This was a possibility as the full D1 Board has the ability as I understand it to overturn the decisions of the D1 Council(which was basically just the FBS Conferences and even then was pretty closely split) which passed the ban and any other subordinate groups.
So ODU's hosting, and Michigan's Summer Tour are back on.
We absolutely need the ACC to get in the game and get some camps down at the small Florida and Ga Schools.
Full NCAA Release: https://www.ncaa.org/about/resources/media-center/news/board-rescinds-ca...
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And here is the ACC when it comes to camps.
What a bunch of spineless douches.
Or, OR, it is the result of when the University presidents made the decision vs the AD's and it wasn't weighted towards the P5. Yes the P5 are bigger and bring in the more money but on this topic since it basically impacts both sides pretty heavily I don't see the reason to weight the voting towards the P5. Particularly since the Autonomy Group of just the P5 can limit it themselves, or do so on the Conference level like the ACC and SEC have done.
The D1 Board of Directors makeup is mostly University side: http://web1.ncaa.org/committees/committees_roster.jsp?CommitteeName=BOARD
While the D1 Council is mostly AD's and weighted towards the P5(who get 2 votes) and G5 get 1.: http://web1.ncaa.org/committees/committees_roster.jsp?CommitteeName=1COU...
How are they spineless? They just shutdown the most profitable football conference (SEC). This is a victory for most of the little guys, and a handful of bluebloods. If they upheld it, it would have benefited the SEC, Texas, USC, Oklahoma, etc.
Yes, because the SEC doesn't have money for camps.
/s
Of course the SEC has money for camps. But their locations make satellite camps unnecessary. They're surrounded by the best talent in the country. The rule change hurts the SEC by loosening their stranglehold on the fertile recruiting grounds they inhabit.
I think a
is a vast understatement. The B1G, PAC 12, and half the ACC will benefit GREATLY and the SEC/half the ACC/Big 12 will not.
IMO, there's 15 or less 'bluebloods':
Alabama
Auburn
Notre Dame
USC
UGA
UF
FSU
Texas
Oklahoma
OSU
Michigan
Miami
Maybe there's a couple I'm missing. Regardless, ND, Michigan and OSU are the only ones listed above who benefit greatly from it. Every school has a unique situation, and almost any school that does not already have recruiting relationships established in Georgia, Florida, Texas or CA can turn this into a net positive.
Is Florida really a blueblood? Spurrier made them relevant in the 90s for basically the first time. Spurrier was very much their Beamer.
I'm not saying they aren't a huge and relevant football program, but they aren't pedigreed.
All three of the Florida schools basically rose to prominence in the 80s-90s. Not much success football-wise at Miami, FSU, and UF before Schnellenberger/Johnson, Bowden, and Spurrier, respectively. Granted, they had a ton of success in a short period of time, but they haven't been football powers for generations.
When I think of "blueblood" college football programs, I immediately think of Bama, USCw, Ohio State, Michigan, ND, Texas, and Oklahoma.
The three Florida schools all have at least a quarter century of national relevance. Bowden's 14 straight years of top 5 finishes is perhaps the most impressive least-talked-about-feat in CFB history.
Regardless of your opinion of the three Florida Schools, I think we can all agree that there's less than 15 'bluebloods' and allowing satellite camps is a net negative for all but 2 or 3 of them.
ACC is going to allow satellite camps as long as the NCAA does.
I feel like her Twitter avatar reflects how she does all of her articles
thanks....i can't un-see that now....thankfully:
1. i don't tweet, twitter...whatever...
2. if i did, i wouldn't follow her...
since Fireman posted more tweets below, all i see above her avatar is a balloon with 'wut' in it.......that about sums it up......
This just makes NCAA athletics all the more a professional sport, which I hate.
Because the Elite 11, and The Opening are somehow better?
Given the choice between literally Nike Run and Hosted Camps for recruits and ones where they might meet 2 or 3 coaching staffs Ill take the one at least hosted by a school and exposing them to college.
Besides this still has nothing on AAU shooty hoops
Exactly. These camps give kids that wouldn't normally get the exposure a chance to get a big offer.
Is there really an "exposure" void these days? Every school in the country already knows about every kid that has the talent to play at the schools running these out of state camps.
Not for big name recruits, but there is for smaller ones. A lot of them can't afford to travel across the country for a camp. Will they get the huge D-1 scholarship? Probably not, but some will, and even if they don't they can at least be seen by people that normally wouldn't have seen them.
The problem though is that it has been countered by the rise in "Non Commitable" Offers.
Sure a coach might see your film, but if he says you wont get a real offer till you perform on site in front on them it doesnt matter.
This barely moves the needle in terms of the amateur/pro divide. Big money and sham classes do far more to that end
Well that got fixed fast.
Hello ODU...
That Atlantic High school in Delray, FL has basically been a branch campus of ours. Lets set up shop there
and if ODU won't let us set up shop, i say take it across the city to NSU...
Good. Set a limit on the number of camps, but an outright ban was just dumb
That is f what my ideal resolution looks like.
Maybe a school gets 4 or 5 camp weekends from May 1 to August 1. Use them how you like on campus or off but you only get 5 in a set time.
That way the big schools get really nice ones that are a draw, but maybe a few small schools pool together to rival them.
And it creates choices about balancing drawing kids to campus and going to where they are.
I like this - restrict the time and quantity of camps. Good compromise for everyone - coaches, players, bluebloods and little guys.
As far as I've read there is not a restriction on how many camps coaches can go to. If there is a good read about the details could you link it?
There is no restriction at the moment. I was just responding in agreement to DBHT14's ideal resolution.
Kudos to the NCAA for finally getting it right on this issue. The rule they passed earlier was a terrible deal for student-athletes. Glad to see the kids' best interests being served here.
You know what... fuck it
We should host camps in NC, TN, Md, PA, TX, FL, SC, MI, and CA annually from now on. Fuck it, you're going to come and try to poach ours, we'll double down on poaching yours. And absolutely pour money into this venture.
If they're not going to regulate this shit, then we take it to the fucking extreme and legitimately test what they're willing to allow.
Have you not been watching Harbaugh the last 3 months?
I'm saying go above and beyond what even they're doing.
I'm talking about building a VT branded facility in the 757 to use for annual camps, various spring workouts for the team, a summer scrimmage, and then bid it out for high school teams to use during their season. Have a recruiter on our payroll working permanently out of this facility. And then do the same in DC.
You want to open up our state for everyone else to use, fine.... We'll annex the rest of the commonwealth, setting up permanent shop in every major recruiting hotbed and take it to the extreme. Oh, you don't like it, tough shit, NCAA, you had your chance.
If the NCAA is going to blatantly cave like this and to those who have zero respect for the rules in place (also relevant: Miami, UNC), then fuck it, bend the rules in our favor as much as we can while spinning it that we're abiding. Take everything to its absurd conclusion.
I mean I would be mad if we didn't leverage and have a ground presence everywhere that mattered.
We are the Largest FBS school(2nd largest public school) in the 12th largest state. There is absolutely no reason except administrative ennui and timidity that we should not be outlaying like the best of them.
We aren't a small school we need to stop acting like it, its time to start throwing weight around, anything else is accepting defeat already.
Michigan was following the rules.
If that scenario you just described is within the rules and affordable within the football/athletic budget VT 100% should be doing that. I have a hard time getting upset at Michigan because they found a flaw in the rules and exploited it better (or more aggressively) then everyone else. The ACC shouldn't have had a ban to begin with
EDIT: what he said^
I think they're willing to bet that we won't go overboard with our extremely modest recruiting and athletic budget.
You need to get over this "our state our recruits" mentality. There is no ours and yours. Recruits aren't owed to their states and out of state schools aren't being dicks by approaching them.
For a site that continually wants a greater presence nationally, I don't understand why people here wanted the ban. This is nothing but good for exposure
I have to agree. As great as it sounds to lock down the 757 and elsewhere in VA, the recruiting landscape has changed so much that I don't think it is possible. The big recruits in the 757 have absolutely 0 loyalty to VT and/or the Commonwealth in general. Let's stop pretending they do. I'm personally tired of the friend-zoned vibe some of these recruits continually give us because we are too dumb or naive to understand that they are uninterested in actually going to VT. They will go wherever the most smoke is blown up their tails nationally (and I don't doubt they have benefactors/influences on them that push them to do so). For as many resources as we blow on recruiting there annually, the yield is incredibly low. I really think we should court any and all in-state recruits interested, but we need to focus on other areas as well (Florida has become a pipeline recently, and Fuente and Co. brings us loads of connections in the deeper south/TX/OK) to be truly successful. The "six hour radius" and own the state mentality is pretty worn out.
Because VT has always been one to push the boundaries of NCAA rules...
"I'm talking about building a VT branded facility in the 757 to use for annual camps, various spring workouts for the team, a summer scrimmage, and then bid it out for high school teams to use during their season. Have a recruiter on our payroll working permanently out of this facility. And then do the same in DC."
Building a facility and defraying costs by renting it out to high schools? High schools don't have any way of paying for that in the 757, nor would they be inclined to do so. It is against the rules to practice football year round, last I checked, and the fields they already have suit them just fine.
And staffing these new facilities with full time recruiters? Sign me up for that job!
"Oh, Mama!"
I'll let Fuente and Co. Set up in my backyard here in Myrtle Beach.
MBHS is the real deal, or at least they were during my time not too long ago. Isn't that where Bruce Taylor played?
The talent is spreading out down here. Socastee High School, Carolina Forest, St. James and Myrtle Beach High School all have talented guys recently.
What I really want is to work on our hologram technology so that we can hold multiple camps at once!
THANKS ACC!
Well We're comin' ..... To YOUR Ci-tay!
...Gone play something something sing you a something SAWNG!
Dave's not here, maahn.
Well that didn't take long...
I know one will be at ODU.
"Coming soon..."
Oh...a contingency plan was on the back burner?
This staff seriously has its shit together. I feel like I'm dreaming here.
I love our new head coach.
I know a lot of people dont like them, but the jerseys look pretty sick here
I'm really excited that the stripes on the helmets are staying. I love those.
I'm not sure those will become the standard helmet but they do look great.
1 at ODU
1 in Delray Beach
1 in Baltimore
1 in NOVA
1 in New Jersey
1 in Charlotte
Am I missing any?
Sauce?
FL, GA, TX, LA, SC
Need one in Pennsylvania and one in Georgia.
Indianapolis. The 747.
I don't know why or what happened - shows NCAA flip-flopping per usual.
But I love giving the ol' middle finger to the SEC! I hope everyone steals the elite talent they seem to horde.
*Cough *Cough... money to be made
Basically the first body to vote was weighted towards the P5 and the SEC and with the ACC's help were able to get the ban through.
The body above them that now overturned it was not weighted like that and was equally represented across all of Division 1. and made up of University Presidents not Athletic Directors.
Don't forget that the Pac12 rep and one of the group of 5 reps voted the wrong way.
Very true, though I read the Pac-12's justification and I admit it is at least plausible.
Basically they were supporting the counter proposal that would had let them happen but more restricted IIRC.
When it was obvious that wasnt happening the Rep decided a uniform policy across the country was the best optiona nd that meant voting for the ban.
ODU is one of our targets
Somewhere in the Ok/Tx territory is another with the pedigree of our coach
Delray Beach is another one
DC area? We'll need to defend against PSU and MD. Mich/OSU/Tx/Ok/FSU/ND/etc won't go there but it is our house so we should defend it
David Teel reporting that the ACC is still limiting its out-of-state camps to a 50-mile radius. So no national takeover for VT (or any other ACC program).
That should get us into Charlotte and DC. Any other decent territories?
I don't understand why the ACC would place this arbitrary limitation on itself when there is no such NCAA limitation.
Because #goacc
Because John Swofford is a dumbass UNC shill who doesn't give a shit if it doesn't benefit the heels
I'd hold off on this just yet. A lot of confusion about exact wording and what it means. The ACC is NOT adding any restrictions on top of NCAA rules.
As I understand the VT Compliance Tweet it only applies to camps being run and organized by the big school.
No reason Fuente or Bud couldnt be Celebrity Guests though at say a UCF or North Texas Camp though.
I don't know why we go to ODU we already host all the 757 players at Tech. Let's go out-of-state Texas Florida somewhere where they have hundreds of D1 level recruits that maybe slip through the cracks everyone knows who all the big names are down in the 757
These camps are a good thing for literally everyone except the conferences that don't allow them. Don't want other schools 'poaching' VA recruits? Win more games
Every conference now allows them. However without some kid of rules and oversight this is about to get out of hand fast.
The ACC changed their rule today, and the SEC has said they will by May 29th.
There are no more conferences that outright ban them so it is more or less a wide open playground for all of Division 1 now.
http://www.dailypress.com/sports/old-dominion/dp-spt-satellite-ncaa-0429...
Yes, because what we really need is more free exchange of camp benefits and cash from big schools.
You know. For the kids.
If only VT were a big school with potential and money left on the table to take advantage with proper management and leadership!
If anything, this just adds another venue to the arms race.
Relevant: The NCAA's satellite camps controversy, explained as simply as it possibly can be
Funny and accurate. You can always trust Faux Pelini to deliver.
I almost snorted laughter at my desk reading this:
Jim is doing his best to raise more concerns here. Here is his month of June per mlive.com:
June 2 — Maynard H. Jackson H.S. (Atlanta) — hosted by Cedar Grove H.S., featuring Michigan and Georgia
June 3 — Trinity Christian Academy (Jacksonville, Fla.)
June 3 — St. Thomas Aquinas (Fort Lauderdale, Fla.)
June 4 — University of South Florida camp (Tampa, Fla.) — hosted by USF, featuring Michigan
June 4 — Cheshire Academy (Cheshire, Conn.)
June 5 — Old Dominion University (Norfolk, Va.) — hosted by ODU, featuring Michigan
June 6 — Bob Jones High School (Madison, Ala.)
June 7 — Hun School (Princeton, N.J.)
June 7 — University of South Alabama (Mobile, Ala.) — hosted by USA, featuring Michigan
June 8 — Pearl H.S. (Pearl, Miss.) — featuring Michigan, Ole Miss and Mississippi State
June 8 — Raw Talent U (Cleveland Heights, Ohio)
June 8 — Paramus Catholic (Paramus, N.J.)
June 9 — Warren G. Harding H.S. (Warren, Ohio)
June 9 — Fairfield High School (Fairfield, Ohio)
June 9 — Sound Mind, Sound Body (Detroit)
June 10 — Sound Mind, Sound Body (Detroit)
June 11 — "5th Quarter Football Camp" (Ann Arbor)
June 11 — Youth Camp (Ann Arbor)
June 12 — Baylor camp (Waco, Texas) — hosted by Baylor, featuring Michigan
June 12 — Empire Showcase (Norco, Calif.)
June 13 — East Houston Football Showcase (Houston, Texas)
June 14 — Showtyme Camp (Addison, Texas) — hosted by Michigan and Iowa State
June 14 — Oakland H.S. (Murfreesboro, Tenn.)
June 15 — Pittsburg State University (Pittsburg, Kan.)
June 15 — Blue Springs South H.S. (Blue Springs, Mo.)
June 17 — Ridge View High School (Columbia, S.C.)
June 17 — Bright Lights Big House camp (Ann Arbor)
June 18 — Aerial Assault QB camp (Ann Arbor)
June 18 — Big Man lineman camp (Ann Arbor)
June 20 — Shine Time camp (Ann Arbor)
June 21 — Shine Time camp (Ann Arbor)
June 22 – Specialist camp (Ann Arbor)
June 23 – Specialist camp (Ann Arbor)
June 23 — Antioch H.S. (Antioch, Calif.)
June 24 — Seven60Athletes Camp (Oceanside, Calif.)
June 25 — Augustus F. Hawkins H.S. (Los Angeles)
Too much.
Don't care, while Michigan has deep coffers, nobody has unlimited resources, all of it has trade offs.
If they experience a staff exodus or guys looking to get out that is their trade off for sending them across the country in the off season.
NCAA once again shows how inept they are. They could at least cap it to 1 per day....
He's just trying to help the kids out, right?
So 36 camps and they can only sign 25 players. Yup, this DEFINITELY has the recruits' best interests in mind.
It's not like this hurts a recruits quality of life.
Not saying it does, but the argument was that some recruits can't make it to camps on campus, so the satellite camps allow them to get exposure. If Michigan can't even take 1 player from each camp, what sort of exposure are they really getting? Sure, some camps are joint with other schools, but it really isn't upping their chances much at all when schools, like Michigan, are going overboard with it like this.
When you join with another school, it gives lower level kids a chance to be seen by other coaches. Kid might not be good enough to get a scholly to Michigan, but he may catch the eye of the Iowa State coach.
Bottom line is - If I had a kid being recruited in any sport and you told me he/she could attend a camp and potentially network/further open his recruiting and meet a great coach, I would encourage him/her to attend (assuming he/she had some interest in at least one of the schools there).
I get the point though... The kids get a free camp and a little bit of visibility, while Michigan gets A LOT of visibility, and the chance to build recruiting connections in new territories. I think the right move is to allow satellite camps, but limit the number a school can hold/attend, the time of the year in which they can be held/attended and (maybe) the area they can be held/attended.
This isn't about the recruits. The four and five star recruits that Michigan is going after were noticed already.
This is about leveraging cash for recruiting advantage.
Then maybe if VT wasn't 11th in the ACC for alumni donations we wouldnt be so mad about the gap?
Don't know which is worse.
11th, or "in the ACC".
Either one means I don't want colleges buying recruits. In fact, I don't like the idea of a money advantage to individual teams in college athletics to begin with, but I guess that horse has left the barn a long time ago.
If you want enforced Parity, and spending limits the NFL is for you.
VT is now a big boy school and getting bigger. If we hadn't spent a decade slowly becoming one of the worst in the P5 at cultivating a donor base we could be taking advantage with a much expanded level of resources.
That's on us not on the NCAA, they didn't create rules that forced Weaver to slowly kill the Hokie club and not evolve with the times.
For a history trip that horse was never in the barn to begin with. When Pop Warner was coaching Cornell in the late 1890's he once protested Harvard allowing certain players on the team. Supposedly they had a deal with a Cigarette company owned by a Harvard alum that gave them a profit if they sold boxes to other students, thus funding their education in the days before legal athletic scholarships.
Yea, I suppose I object to schools giving recruits money or benefits for recruiting advantage.
Next thing you know you'll be telling me it's OK for billionaires and foreign interests to give politicians money without public disclosure.
> Yea, I suppose I object to schools giving recruits money or benefits for recruiting advantage.
I agree with you on that on 100% outright bribery has no place in the sport. The debate about how much a scholarship should really be worth is fine, but we can all stop short of trying to buy high school kids.
But that doesn't mean schools should be too heavily restricted from spending their own money to put themselves in front of a kid.
If Notre Dame wants to spend the thousands it costs to drive their Equipment Truck in front of a recruits high school like they did recently, go for it. It is between the school and the donors if they think that was an appropriate use of funds. But if then they come up a little short and a S&C coach leaves for a raise, or a major donor gets disgruntled when he gets hit up for an unexpected bump that can be the trade off.
Yep... totally doing this with the recruits best interests in mind....
What a farce of an argument THAT was...
How is more recruiting exposure bad for kids in any way?
The fact that tOSU, Temple, and Rutgers(coached by an Urban disciple) are holding one together should beyond a doubt show the networked nature of recruiting, along with VT's experience in getting brewer. If a kid performs in front of a big time coach, word will get around even faster than any edited hype video.
Harbaugh giving the SEC the finger by recruiting further south than they ever thought possible...
Michigan to hold satellite camp in Australia
It's, you know, for the kids...
so, really far south and really really really far east?
Obviously we know how most everybody in the ACC feels about all of this but here's the good guys 2 cents worth...
"We're goin' to see that there's a lot of people that can go overboard with the whole situation..I think we're seeing that now.."
Fuente on Jim Harbaugh and Michigan.
There are always going to be crazy coaches who decide to try to go that extra mile, and run themselves ragged, along with their staff and spend huge sums of money for only a possible payoff.
That's fine, it shouldn't ruin a perfectly good idea, you are never going to have parity in college football, to do so removes any agency a fan base has in their interaction with their alma mater and reasons to incentivize fan support.
those are lots of big words. I'm just an engineer....and not even a very good one at that :p
Life isn't fair. Other people will always spend more/do things differently.
I'm a SE - I translate for engineers a lot
So what you're saying is you're this guy:
Pretty much - minus the glasses and the mustache. It is even worse - I'm the 'User Engagement Lead' so they expect me to go talk to people.
I'm against anything that gives Michigan even more of an advantage than they already have.
That said, I think the VT administration is looking at this correctly. If you can't disallow it, you might as well participate.
VT Football camp at DePaul Hgh School Wayne NJ.
Oof I would not expect a huge turnout for this one guys.
Harbaugh is doing two that same week, 1 on the Tuesday one on the Thursday(we are Friday) at the Hun School next to Princeton, and powerhouse Paramus Catholic literally not 10 miles away(DePaul is very solid too though) and I think BC will be at that one.
Then there is also a joint tOSU, Rutgers, Temple on the 8th at Farleigh Dickenson University that week too in North Jersey.
We do have the advantage of being the Friday Night option since it wouldn't require missing school like the others, but I suspect many kids of every ability level are just going to be worn out from any other camp they attended that week.
I don't like the idea of having tons and tons of camps. Something doesn't
sit right about that. But having a limited number seems all right.
OTOH, good to see we have our first one set up.