An ESPN investigation: Sources describe a toxic culture inside #Maryland's football program through humiliation, bullying and verbal abuse.Story from @CFBHeather, @TomVH and me: https://t.co/gAsKoBdZGK— Adam Rittenberg (@ESPNRittenberg) August 10, 2018
UPDATE:
UPDATE: Sources tell ESPN that Rick Court, head strength and conditioning coach for #Maryland football, also has been placed on paid administrative leave. https://t.co/DP7SZlUd15— Adam Rittenberg (@ESPNRittenberg) August 11, 2018
Forums:
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Comments
Oddly enough Durkin and Court worked with Urban Meyer in the past and Urban has had similar allegations against him recently
So we gettin' some 'cruits or nah?
Tkp is always good for getting to the important issues right away.
Well done
I don't think there's a recruit in their class that we would accept a commitment from right now. We've already turned their top two commits away.
yeah tavion got bumped down to a 3star after committing to UMD.
They made a kid sit & eat Candy bars while watching his teammates work out to gain weight!
Ain't nuthin.
Bronco had Triple H teach the entire team pilates to "get tougher"
Don't sully the good name of Triple-H like that.
It was DDP Yoga
You are correct, I had a bourbon brain fart.
That was actually the kid that needed to *lose* weight. They made him eat candy bars while his teammates worked out ("allegedly") to make him realize what a fatty he is. Pretty seriously screwed up there.
Not original
who was being punished? the guys working out or the guys getting candy?
I know you guys are joking, but that's some serious humiliation factor on a football team.
I broke my foot over the summer, and couldn't practice right away when camp started in High School.
One of the coaches had me and the other injured players who were there watching practice suck our thumbs on the sidelines.
So, this crap, is not surprising at all to me at least.
Good news is, that I never saw anything bad at Tech whatsoever in regards to player treatment.
So, what you're saying is that Maryland is up to the standard of your high school.
I'm glad to hear that VT has a better culture in place.
I am surprised this isn't another uniform thread.
Title-of-every-Maryland-uniform-release-thread!
Nailed it.
Here's a fun fact: when out of the USA, Brooklyn 99 is on Netflix. Figured that out on our honeymoon. I wanted to see if there was anything different...boy, what a lovely surprise! It's become an out of country tradition unlike any other.
This is gonna escalate quickly. If the season wasn't right around the corner, I think they would clean house. Even with that, I don't see any way Durkin and the strength coach aren't gone in short order.
It is absolutely criminal what that strength coach did to Jordan McNair. If I'm his family I am suing the ever living hell out of that program.
So what does UA do to keep it from looking like their donations going forward do not cover these lawsuits
Pick VT as their flagship but not flag themed program
So serious question: how close could this be to manslaughter charges?
Probably not close if Dennis Green didn't get charged for involuntary manslaughter back in 2000 when Korey Stringer passed away from heatstroke.
Well this isn't 2000
At the very least it's got to be reckless endangerment
You mean like when Brian Kelly killed a kid?
Them kids in the Beta house at Penn State got charged. I see parallels.
In Maryland, the definition of Manslaughter is: "an unintentional killing done without malice, (1) by doing some unlawful act endangering life but which does not amount to a felony, or (2) in negligently doing some act lawful in itself, or (3) by the negligent omission to perform a legal duty."
the word 'negligently' appears to require that 'the conduct must manifest a wanton or reckless disregard of human life.'
Based on a cursory review of just the ESPN articles, sounds like somebody could be indicted for manslaughter on either of the final 2 theories (negligently doing a legal act or failure to perform legal duty). I'm not going down the rabbit hole of 'legal duties', but if I were at all involved with those people, I'd be getting a lawyer and shutting the fuck up.
(I am a lawyer. However, I am not a lawyer in the state of Maryland, and I am not your lawyer.)
"It's called hazing! Look it up!" -Thad Castle
Agree, and it's completely unacceptable. The fact it was being led by the very person you're supposed to trust the most is disgusting.
If my son went there and played I'd be looking to transfer immediately. And I'd call anybody and everybody to see who has a spot. And if get an injunction against the NCAA to remove the sit a season rule because this is criminal
I'd assume a hardship waiver could be issued
A LOLUVa coach had a fight club going on and broke a kid's orbital socket. It blew over and all parties are still employed.
But don't let that take away from the fact that LOLUVa is the only #1 seed to lose to a #16 seed.
...somebody watches too many movies
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5NP8y63Ms4o
I dont know, I see anything from Heather Dinich and immediately cant take it seriously
YIKES.
Wonder if Trey has any insight to the culture there?
This looks bad:
Washington Post story
Even if they had put him in an ice bath it's possible his temperature could still be that high. I only know this because another program overworked a player and put them immediately in an ice bath before they finally transferred him to the hospital where he showed up with a temperature higher than 106.
Edited to remove some information provided by my source.
Unfortunately, they didn't do that at Maryland.
Seems to me that any athletic program that trains in the summer (and really, everyone else) needs to know this.
Agreed. I got confused with the wording but wanted to point out that even with an ice bath you could still have an exceedingly high body temperature. Either way it should never happen.
It was uva wasn't it...
I saw the original post, so now I have all the power! (insert maniacal laughter)
With all the wearable technology available, is there anything that can track body temp in real time?
If a guy is showing signs of dizziness, confusion, and can't walk straight, I doubt that wearable technology is needed in order to suggest treatment for heatstroke.
Can be verified with a thermometer.
But your point is well-taken. Eventually this technology will all be on your watch. Temperature is internal, so a bit tricky.
Maryland sucks.
Fuck Maryland.
I guess we can say Cam Goode will not be transferring to Maryland
But but but their uniforms /s
🚮 uniforms
Mason Bagget former Hokie works under court in the Football Strength and Conditioning program. So sadly our Hokie fam is tied up in it.
Also Stinespring is there as well as the O-line coach.
OT: Maryland roads are terrible.
Never drive in Delaware then.
I think he meant to say "drivers".
Or western PA.
It's not just western PA unfortunately.
True. But I think it the least of the worst.
To those that are traveling through DC, you can tell you're in Maryland by the amount of trash everywhere
I think the most damaging part of the article is that they have made no changes to the program after the death of that young kid.
If they did I don't think anyone would be up in arms right now, but the players after seeing their teammate die are now really concerned about it happening to someone else or themselves.
I don't know what goes on at D-1 College Football practices, how much more extreme is this than other schools? It sounds like just a few players talking out on it, similar to the Florida players talking out about Urbans regime
Making a player eat candy bars while watching other players work out seems a bit cruel.
Depends on what candy bar it was
Milk chocolate?
Ewww.
right! everyone knows pie is the way to go!
Something tells me there's a big difference between Hilgart's motivational tactics and Couch's.
This didn't take long
It's going to get downright ugly over there.
Well, already has, I guess.
Unfortunately their recruiting class isn't filled with DMV studs as it usually has been in the past few years, so for us there's no one we'll want a shot at. It'll be interesting to see if anyone with talent transfers as well.
Also on a side note, Melvin Keihn grad transferred from Maryland this year and is a U of Richmond this season for his final year of eligibility.
Still though, you have to think it only helps us to have a recruiting rival taken off the board even if it won't necessarily be obvious which recruiting targets this affects for us this year.
Who is the Maryland OL coach?
He gave them better than they deserved. I don't know if I'd be so tactful in my decommitment after what we've found out about that program.
It doesn't hurt to be tactful. He hasn't chosen a new school yet.
Wonder if Cape is glad he took that visit now?
Maybe Maryland should fire Durkin and promote new OC Matt Canada to the HC position.
EDIT: Maryland is heeding my advice
Ohio state fires urban. Maryland hires urban. Shitstorm intensifies. Maryland secedes from the union. Nobody notices or cares.
"Maryland secedes from the union. Nobody notices or cares"
As one who was raised there I could not agree more. What a freaking awful state. Even the beaches suck.
In the interest of transparency, I like the Chesapeake Bay, the Eastern Shore, and Annapolis.
Deep Creek, probably the best thing in Maryland.
If I could give you more than a leg for this I would... Hate Maryland but absolutely love going to Deep Creek in the summers. We have a place that is a drunk stumble away from the Honi Honi bar.
Yes, you are spot on... The only redeeming places in the whole state especially Annapolis
Nahhhh.....fuck Maryland besides Bethesda, Silver Spring, or Really Rockville the whole state is A shit show. Baltimore is a bigger dump than Detroit. I live in DC and the Virginia side (Arlington/Alexandria) is night and day difference from Maryland side (PG county).
I don't give a fuck what Maryland fans say about leaving the ACC for more $. The freaking real reason they left the ACC is because they had become a bottom feeder program in both football/basketball. They are having real problems now selling tickets with no real rivals coming to town. You can't force Rutgers as a rival and expect to sell tickets. Seriously fuck'em.
Silver Spring?
Hey, Seacrets in OC is a great place to get shitty when you "just turn 21"
Other than that I agree
I love standing in strangers urine for hours on end.
That place is bizarro world.
I'm of the belief that MASN runs solely on the funds of Ocean City, Maryland's, insanely nice beaches with the best and bro-eist lifeguard that ever lived. Are you crushing my belief system?
Need a contract hit on the fun family.
Maryland secedes from the union.
This would be bigger than 4th of July.
Yuuuppp. Pretty sure that means Durkin is gone.
The lawyer of the family that lost their son threatened to sue the school.
I wonder how much of the staff is gone?
It honestly should be the entire staff. They all stood around for nearly an hour after McNair showed signs of distress (read: he had a seizure on the field) before 9-1-1 was called. During this time, no attempts were made to see if this was a result of heat stroke, or to even attempt to bring his body temperature down.
After the incident, and while McNair was still alive and in the hospital, players spoke to the coaching staff about the coaching behavior, saying they were concerned that the methods being used were causing a legitimately unhealthy and dangerous environment, to which the coaching staff sounded receptive. When fall practices started back up, nothing had changed.
So yeah, fire them all. Of course, because they have to field a team this year, that won't happen, but it should.
President Loh should be stepping down. Or administering a self-inflicted no-football season after his comments in regards to UNC.
It's only right, right.
President Loh has been an idiot in regards to athletics his entire tenure.
To him, it's just a profit center.
The duo of President/AD has been atrocious for some time now.
Bring in Stinespring to head up recruiting?
Ducks and covers.
I don't expect it to happen but in a scenario where the entire staff gets the ax, what on earth happens to the team this season?
I think Maryland has sort of already addressed that.
Matt Canada seems to be in the clear.
I don't see how any coach associated with the program can be in the clear. The kid had a seizure on the field and nobody, no coach, no trainer, no GA, nobody called 9-1-1 to get him help. Even if you weren't directly involved with whatever workouts the kid was doing at that time, you're still indirectly involved by neglecting to act on an emergency situation. Gross negligence for the whole lot.
And that's before you hear about all the other stuff that went on behind closed doors.
Sort of depends on the story and the actual timeline.
For sure, Durkin has to be held responsible for anything that happened. If it went down as rumored, maybe it's better to just replace everybody. They are going to get the crap sued out of them.
Didn't this incident happen during offseason conditioning and not actual football practice? position coaches can't participate in those sessions... it's S&C staff and training staff only.
Apparently Durkin was there.
They ask local high school coaches to volunteer their time to help out on the weekends.
(Hey, it sorta happened before...cough, cough, Bob Wade, cough, cough.)
First of all, this is more prevalent than people want to admit. Secondly, where was this pitchfork group coming after Durkin a couple years ago with Brian Kelly? What he did should classify as manslaughter. If that was in the oilfield and someone had already voiced their concern for safety it would be a prison sentence, but I guess ND coaches get a pass by the entire nation?
Wouldn't mind seeing Virginia Tech taking a proactive approach to assure the fanbase/public that there are many safeguards in place for player safety. I cannot see Fuente's culture being anything like Durkin's - especially with the social media visibility - but it never hurts to provide assurance.
Wisconsin is a good example...
Bruh, I still have my Brian Kelly pitchfork.
For me this seems even WORSE.
Not addressing symptoms of heat stroke or not taking it seriously is really, REALLY bad, and may have been the direct cause of death in this situation.
Both are bad. Both resulted in a kid's death.
True, but if the timelines being presented are correct, it's the equivalent of Brian Kelly not calling for medical help for an hour after the crane was blown over.
There's judgment errors, and there is failing to respond to an emergency..
Looks like we'll have a chance to hire Aazaar Abdul-Rahim, like one LAHokie wanted.
In reality idk, but I imagine unless Matt Canada has a great season and never has a PR stumble with himself or the team then I imagine they clean house including some of the atheletic dept leadership and maybe even the AD.
The AD is going to be AT the presser with the President.
And he was just "hired" as AD in late June.
Wasn't clear, I meant that this season I expect some combination of Durkin and/or strength and conditioning staffers and/or athletics dept leadership that were around at the time of the death would be let go. Following this season if the PR doesn't improve and they have some other type of major stumble even with another sport (Len Bias Men's b-ball died not too long ago) where the culture doesn't seem to change around how players treated well and with respect then the AD could be fired as well in the next season or two.
The new AD WAS at the school as the Executive AD since 2014.
And, fwiw, Bias died nearly 35 years ago...not exactly "not too long ago" especially in athletics terms. Heck, the Hokies have gone from Independent, to the A-10, to the Big East, to the ACC in that time.
My impression was that he meant the program that was effectively created on the back of Bias' play died recently, not that he died.
Given how far Maryland has fallen since the 2001 glory days, I kind of agree
Len Bias died 32 years ago and so did the drug and academic scandal surrounding his death.
I think ya'll would be surprised how much that still matters particularly to the older alumni and boosters at UMD, and the Jordan McNair while not exactly the same brings back memories of it. So yeah feel free to disregard it but it still does matter no matter what Nick Young thinks.
Never ever said it doesn't matter.
Said it's not recent history.
BIG difference.
I think you mean B1G difference.
True, but can you imagine if he fired the man standing next to him?
Surprise mofo!
"alleged"
No firings....
Edit...Court was fired.
They managed to take a bad situation and somehow make it that much worse.
How the hell is any parent going to want their kid to play for Durkin after all this?
Or worse, AT Murland...
Edit:
Durkin is big money, so they'll probably be needing some documentation to fire him for cause.
A kid died on his watch. What more documentation do they need?
And for the record, looking over his contract...
They don't need a specific reason to fire him if they deem his employment to not be in the best interests of the school. And its not like the school doesn't know the staff fucked up, President Loh openly admitted they did during the press conference, so by not firing him and knowing this clause is in there, they're effectively saying they care more about the buyout number than employing a head coach they admit was negligent to the point of costing a player his life.
Yeah that was what I was gonna say, they can fire him anytime they want at this point but they'll probably have to pay him out the rest of his contract or do a buyout unless they have something formal like the report. I assume they decided to keep him on leave and wait for the report to be done and then fire him so they don't have to pay him any money. They mentioned they wanted to do the investigation quickly at the press conference.
So the question then is the money worth not only the morality with the family and dead player but also is the PR hit worth saving the money that they would have to pay him if they let him go immediately. They mentioned in the press conference that they spoke with the family this morning and I would assume they communicated what their larger plan is if indeed they are waiting to fire him for monetary reasons. I think this puts the university, president and AD in a bad place.
The answer to that is probably yes, the PR hit is probably worth less than a buyout. One year not doing well and bad recruiting would be less of a problem to their bottom line, unless he only has one more year on contract which is unlikely.
If they do an investigation, find probable cause they can then spin that to correct some of that PR problem. Big companies don't fire executives because of a rumor or possible wrongdoing and risk $10s of millions until there's some usable proof or it starts to extensively hurt the bottom line.
How much UA money was used in the settlement
They go B1G money now!
They have state of maryland taxpayer money now.
As for Plank, he is still deer in headlights property developer wondering if he should cut his connected devices division while cutting contracts and staff associated with being a retail brand. Hmmm, maybe that Gildan and/or Champion business model isn't so bad after all?
I'm sure the Governor will have something to say about spending taxpayer money.
Previously they wanted to fire
Fridgeedit: Edsall. The previous Gov wouldn't allow them to buy out his contract with tax payer money, which is exactly what the Pres of the Univ. wanted to do. They did a fund raising campaign from the boosters...to attempt to raise several million dollars to buy him out. It failed. They had to have him coach another year. I give props to the Gov for not allowing several million dollars of tax payer money be spent on a coach that wouldn't be there.Seems like they should send Kevin Plank the bill.
He was deep in his pockets already. He ponied up for the hire of Durkin. And the redo of the field. And some other facilities.
And he'll keep on paying.
One reason why I don't buy Under Armour.
Yup. Plank's developer friends have left him in the dust on their planned ventures.
So an in-depth investigation by a 4-person panel. 2 retired judges, a federal prosecutor, and a retired football coach turned AD (Osborn?) Then the school will look at the recommendations and react.
Durkin could be in limbo for some time. (Not advocating one way or another at all...just stating a statement is all.)
BUT, what about the recommendations for the AD, who was hired from within, after the player died...and he was on staff at the time. Or the university President who has been present for this situation, and is only now "looking into thing further." Curious to see if they are out of bounds for the report, or in-play and nothing happens to them.
Loh said Maryland takes "legal and moral responsibility" for the circumstances leading to McNair's death.
What does that mean?
Seems like that's admitting things weren't good. Whatever number McNair's lawyer was thinking of, it just went up.
There's a cap to the amount in Maryland courts. In Federal though, there isn't.
I think the report will show that it was an on-campus thing...so not sure they can go federal.
Looks like to me that Maryland, with statements like these, is angling for an out-of-court settlement. Could they offer more than the Maryland court limit just to make it go quicker and get it out of the public eye on their terms?
Most likely cheaper to settle out of court. The family's lawyer is a shark. And has been angling for a few days. I bet UMD would spend $5 million on the defense. And as a tax payer, that's crazy. Own it and pay the family.
I was talking about settling out of court. Seems like they'd have to pay a premium to get it done fast.
There's no fucking way the university's counsel let him go on television and say that unless there is an agreement in place between the school and the family beforehand. It kind of feels like a strange way to convey that, so I wonder if that phrase is part of the settlement.
"legal and moral responsibility for mistakes made by the training staff"
i may be paraphrasing but I think that is essentially what he said... pretty much nothing unless he detailed the mistakes made by the training staff... who knows maybe only one mistake was made and it was made by medical staff
when i heard that phrase I thought the President and the AD have to go as well
even if you accept that there were mistakes made by the training staff, if the training staff was the one that basically said to drag his ass across the field then left him be without a temperature check, without an ice bath, if reports are believe without honoring his request they call his mother... well ain't nobody taking responsibility for that but the taxpayer of maryland, and the trainer who could end up being criminally, personally, and if he has insurance professionally negligent... fuck the AD, fuck the president... and the football staff should go work at Ohio State or Michigan
but I should go back and listen to the presser before leaping
He did throw the word "alleged" in there repeatedly after that statement...
But yes, he did say that directly. Seemed very odd.
It seemed really odd to me.
How can the family settle if they haven't even seen the results of the investigation?
I think that assumes that the family and the university haven't seen most of the information. I get that they're empaneling this group of lawyers judges and tom osborn to figure out what happened, but I would still believe that the sides fundamentally know what's going on. Something preliminary like 'here's 5 mil, we'll admit legal and moral responsibility asap, and make the changes recommended by this panel.' Even if it's not 'final,' it seems like they could get that done without the full report.
On the other hand, if the university president is spouting off on national television and making admissions like that without some kind of agreement in place, from a legal standpoint he's a moron. That's so bad that he's now potentially voided whatever insurance (if any) the university or state might have for this kind of situation. He's completely violated whatever policies the university and state have about making remarks about pending litigation. If that's the case, he's lost his job and potentially made himself personally liable. For those reasons I just don't believe that there was not some kind of agreement in place before he went on national television and said that stuff.
I have to say, that makes perfect sense. For both sides.
The lawyer was also saying that Durkin should be fired. Seems to me that part is unresolved, unless there is also a gentleman's agreement about that (or it's in the recommendations).
The timing of all of this seems a bit suspicious, as all of this seems to have gathered steam only after the ESPN report.
Another interesting note is that Court resigned, but got 2/3 of his contract value.
I imagine there are clauses in their contracts, similar to the Louisville ones, where they have to be put on administrative leave for a period of time. Durkin's demise is just a matter of time right now.
They will probably get sued, lose, then instead of paying out, they will name a building after him and claim that is worth $20 million dollars
Looks like the strength coach is saying he resigned yesterday.
Odd. it's not like this happened yesterday. Almost like nothing would have happened without the recent surge in media coverage...
They gave him the option to resign. You're right, though. It's not like they didn't have their own information before the ESPN story came out. He wasn't even suspended until last Friday.
They're still in negotiations with Durkin.
This means the report is going to be bad. It doesn't take three months to do an investigation of a two hour incident.
But the ESPN report does seem to have sprung this whole thing loose.
With Loh stating they take responsibility, it blows my mind how manslaughter charges aren't being pressed.
McNair's family should sue the school, AD, Durkin, Court and maybe some more people.
This is what I do for a living. I would be shocked if several 'somebodies' don't get charged with a crime over this.
See my comment upthread, but based on the statements the president made, I think there's some kind of agreement already in place regarding this.
I am not your lawyer.
what sick schmuck decided that a term for killing someone should have "laughter" in it?
Probably the guy that invented the word "slaughter".
Bernard Basham got it way better then I did. Legs all the way around.
I am not your lawyer.
Just realized that you actually being a lawyer ruins the IANAL acronym that makes me giggle like a child.
This guy...
I like IANYL, but I don't feel like enough people would get it.
Happy to see the Board of Regents take the investigation oversight away from Loh. There was no way he (or Evans) should have been steering that ship. And from the rumblings, it sounds like there is a good chance Loh and Evans are gone when the dust settles. I live and work around many UMD alum. I haven't met a single one that is happy with the overall direction of the school or athletic program in the past 3-5 years. Time for a clean slate.
Rumor is that Gary Williams will step in as interim AD. We'll see how that goes...
New info:
http://footballscoop.com/news/new-allegations-emerge-maryland-football-d...
This is a big deal because the school previously claimed that they weren't aware of anything before the news reports from about six weeks ago.
Also interesting that the Board of Visitors backed off the "moral and legal responsibility" comment of Maryland President Loh last week.
At this point I think they're just trying to get out of paying Durkin.
Also believe they are trying to find a way to get rid of Loh.