So with the dominance of our pass defense thus far this season (second nationally in pass defense, first in passing efficiency), how much do you guys credit that to the new staff that's been brought in? To young players getting more reps? Other factors entirely?
Personally I feel like the new personnel have provide as much of a spark within the defense as the offensive production (and therefore lack of pressure on Bud) has. Thoughts?
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I'll be completely honest...I think our great pass defense can be attributed more to pass rush than to lock-down DB play
Don't get me wrong, I think our DBs are solid...but I just don't think any of them are truly stand-out top flight DBs...I'm not sold on them being great. I think our improvements in the front 7 have had a bigger impact on the passing defense than anything
Agreed about the front 7 being the main catalyst for an improved defense, but I would argue that Mook is/has the potential to be great.
Definitely right on with Mook, he has really been turning heads this year.
Agree completely on Mook! I personally would put Terrell Edmunds in that category with Mook, he has fantastic potential, dude is an absolute animal.
I think so far Mook has been nothing short of great, and potential wise, we have great guys all over. Facyson is a known commodity and if he stays healthy I expect him to see a stock rise come draft time. Stroman and Alexander are both great athletes and are flashing a ton of great potential. Alexander is built such that he could become an elite shutdown man corner down the road. I really liked Terrell at corner last year, but I think he has adjusted really well to safety. Can't forget Clark, he's experienced, been through the ringer, and lays the wood.
I think it has more to do with new offensive staff, so the defense isn't feeling as much pressure and can play much looser. Giving up a big play isn't as big of a risk when the offense can go score right away.
Its a combination of many things.
1. The secondary all having experience from last year. Last year Mook, Stro, Adonis and Terrell were all new. Now they have confidence in what they are doing.
2. The front four have been able to get pressure and stop the run more consistently without stacking the box. Even getting pressure on three man rushes. So now in a third and long we can drop 7 or 8 back into coverage more frequently.
3. Buds desire to go back to more zone looks. That has a lot of explanation in itself, but to make it short, not needing to hold the opposing team to zero to have a chance to win has allowed Bud to put less pressure on the corners, have more eyes on the ball, and keep the ball in front of them.
4. I'm not sure how much Mitch has done to help the secondary. Someone who knows corner techniques will probably have an answer to that.
5. Fear of getting hit by Chuck Clark.
He will knock the dog out of you.
To expand a little bit on
and #2, the improved performance of the front 4 against the run/QB contain have allowed the secondary to complete their assignments without having to keep an eye out for a rusher breaking free.
They can do their jobs with confidence and that really feeds on itself positively.
I think kff11 has hit on the key points above.
To expand on strategy: I think Bud's aggression with the Bear has been modified this year - we saw in French's breakdown where he is using strategical blitzes that offer some backdrop of support in order to prevent big plays. More zone this year has been huge. We have been able to bracket players and it is yielding results. No doubt we are more stout up front with more discipline. Truly a thing of beauty.
is "strategical" the new "irregardless"?
No. Irregardless is a word!
and it shouldn't be. Coincidentally, strategical is also a word...and shouldn't be
"strategical" is the new "trickeration"
The entire weight of the program isn't on the defense's shoulders anymore. Above all else, I believe this is what has us playing better this year.
Yes, the new coaches are great, and I'm really not surprised to see guys like Motu bring their game to the next level with a year of experience under their belt, but just knowing that its ok if you aren't perfect for that one play because the offense is more than capable of bailing you out allows you to play a lot looser and allows you to not dwell on an off play here or there during the game itself.
As opposed to years past, one off play isn't the potential difference between bowl eligibility and LOLUVa status. That has to mean a lot
to be fair, schools like UNC and even Syracuse can usually depend on their offense to put up numbers to keep them in the game, but their defense still sucks. We legitimately have a good defense, maybe not elite (though who knows, if we continue to shut down teams I may change my tune), but it's not like the safety net of a good offense is what's making them play awesome.
Oh, agreed.... I actually think our defense has always been good, and we even had a good defense the last few years, but the weight of the program being on their shoulders just was too much to carry and it overwhelmed them a bit, making them look worse than they really were. Now that the offense is lighting up scoreboards, the defense is rounding into the form it should have been all along.
And I completely agree with what you said. Seemingly every time you've seen a team with a great offense in college football its backed by a bad defense, going all the way back to when WVU, Texas Tech, and Oregon kicked it off nearly 10-15 years ago. And that's where we differ from the pack. Yes, we have an offense that can light you up. We also have a defense that can shut you down. I ran the numbers over the summer, and found if we are able to break 31 points in a given game, last years' defense would have won us the game. We're destroying that value this year, and our defense is lowering the bar on what we need to accomplish to win. If we can keep up this rate of play for multiple years on end, right now we have the formula to legitimately contend for a National Championship.
Which is insane to say for a team that was barely scraping above .500 the last few years
There's something to be said for forcing a team to play from behind, particularly in the second half. If you know that the offense is feeling rushed to score, and is more than likely going to have to throw the ball to make plays, the way you play defense changes. The ability for the D line to pin their ears back and rush the QB can get the offense behind the sticks. This in turn allows the secondary to play a softer coverage and allows chances for the LB's to play some underneath coverage where they can jump routes and make plays.
100% this. I think that our offense has a lot to do with the caliber of play that we are seeing from LPD. When your offense can hold onto the ball longer and produce points consistently.
For instance, take the TOP stats from Saturday's game. VT possessed the ball a lot longer than UNC. This rests our defense and gives them the ability to catch their breath before coming out on the next series. If you watch the body language of the tar heel defense towards the end of the game you will notice that they were tired and were unable to preform like they did in the 1st quarter. This has been our case in the past. Our defense was constantly out on the field, placed in horrible situations, and mental errors began to happen.
This makes me appreciate Bud a lot more because of what he was able to do in the years where we ranked in the top 10 nationally in defense but were in the 80s-90s on offense. We are onto something here, boys.
My answer: Yes!
Simply put, I think it is due to a wholesale culture shift. Offense, defense, special teams, training, conditioning, preparation, etc.
Han...RIP
Also, unlike last year, all of the starters are healthy (knock on wood). We seem to forget all the injuries last year, including Kendall Fuller, that forced Bud to play inexperienced guys and move to a more vanilla defensive scheme.
Came here to say this. I've been saying since the beginning of this season that if the defense can stay healthy, it allows Bud to throw more zone looks at a defense -- something that is deadly when used by Foster.
From my perspective, it seems like the secondary knowing where to be
has helped quite a bit. I remember last year, game after game we'd have
errors lining up, etc. Now it seems like everything's been tuned in.
There are many factors that make a DC's job much easier. In our example, better line play, better linebacker play from Moto, and increased chemistry and experience in the secondary have all contributed to Bud being able to call games differently and is allowing him to play his chess match a little more with the opposing offense because he trusts his guys to execute and not make alignment/mental errors consistently.
Another example, the last three years Clemson has had elite defensive line play, enormous, fast guys that are all at least 275 lbs and it has given Brent Venables a tremendous amount of slack in his line. I think there have been glaring weaknesses in their defense each of the last three years, but they are covered up for the most part by superb line play.
I think our 2-deep on the front four has also panned out better which us allows to rotate without much of a drop-off. I also agree with others that the defense being able to play a bit looser due to the offenses capability has a play in it. As stated above, Bud said he wanted to get back to more of a zone look. However the past few years injuries and inexperience hurt us in employing that. We have guys with experience and everyone is relatively healthy as well. The front 4 (8 really) are playing great and LB play has improved dramatically as well. I also think new blood in the defense coaching staff plays a role as well. I don't go to practice so it's hard to know exactly what the new defensive coaches are doing as opposed to old and we only hear from Bud in the media. But either way I like it.
You bring up a good point. We haven't seen or heard a lot from any of the assistant coaches. Even on Tech talk live we only hear from Fuente. I for one would like to hear more from coach Corn and the others.
I think the defense feeds off the offense, and vice versa. It has to help boost the defense that when they force a turnover or get a big stop, they know the offense is going to do something good with the ball.
Also, when the defense rarely does give up a big play, it's not the end of the world because we're already up a bunch of points(e.g. ECU early 3rd qtr).
It seems unlikely having a more effective offense significantly contributes to performance on the other side of the ball. It is clear that this season the execution by individual players is much better, with more sound fundamentals, proper alignment, fitting gaps, tackling etc... And I can't imagine a causative link back to the offense to explain that kind of change in performance. Yes, the defense feels better about where the team is but I don't see that driving better execution.
Then you have to take Coach Bud Foster at his word. He always preaches playing experience. This is definitely a much more experienced defense. This has allowed Bud to mix up the scheme more effectively, run more zone and blend zone and man looks. The play of the d-line and the linebackers, many of which are talent upgrades, has led to solid run defense and pretty good pressure on the passing game, thus less need to press with bear fronts, putting more eyes on the football in the back end.
Good coaches coming in has probably contributed some as well. But from my perspective as a fan, the S&C has been huge in reducing injury and guys just look faster and appear to have more gas in the tank at the end of games.
We love our new found offensive production but I think its impact on the resurgent Hokie defense is minimal at best. We should give credit where it is due.
I think it comes down to high risk, high reward type of plays. Let's say there's a play where the defense can be aggressive and stuff the other team behind the line. The flip side is that if they miss on that play, the other team gains 60 yards. So, either they take the risk and blitz anyway, or they play it safe, and let the other team gain 5-10 yards.
I feel like the defense is willing to take their chances, because the offense has a better chance to bail them out in case of the big play.
That, and we're playing with bigger leads this year than last. Our margins of victory last year were 39 (Furman), 27 (Purdue), 15 (NC State), 16 (Boston College), 2 (GT), and 3 (UVA and Tulsa).
This year, we have 23 (Liberty), 49 (BC), 37 (ECU), and 31 (UNC).
Plus, Bud essentially got a new job, so I think there was a refreshment that came along with that.
I can see your logic but if anything, I think most of CBF's schemes have been less aggressive this year. I seem to be seeing more cover 2 and a lot less placing our corners on an island in 1v1 man this season.
Regardless, while the more potent offense may have some impact on defensive play calling, I think that really misplaces where the credit should go.
Bud and his staff, coupled with more experienced even more talented players should get the bulk of the credit for the turnaround this season. Along with the new S&C program, less injuries has been huge. (Obviously luck has some role in that as well.)
Let's just give credit where credit is due. IMHO or NSHO
Edit: Typo
Sure is amazing what our defense can do when they don't have to stay on the field the entire game.
I think we just lack depth at certain positions on D (CB and LB) to truly be elite there. Our first string i'd argue is second to none, but weneedmoredogs.jpg. Since our O actually is playing well this year our depth on D hasn't been exposed just yet.
Same with O wrt depth. We're great on O but we're no where near elite there either. Obviously need more depth at WR, TE, and OL - and RB just need to be consistent.
LB depth is a huge place of need. Hopefully our renewed success will attract some LB talent back to Blacksburg. I hope we can make a push for Teradja Mitchell, he seems impressed with our resurgence, but he will be hard to snag.
He does but he retweets the performance of every team that he likes, so I can't tell whom he's giving lip-service to.
I'm more optimistic about Dax Hollifield. He's visited several times already, too. But, I would never complain about Teradja Mitchell becoming a Hokie.
Seems like the next FSU snag from VA.
who wouldn't want to play for that amazing FSU defense!
Valid point.
I'd argue that we have plenty of depth at RB. Mac, Juice and Shai have all started. Plus Rodgers as a fill in on occasion, and I bet Peoples could as well if needed. Also McClease, but IIRC he is hurt.
Edit: I read that wrong thinking you said we need more RB depth.
Can never have too much O-line depth. One of those guys goes down and it can hurt the entire offense.
1. The experience in the back end allowing them to play zone instead of man free
2. The DL is playing great and getting pressure
3. We played Liberty, BC who has a serious talent deficiency, and UNC in conditions where you can't throw very well. ECU we just dominated.
Not having to be perfect means Bud can take risks, like having Motu cover the slot rcvr on 4-11 in the UNC game. Its not like the game was on the line at that point if UNC converts. It also allows the guys to grow a little bit and feel comfortable in the wrinkles, which in turn will scare the pants off future OCs.
Blitzes, twists and fakes coming from EVERYWHERE.
BTW, I love the late shift the D-line is using to creating havoc and false starts up front this year.
It might be an unpopular opinion, but I think some of it has to do with our level of competition so far. I love that we have locked opponents down in the passing game, but the only real opponent we have had so far is Tennessee (which still passed for less than 100 yards).
UNC in the rain was a dominant win, no doubt, but not really indicative of how things would have gone in less than a hurricane environment in my opinion. ECU was a sweet ass whooping regardless of location.
Real tests coming up in Syracuse and Miami, hoping they can keep up this play.
I really love this defense. The whole is greater than the sum of the parts. We have had better defensive lines and better lock down DBs on the field at the same time. But this unit is assignment sound and has eliminated the gashing big plays.
I have a question: where does our defense (secondary in particular) rank, so far this season, in terms of INTs?? I'll be honest, I wish I could see more picks from Facyson, Mook, Alexander and Clark.
Agree the improved line play, linebacker, and experience in the secondary have all helped, and allowed Bud to do more what he wants to do. I do think playing with a large lead, where opposing offense have to look more for big plays, helps Bud in calling his defense. Not so much in agreement with depth. We are thin enough at LB an injury could hurt, but our back-ups are getting a lot more reps than in past seasons, and I feel we are better than the past several seasons when it comes to our depth. I also think we are in a better position on health and depth because our starters have been on the filed less, and are fresher/less dinged up at this point in the season, due to the offensive production. I also agree we have been helped from the schedule/other factors, and the Miami game will give us a better idea of where we really are vs good offenses. I don't believe Syracuse has the line play to be a good indicator, and I don't see any elite passing teams on the schedule after Miami.
I haven't heard much mention of Facyson. Which is usually a good thing for a DB-- but still.
Has he been playing well? He showed so much potential as a freshman.
I mean props to the new staff buttttttt Torian Gray the dean on DBU has florida as the #1 pass defense in the county. just saying.
Not after last week's games
UMass
Kentucky
North Texas
Tennessee
Vanderbilt
Sh!t, I'd have the best pass defense in the country too
We shall see who is best after the 12th game.
And had they played pass-phobic LSU, it would have gone higher still.
TG inherited DBU. Bud is the reason it even exists.
The bottom line to me is that this team is playing like A TEAM. There isn't one side of the ball that isn't doing their job in the grand scheme of things. You have to say that that is a tribute to the change in coaching culture. This culture change has had a positive effect on the defense.
That's really a great point. In Bud's D, heroball leads to giving up big plays. You have an assignment, trust the other players and domination will ensue.