After watching many a game this year, I have come to the conclusion Farley just isn't a CB.
Specific weaknesses, which are huge, are tackling, zone coverage, and getting off blocks. If you watch the UVA game, Farley was manhandled by UVA WRd multiple times on runs/screens and was not able to shed the block. He also had a major whiff on an easy tackle on a UVA TD.
He is okay in man-to-man coverage due to his athleticism but other than that, he is a liability when it comes to tackling and the run game.
Thoughts?
[Mod Edit: Update title.]
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I remember when we were saying this about Greg Stroman.
Greg improved drastically during his time here, no doubt, but I don't think that should be the baseline expectation, especially considering Greg had at least played the position in HS, and had better college coaching than Caleb is getting now. Beyond coverage technique, Caleb needs to learn how to tackle, basically from scratch. He's got tons to improve on. He's got the physical ability to be a CB someday, but I think he'd be much better off playing WR.
Id say the argument of greg having more previous experience and better coaching makes the opposite point than the one you are trying to make. It shows that caleb has more untapped upside at this point.
I may be wrong, but I saw Stroman play one game as a senior, and he was exclusively a quarterback. I didn't see him take a single rep at corner.
He played CB in HS also
https://www.hudl.com/video/3/508838/5721a9d00c5e681224660914
Said the same thing about kyle fuller too "he cant cover" and one mook Reynolds too. Theres always a hell never improve thing
Yea but Kyle's strong suit was always tackling. He had a nose for the ball and wasn't afraid to throw his weight in there. I think coverage-wise, Farley just needs to keep getting experience and grow up a little bit. My biggest worry was his run support and tackling, which to me is either something you have or you don't have. I think a lot of the frustration in this is we saw his potential at receiver and some of us just think that ceiling is higher. Problem is, we need DB's not more receivers, which is why I think he's at DB.
Mook never did learn to cover
This just isn't true. Every db gets beat sometimes.
Even the Fullers.
Take that back. Right now. Oh Mama Fuller, please don't hurt em. They don't mean to slight your sons.
Lol I mean Kyle was getting burnt all day in the 2012 season
Experience and an off-season can do wonders.
Yeah, he's just learning to play CB so, let's give him until say, just after first game next year and let's see if we feel the same way.
He's a freshman, a year removed from ACL surgery and probably still dealing with the residual effects of his mother passing away from cancer earlier this year.
He'll be better next year. Per Foster, he has the potential to be the best corner he's ever coached.
If the coaches are putting him out there now then they think that right now of the guys we've got, he is the guy that gives us the best chance to win.
Or he had to move to CB bc we recruited the position poorly and are desperate for an athletic body at the position.
Link Here
I'm not doubting he said it, I'm stating that he wasn't originally recruited to VT to come play CB. He was forced into the role because we don't have any on roster.
It's nice that he gets high praises from Bud about his potential, but we need starters that are capable of playing in the moment, as starters.
Do you know for sure that he was not recruited at corner or are you just basing this on the fact that 247 had him listed him at another position? I'm fairly certain that he started practicing at corner first and only played some wr due to our lack of depth last year. Just curious, and I may be remembering wrong.
I'll add this: I personally have more faith in Bud developing a good athlete into a good football player than anybody on any offensive staff in vts history (including Corn or Fuente). Just my opinion.
Yes, he was recruited as a WR. Any recruiting insider or those who closely followed his recruitment will attest to that, he was learning the position, was playing it camps and in the all-star game he played in, and came into camp at VT to play WR, which is why it was such a big deal was made when he moved over to the defensive side of the ball - because we had no depth.
My memory is he played all spring at DB last year and only moved to O the week of the spring game which is why he didnt know the playbook.
He was offered as a quarterback.
But I even asked him about the switch to WR then, because the writing was on the wall.
He was recruited as an athlete with the intention of trying him at both WR and CB during the spring. Anyone that thinks he was recruited strictly as a receiver is wrong. There's a reason why they tried him at corner first.
If Foster is saying he could be the best CB he's ever coached at Tech how is it forced for him to play CB? If someone has the ability to be the best ever they are going to start over anyone on the roster whether the other guys on the roster are capable of starting or not.
Wyatt Teller came to Virginia Tech to play defense but switched to offense during his first training camp. Worked out pretty well for him.
The point I'm trying to make it that if it's the best interest of the team for you to play a certain position at VT, that (probably) means that position is your best chance to play in the NFL. We're not Bama, we don't have 6-7 NFL prospects at each position group.
I think Foster believes Farley can become a Fuller-level CB when it's all said and done.
Our defense literally lost 6-7 NFL players last off-season. Truly believe the timing of the departures set this defense back.
Let's keep in mind Jeremy Webb comes back. That makes Farley, Watts, and Webb with two spots. IMO, Farley can cover, but the tackling has to improve
He sounds a lot like Roc Carmichael when he came to tech.
Roc was a genuine DB, massive difference.
He also sucked his freshman year
Roc was a fluid corner. He had great hip movement and could lay the wood when necessary. He was just a little on the short side. He also got to develop behind our stacked CBs at the time.
And his freshman year Torrian Gray told him to that he wasnt good enough to play DB for VT and should look for a place on offense.
The development behind the stacked DBs helped him.
That's news to me seeing that I was apart of that team.
My apologies, I got the quote wrong, sorry from memory. Torrian told Roc that he was at best a backup. And Roc was an offensive player in highschool. I must convoluted the two things.
https://pilotonline.com/sports/college/virginia-tech/article_ed4c70e0-de...
Everyone needs to stop using Farley and Med Hill as the football and basketball scapegoats. I swear there aren't two players I see criticized more often
Gotta find someone to replace Moto...
Soon as Caleb stops letting up big plays and Med can score a single point in almost a whole game, the criticism will die down same as it did from Motu his last year here when he was playing really solid.
First game in his 4 year career that Med got a goose egg. Give him a break. I want to believe that was an aberration and he will be back to normal.
I like Hill and I know he will bounce back. But his performance is a key reason we lost and it's ok to say that.
And the concern is that the previous normal for Hill is a major reduction in production against talented teams. I am hoping for a new normal this season.
He is also on a team that put almost no pressure on the web throughout and the season while also giving up big plays against the run consistently causing the secondary to always have to be aware of it is a run. Freshman Flowers, Fuller, Fuller, Stroman, etc. would not have done much better. No CB can stay with a receiver forever.
It's not that the WR gets away from him, its that he lets WRs run free behind him when he doesn't have a safety and that his mistackles have given up several 90 yard runs.
This has nothing to do with ability as a DB, only with knowledge of the system and communication.
It has just as much with being a DB as seeing open receivers does with being a quarterback.
Coming back from an ACL injury isn't a joke. Your brain and leg take a long time to reconnect. It takes awhile to trust yourself using that part of the body at 100% again. Couple that with him learning a new position, and you get the product that we saw this season. Like someone mentioned earlier in the thread, we were saying the same about Stroman back in 2015 when he was thrust into a starting role really early. Farley is more physically gifted than Stroman too. I want him to stick it out at DB.
Say what you will about Farley as a CB, but please for the love of all things good and holy, use your brain and make a better title for this post. I thought he was injured or transferred or was arrested or any number of bad things because of your refusal to be specific.
TL;DR - Your title is bad and you should feel bad.
EDIT: thanks for changing the title from "Caleb Farley"
My apologies
It started a really interesting discussion, good stuff, don't sweat it this time around.
I get the criticism as Caleb has had tough moments this year, but I don't know if I agree with the sentiment. Caleb shouldn't be playing regularly this year and is being judged before he is ready. He is 1 year removed from tearing his ACL, playing a new position (albeit on D which he has never played) on a defense with a bunch of other players in similar situations. He was going to look bad as it wasn't reasonable to think he would be ready to judge until at least his redshirt-sophomore year.
It's unfortunate that his development is in the public spotlight. He needed a year behind the scenes to figure things out. To me the real challenge will be how he handles the criticism and an off-season to learn zone coverage, improve his tackling and develop the instincts to play corner (this is a huge component for a player that's a project with very high upside - which he has all
world upside)
He is possibly one of the best athletes on the team and I am hopeful that this off-season will make next year be night and day as he has had flashes of starting to get it (see first half uva).
This is something I've been telling myself all year. For as shitty as we look sometimes, I bet a lot of our all-time greats looked just as shitty when they were freshmen. Only difference was they made their terrible mistakes in practice against their teammates.
If a freshman was on the field, it was because they were elite players that had taken the job from older guys. Now we have freshmen all over the field because we have no other choice.
That's how I'm choosing to look at it, at least.
Or, they had enough experience around them to mask a lot of their flaws.
I have never seen a defensive player in P5 college look so out of place. The guy is obviously talented and athletic, but it is clear, to me at least, he looks like an offensive skill player trying to play defense. Watching him attempt to make plays on balls and WRs is cringe worthy, and it is apparent the basic instincts to be play on that side of the ball are just not there. I hope he proves me wrong over time, but I think the staff should cut their loses and move him back to offense where he could be more impactful.
Our secondary is turning into the offensive line under Beamer - who the hell can we throw out there orconvert to plug the holes and add depth.
How did it get this bad so suddenly? Understand the usual things we have all talked about this year, but some of this I believe is the shift of focus to offensive recruiting. We use to have a plethora of decent DBs recruited every year and at least a couple that were ready to play better than this. Now we recruit a plethora of WRs and offensive skill players. I do not like this change...Who cares about a 5th, 6th or 7th WR to make the offense work perfectly. Get some guys on defense to make it not record setting, embarrassingly, god awful.
How did it get this bad so suddenly?
Well, Adonis didn't want to play school by his own admission, Mook got kicked off for his alleged incident, Webb tore his Achilles and Mama Fuller maxed out the capability of her ovaries.
Watts, Quillen and Farley all will have a year under their belt next year and we will have some solid incoming corners. It will be ok. I'd be much more concerned about DT.
Or just chose not to add capability due to cost, schedule, or resource limitations.
Clone-A-Fuller had the right idea.
Also, don't forget that Trevon Hill was removed from the team, and Vinny Mihota was playing while less than 12 months from ACL knee surgery.
Getting off blocks and zone coverage skills can grow with experience. His man coverage has improved exponentially over the course of the season. Tackling is a concern to me as well but it is a teachable skill.
I agree you can teach tackling fundamentals, but it takes a certain mentality to play defensive football. Some players aren't cut out for it, and that's OK. Don't know if that's the case with Farley. Given his measurables and proper coaching, I think he could be a great cover corner.
I still wonder if he could be even better on offense though.
THIS....
100% agreed. It is a teachable skill but it doesn't mean he will or won't learn it.
Farley + Turner + Hazelton + Keene + McClease in 2020 with QP under center
Agreed. Stroman took his lumps early but I dont recall ever feeling like Stro was scared. He may have been the smallest guy on the field but he was scrappy from day 1. If you could 3-D print an all-world corner, he would look like Caleb. Unfortunately he doesn't appear to enjoy contact. Kam used to say tackling is all about who wants it more,the runner or defender. Thus far CF hasn't displayed that desire to hit somebody. I've said this to friends only half kidding; I think bud should get him an MMA instructor this offseason and work the fear out of him. If he can get nasty, he'll be a great db for us.
To me so far... whenever I was watching the Hokies on the TV, and the camera would zoom in on Farley, he does have a doe in the headlights look, pretty much every time.
I ain't saying he's scared, but I do think he needs to get his DBU swag on bit more. That's where we miss Coach Torrian. He coached up that swag.
so you're saying.. every time the camera focuses on him, he looks like a freshman? I agree.
That's because he is a freshman. Coming back from a knee injury too, which means even fewer reps during his redshirt season than normal.
Do we have the coaches (Nix and Mitchell) who can teach it though? I would say, yes, for sure if Torian was around. Part of the problem as well.
I happen to believe the FSU game was a preview at just how promising he can be at CB.
Man, he looked promising that game. But that missed tackle on Cam Akers.... oof, what a harbringer of what was to come.
We have recruited DB's but everyone is young like Farley. Losing Adonis and Webb is a tough break in the same year. Even having 1 would have provided cover for Foster to protect a young corner on the other side of the field. DB's are all over the program with Connor, Waller, Hunter and this year's class all with upside that could be realized as early as next year.
I'll preface what I have to say with a comment that I think Farley is a strong competitor and an elite athlete. I am in complete agreement that he isn't a CB. There are some things that you have to be able to pick up after a full season of coaching if you want to play defense and the ability to tackle is one of them. His tackling never improved and I noticed some teams taking advantage of it. There was a crucial series in the BC game when they just ran sweeps to Farley's side of the field three times in a row. The BC WR down blocked and left the RB one on one in space with Farley... it was a joke. I believe Foster thinks he has the potential to be the best CB in VT history based on his athleticism, I know he has only been there a year (God knows I hope he does have a breakthrough in the offseason) but sometimes you can just see a person is out of position. Someone mentioned Stroman faced similar criticism, if so, I don't remember it.
I hope I am wrong and I'd love to eat crow on this because I like the kid and we need CB's but I think for his sake and for the team he'd be best at WR and KR/PR.
He is literally the fastest guy on the field. His man coverage has gotten better over the year. UVA had some damn good WRs this year. Most of the ACC struggled with them.
Run support and tackling have been a problem on this team as a whole all year. I trust next year will be very different.
Until Payoute or Beck step on it.
Most of us are excited for Payoute, I might burn couches over him. Y'all excitement is too tempered for this kid. If he can avoid injuries and learn the offense, he's going to be very very good.
I agree - the post title is silly. WE are supporters of the players and their long-term upside. The other dynamic with young inexperienced corners is that our D was young as a whole and couldn't produce consistent pressure rushing 4-5 which puts even more more pressure on a young player like Farley.
This gets covered up on a team that has a veteran front 6-7. The improvement of the front 6 (these days) will help Farley and Watts.
I'm a believer that these kids will be super players long-term if they believe and put in the work in the off-season and don't listen to the critics.
Thx for giving it a decent title.
Dude!!! I saw the thread and an "Oh $hit! Now what?!" moment. With the craziness of this season (both off-season and regular season), you've gotta give us more than just "Caleb Farley" as a topic.
I've had a bit of a beef with Caleb at CB all year. When he missed his gap in the ND game that lead to a 97 yd TD I knew he wasn't going to be able to play against GT. I'm not sure if the infamous dropped pass against LOLUVA was entirely his miss or whether a safety should have had him over the top. I'm not a football analyst, I can't say.
But if we are talking in terms of Caleb being as good as Roc Carmichael, then I'm not optimistic. Roc was a good guy and I love him as much as any Hokie, but I was half expecting Caleb to show up like Brandon Facyson, who looked so, so good when he was in his first season. Caleb has incredible top end speed but I just don't think he feels the defensive game like a Jayron or, at best, a Flowers. It just doesn't seem to be in the way he sees the game.
At KR/PR he might be magical. With the ball in his hands, he could be brilliant. But I just don't feel like he's destined to be a great DB. At least not a cover CB, maybe he could be an absurd FS, but I don't see him as a whip, an SS, a boundary, or anything there.
If we weren't so deep at WR and so thin at DB I'd say move him back, and even with those scenarios as they are I think he'd be better on offense. I want the ball in his daggum hands!
Watch Farley's technique on pass break-ups. It's very good. It may even border on textbook perfect. Because of that technique he rarely (if ever?) gets PI called on him. Watts, on the other hand, get's PI'd all the time. I'm not even saying that's a huge issue at this point in time. They're both young.
Farley chases people down even if they aren't "his man". He's fast a hell. I think people forget that the you can be pretty good at corner as a true freshman but you aren't going to be Kendal Fuller, especially if you didn't play the position in high school.
And especially if you have to cover your man for 5 seconds or more. Need a DL to make your CBS look better.
I am critical of Farley at corner but I agree that his pass breakup technique is very good.
The comparisons to Flowers or Facyson are extremely difficult to justify as those guys were corners out of high school. Farley is a project more akin to a basketball player with all the natural physical talents, but doesn't have the experience to develop the instincts to use his skills most effectively. He needs time and experience and expectations that he was Facyson out of high school feels unrealistic. The staff did not want to have to start him in such an exposed spot this year, but had no choice.
I agree he has jump off the screen talent with the ball, but even that might not translate to a position in college as he was an all world QB in NC. He was a project regardless of position change and this year will be a full off-season which will help immensely for him to take a giant step forward.
I propose a wager!
I believe Farley will be 2nd team or better all ACC before he graduations/leaves for the draft (barring career ending injury). If you win, I'll buy you (and/or venmo you money for) a rail at TOTS. If I win, you'll pay for my TKPC membership renewal. That's roughly 1:8 odds, which IMO is pretty reasonable given that Farley is competing against other players on our team, and players on other ACC teams (Miami, Clemson tend to have great DBs too).
Any takers?
Edit: 12 hours and 9 turkey legs later, no one has accepted my wager. Alllll of this complaining, and not one person is willing to put their money where their mouth is?
I'll take it if you go first team
I'd have to change the odds. Farley could be a top VT DB, and never be a top 2 DB in the ACC.
For reference, after googling all ACC teams from 2011-2017, I saw that Bonner never made an all ACC team. Facyson peaked at 3rd team all ACC. Exum, Hosely, and Whitley peaked at 2nd team all ACC. Stroman and the Fullers made first team.
You have to be pretty good to make All-ACC third team. To make all-ACC first team secondary, you have to either be a shutdown corner or a safety who receivers are afraid of. Farley could have an incredible career at VT and never get a first team vote.
Alright fine 2nd Team. Done. Hope I'm not drinking a rail in 3 years
Yahtzee! bookmarking this.
Welcome to TKP
Welcome to the internet, more like...
This is absurd considering he is not polished at either corner or wide receiver. I honestly don't see an athlete winning the starting job over our current receivers. Everybody gets excited because of a few plays in a spring game. If he cant tackle he probably can't block either. I highly doubt he would be a crisp route runner without significant number of reps. We dont run many fly patterns so speed isnt really going to separate. If he isn't a natural catcher he is a liability on slants. See what I'm saying is that the coaches have had looks at him on both sides now and he is currently on the defensive side of the ball...I trust them.
My #sauces say he's a wide receiver next year. I heard this over a month ago. Need someone to be able to take the top off the defense and we don't have that right now. In my opinion, his coverage drastically improved over the year, but he is waaay too much of a liability in the run game and open field tackling on short throws.
Like others have alluded to, there are plenty of Virginia Tech greats who struggled early in their secondary careers.
Kyle Fuller, Roc Carmichael and Stephon Virgil were all cringe-worthy their freshmen seasons, especially Fuller. I thought he was a liability on the field, but look at what he turned into. Jayron Hosley was also maddening at time on defense his freshman year.
Caleb Farley was terrible quite often this year, but I have hope that he will progress immensely over the next year or two.
Kyle from the the beginning showed the aggressive relentless tackling ability that he possesses to this day. I distinctly remember his "nose for the ball" ability jumping out off the the tv screen. Lapses in coverage/breakdowns etc... sure, But he had, from the get go, precisely what I find Caleb to be missing at this point.
You know who else sucked at tackling?
Deion Sanders.
Sanders also ran a 4.27 40. Farley ran a 4.37, which, for his height, is scary. But still... that's a tenth of a second faster for Sanders. That guy was FAST.
How fast was Hall?
Wikipedia had Hall running the 40 in 4.34. Link
I think it's simply too early to panic either way. He's an elite athlete, and we will find the best way to get him on the field whether it's at corner or receiver. I personally think he can become a great corner for us. I also think he would be fun to watch at receiver, time will tell.
Time is running out.
He has 75% of his eligibility left. It's hardly "running out"
So are you suggesting if a Freshman can't contribute immediately, it's almost too late already?
Of course not! That's preposterous. But what I am saying is that from the moment a commit signs their LOI, the clock on their collegiate career already starts ticking down. Sure, there are a minuscule number of exceptions to that (Facyson). But in general, it already starts winding down, & even a redshirt or medical waiver, makes it even shorter.
If Farley improves in the fashion that Stro did (I have my doubts he'll ever get as good as Roc), then I'll happily eat crow & admit I was wrong (I've done it before). But so far, the criticism at the staff's decision to move him is justified & is looking like a very failed experiment.
This was/is a season where immediate (& significant) contribution was required more than ever. We thought we saw it at FSU, but we needed a continuation. We didn't get that. Also, can someone please tell me the last game our defense got an INT?? How about a pick 6??
Last INT was against ND.
It is entirely unfair to say that Farley not getting INTs is on him. INTs often come as the result of poor decisions due to pressure. We have not had that pressure with the departures and injuries on the line. The secondary has been holding its own and contributing significantly.
Farley in particular picked two vs FSU and has had multi tackle games in all but GT and W&M.
Agreed (& I wasn't insinuating that). That was more of me nitpicking on the backfield as a whole. I ageee they've been (kind of) holding their own, but in terms of significant contribution, sorry, can't sign off on that.
It wasn't too long ago that people were heavily criticizing Motu, a young Motu, for missing tackles and the mob called for him to be benched. The experience, time, and coaching turned Drew into one of the most reliable LBs we ever had.
Give Caleb a chance. Yes, he had issues tackling. He was not the only one. Farley is, and I say this knowing I will get some backlash, one of if not the best cover guy we have on the team right now.
For some Cough They never stopped attacking him, despite his stats especially turnover TD's.
Yeaaaaaa he got better but I don't know about all that. Looking good at linebacker is a lot easier when you've got Walker and Settle as your DTs and Edmunds right beside you.
So are you discrediting Motu or crediting Farley and saying he needs more pieces around him?
A. Not discrediting Drew. Just saying I don't think we was one of the most reliable linebackers we've ever had. He was a good player, but I can't say I was never not nervous about him in coverage or having to make an open field play. Also, if both your DTs are monsters then most of the time, your linebackers look good.
B. Farley has his own skills he needs to development but yea it wouldn't hurt knowing you have solid safeties over top and an adequate pass rush. Half the reason our coverage is so bad this year is we have zero pass rush. Typically a qb has to have a 4 second clock in his head to get the pass off or get on the move. QB's were hitting the snooze button on that clock all year with us. Impossible to ask guys to cover that long.
I don't think enough people realize that a great pass rush is often the best pass defense. It's incredibly difficult to have a great pass defense without a reliable pass rush and we had essentially no pass rush after the Duke game outside of blitz packages.
Clemson has gotten absolutely shredded through the air twice this year, both were games where their all-world DL failed to get enough pressure on the opposing QB. This has been the case every year that Venables has been putting elite Clemson defenses on the field so 2014 onward. Every team with a competent QB and an OL that can give them some time has had success against Clemson. However, 9/10 games that doesn't matter because Clemson has had every DL starter since 2014 go to the NFL and Venables blitzes more than any other DC in the country.
Motu changed the results & managed to alter the narrative of (most) his critics. Plus, wasn't he already recruited as a player for defense?? Seriously, I feel like the closest comparison one can make is with Stro & that's it. If Farley improves significantly, garnering better results than this season, he will manage to change the narratives.
I think we will feel much different about this after next season. Give Caleb an off-season to prepare now that he understands the speed of the game and can comfortably play within the defensive scheme, I think he will be much improved.
Getting comfortable within a defense is difficult in the first year (especially a defense highlighted with first year players). He'll learn to trust defensive keys and the players around him to keep their responsibilities.
Coming out of high school, you can peak in the backfield and make big plays. In a complex defensive scheme if you over play your roll it can lead to disaster, as we've seen.
I'm holding out hope he'll get better. He's doing about as well as I would in his shoes.
I think we're in much bigger trouble at CB than anyone is willing to admit, and it isn't an issue of forcing a square peg in a round hole. The problem isn't that we converted Farley to CB, it's that we converted him and then needed him to start immediately. We are now basically in the same position at CB as were at QB circa 2011, robbing Peter to pay Paul just to get the position filled.
And before anyone bangs the attrition drum, it's critical to realize that understanding the legitimate reasons we're in this position doesn't somehow magically get us out of this position. Diagnosing a problem doesn't solve the problem. The reality is our defensive backfield is a skeleton crew of young, inexperienced guys, many playing outside of their natural position, in a scheme that, by design, requires CBs and safeties to play out of their minds to make the system work.
The problem isn't that Caleb Farley is at CB. The problem is we have zero alternatives.
I've said it before, I'll say it again: we are going to be bad defensively for a while yet. Do not expect a return to form on defense in 2019; you are just setting yourself up for disappointment. A combination of factors has dug the defense into a crater that it will take time to claw out of, and if I'm being blunt, I'm not convinced we can trust Brian Mitchell and Tyrone Nix to produce the defensive backfield Foster needs even under normal circumstances.
This. We're not going to magically get better next year. What we need is for the talented youngsters we have in the program to get experience, and that doesn't happen overnight. We're going to be short on experienced DTs and CBs next year, still.
It will help to have Webb back and I definitely think Farley will get better, but I feel like this is the raw truth with which we're going to have to come to grips.
I expect to see us top 50 S&P+ for defense next year, and returning to a top 25 level in 2020. I think it takes the average (note, average - Fullers and the like are obviously far above average) player 3 season to become a major contributor in a Bud Foster defense. Two more years til we're good again.
I would have agreed with this years ago. Our bread and butter used to be doing more with less. But I, like IH, do not trust Mitchell and Nix to develop our DBs the way we have in the past. I hope they prove us wrong, but seeing is believing.
With all the different disguised coverages that Bud likes to use, many of which require corners and safeties to switch responsibilities on a given play, I really don't know if I like the idea of corners and safeties having different position coaches. Couple that with the fact that I just don't think Mitchell and Nix are great fits with Foster's scheme. Mitchell coached corners in the Big XII and Nix is a career linebackers coach. Our defense was at its best when we had someone who played cornerback in this system teaching people how to play cornerback in this system. I'm not saying all our coaches should have ties to the program, but with Foster's defense being so distinct from what a lot of other P5 DCs do, I think it might really be necessary in this case.
Bingo
Anyone who doesn't see this is simply burying their head in the sand. The defense should be a bit better next season by simply being more experienced and stronger. But this unit is at least 3 years from being back to vintage form, and that is assuming that we can get a couple of productive defensive lineman (specifically DTs) into the fold.
And I'm not sure how we do that. We know that Clemson is going to get the best DL in the region. NCSU has been doing a fantastic job recruiting and developing DL, that will continue. And now UNC is putting together, if nothing else, a very good recruiting staff.
Also, knowing, diagnosing the problem & tempering/adjusting expectations absolutely WILL NOT remove the disappointment factor. I don't trust Mitchell or Nix. What drives me crazy is the coaching staff not anticipating shit like this happening. Heck, they try to anticipate what the opponent is going to do on the field & then game plan/scheme for it & (generally) make adjustments. I presumed that type of mentality & practice would carry over into the off-the-field operations. They seriously need to fix this shit.
He's a young player that will get bigger, stronger, and possibly even faster. He'll also get smarter at the position. Give him time!
Farley has the tools he needs to be a difference maker wherever he lands. He currently has been learning on the fly all season and is seeing all of this for the first time, being put through the ringer each week trying to prepare. Another year at the position will only benefit his confidence in his game and his knee. He has been playing hesitant all year because big plays in the run game. With experience, I see him able to "pin his ears back" and go play on an aggressive Bud Foster defense and have a chance to make plays he was not making this year.
Also possibly returning punts.
His development as a CB will have a lot to do with the coaching he receives.
HOT TAKE
He's a first guy in, last guy out kind of guy.
And whether or not he's a heady player.
i got extremely frustrated with some of his mistakes this year, specifically his tackling. but i still remember watching him in the opening game at FSU and being in absolute awe of some of the plays he made. i think if we give him a healthy offseason in the weightroom and working out the kinks we're gonna start to see the potential Bud is talking about.
I saw Caleb at Bull and Bones last night. He was extolling the virtues of Jay Z's lyricism to what I assume were some family members who were with him. They seemed happy and were undoubtedly about to be served a delicious meal. I take this as a sign that his development is trending in the right direction and that the bowl streak is assured.
You were correct about the bowl streak!
Caleb absolutely shut down Tyre Brady yesterday who was one of the best receivers he's faced all season. If he can get better in run support and tackling, he's going to be a good one.