Coming off a 6-7 season and a suspicious number of players leaving over the course of the last 2 years, I can't think of a lower point for Virginia Tech football than right now. It's not just the losing, it's the disturbing sense that the leaving players is an indication of something rotten going on behind the scenes. The mood is certainly dark on TKP right now, and people are pointing the finger at Fuente. I've been a huge defender of the guy myself, but it gets harder and harder as more bad news leaks out.
So the question is, what does Fuente need to do to instill confidence back in the fanbase? Win obviously. But how much winning? It's already been pointed out that our schedule is weak next year, so that muddies the water quite a bit. I'm curious if people can quantify the on the field results they need to see.
Comments
All the winning.
You need to update your signature!
"Scared money, don't make money"
Neither JJ nor RW have finished their careers at VT. Beard only updates when a QB has finished their career.
Yea go ahead and update it bud
Do we have a QP hopeful in our midst...?
I'm sure QP will get it, but that isnt what this is
haha I was trying to be optimistic about the fact there's rumo JJ is gonzo
Cough cough
did I say JJ? I meant McClease....
When I'm good and ready, sharkbait hoo ha ha
I guess it's time to add JJ.
but what if he transfers to a school who plays UVa this year and he loses?
if it didn't happen at Tech I don't care and dammit now I have to put 'undefeated as Hokies' in there don't I
I'll get around to that sometime before Black Friday
Better not have "some" my winning
Not "half" my winning
Better have ALL my winning
I don't see why this is a thread when you answered your own question inside the post....
Did I answer that question?
You'll know it when you see it.
That's such an open ended question though that no one (including Whit) could even answer it.
Winning is winning and as long as Fuente trusts his process, who cares about some players (some deserving, some questionable) transferring/kicked off.
I'm still cautious as to this fan base gathering up their torches and pitchforks just because a few "problematic" ex-players are proving their immaturity by blowing smoke on Twitter.
Bottom line.... there's a wide variety of variables outside of a few transfers which could affect the upcoming season, why stress about it now?
I think the torches and pitchforks are still about ODU.
They just come out again with any piece of negative news.
People need to get over that game though.... while embarrassing internally, no one nationally even remembers or could recall that VT lost to ODU. If it was a UVA/UMBC caliber loss...I'd feel more strongly about it.
But if we're still using ODU as a measuring stick for impeachment, then technically Foster should be first in line....last I saw, the offense did their job that game...
All true.
But the negativity towards Fuente spiked after that.
The UVA/UMBC loss was definitely a worse loss than VT/ODU. Even so, the UMBC loss seems to have been a temporary setback from which a recovery was possible in less than a year. Our problem is broader and deeper than a one game embarrassment.
Your criticism is that the question posed is open ended? Isn't that what makes for a good forum topic? You know, something that sparks an interesting conversation? I don't open many of these, so maybe I'm misunderstanding what's appropriate, but I'm not sure I'm following your complaint here.
Briefly, to your other point I'd say we've been unusually snakebit in the attrition department since Fuente came on. For a while I've regarded it as bad luck, and maybe that is the case, but it has gotten to the point where you start to wonder. If you click on just about any of the other threads you can tell I'm not the only one.
Al_Davis_Just_Win_Baby.mp3
A 10 win season will make most folks pretty content I think, even with the soft schedule. A 9 win season will at least buy him enough good will to make it to 2020, but If Fuente wants to silence even the most vocal critics he'll need two seasons of >=9 wins in a row.
I think we've all been spoiled with the 10 win seasons and come to expect that year in and year out....
9 wins is still a pretty damn good season in and of itself
We were good for a little bit, but we aren't and probably never will be a traditional national powerhouse team. I'd expect 8 wins with next years schedule will keep him safe.
Meh, we'll see. 9 Ws would certainly (I feel at this point) be acceptably bearable for the fan base en mass. 8 would be a toss up.
I know we had a run of 10 win seasons... I just don't see very many schools canning their coach after an 8 win season...
All the same, if I were in Fuente's position, 8 Ws is not something I would hang my hat on.
I'm not saying we should throw him a parade for 8 wins, but 8 wins isn't a failure IMO...
If he's chronically hovering at 7-8 wins year after year then I could see a change being made if the right candidate presents itself.
Have you seen the schedule?
@ BC
ODU
Furman
Duke
@ Miami
Rhode Island
UNC
@ ND
Wake
@ GT
Pitt
@ UVa
Realistically, where we should be vs where everyone else is, I see 3 losses on this schedule (@ Miami, @ ND, Pitt) that would be reasonably acceptable. ODU, Furman, and Rhode Island would be unforgivable losses. BC and Wake are teams we shouldn't be losing to. Duke is looking to have a down year. UNC and GT are breaking in new coaching staffs, and losing to UVa would set this place on fire.
Realistically, Fuente has to win 9 games next year to not have people pissed at how the season went. That's a lot, but our schedule is so bad its pretty much the bare minimum.
I agree, but am I the only one who thinks that uva is getting better, and we are getting worse? I think that we will be doubly lucky to beat them again this year. They have a very good qb, and are solid everywhere else. Not sure we are back to solid ,yet. Our d has a long way to go for tech to be able to control games
Based on how we played last season....my rough guesses at our chances for these games:
@ BC - 50/50 game
ODU - Win
Furman - Win
Duke - 66/33 game in our favor
@ Miami - 60/40 game in their favor
Rhode Island - Win
UNC - 65/35 game in our favor
@ ND - Loss
Wake - 70/30 game in our favor
@ GT - 50/50
Pitt - 50/50
@ UVa - 50/50
I'm counting about 6 games we should be favored most likely, and favored is being used loosely....
4 games are probable toss ups.
9 wins is easy next year?
Insert smart ass comment about how we lost to ODU last year.
I never said it would be easy. I said that's the record that would take heat off his seat with this fanbase.
I don't think he can afford to lose to programs like BC, Duke, Wake, UNC, GT, or UVa next year. Not after what happened this past year and not after the exodus and the public airing of grievances by our former players. I think the leash was already short going into this offseason as it was after the ODU loss and the embarrassments we suffered against GT and Pitt. I don't know how much rope is still left.
I'll agree to disagree on win totals for CJF to feel safe.
I'm content if we win 8 and are competitive in our other games instead of 3 or 4 out of character blowouts.
I don't mind losing so much to a semi-legit conference opponent if it's due to a crazy bounce or something, but losing by 30 irks me....
Honestly, we aren't having this discussion if the defense wasn't a sieve last year...
Not that I love Fuente yet, but I also feel like it's a bit unfair given last year's circumstances to be calling for his head already.
Season 1 was great.
Season 2 was fine with decent defense/bad offense.
Season 3 was eh due to awful defense/above average offense.
If/when he gets personnel on both sides, I don't see us being bad.
I'll agree with that. The GT and Pitt debacles and the Cinci defensive performance where half the players looked disinterested in even playing aren't helping at all right now.
Unfortunately college sports take years to recover from stuff, so its mostly a matter of faith and patience...
If we win 9 games will we make it to the ACC Championship? How does that affect views on coach CJF? What if we win 8 games but still make the ACC Championship game and are competitive?
I think next year needs to shake out a little bit before we start labeling a certain number of wins a must.
If we win 9 games next year, the three losses better not include ODU, Furman, or Rhode Island. So you're looking at losses to ND and two conference teams, or three conference losses. Don't think we make it with three conference losses unless there is some ridiculous tiebreaker scenario. I think two losses would win the division, just hopefully we don't lose a tiebreaker to a team like Miami, Pitt, or (gulp) UVa.
Ridiculous
K?
You know this isn't what I think personally, just what I think it'll take to win over the fanbase at large right? No need to lay a dv on posts like mine.
He has to win the big games this year like Miami and Notre Dame in my opinion he has to win one of those. And don't loose to teams that you are supposed to beat case in point ODU.
We should be in the ACC Championship game in 2019 and be a top contender for the Coastal every year. Start doing that, and you win back the fans.
Win every game we should win. And do it comfortably. And do it by beating the piss out of those opponents with our offense.
Long term- winning, especially high profile games.
Short term- engaging the fan base. We can speculate on what is happening in the locker room. However, there is one thing we can agree on. Fuente not engaging the fan base and stepping out and controlling the messaging around these transfers has allowed the fan base to speculate the worst. He has to engage the fan base and make the fan base believe this is for the better. And, regardless of what I think of Fuente as an Xs an Os guy or a locker room coach, I have not seen the capability to engage the fan base effectively.
This. I tweeted something along these lines last night. I think in general he has been terrible at showing the fan base that his players want to play for him. As bad as it sounds, I see a football team of players that would follow Bronco Mendenhall to the ends of the earth. Not the case with Fuente.
I remember when he was at Memphis, he seemed a lot looser than he does now. Even when the Hokies were winning, when he first got here he's always seemed uptight. I used to listen to his postgame interviews and he seemed likable and engaging....but i agree with you French, i think Whit has given complete autonomy over the football program as im sure he doesn't want to have to look over anyone's shoulder, but i agree that the program should be opened more during the spring to engage the fans. Also, there needs to be give and take between the fans and the program, you can't ask people for money and then completely shut the program off...VT can't do that especially when youre trying to "Drive for 25"
Speaking of the Drive for 25
Given the push we have to prop up the '25' here in Blacksburg, I'm very curious on this supposed push to basically wipe every player who ever played for Frank off the roster before next year. Makes the whole 25 jersey honor ring a little hollow if you're saying anyone who played for Frank is the current problem with the team.
I don't remember Fuente saying that.
Actions speak louder than words
We can certainly say that most of Beamer's talent has left the building at this point. We should be able to admit that the cupboard wasn't really loaded, and some of the players who left didn't really leave because of Fuente.
This is what I was getting at in the Kumah thread and is exactly what is needed. Fans are just going to fill that void with speculation and there's nothing to possibly counter it unless someone from the organization clears the air.
There is some truth to this.
Devil's Advocate:
How do we judge success/tenure based off winning high profile games when our past Hall of Fame Head Coach was notorious for losing said high profile games?
I am a big Fuente supporter and think most of this talk is crazy. I DO agree 100% with this post about engaging the fan base though!
This is a common narrative, and I'm not disagreeing, but off the top of my head the only thing that sticks out is that there are fewer open practices. Not saying that is trivial, but for those of you who rely on access to the program to produce content, what are some of the other examples?
Imo Fuente is pretty candid during interviews/ press conferences. While a lot of the angst here probably does come from the need to fill in the gaps, I'm not sure what Fuente can reasonably do to address why kids transfer or are released from the team. Much of that is private by rule, but regardless, if I were in his position I probably wouldn't put much out there publicly either. It would violate the trust established with that player as well as everyone else still on the team.
Fuente just needs to get the offense right. Bud's going to get the defense back to where it needs to be, eventually.
We haven't been in the top 50 in yards per play since 2011. If we have a top 20 offense (for once), I think Hokie Nation will buy in.
Minimum of 8-9 wins next season, with a quality product that looks good on and off the field. The program trajectory must clearly shift from declining to improving.
This year was the same as CFB last 4 years. The last 2 years were much improved, the overall trajectory will be determined in the next 2 years. Check Saban and Dabo records after 3 or 4 years. Delusional fan base....at this point.
I saw a guy on twitter swear he would steer his son (8yo) away from VT "if he becomes a star recruit, as long as Fuente is at the helm."
I don't think there's any recovering from that. Fanbase lost. We've already got a recruiting miss for the class of 2029 /s
It's okay, 2030 will be the year recruiting takes off.
He sounds like the kind of parent who doesn't want to listen to or support their child and is looking forward to their moment of vicarious fame.
Related:
The rumor (no reliable source, just hard to confirm forum gossip) is he has gang relations in Florida. If true, that's not exactly a petty reason to walk out.
That makes sense. I always wondered why she had both tenn and bama gear on. Basically... anywhere but Florida.
personally im a little sick of every post game interview from fuente saying and I quote "thanks hokie nation for being the greatest fans out there" that's just lip service at this point. don't gas me up bro to keep me around. I was here before you and ill be here after you. But you are losing me as a "fan" of you, and your job depends on having fans. period. boosters will have you out the door before it even swings open. I agree with French. ENGAGE THE FAN BASE. If you think that it doesn't matter and all you need to do is win. then you better get to winning some real wins. A 10 win season wont mean anything to me if we lose to ND, UM, and Clemson.
Yes, because clearly some of the fans aren't the greatest out there.
Frankly, if Fuente puts a winning team out there, he's done his job. But things might go a bit smoother for him if he strokes everybody's fur now and then (players and fans).
Umm I'm pretty sure Whit's goals are more than "go 7-5"... Fuentes job a bit more than that and rightfully so. This is not uva football.
When I said "winning team", I didn't mean 7-5.
I meant winning in the sense that they've publicly said it - getting into championship games and winning those. Or moving towards that situation.
But that wasn't really even the point of the comment. The point was that some of the angst on here is over Fuente not engaging the community enough, and that an effort in that area might mitigate some of the criticism he's getting right now.
Stop losing to bullshit teams like GT, BC, and Pitt. Period. Get back to the top of the coastal consistently. Don't get your ass kicked in every way by 7-7 Pittsburgh.. don't let Paul Johnson chuckle at your soft ass team on the sideline. Get the program past that bullshit.
At least now PJ will be chuckling from his sofa (or fishing vessel if he's like Bowden).
He could start by letting the spring game be televised and maybe consider not running the program like a Warsaw Pact country.
Achtung!
Honest question...besides opening up the spring game more, how do you want him to engage the fan base? What did Beamer do that was different?
I honestly don't care if the guy ever talks, as long as we win.
I honestly think the Spring Game and closed practices are what irks reports and the fanbase.
I think a good compromise for someone like Coach Fu, who doesn't like to show he hand, is to hire a talented video guy that can keep the fans engaged with the program while still being able to control the overall narrative. Clemson does a great job with these vlog type videos and I also love watching our bball's teams beyond the arc series. Gives a sense of a peek into the inside without divulging too much info.
I would love to see a Beyond the Arc-esque piece for the football team. Those are a blast to watch.
Beamer typically had three open scrimmages leading up to the spring game, allowed the spring game to broadcasted on WatchESPN, had some open practices for students, things like that.
I think - in the shadow of the recent transfer news - is even tweeting something saying 'we wish the best and will always welcome him back to Virginia Tech. Once a Hokie, Always a Hokie."
But to say nothing only leads to speculation, especially when former players are hinting at it being a culture problem, or Fu not caring about his players.
Thank you
To be quite honest I'm not sure the man could have handled the last three years any better. Look at the chaos/dumpster fires at other programs that had legendary coaches step down/get fired and all.
We all hate losing, we all hate seeing players transfer (hello new transfer rules), and we are all frustrated (coaches and players).
This may also not be a popular opinion...we've got to let go of the Beamer years. Comparing Fuente to the best of that era is simply not fair...lest we forget the last half dozen or so years of Beamer's decline that was inherited.
Fuente was also blessed with a senior laden team his first year (thank you Sam Rogers), that remarkably made it to the ACCCG and nearly beat dare I say...Clemson. Those lofty achievements only made many of us harken back to the glory days of the Beamer era, myself included. Unfortunately given all the recruiting missing, players not panning out, injuries, and dismissals we are in the thick of a rebuild not reload situation.
Can VT rebuild into a national contender? Possibly. Is Fuente the man to do it? Who knows, but perhaps 8-10 win seasons is the ceiling for this program with the occassional run at an ACC championship and playoff run.
Bottom line, if we go another 25 years without a losing season, I'll be a happy Hokie. Not many other programs can claim that!
this is accurate. well said.
VT is a long game strategy, but fans want short game results.
And that's precisely the combination that cratered Tennessee.
and Nebraska
Fuente handled the hand off well, but the team is passed that phase. In three recruiting classes, he's failed to address depth issues in the secondary and at defensive tackle. He's marginally improved recruiting, but has been unable to consistently recruit inside the top 25. His offense has not delivered on expectations, and hasn't resembled the identity that he sold to us on day one (tempo). He has not made an effort to engage fans, and has actually done the opposite.
Now, there's a variety of reasons for the subpar results, some of which are in Fuente's control, some are not, and most are somewhere in between. That said, Fuente is either failing drastically, or the unluckiest coach in the ACC.
And all of this is happening while he has put up an iron curtain around the program, completely cutting it off from fans and boosters.
We don't know what is going on behind closed doors. What is making its way to the other side of the curtain is painting an ugly picture of a completely dysfunctional locker room with a nasty split among players who are with him and players who are pissed at how he's treated some of their teammates. And on the field, we lost to ODU and got thoroughly embarrassed by GT and Pitt, so bad in the Pitt game they would have set an NCAA record for yards per play, only not getting it because they weren't on the field long enough to run enough plays to quality for the honor. And all of this while the offense sputtered badly, spinning its wheels against defenses it had no business spinning its wheels against.
So yeah, agreed the initial transition was handled very well, but right now, as someone who isn't plugged into the program, it looks like we're on the verge of falling off a damn cliff.
I'm not at all convinced that either of those is true. I mean there certainly was some bad luck losing some players to injury or legal difficulties of their own making, but that doesn't make him the "unluckiest".
I'm willing to give him some time to realize the vision he has for the team, even if he doesn't broadcast the spring game on ESPN.
As far as the players who have left, best of luck to them, but don't be trolling the program. Trolling the program is more a sign that the individual wasn't cutting it, and STILL isn't, and isn't focusing their energies very well.
I want Fuente to tell us what the hell is going on with the program
Personally, Fuente and the staff don't need to "win me back" as a fan. I'm still supportive of him and the team, will still watch all the games and follow too much recruiting in the offseason.
I know there are some who feel differently, but my stance as a fan is that it is my job to support the team and cheer loud and enjoy success when it comes, but remain a faithful supporter when it doesn't come (obviously there is a limit to this, but that limit doesn't have to do with the success of the teams and more to do with unethical behavior and immoral practices - of course fans shouldn't support that). The athletic department and Whit's job is to hold the coaches to an acceptable standard and make decisions to hire and fire coaches.
Im with you on this Davids Rabbit.
Im not sure hes 'lost' the fan base - maybe a small, but loud subset. But overall, I think most are happy with the back to back 9+ wins season and understand last year was an anomaly in having an uncharacteristically horrible defense from someone who after the first game of the season (and I still consider) was a shoe in to be a hall of fame Defensive coordinator.
Now, if our offense doesnt take a few strides forward next season and display some flash - depending on the win/loss record - I could see dissension growing. Or our defense falling on its face once again.
he hasn't "lost the fan base" as fans. hes losing the trust in him from the fan base. trust is the basis of every relationship. if you don't trust the people the fans are in a relationship with then there is only the picture you paint in your head. right or wrong. but when you see a bunch of shady stuff going on your imagination will get the best of you. and that's whats going on with the "fans that he is losing" hes not doing anything to make us believe anything other than what we are seeing. Hes losing our trust and hes not doing anything to restore it. and our imagination is taking what weve seen on twitter, and TKP, and the rumors, and the transfer portal, and the news and we are RUNNNNINGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG
I think some information has come out since this post that's relevant, including the written statement from Fuente, and a lot of positive tweets from the current team members.
#ITSTARTSNOW
It's the simple answer but if he wins with his players the way he wants to I'm willing to overlook how many guys who "aren't his guys" are leaving and making it look like a bad situation on their way out.
But based on last year I am extremely skeptical of that. As somebody in another thread said, this feels much more like Chip Kelly in Philly than it does Buzz cleaning house and building his team up. If there isn't a tangible 2+ win improvement in this team next year I'd take a hard look at firing Fuente and starting over again.
He hasn't lost me yet. None of the recent transfers make me all that concerned, even Kumah. Without Kumah we'll still have Turner, Grimsley and Hazleton as our top 3, and plenty of interesting options beyond those guys.
Cunningham and McClease are just JAGs. Nothing against them, but Cunningham was likely gonna have a minimal role, and frankly I don't think McClease is any better than the rest of our RBs. Our running game will likely be mediocre next season regardless unless King tears it up day one or Devon Hunter is a revelation.
Joshua Jackson is potentially the most concerning, since Hooker could be transferring as well leaving us real thin at QB in 2020. But Fuente's had success finding JUCO QBs with Evans and Willis. If Patterson isn't ready to take over by his 3rd year maybe he'll snag another Jerod Evans from the Portal.
His on field performance doesn't concern me quite yet either. He went 6-7 last season, but I predicted we'd go 6-6 before the year started given what happened last offseason. The ODU loss stings, but besides that and our inconsistency on offense most of the year I wasn't surprised by the results.
But Beamer's guys are almost all gone, and it's now more or less his team. He has an incredibly soft schedule with maybe 2 games i'd call pretty tough (Notre Dame and perhaps Miami depending on how their new coach does). If we go 7-5 or worse and the unrest persists in the program then that panic button will start looking far more attractive. Even 8 or 9 wins probably make me have some doubts. However if he wins 10+ games and the team demonstrates growth i won't have any issues.
8 or 9 wins will give me doubts??? Soft schedule for sure, but be reasonable. Look at Nebraska, Tennessee, USC etc and be careful what you wish for
All I said is that I may start having some doubts about Fuente if we end up 9-4 or 8-5 (9 wins might be harsh but still), not that we should kick his butt to the curb. But i think with an easier schedule, a core group a year older and, current transfers aside, presumably a less tumultous off-season and in-season, going 9-3 with this schedule and winning the bowl game shouldn't be too ridiculous to expect. I mean he accomplished that his first two seasons as our coach.
Right now? Start recruiting better and unlock the doors around the Chocolate factory to let the fanbase be more engaged and the program be less secretive.
Future? Win.
This piece is so frustrating. Realistically, it would take no effort to have a couple open scrimmages during the spring/fall. The spring game is already as vanilla as possible, so why not broadcast it? It seems low risk/cost, high reward to me.
Exactly, I don't see the value in keeping the doors closed, at all.
Does Fuente think someone will watch and know all our secrets? ESPN spent all August every time I turned on my TV broadcasting Alabama's August camp. All that vital information that was exposed made Alabama only win all of their regular season games by 22 or more !!!
Totally agree and would love to see Spring Game televised again. It is mystifying. Do we know if it was Fuente's call, or was it the Athletic Department trying increase turnout/ concessions and swag revenue?
I'm going to go out on a limb here and suggest that Alabama has less blatant holes in their team than VT does. They're a super-team, 4 deep. VT does not have a deep bench. If we lose one game during the season because an opposing coach saw something/someone to exploit in film from the spring game, was it worth it?
I get that fans really want to know more about the team, but at this point in the team's development, and with as many changes that will be happening over the next year or so, I'll go with Fuente's opinion, no matter what it is.
How many fans really care all that much who aren't able to go to the game? I'd guess not so many. Maybe 100 here? Maybe 100 on TSL? For me, they can go to the game. I wouldn't trade one regular season loss (or even 3 regular season points) for a televised Spring game. Even if you disagree, you have to acknowledge the possibility.
I don't think he has to win back the fanbase per se. I think he could do some basic things to earn some trust back, such as being more open about the recent attrition without throwing players under the bus needlessly, making more practices open etc. He also needs to win games that he should win and not get shitwhipped by teams in Lane. The offense needs to be much closer to what he advertised this year. It's put up or shut up now.
He kept the bowl streak and UVA streak alive (albeit with a decent measure of luck), and that counts for something. But so far the on field product isn't what we would have expected from a so called "offensive guru."
Walk over the Hahn Hurst and talk to Buzz. Buzz gets it with his Get Better vids, twitter, etc.
Televise spring game
And win
I'm not entirely sure Fuente has "lost the fanbase".
Some of the people here are nervous, and some are downright negative, but when haven't they been?
🤙
Some of the fanbase lost their minds though
To be clear, I didn't say, nor intend to say, that he "lost the fanbase", although I understand how the title implies that. A more nuanced rephrasing might be to say that I think he's lost a certain level of trust with the fanbase due to both an historically bad season and recent events. That's hard to deny.
So I feel he hasn't lost me yet. This past season I had 3 requirements to be on par with him moving the program forward. Beat GT, UVA, and keep the bowl streak alive. He was 2 out of 3 with an impossibly young and depleted defense. So he didn't check all the boxes but I realize that some of that was out of his control and he did what he could with what he had.
Unfortunately he has to do more this year for me to keep being on his side for the betterment of this program. He must Beat ODU, GT, UVA, and a bowl game. I would like for more but I try to keep the requirements realistic for where we are as a program. We are not Clemson and we are not Georgia, but we should be there soon if Fuente is the right man for the job. The jury is still out on that.
I would also like to say that this is the first time I remember VT making a HC coaching change, born 6 months before Beamer was hired. The football landscape has changed in that time and how things are done. We haven't been in this position in a long time. Please don't try to get rid of a good coach because we are impatient. I do feel some more insight would do him well in the long run. I feel the inhouse vlog videos would quiet a lot of fans.
Post a video of winter workouts combined with coaches working the phones and making visits to Dolly Parton's "Nine to Five." Hey, you asked!
Clark Rutland has a good point. Things were very different when CJF played, but he was a transfer, so what these athletes are going through is not completely foreign to him.
I didnt think people needed to be won back
Hookers and blow
Found Hugh Freeze's TKP account.
More transparency and more wins on the field. Recruiting wins would also help
I dont know if it really will help. I mean we got Hunter - Payoute - Dax - Quincy - Dylan Rivers - Tre Turner - Hudson - JR Walker - Tayvion Robinson
It seems like recruiting will always be chasing the dragon - it will never be enough.
I agree with wins - I also think an offense that moves the ball and scores as well in the 2nd half as the first
I suppose you're right about the recruiting. I personally don't really follow recruiting - I just sense quite a bit of angst around it on TKP so I just sort of assumed it hasn't been very good.
I agree with you on the offense too. As far as many fans are concerned, Fuente was hired to bring an offense to Blacksburg. And as Chris has so plainly laid out, he's largely failed in that regard. Sure, we've looked like world beaters against some lesser teams but when our offense has only managed to eclipse 24(?) points against ACC opponents 3(?) times in 16 tries over the last two years that can be a bit of a concern.
Do the fans have the patience to wait and see what Fuente is trying to build? I'm not sure. I'll admit that my patience has worn thin. My concern is that we don't seem to improve markedly in any area over the course of the season. The same silly mistakes seemingly plague us for entire seasons. Mistakes that happen for many teams early in the year and are often attributed to rust from the off season. Many teams iron those out but VT seems to stagnate. That concerns me.
Seems to me that the offense HAS changed for the better. If the defense had been what we've had in the past, a lot of this year's losses turn into wins. I see a lot of talent on the offense this year.
I remember VT teams that only had a defense. Remember when Beamer celebrated a 0-0 tie with Wake Forest? For me it seems like people have selective memories. I can remember low-scoring games when we had no confidence whatsoever in the offense. If the other team scored, there was no way we were coming back from that. If we're within a score or two now, you'd better stay to the end, because we're still in it.
So to throw in the towel on Fuente now just seems silly. How long do you give the next coach? 3 years? Just add a couple of years onto what you've already given Fuente. Then you'll know if it worked or not.
Patience is a virtue.
Win if not wait for Oklahoma state job to open and he can leave
Fuente needs to come up to the mike and say things like: They're a good team with a lot of good athletes; they'll really get after ya; That's outta whack (when asked about players entering the transfer portal); We were one block away; and Let's go Krogering. If he sounds just like Beamer and says essentially nothing but coach speak, will that make a lot of people feel better?
I get that people want to "have more access" to practices. But what does that really mean? It's not like there were a ton of fans going to every practice. It was mostly the press. And that can be a distraction, especially when you're working fundamentals with young players. The Instagram account gives us some idea of what is happening at practice. And reporters do have sessions to see what is going on, even if the time is limited.
I understand that people want to know what's going on but would it really make you feel better to know that QB1 has a hard time hitting a receiver on a crossing route? We all saw that plenty in games, so I think we already know that. Having a bunch of people hanging around reporting doom and gloom because QB1 can't make that throw doesn't lend itself to a conducive learning environment. I am okay with not knowing that QB1 can throw something other than a 50/50 ball when the game is on the line because the opposing D shouldn't know it either. And if he can pick up the read option and get better at selling the RPO? Watch out now!
I agree with most people on here by saying winning. Winning cures a lot of things. It improves recruiting. It makes people happy.
Yeah, I'm OK with not televising the Spring game. You want to see the Spring game? Get a ticket.
I don't buy that this moves the needle one iota with 98% of the fanbase. Nobody is going to overlook a bad loss or bad record on account of televising the Spring game. It's just an accessible gripe when VT does have a bad loss or bad record.
The people griping about Fuente were going to be griping about him no matter what. It's human nature to form an opinion, and to then find things to support it.
We had a number of fans griping that our run of 10 win seasons wasn't good enough. Unrealistic expectations coupled with the kinds of trouble other teams have experienced as well have lead to some of this angst, but I'm of the opinion that twitter is also to blame, hooking up the dissatisfied with the dissatisfied to make it seem like a movement.
Yes, last year sucked. Yes, we expected more from Fuente offensively. But some of the stuff I'm reading here is disappointing to me and shows that for some, Fu's only way out is to win the ACC and play in the playoffs. Of course, that still won't be enough for some folks.
Spot on. And if you have your doubts, consider that there were Alabama fans wanting to move on from Saban after this year's championship game.
ultimately twitter and TKP is not going to determine if Fuente keeps his job or not. That will come down to Whit, Dr Sands and VT's large donors.
Twitter, despite my personal distrust of it, is not to blame because ultimately people are responsible for their own assessment of information being presented to them. If someone gets easily persuaded, as I have done in the past (Bitter's comments on Barber, for example), to believe what's in a tweet without further context and validity then likely it doesn't matter what medium they receive information they just want to believe it to validate their own speculation.
I do agree about fans unrealistic expectations though. I remember fans griping about how 10 wins seasons aren't enough for Beamer to keep his job.
Unfortunately, social media does affect public perception.
These days, twitter reactions get people fired, and create fairly quick change to both public and private corporate policy. I do think too much negative social media can hurt any organization, including a college football team.
If the social media gets out of hand, you'd better get a handle on it, or you could be out of a job.
Let me be clear here. I consistently call twitter evil, but I'm not stupid. I know it is the use of it that can be a negative thing, so perhaps I do the knee jerk thing anytime twitter even gets mentioned. I know I am old and in the damn way when it comes to social media, but I think it is negative, overall, in its effects on modern life. TKP absolutely doesn't have anything to do with Fuente keeping his job, but twitter, on the other hand, may play a part.
I'd go one step further, and suggest that TKP and TSL, when mixed with Twitter, could have some influence. I know for a fact that Bitter reads these forums, and people read his columns.
Different social media affect each other, and the consumers of the information.
I'd like to agree with this but objectively I don't think that's true these days. Without Twitter, I think there's a very good chance Greg Schiano is head coach at Tennessee right now.
And that is a horrible thing. I would have loved to see the former Rutgers coach as the head coach of Tennessee.
I'll be honest....he hasn't lost me. It does not bother me if we don't get a ton of information in his interviews, it does not bother me if we don't get practice reports, and it doesn't bother me if guys transfer. I'll admit that these recent transfers do not look good, but I also think that times have changed in college football and players transfer to try and move to team for a better opportunity. I wish guys would compete more to try and win a starting job instead of leaving, but what can you do?
I think Fuente is a really good coach, he has his standards, he has his philosophy and the team needs to buy in. I think we'll see more of that as the team is filled with his recruits.
I would rather have a team filled with guys that want to be a part of the team than dudes that are miserable and potentially dividing the locker room.
I don't think he will lose the fanbase until he
has a losing season;has a mass exodus of quality players;doesn't deliver a world beating offense;has a mediocre defense; loses to LOLUva.I never left as a fan. However, I want my Hokie football toughness back! Bring it Whit!
And the
Richmond paper is so on it. This has been going on for more than 2 weeks!
I'd take Paul Woody's opinion with a grain of salt.
Some of you with the loudest pitch forks say the dumbest shit
What kind of sound does a pitchfork make? I wouldn't know, I don't have one.
Maybe a tuning fork?
I don't know where to put this but I just talked to someone in the program. Asked 2 questions
Is Tre leaving? "Nope, no chance"
How did the team meeting go? "Really well"
I got some other info as well. I know that isn't ground breaking stuff but I was a bit concerned about some rumors still floating around so that's what I asked.
Awesome, thank you
There's only one thing that Fu and company have lost - excuses.
Not OKOG's (culture) - check
Lost to Draft - check
Academic Issues - check
Won't block - check
We're effectively a JV squad - check
Not bought in - check
Out of shape/bad work ethic - check
Anything else I forgot - check
The decks are clear with only "fu's guys" left. Now it's time to take the car out on the road and START DRIVING!
BTW: Whit has given Fu the time and patience for a long term base of players! I'm pretty excited to see where this car goes!
Yeah it's true. A few things I would like to see moving forward. Fuente to be a little more outspoken about his players (outwordly supportive). To grant a bit more access to the program so the media and fanbase isn't as frustrated. And better roster management. The distribution of scholarships and some glaring misses on the recruiting trail partially lead to what we saw on the field this season.
A lot is being said here about winning back the fan base but I'd appreciate more if he'd win back the alumni.
They played here and their ongoing support matters. Some of what we've seen in the twitterverse has been coming from former players, which is something I'd really like to squash. For us to be able to sell the family atmosphere and the 'this is home' message, we need to start treating those guys more like family.
I think the topic for this thread is a false premise to begin with. The transfers transferred about the same time because you lose your scholarship unless you wait till the beginning of the semester to announce your transfer according to the new transfer rules. Most of the players transferring have a very good reason for transferring, in most cases because they've been on first string in the past and it's very unlikely that they're going to remain on first string next year. It makes sense from a personal standpoint that they did what they did. Just because a couple malcontents, one who has a felony dismissal on his record, make a bunch of whoopie about this on Twitter, I don't see this as losing the fan base. This is not something that should have upset us this much when we look at a lot of other schools undergoing the same problem. It actually makes it interesting to me to see if there might be transfers from other schools that we might pick up in areas of great need now that all the names are out there on the transfer portal.