http://www.ncaa.org/about/resources/media-center/news/ncaa-relocate-cham...
Based on the NCAA's commitment to fairness and inclusion, the Association will relocate all seven previously awarded championship events from North Carolina during the 2016-17 academic year.
Five states plus numerous cities prohibit travel to North Carolina for public employees and representatives of public institutions, which could include student-athletes and campus athletics staff. These states are New York, Minnesota, Washington, Vermont and Connecticut
This really might impact ACC events in the state. The state of NC seems to be the host venue for almost every major sport at some point in the next 5 years. That all might change and quickly. I know we had a lengthy discussion about where the ACC might move the football championship game but where could other sports like mens and woman's basketball move to? Swimming/diving, baseball etc etc.
Comments
Ridiculous IMO!
Topics like this one are sort of weird on TKP. It's one of the few times politics and sports clearly cross paths. I really can't say anything nonpolitical and constructive expect that it really could put the ACC in a though spot if we have to move events out of NC.
I'm with you. As someone that's taken a couple of gender and sexuality courses at VT, I've got some pretty clear and educated opinions on the subject. Also this is impacting ACC sports which is another thing I'm passionate about. However, a ton of the discussion about this topic is also going to include politics, which I don't talk about (especially on TKP where it violates the community guidelines).
So yeah, sort of weird is a good way of putting it.
Maybe the NBA/ACC/NCAA should follow Joe's and TKP's lead and do their best to keep politics out of sports.
I partially agree with that statement. However, it's not that simple. That's all I'll say in this community.
It could be much more simple than it is. Courage, consistency, and common sense would be necessary, however. All things that are in short supply these days.
And.... that's all that I will say in this community.
Common sense is a bullshit phrase that sounds nice on the surface.
In general, people make decisions based on past experiences that are in someway unique to them. It is because of this that an action that seems like common sense to Frank may seem incredibly dumb to Leonard and vice versa. At best common sense is a way of saying something is a social norm for a community, but it doesn't mean that it is a social norm for everyone.
Also, it wasn't me who down voted you.
is it just me or does this definition-of-common-sense idea reek a little bit of that "morals" rabbit hole?
Point taken.
My take on "common sense" in my post, was coming from an "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" viewpoint. There is such gross overreach from both sides of this issue. I wasn't trying to sound nice. Just honest.
But... I should stop. This really isn't the place, nor should it be. I do enjoy that TKP is usually one of the rare secluded hideaways from all of the silly social/political nonsense that is so pervasive nowadays. I thought about deleting every post that I've made in this forum, but if downvoters want to unleash, I'll leave them up. Whatever. Go Hokies.
I sort of wish I could state my political opinions on here. I think I would get some interesting feedback and would like to hear some of the other opinions on here. However, this is a site for VT athletics and that should be the main focus of the site. Even though I am against censorship in general, I 100% back Joe's rule against political discussions on this site. It greaty reduces the number of trolls that have to be dealt with and avoids many unnecessarily heated arguments.
I'm a member of the Rhinoceros Party.
I see someone has been on reddit today. This guy seems to be the original Vermin Supreme.
Being born and raised in NC and seeing what HB2 has done to ruin our reputation, I can't talk about this topic without going into politics outside of saying it's gut wrenching to see what damage this law has done. I would not be surprised if my job is relocated within 5 years if it isn't repealed.
Well the nearest middle of the conference site to have the ACCCG would be FedEx or M&T Bank Stadium. Philadelphia wouldn't be too bad either, and I'd rather attend a game there than have my team play at FedEx. Just don't go back to Florida. That shit was embarrassing when they showed the crowd.
Ridiculous. If I were N.C., I'd start suing for breach of contract. You want to make a P.C. statement and renege on contracts on the grounds of silly contrived issues, you ought to have to deal with all the consequences.
I don't agree with you, but I gave you a leg because you brought up a good point. Would NC have a leg to stand on if this were brought before the courts? The state has already been hemorrhaging money because tours and events pass them by. At what point would the state begin to take steps to get some of that back?
Breach of contract can easily go the other way. NCAA could sue on the grounds that North Carolina has now made decisions that could potentially mean a huge loss in business if for example fans refuse to go, or teams refuse to go, or etc, etc.
This is extremely easy to show precedence for because so many people and groups have already cancelled and rejected North Carolina as a place they will do business with.
There is no way North Carolina would win this.
To anyone who wants to comment in this thread: Let's. Not. Talk. About. Politics.
Sports!!!
We did this once before with just speculation and it went well. I'm not sure why this one isn't.
This topic is 100 percent politics by its very nature.
I believe we can all maturely discuss potential sites and keep politics out of it.
Feel free to discuss where the ACC might host its championship events if they get moved, not the politics behind the move.
Disneyland?
Again, I say don't move anything. Port-O Pottys are inherently uni-sex.
Not really. I specifically asked what other venues and cities could host ACC Events if they were moved, where would people
Like to see the events at. Personally I think SC and FL make great hosts.
Florida might work now that FSU and Clemson are resurgent. The entire reason Jacksonville and Tampa failed the first time was because that was during the stretch when we were dominating the Coastal and BC was doing well in the Atlantic. The ACC was scheduling about as far from the division champions as possible. Also, there were no national ramifications for the game in those days. It was never for a play in to the BCS championship. For at least the last three years, it's had national title implications.
I thought this was going to be a thread about UNC getting its 2016 athletic championships vacated or something. I was thinking, "relocated? Is that the term now? Did they just hide UNC's ACC basketball trophy? That's a weird way to say vacated."
I was also wondering why they only vacated 2016 championships, but I was happy to see the NCAA concluded its investigation. From now on, I'm just going to click on the titles instead of just seeing them and speculating in my mind.
I read it as if UNC won a bunch of championships last year.
I had initially thought the same thing, though I read relocated as realocated.
I saw relegated, re-read because that didn't make sense, and still got the idea of vacated. Had to open and read to really understand. Well played, Fireman.
This seems like an opportunity for SC to get a lot of events moved here. Charleston needs to get on building the football stadium.
Preach on.
What a great destination for a bowl, just no adequate venue.
Ironically the only adequate stadiums would be Williams-Brice in Columbia, or Death Valley, both likely disqualified for obvious reasons. (W-B stadium is great, but Columbia not so much IMHO.)
My plan is College of Charleston, Citadel, County of Charleston, State of SC all get together and build 45,000 seat stadium. Clemson/USCjr plays there every 5 years, Citadel and CoC play there and SC gets bowl game and maybe ACC championship.
I'd rather go to SC than Florida or northern locations for ACCCG. I want to get away from winter that time of year, not closer.
However, Charlotte was about the only location I could drive to, watch game, and drive back in a single day. No other location would be as viable and cost effective. It also made it easy for me to burn one sick day than try to schedule a whole weekend off. Looks like tv it is.
I just wish Virginia could take the opportunity and host all the games.
Downtown Richmond needs to clean up a bit before that happens
Richmond has squat for venues!
Live in Richmond. Agree with your statement wholeheartedly
University of Richmond had a great opportunity to capitalize when they built the new stadium, but I think its only 12,000.
Less, actually. Officially 8,700, but I'm not sure if that includes the temporary bleachers in the endzones they bring in for the students.
There's not really any way they could have made it bigger though - neighbors were against the on-campus stadium for traffic reasons, so the school more or less had to build the minimum they could. The road network in and out of the university really couldn't handle much more capacity anyway. For a school with an enrollment barely over 4,000 and an alumni base that is fairly spread out, I think the number works for them.
Exactly. UR wanted a smaller stadium. That was one of the issues they had with City Stadium, it was too big. UR is content right where they are in the FCS.
Used to live there, and I agree but I think they would be willing to reform somewhere downtown, possibly U of R as mentioned above, if a NCAA Championship came calling.
Watch out for the Camping World Stadium to be used for ACC Championship game if more pressure builds up. They saw how packed it got for Ole Miss vs FSU..
Imagine what an FSU or Clemson vs Miami or UNC or VT would do..
Been to the stadium...no thanks. Didn't feel safe at all, and certainly wouldn't at night. I don't think fan safety should be compromised for the sake of what the NCAA is trying to accomplish regarding discrimination.
Fan Safety LOL.. they have 2-3 Bowl Games their every year and MLS games week in week out with no problems.
If anything the people around their love it because football weekends/MLS Games and the Monster Jam race is a way for them to make some money and pay the bills or put food on the table for that month.
No problems that you know of, right? Watching the FSU-Ole Miss game, they mentioned that one of the players was from a really bad area of Orlando that was close to the stadium, and he watched his dad get shot and killed as a child. So, I think there's validity to my statement. When I went to a game there, the whole time my wife was saying she'd never go back because she didn't feel safe. Between Charlotte and the CWS in Orlando, I'll put my confidence in Charlotte every single time. I think it's hard to argue with that.
fair enough but that probably was 10-12 years ago as the kid is now in college... any place can be a sketch place it takes 1 person with bad intentions to ruin it.
Like I said they really have cleaned that area up within the past 6-8 years and its honestly not as bad as it seems. Yeah it might not have the downtown feeling that Charlotte has but it's not the slums either.
The new Orlando City stadium will be right up the road from CWS as well so obviously isn't that bad of an area.
I've been to multiple games at that stadium over the past 20 years and never once did I not feel safe. However your wife didn't feel safe so you will not be going back which is 100% fine.
I've been there at night with our kids. There is nothing about that area that is any better or worse than most large city venues.
I laugh when people talk about wanting to go to New Orleans. It doesn't get much worse in terms of safety.
Alright, I'll try to comment about only the sport angle...
If the ACC is forced to move there is going to be a monumental impact to the schools. Greensboro for basketball, Durham for baseball, Cary for soccer, Charlotte for football... Those are top class facilities that is easy for the majority of the conference to get to and those are just for the neutral site championships, as now you're taking about 25% of the schools themselves barred from hosting even the peripheral championships. VT could benefit, but most likely it would hurt us because the alternate facilities will all most likely be a further trip away for our fans than the NC venues unless they choose DC.
I'm somewhat shocked that businesses and sports leagues are actually going through with their threats. I can't think of another situation where so many businesses/events left a state over a law that didn't directly affect them. Will be interesting to see the economic effect of this law (if any) 5+ years down the road.
I read Charlotte taxpayers already paid out $40m in taxes to renovate The Hornets arena and surrounding area to secure the NBA All-star game which was previously stripped away. We've also lost out on a couple large companies moving regional headquarters to the area with thousands of job opportunities lost as well. And those are just the ones we know about right now, as I know the corporations within the RTP banded together and are making threats as well while negotiating with the government behind closed doors.
edit: meant to be a reply to ^ but yay mobile
Well, if the ACC decides to move its championship game for football, just play it in Charlottesville at Lane Stadium North. We know it will be vacant on whatever day it's needed, and it's just a few hours' drive for the eventual Coastal representatives.
How do you fill Scott Stadium? Make sure anyone but the cavs are playing.
Anything but the hoos are playing.
I believe Frozen drew quite the large crowd.
I'd prefer a venue which has experience in dealing with capacity crowds. Shame Duke and Wake would be excluded.
You forgot BMS!
So what about the 17/18 year?? Just testing the waters NCAA? Unreal. Not sure how this effects the NCAA at all. If they want to make a stand for something how about their own rules which so many teams have violated and gotten off with a slap on the wrist for whatever reason. The NCAA is a sham.
Five states plus numerous cities prohibit travel to North Carolina for public employees and representatives of public institutions, which could include student-athletes and campus athletics staff. These states are New York, Minnesota, Washington, Vermont and Connecticut
If Syracuse (not sure if any of our cities are indicated, but if Atlanta, for example had a similar law, they too would not travel to NC) were to make it to a championship game in any of the 7 sports indicated, they would have to forfeit.
This would seem to indicate that Syracuse can't play an away game at Duke, UNC, NCSt or Wake Forest in any sport as well.
Not sure what the solution to that is, and this is not a form to speculate on that. Removing the championship games allows all 14 schools to compete for a championship.
TLDR; Syracuse matters
Edit: Syracuse plays at Wake Forest on 10/8. Now I'm confused...
Syracuse is private, so they don't apply
Yep. It's a completely political decision.
Interesting news, but not much to talk about here...
14 sports have their championship in NC.
H/t to David Teel.
TIL that the ACC Tournament this year is going to be in New York
This thread should probably be deleted, but since it's up I'll give my two cents.
Edit: don't want to be responsible for sending TKP down the rabbit hole
http://www.thekeyplay.com/comment/451007#comment-451007
If Joe doesn't see an issue with it why should you? It's really not that hard to discuss this in terms of sports.
Well the ACC is headquartered in North Carolina, so I don't see them moving it just because of that.
They should move it to Miami because it's a destination location. The reason it never worked in Tampa or Jacksonville is because those places are boring to visit.
People want to go to Miami, it's beautiful there, there are topless beaches, the Miami strip is awesome.
That's a place that will sell out. Tampa and Jacksonville aren't sexy.
Indianapolis, Charlotte and Atlanta are not "sexy" either.
Charlotte and Atlanta work because of football watching destinations for either conference.
No one is spending money to go to Jacksonville when the loser was headed back there for a bowl game. Tampa wasn't a college destination either.
Atlanta won't work because SEC...
I didn't think the Taxslayer was that high in the ACC bowl picks. But I'd take Orlando, Jacksonville, Tampa over Phiily, NY or DC in Dec.
Taxslayer is a conditional tier 1 bowl, so it could potentially get the third best ACC team, assuming only one team goes to the New Year's Six, and then the Russell Athletic.
That is the problem with conference championship games in general. It's not fair to expect your fans to travel to that game and a bowl game within a month of each other.
Exactly why the conference championship should be played at the home stadium of the team with the better conference record
Nooo, PAC tried that and nobody liked it. Home team having to give visiting team tickets, upsettting season ticket holders. Visiting team having to travel with less support from fans and have visitior resources at game. Potentially poor venues as options: Wake, Duke, Cuse.
That's what the PAC12 did wrong - they tried to make one team's home game a nuetral site game. I'm suggesting that you treat it as a true home game. Visiting fans get the same amount of tickets that they would normally get. No need to disrupt season ticket holders. Visiting teams travel with the same amount of resources they normally would.
If you get 6-8 conference wins, then you deserve to host the championship game.
But what happens in the event of 2 undefeated teams that didn't play each other?
Common opponents? Sucks that the transitive property would be used to determine the "home" team. With the clusterf**k that the Coastal usually is, I could see this being a nightmare if you had an Atlantic champ at 6-2 and a Coastal three-way of 6-2 teams (is that mathematically possible?).
higher ranking, probably
ACC has to have a set of tiebreak rules in place. Last tiebreaker defaults to CFP Selection committee rankings.
Everyone said they enjoyed Battle at Bristol so much, let's just do it at RIR every year!
It meets all the criteria: it's had capacity crowds before, fairly easy to get to, and most of all richmond is certainly sexy*!
*i hear edgar allen poe is a real hit with the ladies, or something /s
Why is this not seriously being considered?
RIR said they have "looked at options" to do other events there, but some issues that come up. They don't want to remove tower in middle of infield, they have important spot in race schedule and won't give that up.
They wouldn't be able to fill it. VT and Tennessee did because tha fan bases are right there.
Va Beach - Bristol 6.5 hours
Chantilly - Bristol 5.25 hours
Charlotte- Bristol 3.5 hours
Raleigh - Bristol 4 hours
Clemson to Richmond - 6.25 hours
Columbia to Richmond - 5.25 hours
Louisville to Richmond - 8.25 hours
Tallahassee to Richmond -10.5 hours
Chapel Hill to Richmond - 2.5 hours
So the time involved for fans to get from their house to Richmond really isn't that big a time issue as you make it seem. Not to mention RIR only holds 71,000 total fans. For a football game that number would drop dramatically into the 55,000-60,000 range. Richmond if it had a workable stadium or at RIR would be a fine location.
then there's the fact that richmond has an airport and is on the east coast amtrak line. Getting to richmond is not hard.
I live here Richmond sucks for this. RIR is not vertical like BMS.
Fact. Also its track is longer than Bristol's which means fans will be further away.
Play VT-UVA or even VT-ODU at RIR, and you could fill it. Not to mention a large fanbase in Richmond, plus it's not that hard for NoVa and Tidewater to get there.
If the Tidewater can get an NBA arena without an NBA team, I'm sure they can get a football stadium going too.....
Maybe renovate and expand Harbor Park?
What NBA arenas are in the 757 though? The Coliseum and the Scope don't quite make the cut.
They are building a brand spanking new one next to the convention center
Huh. I hadn't heard.
Well, the area has been trying to get a major league team since forever. I figure having an arena shovel-ready is a much better way to do it than in years past.
Air Force Academy in Colorado Springs, please.
I hear Bristol Motor Speedway does a good job with football games. /s
Relevant:
OT: How do I make big pictures small? This is unwarrantedly large.
Do what you normally do to insert a photo. Then before you post, click just before the > and type
height=XXX width=YYY
Where XXX and YYY are the pixel dimensions. One more caveat, you want to keep the same ratio. I usually just open the picture by itself in chrome and it will put the dimensions in the title bar (say, 1920x1200). Then I'll just divide each by a factor. So I might do
height=240 width=384>
If the picture is 5x too big.
If the picture is on imgur, ignore the above and just add one of the following letters before the .jpg to get the desired size
s = Small Square (9090) as seen in the example above
b = Big Square (160160)
t = Small Thumbnail (160160)
m = Medium Thumbnail (320320)
l = Large Thumbnail (640640) as seen in the example above
h = Huge Thumbnail (10241024)
So picture.jpg becomes pictureh.jpg and shows at 1024x1024
Thank you kind sir.
At the end of the picture link inside the last ">", use a width=xxx
example of text between the brackets:
img src="https://scontent-lax3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/14212045_1251338121585769_..." /width=30
Also, and this is not a slam on you by any means because I obviously feel the topic is poisoned from the intrinsic nature of the topic, so avoiding it I think is inevitable -- that quote turns the conversation political in 2 ways.
Move the ACC wrestling tournament to Blacksburg
Moss Arts Center event has been a huge success for meets, I am sure they can handle the ACC tourney.
The limited seating may be prohibitive for the Tournament meet but it has been an excellent venue for regular meets. I have had a great time every meet I have been at the Moss Arts Center.
The economics of this fascinate me. Presumably, the cost of doing business will decrease in NC because of over supply of skilled workers, gov't subsidies, whatever that are driven by the need to fill the void left by boycotting companies. I mean, at what point does it become cheap enough to operate in NC that other companies move in or currently boycotting companies can't afford to continue?
You assume skilled workers will stay in NC. The current job/economic landscape is very mobile.
That's another dynamic that will be interesting to see. Who cares enough about the issue to move out of the state in protest? Who feels to tied to the state to move for whatever reason whether they have a strong opinion or not? Who is willing to look for more work in the state if their company leaves or will just pull up stakes and go where the work is?
Another interesting dynamic is what's happening in the university system. The ability of UNC, etc. to receive federal funds depends, in part, on compliance with federal law. It also has to comply with state law. The two are currently at odds, so what does this mean for the ability of faculty to receive grants, and for the university itself to receive necessary funds for administration? Add to the fact that UNC is still under probation from its accrediting body from the whole AFAM/athletics scandal and you have a seriously precarious situation that affects faculty hiring/retention, student enrollment and tuition costs, etc.
so, as a swing state, I wonder if it's more beneficial for NC to vote for someone who would likely relieve some of the federal pressure and let the state just have to worry about economic pressures or someone who would be willing to beat the state into submission which would then, presumably, relieve the economic pressure.
I'm sure it's a frustrating situation to be in down there, but it makes for some interesting study.
Doubt if it matters; the political economics at the national level are worse than the actual dollars and cents.
Objectively speaking on the issue:
As of yet, there is no actual Federal law at odds with HB2. Congress has not passed anything, and the Federal Court system will have it first hearing in November. The Obama administration, and thus the executive agencies, are at odds with the law and could revoke funding (e.g. from the DOE), but there is no law to support revokation. It would be a bold move, because the administration would only rely on policy grounds for this move. Previous funding revocation for civil rights were based on long-standing law, well after major Supreme Ct decisions (e.g. Brown v. Brd of Ed.).
But the administration argues that HB2 violates the Civil Rights Act and Title IX:
http://www.charlotteobserver.com/news/politics-government/article7560191...
This is what I was thinking of. But, I guess until a court actually settles that particular issue, it's an executive policy/interpretation issue rather than a "federal vs. state law" as I was thinking of it. Is that more accurate?
which is why I brought up who is in the White House come January. The administration is choosing to pursue this because they interpret the law a certain way. Another administration might not interpret it the same way.
To ye one and all I say... VOTE!!!!
Edit: Yeah, I know...political...sorry.
Yea. Definitely. This election will also set up the Supreme Ct for many years. Could easily see 3-4 justices retire in the next 4 years, in addition to Scalia's spot.
Yea, that's exactly right.
For trangenders to be discriminated against, either the Supreme Ct or Congress must identify them as a class of individuals and that this class is deserving of equal rights. As of yet, there is no legal authority to support that this notion. No authoritative court case or federal passed law has given transgender individual rights. That's not to say they do not exist, but simply their rights have not been legally recognized.
So, if the DOE revoked funds based on Title IX and the Civil Rights act, it would be because the agency interprets those acts to protect rights of transgender individuals. These acts, however, explicitly say no discrimination based on "race, color, religion, sex, or national origin" but not gender identity. Gender identity could also fall under these Acts, but because it would implicit, it's open to interpretation.
Thus, if DOE revoked funds, NC would surely sue the DOE for revoking their funding on an interpretation that's incorrect. Each side would battle for the correct interpretation of the law.
In sum, only Congress or Supreme Ct can explicitly grant equality rights to transgender individuals. Until then, transgender rights are an implicit interpretation that will undoubtedly have opposing views.
Not sure there is much doubt about the last question...that experiment has been conducted many times.
I can only speak for myself, but my wife and I have already had that conversation, and should my company pull up stakes, we would likely follow. Spent 14 months on unemployment after my previous company slashed jobs in 2010, and remembering how thin the job market was back then, even when Raleigh was among the few markets actually growing, I'm not about to allow myself to be in that situation again if I can help it.
Most of the skilled workers came to NC because the work was there. If it's not there, they will simply go to where it is. That's pretty much the reality of today's workforce.
I work for a large firm with a corporate campus in Charlotte, and have been asked more than once if I would relocate there for various positions. At this point in time the answer would be no. (Not specifically because of this bill, but the economic uncertainty that seems to be forming)
So what are the chances the first round games that were scheduled for Greensboro get moved up to Charlottesville and JPJ?
Would UVa even want to do that? If you host, you can't play there, and with UVa having annual hopes of a preferential seed (which they have gotten numerous times in recent years) would they want to sign up and remove a favorable location from where they could play?
I'll add here, and if my post is overtly political I'll accept the down votes as part of this great online Hokie Community...
Regardless of where any of us stand on the issue of LGBTQ rights and regardless of how we all feel about the bill, the ensuing results/outcome of the bill have been negative in a state where I spent quite a few years. NC is a wonderful place to live, work and vacation and it is a shame that all of this is happening.
I have nothing but wonderful things to say about the people in NC (other than maybe Larry Fedora:)) and I hope that this whole situation can be rectified in some way so that everyone who lives there can continue to have a thriving and productive society in which to live.
In the meantime, we should just move the ACC Football Championship to Blacksburg since the trophy will soon find its permanent residence there!
I moved to NC a year ago from Roanoke, and I can say that this bill has been a hugely frustrating thing to most residents. It's made our state look like we're run by a bunch of buffoons, and rather than try to reach a compromise the defenders of the bill have dug their heels in
If you read the NCAA's statement, they did a good job of pointing out that they are objecting to the full power of HB2, not just the "bathroom issue" that has people here in NC up in a tizzy.
The real crux of the issue is that it is now legal to fire/refuse service/refuse housing to people in NC if they are LGBT.
You point out the complexity of this situation. To some, it is a Political Correctness issue, for others, it is a state's rights issue, for some it is an economic issue, for others, it is a religious issue, for many, it is a civil rights issue, for all of us, it has become a political issue. But as VTMikeO points out, it isn't just a "bathroom issue", and it is unlikely to just all go away.
Can we say safety issue?? How are we to distinguish between a true transgender and a predator? How would you feel about a grown man being in the bathroom or shower with your daughter? Sure the bill should not allow someone to be fired or denied service based on beliefs/gender identity but I will put my children before being politically correct any day! Sorry if someone gets their feeling hurt using the bathroom based on PHYSICAL Gender. Delete this if you want down vote etc but those are my feelings on the subject.
The whole thing is moot because the Police Union of NC already said the law is unenforceable. If someone wants to go in the bathroom of their choice there literally is nothing stopping them.
What part of this
Is hard not to do? Read what I posted as the topic. Not your thoughts on the move BUT WHERE YOU WOULD LIKE TO SEE EVENTS MOVED TO.
too far
Edit: Removed in order to adhere to Community Guidelines.
Edit: Also removed in order to adhere to Community Guidelines.
I really don't think we need to keep going down this sub-thread, which was initiated by a textbook example of "what not to post on TKP when asked to be mindful that this is a hot-button topic."
Steve Addazio thinks this is a terrible idea.
Transgender people have been using the bathroom they identify with for years. Often times we don't even notice, because this is the most logical scenario. Wouldn't it be more of an issue having someone who has become a man in the women's restroom or someone who has become a woman in the men's restroom?
Maybe but, that is why last year, NC passed a law that said once you have made the change, just send a note from your doc to the state and they will alter your birth certificate so that it reads your newly changed sexual apparatus as your sex.
As far as the state is concerned you are not trans-gender once that has occurred you are legally, your new sex.
I will say that the blurry effect to an extremely down-voted comment is a very cool feature! I don't think anything has been down-voted enough for me to see it.
Must. Resist. Downvoting.
Been here 2 years and haven't seen that yet? Gotta TKP harder. /s
It's even broader than that. Filing any sort of anti-discrimination claim got three times harder once the law passed.
Other than some parking issues and traffic, I loved Navy-Marine Corps Memorial Stadium.
DC is probably the best alternative: it's something of a destination, the stadiums are set up for use, easy enough to get to for all teams, and the weather is comparable to what it's like in charlotte that time of year
after that i'd say orlando and philadelphia for permanent cities
another possibility is setting up a rotation of X number of in conference schools that host it.
more crazy idea: buy city stadium (22k seats) from Richmond, and renovate it to about 45-55k and lease it out to the city and use it for other events (i'm not sure that's even possible for a conference to own a stadium)
finally: just do what they did in Friday Night Lights (show) and play it in a massive field somewhere
I'm sure the Virginia Tech Foundation could buy a stadium. They own tons of commercial property.
Good. Get it together NC. Geez.
Ugh, I'm really hoping this doesn't keep the ACC tourney from returning to Greensboro. It's a whole lot easier to find tickets there than DC, and obviously a much better venue for 99% of us than New York.
It actually sounds like the ACC is going to strip the state of championship events as well. There is a President's meeting this week where it will be discussed and is likely that's how they will vote. At least that's the message that was on sports radio in Raleigh on the way home from work today.
ACC moving neutral-site championship games out of North Carolina due to HB2.
It's been a day, and the entirely predictable has unfolded.
The topic is clearly political, the political reason for it being stated in the very first sentence of the OP.
Overtly political statements in support of the premise have been uttered with no repercussion and no small amount of community approval by the like-minded, while statements against it met with the usual chorus of "don't politicize the issue."
Assertions have been made that are impossible to debate without discussing the very premise of the action the NCAA has taken.
I think it would be a good time for this topic to go away.
Seconded.
I disagree and not just because I started this topic. There is plenty to discuss here without getting into the issue itself. If we as a community can't discuss moving of ACC events, where we would like those events to move to etc then there are a lot of topics we can no longer touch on. Everything in some way involves sensitive topics like sex, polictics or policy. We should be able to as a community discuss these issues without breaking community guidelines.
It would have helped if the OP didn't start with the reason for the NCAA action, but it probably wouldn't have mattered.
There is what people should be able to do (stay away from a political angle), and then there is human nature, replete with the need to assert some dominance, ideological or otherwise, and the choosing of sides.
Finally, it's the internet. What you want or expect in response to something you publish is not even on the horizon of possibilities for many potential responders.
If someone can't overcome a need to "assert dominance" to talk about where they want to see the ACC Championship then I'm not sure they belong on this website anyway. It's not that hard to do, yet you have exacerbated the situation by not actually discussing what the topic was intended to discuss. You're one of the worst offenders here by your own standards. There's no reason we can't be mature Hokie fans and talk about host sites.
Thank you for demonstrating my point clearly.
Some don't agree with the premise of the NCAA's action, the premise the whole topic starts with in the very first sentence of the OP. They are told, essentially, choke on this bit of politics, and instead discuss something else.
Then, when my warning about the political nature of the topic is born out with many comments in support of either side of the premise, I am accused of being an "offender" of community rules and told I probably don't belong on the website.
This is exactly why topics like this are generally frowned upon and removed. The sense of community disappears when you start pointing at others and saying they aren't acceptable company to keep.
Some people did a great job discussing the topic without talking about the premise. Why do you feel the need to warn about political nature? Can you seriously not discuss a good host site for a championship game without getting into politics? It's just a little self control man, it's so easy. You're sitting here attacking people for not being able to avoid talking politics when you yourself can't even stay on topic. Do you not see the issue here?
We're all adults, we don't need someone telling us when a topic can be a hot button issue. It's quite obvious that it is, but some of us are trying (and doing a great job avoiding it). You're not.
But we already had a very lengthy thread about possible locations to relocate the ACC-CG to around the time that the bill was passed. Nothing really new has been added to that part of the discussion other than it affecting all sports, not just football. It's not worth the potential pitfalls to rehash all of that.
This isn't just about football anymore. There are 17 sports that will be effected in 2016/17. Not to mention NCAA level championship events.
Pretty sure I said that. Still doesn't change the discussion we previously had about alternative locations. You have stated that that was the whole reason you posted the thread. All that recent news really adds to the discussion is, "other sports, too."
The NCAA and soon the ACC moving all championship level competition out of NC to me is huge new information.
If anyone thinks the NCAA made this move because of their "commitment to fairness and inclusion" then I have a friend from Nigeria I want them to talk to.
The NCAA wants a stable platform on which to operate economically. That's it. That's the reason. Money.
They are not the first and will not be the last economic enterprise to exert their will to maintain the economic status quo that they want. For the NCAA that is a platform in which they do not need to worry about if fans, teams, universities, sponsors, celebrities, athletes or even other States refuse to do business with.
If the NCAA had a championship there and every sponsor pulled out, or heck even if 1 major sponsor pulled out they would be paying out the ass for it themselves. This is business 101. Don't do that.
I think everyone on here is letting their personal bias run their opinions on the motivation afoul. This, like most things, is about money. Take a step back and redirect the conversation to what it should be, which should start with a headline like this:
"The NCAA has just used a political mask to hide a major money leverage, if they pull all economics from NC then where should they redirect that money to and what market is going to be best to serve their return structure?"
this is the CORRECT question to ask.
NCAA doesn't fit with fairness and inclusion. See examples of handling UNC, Miami, etc
if the city of Virginia Beach had some foresight, they'd put in a bid to host the ACC soccer games.
we've got an amazing facility in the Hampton Roads Soccer Complex that sits on 75 acres of land with 19 grass turf fields. as for attendance, we're a hotbed of soccer talent with several traveling teams based in the area and the support of the community. plus, it'd be a great way for 757 high school soccer players to see some great college games locally. the weather's fairly cooperative year-round and we'd make a great substitute for
GreensboroCary.my two cents...
I wonder how the ACC would feel about moving soccer championships to DC United's new soccer specific stadium. Not to take anything away from the 757, but DCU's new stadium seems ideal when and if it ever gets built haha.
i'll take DC United's (future) soccer specific stadium and counter with Virginia Beach's Sportsplex; it's already hosted soccer/lacrosse/football/field hockey games. big plus: it's already built and has a track record of hosting championship games.
As I read this, I wonder what area would better suit the ACC? Think about it for a minute... If we (the ACC) really want to continue to elevate and compete with/be better than the SEC in football, why not figure out a way to get the ACCCG to the 757 where all these kids can see/be a part of that great atmosphere and venue?
I understand this would take a great deal of money and planning, but a long term plan to this end could pay huge dividends to ACC schools.
I hear Brazil has some brand new facilities that will remain completely unused for the foreseeable future.
At first there was much hesitation on the part of the NCAA, because they were worried about certain segments of the population. But things got smoothed over when they heard Ryan Lochte left after the Olympics were over.
Unless the NCAA can force the ACC to move their events, and I don't think they can, then what the NCAA does for NCAA events has no bearing on ACC specific events. If the ACC is going to move major events out of NC then they would also have to move their headquarters out, otherwise they're just spineless. The ACC is deeply ingrained in NC, which the NCAA is not. I would think the only way this get pushed is if either, multiple universities force the issue or if sponsors for the major events start pulling out. Any decision I believe would have to be voted on by the member universities.
Also, moving these events out of NC likely hurts the ACC more than anything, every saw how disastrous the ACC Championship games were when not held in Charlotte. The ACC Tournament moves around a lot but always does best in Greensboro or Charlotte. Ultimately this will be a financial decision, IMO.
I agree that ultimately the decision by the ACC will come down to financials. I don't see them removing events from the state of NC any time soon
...meanwhile....4 hours later....
haha...inorite?
I'm surprised..not sure where they'll move it to...not sure what will be available. I guess it's possible we'll see FSU and Pitt playing in Charlottesville come December
didn't the acc tournament do pretty well in DC this past year?
Local radio in Raleigh got into the details on why this was more of just a political decision by the NCAA....
Several states throughout the nation have banned non-essential travel to NC for public employees and people acting as representatives of public institutions. This ban has already impacted sporting events in the state, as at least a few schools had to cancel games against Duke and UNC in basketball, and those were just the ones that made the news because Duke and UNC basketball. If they hadn't stripped these championship events away, you're opening the door for the possibility numerous schools would have to pull out of NCAA sanctioned championship events over the next few years, which wouldn't be fair to any of the schools or students involved. This was the NCAA actually acting on behalf of and to the benefit of their member institutions.
No small part of the failures of the Jacksonville and Tampa years was due to the fact that the game was nationally irrelevant and the conference's biggest bankable programs (which also happened to be the most geographically proximate programs) were in the doldrums. The ACCCG is now prominent in the CFP seeding, and FSU and Clemson are resurgent. The tire might be ripe for a move back to the Sunshine State.
How about we move the ACCCG to State College, PA? There's a big stadium that sits unused that weekend every year and it's within walking distance of my house. Y'all can crash in the barn
Actually, that would be bad ass. The stadium, not your barn. But the barn could be hype too. Beaver Stadium is huge though and I'm not sure they could fill it. I got to visit Penn State when my wife was touring law schools. Wonderful, wonderful place but so so cold. (We went March 1)
Yup. Beaver Stadium holds 80K people. Dec 1 isn't normally too bad as far as cold is concerned, but it's definitely not a warm weather venue. Town probably has enough infrastructure/rentals to sustain an influx of people.
I thought it held like 106k
They say it holds 109k. But when you actually get in the stadium, your seat numbers are about 8 inches apart, meaning that it'll hold 109k babies. Full grown adults, figure on 80k.
Worst stadium experience I've ever had.
Relevant for football
ORL makes the most sense, no worry about NFL. Looked like the FSU/Ole Miss game went well.
And it makes a nice gesture to the LGBTQ community as well.
Apparently Orlando is hosting state football championships, so Camping World Stadium isn't available it seems.
i'd imagine those high school championship games will get moved for a million dollar or so ACC Championship game..
Yep, and it appears that's already the case. Supposedly, there's talk of moving them to UCF's stadium so that Orlando can host the ACC Championship.
looks at schedule of events from earlier today... can confirm.
"It's political!"
"It's not political!"
How about, "It's patriotic"? It's upholding the Constitution of the United States of America (Section 1 of the 14th Amendment, to be specific).
#goacc
Ok, now we've breached into an area in which there can be no response that breaks the rules of the TKP community.
You mean because his comment already violates the community guidelines?
DC please
While DC makes a lot of sense, I am loathe to do anything that will put money in Snyder's pockets.
That, and the fact that it would mean playing at the house of horrors known as FedEx field.
RFK baby!
This is the correct answer
If UMD wasn't such a trash emoji, M&T Stadium might've been in the mix too.
I'd rather keep money in my pockets than worry about Snyder's
He said DC, not Maryland.
I would bet the ACC has the team with better record host this season, and if nothing changes in the future find a permanent site next year.
I say that we run a bill through the NC House that annexes Charlotte Proper to South Carolina for a day.
Problem solved.
ACCCG will be at Orlando's Camping World Stadium per ESPN
Edit: I got excited and didn't totally read the notification on my phone. The stadium "has been contacted" to replace Charlotte as host. So not confirmed yet.
The alert I just got only said they have been contacted.
Yeah my bad, I can't read.
But they have to work out the conflict with the Florida State high school football championships.
They have options...if Orlando wants it they'll get it
Yeah don't believe for a second CWS is going to tell the ACC no for high school games with a max of 20k people.
I think UCF would snatch it up in a second. Bright House is a nice venue.
I'd prefer it to go to DC but I'll bet dollars to donuts that it's going to Orlando. Especially this year since you're almost guaranteed to get either FSU or Clemson versus a school like UNC, Miami, VT, or Pitt.
I moved from Orlando to Charlotte and possibly getting to see the Hokies play in the ACCCG was a nice benefit.
#$%&!
If you really want to make a difference, taking revenue from a corporation/state is the only way change will truly happen. I could care less about which NFL player kneels next during the national anthem cuz it doesn't cost anyone anything, but losing events that bring in a ton of profits is going to cost NC way too much money for them to stay stuck the way it is now.
More than anything, putting a hurt on the prospects of UNC or NCSU having any kind of home field advantage in any ACC or NCAA championship venue going forward was really the only way that HB2 was going to be changed. The concerts being canceled, the jobs being lost, the NBA All-Star Game being moved... None of those really impacted the general demographic of people who support that piece of legislature. But making it a certainty that UNC and NCSU would not be able to play championship level events near their homes, and especially for football and basketball? That turns the coils to broil.
Economic Sanctions 101.
People who say sanctions don't work, don't understand how sanctions work.
Steve Addazzio says you are all thinking too small.... Move the game to Ireland.... he attests to the fact that it's a great venue and maybe the ACC could get Notre Dame to finally join the conference if they could play for the championship there....
I gotta think South Carolina has got to be aiming for some events, either ACC or NCAA, (not football) now that they are out the NCAA dog house. NC needs to look at how well sticking to your guns worked for SC and NC has a lot more to lose, because NC has pro level venues.
will be interesting to see if it eventually impacts any league games, i.e., either a school or a team refusing to travel
It has, but not in football. NY is prohibiting non essential travel to NC, which affected one of the SUNY schools going to UNC or Duke in round ball.
This is my first experience of the phrase "prohibitive favorite" that I can recall. Neat phrase.
Also, Orlando in early December wouldn't suck. Take in Disney or Universal and a Hokies game in the same trip.
As someone who turns 66 tomorrow morning, I cannot tell you how old your post makes me feel.
Happy birthday!
Thanks, and a fine one it has been. Spent the morning doing Meals on Wheels with me wife, then shrimp for lunch and an afternoon Longmire season 4 binge with chocolate and Nacho Bugles and beer and a rum drink involved. Great day so far for the Fish home team.
The intersection of college sports and money is like the intersection of college sports and politics. I wish for separation of both but they are consistently and thoroughly intertwined. And, the more I think about either, the less appealing college sports is. So I try not to. Go Hokies!
Whelp, politics is the major reason VT got into the ACC...
We are all going to hell!
But at least we're enjoying the ride.
How bad could it be if all of the fun and interesting people are there?
"Id rather laugh with the sinners than cry with the saints, the sinners are much more fun".
The news in Atlanta just reported that Kennesaw State has been contacted about hosting lacrosse.
Ah, Kennesaw State University. Founded in 1963, this college boasts 350,000lb sculpture called Spaceship Earth, created by Finnish American artist Eino. The sculpture was commissioned by the Maxwell Family Foundation in memory of the late environmentalist David Brower. The sculpture was intended to be a permanent reminder to future generations to take care of their delicate planet.
In late December 2006, only three months after installation on campus, the structure collapsed. After the collapse, Eino attributed the disaster to vandalism, but later reports that surfaced associated the collapse with poor construction.
Boy did it ever collapse....
never send an artist to do an engineer's job...
#ACCCGDestination-rensics
From the Wikipedia article:
TIL there may be limits to what J-B weld can do.
Well I have attended 3 ACC championships, with one being in Jacksonville and wont be going to anymore. The fact that politics gets into everything just sours it for me. College football is something I love, but its slowly being ruined. Charlotte was a nice spot and had a good thing going. Moving this game is not hurting anyone except good people.
I wonder if they'll still offer the family 4-pack of tickets and food for a ridiculously low price, that they advertise on the ACC Network.