Mel Kiper loves him some Hokies! He updated his Top Ten for every position and it has some familiar faces.
http://www.espn.com/nfl/draft2017/insider/story/_/id/17666318/nfl-draft-...
Evans, who is 6-foot-4, came from a junior college and is an intriguing prospect. He has 13 touchdown passes to just one interception.
Ford is Jerod Evans' top wideout for the Hokies, with 24 catches in four games and averaging 15.7 yards per catch. He was stellar last season, too.
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I remember when you could actually read an article on ESPN without having to subscribe.
Not a shot at you by any means, I just hate that ESPN has put all of their remotely interesting content behind a paywall.
Just another reason to join the key players club!!
How dare they make money on their content
Yeah, they don't have much revenue coming in from anywhere else
Well they did massively overpay for the SEC media rights.
Yeah they should give everything away for free because they make money
How dare they try to make money on their content. Doesn't seem to be going too well these days.
For a company with the reach and demand for content that ESPN has, they have plenty of non-subscription means for revenue generation. There's a fine balance, but they should limit the paywall to truly premium content and/or services. If they start moving more and more basic content and coverage behind the wall, they can actually hurt themselves by driving away unique visitors that they could be serving ads to. Case in point, I used to read ESPN articles on football all the time, now I pretty much only use it to check scores. That's ad impressions they don't get anymore from non-subscribers who gave up on finding good content for free.
The draft ranking articles and recruiting articles have always been premium content.
Mel Kiper and "remotely interesting content" in the same sentence. Never thought I'd ever see that.
"oh, cool. lemme check out this list aaaand nevermind"
- me
"At least we got to see the first 5 senior QB's"
-said no one......ever
Sorry, forgot about Kiper being insider. He broke it out into 5 Seniors and 5 underclass men. Rogers #1 Senior, Hodges #1 Underclassmen, Ford and Evans both #3 Underclassmen.
What playing position was Rogers at? And Hodges was listed at TE, I assume?
Hodges was listed at QB naturally
(too easy)
Rogers was listed as a Fullback. And yes, Hodges at TE.
Hmm...no Bucky Rogers. That kid is talked about every game!
While it was just a snippit you quoted, just a reminder for all about not posting information from behind a paywall on here.
To me this is how posting about stuff that was behind a paywall should be done.
I'm already paying for ESPN. No chance I pay another fee to read Mel Kiper's opinions.
Especially since his opinions will change roughly 4,128 times before the draft. (Some allege that this has to do with contact between the agents of top prospects and Kiper's bank account)
When they are the most expensive part of your cable package and can confirm that they are already taking you behind the woodshed pretty easily it's pretty unpalateable to pay them any more for the occasional good tidbit.
That's great to see. We've got some good players.
I saw on a the ticker last sat that Bucky was the #5 TE this year for the draft. Didn't recall seeing anyone else. Glad to see they are getting recognized though.
Curious that he didn't have Teller on there, figured he would be our top OL prospect
No, he's only our second string OG. s/
I know Rogers is a senior but we could be a little screwed on offense losing all 4 of these guys for next season. Hopefully they continue to have success and decide to come back next year for a special run.
Hodges, Ford, Rogers who else?
I personally think it's a stretch but the article did list Evans
I don't think it's that much of a stretch if he continues to dominate like he has the last two games. He really is a third year QB considering how dominant he was at the previous level.
Man I just hope at a minimum he and Bucky stay. Ford would be nice too. Might be a devastating offensive setback to lose 4 guys like that without a lot of WR depth and with a R-Freshman QB in Jackson waiting in the wings.
I still don't get how these lists continue to leave Ken Ekanem off.
Give it time.....
Bumping this because in McShay's latest list both Evans and Ford are outside his top ten for the position.... Bucky also fell to 8th. I know these things are fluid and really do not matter too much, but its looking worse and worse for all three of them.
How tf does Bucky FALL after that combine. Also Ford will be fine.
also why is mister hairdo the expert for draft stock? this has boggled my mind for years
I have always wondered if anyone has gone back and done a comparison a few years down the road to see if his "top players" worked out as well as he thought they would.
Tradition mostly haha. But him and McShay aren't too far off usually. And since both of them have Evans and Ford off of their list, it seems to be a trend. Obviously we won't know until draft day but its just sad to read.
He's the main guy for ESPN, so naturally the most visible. There's plenty of other people who cover the draft, they just aren't employed by ESPN.
Maybe they watched a bunch of film and figured out that he cannot catch a ball without falling, jumping and/or doing a ninja roll?
Not sure why I thought of this:
because they probably watched his tape and saw he wasn't as productive as an elite player should be? He also isn't a true TE.
Just how productive should he have been? What about the numbers of the other guys ahead of him? Because the numbers suggest he was quite productive, by far our most productive TE in his first two seasons, and as an outside receiver he had pretty solid numbers as well, so I'm not quite sure where this narrative derived from? Was he supposed to have 1000 yards and 12 TD's every year? Especially in 2014/2015 that's just ludicrous to even suggest.
I'm not saying he's a polished route runner, and he doesn't catch the football as naturally as some guys, but his athleticism is through the roof and it showed at the combine.
comparing his production to other TEs when he isn't a TE is a joke. Bucky was a WR and was used as such. Compare his production to other top tier WRs.
If we want to start comparing him to OJ Howard, the kid from Miami etc who actually play on the end of the line and contribute as blockers then maybe Bucky needs to develop that skillset.
If he was so athletic maybe he could catch the ball without having to fall over and generate more YAC?
He was used as a WR this year, what about his 2014 numbers, when he was definitely a tight end who flexed out sometimes (which is normal)?
I just want to know what YOU think would have been acceptable production.
he was mainly used as a WR his whole time here. We listed him as a TE but he did very little blocking and showed minimal effort when it was called upon him to do so. Even when he was lined up outside as a TE on corners he couldn't sustain blocks.
As a WR with the mismatches and opportunities he had he should have been much closer to a 1,000 yard season which he never got close to. He should have been able to produce much more after the catch, but even when hit in stride he would slide to the ground in order to catch the ball when it wasn't necessary. He just doesn't seem to be a natural, or comfortable, catching the ball in stride. Jump balls are his thing.
And yet, I don't feel like he was our main target in the end zone because we had better pass catchers available when it really mattered (Ford, Cunningham, Phillips, even rogers)
Agreed that he didn't seem like our main target, but I think part of that came from teams scheming towards him and giving those other guys more favorable matchups.
i never got the feeling jump balls were his thing. sure they should have been just because of his overwhelming size advantage but bucky never learned to high point the football. he always catches it with his body which wipes away any height advantage he had. ford is a much better jump ball guy. I think that is the one area bucky must work on the most if he wants to be successful in the NFL is high pointing the football and catching with his hands. hes still new to the position so I don't think its out of the question but its going to take a lot of reps and some time.
Why use the word always, when you know that it categorically untrue. He does catch with his body sometimes, and struggles with consistently attacking the football, but you've got cloudy memory if you think anywhere close to even half of his catches were with his body. That is ludicrous.
He catches the ball far too often with his body, isn't particularly good at high pointing the ball, and has a strong tendency to go to the ground after catching a ball while moving downfield.
Better?
Here's the issue, being a physical mismatch doesn't mean the offense is going to dictate an overwhelming amount of plays to you, especially when there are other quality options in Phillips and Ford, both of whom will also likely play on Sundays. In fact, as you alluded to above in the question of his use in the EZ, his presence alone can help create mismatches for other players. I think given that he got fewer looks than Phillips and Ford, he was very productive with what he was given (higher YPC than either of the other two). I also think our limited route tree/what Evans was comfortable with could have limited a lot of the stuff over the middle with him. Evans never looked comfortable throwing over the middle of the field, which hurt attacking that middle intermediate area of the field where Bucky once again will have size/athleticism advantages over safeties and linebackers. The only times we attacked the middle was on RPO's when Evans was throwing to a wide open player as a result of the run action, or that play where Bucky made an amazing one handed reverse direction catch against Duke to save an almost sure interception.
Not sure what part of the combine you are referring to but Bucky looked terrible in the pass catching session. Both his route running and hands were a problem. On one curl route, it was clear that you were supposed to pass the first cone, come back to the closer cone and then go back up field after catching the ball. Bucky never made it to the first cone, which left him going flat across to be by the second cone, and then the pass went right through his hands. On both his attempts at the Corner Route, he came up short of reaching the ball including ending up on his face on the second attempt. He wasnt alone though on this route making TE look bad so it may have been the passer as well. But just about every route he ran, it was clear he was not as crisp at the cuts required as many of his counterparts. I know he had incredible measurables at other events but he might have been better served skipping the route running session.
BINGO
The combine exposed every single thing about Bucky that'd I have been preaching for years. He runs bad routes and he c-a-n-n-o-t catch the ball without falling over to secure the ball with his body (cue a gif showing him catching one pass with he hands). Tight Ends get blasted in the NFL because they are constantly targeted in the most congested part of the field so his lack of solid hands is HUGE.
That is exactly why I thought Bucky should have stayed at least one more season. Yeah, he had great numbers and is a great athlete. But he is not yet an elite player...
I'm not sure he would have benefited from the extra yr; he improved very little from the beginning of '14 to the end of '16. I think he is what he is and I've long suspected NFL teams would think that way too.
I've been saying for a long time he's a tweener skill-wise - and tweeners don't do well as well many think come draft time.
Because combine numbers are valued far more by fans than by real scouts and GMs?
Not surprised that Bucky and Evans fell. I will say that if Ford falls beyond the 4th round, he automatically becomes the biggest steal of the draft. He may not be a star, but I don't see how he doesn't have a long, productive career if he stays healthy.
depends on how far joe mixon falls...
Question for the community at large:
Why are 3 players, who aren't even slated to go early 2nd round, leaving early for the draft? Do they think they got too much physical punishment in Fuente's offense? I just don't understand the thought process. You don't really get a whole lot of guaranteed money at the 3rd round and below level. The whole thing, especially Evans seems...odd.
Ford: what more can he do at Tech? He owns all (most?) relevant records and would have a new QB throwing to him next year which might affect his numbers. Also, risk of injury.
Hodges: the NFL is willing to take someone his size and train him up a little while paying him (though maybe not as much as if he were an early rounder). Also, risk of injury.
Evans: losing two of his primary targets and part of his O-line. Will have a legitimate QB competition now that Jackson can't just red shirt. Wants to start getting paid. Also, risk of injury.
There are certainly reasons for all of them to stay, but that's what I see as why they declared early.
I certianly buy your arguments for Ford and Hodges. But the issue for me is Evans. I do understand that would have lost his 2 biggest targets but we'll reload at WR. There was no way he wasn't going to be the starting QB though, he had a very solid year and it's not like a 3rd Vick is sitting on the sidelines or something. I hope he wasn't thinking about anything like that.
I wonder if he just saw his season from the eyes of someone who was playing at a small college and then had a great season at a top tier university and figured the only next step was the NFL. Wish he stayed, it would've been huge for his draft stock to have a 2nd year under his belt.
#sauces - Evans said after the Belk shopping spree before the bowl that that was the first time he's ever really been able to go into a store and just get whatever he wanted and he really liked that feeling.
Even if he gets picked up in a late round or as a UDFA, he'll be making good money compared to the rest of the world. Might have been a short sighted decision, all things considered, but I totally get it.
Evans won't necessarily be making "good money" as an UDFA. He will need to actually make it through all the cuts and sign with a team (which I have my doubts he will be able to do).
I love the kid and he was exactly what VT football needed last season, but his upside as even a 3rd string NFL QB is very low IMO.
Although I will never hold it against a kid to make a decision like this (only he knows all the nuances of his situation), I do think this one was shortsighted and ill-advised.
Probably bad advice from agents, advisors, friends and family. But who knows, I am sure each of them has their reasoning. Fuente seems like a pretty good guy so I don't think there is anything sinister like you are implying but anyting can be going on during closed meetings and practices that we are not privy too. $$$ in your head can make one do silly things, and ~21 year old kids probably don't have a good concept of guareenteed vice non-guarenteed money. Ford and Hodges are likely going to make rosters as 5th or 6th wr's, and Evans should be able to latch on to a practice squad so maybe that money is good enough for them to go?
Simple answers for Ford and Hodges:
1. Coming back you risk catastrophic injury playing a violent sport
2. Ford's best skills: utilizing his catch radius, attacking the ball, and route running, aren't going to get much better with another year, and he isn't going to get faster either (at least not significantly) so he's developed and ready to play in the NFL. I think he will be successful regardless of where he ends up getting drafted.
3. Hodges is mostly #1. He could certainly become a better route runner, be better at attacking the football, but he can hone those skills while getting a paycheck. The primary benefit of coming back would likely be that next years tight end class won't be as freaky athletic as this years, rather than an increase in his personal skill set.
If Hodges had stayed for next year he would be listed as a WR in next years class not a TE.
This is meaningless. Fans, sportswriters, and bloggers care about what position someone is listed. GMs, scouts, and coaches care about what position someone can play. And in many ways he doesn't have a position.
Thus Hodges' problem.
It's likely the threat of injury. You couldn't go five seconds last season without hearing about concussions. This was even a season that saw guys like Fournette and McCaffery skip bowl games in order to maintain their health for their pro careers. If you have a chance to go out and get paid before some injury does you in and you have all this chatter around the sport about career ending this and career ending that, how can you not get spooked about the possibility of something happening and you never making it to the NFL?
You play college ball until you can make a NFL roster then you go get drafted before that window goes away due to injury.
All good answers. I just always thought the rule of thumb was: First/Early Second - coaches practically throw you out. After that, build up your stock. Things change I guess
You play little league for free.
You play high school ball for free.
Outside of the SEC, you play college ball for free.
Once you feel confident that you're assured of playing professionally for money, go grab the brass ring.
In a lot of ways, it's not different that most other professions. Could I have made more money by staying in school to get a Master's instead of entering the workforce after getting my undergrad diploma? Sure. But getting paid is getting paid. It's an awfully big lure.
Could not disagree more with this premise of playing for free, especially with all the friends and family I see struggling with student loans 10-15 years after they have graduated. If they utilize their 5 years of eligibility they can get multiple bachleors and/or a Masters for free which will set them up for life as long as the degree is not in underwater basketweaving.
There is no perfect answer for many players on whether to come out early because they can't predict the future. They don't know when they'll be drafted, they don't know if they'll get injured, they don't know how things will play out the next year if they stay (could something happen - an injury to another player, a coaching change, etc - that changes their role in a disavantageous way to their draft prospects) and so on.
It's a gamble for most players.
I've said:
- Hodges should go because he is what he is and another year won't make a difference. But he wasn't likely to go as high as many think.
- Ford should probably stay because another year won't make much difference skill-wise, but it could make an appreciable difference physically. And as a TRUE Jr, much of his draft competition would be 1-3 yrs older and more physically mature. This combined with his less than imposing speed would hurt his draft stock. Injury is the primary drawback for him; he (and VT) was lucky in his time at VT in this regard.
- Evans? Makes no sense. There were so many drawbacks to him entering the draft and so few benefits that he is basically playing for an inside straight.
I will never pay for ESPN content. Total waste of money imho. You can easily find similar information (mock drafts for example) elsewhere and most of the information is just on opinion that is and most likely changes/wrong.
http://sports.yahoo.com/news/nfl-draft-qb-rankings-mitchell-trubsiky-des...
Sounds like so many of us on here in this evaluation.