives to see another season. WVU just hired the UNT AD for the AD spot
They kind of have a Fu situation on their hands. His buyout is pretty huge, plus with the new AD coming on so late, they are way behind in the coaching search. So forced to keep him on at least another year.
I feel for Neal Brown. I really enjoyed watching his Troy teams back in the day. From my distant viewpoint, I'm not sure what problems are coaching problems vs what problems are WVU problems.
IMO WVU is a really hard job. It's tough to be a team based in Appalachia, without a national brand, playing in a conference (mostly) based in the southwest. It's tough to recruit, it's tough to plan logistics, it's tough to travel, it's just a shit situation for WVU.
Given that I've only been a VT fan for 15ish years, I don't really have any hate for WVU (way less hate for WVU than UVA, Miami, Pitt, UNC, Liberty, etc). To me, they are the poster child for everything that sucks about realignment and the shifting CFB landscape. I have sympathy for them. Looking back, VT was one ACC vote away from being in the same position.
Yeah I do too. I started getting into VT football in the 90's so the WVU rivalry game is still ingrained in me to a large degree. But I do sympathize with where they are as a program. In many ways, our programs are very much peers and share a lot of similarities. They got to the national title game in the late 80s under Nehlen and always had a blue collar, hard-nosed team that punched way above their weight class. They have just been mired in mediocrity for so long now and in a very weird conference where they will never be relevant. I really fear VT is heading in the same direction unfortunately with how our program and the ACC is trending. But I really would love to see the Black Diamond trophy game back on our schedule annually. That's the kind of rivalry game and peer program we need on our schedule.
Yea, I agree that VT is trending towards WVU-levels of relevance. Fortunately, I don't think we will ever have the conference geography issues that WVU has.
I do have to say though, looking at WVU's non-conference schedule over the next several seasons, Whit deserves a bit of heat for how poor our schedule looks. WVU is no more relevant these days than VT and is playing Penn State, Pitt, Tennessee, Alabama over the next 6-7 years. We have got to step our schedule up, no excuses. No one wants to see us play Liberty and ODU constantly. Unless WVU somehow ends up in the same conference as us, unfortunately it looks like Black Diamond won't happen again for some time.
Whit was able to schedule a home-and-home with WVU (which IMO is the equivalent of WVU playing Pitt). We tried scheduling home-and-homes with Michigan, PSU, and Wiscy, all of whom bailed on us.
I agree that our schedule sucks, but I don't know what more Whit can do (in part because I'm pretty ignorant about how scheduling works, other than its done way in advance).
I know some teams bailed on us, but some of those were set up before Whit arrived. And I can't buy that the only thing he can do is throw his hands up and give us a steady dose of ODU, Liberty, Rutgers, etc. It seems like a concerted, deliberate effort to have a pedestrian and inexpensive OOC slate. Plus, combine that with the significant speculation that we opted for the Pitt/Wake/UVA trio in the new ACC model over our traditional rivalries of Miami/GT/UVA (basically we swapped schedules with Louisville) in order to make our schedule easier. Which ironically is going to end up being 1) more difficult considering where Wake and Pitt are as programs lately and 2) far less exciting for the fan base and general viewers of college football.
Or, it is what is available on short notice when OOC schedules are decided a decade in advance and opponents cancel out from under you.
Bolded for emphasis
That speculation was also reported on by members of the media, not just message board people. Again, sorry I'm not going to give Whit a pass and say he's doing the best he can do like so many do. It's an awful schedule for a program with supposedly "championship brand" aspirations and there's no two ways about it.
please submit a list of acceptable, available replacement opponents to HokieAD@vt.edu
Penn State - 2025 Nevada, Villanova
2028 Syracuse
Could do a home and home those two seasons since we have South Carolina one-off in 25. Replace Vandy/ODU/JMU in 25 and Liberty/ODU/Maryland in 28.
West Virginia - 2028 Tennessee
2029 Pitt
Vacancies starting then we could have scheduled/be scheduling over Liberty, ODU, Maryland, and Arizona(?)
Tennessee - 2024 Kent State, UTEP
2025 Syracuse, UAB
Home and home replacing Vandy/ODU/Marshall/Rutgers in 24 and Vandy in 25. Or just one-off neutral site in 2024 (Charlotte?) if two SEC teams in 25 is too much.
A 15-minute cursory glance at just a few ideas that could make a better schedule in the coming years if explored. But no, let's just schedule ODU and Liberty for the next decade to keep the money in state and call it a day.
Edit: a less sarcastic response
Will those teams adjust their schedule and play us?
They have vacancies (in some cases multiple). Worst they can do is say no. If it's already been tried my apologies to Whit, we are just somehow the most unlucky/snake bitten team in FBS and nothing we can do. But when you make decade-long series against ODU and Liberty when other teams you want to play have vacancies, it smacks of not really trying and cutting costs to a lot of people.
Well, it's pretty obvious that PSU said no, and we just wanted them to reschedule the 2020 game.
Actually, I'm pretty sure the hole in their 2025 OOC schedule is where they cancelled our game.
I'll preface this by saying I agree that the upcoming schedules suck. That said...
Can you think of any other teams that had a home-and-home with a reputable P5 school scheduled nearly a decade in advance, had said home-and-home canceled, and were able to find a similar level replacement (COVID year withstanding)? I don't intend to blindly defend Whit here (I'll do that later) - I just don't know what the norm is in these situations? Are other schools at a similar level to VT able to easily replace top P5 opponents when they cancel? If yes, then we have a problem. If no, then... I don't know what Whit can do?
Also, what an AD can do to prevent this? Maybe the 'buy out' to cancel/delay the series could be higher, but I imagine that could also dissuade other teams from agreeing in the first place.
Regardless, I'm hopeful that the expanded playoff will help other teams be more willing to play a game against VT in the future.
I agree with your frustrations over the conference scheduling, but I don't think you can lump this together with canceled OOC games.
To address the piece on speculation - Everything I saw saying we 'switched' with Louisville was just circumstantial. IIRC, Whit said that he wanted to optimize for an easy path to the ACCCG. Bill Roth speculated on SoS Podcast that the ACC was trying to optimize for multiple playoff teams rather than a better regular season.
As a fan, I don't really agree with either of these decisions (assuming they are accurate). But as a pragmatist, I can understand the rationale for both Whit's and the ACC's alleged decision making.
In this case, I kinda do blindly trust that Whit knows what he's doing here. I would hope he's not sacrificing an additional exciting game each year to save a few hundred grand each season.
But let's look at the games Whit has scheduled:
-Maryland in 2026-2029
-Arizona 2029-2030
-BYU 2030/2033
-Ole Miss 2032/2037
-Alabama 2034/2035
-South Carolina 2034/2035
Yeah, they're all later, but a decent part of that was getting through the non-conference games set up by Weaver. Also, the change in scheduling philosophies in the SEC, especially Alabama. As I said on the last non-con topic, for all the people yelling "we want 'Bama" in the 2010s, none of them were going to get them in the regular season, because Alabama didn't schedule P5 teams outside of neutral site games.
Maryland and Arizona might not be the most exciting matchups, but they're both P5 teams. And even a crappy P5 team is still better than the Liberty/ODU combo.
We also were scrambling a bit when we dropped the ECU series which is partially why we're eating a shit sandwich for a few years.
Definitely had to scramble for the first few years of that. That's why we had two FCS games in 2019. In the pre-covid version of 2020 we had South Alabama scheduled, but avoided a double FCS deal by virtue of Liberty jumping up to FBS. ECU wasn't ever scheduled for 2021, and I'm pretty sure Wofford was 2022's ECU replacement.
We got Marshall in 2023 and 2024 as part of the replacement game deal in 2018, and the 2025 JMU game was announced about a month after we officially cancelled ECU in 2019.
Although the extended ODU and Liberty deals were announced in 2017, before our disagreement with ECU.
Alternate timeline: VT doesn't get approved for the ACC and joins the SEC instead of Missouri. What if getting accepted into the ACC was the worst thing for VT over the past 20 years?
This is assuming that we didn't sink to the level of Vandy in the SEC. We did dominate the ACC for the first 8-10 years of entry.
Hindsight is 20/20, but at this point, one could argue that Vandy is better positioned for long term success than VT is, purely because they will making $100m/year in TV revenue soon, and VT will be making a mere $35-40m/year.
Can't say... Would the SEC even consider VT in 2010/2011 if we hadn't won 4/7(?) ACC titles?
They took Missouri, so titles don't seem to mean much.
That's fair - That entire round of expansion was about TV markets.
Crazy situation unfolding in Lincoln just days after being retained and promoted to Associate Head Coach. LINK.
That's certainly not a good way to stay in line for a head job
Maybe he is hoping for the Liberty job
Ian McCaw licking his lips at hiring another moral-less woman abusing piece of shit
Live view of me reading this comment:
Congrats! You win the Internet today!
LOL. Winner. Can't leg this enough.
Not thrilled over this possiblity.
Don't like that one bit.
Oh no. The last thing I want is someone that I actually respect working for that abomination of an institution.
Someone explain to me, not not from a hatred of Liberty standpoint, why this would be a step up?
MoneyThe almighty dollar, otherwise it's a pretty lateral move IMO.Edit: couldn't help not add the pun.
What they said! 👆
Chadwell has been having a really hard time getting traction with bigger jobs so he may just be trying to get paid.
I'm guessing Chadwell at least doubles
or tripleshis current ~1M/year salary.In addition to the salary bump, he has been passed over on multiple p5 jobs. Proving himself at two stops might be what he needs to do to get a p5 job. Personally I think USF would be a better resume boost for him than Liberty, but Liberty will probably pay more. He is also no stranger to religious schools with his stops at North Greenville and Charleston Southern.
I feel like it's lateral move now, but with more money. Liberty would also have less competition in CUSA vs Coastal in the Sun Belt.
Eww, why? He'd be transferring from a decent G5 school to a universally hated "independent" (future C-USA). Unless they're making him an offer he can't refuse (blink twice Chadwell if your life is in danger), why would you move to that shitstain of a school?
Yeah, stay at coastal. CUSA is adding Kennesaw State. Once you do that, you stop being even a decent G5 league. No putting that toothpaste in the bottle. The conferences are adding fringe jucos now.
Seems like the only way to triple his salary given that he's failing in interviews for a lot of other schools
As soon as Freeze was hired, the Liberty job became a hot commodity. Other coaches now see it as a place that can springboard you into a big time job and they have way, way more money than anyone in their league.
Note: I hate this and think it is dumb
Chadwell might be in for a rude awakening if he's hoping for the same attention Freeze got. Freeze didn't get hired for what he did at Liberty, he got hired for what he did at Ole Miss and Auburn's brass said that specifically. And once LU is properly in the CUSA playing a 9-game conference schedule against the likes of Kennesaw St and Sam Houston there will be far fewer opportunities for visibility. Except against us, of course, thanks to Whit...
Interesting but Liberty students have submitted a petition to the admin with over a 1,000 signatures to try and get D. Sanders as head coach.
because petitions work....
I think people wanting to petition any and everything these days is hilarious. PRIVATE ENTITIES DO NOT CARE and although you have a Constitutional 'right' to petition the government for a redress of grievances, THEY DO NOT HAVE TO LISTEN TO YOU EXCEPT IN CERTAIN LIMITED STATUTORILY ALLOWED CIRUMSTANCES/SITUATIONS!
I've got no problem with people expressing their thoughts and opinions and wanting what they want, but as you said; petitions are generally just toilet paper with a bunch of peoples' signatures on them to the folks they aim to influence.
I think that petitions (like polling) have been casualties of the internet age. They could probably still be used effectively, but I don't think anybody has worked out the details of how yet.
There is an inherent failure of our education system when it comes to petitions. The Constitutional protection of freedom of petition does not mean you can petition whatever and have your voice heard. It means that you may petition the government without fear of reprisal or punishment. The entire Bill of Rights is mostly negative rights (protections instead of an actual right), and so many people I don't think understand that correctly.
There are examples of how petitions are acknowledged. For instance, in VA, localities have the ability for its citizens to petition the Circuit Court to allow certain, permitted by statute, issues to be placed on the ballot for referendum. If properly filed with the court and the requisite signatures obtained, the issue can actually be put up for vote. But it has to be specifically allowed by law, and people just can't petition for anything they're pissed off about.
I'm all for people expressing their beliefs. But petitioning is distinct from polling (generally anonymous whereas petitioning is not) or anything of that sort, and people use that term so erroneously anymore.
Sorry, I wasn't clear. I wasn't equating petition and poll, merely saying that both have been tremendously impacted by the internet to the point where they are not all that useful for the public.
All good. I hear you and agree.
Prime taking the Colorado job
Prime will be miserable at Colorado. It won't be the losing, or the terrible facilities, or the administration's apathy / outright hostility towards football, or the absence of in-state recruits that gets him down.
It will be the total lack of the one thing he wants most: attention.
California and Texas aren't that far away. I'm sure there will be plenty of kids clamoring to be in a program with Prime.
That seems like an...odd...fit at best, but if he can get people to come to Jackson State I'm sure he can get them coming back to Boulder without breaking any rules at all, right
If he is contacting portal players while still the coach at Jackson State for Colorado he is already breaking NCAA rules. Hasn't even been announced as the hire and already stepping in it.
Eh, it's kind of lax during coaching changes, not that it's right or wrong. Jones coached Tx Tech in their bowl game, but was recruiting for us last year.
Bowl season they can.
Significant differences there. First, he wasn't a head coach and he was already announced as being hired by our staff.
Deion hasn't been officially hired yet.
Wonder if the "portal players" mentioned were his own kids.
For a guy with a lot of options sure seems like he's picking one of the worst ones
This just feels weird. He's got a good thing at Jackson state why not keep that for another year and wait for a better gig?
So much for liberty students petition.
Prime not mincing any words here.
holy shit, that is savage! Especially getting those kids to repeat him at the end.
Weird that a grand total of three CU players have gone in the portal since that speech..........apparently you ain't coming HARD ENOUGH Prime.
I laughed at that speech. Deion forgetting the little nuances such as these are human beings on scholarship at CU. Something they worked for their whole lives. This isn't the NFL- yet, or the SWAC where you can literally show up and register at the school on the first day of classes. Different animal, prime.
Do we have an over/under on how long till Prime gets them in NCAA trouble. Should we list it in days/weeks or months?
My prediction is it doesn't work out. He recruits well wins a few more games but nothing special long term.
In a hire I don't think anyone saw coming Scott Satterfield is leaving Louisville for Cincinnati.
And they're playing each other in their bowl game!!!!
He's gonna walk out of the Louisville locker room at kickoff and then walk into the Cinci locker room at half-time.
ON THE SAME SIDELINE
Cincinnati poaching away from Louisville big oof for the ACC.
If that isn't a massive shot across the financial bow of the ACC, I don't know what is.
I'm not sure the state of Louisville football is much of an indicator of the state of the ACC.
Yeah but its also not like they are poor. They still have plenty of Papa John's money from before he got das boot.
agreed. If Cincy had poached, say, Mike Norvell, that might be more significant. We'll know the ACC is roasted when Dabo his hired by, like Arizona State, or something. (Though, I suspect, Dabo is waiting for Saban to retire and angling for that Bama job)
I also wonder what the general atmosphere is for Satterfield at Louisville. He has been flirting with anything in a skirt since he got there, surely things are at least a LITTLE frosty for him.
Literally Jim Phillips trying to keep the conference going right now
Also someone should edit this gif and label the band guys Jim Phillips, John Swofford, Carolina Mafia, ACCN and the violin GoR
It seemed like Satterfield was headed toward a hot seat year. Didn't they just get a new AD?
Not to mentioned he burned through a lot of fanbase/administration good will when he interviewed with USCe without notifying anyone and then having a half-baked "apology" after he didnt get the job
Where have I heard this story before?
Oh no. Please don't take our elite 24-25 record coaches away.
I don't think this reflects all that poorly on the ACC. Satterfield was on the hot seat this year and would be close to it next year, at best he maintained Louisville's stature without showing much upside aside from a good recruiting class this year. Instead of forking out for a buyout Louisville now gets to pocket $3.5 mil and get a fresh start.
Nah, this is another Holgorson situation. Satterfield got the hell out of town before he could be fired. His seat the Louisville was going to be napalm hot next year so he got out while he had some credibility left. The question for me is why did Cincinnati choose him of all people? Satterfield was the best they could do? Really?
Satterfield has been trying to leave UL for years now, but hasn't done good enough to get offers anywhere. They have a really good recruiting class, beat everyone they were supposed to. Just wasn't a fit.
Similar to Holgorson, who wanted to get out of WVU and back to a Texas-based school.
To be honest, I don't think Cincy is going to be great in the B12. I think it's really hard to play in a Texas-centric conference, but not be in or boarding the state of Texas, and I think a lot of coaches are aware of this.
Satterfield was very successful at App State, and decent at Louisville. Recruiting will be tough, but Satterfield has recruited out of Texas a little bit, and has ties to that part of the midwest that is both the rust belt and Appalachia.
I wouldn't call it a slam dunk hire, but I could see it working out.
Edit: Looks like Satterfield took a paycut to get out of UL. He wanted to be gone.
So now that the North Texas job has opened up, I'm seeing a lot of smoke about Justin Fuente being high up on the candidate list. I think that would be a really good fit for him honestly.
edit: although it seems WVU hired away North Texas's AD a few days ago, so that's an interesting problem to have lol. I guess you have to fill that first before you go get a coach! Another fun fact--the old North Texas AD was an assistant AD at Memphis while Fuente was there.
Might be time for a 2.0 thread. Also sounds like Kent St HC to Colorado as OC
Kent St. has been pretty good at offense, but not amazing. I'm wondering what the advanced metrics say, because it looks like the offense did not score much against P5 teams over his tenure at Kent State.
But, he did have that one good half against Georgia! And he beat VT as OC in 2016, when Syracuse was bad.
I don't know, maybe it works. But if it doesn't, I'll enjoy the Prime Time show that develops.
This is wild, he was doing quite well there. The record isn't impressive but Kent State is a tough place to win and he elevated that program, they almost made a bowl game this year with the most brutal OOC schedule in the country (Georgia, Washington, Oklahoma). Pretty sure he was seen as a rising start kind of coach, I wonder if he's realizing elevating a tough job is not a good way to climb the ladder
If you thought Kent State was a hard place to win, he is going to Colorado...
Jeff Brohm leaving Purdue for Louisville.
This is a pretty big deal. 5 years ago, UL would indisputably be a better job than Purdue. Now, with the new B10 TV deal, that's a looming question - what mediocre B10 programs are better than a good (not great) ACC program? I know Brohm has ties to Louisville, so it's a bit different, but this is still a data point in the right direction for the ACC.
Yeah, I think the fact that he's in Louisville's hall of fame has to be a major factor, but he also just got Purdue to the Big 10 championship game. It kinda makes sense, but it's also kind of a head scratcher.
His stock probably doesn't get any higher than it is right now.
It's a data point in the right direction, but he only didn't leave Purdue when Satterfield got the job because he just got there. There was no way he was going to pass up his dream job a second time.
I hope it does help to elevate another ACC program, but this one seems like more of an overall outlier than a real data point
Seems like the chips are starting to fall in place and we've gone another hiring cycle without Fuente getting a seat. Is it that he's not trying because of the money we paid him to go away or are people still wary because of how things panned out here?
Yes
It seems like he was in the running at UAB for awhile and possibly Tulsa. UAB looks to be too broke to get anyone with college football HC experience good or bad. Rumors are multiple coaches turned down Tulsa because the program is a mess. North Texas is still open. We haven't hit coordinator season just yet. So maybe he goes that route, I think he would be better suited for that.
Remember, Justin and Brad are a package deal.
Going to be v interesting to see if this is still the case.
If it is, he is on the all time bonehead list. The guy clear as day cost you your job at a P5 school and your reputation as a HC
Someone with photoshop skills is going to have to put Fuente and Corn's face on their bodies from when they're on the bow of the ship flying.
Fuente is not that stupid. This is a results business. If they are a "package" deal it's Fu recommending him as a QB coach to his new AD- at best.
Odd. I remember when Whit talked to opposing staffs about Fuente and Cornelson and the feedback he got was "our offense was very well thought of".
Has Mack lost control?
Mack never had control. He's there to be the "face" of the Program and Recruit.
Longo likely got frustrated by propping up their abhorrent Defense and may have gotten some extra $$ too.
Now what would be pure hilarity is if Drake Maye decided with his O.C. leaving, he should bolt town too.
Maye has no ties to Longo, but if Downs and Green leave.....
Yep- Bly and Thigpen can't coach a lick, but they can recruit and Brown is going to hold onto them for that alone. That defense has sucked for a while
You know who would be a great OC at UNC? Brad Cornelsen.
Or another option: Colorado just hired Sean Lewis from Kent State. I know another MAC head coach with a ton of offensive coordinator experience who might jump at the chance to get out of the league
Wonder if Longo was told that Mack would be retiring and he would be head coach. Then found out Mack wasn't leaving.
Read that their OL coach, Jack Bicknell Jr, is going to Wisconsin as well for same job.
Probably getting outbid.
Longo in the B10 is going to be very interesting. Zigging while everyone else Zags.
Robert Anae leaving Syracuse for NCST. Third OC job in ACC in three years.
Any O Linemen on the Wolfpack known for their soft hands and surprising wiggle?
Saw someone else throw it out there, wonder if Armstrong would go south with Anae
Esp with Leary also portalling
Wonder if Syracuse is back on the hot seat next year.
They have lost several assistants this cycle.
Maybe the heat is still on after going 6-0, then 0-5, and managing to finish 1-0.
Anae just learning that the Wolf Pac is just.... tooo... sweeeet.....
Wow, huge get for NC State. Beck did OK with them, but he was a below-average to bad coordinator at every other stop and I think that offense under performed given the talent on that roster the past few years. I think Doreen is super overrated but this is the kind of hire that could push them forward
That will make NCSU very dangerous. That potent offense combined with an already stout D will make them a very good program.
🚨 rumor that Purdue might interview old Salty Narduzzi himself.
that's a Purduzzi
All 👏 of 👏 the 👏 legs 👏
10/10 well done
Let me be the first to say.....Puck Pat Purduzzi!
I would love getting Nard Dog out of the ACC
Yes, but we still have to deal with him next year of he takes the Purdue job.
He is from that area originally, has recruiting ties, and we would love to see him leave Pitt so they can go back to being bottom dwellers.
Can you imagine the sideline rants each year as they are getting whopped by 24 points against, OSU, Wisky, and MeatChicken? Glorious!
Fuck Pat Narduzzi
Troy Taylor to Stanford. Took Sacramento State to 3 FCS Playoffs.
Ravens fans I know will be gutted, guess Greg Roman will be sticking in Baltimore
Navy coach is out.
Would love to know the details behind this one. This isn't exactly a job where hotshot assistants are lining up to take, and definitely not a destination HC position. And, do they opt for a coach with the same single wing (I think) option mindset (because there aren't many of those) or are they looking for a program overhaul?
Navy has been trending the wrong way for a few years and losing the dominance over Army isn't going to help your case. 1-11 is a palatable season based on the 1 kind of deal. I would imagine they try to get another option offense coach, based on their size limitations and previous successful stretch
It's been building - last year the AD fired the OC without consulting Coach Ken, then they rehired him back with a different title... very awkward situation. They'll continue running the option, but I'm not sure if they'll hire an Army assistant, or if they'll do something more like Air Force is doing.
The more interesting question (IMO) is where does Coach Ken go? He's said multiple times in the past that if he left Navy he wouldn't run the triple. He interviewed at ASU and allegedly had the job until their QB tweeted that he would leave because he doesn't want to run the triple.
How do you over haul a service academy?
Put the legs on before the shoulder straps? Oh, wait. It was semi rhetorical question, not a joke....
Fired him in the locker room. I get they wanted to move on, but they couldn't wait till the got back to Annapolis?
ooof....that's rough. You'd think they would have a bit more tact but apparently not.
I thought the academies put an emphasis on leadership skills too? Double yikes.
I know it's still really soon to discuss, but I'm wondering how the the news of Mike Leach's passing (RIP, Pirate) will affect the coaching carousel. Will MSU keep the current staff intact and name an interim HC for the coming year? Or do they jump into an external coaching search while the carousel is still moving? Either way, it's a really tough situation to navigate and I'm interested to see how it plays out.
I can't imagine they play their bowl game or announce a new HC anytime soon.
Looks like they are still planning on playing
Can't embed but it was some tweet saying there was "0% chance they were going to skip the bowl. That Leach would've been pissed. They're playing in a stadium with an actual pirate ship!" Paraphrasing.
Boy was I wrong on both counts here. Playing in the bowl and already have their new coach.
I can understand and respect this. For one, it shows solidarity and certainty after such a tragedy. To recruits and players you know the staff is staying intact, and they were winning so it's not like they're bad coaches at all. Also from a business standpoint, it's probably a low risk contract for the school so if for some reason it doesn't work out after a few years, they can begin a new search in earnest. I'm also sure Leach would want them to play the bowl game too. I'm a fan of this and glad they nipped this in the bud and didn't let HC speculation overshadow paying respects to Leach.
They don't really have a choice but to promote someone on staff. If you fail to do so, you probably lose your entire recruiting class and get pillaged by the portal.
The James Johnson logic. Bold strategy Cotton.
Counterpoint: Dabo Swinney logic.
It's quite different IMO:
Fair- but at the heart of it the decision is to "not lose the recruiting class"
More like 'not lose the entire roster' - tampering has been issue since transferring has been deregulated. There are reports all over twitter of other coaches attempting to pillage Mississippi state players after Leach passed.
Which backfired tremendously because IIRC the Greenberg recruits (Montrezl Harrell in particular) decommitted anyway!
How much was Greenburg and how much was the hookers hired by Louisville?
No, the James Johnson logic way would be to wait until 2-3 months after your season ends, THEN try to hire a new coach. Figure out that nobody good is still on the board, then grab a former assistant because he's a cheap deal.
Yeah how quickly do you think Lane was on the phone with Leach's recruits after the bad news was announced
Not quickly tbh. Despite his twitter reputation, Lane isn't really that great of a recruiter. I've seen a lot of people say he's 'sloppy'. He also still owns a place in Boca that he likes to vacation to quite frequently (relative to other college football coaches). Kinda ironic that Leach would do the same thing, and jet off to the Florida Keys for chunks of the offseason.
It's an interesting quandary. Zach Arnett is the DC and Interim coach. He's young, talented, and up & coming, but elevating him to Head Coach perminently seems pre mature. On top of that, I'm not sure if Mississippi state has an AD right now - John Cohen left about a month ago for Auburn - I don't think they've replaced him yet (though I'm not positive). On top of that, Early Signing Day is right around the corner.
Arnett might just have the job through 2023. Going to be an interesting situation to monitor for sure.
Lack of an AD will really screw things up for them. You are right that Arnett might be HC by default for now.
I wonder if they cancel the bowl game, they were already practicing.
can't embed from work, but looks like Vance Vice and James Shibest are joining Barry Odom at UNLV...along with OC Bobby Petrino.
i would say the two better coaches from the old regime
Outside of not finding some one that could catch AND return punts, Shibert had very good special teams.
Just ran across an interesting tidbit. Was looking at radio broadcast assignments to see what Bill Roth was doing for the bowl Season and saw this:
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For someone who didn't seem to like the media this seems like an odd choice.
I agree.....his press conferences weren't what I'd call captivating by any means either.
He is probably trying to do something around football but ain't nobody calling for a coaching job right now.
Nothing more than some message board chatter on the other boards right now, so didn't want to start a new thread - but has anyone heard/seen the rumor that our QB coach Brad Glenn has been hired by Satterfield at Cincy? They just lost their OC to the Colts I believe. Would be a massive blow this late in the game, especially since we don't have another coach qualified to teach QBs and a lot were presuming we were rolling out a more RPO-based offense this year. Not great if true.
while things move fast, that's super quick. Their OC was announced as hired by Colts yesterday. Granted, Satterfeld probably had known that their OC was leaving (or at least considering the job) for a couple of days and his connection with Glenn made it easy for him to inquire prior to the Colt's finalizing the hire. Seems fast that he would agree to the hire within 24 hours of it opening, but the connection is there and it would be a major step up for him to be OC at a P5 school.
It definitely would leave VT in a bind, it's really late in the hiring season. And more concerning would be the facts that Glenn was the only coach with significant OC experience and that Drones was the prototypical QB for Glenn when he was having good success at GSU.
If this plays out to be true, VT will become even more inexperienced on the offensive staff and lack a bona fide RPO expert, if VT moves that way with Drones.
BAG said the same thing in one of the discord servers I'm on, and it's (allegedly) one of the reasons Belfort was slow on committing.
I agree it's a blow, not sure where we go (not that we won't have options; I just don't know who/what is out there).
Hopefully its not a deal breaker. He seems pretty pumped about other aspects of VT though
My first thought was Josh Gattis. Knows Pry and Co from PSU, already has existing relationship with Whit, and great recruiter. But although he's been OC and pass game coordinator he's never coached QBs so we still have that void. Will be interesting to see where they go:
I don't think highly of Josh Gattis. It's possible that he's just never been on a team where the head coach gave him control of the offense (Saban, Harbaugh, and Cristobol are all known to be meddlers) but I've just never thought his offenses to be particularly creative.
Also, to your point, we need someone on the staff who has a proven history of coaching QBs.
Rumors were Harbaugh had to pull the offense back away from him and was happy he left cause he wasn't a fit, not sure how true though.
I don't buy this - Gattis left late in the coaching cycle because Harbaugh was flirting with the NFL and his job was in jeopardy. I don't doubt that there were philosophical scheme disagreements between the two of them, and I imagine Harbaugh is a difficult person to work for, but the timing just doesn't add up to suggest that Gattis was pushed out.
Regardless, I don't want him as a QB coach at VT.
To be clear I didn't say pushed out, he was responsible for less as the season went on. Harbaugh went to the playoffs like that so why push him out if you know it can work well enough.
Well it will be interesting to see how Pry approaches this. Outbid Cincy to keep him? Potential job title change from Passing Game coordinator to OC?
Or if he leaves, does Pry promote from within, find another raw talent, or another veteran. New OC, Tom Brady...
I'm guessing we hire the QB coach from ODU or Marshall, or we promote a QC assistant from within at this stage of the off-season.
Well since I posted that, I know we aren't keeping him.
TBH, if it's gotten this far, it's probably not about the money.