You have to love how our coaches put character above everything else. It also reminds of the saying "The measure of a person is how you treat the people you don't have to be nice to." This is why you want to be friends with the people who clean and take care of the place for you.
So..I Walked in: asked the Janitor about a recruit. He said: "bad attitude". So I walked out. #HokiesOnTheRoad— Zohn Burden (@CoachBurdenVT) April 15, 2016
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Love the approach, glad our program is looking for kids who treat everyone with respect and do things the right way
In other words, players that aren't named Marcus Vick or Cody Journell.
Journell could have been avoided so easily too with how small Giles is.
Not sure I understand what you mean. Beamer could have easily avoided signing him with some more due diligence because the place is so small everyone would have known about issues with him?
In a small area, everyone knows everyone, especially the star athlete. If one coach had talked to someone, they might have gotten insight to Journell.
That's what I thought you meant, OK.
But what is the character of the Janitor. Not trying to start something but I am a teacher and I feel like the janitor shouldn't be your first go to person. If you want the truth on a kid go the the lunch ladies and office assistants because those are the people who give these kids things. You see the a better picture of people when they are given things.
If I'm a coach, I wouldn't want anyone saying my recruit has a bad attitude, no matter who they are.
Depending on the sample size, the janitor typically interacts with the students less then the office and lunch crew. Not making excuses or saying this kid is any angel but I would want more then just one guy telling me the kid is no good in a high school filled with students all with hormone raging attitudes.
Can we really parse the full interaction of what happened in twitter? I think that the overall point is the most important. Character matters to the coaching staff. One flag probably isn't enough but this is probably the straw that broke the camel's back.
yea trying to be a twitter investigation is not my strong suit. I will move along. You're words have been heard and understood
This! There is no way this tweet on its own is an indication that coach Burden (or any coach) uses such a small sample size to make that determination.
I don't know... What about that janitor in "Breakfast Club"? He seemed to have his shit together. I'd trust his opinion.
Or Matt Damon...to be a genius, he was a damn trainwreck of a human.
Frazz has all the answers, I am reminded of it every day.
Then coach him to not be a jackass.
Agree to a certain extent, but isn't that a large portion of being a parent?? They're coaches, not babysitters. A slippery slope indeed. Coaches can definitely have a positive impact in youth's lives and help pick up some slack, but breaking a 18 year old jackass mindset/behavior is a 2 way interstate. The player needs to be open to not being a jackass in order to be able to be coached not to be one.
I do get that. My point is, if the kid actually has a bad attitude, IDGAF if the coach wants me to communicate that to recruiters or not. The recruiter needs to know exactly what he's actually getting, and whether the upside in talent overcomes any character issues.
someone somewhere has probably had a bad interaction with you. if burden happened to talk to that one person would you think that would be enough for him to move on?
disagree
pretty sure this guy's janitor said the same
sometimes a little attitude is what makes the difference
Corey Moore has "attitude", not "bad attitude".
I'm guessing janitors would love that guy.
nope. this is too subjective to be true
anyone can take issue with anyone else for any reason. logic fail
Of course, I don't know if Corey's janitor actual took issue with him. Just saying that basing a recruiting decision solely on that is not prudent, but I doubt Burden did that either.
What I'm saying is that Corey Moore has "attitude", not "bad attitude". Those aren't the same thing. He tells it like it is.
Janitors don't like people who aren't nice to "the little people", so they could be a fairly good judge of character.
I see Burden's point, and I'm guessing he does his homework, so it probably wasn't just the janitor's opinion -- that's just the point he was trying to make.
Yes and what I am saying is that what you are saying is too subjective.
Someone with "attitude" could easily be seen as someone with "bad attitude". I knew players in those days and had good interaction with Moore. But i can guarantee you that others he came in contact with left with the impression that he had "bad attitude", because i watched it happen.
I am not saying this was the only factor for Burden but there is something here about these kids getting coached in life as well as sports. Shaping young men to become better.
Unless you can produce a janitor who didn't like Corey Moore, you should just let it go.
What I'm saying is that janitors tend to point out the types who act differently around different people. They see players when their guard is down.
As far as I could tell, Corey Moore didn't change his attitude depending on who he was around. You didn't need to talk to his janitor, you could just look at his media interview, or talk to him directly. Yea, he had attitude. The kind you want if it can be channeled for good.
In fact, I loved his attitude, and even if the media was shocked by it (and I'm sure others on VT cringed), they liked it to.
Burden's point is that you have to be careful how you act around everyone. Hopefully he's not ruling out everyone who has passion or a chip on their shoulder in high school. I'm not sure you'd be able to fill a roster.
Haha, sure dude. I am telling you first hand info. I don't need a janitor. I don't really care if you believe me. That's on you. But be less subjective if you want to make a point or as you say, let it go.
Opinions are subjective. News at eleven.
Arguing about janitors' point of views. I love this website.
Ooooh, news at eleven! What a slam! Burn Center me, right?
my original opinion is that it is easy for someone with "attitude" to be mistaken for "bad attitude". That was all. I used Moore as an example specifically because I saw it happen and he had "attitude".
You say that this is wrong with Moore because he "tells it like it is" and has "attitude" not "bad attitude." You're not stating an opinion, you're making a point. One which you would need to have known him personally to make with the level of authority you want me to believe. So, did you know him? It is also a point that is too subjective to be true, because, much like you and I taking issue with each other, people can and do take issue with others for tiny things all the time even if by mistake, which is my original opinion.
Or am I misrepresenting you again? Should I watch the morning news now?
Aaaand I pooped my pants. Again. That's like the 2nd time this month. Those eyes scare the crap out of me!
The best measure of a man's character is how he treats those from whom he stands to gain nothing.
not my point but oh well.
However for the benefit of the doubt, he may have heard similar and this was just confirmation.
Is it the janitor from Rudy?
via GIPHY
Rudy was offsides
As a gold domer hater, every time I see the final play, I hope he blows a ligament
From a high schooler's perspective: the janitor sees everything. High schoolers generally don't filter themselves at all in front of janitors because they usually don't get us in trouble. They're also really the only group of people on the staff who have to go everywhere in the school in a week if not a day.
I hope there was more to it than just that. Not really a good way to judge a kid lol. Weird to see everyone on here praising the approach, but it seems pretty irresponsible.
Idk, I get the sense that this was a kid the staff was on the fence about, and so it was easy to decide he wasn't worth the trouble
I came here for the #hottakes, wasn't disappointed. I don't even know if the tweet is a true story or if Burden is just reminding recruits at Virginia Tech we want guys with character in addition to athletic ability. He knew the tweet would get visibility.
....I'd rather have a beer.
Billy likes soda
This probably never happened it's just an illustration to make a point
I understand LOLUVA has a new program for building character and changing attitude so they can recruit players like this.
Yeah cause bronco's teams have a great history of good sportsmanship.
Exhibit A- crotch punch
Exhibit B- sucker punch
It's also a possibility that he was asked to come back at another time because the kid got in trouble. I know that at some high schools near where I live, they don't allow a kid to talk to a coach if he/she were in in-school suspension for a day or something along those lines. They would politely ask the coach to come back at a later time or to talk to them once the school day is over.
Savage
DIG IT!
A fine teaching moment, Coach Burden. However, I would counsel caution without further investigation. I know the story of a high school coach who after a run-in with a star athlete's father over the playing time of another player put the word out that the kid was trouble. The player himself never had any idea what happened. He just suffered the consequences of all interest stopping, and even found it almost impossible to get a walk-on position without the help of a powerful booster who knew better.
Thank god we didn't overanalyze this.
Engineers?
LOL!!
They've been doing something right.. being on campus met a lot of the guys and never met a kid who was not first class. The Edmunds, Ryan Williams (and that was the day after his game changing fumble vs UNC), Motuapuaka, Sam Rogers, and the cream of the crop being Ronny VanDyke and JC Coleman, really all the way back to Bryan Randall. You can see why it was tough for Frank to leave. Great kids to be around.
Even though he is no longer on the team, Devin VanDyke is really nice too. Had a few classes with him last semester. Both Ronny and Devin (I believe) have been involved with FCA.
This is really nothing new:
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/bad-behavior-on-social-media-can-cost-studen...
Coaches and recruiting staff keenly monitor social media presence and character issues. Even if Zohn is using this opportunity just to make a point, this sort of monitoring is very common. A college scholarship offer is a significant investment on the part of the school, and they risk their reputation (via perception) on these kids. If Zohn's tweet makes anyone think twice about being a jerk, then it's achieved its purpose. Good on him.
Why would you want to ask a UVA grad about a potential VT recruit anyway?