Late Night Expansion Updates

College football's high stakes game of chicken continues. To keep everyone up to date. BearsTruth.com (part of the 247Sports network) reported FSU and Clemson will let the ACC know they're looking around.

Sources out of South Carolina and Florida have indicated the deals have been agreed upon for Clemson and Florida State to notify the ACC of their intent to explore other conferences. Then the two universities will need to submit an application to the Big 12. Big 12 presidents will need to approve the applications and welcome the two newest members.

Then the dominos fall.

They also report Virginia Tech is among Georgia Tech, Louisville, Pitt, and Notre Dame as, "looking at the two seats to 14 to match the SEC in conference size."

Then there's this quote (full audio here) from ESPN's Chris Low on the Paul Finebaum radio show.

Not only would Virginia Tech be another quality tradition rich football program in the SEC, but they'd add a new state to the SEC's existing footprint. They could deliver Virginia, and perhaps Washington DC TV viewers to an SEC television network.

Finally, it looks like David Teel caught up with Jim Weaver this evening.

I'm not going to overreact to Weaver's comments. I don't believe he's numb to the situation, and he's a smart savvy guy. Also, I had to remind myself that even though he's athletic director, he's just one of a handful of decision makers.

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Comments

to be fair

nothing has changed in weaver's home office, the bed, tv and remote are where they have always been.

i kid, jim, i kid. don't go interwebs witching hunting me.

i actually think he is on top of this and their is an AD movement to bounce if fsu and clemson bolt.

Maybe Weaver hasn't had expansion discussions... this year

But he's lying if he ever tells you he and/or VT didn't have them with the SEC last year. The SEC knows where we stand. We stay put as long as the current situation doesn't change. A soon as the current situation changes, it's time to talk. Weaver in his comments last year pretty much said, we're staying in the ACC as long as it stays viable. He didn't define viable but an ACC without Clemson and FSU, from a financial standpoint is no longer viable. That 17 million a year, already less than the big-4 conferences shrinks to probable 10-12 million a year. As a football program, you can't compete with the Big-4 when you're making at least 10 million a year less then they are.

can we finally

put the "ACC is a good fit for VT" sound byte to rest? Yes, I think we finally can.

Weaver might have said that he hadn't discussed "conference" options with anyone, but he sure as $hit has discussed VT options with people....

No, we cannot, because it remains correct.

In terms of athletic budget, academic/athletic balance (both in rankings and our admissions department's refusal to take OL jucos with nine transferable credits after two years), existing academic partnerships with peer institutions, location of the school, geography of the student draw and geography of the alumni base, the ACC is light years ahead of any other conference as a fit for Virginia Tech.

In the SEC, we would be bottom-half in revenue and budget, jockeying with A&M for #3 in academics (and, as such, continuing to refuse to take players who can't read), holding zero existing partnerships to the south, averaging 10 hours away from our conference mates, and with a main alumni base four and a half hours farther northeast than that. Enjoy those huge Hokie crowds you see at our current conference road games? They won't happen when every single road game is at least eight and a half hours or a $400 plane ticket from Northern Virginia.

We may have to leave anyway because of the money of the nascent playoff system. But it will be a damned tragedy to have to leave the conference we spent fifty years trying to get into. As everyone but one snotty UNC professor finally admitted in 2003-04, we belonged there all along.

all your points are true

But the sound byte needs to go away. It represents ideals that will not protect us in the changing landscape. The fact that at this moment in time we are where we need to be won't stop FSU and Clemson from leaving. Yes it is a shame but change is coming, we need to prepare for it in order to stay relevant and rid ourselves of the coaches' speak. Those 50 years are a Golden Age of college athletics that are being ushered out by less noble forces.

What's the truth to this jibber jabber I hear about the impact of VT leaving the ACC on UVa and how that could prevent VT from going? How would that even work? Is someone going to pressure VT from making a move unless there's a nice soft landing for UVa somewhere?

If FSU & Clemson leave, then I feel like it's everyone for themselves... let's GTFO to greener pastures.

The question becomes...

Do you prevent VT from leaving and harm both programs or do you at least ensure the viability of 1 of your instate programs? In other words, do you cut off your nose to spite your face?

You have to let VT take care of itself if it has that opportunity then, use your politics to try and get UVA into the BigG

Very good audio

If he's correct, it is Virginia Tech 1st that the SEC wants, worry about the 2nd team later. If the SEC's interest is this high in VT, and I do think it is, There is no way Weaver doesn't know this. In fact, I'm quite sure The SEC sent out feelers to VT last year when they were adding A&M. Weaver knows all of this. At the end of the day however, we're not going to leave the current situation unless the current situation changes.

VT is the most logical choice

I won't rehash why, we all know why. I think that NC State by default is the 2nd just to complete the map; can't have Virginia as a peninsula off of Kentucky.

The Big12

currently has a WV island and may get two more islands in FL and SC. None of the east coast schools would be linked, unless GT went as well.

Not excited by NC State, but who else would we want the SEC to take? Miami would be my #1 choice, but probably isn't the SEC's #1. Oh well, at least it isn't WF or Duke.

Why wouldn't Miami be their #1 choice? They have the best TV ratings by far of the remaining schools, and that is really all that matters. It doesn't matter if their fans suck, if academics suck, if non-revs suck. All that matters is $$$, as it should be.

A Few Reasons

1. SEC already has a TV presence in Florida.
2. There seems to be a gentlemen's agreement in place among the 14 schools not to invite any school already in a state with an existing SEC school.
3. And this is way down the ladder, looming NCAA sanctions.

#3 is a good point. Obviously in the case of the death penalty, Miami has no value to anyone. In other words, they're a perfect fit for the ACC. (ha... kind of)

In the case of #1, How many new markets can they really go after other than DC via VT? There are no other big markets that are contiguous with their footprint. Getting one of the top 10 highest rated teams in football is almost certainly more lucrative than expanding to Omaha or Topeka or something.

In the case of #2, I addressed in another post but if it looks like the ACC is not viable, I think all bets are off. State legislatures and governors will exert a lot of influence to make sure their schools survive just like Virginia did for us.

I think that's why most people believe they want a Carolina school. That's exposure to the Raleigh/Durham/Fayetteville makert (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_media_markets_and_college_football). If they nab NC State and Tech they'll reach from Flordia to DC, and from Florida to Texas.

I only think all bets are off if FSU and Clemson leave. Also remember Miami isn't a state school, it's private. I'm sure there are alumns with political power, but it won't be part of the public agenda.

I just don't think any North Carolina school could come anywhere close to generating the revenue that Miami can for the SEC regardless of georgraphic TV market. Miami has a national following. Miami could potentially get the SEC picked up in NYC.

And a 16 team SEC with VT, Tennessee and South Carolina would probably be on most NC TV sets anyway. An SEC network would definitely get picked up across the state. Just look at the random markets the Big 10 network gets picked up in.

SEC already has NYC Presence

The SEC already has a NYC presence with graduates moving up here for jobs and the what not. Any bar during the season is packed with ACC, SEC, and B1G fans from the Bowery to just south of Midtown (41st/42nd). Even Oklahoma has its own viewing areas. The problem then lies with getting residents to watch in their homes and with NYC being such a "pro-sports" town, I am not sure even adding Miami or ND to the SEC would generate a much greater following here.

Virginia Tech '08
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^^^these points are all great .. to clarify -- i don't think it's necessarily a gentleman's agreement with the whole conference, just an agreement among certain universities who do not want to have to compete with another in-state (namely florida, georgia, south carolina, kentucky) ... without those 4 .. i don't think that the remaining had enough votes

so that basically puts fsu, miami, clemson, ga tech, and louisville out of the picture .. it's VERY obvious that if the sec looks to expand past 14 that they'll be looking to grab a piece of the NC pie and DMV pie ... barring the near-zero-percent possibility that ND joins the SEC

Position of Safety

Frankly there is no need to get in a hurry to act. I know people are scared we will get left behind but it simply isn't going to happen. FSU and Clemson aren't going to the SEC because of USC and UF that leaves the SEC with slim pickings for a good expansion team, GT will probably be blocked by UGA, same goes for Louisville and Kentucky. That leaves VT as a geographic natural fit and a perfect fit with a solid history and rabid fan base. There is no need to panic, if the dominoes start to fall the SEC will most likely come calling and even if we arent the number one choice they will need to add two teams eventually. We are in a much better position than almost any other school not currently in the big four, and that gives us the liberty of waiting to see how this shakes out.

For those to come, reach for excellence

I agree that VT is in a good spot, but I don't get why South Carolina, Florida and Georgia are any different from Virginia. UVA was the reason we got into the ACC, and if the ACC is crumbling, state politicians will be playing every card they can to ensure the survival of all their state schools.

Dog eat dog

What UVA and, now senator, Warren did are the exception definitely not the rule. UVA wasn't a power in football in fear of losing recruits, every SEC school, including perennial third tier kentucky will want to protect its turf, I just don't see many schools/politicians going out on a limb to save a rival. But I could easily be wrong, we are all making this up as we go and firing from the hip.

For those to come, reach for excellence

But they won't have any cards to play except an attempt to try and make VT stay behind in the ACC to preserve UVA and the ACC. But I don't really see that happening, because I don't really think that's even a good strategy. VT and UVA will not preserve a crumbling ACC, so I'm sure that the state would rather have one school in a conference and one out than have two teams completely displaced.

Unless the politicians see the ACC as a viable option. In reality, the ACC would be losing two teams, but we just got two teams. Tech leaving would cause the crumbling of the ACC after FSU and Clemson, and force them to add at least one other team (big east). Of course, politicians trying to make Tech stay would basically be asking them to suck it up so UVA could enjoy the sports that VT doesn't care enough about to stay in the ACC for.

804

Trouble

Hoping this isn't a situation where we are wishing for something that is bad for us. I think I speak for all VT football fans when I say that the SEC is in all of our dreams at night and we would do DW backflips if we were to make the move. While recruiting would grow, I think we wouldn't like the change in expectations. Every team in the SEC at some point moves to average during stretches. I love going to the ACC championship pretty much every year and like having something to care about in the winter. At the end of the day though, I would love to see this come to life.

Think about this

Getting into the SEC championship game is a HUGE accomplishment. Not being the ACC championship game is a HUGE disappointment. Hell, the last National Champion didn't even play in the SEC championship. Bottom line, if you don't get into the SEC championship, you can still do big things in the playoff or bowl season. If you don't get into the ACC championship, enjoy the Belk Bowl.

At the end of the day

Like I said I would still choose to go like any other VT fan pretty much. I'm just hoping that the transition isn't as bumpy as I think it could be if we do end up going.

I'd much rather see 5-6 years of VT being an "average" SEC school followed by 2-3 years of dominance and playing for/winning a national title. It's time to move to a big boy football conference because even if VT goes undefeated in the ACC and there are two undefeated teams coming out of one of the other four big conferences, VT gets the shaft. Heck a 1 loss SEC champion would probably push an undefeated VT out of the national title game...

This. I really don't get any value from watching us beat Austin Peay and William and Mary by 50 points. I'd rather watch us lose a good game vs. Alabama or Tennessee. And sometimes, maybe more often than not, we'd be the ones winning those big games. That would be so much better than anything we have to look forward to now. As far as driving, Yeah we'd be able to travel to fewer games, but I'd rather watch VT-Alabama on TV than drive to Duke.

Big ACC

If FSU, VT, Miami, and Clemson left do you think there could be a merger between Big East and ACC?

-VT

WVU: "we'd rather not have to play FSU"

didnt they just pay an exorbitant amount to get out of doing so? Now the Noles come calling to the XII, eers are like shit! We cant get away!

"I'm just rocking the Fuller"-Kendall Fuller
"That kid you're talking to right there, I think he played his nuts off! And you can quote me on that shit!" -Bud Foster

SEC not a good fit

Who would be the closest opponent? Would you be able/willing to attend any away games? It is similar to Boise in the Big East. Why should we be an afterthought in the SEC? The leaders of the SEC and BIGs are just looking to consolidate a bigger TV audience to enrich themselves at the expense of every other conference. In the end we are still competing with individual teams and not conferences. We don't improve our situation.

Is VT one of the main reasons why the ACC is considered not as good as other conferences in football? How many times have we won the ACC since we joined? Yet we are still not the face of ACC football. The Florida schools have not done much recently but everyone jumps on the "they are back" bandwagon every year. We should be a leader in the conference but are not. Probably because we don't have much weight to throw around. The weight we would need is a highly engaged and supportive ($$$$) alumni base and a enthusiastic national following (TV audience). The only way we get to be a leader is to earn it. Winning a NC would be a big step. The conference will not matter.

If your not in a conference

that has no pull in the new playoff system that is coming then how are you supposed to play for a national championship? I think when all the details emerge about the new playoff system and exactly how it will be decided who gets in then the dominoes begin to fall. So I think no matter how you shake it, it really is going to matter what conference you are in.

UVA: Jefferson's biggest mistake

@pbowman6

cmon man

comparing vt in the sec or vt in the b1g to boise in the big east? apples and oranges. the acc is geographically our best fit for sure .. but our hand may be forced in this. vt would prefer to be in the b1g ... but they probably can't afford to wait terribly long if clemson and fsu bolt.

we'd probably be in a "pod" with the 3 of the 4 of : nc team taken in the sec, kentucky, vandy, tennessee if i had to guess ... part of the sec east which will include usc-e, florida, georgia

and an earlier comment that vt has the luxury of waiting it out a bit and not jumping the gun is correct. they're making calls .. would look for us to be ready to jump if we feel we need to .. and uva won't stop us. i'm sure we'd try to help them but it is what it is.

drive times

approximate driving times to current SEC schools from Blacksburg:

Tenn 4 hrs
USCe 4.5 hrs
UK 5.5 hrs
UGA 6 hrs
Vandy 6.5 hrs
Aub 8.5 hrs
Bama 9 hrs
Miss St. 10.5 hrs
UF 10.5 hrs
Ole Miss 11 hrs
Missouri 12.5 hrs
LSU 14 hrs
Ark 15 hrs
TA&M 20 hrs

Note that several of those are not that far. And that UNC or NCSU would likely be added as well, for another reasonable drive. And that those longer drives would likely be to the other side of the conference, and thus much less frequent. And that it's not like staying in the ACC means no long drives (think FSU, Miami, BC, and Syracuse). I get that we have a very good geographic fit right now with the ACC, but you can't say the SEC is a bad geographic fit...

Money and Recruits

Talking about how we compete in the ACC right now is irrelevant...this move is about money and recruits. The SEC wants money that our TV market could bring, and VT needs the money that SEC TV contracts bring in order to stay relevant nationally. This is about VT being able to get the money and recruits to eventually fill that national championship trophy case. All of the news right now is about how there is a Big 4 and the ACC and Big East are getting left out...if you're a recruit and have an offer for VT or a middle-of-the-pack SEC school right now, what has more appeal? The ACC is very unappealing and if FSU left would be more so.

The ACC Championships have been nice, but to get a championship we need recruits and money and we're better off as a decent SEC team in that respect than a champion ACC team. I can't imagine Beamer and his staff aren't having recruiting difficulties at the moment...surely they would want this move.

I'll go one further

VT in the SEC would stop Saban himself from stealing some of the elite 757 recruits, not just a middle-of-the-pack SEC team.

It's going to piss everyone off when who some are calling the top #1-2 recuits nationwide leave the Commonwealth.

some, maybe

Saban is still going to get his. He's earned his rep, and it's a good one. Kids want to play for him. That's not going to change all the sudden if we happen to be in the same conference.

SEC

Don't know about you guys... but I would much rather be a competitive SEC team and play UGA, TENN and UF in Lane Stadium at night then have to deal with playing the Duke's of the ACC at noon. If you have ever been to an SEC football game you would agree. Every SEC game has the same feel as the ACC championship. The tailgating is great, fans are great, rivalry is great and the games are always meaningful.

I saw some Boise State comparisons above... I feel like if we stay in the ACC then we become a "Boise State. " Winning a bunch of games that no one cares about and playing one game a year that means anything at all. If that's what you want.. then you can have the ACC (once dissolved). I would much rather be 2-3 loss SEC team and win some really exciting games than be 1 loss ACC team... either way we wouldn't make the 4 team play off... but coming from the SEC would play in an exciting bowl game.

As for academics... since when has being the smartest guy in the classroom been a bad thing?? Better than having the UNC and UVA douchers claim that they are our "academic superiors" as they leaving the stadium early because we are winning 38-0.

I Agree

Completely agree. If we go to the SEC, we would be in the East and I think we are more prepared to compete with those teams right now. We would have way more night games and occasionally get Bama & LSU to play in Lane. Remember the amount of hype around the 03 & 05 Miami games? There would be much more of that type of hype surrounding a home game multiple times a year.

There are only positives surrounding this rumored conference switch in my opinion and I'm too ADD to post them all.

Plus it will be cool to have Kentucky come play us in basketball in Cassell.

Pre-marital sex will blow your mothers fake legs off her porch

(those who were frequents at Sharkeys from 2006-2008 will understand this epic graffiti by the first urinal)

If Kentucky came to Cassell, think how our basketball ticket sales would skyrocket! And people would be excited again.

Wholeheartedly agree with all of the above.

Tech has football tradition. The ACC has basketball tradition. That doesn't exactly match, does it?

And remember how everyone said it would take us a while to win in the ACC, but we immediately took it over? Yeah, that's probably not going to happen in the SEC, but wouldn't you like the chance to actually play some games that mean something? I mean, other than games that just mean winning the ACC championship trophy and getting an automatic Orange Bowl bid only to get beaten by some stupid Big East team? Wouldn't you like for Tech to get the chance to prove themselves on a NATIONAL stage? Isn't the lack of national respect what we all complain about? Well this is how we get it. We go to a nationally recognized conference, work hard, and win. Winning might take a couple of years, but once the recruiting kicks in and the proper adjustments needed to compete with SEC teams are made, we'll win.

And the comment about the academics was genius. Well said. Yes, it sure would be nice not to have academics thrown spitefully back in your face.

SEC GREAT

I think you need to also look at where some of the alumni have landed geographically after graduation. There is a pretty large following here in the upstate of SC that would have no problem driving to Tennesse, Ga, Kentucky, USC etc to go to away games. I know i would love beating the Cocks each year and gloating to the in-laws....and if we lost I could always drag my family back to the Burg and not have to listen to it! :) The bowl tie-ins would be better then they are now. Being matched up against whatever the Big 12 will call itself would generate a bigger following from recruits. As pointed out before I would rather play night games in Lane against SEC competeion then have noon or even FRIDAY games against Duke.

The impact reaches outside of football too. We would be able to weather easier the basketball schedule in the SEC also. We would dominate in state recruiting because going to UVA at that point would be even more like going to a FCS school then it already is.

VTMidge-Andrew Shields

Geography

Lots of talk about geography. (paraphrasing) "are NOVA alums gong to travel to SEC games for $400 plane tickets?"...

Personally, I agree with the last statement more - our alums are going to NoVa and SOUTH, not north. We have a big following in FLA, GA, and especially the carolinas.

PROOF: https://secure.hosting.vt.edu/alumni.vt.edu/chapter_info/chapterlist.php
Look at the number of chapters and members of each chapter for SEC states compared to others.

I personally would rather drive 10+ hours to watch a good game than get a free plane/game ticket to go up to boston and watch a game against B.C. (Or even make the short drive to Duke and cheer for Tech who seems like a bully picking on poor ole Duke's "football" team with a half empty and tiny stadium)

It is also undeniable that we are an SEC school when it comes to football. If you have ever been to an ACC away game, then you know what I am talking about. Truth is Clemson, FSU, and Miami are probably the only ACC schools that compare to our football tailgating and spirit.

I hope we don't become the Boise State of football and start losing the momentum we have had in the past 10-15 years just because we decided to stay in a conference for "academics" (which doesn't relate to sports) or for "all-around sports" (we are not UVA, and never will be, I love soccer, baseball, etc., but when it comes to Va Tech, it's football, basketball, and then more football).

804

very good points

never thought about our geographical footprint that way, but I believe it to be true now that you mention it.

Miami might sell a lot of t-shirts, but their fans suck. How else do you explain their stadium situation? Clemson and FSU definitely.

True

I guess I should rephrase that portion and mention that Miami is just in the list because of the $$ their football program brings in, not necessarily their atmosphere or following.

Another post makes a good point about Miami's sanctions - it seems unlikely that Miami would get an offer from another conference because of what is going on with them at the moment. This is only the case because with FSU and Clemson out of the ACC (hypothetically, of course), things need to happen FAST, and nobody can sit around and dilly dally with Miami's possible future. Then again, SEC schools buy athletes all the time, so maybe they would actually realize that and reconsider Miami...again, this is only if UF agrees to this, which is unlikely with the "gentlemen's agreement."

804

Where are you finding numbers of members per chapter?

The numbers on that page are chapter numbers (assigned sequentially at some point, then added as new chapters were founded). My experience working with alumni outreach for some large student organizations is that the only SEC area with any sizable VT alumni representation is Atlanta, and North Carolina dwarfs ATL (though of course NC could drive to Columbia and Athens pretty easily). But both of those (and all the other Southeastern states) are in turn dwarfed by the flow to Northern VA, DC and Maryland -- even farther away from the SEC.

You're kidding yourself if you think academics has no impact. Look at the Big Ten -- their academic arm, the CIC, is a research funding powerhouse. That's what the ACC-IAC is intended to become for the East, and that's money that university presidents go to war for. And ask our coaches whether our academic standards affect our recruiting -- they'll be very clear that they do, and that all but a couple schools in the ACC play by the same rules where virtually no one in the SEC does. That won't change if we go SEC; all it'll do is put us at a competitive disadvantage to the teams on our schedule.

Well

The numbers that I am assuming come from both the number of chapters in a state and the number of different officers that they have listed; I think it is easy to assume a chapter with 10 positions and 5 different people holding those positions has less members than another chapter that has 10 different people in 10 different positions. You can also infer membership size by the events, venues, and Facebook "likes." These are obviously not concrete, but they certainly indicate whether a chapter is just there on paper or if there is actually a following there.

As far as academics...they certainly drive athletes. However, as said previously, our academics don't change just because we change conferences. Furthermore, the majors that high recruits go into (aside from sports like soccer and track), aren't exactly rocket science. The grants, etc. that are given for academics, and the image that is portrayed from schools is not based on conference; the ACC might have these specific scholarships/grants and what-not, but so would the SEC. Look at Vanderbilt, Auburn, Georgia (recently), and even Florida, they all have good academic reputations and maintain highly funded research. (http://mup.asu.edu/research2009.pdf - just one source of many)

Fact is that we would be one of the top institutions academically in the SEC. We would also gain more recruiting leverage by being in a more competetive conference compared to what we would lose in leverage by going to a "lower" academic conference.

(Your point on playing fair may be true, but with the crack downs going on lately, I'd expect much of that to slow down in the coming years)

804

I used to be all about the ACC

and staying in it with hopes that FSU and Miami would be good again, but this was before league decision-makers decided to bring in Pitt and Syracuse, basically screaming from a mountain top that they want to be a baller-first conference. Homey don't play dat, so at this point, I'm salivating over the potential of being in the SEC. Wanting to stay in the ACC because it's "easier to win" is just about the most backwards thing I've ever heard considering where the last few national champions have come from. Also, it's not an attitude that's very becoming of a team/fan base that wants to win a national championship. People get too hung up on the fact that "We havent one big games", maybe that's because we don't play enough of them, and we're not prepared or battle-tested. The SEC can offer that.

The SEC is an insanely cyclical league, in which teams blow up, have a couple of ok years, and then blow up again. Auburn in 2005 and 2010, as well as LSU in 2003, 2007, and 2012. It's how it works, and it works like this due to the fact that it's so easy to recruit in that league, that you can just have an insane couple of classes that will turn everything around. Also, money. Traveling to away games is hard as it is right now. I usually only go to home games, because I'm never really "thrilled" to see us play at Duke, or UNC. But imagine a game in Knoxville, or Athens? Imagine the potential rivalries we could develop with Tennessee, Georgia, and the types of games we would see come to Lane Stadium. Game day would come a lot more often, we'd get more prime-time match ups, and our recognizability would blow up.

I also think we'd do well with basketball there. People who say the SEC has terrible basketball clearly is hung up on mass perception and not actual records. Florida won two, Vanderbilt is always good. UT was good during the Bruce Pearl era, and, um, KENTUCKY. I think, if things fall apart, that we absolutely HAVE to listen to what the SEC has to offer. I mean, there's almost no limit to what the new contract negotiations could offer each school, but I'm sure it's a little better than $17.1 million.

@scobeard

38-0 bro

I agree

Agreed, but I'd rather not get hung up on a national championship. Of course everybody wants to win one, but we should be thankful for the team we have and realize that a move to the SEC would drop our chances of a nc for the first 4 years or so dramatically. In the ACC, we can win out with decent out of conference games (Bama, for instance), and have a shot. We were almost in the running this year if things had happened differently with Clemson and the LSU/Bama game before the championship.

804

Good points

but playing in a watered down acc or whatever its going to end up being called also is going to diminish our chances of playing in a national championship as well once this playoff situation is hashed out. We might as well take our chances in the sec. I think right now as a program we compare favorably to South Carolina and they have done pretty well in sec east the past couple of years. So I think we'd be ok.

UVA: Jefferson's biggest mistake

@pbowman6

Remember When?

We have to remember that "Virginia Politics put us in the ACC". If we were invited to another conference would lawmakers get in the way again? Would we be forced to take UVA with us? Could this be Karma? Do you really think UVA would just let us go?

fast forward to hear about VT-UVA-Politics 7:15
http://www.wralsportsfan.com/999thefan/audio/11127843/

-VT

It's not UVA that matters, it's the governor and legislature. They want Virginia schools to get as much money as possible, they don't care about the conference. If the state sees its options of having 2 schools in an ACC that's not financially viable or 1 school in the ACC and one school making insane money in the SEC, they will take the latter at the drop of a hat.

The "politics blocking a VT move from the ACC unless UVA is taken care of" narrative is nice talk radio fodder to give Hoo fan some hope of relevancy after the shakeout takes place, but I haven't yet found anyone who can say how that would play out.

Exactly WHO would be exerting political pressure? And WHOM would they be exerting it on? Name the players in this hypothetical chess game? What are their motivations and why would anyone listen? An argument could be made that VT to SEC and UVA to wherever is better for the state of VA as a whole than VT & UVA both languishing in a crippled ACC.

UVA did us a solid 9 years ago, but the circumstances this time around just aren't the same thing... it's everyone for themselves.

You're right.

There is no SEC insider to lobby for us this time. This is a completely different situation. The state legislators don't have a SEC school in Virginia which means they don't have a SEC BOV that they can force to back VT. So the state legislators will have no part in this. They might try... but they will have zero power to do anything.

The best connection I've come up with is Gov. Nikki Haley of South Carolina. She's buds with our Governor. (He lost a bet to her on our second loss to Clemson last season... he had to send her a Virginia ham. Seriously.) But that is really stretching it. Don't really think Bob is going to call up Nikki and ask her to get SC's BOV to support VT to the SEC... If anything, she'll be pressing the SC BOV to back her alma mater Clemson's move to the SEC if the ACC crumbles.

I will disagree with your last statement. Mark Warner did us a solid, not UVA. If there had been no political (read: state funding) pressure, UVA would have never backed us.

And to answer the first question...

No I don't think the politicians could force UVA into a package deal with VT. Like I said before, they'll have zero power when all hell breaks loose and there is no way they could force or convince a conference with absolutely no connections in our state to take VT, UVA, or both, because all they'll have are political threats but that won't really affect the funding of schools or conferences out of state, will it?

As far as the national championship goes

That's the goal, but I don't think we'd be all THAT bad for the first 4 years. It's not like we weren't competitive with Alabama 3 years ago. I think we'd do better than most people expect. We're very similar to USC.

Also, what people seem to have trouble realizing is that we'd stand to make maybe as much as 10 million more per year. For an athletic dept that already operates in the black with what we have now, this could be huge. It would trickle down to every other sport, and the department would get better as a whole. It happened when we joined the ACC, and it will happen again if we go to the SEC.

As far as UVA and the SEC jump? I doubt that happens at all. I doubt UVA even wants to join the SEC, and given today's landscape, I think there'd me more tolerance for us doing what is best for us. There's no use in holding us back because UVA can't come, that helps no one. Better to see one do well. But that's my next question. If this DOES happen, and we go, who else do you think would join?

I wouldn't mind Miami. I love playing them every year, and hate them so much. NC State would be a decent fit, but not too much of a threat. I also bet they just want to give Duke and UNC the finger and be on their way. I can respect that. I just hope we continue to schedule UVA each year.

@scobeard

38-0 bro

I don't see how UF would even allow conversations on Miami. I could see NC State, but certainly not Miami.

Not just Miami

Florida wants no part of Miami or FSU in the SEC. Florida already dominates the TV markets so there is no need for the Conference to step in and violate the handshake agreement between the Presidents.

Virginia Tech '08
Fordham University (NY) '11, '12

Twitter: @duffmanhokie
PSN Handle: duffmanhokie1568 (NCAAF '12, NHL '11, Battlefield)

Hokies, NY Rangers, NY Jets, NY Mets (sigh), USA Hockey, Richmond Renegades (R.I.P)

Not just Miami

Florida wants no part of Miami or FSU in the SEC. Florida already dominates the TV markets so there is no need for the Conference to step in and violate the handshake agreement between the Presidents.

Virginia Tech '08
Fordham University (NY) '11, '12

Twitter: @duffmanhokie
PSN Handle: duffmanhokie1568 (NCAAF '12, NHL '11, Battlefield)

Hokies, NY Rangers, NY Jets, NY Mets (sigh), USA Hockey, Richmond Renegades (R.I.P)

Virginia Tech vs Georgia. Virginia Tech vs Tennessee. Virginia Tech vs Florida. Virginia Tech vs South Carolina. LSU. Alabama. Those sound like incredible Chick-Fil-A Bowls. They would be regular season games.

National Championships aside. ACC championships aside. Fans having to travel further aside. Academics aside. Cash money aside. 10-win seasons aside.

Being in the SEC would mean that VT would have an epic regular season, year in, year out. Period. What is not to love about that as a fan?

How competetive would we be? I believe with the extra cash and energy, and with our current brand and tradition, we would be able to recruit the heck out of the mid-atlantic.

man

seeing it typed out like that...that does look pretty epic.

And note that while the athletic department operates in the black, almost 7% of VT student expenses go to the athletic department. If VT could replace student fees with TV revenue, that would be an incredible win for the university itself, which is what I would expect alumni and students really care about.

Thats what you would expect Hokies to care about but we all know that when the leaves start to change and there is a slight chill in the air the only thing that any Hokie cares about is watching HIGH PROFILE games in Lane or on the road. Think about these same match ups that were mentioned about and throw them into Lane on a Thursday night! Tennessee in our house on a THURSDAY night!!!

VTMidge-Andrew Shields

Fortunately we can have both. It's capitalism at its finest.

VT in the SEC

means you can kiss the Thursday night games goodbye. Only OOC games would be scheduled then. The SEC was built for Saturdays.

I just looked up the 2012 schedule. Only 2 SEC games on Thursday, S.C. at Vandy and TxAM at Lousianna Tech, both on opening day, Aug 30.

I dont know about that

Seems like the $EC and the Mothership would realize the ratings and the unquestionable awesomeness of Thursday Night in Lane against insert opponent here. They dont play many, and yes they're early in the year, but they do play Thursday games. Hell they play Fridays too. Its kind of our thing, I think the powers that be would want to continue that.

All that being said, I feel like we're all creaming our pants cause one guy said a sentence to another guy. But hey its the offseason, gotta talk about something right?

"I'm just rocking the Fuller"-Kendall Fuller
"That kid you're talking to right there, I think he played his nuts off! And you can quote me on that shit!" -Bud Foster

I have mixed feelings about VT going to the $EC. College Football is by far my favorite sport, and no one does it better than the Southeast. However, traveling would be more difficult for fans. I think VT could hold its own in the SEC East, being on par with UGA. Maybe this is what VT needs to take our program to the next level.

That being said, the ACC has been pretty good to VT, as far as schedules go.

The U invented Swag, but UVA invented Smug.

VT '10, Born & Raised in the 804. Hokies, Keydets, Army Black Knights, NY Giants, NY Rangers, and ATL Braves.

Heard A lot about away games being too far

Anyone remember the LSU game in 2002? Particularly the tailgating before the game? I have never seen so many RVs in my life. The amount of LSU faithful that came to that game was ridiculous. I remember one RV was UGA fans and we went up to them to ask why they were in Blacksburg. They told us they had a plan to see 6 new stadiums every year, so they purchased the VT LSU tickets to see Lane. This would be the culture VT would get into. Our fanbase would never reach LSU, UGA, Bama, UF, or some of the others, but it would rub off us.

Besides, UT, UK, SC and UGA are less than 6 hrs drive from Blacksburg. But, living in NoVA does add another 4 hrs, so I guess that's an issue.

Thursday night games...

If it expands to 16, they're going to need to schedule differently. Especially if super-conferences are on the horizon. I think Thursday nights may just become a niche for VT. It's obviously favored by ESPN now, no reason to think it wouldn't continue. You also have to figure that SEC games sell out a lot easier than ACC ones. Away games may not be as easy to get tickets for as they once were. Traveling won't be as easy, but that's the price you pay for prime time scheduling and marquis match ups. I love the luxury of being able to occupy Duke and other stadiums, but I'm just as happy with watching big time match-ups against Auburn and other SEC teams each year on TV. Makes for some exciting possibilities. Also, money.

@scobeard

38-0 bro

The SEC doesn't often play on Thursdays

So unless completely necessary, I don't think VT would see many in conference Thursday night games. I think the current SEC schools would make sure that happens, so they don't have to play on short rest.

In 2012, the SEC only has two Thursday night games, both are on Aug 30th to start the season.

I didn't think so much Cons

as rather "pluses" for being in the ACC...what an ambassador for our school (and fans)! After hearing that I was like, "hell yeah, SEC, we'll start the bidding at $20 million exit fee reimbursement."

What struck me was that he said "Virginia Tech will do whatever it takes to compete at the highest level", followed up with his 'ACC fills this need today' comment. Let's not forget, he is an actual school employee, is he not? I don't know what his W2 says, maybe he he's listed as a private contractor under a PO or whatever. But definitely a spokesperson representing VT, and the lines were a little wider apart for us to be able to read between versus Weaver's political discourse.

Thanks for finding.

Hokie in Alabama here

FWIW, there is a pretty good number of Hokie fans here in NE Alabama. And I can guarantee I would travel to see us at Alabama (2 hrs), Vandy (1.5 hrs), Auburn (3.5 hrs), Georgia (4.5 hrs), Tennessee (4 hrs), Ole Miss (3.5 hrs), MSU (3.5 hrs). I'm 500 miles from Blacksburg- so selfishly I would love being closer to more games and more competitive games.

SEC will eat our lunch

In the current or near future arrangement of the SEC no way VT ever wins the SEC or even the division. Therefore no NC. Unless VT can consistently win against GA, Bama, TN, and the like, which has not been shown, the profile of the games with these teams will not be raised. In fact it will decline over time when we always come up short (can't win the big game). VT moving to the SEC is more about the SEC and less about VT. We don't really add anything except for the SEC consolidating as many top 25 teams as they can get. More money will not equal more success.

All this being said there is still the problem of a declining ACC and realignment of other conferences. ODU may even start to pull away recruits in the 757.

Dude, Bama literally lost the SEC championship and won the national championship THIS YEAR. The SEC is on a different level and that's where we need to be if we want to maximize our success, competitively and financially.

Lies

You are implying that we would not have a chance at a division title, which does not hold any factual basis. Are these just assumptions? I was at the last two SEC games we played, and, last I recall, we beat Tenn in the Chik-fil-A bowl (I remember the A-C-C chant afterwards), and we shoulda coulda woulda beat Bama in the opener if we had just played a little better (and only lost by 10 to the undefeated team).

So how do we not have a chance at a division title?

804

Agreed

I agree- especially if we're put in the SEC East. Not projecting but to say we'd have no chance is absolutely false.

Virginia Tech '08
Fordham University (NY) '11, '12

Twitter: @duffmanhokie
PSN Handle: duffmanhokie1568 (NCAAF '12, NHL '11, Battlefield)

Hokies, NY Rangers, NY Jets, NY Mets (sigh), USA Hockey, Richmond Renegades (R.I.P)

If South Carolina

can win the SEC East, any team can. USC is good now, but they were terrible for so many years. Lou Holtz brought them to mediocre and Spurrier has then at annual SEC East contenders.

The SEC is so cyclical anyways, VT will be fine.

ODU may even start to pull away recruits in the 757

really?? bahahaha

It is already happening

Local guys that were being recruited by several ACC schools have made commitments to ODU. They like the idea of staying near home since ODU is now FBS (bowls, TV coverage). That gives ODU an advantage over the FCS schools in Virginia who traditionally recruited these players. They have a very good coach and have been winning.

The big recruits will still likely go to the big schools and out of state. For now the local media likes ODU and there is a lot of excitement. Those are key in getting attention from recruits. If there is success on the field it will feed itself. The excitement can fade, but for now there is momentum. If they aren't already, I think ODU will become the second or third choice of Virginia schools behind VT and Uva. If they consistently lose the next few years the excitement will probably fade. But for now ODU has the FBS fever.

Nope

Not a chance. I like ODU, but their BRAND new football program will not take any recruits from VT that aren't easily replaceable (most likely, none at all). VT/UVa/JMU/UofR then maybe ODU.

Moot point, but it will never happen.

804