This is great for us! Sorry guys hate to say it but we play games better when we aren't given credit. As I said once before we aren't part of the $EC so no bump there and we did finish 7-6 last year. But also it isn't like we have a top 5 defense returning from last year or that many players returning in general /s. The polls are a joke and shouldn't be considered until week 4 as most these teams don't play anyone worth mentioning until Week 3, check their schedules... just sayin.
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What amazes me about this is how well TCU has done with by far the lower recruiting class rankings until you get all the way down to 2014 Georgia Tech. Dang.
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Yea, this is why recruiting doesn't guarantee Championships just helps. It is why I think so many people are aggravated at the OC and lack of an identity or production
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Team/15 AP Rank/14 Bowl Games/Returning Players (Total) Alabama/#3/Lost to #4 OSU (35 - 42)/10 Auburn/#6/Lost to #18 Wisconsin (31 - 34)/10 Georgia/#9/Won vs #21 Louisville (37-14)/12 LSU/#14/Lost vs Notre Dame (28-31)/12 Ole Miss/#17/Lost vs #6 TCU (3-42)/14 Arkansas/#18/Won vs. Texas (31-7)/14 Missouri/#24/Lost vs #25 Minnesota (17-35)/11 Tennessee/#25/Won vs Iowa (45 - 28)/17
I understand the $EC recruits well but that is a lot of unknowns of returning players. Just sayin...
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I think VT is about right where they belong. I thought UNC would crack the top 25 with all of the players they are returning, plus adding Gene Chizik at DC. Mainly I expected GT and Clemson to be ranked a couple spots better than they are.
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NC State and Louisville also merit discussion. I'm more upset by the placement of those three than those being the only 3. For example, there is really no reason to rank Bama ahead of FSU. FSU has been recruiting at the same level as Bama, has been winning at the same level as Bama and has the same returning starters as Bama.
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... Except that they way outplayed FSU last year. FSU was lucky to finish with the record that they did. Also, not all returning starters are equal. Pending the resolution of Dalvin Cook's case, FSU essentially just returns Jalen Ramsey and some talent. Out of their starters, 7 are from last year's mediocre defense, while the offense that saved them so many times returns only 3. Conversely, the defense that Bama mostly returns was very good and the strength of that team. Hardly the same. If anything, FSU is being overrated a little.
Much more baffling is 100 people voting for a Mississippi State team than only returns 7 starters, has been outpaced by its SEC West counterparts in recruiting, and plays, according to the voters themselves, a brutal schedule. They might struggle to make a bowl and yet are being ranked by folks.
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Except that they way outplayed FSU last year. FSU was lucky to finish with the record that they did.
So beating an Arkansas team that hasn't won a conference game in 2 years by 1 point is "outplaying" FSU? Or was it the fact that they had to come back from down 2 possessions to Auburn to win the game? That's apparently not "lucky," but rather, shows that they are "resilient" right? /s
When FSU had multiple double digit comebacks (and STILL beats the spread), it was considered lucky. But when Alabama does it, they are credited? That sounds completely logical.
Conversely, the defense that Bama mostly returns was very good and the strength of that team. Hardly the same.
This is just wrong. Any Alabama fan will tell you that the Alabama defense from last year was one of the weakest units they've had in recent years. They didn't have any corners and their defensive line play was weaker than it has been over the past few years. There is a reason why they were decimated by Ohio State in the playoff game, even with Ohio State turning the ball over multiple times. They couldn't stop anyone that had a pulse. I mean heck, even Florida put up 21 points on them last year.
The original argument for why FSU and Bama should be ranked similarly is completely relevant. And it's even more strange due to the fact that FSU's most recent championship has come after Alabama's.
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Really, you're gonna choose to pick out wins against solid Arkansas and Auburn teams? When FSU struggled with Oklahoma State and Florida and needed to come from behind against Miami, Louisville, NC State, and Notre Dame (that's a lot of games), and needed BC to miss an easy field goal to win? Yes, given those circumstances, and given how they played, winning as many games as they did is, statistically speaking, very lucky. It could be argued that Bama got lucky against a couple of teams, but FSU got lucky against a hell of a lot of teams. http://www.footballstudyhall.com/2015/1/26/7917313/second-order-wins-col...
Never mind that Bama was more highly regarded by all of the major advanced metrics along with the pundits... (fplus (FEI and S&P+) and ESPN's FPI (FSU was #15, Bama was #2) for what little that's worth).
Bama's defense was weaker relative to some of their dominant defenses in recent years, and it did have very specific weaknesses in coverage and in terms of linebacker depth, but it was still a very good defense and was considerable stronger than FSU's. Ohio State and Auburn were able to take advantage of their weaknesses repeatedly. But let's not discount how good they were because they got torched by elite offenses that were also a bad match ups for them (Also, one of Florida's touchdowns was a fumble return, they only allowed 200 yards that game, so...). They were #3 in defensive S&P+, #6 in scoring defense, #12 in total defense, #18 in yards per play allowed, #7 in FPI defensive efficiency, and #8 in FEI defense. That's pretty good. FSU, on the other hand, was #30, #50, #63, #63, #42, and #28 respectively. No where close to Bama's numbers. Regardless of your stat or advanced metric of choice, there really isn't much of a comparison.
I think Penn State is pretty low. They have a lot returning on Offense including a potential #1 overall pick QB, and had a legitimate top 5 defense last year with major parts returning.
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Think you'll see it a little more with the playoffs now days. Its a lot harder to argue that Ohio state didn't deserve it the way they thrashed Oregon and bama and I think it'll be the start of a trend. Less and less you'll have which 1 loss team passes the eye test and gets into the championship that you used to get with the bcs
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That right there shows explicitly why polls are currently, have always been, and will always be a joke
What's even more asinine is that these polls determine championships. They shouldn't. And really, with conference title games, and the requirements to play in one (win your division), polls should be meaningless in the grand scheme, and the 'regular season' should essentially be the group stage of the season long playoff.
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That is actually probably legit. Notre Dame had a pretty good team last year, but kinda lost their way after the FSU game which ended in benching Golson. Now they are returning essentially everyone. I think they are losing something like one starter on each side of the ball.
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They had injury issues as bad a we did. I think all but 2 starters on defense were hurt for a significant period of time. Plus they had a lot of guys decide to stick around and didn't graduate much from last year.
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Malik Zaire looked good near the end of last year as well. Mike Monaco at Bleacher Report compared Zaire's first year starting to other recent Notre Dame QBs. I'd be a little hyped at the prospect that he'll be good. They start the season at Texas and have USCw, Stanford, GT, and Clemson in an otherwise light schedule.
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Comments
Hokies were 29th if you go by the other receiving votes.
True, but sadly, ESPN won't be putting a 29 next to our name come Monday night
Gonna be a big jump up to top 15 on Tuesday
...anOSU falls all the way to 10....
I guess "underrated" is correct.
I'm OK with that.
I like VT when the team has a chip on their shoulder.
29 is not underrated, actually that is overrating us.
I'd say it's about right for now.
Not based on what teams are ranked I don't think.
The rankings don't go to 29.
This is great for us! Sorry guys hate to say it but we play games better when we aren't given credit. As I said once before we aren't part of the $EC so no bump there and we did finish 7-6 last year. But also it isn't like we have a top 5 defense returning from last year or that many players returning in general /s. The polls are a joke and shouldn't be considered until week 4 as most these teams don't play anyone worth mentioning until Week 3, check their schedules... just sayin.
I'm sure there is SEC Bias, but the rankings are fairly legit.
What VT needs is an offensive Identity.Or a Top recruiting
TCU, Baylor, Oregon, Wisconsin, Boise State, and Georgia Tech all have high offense systems with a true identity
Let's include Offense and Defense Ranking
What amazes me about this is how well TCU has done with by far the lower recruiting class rankings until you get all the way down to 2014 Georgia Tech. Dang.
At least we aren't Tennessee....
Yea, this is why recruiting doesn't guarantee Championships just helps. It is why I think so many people are aggravated at the OC and lack of an identity or production
EIGHT! EIGHT SEC TEAMS IN THE PRESEASON TOP 25 HAHAHAHA
Didn't they all win the NC last year?
Yeah, and the year before that
Team/15 AP Rank/14 Bowl Games/Returning Players (Total)
Alabama/#3/Lost to #4 OSU (35 - 42)/10
Auburn/#6/Lost to #18 Wisconsin (31 - 34)/10
Georgia/#9/Won vs #21 Louisville (37-14)/12
LSU/#14/Lost vs Notre Dame (28-31)/12
Ole Miss/#17/Lost vs #6 TCU (3-42)/14
Arkansas/#18/Won vs. Texas (31-7)/14
Missouri/#24/Lost vs #25 Minnesota (17-35)/11
Tennessee/#25/Won vs Iowa (45 - 28)/17
I understand the $EC recruits well but that is a lot of unknowns of returning players. Just sayin...
All summer I've been trying to get filled in on whatever secret everyone else knows about Auburn. No one will tell me.
They have two mascots! Makes them extra special!
Completely false. They have 3.
Explain...?
Auburn mascots include:
Aubie the Tiger
the War Eagle
Plainsmen
You and the NCAA investigation crew into $cam Newton and payments to his father...
I'm not an endorser of preseason polls anyway but the ACC didn't get much love:
#10 FSU
#12 Clemson
#16 GT
Kind of hard when one conference makes up 1/3rd of the teams...
besides a homer pick for VT, who else would you say deserves to be in the top 25?
I think VT is about right where they belong. I thought UNC would crack the top 25 with all of the players they are returning, plus adding Gene Chizik at DC. Mainly I expected GT and Clemson to be ranked a couple spots better than they are.
NC State and Louisville also merit discussion. I'm more upset by the placement of those three than those being the only 3. For example, there is really no reason to rank Bama ahead of FSU. FSU has been recruiting at the same level as Bama, has been winning at the same level as Bama and has the same returning starters as Bama.
... Except that they way outplayed FSU last year. FSU was lucky to finish with the record that they did. Also, not all returning starters are equal. Pending the resolution of Dalvin Cook's case, FSU essentially just returns Jalen Ramsey and some talent. Out of their starters, 7 are from last year's mediocre defense, while the offense that saved them so many times returns only 3. Conversely, the defense that Bama mostly returns was very good and the strength of that team. Hardly the same. If anything, FSU is being overrated a little.
Much more baffling is 100 people voting for a Mississippi State team than only returns 7 starters, has been outpaced by its SEC West counterparts in recruiting, and plays, according to the voters themselves, a brutal schedule. They might struggle to make a bowl and yet are being ranked by folks.
So beating an Arkansas team that hasn't won a conference game in 2 years by 1 point is "outplaying" FSU? Or was it the fact that they had to come back from down 2 possessions to Auburn to win the game? That's apparently not "lucky," but rather, shows that they are "resilient" right? /s
When FSU had multiple double digit comebacks (and STILL beats the spread), it was considered lucky. But when Alabama does it, they are credited? That sounds completely logical.
This is just wrong. Any Alabama fan will tell you that the Alabama defense from last year was one of the weakest units they've had in recent years. They didn't have any corners and their defensive line play was weaker than it has been over the past few years. There is a reason why they were decimated by Ohio State in the playoff game, even with Ohio State turning the ball over multiple times. They couldn't stop anyone that had a pulse. I mean heck, even Florida put up 21 points on them last year.
The original argument for why FSU and Bama should be ranked similarly is completely relevant. And it's even more strange due to the fact that FSU's most recent championship has come after Alabama's.
Really, you're gonna choose to pick out wins against solid Arkansas and Auburn teams? When FSU struggled with Oklahoma State and Florida and needed to come from behind against Miami, Louisville, NC State, and Notre Dame (that's a lot of games), and needed BC to miss an easy field goal to win? Yes, given those circumstances, and given how they played, winning as many games as they did is, statistically speaking, very lucky. It could be argued that Bama got lucky against a couple of teams, but FSU got lucky against a hell of a lot of teams.
http://www.footballstudyhall.com/2015/1/26/7917313/second-order-wins-col...
Never mind that Bama was more highly regarded by all of the major advanced metrics along with the pundits... (fplus (FEI and S&P+) and ESPN's FPI (FSU was #15, Bama was #2) for what little that's worth).
Bama's defense was weaker relative to some of their dominant defenses in recent years, and it did have very specific weaknesses in coverage and in terms of linebacker depth, but it was still a very good defense and was considerable stronger than FSU's. Ohio State and Auburn were able to take advantage of their weaknesses repeatedly. But let's not discount how good they were because they got torched by elite offenses that were also a bad match ups for them (Also, one of Florida's touchdowns was a fumble return, they only allowed 200 yards that game, so...). They were #3 in defensive S&P+, #6 in scoring defense, #12 in total defense, #18 in yards per play allowed, #7 in FPI defensive efficiency, and #8 in FEI defense. That's pretty good. FSU, on the other hand, was #30, #50, #63, #63, #42, and #28 respectively. No where close to Bama's numbers. Regardless of your stat or advanced metric of choice, there really isn't much of a comparison.
http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/ncaadef
http://www.cfbstats.com/2014/leader/national/team/defense/split01/catego...
http://www.cfbstats.com/2014/leader/national/team/defense/split01/catego...
http://www.cfbstats.com/2014/leader/national/team/defense/split01/catego...
http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/feidef
Da U is Bak!!!
Is Da U bak yet?
I think Penn State is pretty low. They have a lot returning on Offense including a potential #1 overall pick QB, and had a legitimate top 5 defense last year with major parts returning.
Potential number 1 pick doesn't mean much. We had one of those a few years ago.
They lost to Maryland last year.
Also, Ohio State is the first unanimous AP #1 of all-time going back for 66 years since the polls inception. That's craziness.
But as they say: the bigger they are, the harder they fall...
Think you'll see it a little more with the playoffs now days. Its a lot harder to argue that Ohio state didn't deserve it the way they thrashed Oregon and bama and I think it'll be the start of a trend. Less and less you'll have which 1 loss team passes the eye test and gets into the championship that you used to get with the bcs
Kinda, but look at the talent coming back, and the easy schedule. Not one voter thought of a good enough challenger.
TCU has a very similar team and schedule. Michigan St also, and USC has been hype with their new team.
Since 1976 all 7 teams with 90%+ of 1st place votes in the first AP poll did not win the title.
In the last 25 years, the National Champion has come from the AP top 5, 18 times.
Since 1985, the Preseason #1 or #2 has won the title 10 times. The most of any two positions by 200%.
so... combining the logic of your posts, I conclude that TCU will win it all this year.
I wasn't knocking OSU. I just thought it was an interesting stat.
Another thing that jumps out, obviously the SEC is well represented but the SEC West in particular:
All SEC West schools are in the top 27 teams in the country.
SEC West bias much?
That right there shows explicitly why polls are currently, have always been, and will always be a joke
What's even more asinine is that these polls determine championships. They shouldn't. And really, with conference title games, and the requirements to play in one (win your division), polls should be meaningless in the grand scheme, and the 'regular season' should essentially be the group stage of the season long playoff.
Sooooooo.....can they get 3 teams in the playoff?
Try 4
That's about right....but Notre Dame is ranked?? Amazing
That is actually probably legit. Notre Dame had a pretty good team last year, but kinda lost their way after the FSU game which ended in benching Golson. Now they are returning essentially everyone. I think they are losing something like one starter on each side of the ball.
They had injury issues as bad a we did. I think all but 2 starters on defense were hurt for a significant period of time. Plus they had a lot of guys decide to stick around and didn't graduate much from last year.
Malik Zaire looked good near the end of last year as well. Mike Monaco at Bleacher Report compared Zaire's first year starting to other recent Notre Dame QBs. I'd be a little hyped at the prospect that he'll be good. They start the season at Texas and have USCw, Stanford, GT, and Clemson in an otherwise light schedule.
They start the season
atwith Texas and have USCw, Stanford, GT, and Clemson in an otherwise light schedule.FTFY