The 2003 Insight bowl was on last night
At the time I wasn't a Hokies fan or a CFB game follower
I learned a lot, mostly about Aaron Rodgers but also Kevin Jones
And the ups and downs of special teams, yeeesh
But mostly losing to BC UVA AND WVU
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I happened to flip it on right when DeAngelo hall ran back a punt for a td to tie the game with 3 minutes left. I wasnt a fan back then but what a wild game
I was surfing and beering and in less than perfect shape when I also ran into the game. I picked it up in the second quarter and thought it was an Aaron Rodgers highlights tape, but it refreshed my memory of those days and those players. It was, indeed, a wild game. Damn, we had some players on that team.
I'm not sure exactly what you mean by a better year considering it is the first week of September. However, 2003 was a horrible season all things considered. The team had NFL talent and college stars up and down the roster and absolutely melted down half way through the season. I'm still not sure how that was not a top ten team.
By far the most disappointing season season i've had as a tech fan. The talent and experience on this year's team doesn't come close to 2003.
Also bailing on this year's team already would be like bailing on the 2004 team after losing to NC State at home week 2 or the 2010 after losing to JMU at home week 2.
You make a good point about bailing. I remember '95 and losing the first two games in pretty miserable fashion. I thought the season was done, but then we ran the table. I'm as guilty as anyone here of feeling less than happy right now, but perspective can only be gained by time, so I'll try to temper my trepidation until if/when that bubble is burst.
The first week of September is the needle that we seem to be thinking broke alot of our backs
The past 52 weeks being a lot. The narrow win over UVA vs a lose to uva in a season like that
Yeah, I can understand, I'm just not in that camp yet. Coincidentally, the 2003 season is pretty much the best example I can think of to illustrate that it's a long season and things can turn in a hurry.
IMO it started with missing Devyn Ford, followed by the Galen Scott Fiasco, followed by the start of the attrition, followed by a subpar season, followed by more attrition, followed by a poorly perceived WR hire, followed by a mediocre recruiting class, followed by a bad start to the 2019 season.... The bleeding has to stop
Literally it all started after the Fu contract extension. All things considered at the close of the 2017 season, Fu had taken us to consecutive 10 and 9 win seasons, and an ACCCG appearance. Big name schools were rumored to be pursuing Fuente, and it seemed we had one of the top up and coming coaches in the nation. We lock him up for a ridiculous deal with almost fully guaranteed money and then it started hitting the fan. Roster attrition, Galen fiasco, missing on Ford, awful 2018, toxic locker room, etc. How we got to this point from where we were sitting at the end of 2017 I have no idea.
I mean, I thought the Fu contract extension was a good thing at the time. I wouldn't consider that the beginning of the downfall, because it hadn't started yet.
At the time, many of us breathed a sigh of relief that he was locked in.
I firmly believe that no 6 year contract should be extended before a minimum of halfway through.
A narrow win over UVa when we're clawing by our fingernails for bowl eligibility is still a win.
Not what we want, but I'll take it.
what do you call a team that ekes out an overtime win in their 11th game and then has to schedule a special 12th game just get to 6 wins?
bowl eligible
Exactly. Also: UVa streak intact.
Its not our fault a 12th game had to be rescheduled. We had 12 games scheduled to begin with
Not FSU
I was a junior in 03 and remember it being a really weird year obviously. I was part of a group of 50 or so that rented a charter bus to go to Morgantown for that game. The drive home SUUUUUCKED. Then I remember the absolute elation of the Miami win. To this day never been part of something like that or the scene downtown afterwards. As I am from the Philly area, I attended that Temple game at the Linc, and even that one some troubling signs were showing up big time. We won on a missed play in OT.
Hell, even the memory of the aTm game in the "hurricane" was really really awesome. Just recall being absolutely soaked through and having the time of my life with my dad in town with his buddies to catch that game. The remember thinking that their fans were very cool to talk football with in town beforehand, but these days I find them to be as obnoxious as it gets. (SEC, it just means more)
That team had so much talent but just enough poor attitudes to blow it up at the end when adversity set in. Quite a shame. At least this years BC game I didn't see any quit in the guys, I most certainly did in 03. But from a pure talent standpoint its not even close, that 03 team would most likely kill our current squad
Carter Warley had money on that game unfortunatley, and Cal could throw in between the hashes for 15 yards or more ANY time they wanted in that game. Exposed a glaring weakness to the point Bud had to change his scheme. Our Whip backer could not cover slot receivers in that scheme. At all.
I think Warley had money on that entire season. He missed more extra points that year than we did field goals from 2007-2010.
I had a really good friend on the VT softball team at that time, and all the parties at their apartment had a bunch of FB players show up. I am fairly certain at one point I told Carter to his face that my 13 year old brother could kick better than he could. Beer may or may not have been involved.
*Hears the words Carter Warley*
Talent-wise, that was a great roster for us, definitely better than the 2004 squad.
But the "team" part was lacking. It seemed we had a lot of "me-first" attitudes going on, and not much cohesion.
As disappointing as 2003 was, it made the total turnaround of the program in 2004 all the more amazing. For me, 2004 was the most enjoyable season I've had as a Hokies fan (besides maybe the 1999 national title game run).
Between Bud revamping his scheme, the new stars at WR (Royal, Harper, Morgan) and on D (Tapp, Adibi, Hall), Bryan Randall's leadership, and putting physical beat downs on our new soft-as-butter ACC opponents, 2004 was pure Hokie pride.
Back then, you could tell from their body language that ACC teams simply hadn't been used to being hit like Virginia Tech laid the lumber back then.
MV5 getting suspended really helped Randell just be the leader of that team. He split time every year with another QB. He just balled out that year.
I forget, did he split '02 w/ Noel?? Because it felt like he (Randall) started (& played) the bulk of the games that season. I remembered he split '03 w/ MV5. Was Noel originally named the starter for '02 & then benched for Randall (I forgot what happened in the off-season after that pathetic showing vs FSU in the Gator Bowl, which my da & I had the misfortune of attending. I remembered we finished the '01 season a paltry 8-4)??
Noel was the starter coming into 02, then he got hurt and Randall took over.
It was better (record & talent wise) than last season.
2003 was a fiasco. By all accounts, that team hated each other by the end of the season. I remember after DeAngelo Hall got ejected for fighting Antrel Rolle during the Miami game, he was about to fight Keith Willis on our sideline. It was on national television for the whole country to see. A team beating the 2nd ranked team in the country 31-7 in the 4th quarter was ready to fight each other on the sideline. They almost lost to Temple, who was literally the worst team in college football back then, they lost to Boston College who hadn't beaten us since 1995, they lost to UVA (speaks for itself), and they lost to Cal while Aaron Rodgers literally laughed at our defense. They went 2-5 in their last 7 games, and it came right after the 2001 and 2002 seasons too, which saw Tech finish both seasons 2-4 after roaring starts. At that time, it was clear that something was inherently wrong with the culture of Virginia Tech football. Too much talent and experience to be doing that shit. Right now, we have the talent but not quite the experience. I have my concerns with this staff, but we shouldn't feel how we did after 2003.
There is not nearly as much talent in the program now as there was then. Not near as much. Young or not
This reality doesn't get enough credit for the results on the field these days. It's not remotely close. Today's roster much more closely resembles a middle tier G5 roster. That squad, however poorly managed, had elite level talent and legit P5 starters at every position with at least serviceable depth.
Yep... That 2003 secondary is light years ahead of this one. the DL was much better too. Nathaniel Adibi is better than any DE we have had in 5 years.
Talent wise, yes that secondary was better. Discipline wise, god no. Jimmy Williams, Eric Green, and DeAngelo Hall all had their own agendas to the point where they moved Williams to corner so all he had to do was cover someone and told Green to get his shit together or they'd start Roland Minor or DJ Parker. I'd rather have a secondary that is disciplined and has lapses on 4 or 5 plays in a season opener than one that is giving up 400 yards to and getting laughed at by the opposing team's quarterback in the final game.
LOL- 3 NFL draft pics in a meaningless bowl game vs. Aaron Rodgers or Farley blowing coverage and Quillen looking lost and getting torched by run-first BC. LOL. Neither one of those guys will sniff the NFL draft. No comparison in talent- none.
Bowl games meant a little more back then. Meaningless bowl game today? Yes. Meaningless bowl game back then? No.
Quillen will not be a pro, you are correct. Farley still has the potential I believe. Anyone with that size and talent does. And my point is that the 2003 defense was freelancing basically the entire second half of that season with the exception of the Miami game. At least this defense stays disciplined. If Waller was an Eric Green, DeAngelo Hall, or Jimmy Williams back in 2003, he doesn't get that INT because he is out of position.
This is dramatic. We have the talent of a middle tier P5 team. And that's exactly what we are.
2004 didn't have as much talent as 2003, though, and managed to rebound and have a great season by being a unified team. After the tough loss to NC State, they rebounded and won 8 straight riding the backs of freshman receivers in the two deep on offense and freshman in the two deep all over the defense. I think this team has potential to do the same if they don't throw in the towel, and, given the offseason language, I don't think that's going to happen.
If Willis doesn't throw 4 picks in the first game, we're not having this discussion right now. We're 1-0 and cruising to 4-0. Will Stewart brought up a great point in his podcast. Bryan Randall was an average quarterback all the way up to that WVU game in 2004, then he turned it on and flipped the whole season around. Maybe this Boston College game was the 2004 NC State game. Maybe Willis will start taking care of the ball and go on a tear. Maybe the defense will eliminate those 4 or 5 plays that cost us the game. Or maybe none of that will happen and the Boston College game was just another game that will be lumped together with the decline of Virginia Tech football under Fuente. We really don't know yet.
After the USCW game, felt like there was a greater positivity among the fanbase en masse (even regardless of the NCSU bump). And that '04 team STILL had talent the dwarfs this current one.
After the NC State game, though, there was less positivity. I'm pretty sure NC State had like 10 sacks that game.
Yeah I was at that game. It wasn't very positive when it was over lol. We were in the SEZ and that kick at the end looked good to me.
I would actually say that the 2004 team may have had the most talent of any team in VT history, including the 1999 team. Although VT only had 3 players drafted in the 2005 draft, many of the starters on the 2004 team were too young for the 2005 or even 2006 drafts.
Here is a list of starters/major contributors that played in 2004 and were eventually drafted:
-Eric Green (2005 draft, 3rd round)
-Jimmy Williams (2006, 2nd)
-Eddie Royal (2008, 2nd)
-Vincent Fuller (2005, 4th)
-Xavier Adibi (2008, 4th)
-Josh Morgan (2008, 6th)
-Cedric Humes (2006, 7th)
-Aaron Rouse (2007, 3rd)
-James Anderson (2006, 3rd)
-Chris Ellis (2008, 3rd)
-Jimmy Martin (2006, 7th)
-Daryl Tapp (2006, 2nd)
-Jonathan Lewis (2006, 6th)
-Will Montgomery (2006, 7th)
-Brandon Frye (2007, 5th)
-Jon Dunn (2005, 6th)
-Justin Harper (2008, 7th)
-David Clowney (2007, 5th)
-Jeff King (2006, 5th)
-Carlton Powell (2008, 5th)
That's 20 future NFL players on the field for the Hokies in 2004!
And here are some other players who were either undrafted studs, or eventual pros who were on the team but didn't play much in 2004:
Bryan Randall (2004 ACC Player of the Year, but wasn't drafted)
Vince Hall (2006 1st team All-ACC, best ILB in VT history, but wasn't drafted)
Brandon Flowers (2008, 2nd, but was a freshman in 2004)
Duane Brown (2008, 1st as a LT, but was a TE in 2004)
Justin Hamilton (2006, 7th as a FS, but was a TB in 2004)
Man that 2003 collapse sure gave the fanbase a complex about talent at Virginia Tech.
Should have been the best secondary in school history, and they got shredded in the passing game that season. No QB play (freshman Randall was very limited) either. The low point was DeAngelo Hall running away from trying to tackle Heath Miller in the UVA game. That UVA game just about killed my interest in the program. You could tell there was a sour locker room, and conversations after the fact affirmed it. It was no accident that a much less talented team with some cancers removed were a much better team the following season.
There are so many parallels to this team and the 2004 team in that regard. Here's hoping that the early season stumble in a game we should have won is an indictor of a championship.
I'd put the 2005 VT defensive backfield (Macho Harris, Jimmy Williams, Roland Minor, Brandon Flowers, DJ Parker, Justin Hamilton and Aaron Rouse) or the 2006 backfield (Harris, Minor, Kam Chancellor, Flowers, Parker and Rouse, with Brenden Hill at whip) ahead of the talent/potential/production of the 2003 group any day of the week. That was DBU at it's peak.
I also heard at the time that the 2003 team had locker room cancers (spoiler alert: it was DeAngelo Hall, who years later became known as a great locker room leader in the NFL). But the 2004 roster was overflowing with talent unlike any other year in VT history. The huge upgrades at DE (Tapp and Burchette), WR (Royal, Morgan, Harper, Clowney) and LB (Hall and Adibi), as well as the improved play of Bryan Randall (sorry to nitpick but Randall was a junior in 2003), made the 2004 team one of the top 3 or 4 VT teams in history, in my opinion.
Randall was a junior in 2003. I'm not sure he was properly developed though, given how the entire fan base wanted him playing in 2001 and 2002 over Grant Noel.
The uniforms were certainly better.
I can't say either way as we are only 1 game into the 2019 season. I can say this though... Regardless of how that 2003 season went down, we all still knew what VT football under Frank Beamer was and was supposed to be, and he got right back to that in 2004.
With the program under Fuente, I still have no idea what VT football is supposed to be.
I watched some of the game last night, and couldn't bring myself to watch the second half. I knew what was coming, and didn't want to go through that again.
I was a brand new hokie freshman in 2003, so yes, 2003 was a much better year.