Well, it happened and Frank Beamer has announced his retirement after a completely stellar 29 years at Virginia Tech turning a program that was for all intents and purposes a dumpster fire of a program on probation with little to no history to one with 7 conference titles, 8 BCS/Alliance appearances, a National Championship appearance, while playing in a conference the school eyed as a pie in the sky dream when he started.
Where do we go from here? For the majority of us in here, Beamer has been the coach for the majority of our lives, if not the entirety. How do you follow a legend? Who would even be willing to get themselves into that kind of position?
Apparently quite a few of the top names out there, to be honest. Kirby Smart, the DC of perennial powerhouse Alabama has already thrown his name into the pot. We've heard endless rumors that Rich Rodriguez is interested in coming back East and has been linked to the possibility for a while. And of course there's the usual gamete of coaches from lower schools who would love to move up like Justin Fuente and Tom Herman. There's also rumors that Mark Richt could be out at Georgia by year's end as well as Chip Kelly possibly wanting to bail back to college as his experiment in Philadelphia isn't exactly going as planned. Or, do we look to within, and go with Bud Foster, who has been wanting the job forever, or Shane Beamer, who could be our version of a Dabo Swinney?
So when you have a possible lineup of candidates like this, where do you go? How do you sift through the talent pool and bring in the perfect guy for the job. Thankfully, the last time we had to do this, it went exceptionally well for us, so lets go back to that old playbook.
In all seriousness, though, I'm just glad that Whit Babcock is in charge of this process and not myself. Not because I don't think I could totally nail the process (let's be honest, I totally could... boom!) but Whit has proven himself already to our fanbase that he can swing above his weight class and bring in the perfect guy for the job. Of all the guys listed in the above paragraph, there is one that will most likely end up with the job, and that is the shocking out of nowhere bombshell hire. And I'll be honest, I'm a little excited to see what happens.
So sit back, Hokie Nation, and enjoy the ride. We are literally going to have coaches falling over themselves trying to get this job, and we're going to have to turn away some great talent. And one thing is for certain, the next few months and years are going to be exciting, as we're going through a process most of us have never been through before.
And as an aside, I would be remiss in not clarifying this would all not be possible without the work that Frank has done over the past 29 years with this program. He literally built a sustainable program out of nothing, and turned an also ran into a national name. If you don't think we're a national name, read the articles that are coming out about Frank now and the amount of respect that is being paid for what he was able to do. He took a program that was perennially mediocre and turned it into one that is expected to compete for conference titles annually and to get into the national title conversation regularly. We have some of the best facilities in the country with a rabid and loyal fanbase who travels especially well, even when the team isn't playing to expectations. We have the financial ability to pay a new coach a very good salary, and we have the support system within the athletic department and within the fanbase to completely support the new staff from Day 1. None of this is possible without Frank Beamer. I said it before, and I will say it again, long after he is gone, Beamer Ball will still be our reputation. Our Special Teams will always be known as the Pride and Joy, and the expectation will be that we will dominate you in special teams and defense to win games. That is our identity and it will live on. Now we just have to bring in a coach who can build on that reputation and keep progressing it forward.
Comments
Dream scenario...
Justin Fuente or Tom Herman, they find a way to hold onto Bud Foster. That would be literally the best case scenario. I don't think it's likely that Foster stays in Blacksburg if he's not offered the job. Hopefully I'm wrong.
Hopefully Foster is offered the job and wins 10 national championships. My heart and my head are waging a fierce war over who I want to be next head coach right now.
I agree fully with your dream scenario, and barring that I want Bud to get the job.
#FuenteFoster2016
I would absolutely not hate this, and with the guys that we KNOW are interested, this would be top scenario 1a.
That being said, I just have this feeling there's a guy out there that nobody is even considering that Whit has up his sleeve. Someone like a Gary Patterson from TCU. If we could bring him in and still keep Bud, that combination could leap that scenario.
Isn't Gary Patterson a coach who specializes on the defensive side of the ball? Why would you keep Bud in that scenario?
I thought he brought in an offensive coordinator who changed up his system so they could hang with the offenses in the Big12.
I'm in the same boat.
1: Fuente/Foster
2a: Fuente
2b: Foster
3a: Herman
3b: Smart
I think a young and energetic coach like Fuente would be great and would definitely be nice down the road as he develops more with the program, but Foster also has his points being one of the pillars of VT Football. I can see both being great for their own reasons, but together they could be a powerhouse, IMO.
Other names:
Chad Morris (SMU, former Clemson OC)
Matt Rhule (Temple)
Matt Campbell (Toledo)
Rod Carey (NIU)
just throwing those out there.
I was really hoping Temple would knock off ND this past weekend just to add some steam to the Rhule hype train
IMHO, they didn't need to win, they just needed to do what they did -- show up big against the ND powerhouse. I actually expected them to get boat-raced by ND. The fact that Temple played ND as strong as they did showed me all I need to know about Rhule. He's a solid coach. I don't have him above Fuente or Herman, personally. But, he's in my 2nd tier.
The more I read about him, the more I like Campbell. Still not at the top of my personal list with Fuente/Foster/Herman, but definitely not far behind. Could be a good hire in the long run.
My wishlist for the new "big whistle":
1) Someone with a PLAN - yep as simple as that. I like system guys, but I also like guys who have a definitive plan/roadmap. Also worth noting, that plan should mesh with our abilities (i.e. running a 3-4 defense or BC style offensive line is probably not in the cards for our recruiting base).
2) Some who can punch above their weight class - primarily in recruiting. Looking at the current team, imagine how we would look with most of those misses.
3) Energetic - inside the locker room, in the recruits homes, in the huddle, on the sidelines, etc. Not a clown...but someone with a lot of energy.
4) Keep as much of the staff as necessary - keeping in mind several (Gray, Beamer, Brown) are alumni or long term (Foster, Wiles) kicking them to the curb is not good for cohesion and alumni engagement (remember the stat where 0% of our pro players are donating to VT). That said #4, is low on this list for a reason...it shouldn't come at the cost of #1.
Few schools get actual Monetary donations from former players.
Fuente/Herman/Morris
retain Foster and Gray on defense. Everyone else is up for grabs. lil Beams catchs an FBS HC gig.
You don't want to retain Charley Wiles, the defensive line coach. I don't know you anymore. :)
that made me laugh. leg for you! I was actually thinking about what would happen in that scenario, not my personal decision.
I'd actually like to see a couple of the offensive coaches hang on too. Burden seems like a good recruiter and a solid WR coach. I fully expect a new HC to bring in his own OC, but I'd be happy with Loeffler as a QB coach as well. (assuming, of course, that he'd be willing to accept a demotion)
We should clean house on offense.
Isn't the whole offensive staff on 1-year letter of appointments? I think they are all up this June. Wonderful timing for a new coach.
Everyone on staff except for Bud and Frank expire June 2016.
I agree with Burden. He has done exactly what I had hoped. Recruit well and improve Ford, Phillips and Bucky. the lack of a 3rd WR in rotation is more history than it is Burden. Would love for him to stay on.
for my personal beliefs I actually think everything has been predetermined. Pure speculation, but I think Foster was told in his new contract extension that he wouldn't be the HC but he will be retained as DC. I think that was written in stone and that's why Foster was so emotional about it. That's wild speculation but I believe that is the case. I don't think there will be much turnover on defense but I would be ok with a new DL coach. And as much as I love Brown, I am just not sure what he is adding at the moment.
On the offensive side, Lefty's days are numbered. Which I am bittersweet about because I think he is a lot better than what people give him credit for. I think Shane will either go to special teams/recruiter or take a HC at FBS. Would love to keep Burden, but entire offensive side could be cleared.
I'm with you on Brown, for sure. I was a student during his playing days and respect the hell outta that man, but if someone on the defensive side has to go (as I'm assuming will be the case if anyone not named Bud Foster is the next HC), he's the most logical choice. LB seems to be our most glaring weakness on defense, and unless something happens to Wiles, allowing Brown to coach his natrual position group on the DL, it'll be hard to justify retaining him.
On Lefty, I think he's still very highly regarded as a QB coach, and has been instrumental in getting commitments from some good QB recruits. Unless the next coach has his own, very good, guy to bring along with him, he'd be foolish to not consider Lefty for QB coach.
Someone like Buzz Williams...but for football
Buzz is crazy enough to coach both.
And talk about a curve ball.
the "smart" pick
Seriously though, sometimes I wonder about coaches that get to be places like Bama. On the one hand, they can't be completely worthless because they'd get kicked to the curb in a second. On the other hand, you get to work with 5 star athletes without having to do as much to recruit them (as in, the brand recruits itself).
Except it's much harder, not easier. Bama is great but even a 5* guy rides the bench on the 3rd team (Hand), So it's hard selling playing time. And then add in recruiting against Bama/Auburn/FSU/USCw/Texas A&M/Flordia/Mich/Mich St/Ohio St/Oregon/Texas/Clemson, and then every other hometown/small school that's trying to recruit you on the environment of the area you're from and playing time at YOUR school.
VT is out battling ODU/DUKE/UNC/UVA/Miami and having it pretty easy...Best in the ACC, Best in state. Long time Coaches, close to home
It's worth taking a look at what is happening with McElwain at Florida. Yes, he had a few years of head coaching experience before Florida, but he was successful as a head coach as soon as he got to Colorado state. He too was a coordinator for Saban with the same kinds of questions being asked. Doesn't prove that Smart will be as successful, but does show that those coordinators are quality coaches in their own right.
My only concern is that this move would be a career stepping stone. I don't expect the next VT to view Blacksburg as the place where he will spend several decades coaching, but if someone like Smart or Morris comes here and has success, and there is an opening at an SEC school (yes, I know USCe is currently open), then they might bolt and they don't really care about the program or what happens to it. I know that I might have Orange and Maroon blinders on and that in 2015 college athletics, people are going to be coaching with one eye on their next big job/raise, but I just hope the next guy really wants to be here. And not somoene like Bobby Petrino. I know VT isn't a blue blood with name cache like some of the classic big schools, but it is more than a resume upgrade for a coach with higher aspirations.
The thing is, VT will have one of the easiest P5 paths to the playoff. We have top notch facilities, a rabid fanbase and fertile recruiting grounds. While some may see it as a stepping stone, someone like Kirby Smart might see it as a place that he can win and leave a legacy like Bob Stoops has at OU. No one will be able to replicate what Beamer did here since he brought us from nothing to a nationally recognized brand.
Yeah, go and look at what people are saying about the opening right now. They aren't treating it as a stepping stone job, because it isn't one anymore. We're the top tier program in a division within a Power 5 conference that is expected to contend for conference titles, and along with that Playoff appearances, on an annual basis. We're also the biggest football program in the Mid-Atlantic region with the potential to expand that to a greater range.
The only people who seriously consider us a stepping stone and not a destination are ourselves.
Not sure I completely agree with that statement, especially as it pertains to a guy like Smart. He's widely believed to be the heir apparent to Saban at Alabama. 5 years from now, if the Tide come calling, I don't see any chance that he'd say no. I do agree in principle though, that Beamer has elevated this job to 'destination' status, rather than 'stepping stone' for most coaches, but I don't think that's the case for all the coaches currently rumored to be candidates. To me, that decreases the desirability of guys like Kirby Smart.
Well, Smart is a UGA alum. So if the Georgia job does open up, I could see him going there. He was offered the defensive coordinator position a while ago, but turned the Dawgs down.
On the other hand, Smart+Foster would just be a nightmare to plan against.
If the Tide came calling in 5 years it would mean we are winning big, and I'd be ok with that. :-)
I think Alum07 has identified a big challenge for our fanbase. We are all going to have to become used to an increased coaching carousel then we have ever experienced. The 'Top Tier' programs that we keep talking about as 'destination' jobs (Alabama, LSU, USCw, ND, etc.) all have more turnover within their recent coaching history than VT, they also have (in most cases) a historical legacy of sustained success with multiple different coaches.
I think the plan should be to identify someone who carry the program forward maintaining the defensive ferocity that the fanbase expects and building upon the offensive improvements we have seen the past couple of years. If the next coach can accomplish those things they have the chance to make this progam a program that is mentioned with the historical legacy programs. That would be a good goal for our next HC - bring a national championship to Blacksburg and build upon the existing legacy of HCB.
I hear this a lot about it being a stepping stone. but I think VT is a lot like FSU in some aspects. and jimbo fischer to me is the definition of a SEC coach but I don't think he is looking to go anywhere. if whoever is next at VT can be successful I don't think he will be looking to bolt to the SEC. so much hype about SEC coaching gigs but I really don't see anyone trying to get them except for SEC assistance to be honest.
So the scenario in my mind is something like this. whit nails some great hire from the list. Shane leaves to get some coordinator/ HC experience. 3-4 years the hire takes off for OSU, USCw, LSU, Alabama...Shane comes back and we have Beamer legacy part deux...
And then we rotate the players at every position instead of just running back. It's so crazy it just might work.
Run it like a goddamn hockey team
30-50 second shifts! Keep'em fresh!
For me the importance must include making sure the VT family and Hokie Nation stay an important part. No head coach hiding in his closed off office, no banning of families and donors from practice/events.
Repost from another thread...
Here's a crazy thought... Butch Jones. Was Whit's HC at Cincy. Its not a big stretch to say the least. Know nothing about salary. Its been three years, and given UT has not had a breakthrough season yet, could be ripe for the picking.
http://www.foxsports.com/college-football/story/whos-next-at-virginia-te...
That would make my marriage to a Vol very interesting.
I can't see Butch leaving UT. He's doing a good job and they are on the verge.
While that'd certainly make the Battle at Bristol interesting, I can't see Butch leaving either. I've seen a couple of UT fans saying that they could be 8-0 if they had changed one play per game (interesting ideology, isn't it). Before the win against Georgia, I would've said it might be a possibility, but now their fans are pretty content, or so it seems to me. And Butch seems to care a lot about Tennessee too.
#brickbybrick
For awhile I wanted Butch Jones real bad. After watching him coach this year, I don't want him near Blacksburg. The reason Tennessee has lost all of those close game is because he gets a lead and turtles. Draws back the play calling trying to run out the clock. Sound familiar? Butch Jones' in game management philosophy seems to be very similar to Frank's and it has cost them dearly against top competition.
The top 6 names being thrown around out there OR the field? Which do you bet on?
I take the field.
Field, because of the sheer number of open positions this year. Who knows who might be in play with that many coaching changes?
Who are your top 6 'names being thrown around'? From what I've read:
I'd take the field. I don't see Whit hiring anyone without HC experience, so that knocks off Foster and Smart. I don't see us taking Rich Rod - the rumor has been floated enough that Whit has seen dismay from fans. I suppose Richt is a possibility, but I see the result being very similar to Tuberville in Cincy, which I'm not interested in, maybe Whit is, idk.
So, of my 'top 6 names being thrown around' (note - I read this as 6 most speculated names, not 6 best candidates), I only see 2-3 of them being realistic hires (Fuente, Herman, maybe Richt). I'll take the field, especially this year with so many openings.
Morris and Rhule are probably more realistic than Richt
I think Morris is least realistic. I'm in that boat of people that don't see him leaving the state of Texas.
I'm surprised his name keeps popping up. I don't want a guy with one year of 1-7 HC experience when there are plenty of other options.
He already expressed interest in the South Carolina job
I've never really understood why fans are so infatuated with Richt.
UGA fans aren't.
Despite the talent, money, and rabid fans, his teams always seem to come up short when it matters most. As one fan said on twitter after the 'bama loss: "He's solid, but not stellar." IMO Richt is to Beamer as Loeffler is to Stiney: an improvement, but not one that will yield the result we're looking for.
I would love to see Herman or an offensive minded guy come in and keep Foster. I think that would be a win for everyone. I don't see Whit going for a defensive minded HC (unless it is Kirby) so the new guy will need a DC and there is no better way to win the fanbase over early than keeping Bud around. It would be good for the culture and I think the new HC and energy could help land some of those studs Bud has been missing on defense.
I believe in earning your position in life, and I don't think any hokie has earned his shot at a HC coaching job like Bud Foster. His multi-decade audition has shown me (and I think everyone) that he deserves the head hokie job. With a few exceptions, everyone has had short term success at some school, either as a HC or coordinator. We've had someone for years who embodies the hokie football ideal of a blue collar work ethic, but with some fire that we wished we saw more of from Frank.
Foster for HC!
THIS !!!
Bud Foster - Whatever it takes
While I really want to agree with you, but I'm not sure I can. I do believe that, if Foster is interested in the position, he deserves an interview. Some questions I would ask Bud (and every other candidate interviewed):
If he lays out a strategy better than any other candidate, proves he has a distinct vision and a means to execute it, and can name specific ways where the Beamer team went wrong and specific ways to correct, then I'm ok with him getting consideration.
I would love to see Bud as HC, but I think recruiting is just too big a question mark with him
He deserves the interview for sure, but his body of work also speaks for itself. The best "interview" doesn't necessarily make for the best candidate. On the flip side, his plans and strategy need to be in line with Whit's vision for the team.
With the retirement now publicly announced, Whit can begin a nationwide search program before the end of the season. A lot of currently employed coaches won't be able to interview or comment on interest but behind the scene chats can start.
I imagine that Bud and potentially Shane are going to get interviews as that was Frank's expressed desire. Unfortunately, I am not sure I can see either getting the job. Bud partially because of his age, while Tech might be a stepping stone for an up and coming hire, I want Whit thinking of the next coach that might be here for a decade or two. Sadly, that is not Bud anymore.
While Dabo was a success as a HC with no prior experience as a HC, it was solely due to having Chad Morris as his OC. Hiring Venerables helped as well a couple of years later. I don't see Shane having the connection to a Chad Morris, OC guru type that he could bring in. On a plus side, Shane has coached special teams before and we could get a new real RB coach.
Whit has previously stated he wanted some prior experience as a HC as a factor. But I think if he brings in a defensive HC other than Bud that is going to piss off a substantial portion of the fanbase. So expect a new offensive minded HC.
Best case, a new offensive minded head coach who likes and appreciates Bud Foster for who he is and can work with him.
A young energetic offensive minded HC will be hard to find a better DC candidate than Bud. The question is if Bud will want to stay in that role or if he feels like it would be time to go find a HC job and maybe settle for one a little lower down just so he can be a HC before he retires.
Unless Bud has no fire left to become a HC, there's no way he stays without getting the head hokie job (and quite frankly, he should leave if that happens).
Except he is under contract
So are the coaches we want to hire. That means he has to buy out his contract or he retires. The contracts mean nothing when it comes to holding a coach in a spot.
Would he take a DC job somewhere else? Would he go against his idea of only taking the right HC job if it is available? He loves the area around Blacksburg, has been there for decades and is a beloved person in the area. He is paid handsomely now as an assistant. Frank will still be around and involved in the administration so he isn't "alone" there as a DC. There are plenty of reasons he would stay if he isn't the next HC.
The biggest difference with Dabo is he was interim head coach for half a season before he was hired to officially takeover as the head coach. Clemson got a low cost, low risk chance to really evaluate him with the ability to walk away after 6 games if it didn't work out. Of course, Dabo made the most of his opportunity and now looks like a good hire. Shane is not going to get a 7-game audition, and I do not see us hiring a coach that does not have any experience as HC, OC, or DC. Sure, it's possible that it could work out, but it's a massive gamble that we do not need to take.
I agree, I think they get interviews because Frank wanted them to, but I can't see either getting the job.
So reading over Twitter it looks like Whit and members of his staff have reached out to recruits and commits and said something about the new hire would be someone offensively minded.
Source?
Well,
what else would you tell offensive recruits? right?
I have a lot of faith in Whit and I'm sure he'll hit a grand slam in December/January when he announces the next Head Hokie. Until then, however, I'm not going to rule out the possibility of the next head coach coming from the defensive side of the ball.
I mean, I have no idea who James Copeland is and a quick scan through his feed doesn't suggest he's connected in any way.
Also Alex doesn't seem to be implying anything about offensive minded coaches so I'd pump the brakes on this meaning anything regarding who will be the next HC.
you're right- that J Copeland guy is a loser...
Ha!
Didn't mean any disrespect to you, obviously, but I haven't really seen or heard anything concrete that the next guy will be an offensive minded coach -- just that he'll be hired by January.
But if your #marinades are telling you differently, maybe I need to check my #sauces.
I should just say your name out loud and you will have my back in the media/photoshop dept. I have the info you know how to find it and put it on here faster than I can get off my iPad to do so.
...sigh..this will make me even more sad than Beamer retiring
I'm hoping Fuente, but I'm not one that will be Googling how to tie a hangman's knot if it's RichRod. He's probably 3-4 on my list.
Am I the only person who really wants Rich Rod?
yes
No. But the people who don't want him are really, really vocal about it.
Me personally, he's probably my third or fourth choice. I won't be disappointed if we wind up with him, but I'll think we could have done better getting a younger/hotter coach.
I'd take Herman, Fuente, Foster, Rhule, Smart, Morris, Venables, Pep Hamilton, Pelini, Butch Jones and others I can't think of off the top of my head over RichRod. He's not the worst choice, but there are many better options out there.
Pelini can eat an entire bag of dicks.
I live in West Virginia. He picked up that program after Don Nehlen sort of let it slide, similar to Frank at Tech. Fans absolutely loved Rich Rod when he was their coach. When he left, he received death threats... I was an advocate of Rich Rod, but he struggled at Michigan (whether or not he was given a fair shake is for another conversation), and while he improved Arizona from what they were before, he hasn't really gotten any farther than 8-5 seasons and the occasional upset of Oregon.
Personally, I am a huge fan of Matt Rhule. He is the only coach of Fuente, Herman, and himself to play against an elite team this season, and he did not disappoint. While Temple did not pull out the win, they were competitive the entire game and it came down to the last possession. He is a young and energetic coach who took probably the worst program in college football in the early 2000s and turned them into a very good football team in the matter of three seasons.
Ole Miss would like to speak with you
Yeah I forgot about Ole Miss.
Apologies to them.
Considering their average fan, this isn't exactly a plus.
Nah their average fan is just like ours. It's just that their worst are worse than most.
I like RichRod but considering how divisive he is in our fan base, I hope we don't hire him. We need to come together as a group, not be pulled apart. Hokie Nation is in a precarious position.
The whole thing just annoys me though, the argument against RichRod is so illogical I almost want him hired out of spite. My wife hates RicRod because "he's got a stupid face." At least that's honest.
I have yet to hear an argument against RichRod that reduces to anything more than, "He's Rich Rod!"
Rationally, I don't want him because I don't think he has the blueprint to take us to the top.
The five year old in me things watching his hire unfold and the ensuing meltdown would he highly entertaining.
But deep down inside, I don't want to see the fanbase split. So I think we should look elsewhere.
Then you have not been looking, numerous people from French to me to VPIHokie have all laid out cases for why he would be a bad hire with numerous reasons given.
Sorry, just calling it like I see it, but for every argument posted, there has been a counterargument that addresses the particular grievance. At this point I think those opposed to Rich Rod have emptied the arsenal, and based on everything I've read, your platform seems more fueled by emotion than anything else. You guys really don't want him. And that's fine with me, really, because I don't have a horse (on a treadmill) in the race. The thought of a RichRod-coached VT doesn't cause me angst, but I'm not hoping against hope that we get him. All the net pluses that he brings to Tech, I think there are coaches out there that would bring them in greater without splitting the fanbase. But as for actual, fact-based arguments about why RichRod would be a terrible coaching hire that would threaten to undo everything we love about VT football, I've followed just about every argument posted here and I just don't see it. If anything about a RichRod hire would destroy the program, it would be the fans who walk away from it because of a grudge.
Rich Rod struggled mightily at Michigan, which has an absolute wealth of resources and recruiting gravitas. He went 15-22 over 3 years during a time when tOSU was literally the only threat in the entire B1G conference.
He had a good year with Arizona last year but can't keep it up now. His record at Arizona is better than his record at Michigan, but still not stellar (31-18)
His overall record is 151-102-2 which is good for a .592 win percentage. Frank Beamer, for comparison, is sitting at .652.
Rich's best resume boost are the 3 year stretch at WVU where he posted records of 11-1, 11-2, 10-2 from 2005 - 2007 (it should be pointed out, however, that he wasn't exactly going against juggernauts to achieve those records). Three winning seasons almost a decade ago coupled with one decent season at Arizona last year which has quickly vanished in the throes of a 5-4 campaign this year are the only positives propping him up. That's 4 pretty good seasons in a 27 year career. He's not a Mike London, by any stretch of the imagination, but I fail to see how he's qualified to take VT to the next level.
I don't think Rich Rod is a bad coach but I certainly think that is "offensive genius" is way overblown and I don't think he has what it takes to elevate this program.
Rich Rod has some character traits that make people uncomfortable with potentially hiring him at VT. He left WVU under controversial circumstances following a loss to un-ranked Pitt. His character is called further into question by being accused by his own players of continual habitual violations of NCAA rules. He mired UM in Major NCAA violations for the first time in their history during his short 3 year stint.
He has not been impressive IMO and I don't think his 'vaunted' offense is all that it's cracked up to be. I don't want a man who left his alma mater high and dry to go to a university steeped in history and tradition only to fail miserably and bring on major NCAA violations while doing so. That is a man with character flaws that I think can be dangerous and toxic to an institution. No Thanks! I especially don't think it is worth it because he isn't the proven winner or offensive guru that everyone seems to think he is. He's had 4 impressive seasons against mediocre competition in his 27 year coaching career. That is a far cry from Urban Meyer or Chip Kelly. If I was going to take a chance on a guy whose character was questionable it better damn well be a guy I know is going to win and win big. RR is not that guy.
I don't really see how any of what I've outlined above has been addressed sufficiently on these boards.
RichRod had major NCAA violations at Michigan? I don't remember Brady Hoke coming into a bowl ban or reduction of scholarship situation. I remember there was something about unauthorized practices that got a warning from the NCAA, a slap on the wrist deal, but this is the first I've ever heard about Rich Rod having major NCAA violations anywhere he's been.
NCAA formally accused Michigan of 5 major rules violations on February 22, 2010. Michigan self imposed some bans. Wiki
Michigan self imposed.
http://content.usatoday.com/communities/campusrivalry/post/2010/11/michi...
Oh for f@cks sake are people still arguing that RichRod isn't an excellent football coach.
Illinois is right on this one. The hatred for RichRod, which I feel as well, is based on emotion, not data. He is an excellent football coach who makes me want to gag.
RichRich Rod is absoluty not an excellent football coach. Harbaugh is an excellent football coach. Rich Rod is not incompetent. He knows the game of football. But he most certainly is not an excellent coach. If Rich Rod is the definition of an excellent coach than there are at least 5 excellent coaches in every single league in America. That's just not the case.
Rich Rod is good, but he's not nearly good enough to risk bringing him to Blacksburg knowing his reputation. We could very well be 5-4 this year with Rich Rod. No thanks.
Excellent football coaches have some kind of consistent results. RR does not.
Nailed it. I respect him and want to choke him at the same time.
I get that you respect him and I'm not trying to change your opinion of him. You have continually said that the RR haters just hate him for emotional reasons and that he's an excellent coach but I have yet to see you, of all people, support that reverence of him with stats and numbers. I'm not trying to be snarky and it's entirely possible I just missed the comments that break it down but I've tried to support my argument that RR just isn't an excellent coach with his results and all I'm getting in return is "you're just emotional..don't worry because we hate him too but he's still an excellent coach" but I fail to see any evidence to suggest he's even close to being on the same level as Urban, Saban, Chip Kelly, Les Miles, Harbaugh, etc. IMO those guys are all excellent coaches in their own rights. I just don't see it for RR. Show me some hard evidence to suggest that he's actually an excellent coach and I'll consider conceding that to you. Until then, I don't like him because I don't think he's as great as everyone seems to think he is AND I think he's toxic.
I actually wouldn't say he's an excellent coach. I think he was on the cutting edge of offense circa 2004. I think other coaches have surpassed him. I think he is a very good offensive coach, and with a good DC could still be potent. I think there are much better options to make us a far more dangerous team. I actually think of RichRod as our safety net choice, a guy who is a proven commodity that we can fall back to if we can't get our first top priority picks. Like I said somewhere else, I don't think he has the blueprint to take VT to the next level.
I don't think anyone who is criticizing his offensive scheme is driven by emotion. There are reasons to believe that he is not at the forefront of college football offense anymore.
I think what's driven from emotion rather than logic is the notion that RichRod is going to destroy the culture of VT football and destroy any sense of family. I don't think that's true at all. I think that he had Lloyd Carr breathing down his neck, putting the harshest spotlight of any changes he tried to bring about at Michigan. In essence, I think the whole thing at Michigan got blown the hell up because old coach was keeping tabs on new coach. Toxic situation.
And I will say, the notion that he isn't a good coach because he's following up a really good year at Arizona with a mediocre one...I think we all need to pause and realize that if we're expecting a return to a 10-win season streak, we're deluding ourselves. We might never see that again as fans. It's almost unheard of to sustain that level of consistently stellar football. I think a more reasonable expectation for the new coach (RichRod, Fuente, Herman, Hamilton, Bud, whoever) is that in our really great seasons (2004, 2010, etc) we don't just contend for the coastal but that we make the playoffs. Having a string of four or five ten win seasons may never happen again in our lifetime. Set the goal as ONE national championship season, not seven 10-win seasons.
This is a good response. Thank you. I definitely understand people are vehemently against RR for emotional reasons. All I'm saying is I don't think he's good enough to justify the risk. That's my argument. We can do better. We should do better.
Isn't that what we're kinda gonna have here with Beamer still hanging around the program as Assistant (to the) Athletic Director? I'm not saying I don't want Beamer around, but that does sound eerily similar.
Well, there were some divided loyalties, I think. RichRod was never really embraced/given a chance there because he wasn't a "Michigan Man." I always got the sense that there were people in Ann Arbor actively trying to sink him/hoping he'd fail
They were extremely effective. If we could get those same people to root for our coach to succeed we'll be in pretty damn good shape
I almost brought this up, but deleted it because it was kind of a tangent. My original comment on it was:
Toxic situation (and one that we could potentially have here, except that Frank Beamer is interested in Virginia Tech succeeding, and Lloyd Carr was interested in remaking Michigan in his own image.)
In essence, Frank Beamer >>>>>>>>>>>> Lloyd Carr.
I had this discussion with my wife. Her reply was - "We are not going to replace Beamer with a guy who cheated on his wife."
I saw a tweet this morning that claimed Kirby Smart "is highly interested in the Tech coaching position". I'm not one to give in to rumors like this, but Smart wouldn't be a bad option...
Ughhhh, I just saw the thread about this....
I might not Smart for one reason, that being he is a defensive minded guy and I would, for an ideal solution, want an offensive minded coach that can keep Bud.
However, one big, and I mean real big, thing that we could get out of Smart is that he would be able to bring "The Process" to Blacksburg, which may be enough to send us over the top all by itself.
I don't doubt that Whit already has a short list; it's not like Beamer's announcement was a huge surprise.
I think he'll do his due diligence, narrow the field to and handful of potential coaches, and select one that both fits the culture of VT and has the most potential.
I also think he'll move rather quickly to contact the people he's most interested in. Also, I bet some coaches contact him. I think that VT is a very desirable football coaching position.
Here's a name to file away: Ed Orgeron
For the love of all that is good.....NOOOOOOO! While known as a great recruiter, there's a reason.....he's as dirty as they come. Think: Univ of Louisville recruiting sex scandal, dirty.
No thank you.
How is Coach O dirty? Never heard this before. He was beloved by players at USC. Many have publically voiced their displeasure with Sark getting the job over Coach O.
Edit: Just checked the Wiki's
For the record, I'm not pushing for him. Just passing along some whispers. I do not think he's a good head coach. I have not read about his recruiting tactics, but in order to continually land the recruits he does, I have no doubt he has resorted to some methods that are ... quite persuasive. I also know he had some run-ins with the law, although that is very far in the rearview mirror at this point; long enough that it seems like he has put those types of issues behind him. I do not see him being the next head coach. But if he somehow lands in Blacksburg as a position coach and recruiting coordinator ... well, don't say it was out of the blue.
He's wen 6-1 with two wins over ranked teams as an interim head coach at USC. Team was 4-3 prior to Orgeron taking over. He was rather unsuccessful as a head coach at Ole Miss.
Aside from players' comments this week(end) about Beamer, I don't think I've ever heard players speak as highly about a coach as USC players spoke about Ed Orgeron. I didn't know about his past legal issues until today, but prior to that I would have been 100% on board with Whit hiring him.
True, that is a name.
Unrealistic dream coach: Jon Gruden
I think that ranks with Bill Cowher.
Please no. There's nothing about Jon Gruden that I like.
being a Bucs fan i liked this quite a bit
With all due respect to Gruden, winning a super bowl with professional athletes dedicated to their craft (a team Tony Dungy built by the way) in no way equates to the skills needed to recruit 16 and 17 year old kids, ensure they attend class and make grades, build a program with limitations on practice times, glad-hand with donors, and represent the face of a major university. Sorry but no thanks.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CRZbG73SX3s
^^^Jon Gruden has worked with Lawson before. I would personally love that hire. Dream scenario for me!
LINK
#SAUCES
This guy's top 8 in line for the job are:
1. Fuente
2. RichRod (boo hiss boo)
3. Larry Fedora (first I've heard his name mentioned)
4. Herman
5. Rhule
6. Chad Morris
7. Butch Jones (huh?)
8. Bud Foster
Funny, that overlaps quite a bit with most of the lists here...
Fedora?
Oh what sweet irony that would be if we stole him from UNC after how they tried to poach Beamer from us. That being said, I'd rather not.
Then again a Fedora offense with a Bud Foster defense...
Well...if this happens at least our players might get a chance to learn Swahili
Yea, I saw that story last night. Very happy to see Fuente at the top of the list. As others have said here, my dream scenario is Fuente, with Bud staying as DC. Though, I don't know that it's likely to happen (the Bud staying part).
Others on this list that are realistic and I would be content with....
Herman, Rhule, Morris
I would be disappointed in a Fedora hire. The guy has had some success, but has proven at UNC that he has real difficulty managing a game or, at the very least, managing his offensive personnel in the game. He was a high profile guy when UNC hired him, and I wonder if he is near his ceiling.
Just an observation from someone who watches a lot of UNC football.
i agree with most everyone in that i want an offensive-minded HC.
my fantasy set-up would be a Fuente/Herman/Morris HC with Bud Foster's defensive staff intact. will it happen? i don't think so. but that's just me putting together the best elements of an offense and defense together to make an unstoppable team for the future
"We few had survived and I thought to myself then 'There is one I could follow. There is one I could call King'."
I so hope that Bud can get the job.
Fuente is my top choice. However, I hope Memphis' success isn't just from having a potential NFL starter caliber QB.
Between Lynch and the work he did with Dalton, I think he gets a large share of credit for developing them, not just lucking out with them
One of the reason Fuente is (I think) my #1 choice at the moment is because he's posted back to back winning seasons; something no other 'up and coming' coach (Herman, Morris) has done. Rhule has shown major improvement at Temple (2-10, 6-6 and now 7-1), but has not posted multiple winning seasons. Herman/Morris obviously have not had this opportunity yet.
We all would love to see Bud stay, but with no Beamer and no head coaching offer, in my opinion, its highly unlikely. Right now the person everyone is overlooking is Torrian Gray. We MUST retain him. He to me, is the key to the defense and us being called DBU. Just my two cents. Personally I'm all for a Fuente/Foster combo and retaining Gray. To me that's like hitting the lottery.
My dream coach would be Bruce Arians, but I know that'll never happen
Hey guys, what's going on in this thread?
Seriously though, is Sumlin on the hot seat in College Station? We all know he wants to work with Bud.
Moorehead would be begging to dig his VT gear out of the closet if this happens.
I would laugh hysterically if Zurden held onto his job over Moorehead. I think he has done a better job with the WR's teaching them routes and blocking.
This would be a total Whit Babcock move, wouldn't it?
It struck me as one when I got to studying about it.
I could see Whit with this shit-eating grin on his face after introducing him that says "you guys didn't see that one coming, did you?"
That would be pretty cool.
Literally just said this morning that Sumlin would be a home freaking run. I'd even let him bring Amo back with him.
Paging Whit Babcock.....
Would it though? He's done worse every year hes been there and costs 5 mil. I don't think the swagcopter would fit in with Blacksburg
He's an energetic coach who knows how to recruit. And lets be honest, 2-3 losses in the SEC west would translate slightly differently in the ACC Coastal.
Since he is a little older, you have less concern than you would have with a Fuente/Herman/Rhule to leave in a few years. Just my opinion. I would much rather have him than RR.
I guess I see it as two scenarios. Either A&M wants him, and there's nothing we can do to outspend them, or they don't want him, in which case why would we?
Hear hear
Not much, just chillin.
Great recruiter. Great offensive mind. Great with media.
Behind closed doors, he is the opposite of Frank Beamer.
So wait... recruits and players are already being told that it will be offensive minded with the new hire and the media is being told that the hire will come from outside the program, and Whit has gone on record before to say that HC experience will play into the decision?
Whit is also pretty dang good at taking the temperature of the fan base. I suspect he's figured out there is a significant portion of the fan base which would be seriously displeased with the hiring of RR
Test balloon. Classic West Wing tactic.
Yeah but a lot fans are uninformed and just know that he coached WVU and Michigan and base their opinions off of that. I think that RR would be a great fit here.
You mean his subpar performance at Mich and AZ? The NCAA sniffing around at both Mich and WVU? His running out of WVU when a better job came calling or the fact he hasn't really done anything to prove he has a culture of family, that isn't enough to not want him?
He took Arizona to a 10 win season(their second ever) and their first division championship
Then followed it up with this year, so Frank not winning enough "big games" got the fan base riled up but going from 10 wins to MAYBE 6 is making him the next coming of Bear Bryant?
Loads of injuries this year, it isn't all on him
you know who else has had loads of injuries each year for the last 3 years? VT. That's right. And Beamer has been crucified for not being able to build depth. Injuries aren't an excuse. Keep RR the heck away from Blacksburg.
Like his starting QB? Or maybe his all American CB?
His starting quarterback suffered a concussion and hasn't been the same, Scooby Wright (as highly touted if not more so than Kendall) has also been out , so comparable yes.
So RR is playing an injured QB who had a concussion and "hasn't been the same" seems like an issue.
They started their second string for a few games he wasn't great. They are also down their starting runningback
So his team has no depth? Man this all sounds really familiar.
I mean you can say what you want, Arizona didn't care about football until RR arrived and he has since lead them to a 10 win season, that is impressive to virtually everyone
This article from 2006 says differently.
http://www.arizonawildcats.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=30700&ATCLID=2...
This. If we're going with an external hire, I also hope that coach is below the age of 50 (RichRod is not).
I am not a fan of RichRod but his performance at AZ cannot be classified as subpar. when i lived there football games were a joke. most fans wouldn't even arrive until nearly half and then left after 3rd quarter. pure laughing stock. the loluva of Arizona.
but stoops and now to a much greater level RichRod have taken that program to new heights. what he has done with AZ has been quite miraculous to be honest, and he should be credited for that. you can't look at his record or a few bad losses and see the 100% culture change he has made down there.
The team quite against Washington, that's on the coaches. They have barely put up wins against really bad teams this year. Have a single win against a team with a winning record and it's not a P5 team. Why would VT settle for a guy who can't get it done in back to back years?? Rich Rod would destroy everything Beamer built at VT.
I get that people don't like the man, and that's fine, he's far from my first choice too. But Arizona is an unmitigated success for the guy. It can't be overstated how little that school cared about football before this most recent run. This year hasn't been great, but they've also had a rash of devastating injuries in a highly competitive conference. And anyone who tells you injuries are just an excuse is delusional. Injury luck is one of the most important components to a successful year and you can't just write it off.
Yet the numerous injuries at VT didn't help Franks case. A guy who took this school to new heights.
If you don't agree with what I'm saying speak up don't hide behind anonymous down votes.
Not one of your comments is negative. Take a deep breath
deleted
I'm offsetting you. You have a serial downvoter, and that person needs to stop being a jerk.
It isn't the down votes thats my issue, it's someone who refuses to step out and talk. I may disagree with Alum on this issue but at least he is man enough to come out and talk about it.
I agree. Someone is just being a jerk for the sake of doing it. Have a discussion, have a debate, don't abuse the rules. Whoever you are.
surely Joe could give you visibility on votes...right?
Surely, but that would probably require him to do more coding to bestow more power upon me. As I understand it, he has to go into the CMS to see who's voted on what. Coming up with an interface/visibility for me is probably just more work for him to do.
I'm game to keep an eye on this kind of stuff. But only if it's useful.
I don't get why folks downvote a good discussion. I've had to offset some downvotes in the past for comments that shouldn't have been downvoted. Lovers' quarrels do get heated around here but there's definitely no need for domestic "downvote" abuse...
Keep up the awesome moderator work VTGuitarMan. Leg to you sir!
whoa, you are saying that to me?
I can honestly say I don't think I have ever given you a downvote. And I certainly haven't been now.
I was just giving you perspective about what RR has accomplished in Tucson. I know you have found articles but you just don't know how much that school/city just did not give a phuck about football prior to stoops and now RR. And for as much as stoops lifted that program up RR has taken it to a level it has never been at. is that championships and 10 win seasons? nope. but for UofA I am telling you that having lived there and gotten to know many people involved in athletics and boosters there RR has been a lightning rod for that entire city. I get that you don't like him. I don't either. But what he has done there has not been subpar.
No that wasn't addressed to you, you have always come out and had discourse with others, I was talking to whomever was downvoting every one of my posts and not engaging in discussion.
As for Rich Rod I don't see how one good season has made him this must have coach? AZ has not set attendance records under him, they have not that I can find set records for money given to the school and they have failed at winning this year.
ok, cool.
yeah, I agree with you. I really do not want RichRod. My reasoning has nothing to do with his coaching though. I just don't believe him. If he says he wants to come back east and create something with longevity there then well, that is exactly the same thing he said in Tucson. It's what he said at WVU.
I don't blame him for wanting to change jobs. I don't blame him for taking those jobs. Fans will get upset at pretty much everything. My thing is that I just can't trust him. I blame him for his callous disregard to the program's he leaves.
I don't want to go from a program that was run the right way by a man I would trust my children with, to a man I would second guess every damn thing he says. Whit knows him, and he surely knows much more about what really went down in WVU, but the fact is that he handled it poorly. extremely poorly. And if he leaves Tucson for Blacksburg, after annually talking about how he wants to build his legacy there, then I will never believe him regarding anything he says at VT.
You don't replace a man like Frank Beamer with a man like RichRod, no matter how good a coach he is. To me that's a slap in the face to what has been accomplished in the last 29 years.
(I disagree with you on Urban Meyer though)
Just a name to throw out there John Harbaugh, ravens are bad smith is out for the year things got stale
Our future leader?
Ken Whisenhunt is also now taking calls
I wrote this earlier today as a feature article from an unbiased perspective. However, I think my list goes Arians, Herman, Smart, Fuente. If there's a home run hire like a Sumlin, I'm completely on board. I actually have a friend that plays for Sumlin and he says that everybody loves him!
Here's my thoughts....
1) The issues in the past few years have been offensive and recruiting based problems.
2) Generally, the trend in head coaching, if hiring a co-ordinator instead of an experienced HC is to hire OC's rather than DC's
3) We have a very attractive opening (Thanks again Frank! It's because of what you've done.)
Now, with those things in mind, I think two or three things are going to guide Whit's decision. (Know and understand this: we will know absolutely nothing about the new hire until he's ready to announce or shortly before) I think Whit will look for someone who is a fit for the family atmosphere in Blacksburg. I think he will lean toward offensive-minded coaches, and head coaching experience will likely be a plus.
This leads me to think that one of the best candidates for the job may be Mark Richt. Generally thought of as a good guy.....OC at FSU prior to the gig at Georgia. His teams biggest fault there have been his lack of defense. And here's a key....He has pursued Bud Foster before. Let me repeat....HE HAS PURSUED BUD FOSTER BEFORE. This is big, in my opinion. He knows how good a coach Bud is, and I think he represents the best chance to keep the defensive coaching staff in place. He also is quite familiar with Stacy Searles, who was on his staff for three years, although I'm not sure that is a good thing or not. I don't know how amicable a parting that was. I think any other offensive staff might be out with Richt as coach.
I think the riskier hires from an experience standpoint are any of the Fuente/Herman/Morris trio. Morris may come with some possibility of retaining our defensive staff too. Fuente or Herman have the offensive chops, Herman has had the Urban Meyer experience (again, not sure if that's a positive or not, but Houston looks impressive).
I really hope we can retain our defensive coaching staff, not sure that it will work out that way, though. I think Foster/Wiles/Gray are critical to keeping our D strong. Add to that some increased recruiting and an offense, we could be formidable in short order. The question becomes will Bud want to stay with a different head coach, and will he exit for a HC position. If he goes, I think Wiles and Gray follow him wherever he ends up.
EDIT: And for the love of all that is good and proper, PLEASE NOT RICHROD!!!!!!!
Completely agree on Richt's ability to continue the legacy of a family atmosphere here at VT. Listening to Ken Ekanum talk at the press conference today about Frank not pulling his scholarship after the injury, reminded me of something I had read about Richt. From his Wiki; "While coaching at Georgia, Richt has been a strong opponent of oversigning, a practice popular in the SEC, believing that a scholarship is a 4-year commitment."
As you stated, he is an offensive minded head coach and appears to be on the hot seat with the Dogs at the moment. With rumors in the past linking him to a VT opening if it were to come available, I would be ecstatic if Whit landed a coach of his caliber. His lifetime .734 winning percentage doesn't hurt either.
Edit: There also is a relationship with Chuck Cantor, VT's head of football recruiting.
I have a lot of family very close to Georgia and follow them a bit, and Richt really does do things the right way and fosters a great atmosphere there. The problem with him is that he's at a school with premier resources and automatic recruiting of top talent, and has never exceeded expectations and had the level of success that a school like Georgia should get. I have a hard time believing he could suddenly scale that wall at Tech without the resources and a large portion of the best recruits in the country committed to UGA from birth.
Brian Harsin at Boise deserves strong consideration. He's got three years experience at two schools, more comparable to Fuente than Herman or Morris.
Other names I haven't seen mentioned in this thread are David Shaw, Mark Dantonio, Pat Fitzgerald, Pat Narduzzi and Gary Pinkel (surprisingly in his 60s).
Need to keep monitoring the Charlie Strong situation as well. Maybe even bob stoops and Gus Malzahn.
Besides Harsin, we have a better chance of winning the ACC (50M:1) than any of those coaches coming here, unless they are fired. And honestly, the only coach with a chance of getting fired is Malzahn.
I disagree with this entirely. For one thing, there are a whole lot less than 50M coaches so statistically speaking you're way off.
But the main point is that you're way underestimating how attractive the VT job is. We have (Thanks to Frank) a great foundation for a talented, ambitious coach to come in and (re)build very quickly. If Whit makes the right hire (and I believe he will) I'm confident we'll find a coach capable of getting us back into the ACC CG conversation within 2 years.
We have a terrific AD who is building an incredible support system for any coach to come here. We have top notch facilities. We have a relatively easy path to the Playoffs. We are close to talent rich recruiting regions. We have brand recognition. We have loyal fans who show up to home games and travel really well to away games. We have a great university that offers a plethora of academic options to appease any and all recruits. Virginia Tech has a ton of great things going for it, mostly due to Frank's tireless efforts, and there is no way that our odds at landing a top notch coach are even close to as slim as you think. I would even argue that our odds of landing a top notch coach are better than our odds at winning out and finishing 8-5 this season.
First, I was being a bit sarcastic with the statistic. However, I think you are misusing the statistic as well. There might be 10 horses in a race, yet one may have 3:1 odds while another might have 100:1 - they all don't have 10:1 odds since there are 10 horses in the race. VT doesn't have much of a shot at any of those coaches, thus my comment. And at that - whatever the large odds were to win the ACC, I would have used them.
Second, do you really think Dantonio is going to leave MSU when he is close to going to the playoff? Shaw at Stanford? Bob Stoops is just going to up and leave Oklahoma? They have a combined 2 losses this year. All of those coaches mentioned (besides Harsin) have built anywhere from good to great programs at their schools. Why leave that?
I think VT is a great place for any HC, and I think we will get a good coach. I agree with most that it is only second to USC in the current coaching openings. But it won't be any of the coaches in the above post unless they get fired.
Strong (Texas), McElwain (UF), Kiffin (USC), Sarkisian (USC), Muschamp (UF), Rich Rod (UM), Dooley (UT), Jones (UT) - all of those coaches left for schools that have much more prestige and money than VT and their resumes (at the time) don't come close to those mentioned in the first post. When Florida hired Meyer for the first time he had 4 years of HC experience at BG and Utah, not even close to the caliber of the names above.
VT will have its pick of coaches and many will be interested, but I think it is smart to temper our expectations.
Tech could give Shaw a 50% pay raise. Money isn't everything, but turning down a raise of over $1M/year is pretty difficult.
Auburn won't fire Malzahn this offseason- the extension he signed last offseason essentially guarantees that since his buyout is about $2.3M for every year remaining on his contract, which runs through 2019. So realistically Auburn needs to keep him another 2 years before even considering to fire him. But, that massive buyout does give him some leverage. Even though they can't really fire him, things are getting hot for him and they could do things that make it uncomfortable for him to stay. Because Auburn is on the hook for a boatload of money if they fire him, I could see them agreeing to waive his buyout if he walks-- it would be a win for both sides as Malzahn would get to hit the reset button on his career and Auburn would get out from under his contract.
I'm not saying Malzahn is likely to be our next head coach, but I actually wouldn't be that surprised if he leaves Auburn this offseason. I bet UGA would be interested in him if they decide to move on from Richt, which seems likely.
You bring up an interesting discussion there at the end: what is everyone's opinion of Richt? Been looking around on the internet, and it looks like UGA might seriously be cutting ties with him. The guy brings in top-ten recruiting classes each year and is an offensive-minded coach. Seems like he always has some excellent RBs in the pipeline. Been a consistent winner at UGA, but hasn't quite been able to get them to the top. Granted, going against the likes of Florida, Auburn, Bama, Tennessee, etc. annually is no easy task. Guy seems like a well-respected and family oriented coach, runs a clean program similar to Beamer.
His problem at Georgia has been defense, and he has attempted to go after Bud Foster in the past. Could an upgrade in recruiting, pairing Bud with Richt's offensive mind, and maintaining the family atmosphere at VT be the key to success? UGA better be careful what they wish for if they decide to cut ties, look at how cutting Pellini is going for Nebraska. I could get behind Richt, but are there far and away better options out there?
I don't understand the infatuation with Richt. He's only 15 years younger than Beamer. He's had a comparable career with significantly more resources. If he can't win division titles in the seriously less potent East division of the SEC (Florida being the only real threat on that side of the league...) what makes you think he can win Coastal Crowns in Blacksburg? I just don't see it happening. Sure he's a good guy and I like him as a person but I'd much rather have a younger more energetic guy with ambition and a vision for success. Richt has under-performed given the recruting success and relative ease of the SEC East IMO.
If what you say about him lacking a defense is true then he might already be having discussions with Bud about hiring him when Beamer's replacement is named...
I generally agree. Richt is what I would see as a "safe" choice - comparable styles and reputation. I wouldn't mind that, per se, and would not be upset with hiring Richt, but I think we can do better. He's a high-floor, low-ceiling kind of guy and I would rather we take a shot at someone, as you say, younger and more energetic, someone that I think can be a transformative force rather than just "the next guy up." I think Whit has a unique opportunity to try to shape the future of VT football. It is a rare opportunity that is thus far being handled expertly.
I have been thinking the same way as you but also wonder what would Richt do with a fresh set of faces given all he has learned in the SEc? Sometimes everybody needs a change
I see what you're saying. I definitely think there are some concerns, but some positive aspects as well. I think we would be best suited in going after a younger guy, even though Richt is only 55. I'm not completely anti-RichRod like some, but I feel like we could do a lot better. I would put Richt way above RR. I would say Richt is definitely a safe hire if we go that direction, but I wonder if Whit is going to be more aggressive in making this hire.
Again, I just think UGA better be careful what they wish for. It's not easy to win the national title. They've enjoyed pretty consistent success in the SEC, even if they haven't gotten to the big game.
Don't forget Whit is also the man that hired Tommy Tuberville. That was a safe hire.
What does being 15 years younger than Beamer mean to you? Seems like the perfect age for our next HC.
I have serious doubts Whit will hire a 40 year old. Too much risk.
I think it's a toss up as everyone has been saying for days now. High ceiling younger guys vs. Higher floor older more established guys. All I know is that I trust Whit to do the right thing for the program and the University. My two cents would be to get a young guy with the potential to thrust us back into the national spotlight. Fuente with Bud as DC is my dream hire/situation right now.
Number of coaches in the current AP top 10 in their 40s: two, Swinney and Shaw.
I like the g5 choices, but their risk level, especially compared to Richt, is off the charts. Matt Rhule is the answer to the question in three years of "Wait, who did VT hire to replace Beamer?"
Richt is a class act. My problem with Richt is the on-field performance. He's had a ton of talent at UGA and not done a whole lot with it. He absolutely should have had his run in the SEC East when Urban Meyer left UF, yet he was not able to take advantage. He's had Top 10 recruiting classes every year but only 2 division titles and 0 conference titles in the 6 years since Urban left. Heck, Missouri joined the SEC in 2012 and has as many SEC East titles as UGA in the last 10 seasons.
I agree, Richt seems like a good guy, but with Florida and Tennessee being down over the last decade, UGA should've played in a lot more SEC Championships than they did. With their recruiting, I think he has underachieved. I hope Whit takes a chance on someone with a higher ceiling.
Richt would be a really good choice. Wiki him, he's won a lot at UGA. Great recruiter (the #1 criteria by most on this board). He's experienced, like Whit wants. Power running attack would be a welcome sight.
The rub with Richt is that he hasn't beaten Sabans, Miles, Urbans and spurriers best teams. But those were great teams with great coaches. No shame in that game. His current team is underperforming, I think, because he has stayed too long. A coach shouldn't stay anywhere more than 10 years.
And I'm not sure how you can say he has a lower ceiling than coaches with 1 or 3 years experience.
Mark Richt: high floor, high ceiling, high character, great recruiter.
After watching the Temple game on Saturday (a phrase I never thought I would say), I have a hard time not liking Matt Rhule. He lives the hard work mantra that Virginia Tech is known for. I think he'd be an excellent fit.
A potentially unpopular opinion to consider: As much as I would love to win a national championship (and I desperately want to win a national championship), it's not what tops my priority list for this coaching search. We had a guy for almost 30 years who did things the right way. He turned a football team in to a family. I think we have to find the guy who prioritizes that above all else. Don't get me wrong, winning is important, but doing it the right way and building teams to be more than just athletes is what matters to me.
Considering the financial boondoggle that is a National Championship, believe me, the #1 goal of whoever is hired is to get us in position to win it all. Whit isn't the kind of AD who is going to let us settle for a path of success that doesn't include a National Championship as a major attainable goal.
I definitely articulated that poorly. I do expect to win and winning is extremely important, but I would be remiss if I did not express my desire to do things the right way. I don't find the idea of winning a National Championship by using the sketchy recruiting tactics of an Auburn, for example, appealing.
And I'll just say the standards for "right way" have a direct correlation between how much you can get away with while doing things 'right' and how many wins you have.
Basically what he said:
I don't know who the next head coach is going to be, but I would bet my house that Whit and the new coach knows.
This whole, "we can search now that Frank is retired" stuff is just to throw off pursuit. Whit's got his guy. This wouldn't be playing out like it is this week if he didn't.
Oh, and I hadn't mentioned it anywhere... Coach Beamer, Thank you. Thank you so much. Virginia Tech football was a part of my life before I was even born, but most of the great memories were made while you were at the helm.
I was at your first home game against Clemson in 1987. That was my first game as a freshman in Blacksburg. I will crawl naked across a barren desert strewn with broken glass to be at the last one on 11/21. Again, sir. Thank you. Nothing else needs to be said that we don't already know.
definitely on board with that logical thinking Whit knows and the new coach knows. I'd almost go out on a limb and say the kids that have committed to VT football in the 16 class know or have a good idea who it will be. Whit seems to be making calls to these kids and informing them everything will be fine and I have _______ on line 1 waiting to be named new VT HC
See I disagree 100%. No way in today's day and age do 17 year old kids not let that out. If they know, we all would.
it's important for the kids that have already committed and are enrolling in January and even next fall to have an idea. I'm sure they will know it before we do and I would expect that to happen pretty soon as well. That way it gives the kids time to think about it and re-open their recruitment.
I don't think so. The odds are that the new coach is currently coaching at another school. If info that he has accepted a position at Tech happens before the end of the season, you'll have a sticky situation.
No way that the ADs office puts that possibility in the hands of 17-18 year olds.
I think you meant gamut. Gametes are the reproductive cells, the ova and sperm. As a biologist, I laughed very hard at this slip-up.
Sidenote: I also laugh at the use of the term "seminal," despite it's other connotations not biology related.
every single time with this OP. Who pays him, anyway?
Is that Bill O'reilly?!?
Yes, he went on quite the tirade... it's on youtube if you want to see the whole thing
I was going to say something about "going for really young coaches" but you beat me to it.
Well, if I learned anything from my elementary school's DARE program it was "Just say NO to Rich Rodriguez". I was totally confused at the time but 25+ years later, it totally makes sense.
If they don't promote Foster, I hope the new HC keeps him. I mean, who else could a new HC get that would be better? It would be a rather short list of candidates.
I will say, Foster has never struck me as one that has the political savy and more polished interpersonal skills that a good recruiting HC needs. Plenty of great X's and O's guys have made great coordinators but flamed out when their turn as HC happened. Look at Muschamp and Lane Kiffin. I'm not saying I think Foster would not be a successful HC, nobody knows for certain. Just something to think about.
If they bring in an outsider, nobody knows if Foster will decide to stick around for the new guy either. Foster could bolt to be D-coordinator for another team. He's said he stays for Beamer. Well, that ride's ending. If he leaves, who knows if he takes some of the other staff with him.
This could all play out in ways none of us anticipate.
Personally, I'd like to see a young, energetic offense guy that can start landing more of the Curtis Grants, Josh Sweats, Derrick Nnadi's, and Koren Kirvens. As well as more Taj Boyd's, etc. I personally think our D-system is perceived as not a good prep for the NFL, so I'd like to see the defense transition away from the Washington defense. Copy Seattle or the Ray Lewis version of the Ravens. Or the Patriots. I think we've got good talent on the team, a few hits in recruiting could make the transition work well.
On offense, Loeffler is a great X's and O's guy. Reading the game analysis on here shows it. But I think we're too "multiple". We need an identity. It's been that way since Beamer promoted Stinespring, so I wonder how much was the OC and how much was the HC. I know it's outdated, but I'd also love to see a return of I-formation on a regular basis, and run right at them, grind 'em down, and beat them into submission. Nothing like neanderthal football.
I'm confused. You want to keep Foster right?
But then you want him to completely change his philosophy? The same defense he's been coaching for all of 20 years at VT needs to completely change fundamentals? I don't understand what you're getting at here.
For one thing, I find it unlikely that Foster will be retained. If that is the case, I would love to see him pick up an HC gig somewhere. And the way this season is shaping up, there will be plenty of openings. If he is retained, there is no chance that he will fundamentally alter the way he has coached defense for the last two decades. 0 chance. Period. You can't have both.
I don't necessarily think keeping Foster on staff is the best idea at this stage anyway. I think it would be in Foster's best interest, as well as VT's, if he were able to find a HC job somewhere else. This program needs to clean house and start fresh across the board. I fear that the transition to the new HC would be hampered if we tried to keep any pieces in place. I know this may not be a popular opinion because, well, Foster. But I truly believe that for the next coach to have success he has to have a completely clean slate to start with.
He doesn't need a clean sat necessarily but he does need the freedom to make those choices for himself
RE: Foster - I think he's plenty smart enough to effectively make a different philosophy work. Beamer is the prime pusher behind our commitment to the Washington Defense. Always has been. I wonder if Foster would make any changes himself with Beamer hanging it up. That's the point I'm really getting at.
And I disagree the program needs to totally clean house. I think we're closer to being back to playing for ACC Championships than most others do to be honest. The cupboard is not bare in Blacksburg. The biggest problem is not the coaching, it's the recruiting misses in key positions. Note I'm separating coaching and recruiting as separate activities. Teams have been able to use Beamer's age and uncertainty over how long he'll be around against us in recruiting for a while. My opinion is plug one or two glaring gaps (looking at MLB mainly) and grab one or two more guys that can make a difference in a few other positions, and we're in the ACC Championship game.
Heck, without the injury bug and other attrition biting so hard, I think we beat ECU, Pitt, Miami, and Duke as well. Give us a healthly, in the groove Brewer for the whole season, add Fuller and Reavis back, and I really think those games turn out different. Give Dadi back healthy hands, it only gets better.
Whoever takes over as HC is going to inherit a team with very strong talent. I don't think we need to clean house. I think we'd do just as well to find the right guy that bring in just a few more pieces, and bring the rest of what we have together well. Sorry to be redundant, but again, we're really close to getting back to where we want to be.
I'm sorry, you guys keep referring to the Washington defense. I have never in all these years heard Foster's defense referred to in that way. Is that what it is? As in the Redskins? Can anyone elaborate?
Washington Huskies way back when.
Hokies Know A Good Defensive Scheme When They Steal One
Back when Bud Foster was running a 4-4 defense he was using a defense very similar to what the Washington Huskies were using in the 80s and early 90s. Over time Foster has morphed the defense to adjust with the times. Here is a good link explaining that morph. I couldn't find a link on here referencing the Washington defense, but I'd highly recommend checking out French's several excellent breakdowns of the one-gap defense that Bud runs.
EDIT: fatgath beat me to this one. But, French's film breakdowns are still worth a read!
I think you're largely correct, however, to me, the major concern is that the current staff has repeatedly failed to address and correct the reoccurring issues (time management, penalties, running back rotation and recruiting come to mind).
In this time, Foster/Lefty must have either believed one of the following:
If bullet 1 or 2 is the case, then why should we bring the coach back?
You're right on a lot of points...we don't need to clean house, we have some really good coaches in Foster, Wiles, Gray...I really like Zohn...but any head coach that comes in is going to want to bring in his guys. I could see an offensive-minded coach coming in and wanting to keep Foster, but I think keeping the entire defensive staff would be a stretch. What the new head coach wants to do with our current coaches will be a very interesting part of this process.
post fail
Love the guy, but no...
Agreed. Love Shane, but not as the next Head Hokie.
I mean of course he does, why wouldn't he?
Shane seems like a good guy, the apple didn't fall too far from the tree but he's not ready.
There is a "Shane is next man up" rumor floating around pretty reliable #sources right now.
id down vote that but i know its not ur opinion lol please not shane please
In many ways, this could be the riskiest hire for Whit.
Agreed. I hope Shane is our HC at some point, but not right after Frank.
I thought RichRod was a done deal already though! /s
I'll do it. I'll be the coach.
I think my 5-11 record in a Madden league a couple years back speaks for itself.
I dunno about us, but it will definitely qualify you for the job in Hooville
Only if you have the ability to completely ignore the game clock.
Also helps if you can't assess QBs.
I think the more prudent qualification is knowing his previous experience as an officer of the law
Sorry bro but I think I'm a little more qualified. I used to recruit 15 Five star recruits to VT and win NC's every year on NCAA Football. Unfortunately, had to take time off for medical reasons.
That carpal tunnel will get after ya
You know it!
What is your thoughts on what will happen to Shane Beamer? I would love to see him stay with the program like daddy Beams, but I am just wondering what his aspirations are?
I don't think an incoming HC will retain any current coaches; zero. If he's a successful HC now, he's going to try to bring his entire coaching staff with him. There is a possibility that Foster could be retained but from a "politics" standpoint, following a HOF head coach that's been at the school for nearly 30 years is more than enough pressure for a new HC without adding in a beloved DC who a significant portion of the fanbase thinks should be HC instead of you.
Just to play devil's advocate here...
Wouldn't chasing off said DC be just as politically risky, if not more so? If the next HC is not Bud, AND Bud wants to stay in Blacksburg anyway, AND the new guy replaces him anyway, then the replacement had better be really, really good or the torches and pitchforks will come out very quickly.
Shane WILL get a job somewhere else and quickly. He is a great coach with a great coaching tree on his resume.
No one mentioning the $1.3 mil buyout if VT sends Bud packing? I think they will try and keep him on as DC. Which for a new coach coming in isn't such a bad pickup. Don't need to search for a DC when you have one of the best already here.
Lot of mentions of some of the coaches I think would be a good fit here. And I think there are already plenty of conversations happening. If CFB already knew he was going to retire at the end of the year, then how long did he and Whit know this. Just like when everyone wondered about the early enrollees announcement. I think there is a lot going on behind the scenes that we will hear about eventually.
Part of getting the HC job is picking your own staff.
I'm not saying it's not a possibility, but I wouldn't limit the choices based on that.
I Agree, however we have done the halfsies in the past, granted with a different AD, but remember hiring Lefty and not letting him pick his staff?
Just wanted to add that there would need to be a buyout and already having a top DC isn't a bad thing. But next coach, in my eyes, should select whoever they feel best.
What if there is a HC that wants Bud Foster as DC, regardless of what team they're on?
Am I crazy in hoping Whit goes after David Cutcliffe?
Yes. Cutcliffe is old. He's not leaving Duke for anything other than retirement
Touche
Going after Cutcliffe is one way to assure us that we'll be doing this again in 5 years...
Yep. Unfortunately.
Duke got Cut at the right time. May be something to learn from that.
I love Cutcliffe. He's a great coach. But he's got it made at Duke.
Let me spin it this way: looking back at Whit's hiring history, what seems to be his tendencies in making a hire? Look at Buzz and Tubberville specifically. Tubs was a great hire for cincy. He was a proven coach coming from decent football schools. Buzz was obviously a proven coach coming from a good basketball school. So, what can we make from Whit's past and how does it translate to making this hire? What would the equivalent be to Tubberville and Buzz? I don't see him hiring a guy from within, nor an unproven HC.
Memphis isn't exactly a 'football' school, but I have to believe Fuente has enough history as a HC to be a prime candidate..
Agree Fuente has proven that he can be a successful HC certainly more so than Herman and Rhule and arguably did it with a far less talented school.
Basically you're describing a "Chris Peterson"-type before he left Boise State for Washington
I'm shocked more people haven't thrown around Matt Rhule's name of Temple. Temple was probably the worst program in college football in the early 2000s and now they are pretty damn good...
I'd actually put him higher than Tom Herman, as he has played against an elite team this season and performed pretty damn well. Lost on the last possession. Of course Fuente beat the one elite team he played against this season by two touchdowns, so he's my first choice, but the numbers don't lie. Rhule's first year, Temple went 2-10. Second year, 6-6. Now they're 7-1 with their lone loss coming to Notre Dame by 1 possession. Does that not sound similar to what we think Buzz Williams is going to do?
One game means that much to you? If temple was rolled by ND, Rhule is off your list?
It was Temple though. Bottom line, they were 2-10 two years ago. Now they're ranked and looks like they could compete with top ten teams. With all the talent that we had over the years, how many wins did we have over top ten teams? Not enough. Temple with less talent looks to be competitive with the top ten. You are right, though. It is one game, but it would be foolish to say that Rhule has not done an excellent job there and that they did not look good the other night.
I just hope he would be better than that last big hire from Temple. You know....that Al Golden guy.
Every hire Miami made after Butch Davis didn't work out for them. I think Whit is smarter than that. Rhule will be hired if he is the right guy and I think it will work out.
caught a radio interview by Rhule one day last week, was really impressed with him. He seems to have the same kind of work ethic, and family value type characteristics that Beamer has instilled in VT for nearly 3 decades.
Rhule's offense isn't very good
Sam Rogers for HC, he can do everything else. Also how soon can we get Brewer on as at least a QB coach? Would love to see him on the sidelines with a headset one day
I think people aren't giving enough attention to how great Brewer could be as a qb coach. Not that it's guaranteed, but he's got a direct line to Texas already, understands Loeffler's complicated offensive scheme and is a dude among dudes. Win
Loeffler would be the ideal QB coach, but I think he lands a OC job elsewhere he's really an okay OC
I heard something really interesting on Kyle Bailey's show this afternoon that I haven't seen anywhere else. I believe he saw this in a USA today column. The idea was that Utah's Kyle Wittingham could be the next Head Hokie. Apparently there are rumblings that he's not happy at Utah. After my initial "that's insane!" reaction I was immediately struck by the notion that if it's possible, it could be a great hire. If a guy can win in Utah, he can win at VT. It's the closest rumor I've heard to drawing a parallel to the Buzz hire.
Unfortunately, I don't know anything else about him. Is he a defensive or offensive guy? Does he have roots or connections in this part of the country? What's his pre-Utah resume look like? Would he 'fit' at Tech? Is he really dissatisfied enough at Utah to leave after season like the one he's having?
What do you all think about a potential Wittingham hire?
Linebacker at BYU, Utah DC before getting the head gig. Defensive guy all the way.
NFL.com has him going to USCw
They are known for their defense and special teams.
Bud Foster for HC, Torrian to DC. I want Virginia tech football, loyal honest, respectful, hard working. i dont want some outsider coming in and changing the culture. Id rather be 6-6 everyday than turning into an ohio state or alabama
Virginia Tech doesn't have a monopoly on honesty and hard work. There are plenty of guys that could come in and keep that mentality
Being happy at 6-6 every year is a culture of complacency and mediocrity , not hard working to excel.
Well it's a good thing Tech has never finished at 6-6.
Maybe there will be some NFL coaches available at the end of the season. John Harbaugh?
Ken Whisenhunt is now available.
I am definitely pulling for Fuente. He's had a chance to build a Memphis program over a few years, and has built a solid offense and defense.
After Fuente, I would hope for Herman, Matt Campbell, or Matt Rhule...or maybe even Pep Hamilton.
I haven't seen anyone mention him yet, but I am also curious about Scott Satterfield at App State. Anyone have an opinion on him?
I talked to Whit tonight, and he said two things I found quite interesting (among other things), when I told him we're all excited to see where things go from here. First, "There's a reason I had a beer tonight" and also, "don't believe everything you read." Hold on tight, folks. This one could very well follow the Buzz model: we all make lists and talk about who might be coming in, and then the announcement is made and we're all like, "yeah... that's much better. Let's do that."
That is definitely interesting. Kind of confirms my thoughts that all the rumors and lists we're hearing from insiders and pundits are mostly speculation. I think Whit might have something big in store.
The beer comment is definitely interesting, too.
That means no RichRod, right?
RIGHT!?
I honestly think Whit had a hunch RichRod was divisive and leaked it to confirm. I would be surprised if it was RR.
Dude... this is a really interesting perspective. Semi-devious, but brilliant. I was warming to RR but now feel he'd be too divisive at a moment when we all need to be all-in.
My goodness I hope that's what he meant.
Could it be that he is having a beer tonight because of the daunting task ahead of him that could define his career at VT?
There are only so many football coaches though. The name will be one someone's list.
yeah...Whit's
I can only conclude that this means with the next coach, VT will be BAK!
No. We're not coming bak, were reloading the double barrel and pouring hot lead down the rest of the ACC's gullets
we BAK??? $$$$$$
Butch Davis confirmed
Let's also remember that the Buzz hire that everyone keeps alluding to, which everyone thinks will be duplicated here, was basically an accident of sorts.
Whit actually didn't have Buzz on his radar at all, and had no idea Buzz was looking to leave. Whit had a conversation with Mick Cronin (Cincy BBall Coach) trying to identify some candidates. It was a little after that, that Cronin spoke to his agent trying to help Whit when he found out that Buzz was an option. Cronin and Buzz having the same agent, and Whit's relationship with Cronin "accidentally" brought Buzz to VT. A lot can happen behind closed doors.
Whit realizes this hire is not only important to the football program, but important to the University.
That's not luck it's called doing due diligence and checking all avenues before proceeding.
I'm not saying it's luck, I'm just saying that even Whit was caught off guard by the chance at Buzz. It was more so a "gift" that fell into his lap if anything.
Edit: I'm not trying to say Whit did a bad job and had no say in the matter, because he did. I'm just saying, a lot goes into these hires, and it's not always as easy as the media leads us to believe with coaches announcing interest. I trust Whit will take his time and make a good hire.
Tuberville was also very unhappy at TT. Whit may have lucked into that one as well.
Whit is incredibly aware of just how important this hire is (hence the beer). In his words, "this is one we have to get right."
This post is single handily going to keep me up tonight
I don't know why, but I really like the sound of those comments. They gave me the giddy Christmas Eve when I was 7 kindof feeling. Whit has done nothing but impress me with everything he has done since he arrived in Blacksburg. I expect he continues that trend and brings a new wave of energy and excitement to the program with this hire. Also, invite me next time you're having beers with Whit, that sounds pretty cool.
Was it a celebratory beer or an "oh crap I have a final tomorrow that I'm not ready for and I need to calm my nerves" beer? This is important to know
edit: just to clarify, I don't mean celebratory in the regard that Beamer is stepping down and Whit sees that as a good thing. I mean celebratory as in he's already lined up the next guy and he's satisfied with his decision. Now he can enjoy a beer because it's just a matter of time before he makes it official...
at least..that's how it played out in my head.
I knew what you meant... and i think there's a very good chance he already has the next guy lined up.
If I need to calm down, I'll drink a brandy, not a beer
I'm glad you knew what I meant.
I re-read it after the fact and realized it could be taken a couple of different ways. That's why I felt compelled to clarify my stance.
Completely agree, I as well took it to mean that he can enjoy a beer because agreements have already been made.
It was definitely said with a "holy crap I'm about to make the biggest move of my career that will define me as a human being to thousands of people"* tone, so probably closer to the second one.
*paraphrased
no doubt
I do think those are interesting comments. He's obviously deliberating very seriously and he understands the impact that his next decision will have. Those are two reasons I really like Whit. He's no dummy!
WARNING: Going to be spilling lots of thoughts below...just kinda thinking...err..out loud, if you will. Feel free to analyze and counter at will.
I don't really know what to make of his second comment. Does that mean that he already knows who the next guy is going to be and is just playing it very close to the vest? Does it mean that he's well aware of all the RR chatter and has decided not to pursue that option? Does it mean he has intentionally let some information leak to play a bit of a smoke-and-mirrors game since he's aware there are going to be lots of coaching searches happening concurrently?
I also wonder how involved Beamer is going to be in the hiring process. I have to imagine that Whit isn't doing this alone and he's assembled a hiring committee. Out of respect and reverence for Beamer does Whit invite Beamer to be a part of that? Does Beamer decline? Who else might be on that committee?
I can't wait until the season is over. I'm really curious how long after the end of the season we're going to wait before an announcement is made. I think Whit likes to get as far ahead of the 8-ball as possible, but if he's this anxious at this stage, with a month left to lock up a candidate, that it might be taking longer than he'd like.
to address one of your questions:
WP
I know he said that. With how close he's playing his cards to the vest, though, how much of that is actually set in stone and how much of it are the goals that he's set for himself? I expect Whit to act quickly but how quickly can we realistically expect? If he's anxiously drinking beers ahead of this decision what message does that convey about where he stands on his own timeline?
If he's actively telling recruits that, then I would bet that is set in stone. He can't afford to be promising things he can't deliver and have the coaching search drag out into January. I think he definitely has a plan, probably already has contacted what guy/guys he's seriously interested in, and is about to take the plunge. I picture the having a beer comment as less "holy $***, I'm freaking out here" and more "this has been an incredibly emotional day and process, it's time to get down to work now. This is the biggest professional decision I've ever made." Probably just realizing the totality of everything now that it is set in motion.
i like dis
First, please don't read too much into the beer comment. I'm just some guy who he's seen in a couple meetings that he saw in a bar. He isn't spilling his innermost secrets and feelings to me, I promise. It was a lighthearted a-lot-of-truth-is-said-in-jest comment. I mean, it's a stressful situation, who wouldn't feel the pressure? However, he's also really, really good at his job. He works quickly and he works quietly. A friend of mine had a basketball employee for a financial client back when Buzz was hired and I can tell you for a fact that no one in Merryman knew who was going to be hired until it hit the newspapers. Whit isn't bumbling around with things set in stone and the fan base will deal with it. He's had feelers out since he was hired (shoot, who's to say the whole staff wouldn't be hit by a bus, might as well) and there's pretty much a mob breaking down his door to apply for the job. He's gonna get someone in the next month and I'm pretty darn confident we'll love it. Him telling recruits he'll have a new guy in place doesn't mean he already has someone, it means he knows what he's doing and he's confident he can get it done. He's just like any other guy with a deadline.
*Edit* After rereading his statements at the beginning of the basketball coaching search, I would in fact put it past Whitnto leak information as a litmus test. That's not how he operates. I would also like to take this time to remind us all (myself included) what he had to say about leaks. "Every leak has a motive". Whether that's clicks, leverage for a current job, leverage for a new job, whatever, every leak has a motive. Have plenty of heaps of salt handy with which to take all information for the next month or so, and let's see where we end up.
Alright all the rumors are killing me. We officially need a spy in the AD. Waiting even until December is going to be torture.
Weaver was a good man and a great Hokie who loved VT. May he Rest In Peace. That being said, does anybody believe for a second that he ever would have been as proactive as Whit? I think VT is extraordinarily fortunate to have Whit at the helm. I think Whit may just be the best Hire VT has made since Frank Beamer.
Weaver: [strolls down the hall] "Hey Bud, you're up." [whistles happily]
I know VT isnt used to changing Coaches, but December is generally used to playing host to coaching announcements.
From Last year
SCHOOL --- / --- DATE ANNOUNCED NEW COACH
Whit is just doing his thing, like the fines press issue. He just says it like it is to stop the flood gates
Thanks for looking that up, helpful info.
Interesting info. It would also be informative to add a column showing when the vacancy became official. For instance, when looking at the hire dates only, it would look like Oregon State took the search at a pretty leisurely pace compared to Troy, but in reality, it's very impressive that they were able to announce a new coach only 6 days after losing their guy to Nebraska. It'd also be interesting to see if there's any correlation between earlier announcements of new coaches to midseason firings/retirements/resignations as opposed to guys that depart immediately after the conclusion of the season.
I'm also dumbfounded that there were only 13 coaching changes after last season, while we already have 10 openings by the first week of November this year, with many more replacements imminent. Lots more coaches will be fired or leave to fill the currently vacant positions before the dust settles on the 2015 season. I wonder if 2014 was an uncommonly calm year for the coaching carousel, or if 2015 is just aberration.
I think last year was on the quiet side and we're making up for it now.
Don't people tend towards liquor for the calming of the nerves? I know when I was at Tech, the Navy made me take PHYS 2305/6 even though I was polisci. I did not physics well. The final in 2305 would basically determine whether I passed or failed, so I drank half a bottle of crown while I crammed. Pretty sure being half drunk is why I passed.
I'll be seeing Whit next week for the GT game so I'll see if he has any similar or different comments by then. Gonna be an interesting time in Hokie Nation in the coming weeks/months.
How has nobody asked the most important follow up question yet? Was that beer a Bud? Inquiring minds want to know!
I think you could be on to something here.
Honestly, I'd prefer if it was a Victory
My guess is a mix, half Bud, half Foster's
So....within 24 hours of this exchange, Pep Hamilton is fired by the Colts. Coincidence????
What do you guys think about Dave Clawson? It seems like he's done a good job at turning around football programs but has never had the chance at being a head coach at a school with the talent and program that VT has.
Could be a UVA, Illinois or Purdue target.
Especially since he preceded TimeCop at Richmond....maybe they figure if they go with the guy that recruited all of the players that London won a championship with...
Going from Beamerball to the Clawfense, eh? No thanks.
Mike Tomlin
Or the not as crazy harbaugh
I'm being serious, 757 guy, went to W&M. Name has been bandied about for the UVA opening if London gets canned. He's a great coach that would be very successful at Tech.
This would be my dream scenario but odds are slim to none.
Being from the 757 is cool and all but it doesn't mean shit when you haven't recruited a player in 15 years. Basically, he's a great coach and I'd love him to coach the Bucs but I don't want him at VT. We need a recruiter.
I think winning a super bowl would help on the recruiting trail.
We need a recruiter that wins. Mike London is a great recruiter, but he doesn't win games.
That was implied ha.
Seen a lot of Kirby Smart itt, you dont want him. 95% of Sabans guys flop. The main reason being Saban runs that defense, and no one else. Fuente is the hot name right now. The downside to him (and I dont know to much on his background so it may or may not be the case) is that if he as success at Tech he will be looking for one of the elite jobs in 4 years. Tech seems like Tennessee, in that it takes a home grown guy to stay at a place for so long and have long term success. Rich Rod could be your guy in that case. ACC is much easier to win in, hes close to home, and he is a great coach.
Saban does have some home runs on his coaching tree tho
Jimbo Fisher
Mark Dantonio
Jim McElwain
Tech isn't the job it was years ago when UNC almost poached Frank, we are a desirable football school with a lot to offer. It would take a blue blood like Alabama, Texas etc... to come calling for us to have a tough fight to keep our coach. With that said if they do come calling it means we are doing something right, if Fuente comes in and has multiple 10+ win seasons and leaves after five years I will still be happy
If he's that successful, why would he leave?
The same reason we are talking about Fuente/Herman etc leaving. Bigger school more money, better recruits etc..
My biggest dream: Bruce Arians. Hire him and keep Bud Foster and we'll be winning national championships in no time.
While his resume is good, there's two details that keep Arians from being on a realistic list of candidates:
1.) He's 63, only 6 years younger than Beamer.
2.) He's having too good a season in Arizona. He's not going to be free from that job until after next season at the earliest, and that's assuming that they completely crap out next year.
3.) He last worked in college 1993-1995. He virtually has no knowledge of current HS recruiting and no HS-recruiting network. Would need to hire the right assistants with recruiting know-how.
There's a possibility we might not have brought up...
What if VT has biologically engineered some sort of ultra head coach?
Leaked images of the Genetic Super Coach...
If we had that kind of capability, woudn't there be another Fuller in the 2016 class...and 2017...and...
FTFY
Invent the Future. Literally.
What about Ruffin McNeill?
I came here to drop this name, among others. I've been a fan of McNeil since he took over the Texas Tech job on an interim basis after Mike Leach got canned. He should have been able to keep that job, Tommy Tuberville bailed for Whit and Cincy after just a few years.
McNeil by all accounts is extremely well respected by his players.
I suppose if you can't beat em', hire em'?
However, his alma mater is ECU.
The idea of us hiring away Ruffin McNeill from ECU reminds me a lot of UNC trying to take Frank from us (which is one of many reasons that UNC will always be just barely a notch below UVa on my list of most hated teams). That being said, I do think McNeill is the type of person that would fit in with the culture of our football program and athletic department and have a lot of success at VT. The more I hear names tossed around, the more I realize that preserving our culture should be an important consideration for the hire.
Agreed, but just a note, Ruffin is an ECU alum. With the success he's had there, my guess is that he'll probably want to stay there. Even more of a reason to compare hiring him to UNC's attempt at Frank - try to take an alum from a school where he's been successful.
Destiny. He was born for this.
No PJ Fleck!? Proven Dabo-type recruiter & head motivator. Three years of head coaching experience.
Keep Bud Foster as defensive coordinator/assistant head coach. Focus on hiring a great offensive coordinator with Foster's guidance, seeing as how he's faced and strategized against just about every offense seen in college football.
Lock Fleck and Foster in a room with the team before a game and get them so fired up that they run through the wall of the stadium as a new entrance.
Let's goooooooooo
im on board with fleck.. been one of my coaches to watch..
If VT doesn't get him which I don't think will happen I am quietly rooting for UCF to snag him. Think that would be a perfect spot.. also extremely biased LOL
Ken Whisenhunt anybody? Just got fired by the Titans.
I think it is going to be Dan Mullen from Miss. State. All of the natural projections like Fuente, Herman, etc. are too obvious, and Whit is not going to just jump in line with everyone else. I'm sure we will pursue those guys, but I don't think they will be the "must get" targets.
Mullen is a great coach who has had solid teams at Miss State, but he will be fighting for relevance forever in the SEC and has been there since 2008. He could come to VT right away and compete. He is an offensive coach who is an Urban Meyer understudy, so the dude is well groomed and he is a great recruiter.
Bud Foster lost his shot the longer Frank hung on. If Beamer was retiring after an Orange Bowl win or a National Championship it would be easy to live with Bud taking over. A few mediocre years later, and the ship has sailed.
can we make it worth his while? he's 8 months into a new 4 year deal worth over $4M/year.
http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/12390402/mississippi-stat...
Haven't heard a lot of buzz on Dan Mullen, but I would be more than happy with that hire.
If he's been fighting for relevance in the SEC why does that qualify him for VT? I'm sorry, but I just don't buy that the SEC is THAT much better than the ACC. The SEC has 3 or 4 teams that annually contend for the best in the country, but the conference as a whole is not as big and tough as everyone seems to believe.
Miss State's 6-2 record and #24 ranking is inflated. Look at who they've played:
Southern Miss (6-3 Conf USA Team)
LSU (7-0 SEC Team)
Northwestern State (2-6 FCS Team)
Auburn (4-4 SEC Team)
aTm (6-2 SEC Team)
Troy (2-6 Sunbelt Team)
LA Tech (6-3 Conf USA Team)
Kentucky (4-4 SEC Team)
Miss State has lost to LSU (which is completely understandable) and aTm this year. The rest of the teams they have played have been pretty mediocre this year. They have played two good teams form Conf USA but take that for whatever it's worth.
You are picking out one year over 7 seasons. Miss State got to one bowl game in the 8 years prior to Mullen arriving, and the only year he has not made a bowl game is his first year inheriting poop from Sly Croom. The SEC also produced the National Champ in 4 of the past 6 seasons, so saying that the SEC is not that much better than the ACC is a joke. I hate watching SEC football, but over the past decade there is no comparison.
You're completely twisting what I'm saying. The SEC has 4 teams that legitimately fight for best team in the country every year. The rest of the conference is garbage. The entire bottom half of the SEC would fail to make it to Charlotte if they were in the ACC. The SEC has more great teams than the ACC. I won't argue with the Alabmas and Floridas in the SEC being great year in and year out. But top to bottom, the SEC isn't that much better than any other conference. I don't think you can prop a conference up on the laurels of 1/4 of it's teams. If a coach steps into a middle of the road SEC team and gets them to 8 wins that's pretty much exactly like putting the same coach in the middle of the road ACC team and getting them to 8 wins. Mullen and Fedora are comparable coaches. Mullen is not better than Fedora just because he coaches in the vaunted SEC but the general perception is that Mullen is better than Fedora because he coaches in the Mighty SEC. So what. That means he plays against 2 or 3 elite teams every year. Sure, that's more than UNC probably plays, but if you're a great coach you'll still win those other 9 or 10 games.
The SEC is better than every other conference top to bottom. There's a reason they haven't had a losing bowl record in like a dozen years despite the fact that they're usually paired up with a team that finished higher in their respective conference.
That really isn't that true, and last year's bowl season proved it. The upper echelon SEC teams got the crap kicked out of them in all of the major bowls. I feel like the conference has been resting on 2007 (when it really was legitimately deep), and one or two elite teams a year.
If you want to use only last season than I guess ACC>SEC too. The SEC isn't untouchable, but there's no other conference than makes a case for the best
Ok, sure. But I think that's very different than "The SEC is better than every other conference top to bottom." It's not some unbeatable juggernaut that pre-season polls typically make them out to be. I mean, just compare it to the ACC this year:
You've got LSU and Bama up top, compared to only Clemson for the ACC, but then FSU and UF are pretty comparable, and then after that, both leagues have a big stretch of varying degrees of "bleh." The ACC may have a bit more depth there (Duke, UNC, Miami - sometimes, Pitt, maybe us vs teams like TA&M, UGA, the Mississippis). I dunno, outside of the SEC having two top teams instead of one, they seem pretty comparable, and I think most people would say the ACC is only mediocre this year. I'll be interested in seeing Clemson play either of those two (assuming they all make the playoff).
Looks like it's Fedora, flight from Chapel Hill to Blacksburg, the morning of the announcement. That's a wrap. /s
LINK
I see the /s but to confirm, the speed of the plane was 160 MPH. Isn't that cesna like speed?
Incognito. "they'll never suspect me in a cesna"
it's got curtains....classy, gotta be him
140 kts is pushing it for a Cessna, at least for regular cruising speed. But it was a single engine prop plane, according to the info on the right of the page. My bet would be some doctor/lawyer alum with just enough money to be dangerous in the sky.
I know no one is going to have my back on this, but Navy's Ken Niumatalolo checks off about 90% of the boxes on our collective checklists.
Ahhh let's see,
1) Signature Offense: Triple Option.
We wouldn't have to worry about ECU anymore tho
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0oztvgZ9Y1c
Larry Fedora would make no sense to me. Hasn't done much before this year and we have to think we can do better. This would be a disappointing hire...particularly if he was the first choice. Its another thing for him to be chosen after others higher on the list passed on the job.
You guys looking for a head coach?
I see Bud sticking around for a few reasons: 1) He coulda/shoulda left for a head coaching position in previous years but stuck around, I really do think this means he has very limited interest in becoming a head coach. 2) That contract, he has a nice amount of money coming his way and our athletic department won't want to eat the buyout.
With that said, I see the next head coach being an offensive mind who is not given the option of dismissing Foster. Those defenses have been pretty damn solid even through this downward spiral.
I'm not sold on Fuente, only because I think Paxton Lynch is a legitimate talent. We all know how much an outstanding qb can influence a teams performance.
I do really like Rhule at Temple. I believe a few years back that Temple considered dropping out of the FBS altogether. That team hung with Notre Dame the whole way.
Ruffin McNeil, I stated on up the thread.... if you cant beat em', hire em'.
Chad Morris, his first season with SMU has been a rough start, but that is one of the worst defenses I've ever witnessed. I feel like he is a guy who could bring enough offensive firepower given the talent we do have in house, while keeping Foster to turn things around as early as next season. It'd be nice to have him tap in to texas recruiting pipeline, but would he even want to leave texas at all?
A few other names:
Charlie Strong - if he does get canned by the horns.. He was a great coach for Louisville, another guy who's players love him.
Mark Stoops - cant knock what he is done at Kentucky, that team is at least somewhat relevant again. I cant imagine he sticks around UK forever.
Josh McDaniels - I think he is an NFL guy who could really excel in the college game, unfortunately he'll be with the Patriots until early February when they win their 5th superbowl in the 21st century.
Pep Hamilton - Indy is going to clean house at the end of the season, he'll be on the hunt for his first coaching job away from Andrew Luck in some time.
Sean Payton - If he is out in New Orleans, he would make a hell of score for a program that has some recruiting competency. How about telling 17 year old kids that they are going to be coached up by an NFL champion, in college.
Gene Chizik - Cam Newton did win him a national championship after all, I dont want em' though. If Larry Fedora leaves UNC this off season, he'll be their next coach. If Fedora stays, Chizik will leave and become the head coach at a smaller program.
I'm confused by this? You say you're not sold on Fuente because Lynch is a legitimate talent yet he had 2 offers and wasn't even ranked in the recruiting world?
His 2 offers were Florida A&M and Memphis.. UF got into his recruiting late and the bounced due to skyler mornhiweg committing to UF so they basically said you can walk on.
If anything Fuente took a risk on a 6'5" QB who ran Wing T in high school and is now reaping the benefits after sticking with the kid. In 1 year Lynch went from 9 TD's and 10 INTs's to 22 & 9, that's pretty impressive
You also have to be impressed with the way Fuente coached up Andy Dalton when he was the OC and QB Coach at TCU.
As much as I love Bud, I want Whit to hire someone and hand over the reins when it comes to coordinators.
I trust Whit to hire a coach, but he's not a coach himself. He's the Chairman of the Board and he'll be hiring a CEO. I want the CEO to do the hiring of his C-Level execs.
Does that mean Bud is automatically out? No, of course not. If Whit brings in an offensive guy it wouldn't shock me to see Bud stick around assuming that he doesn't jump ship to a head coaching opportunity or a higher paying Defensive Coordinator opportunity.
Way to call the Pep Hamilton news, btw
This would be a bad move. You have to give your new coach the final say in assembling his staff, if you want a top-quality coach. I'm fully on board with asking candidates if they are inclined to retain or replace him, and downgrading a candidate who chooses 'replace' without having a damn good replacement in mind, though.
As for the contract, I'm pretty sure that Bud's buyout is $1.5M or less and will be offset by his salary at a new job. His new contract made it much less expensive for either party to terminate the relationship than most.
Bud or Rod, that is who it is going to be. I feel like Whit will be pressured not just by the fans but by his conscience and ties to both of them guys that he may try to make both of them work out there with Rod as head coach, if we do not get Rod then it is Bud. It's not that I don't want to but I just can't see any other way happening. I am curious if we hang on to or get rid of Shane, if Bud is coach I am sure out of respect for Frank that Shane will be kept. I have no doubt Bud would do away with Loeffler for sure.
I know a lot of the fans do not want this, maybe none do, but his respect for those 2 guys and his conscience will override what the fans think and if he ends up with a winning football team then I doubt he even cares if he made any fans mad.
If Whit is going to let himself be pressured into making a hire that is not best for Virginia Tech during a moment this important then he is not a good AD.
We have all established and agree that he is an excellent AD. That is why I do not think either Bud or Rich Rod will be the choice. Plain and simple
Whit is too good at his job to make this monumental of a decision based on his feelings and respect for any individual. It's his job to do what's best for VT, not for himself or Bud or RichRod. He takes care of people (I've yet to hear anyone say he's anything less than amazing to work for), but he knows what he has to do and he's going to make sure it gets done the right way. If that's Bud and RichRod, it'll be because that's what Whit thinks is 100% the best move for Virginia Tech.
Pep Hamilton just got fired by the Colts. We have been interested before. No HC experience but still interesting.
I've seen about 20-25 names dropped on boards and I'd be surprised if it weren't one of them #sauces .. I think we go after Fuentes. If it's not him, I think it'll be a big timer who shocks us all. From what I've heard, RichRod is "very unlikely" but I'd be ok with it. I don't see Bud getting it. I've heard there's practically no chance. Pep is interesting but I don't Whit will be looking for someone who views VT as a 3 year stepping stone .. And he would I think
Championship Drive on ESPNU played a game of "Would You Rather" with the VT job or SC job. One host chose SC (because SEC) and one chose VT (because position of ACC). Pretty sick of ESPN's coverage of us in the past two days.
ESPN=bad
Seriously. After dropping Grantland, ESPN went from bad to Donald trump bad
I haven't seen his name on here but I think Philip Montgomery instills the values that we are looking for.
Family Oriented? Check
Believes in accountability and discipline? Check
Head Coaching Experience? Check (1st year at Tulsa)
Offensive Oriented? Check (Baylor's OC before Tulsa, was with Art Briles for 16 years)
Can't say of many recruiting connections in this area, if any, but a young 43 year old coach, who knows how to put points on the board, seems to relate to recruits.
Not sure that Montgomery would jump ship, and leave the Texas-Oklahoma area, but an increase from an $800k salary may entice him.
Not saying Philip Montgomery is the answer, but he is definitely an option that should be explored.
Edit: Coincidentally, there is a thread started about him on 247 as well. Here are some stats from that post that are worth noting:
Can you post this in the thread about the TKP community reviewing coaching candidates?
Take this with a grain of salt. Just heard info from a source of unknown reliability that Richt met with Babcock yesterday. Another name was also mentioned as a possible candidate - Josh Mcdaniels
Flight aware shows a flight from Athens to Blacksburg.
http://flightaware.com/live/airport/KBCB
Lawyer flying into town. Check the identification of the aircraft. Blasingame, Burch, Garrard & Ashley Law Firm.
The sauce said that it was a donor plane funded by that law firm.
/s
A lawyer would actually make sense. Agents are often lawyers, thus could represent Richt in negotiations and contracts.
Oh ok. Makes more sense now
Is that for yesterday?
It was for yesterday. But as pointed out it was a law firm's plane.
EDIT: just saw your sauce comment on the law firm
I'm not sure why a UGA donor plane would fly Richt to bburg though. Shouldn't we be paying for that? Like I said, take this with a grain of salt. The same sauce was right on Beamer announcing after the BC game though
Shane found out Friday...so I'm assuming your sauce was taking a shot in the dark because it was a bye week.
Wouldn't it be a VT donor?
Pass. Hard pass.
Considering how things went for him in Denver, hard pass is an accurate description
Ehh plenty of great college coaches flared out in the NFL. Nick Saban was a pretty miserable coach of the dolphins, would you turn him down? McDaniels couldn't put it together in Denver, no doubt, plus he drafted Tebow... but he did rid the Broncos of that dumpster fire Jay Cutler and got some good value for him. I think having a young coach with an offensive mind and a few superbowl rings would be good for our program. He does have some head coaching experience, albeit with not much success (8-8, 3-9 [Fired midseason]).
Right now, the Patriots offense is looking just as dangerous as 07, minus Randy Moss but plus 8 years to TB12.
If you could get McDaniels to coach a college team, I bet he'd whoop that collective ncaa ass until our lord and savior Bill Belichick decides to hang up the hoodie. McDaniels will be the head coach the Patriots eventually.
Josh McDaniels has 1 year of college "coaching" experience. GA with Sparty in '99.
Not saying Richt for sure didn't meet with Babcock, but considering he's got a game tomorrow, I'd be surprised.
Does the gif at the top of this post bother anybody else? Every time I come to this thread I see BAGS FULL OF WATER FLOATING ON WATER...and it's driving me nuts
I'm guessing you haven't seen Finding Nemo? I think the point of the gif was to bring the memories associated with that scene.
I have seen the movie...I get the point of the gif..just making a science joke....apparently not very well
No worries. As a fellow engineer, I've tried to block out the physics mistakes in movies. Otherwise, I can't enjoy them any more haha. I think we're on the same page :)
Well, the bags also take the shape of the fish inside of them rather than the liquid that fills out their volume, so debating the physics of the movie is probably going to get frustrating. Though, too, if the water in the bags is less dense (due to solute concentration) then it is possible that they could float. Sea water is slightly more dense than fresh water.
I'm not a biologist but wouldn't you keep salt water fish in salt water, not fresh water?
Considered that. I have no idea what the aquarium conditions would be for cartoon fish, though.
yeah I'm stumped...
Welcome to The Key Play, where important forum threads about the floating ability of cartoon fish in bags of saltwater (or maybe regular water) are muddled with talk of future head coaches.
And where the Moderator
derails everythingkeeps all these @$$holes on topic.Saltwater.
In Nemo, the Dentist collects saltwater fish. Nemo was definitely a saltwater fish and put into the same aquarium as those pictured, thus they should all be in saltwater.
Perhaps, the bag water is significantly warmer than the ocean water. That could explain the floating.
i think those fish would b cooked
Also, if you recall, the water in the bay is very murky and cloudy compared to the rest of the ocean. It would have a lot more particulates and solutes in it than the super clean tank water. That may be a contributing factor.
I'm going to drop this here just as a reminder. Let's have fun, speculate, and enjoy the process, but let's also make sure we don't get too caught up in "coach X did this" or "Babcock is meeting with ___ so they're on the short list" or "Coach X is a lock, the ink is already dry on the contract."
This is from the TSL transcript of Whit's press conference after he fired James Johnson. And hey, I don't think I need to remind anyone that that search resulted in Buzz. So let's just remember how the guy operates and hang on tight.
*edit* Just read Joe's piece about the coaching search and noticed he put this in there too. Oh well, can't hurt to reinforce the point.
I love Whit. Ranks just below Beamer, and just above PIE.
Admit it, we are lucky.
Im just glad to see the OverHypeTrain hasnt left the station yet...
Could you imagine if people started throwing out current NFL coaches as serious contenders and then chanting "No thanks, Hard Pass"?
Lets be real....all these names who are getting thrown out (aside from Rich Rod for his apparent charecter flaws) are extremely high class names.
If the headline tomorrow reads
Mark Richt/Tom Herman/Pep Hamilton/Mark Rhule/etc. named Virginia Tech's Head Coach
and you dont squeel a little with excitement, you're lying to yourself.
Also, first time poster.....
which leads me to the question ----How does one earn turkey legs?
You get upvotes for interesting/useful/insightful/poignant/whatever comments or threads that you start (you need to get 40 TL before you can start a thread). Welcome!
#upVote
also to #upVote to the "we are lucky we have Whit Babcock" comment, 100% agreed. I think he'll make a great hire.
I think the deal has already been had.
If the talk of Bud staying is legit- that tells me that the new HC is keeping him