The news broke last night on twitter (sorry, I'm at work and can't link the post) that our empty trophy case has been removed from the Merryman Center. Most people, myself included, were not very happy about this. I'm trying to withhold judgement until I hear a statement from Whit, Frank, or anybody with the program, but I think this sends the wrong message to recruits and fans.
For as long as I can remember, Frank has set three goals for his teams every year: beat Virginia, win the ACC, and be in a position to compete for the national championship. I have no inside knowledge, but I feel like these three goals get repeated every year. After two bad years (by our standards) have we suddenly given up on the dream of ever winning a crystal football?
I know there are some people in Hokienation that are perfectly fine with just winning the ACC. They don't think our team will ever again be able to compete with the nation's elite. I think most people on this site though would agree that we can do more. Perhaps we're the delusional ones, but I think we can get back to the top of the mountain in the not too distant future.
So what do you guys think? Should the national championship still be our ultimate goal? How do you feel about the trophy case in general? Who made the decision to remove it in the first place (I can't imagine Whit would do it without Frank's blessing) and why?
Comments
I think the message being sent by the removal is not abandonment but "earn it, don't expect it." it's a little more blue collar, I think, and I believe it fits in with our core philosophies. Our goal should still be to win the National Championship, but the only way that's going to happen is by earning it on the field.
I completely agree with this. By having that trophy case out, we were saying "Hey look everybody! We're seriously aiming for a national championship!" There was a time when that was a bold statement by VT, but the fact now is every team in the fbs is aiming for a crystal football. I think having the trophycase was beginning to be like me proclaiming I was going into work everyday
I think LOLUVA's goal is to "be competitive for the ACC Coastal". Taken right out of ML's mouth. But maybe they should set their sights a little more within reach, like, winning one ACC Coastal game next season.
or using their timeouts earlier than the last few minutes of the game.
baby steps.
This was me just now
THIS.
I don't think nuthin', 'cept I never liked that empty case being there when the team of coaches we "had" were not capable of filling that case. Frank, it appears, is trying to set things right.
French knocked this topic out of the park a few months ago when he posted about our goals and winning the ACC. The national championship is very much out of our control, we should focus on what we can achieve by our own merit.
One of you guys who better understand the search/archive functions on TKP can probably find those words of wisdom.
Contending for the NC is not exactly 'out of our control.' We know what it takes to build a program that can contend for the NC, but hell, we don't even ask for the resources to be the top-funded program in our own conference, let alone the Top 10 programs. We have tried to do it on the cheap, and found we can't.
We have upgraded our offensive coaching and scheme. We have added recruiting staff after learning a bunch of stuff from Bud's visit to Ole Miss. Someday I hope we have a strategy aimed at evaluating and recruiting most of the best talent in our region, so we can achieve the talent we need to truly compete.
Then, we can win an NC and put the trophy in a brand new case.
The national championship is the ultimate goal, but it doesn't happen all at once. When we were one step away from a national championship, I think it was a good motivational tool, but over the past few years we've take a step back, so we need to update our goals accordingly.
Also, I think that our focus on the end result each season caused a lot of our hiccups/unexplanatory losses. Hopefully this subtle gesture gets our team to really take one game at a time, instead of focusing on the 'biggest' picture.
That is a good point. I remember in 1999, Frank said we weren't trying to win 12 games, we were trying to win 1 game 12 times.
When it comes to recruiting, you can spin this however you want.
When it comes to the goals of the program, does anybody really think we've given up on winning a national championship?
Of course we haven't. Now we just don't have to see 5 articles every off season about "when is Virginia Tech going to fill that empty trophy case?"
^^^This^^^ When a motivational tool generates more negative talk/feelings than positive, it's serving the opposite of it's purpose.
While I agree, now we'll have to endure 5 articles about how "Virginia Tech removed the empty trophy case because they couldn't fill it".
Hellll no. Imperfections should never lead to lower standards. In anything. Ever. Everever.
I'm not sure why the trophy case got removed, but I do not believe it had anything to do with lowering our goals.
it exists - and inspires the players. no matter where it is.
They know there is a void - whether its on display or not.
Out of sight, out of mind!! Picture this - the case is sitting there in 2020 (just IF we didn't win the NC before then) and a top recruit comes in, sees it and remarks - "how long that thing been sittin' there?? and, it's still empty? Nah, man, I'm going to look at Bama or FSU!".... Just sayin'.... I'd treat it like Old Sparky.....sit it in a room, close the door, let it get a little dusty and then when we win the NC, pull it out and execute the sucker (put the trophy in it)....
Most of those type guys are going to Bama or FSU regardless.
we want the guys who come here and say, "how long its been sitting there and I'M gonna be the guy to fill it!!!!"
That's the pitch I would have been making to those kids. Do you want to be one of many championship teams, or do you want to be THE TEAM, history making and never to be forgotten. The kids that won that fist title in blacksburg will be forever remembered as hero's
Im in suburban Philly and the Villanova team from '85 are deities around here. almost 30 years ago. I can name their starting 5 off the top of my head. I don't quite understand it all but that's what happens when you are the first!
And that is exactly what would happen here, that team would be remembered forever. Unlike a team that wins a title at bama or Ohio st there you are just one of many
I just posted my thoughts on Twitter, so I'm going to copy/paste here (excuse the abbreviations, character restriction)
Yes, removing the empty trophy case from Merryman means we've given up on winning a national title. You figured it out. Great job.
Having an empty national title trophy case in 1998, when we were still an upstart program (we'd only shocked Texas just 3 years earlier)...
is v different from having one in 2014- after a natl title game, 8 consec 10-win seasons, 5 conf championships, & 21 consec bowl appearances
In 1998, we DREAMED of having another shot at the Sugar Bowl or the Orange Bowl or any of the games carried on a major network.
Unlike 1998, ppl know who we are now. We've built something. We're not playing the pre-streaming Internet untelevised nooner against Temple.
And - importantly - unlike 1998, we're in direct competition with powerhouse programs for powerhouse recruits. In 1998, they were like, 2.
We can try to sell recruits on an empty CASE as a symbol of our GOALS, but let's not confuse which of those two is more important.
I liked the case. It was a good symbol for a program clawing its way to the national scene and working to stay there.
PREACH, BROTHA
I am fully in agreement with removing that damn trophy case. I think it was a poor idea to begin with.
Other teams have a countdown clock until the game with their rivals.
SEC teams constantly talk about winning their conferece.
Teams set their goals at the beginning of the year, and their environment projects that goal.
We, for some reason, thought that our goal at the beginning of every season should be national championship. Result? Lose a game in the first month. Where did we get the gall to think that we were supposed to be in the conversation for the championship? It was as anti-blue-collar as anything we've ever done, and told the world we thought of ourselves in a way that wasn't borne out by year-to-year results.
Channeling my inner Jay (of Jay and Silent Bob fame), "F!ck that trophy case! F!ck it in it's f!cking ass!"
I am sure we can find room for a new, better, trophy case when we win the championship.
For now, lets just focus on beating OSU and winning the ACC. Things have a way of working out...
We aren't giving up and we never will.
We can certainly compete with anyone. The difference between us and the top programs is not a big as you think.
Seriously, look how Auburn turned things around....Look at FSU...FSU was beatable a year ago...Auburn was AWFUL.
A few Key Play(ers) can turn the entire program around.
I have a good feeling about our program and the direction we are heading. I am confident we will rise again!
For anyone who thinks VT has "given up" on winning a national championship:
That being said, our trophy case will be put in its proper place after we use the Battle of Bristol to win our first National Championship, beginning a new "Decade of Dominance" where VT wins 10 consecutive national championships while the SEC is reduced to rubble underneath the combined might of Sam Rogers (who goes on to coach) and the Fuller family (who produce perpetual 1st-round talent).
And don't worry, the original decade of dominance will rapidly become the "Half a Century of Dominance," after which then-president (for his 6th term) Sam Rogers passes a presidential decree abolishing LOLUVA and sparing the United States from any more embarrassment caused by that school.
For the record, I don't personally think we having given up on the goal of a championship, but it just left a little bit of a bad taste in my mouth to quietly remove the case in the middle of the night without anybody from the athletic department giving an explanation. Maybe I just don't like change. I'm still upset that "Home of the Fighting Gobblers" isn't prominently displayed on the front of the stadium.
You do realize that it was removed several weeks ago, and that a quiet statement was issued by the ath dept at that time concerning its' removal, don't you? This didn't happen in the middle of the night ala Baltimore Colts, it happened a while back. At that time, it was moved under the guise of 'refurbishing' the center. This was done back when Weaver was still AD, and nobody batted an eye. I knew then the ultimate objective was to remove the reminder. It's just that for all the attention given to Hokie football, quite often folks don't really pay attention.
I thought I heard it was removed like a year ago and no one even noticed until now.
It can be like the 'Lunch pail' - it is a mentality.
The lunch pail is not always on display. In fact, how often do we as fans actually see it?
Granted "Lunch pail mentality" sounds alot better than "Empty Trophy Case Mentality"
Bottom line - OK with me taking the case out of the spotlight of the public eye but it
should be kept - and kept where the team can see it, not the fans.
GO HOKIES!
We can bring the case back when we win back-to-back bowl games again, or beat a top 5 team, or win a BCS game.
I liked when it was there because Tech was on the rise and you could make the argument that we were "right there" in the running. Nowadays, we are back in a pack of good-not-great programs; we need to grab the lunchpail and get to work to get back near the top.
Glad it's gone. It was a badge and reminder of what we've not been able to accomplish.
DO NOT TALK ABOUT THIS ON TWITTER and FB. While it's true that this will get out and people will talk about it, if you blast it to your networks, you're only propogating what will ultimately be a negative discussion outside of the hokie nation. Your efforts are noble, but you will be overrun by sheer numbers.
So in this scenario, all non-Hokies on the internet are zombies?
It's the same principle of why news stories in which someone is injured or killed are followed much more closely than those in which some guy saves someones life or keeps a hospital running. VT has been a punching bag for the internet these past two years and no matter the reason this was taken down the negative reasons will go farther than any of the others.
Although yes, the internet is full of zombies who think they are completely unique and the greatest thing since sliced bread.
Jimbo won it in a bet.
We'll get a better one.
Glad we got rid of it. We should totally sneak into UVA and put it under their countdown clock with a sign "This Trophy Case is reserved for the Commonwealth Cup"
Maybe Walmart will leak our new trophy case design?
Damn thing jinxed us anyway. When was the last time we were even close at smelling a natty, 2007 season? We probably would've went then if LSU didn't destroy us in week 2 or 3.
We were only 38 or 40 missed tackles away from winning that LSU game.
Goals:
Kickoff: win
First down: win
Second down: win
...
Week 1: Win
Week 2: Win
...
ACCCG: Win
Win, win, win, win, win. More winning than Charlie Sheen. That's the goal.
I think we make a new case for the new NC trophy (it won't be a crystal football) when we win it....and it should be a big clear acrylic case shaped like a lunchpail.
Shoot, let's just make our own trophy shaped like a lunchpail.
Where's the Bender meme? I'm gonna build my own MNC Trophy...with blackjack and hookers!
Nah, forget the blackjack.
That's actually the best idea for a display concept. Make a large version of the lunchpail, dented & all. Put it on a pedestal with an accompanying plaque that says something along the lines of - 'This lunchpail is the embodiment of what Hokie football reflects. We thrive on hard work every day, and we have a blue collar attitude towards doing all the difficult tasks to earn our wins. Our reward is the pride in knowing we achieved more than anyone, even ourselves, ever expected.'
I'm glad it's gone, it was an albatross...
To me this doesn't mean we've "given up the goals" or whatever. To me, this is like when a coach removes the player names off the backs of their jerseys and makes them earn that privilege back.
There was a time when that thing was meaningful, served a purpose, and was appropriate. That time has passed, and I think we need to earn the right to even have an empty trophy case again.
that is exactly what it had become. I couldn't think of the word!
I honestly think it was used to deter kids from coming. No-one wants to go from seeing 3 4 5 crystal footballs then go to our office and see an empty case with the emphasis on "YOU" coming to fill that case. It seems like a great idea gone wrong, and I like the hokie bird.
I wonder if whit made this decision or was it mutual with the football office and whit.
nope, that's the other school.
was a snark remark on that school.. kinda making fun of them at the same time as saying how unrealistic it was of us
It was done before Whit arrived. Nobody paid attention when the announcement was made.
hey at least we made the yahoo front page.
the last time we were on there was for the foghorn leghorn helmets so i think this is an improvement
http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/ncaaf-dr-saturday/virginia-tech-s-empty-na...
slow news day when this is news.
I like that they think the Hokie Bird is cute
Life becomes much easier for Hokie fans when you understand the difference between a goal and a wish.
Our goal is to win the ACC.
Our wish is that everything works out in such a way that winning the ACC puts us in contention for the NC.
The trophy case represented the wish, not the goal. We did not develop a strategy to resource a NC contender, we implemented a strategy to resource an ACC contender.
Bud Foster's recent comments about our lack of recruiting staff is telling. It's not that we tried to get one and failed. It's that we didn't acknowledge we needed the added expertise and manpower. In order to contend for the NC, you have to do the things it takes - hire the best coaches, recruit the best players - and resource your program to compete for one. We do not, so we do not.
Uh-huh. Yep. Yep. Yep. Leg.
It is also even more telling that no one on the staff even learned of the disparity in 'Football staff members' until Bud visited Ole Miss. I mean, what about the coaches we've hired recently who worked in the SEC, and not just at Auburn, how about SoCarolina, and elsewhere? What about Frank just looking around during the last decade to see what everybody else is doing? Folks seem to have confused the difference in setting a goal, and in merely wishing for a result. The trophy case needed to come down several years ago.
That's not true at all. John Ballein talked about this in an interview with David Teel in January. Bud and staff visited Ole Miss in March. They've known about it for a long time. I suspect that the funding situation was holding them back, but Whit has already talked about the fact that they've added more football-related staff. The better the cash flow, the more change we'll see.
The ath dept has run a surplus for some years now. Never been any mention about needing additional staff, even while Hite & Cavanaugh were on board, this wasn't a topic. It's only become a topic recently, and there were no hints prior that this was a desire. I'm glad it is now and support it, but considering the lack of focus on so many other facets, it certainly gives every indication this was another evolution in 'doing business' that wasn't acknowledged until just recently.
Sure, we've been in the black, but none of us knows what Weaver might have vetoed or what Beamer & Co. might have asked for in that time. The penny-pinching ways were good in some respects and bad in others. Whit seems plenty in tune with what we need, which I'm glad to see, and I have no doubt that this will be a moot point in no time.
We agree on nearly all of that. I do remember hearing for years & years that 'Franks answers to Steger, now Weaver', so that shakes the argument that Weaver refused Frank anything. Truthfully, I think the Frank/Steger/Weaver scenario dissolved a few months after Beamer's UNC incident, and things returned to normal, being that Beamer did in fact report to Weaver, despite legend. We all know, though, that Frank rightfully carries a big stick within the department, and I find it really challenging to think he was ever turned down on something as innocuous as hiring a couple of new recruiting staff. It's much more believable to me that he was either unaware of the staff makeup at other programs, or inattentive to the benefits. I think it is the second option, inattentive to the benefits. The upside is that now, with Whit, I think we have an influence from above Beamer to evolve and stretch the mindset with the times. It will help us in all of our sports, this is just a football example.
The plot thickens...
2 questions why wasnt it news then and why now is it news?
Your answers are - it was mentioned several weeks ago in something I saw online. Someone asked about the trophy case, and the answer was that it was moved temporarily while Merryman was being refurbished. I want to say I saw it in December or January. It was while Weaver was still in charge. I am pretty certain it has NOT been gone for a year, but I know it has been gone for weeks or a few months. I remember thinking then - they removed it and are hoping nobody noticed. I know for sure it has been gone for weeks, but I doubt Ballein's estimate of a year, I think that is spin.
So its news.now because th hbird has been installed or someone is just calling them out on it?
If an empty trophy case disappears with no trophy, was it really a trophy case?
Trees in the forest want to know!
Maybe the case IS the trophy?... or maybe the trophy and the case cannot exist in the same universe. All very valid theories.
I heard it was on the Malaysian plane...