ESPN doesn't have a link for replay, but did anyone else catch "Kevin's Korner" on ESPNU's College Football Sunday show? Kevin Carter called out the VT fans who have been giving him grief on Twitter for his "Miami has dudes, but VT doesn't" comments, the Sunday after da U lost to FSU.
As a person who's been a contributor to those tweets (I've been very respectful, just pointed out the flaws in his statement), I was proud that I could help make an impact.
He gave props to what VT is doing, but pointed out that we need a marquee win before we profess that we are serious contention for the ACC and Play off discussion. I don't disagree with that assessment. My issue was concluding that Miami had "dudes" based on their 1st 4 games vs cupcakes and a loss to an FSU team that clearly isn't as good as its been the prior 3 seasons.
Comments
This is the issue with ESPN, they hype up teams then we beat them and then they claim they aren't marquee wins. They hyped the hell out of UNC but then say we need a marquee win. Call Miami full of dudes but it's not a marquee win. You can't win with ESPN. Who gives a shit what they think.
You can't win with ESPN.
True. The very definition of a necessary evil.
Who gives a shit what they think.
Unfortunately, a lot of folks do. And when we get people like Herbie (mad respect, for the most part) and Heather F. Dinich (ummmm...) saying "show me something"? And then Syracuse happens? It makes them look like geniuses. We all know this is a storyline for VT.
The argument that the UNC win is somehow lessened by the hurricane is utter BS; both teams played in the exact same conditions and one team scored 34pts and one scored 3. And aaaaaall we'll hear as UNC keeps winning is "yeah, and their one conference loss is bunk because it was raining really hard".
All the more important to keep the heads down and focus focus focus on Pitt. Thursday night at Heinz is the program's biggest game in 4 years. I think we'll be ready -
Exactly. We haven't proved anything by my standards, but my issue is with their double standard. Winning cures all. Win out and it's fine. Stumble against easy teams, they're right. It's all just noise right now and not worth worrying over. Just enjoy what we got!
Easy to say, hard to do. We're all here to worry and wring our hands and 'what if' it to death. We get ahead of ourselves. We put the treadmill before the horse, and the result is a 14-pt loss (& it wasn't that close) in a game we should have won by 20.
So you're right - winning answers all questions simply and emphatically. We're not looking for miracles (yet), we've just gotta beat teams we should beat.
Well said.
If Miami hadn't lost two games in a row this would have been a marquee win. I didn't see anyone hype up miami after they lost to unc and fsu consecutively, and so the win was diminished. No one's out to get us, Kevin's assessment was spot on.
The OP states that Kevin said "Miami has dudes and VT does not" even after their loss to FSU . So VT then beating the team that "had dudes" 5 days earlier doesn't say anything about VT, but only downgrades Miami? I honestly don't care but that's the definition of "a damned if you do damned if you don't" situation.
You know what would make outsiders respect our team? Not losing to Syracuse. Our team needs time to grow. It's the first year under a new coach in 30 years for our program. It would have been the miracle of the century to go undefeated. The fact that we have a solid chance at a 10 win season in late October should be celebrated by us, but it's really not that special to anyone else. Enjoy it, and shut out the outside noise.
Happily, I'm quite confident we won't lose to Syracuse again this year.
I believe we can mathematically still meet them in Orlando. That's nearly impossible though, the Coastal division is pretty top heavy, not sure if Tech could pull that off./s
So am I! Buzzketball is on the rise.
I thought he clarified that Miami has more dudes was about more 4\5*s. He's right, Miami was down 3-4 DL but were still sending out 4/5*s.
And he's right, there is a talent gap between us and Clem/FSU/Louisville. But I'll worry about that problem if we get there.
For now, our dudes 37, miamis dudes 16.
I must've texted "SO MANY ATHLETES" to my Hokie crew 10 times during that game.
This is what worries me about Richt landing at Miami - they might have finally found a guy who can actually make the *'s translate to success on the field.
Just not this year. ))))))))
UGA waited for that to happen for how many years?
Lots of success at Georgia. I know, I know - no Nattys. But consistently relevant. Division winners. Top 10 rankings. High-tier bowl games. In a conference that has DOMINATED the national conversation.
That kind of success is waaaaaay more attainable in the Coastal. I'm pretty sure he understands that...
Right but just like that wasn't good enough for UGA the "fans" at the U won't accept that either. They want the 1980's back.
Yeah, me too. Back in '82 I could throw a pigskin a quarter mile.
You guys come across anything like, time travel while you're out there in cyberspace?
5 Div champs, since 1992 doesn't = "consistently relevant. Division winners." to me. Several of those 5 appearances were teams that were picked to finish 3rd or lower in the SEC East.
The fact that they've had consistent top 10 recruiting classes and playing in the SECCG 5 times 24 years, in what is normally a 2 horse race for the SEC East isn't relevant. They've had good teams, but nothing close to what they should have had given the talent that they've brought in.
Im a UGa fan 2nd. They basically won when UF and UT were both down. Richt always lost the big game. Like he has this year.
I was too lazy to check to see how good UF and UT were in those 5 years, but suspected that this was the case. I didn't want to offend anyone who is a fan of UGA (though I can't understand why anyone with a brain would be)
Every team that doesn't win the division is having a down year in comparison to the team that does.
Miami won a Natty in '01 and lost in OT in the title game in '02. Haven't been heard from since. Are VT's ACC & Coastal titles diminished in your minds? Because they were all won, according to this line of thinking, while The U was "down".
I'm not willing to concede your 1st sentence. LSU and Bama have battled for the west in most of the years after the divisions were in place. For the vast majority of those years, neither was having a "down year" when they didn't win the division. The "down year" reference above is a matter of UF and UT both having multiple losses in conference (in division usually, too) and quite possibly a loss out of conf, so they weren't really in the division race.
Fine. In the SEC West, it doesn't apply. But no rule applies in the SEC West - because, Alabama is the rule...
But what of the rest of it? Because if the "everyone else was down" argument is applied to Georgia, talk to me about VT (5x Coastal champs, 4x ACC (no divisions in '04)), who has played, since 2004, in a division with (in descending order of success):
GT (3x Coastal, 1x ACC (vacated));
UNC (1x Coastal);
Duke (1x Coastal);
Pitt (joined in 2013);
Miami (not a single thing in the ACC, ever);
and UVaaaaaahhhhh I can't even make my thumbs type the words they're such a joke.
We lost a conference game in every ACC title season except 2010 (when we lost to James Madison).
I'm not saying that our success is diminished in any way. You don't win like we won from '93-2010 by virtue of luck. What I am saying is 'be careful about slagging off teams who had some great seasons during their rivals' "down" periods'. Because someone from outside this fan base could say the same about VT - and they'd be no more wrong OR right in making that assertion than you are at making yours.
I get your point, but since VT has won more coastal divs than any other team (by your counts, than by any two coastal teams) and GT is 2nd on the list, the discussion would be is UNC a champ because VT and GT are down? UT and UF have been the dominant teams in the SEC East. It's never been UGA over multiple years (just like Miami has never been in the Coastal). As such, it is fair to access UGA's div titles based on whether or not the historically dominant teams were having their typically good years.
And to that I would reply "depends on whether you ask a Hokie or a Tarheel". But you can't discount either answer if you ask the question.
What I'm really asking is: since no one has come close to our level of ACC (Coastal) success, does the level of competition skew your view of that success? I don't think it should, but we've got a horse in this race. I'm sure people outside our fan base feel differently.
To be honest, if you're comparing the SEC and ACC, it's pretty clear that Coastal:SECe & Atlantic:SECw. So maybe it's all a wash. Ha. I just think that if Richt can draw 'croots to Miami like he did to UGA then the U will be relevant - WITHOUT these writers and coaches who just want them to be "back".
The U was already getting those croots. Over the past decade or so, UGA has only been modestly better than the U.
Right - and if you're a U fan (blech!!!), who would you rather cook the meal with those groceries? Richt? Or Al Golden? There have been a couple seasons lately in which a "modestly better" Miami team would have won the Coastal. 2012, '13, '14 come to mind.
EDIT: mmmmaybe not 2014. Hahaha
In general though? I hear you - Richt definitely had outsized talent - and expectations - for such diminished returns at Georgia. When he took the U gig I was like "Hm. Lateral move at best." But he's a high-profile, respected-as-hell coach at a traditional power in our division, so there's a part of me that wants them to improve because a legit Miami, along with a new & improved VT and a rejuvenated UNC makes the Coastal much more viable not just in the ACC but nationally.
The ACC was garbage for a good period while we were winning. We lost the big game a lot too. Seriosuly. Go show me a game where we won against a really good team in the last 10 years. We beat up on a ton of bad teams and the few big games we did play, we didn't have a great record...
Very true. Good example. Unfortunately it happened when we were not relevant in the least. When we were winning our 10+ games a year, and crushing that ACC booty, we never really dominated the other good teams out there. We were always in that second tier of teams at best.
I wonder why...
It looks like Mike O'Cain just smelled a fart and Stinespring is trying to pretend he can't smell it but really it was him.
Yes
two guys who were better offensive coordinators than Scot Loeffler.
Wow. You REALLY, REALLY hate Scot Loeffler.
Scot Loeffler is to cds7c as Rich Rodriguez is to Hokie Fireman.
as Bryan Stinespring is to Illinois Hokie
debatable...
That's like arguing if you'd rather have herpes or chlamydia.
Sorry. Just wanted to see my post in a teeny tiny box.
LSU, Nebraska x 2, Ta&m x 2
And none of those teams were in the elite tier of teams during that era. They are just top 25ish teams that we beat. We also lost to a lot of those types of teams at the end of the season as well. We just were not a top tier program. Solidly in the second tier though.
The 2009 Nebraska team should have won against Texas, who played for the national title, in the Big 12 championship game and finished the season ranked #14. I'd say they could have easily been a top #10 team.
Good job!
Thank you.
Grad school plus state of my birth is usually a pretty good formula.
I hope you understand that the statement was in jest and only stated because someone professed to be a fan. I live in Atlanta and know a large number of terrific UGA grads who are fans. I also know a bunch of inbred fans who basically aren't capable of filling out an application, let alone attend a class or graduate from UGA. They are a horrible group to endure.
It's all good with me, man. I know how it goes.
Consistent, for sure. But those losses in big games, and a few that weren't, are what really stung the diehard dawg fans. Similar to us, but the SEC is a different animal.
We were missing 2 defensive linemen and replaced them with Trevon Hill (3*) and Tim Settle (4-5*), and we had 8 sacks. ESPN hates seeing tradition broken.
No, he was talking about the eye test, to see the number of "dudes" that Miami had on the field. From what I recall, he never once mentioned recruiting rankings/*'s. His comments about Miami was based on the Miami-FSU game, not Miami's game vs VT. In fact, he's basically confirmed that Miami doesn't have the dudes that he mentioned (since we beat them, how could they?).
Well, on paper, Louisville probably has less talent than VT. Like most halfway decent programs at some point, they've just come up aces with a few classes.
Let's see if they maintain it.
Al Davis said it best...
"......"
- Al Davis, October 2016
Ouch
Who gives a fuck what Kevin Carter thinks? He doesn't matter.
Exactly. Their narrative is old and worn out and he can think what he wants. People put wayyyy too much stock into what "experts" have to say. His opinion matters exactly naught to me.
The problem is that "people" includes recruits, poll participants (polls aren't directly involved in the play off, but you know the committee looks at them) and the playoff committee.
I don't think a recruit is not going to choose Virginia Tech because Kevin Carter said we don't have dudes on our roster.
Look at the comment to which I was responding. It referenced "experts". If collectively the "experts" take Carter's opinion and echo it, then it could have that influence. These things start with 1 guy, then build. As a direct consequence, what one guy says may, in fact matter.
Luckily, wins matter more, so there's a pretty easy solution.
Win this week.
I think "experts" value Aaron Carter's opinion more than Kevin Carter. He literally doesn't matter.
No doubt, but media, even uninformed media, can have a powerful effect. Then again, to Kevin Carter's credit, he gave some actual thought to the feedback and I don't have a problem with his response.
I didn't want to log in, maybe I did, to say this, but I'll say it anyway and leave out all the surrounding fluff.
Just win.
Oh, and Go Hokies! And carry on fans. Give 'em hell, including Kevin whoever he is and whose named is probably pronounced Joe.
I'd like for us to move to a higher bowl, maybe the new year's day bowl or something close to it
I've seen projections for the Citrus or Gator, both on 12/31 and vs SEC/b10/b12 competition.
No games on 1/1 this year, that's an NFL Sunday.
Who's Kevin Carter? Seriously never heard of the guy.
The answer is simple and was said many times above: Win games. If we win then we will gain respect in the eyes of Kevin Carter and Herbie and the little old lady down at the grocery store. Until then, their assessments are accurate. Ultimately though it really doesn't matter what the "talking heads" say, just shut it out.
I'm confused, I thought I was Kevin!?
I caught his horse shit this morning. It was thoroughly subjective. No numbers and no names. Just what he thinks. I am surprised I caught it because I have pretty much tuned out ESPNU. You would think that a station dedicated to college sports would include more talk about other schools and conferences. Nope. All sec and big. Some Big 12 10 whatever thrown in. Little ACC or PAC 10. Forget about The G5. It's all numbers bullshit. I don't watch Gameday much anymore for the same reason.
Actually thinking of watching 3 shows and coming up the avg. time spent with each conference.
And oh lord, Dinich had an extended segment this morning. What she said was fair but up close that poor girl has a face made for radio.
Don't know what YOU look like, Musky, but I resemble your remark.
I think it is all about the money. Seriously, The more you head Northeast in the US the more folks pay attention to the NFL (maybe the pacific is the same). As you move South and West from North Carolina, it is all college football talk. All the attention the PATs and the Steelers get up north, is focused on your SEC, Texas and Oklahoma B12 teams in those areas in the south. NFL has no presents down there in comparison, and college sports is ESPN's playground. There is nothing ESPN would want more than for SEC fans to keep on believing that they are the stronghold on the mountain of college football (real good argument lately) so that they can justifiably keep feeding their big money area's what they want to hear. It is all about the money, and yes it is too biased. And yes that bias will continue to affect recruiting which can directly impact program success and it all stinks. That is why I really don't listen to ESPN. They have a Target audience and ACC teams that are not SEC shared space are not in it.Also, to be realistic, we did choke in NY. The Giraffe was justified in here skepticism. We need to win consistently before we can say we belong in their conversations. They probably still won't talk about us anywhere near SEC level, but at least we can say with conviction that they should.
Edit: second time reading this, and it sounds too much like whining. To those who read it completely, sorry I can't give those minutes of your life back
The OP makes great points. However,for the ESPN bashers in this thread, I would ask who is better at delivering national sports coverage? Mostly, they forget what happens on Saturday as soon as Sunday nfl comes around. Therefore, the only headlines you are going to get are the top 10 teams. Otherwise, college interest is very regional. Stop acting like ESPN not talking up the hokies is some huge slap in the face. More often than not, they have a more objective view, even if ill informed, than we do as O&M fanatics.
Here's the true mental gymnast bullshit when it comes to ESPN and the need to prove it to them. They want you to beat someone good, but the second you do, they then come back and say how that isn't a good win anymore because of some subjective bullshit like the weather wasn't good, or even more absurdly, write it off because the team you beat lost, which means they weren't as good, which allows them to continue with the "beat someone then we'll care" mantra.
We beat the piss out of UNC in their house, but get no credit for it because it was rainy.
We beat Miami and its no longer a good win because its their 3rd loss in a row, so who cares that they used to be Top 10, they're terrible now.
but....
UNC gets credit for beating FSU and Miami because they were both ranked at the time. Yes, the same Miami that we just trashed last week, is a good thing for UNC, but not enough for us. Ignore the fact our margin of victory was higher. Oh, and then there was that big win over FSU, yeah that one really helps out UNC. But why is FSU highly regarded? Oh, right, they beat a Top 10 Miami on a missed XP after playing like absolute ass the first half of the year. Huge season defining win for FSU, that's why they get the respect, so when UNC beats them, boom, season defining win for UNC.
So while FSU and UNC deserve all the respect in the world for those quality wins, all stemming from wins over Miami, the same luxury isn't given to us. And this is also while we have a dominant win over UNC on our record as well. Fuck it, we'll never win with these asshats.
On spot alum!
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I...?
Please respect the NSFW policy
Work?
That pic isn't safe for anyone
And here I was thinking it was not safe for women. Like, don't take her man, she will literally kill you.
You destroyed those straw men.