Mike Farrell of Rivals.com announced Hand's top-3 this morning.
Da'Shawn Hand has eliminated the #Hokies and #Gamecocks and has a top 3 of #Alabama, #Florida and #Michigan. #LSU and #USC could get trips.— Mike Farrell (@rivalsmike) June 12, 2013
Throughout the entire recruiting process, Hand has been adamant about Bud Foster being his favorite coach, so most Hokies and recruiting analysts felt extremely good about Virginia Tech's chances to land him. Early on Hand stated he wanted to pursue a degree in engineering, but his academic interests changed not too long ago, and that might be a reason why the Hokies sit on the outside looking in.
Hand eliminated Virginia Tech because it doesn't offer sports management. Has the utmost respect for the Hokies, wishes them best of luck.— SB Nation Recruiting (@SBNRecruiting) June 12, 2013
Hand is a rare combination of once-in-a-year talent with a good head on his shoulders. There's nothing to do but wish him the best.
Having the nation's top prospect in your backyard and losing out on him in June is a blow for sure. There's been more positive news lately regarding Tech's chances with 5-star defensive tackle Andrew Brown, but right now Tech is 0-2 on in-state 5-star recruits (Hand, Quin Blanding). However, it's June and national signing day is in February. Last June number-one recruit Robert Nkemdiche committed to Clemson, and ended up signing with Ole Miss. I'll admit I'm the eternal optimist and that seems like a longshot as far as Hand is concerned, but things change quickly in recruiting.
Luckily the Hokies have some decent depth at defensive end (Corey Marshall, Ken Ekanem, Dadi Nicolas, Wyatt Teller, among others) and a verbal commitment from Vincent Mihota (high 3-star / 4-star). Tech has also had success pursuing Kentavius Street, a 5-star defensive end prospect from North Carolina.
Comments
How long till Tech installs a Sports Management/Marketing program?
This week wouldn't be soon enough!
I think we offer Sports Marketing as a minor but not a major. My roomate did it.
This sucks, although is somewhat ironic. People thought that we were on the outside with Brown but it turns out he likes us because we offer the degree he's looking out and the opposite comes true for Hand. I don't blame him for not wanting to pursue engineering, but sports management is a pretty far jump. I wonder it other factors are at play.
Edit: FUCK. ASS.
No its over...why even try...lets just field walk-ons for the rest of existance
I am trying to remain calm but my heart can't handle it
Think we can get Jimmy Williams to come back and teach Sports Management? I hear he is pretty good at handling finances.
My thoughts on this:
Not that it matters, but SBNation just clarified his majors choice of Sports Marketing, not Management.
https://twitter.com/sbnrecruiting/status/344800380816871424
I doubt this is soley about Major choice. If it is, I think if we could get him on campus and sit him down with a higher up in Pamplin. They could explain that a Sports Marketing/Management degree would cut him off from a lot of opportunities that a regular Marketing or Management degree would give him.
This has little to do with a major. Saban's not striking out 2 years in a row with the #1 prospect.
At least we're getting #allmarooneverything back. That battle has been fought for longer then recruiting Hand.
Is this true? We are going to be wearing All maroon unies again next year? You sir have found the silver lining to this horrible horrible day.
No. sorry.
Here's Hand's explanation:
http://www.sbnation.com/college-football-recruiting/2013/6/12/4422364/da...
As many have already pointed out, it appears we were dropped because we didn't have a sports marketing program. But then he mentions he was impressed by a $25M project towards improving Alabama's engineering program, and that doesn't make sense to me. If engineering is still on the table, VT is also in the middle of constructing a brand new building (with a freakin' Rolls Royce jet engine hanging from the ceiling: http://www.vtnews.vt.edu/photo-galleries/2012/110612-coe-jetengine/jeten...). So, I don't get it.
At any rate, I wish him luck; hope he finds a school that's a good fit and has a great career. Seems like a good kid.
Bummer, but not a huge surprise when going up against two of the most storied programs in College Football. We really need a topnotch indoor practice facility soon, to enhance our recruiting pitch.
If it isn't us, I'd just hope it would be Alabama. I've grown a severe distaste for Michigan. I could stand Florida. Not so much LSU.
Or USC. I have nothing but dislike for Kiffin.
This would all be a lot more painful if he dropped a verbal commit with us.
really tired of losing top VA prospects year after year.
Unfortunately, until we stop losing high-profile OOC games that we should win, it's going to continue.
The list of big games against "name" opponents that we came ever so close to winning but that we somehow ended up losing anyway is a long and sad one.
FSU in 2000 for the national championship
Auburn in 2004
USC in 2004
FSU in the ACC title game in 2005
Georgia in 2006
Kansas in 2007
#2-ranked Boston College in 2007
Alabama in 2009
Boise State in 2010
Clemson (twice) in 2011
FSU in 2012.
Granted, we've had some nice wins. Beating Nebraska twice, Texas A&M twice, and LSU all count. Our 2010 shellacking of FSU in the ACC championship game was one to remember.
But more often than not, we've come up short in the really big games. Until we can find a way to start winning these types of games, it's going to be difficult to sign the nation's highest-rated players.
I'm hoping that our new offensive staff can get us over the hump.
The best players in the country want to play for the best teams and contend for national championships. Right now, that group of programs doesn't include VT.
Yet Kentucky is pulling in recruits this year despite going 2-10 last year. Jeff Tedford at Cal could always get recruits even though the Bears were consistently mediocre. It seems to me the problem is with the staff, but there isn't an easy fix since the staff is good at coaching football.
I think getting to the NFL matters just as much (if not more) to a lot of these guys than a championship. Nobody seems to put players in the NFL like the SEC.
So here is a list of all of the sports management programs in the US:
http://www.nassm.com/InfoAbout/SportMgmtPrograms/United_States
And here is a (who knows how reliable) list of the top 10 sports management programs:
http://www.ehow.com/list_6644740_top-10-sports-management-programs.html
Alabama just has a Master's program, and South Carolina is listed as having one of the best in the nation, yet they were also eliminated. I think this shows that there are a lot of factors that went in to this and definitely not just the degree program (though that may have been the deciding factor in our case).
Well, Saban can virtually guarantee a recruit they'll play for the National Championship. No other coach can really pitch that right now.
I'm as upset as the next guy about losing out on Hand, but I have faith in #BudHeavy to put together another solid defense behind guys like Mihota, Maddy, Fuller, Fisher, Teller and a handful of not-4 stars who play with #hateface. Plus there's still hope in landing 2 or 3 of Nnadi, Street, and Brown.
Offense is the need. If we go 0-3 on our QBs and whiff on OL again, then I'll be very upset.
Also, losing the #1 recruit due to not having his (suddenly different) major is about as legit as the kid who couldn't land his prom date because she didn't want to risk ruining their great friendship. It's always about the d...
And studies show that the Hokies play angrier when we wear #ALLMAROONEVERYTHING The proof is when you watch films from the Big East and early ACC days.
Yep. It all went downhill with the 1-orange sleeve days. Orange is only appropriate bordering the VT or when used in the throwback shoulder and helmet lines. Otherwise, it's like watching a bunch of nancy boys hitting each other.
I'd like all orange everything when we play at home against Clemson. Imagine how confusing it would be for them to have a stadium full of orange cheering for the other team.
I've always wondered why VT doesn't have Sports Management/Marketing anyway. I knew a few guys that picked JMU over VT in high school just because of that. They weren't recruits or anything, just regular students.
Should have taken him to The Homeplace
not gonna lie. I'm pretty butt hurt.
It's sunny outside. But inside I feel like this....
That's pretty much how my day went.
SUNUVA GODAMN FUCKIN BITCH!
ok, i'm sorry it's out of my system now.
hey look, maroon pants, sweet!
Malaise. Angry glare at Bud Foster until Andrew Brown makes an announcement.
Rivals lists Bud as the primary recruiter. This is on him.
Can't pin it on one person. Alabama is modern college football dynasty, Florida's won two national championships of their own in the BCS era, and Michigan (a team we just lost to) is quite arguably the most historical program in college football.
But, it was a catch!!! I saw it right in front of me with my own eyes!!!
me too man, ...me too. I'm stationed 5 hours away from New Orleans... my friend and I left the game and didn't utter a single word on the entire trip back. It still stings.
Virginia Tech AD Jim Weaver said in a release. “Michigan is the winningest college football program in the country.”
I am not pinning it on Bud, but until very recently, his record on recruiting was not very strong. I am still furious over the Curtis Grant-Stephone Anthony-Travis Hughes debacle while he was off interviewing for the Pitt job.
Bud and Beamer had an in-home visit with Travis Hughes the day after winning the ACC Championship. No time off, the day after they were recruiting him in his house. He took himself out of the running for the Vandy job because of that trip: http://voices.washingtonpost.com/hokies-journal/2010/12/foster_turned_do....
Grant was written off long before the Pitt job opened up.
Heres's a piece that cites Foster's visit with Anthony: http://www.tigernet.com/view/story.do?id=9326 sometime in January 2011.
I'm not saying he's a top-flight recruiter, but he's certainly made the effort.
I'm still not real happy about this as well. I understand that, as VA becomes a better HS FB state (anyone else notice the we went from Rivals making a VA Top 30 to a VA Top 35?), the competition for our athletes will be more intense. Teams like Alabama, Clemson, FSU, FLA, OSU, Michigan, etc. will be able to pull in some of the best of them. But when we have a class loaded with a position group (the LBs mentioned above, the DLs this year, not to mention the QBs we haven't pulled over the past few years [Wilson, Glennon 2, Manuel, Sims, Renner, Boyd]), it starts to feel like our recruiting isn't up to par.
This year, I can give a pass to an extent. We had a bad year last year and our new coaches don't know the commonwealth like the old ones did, I get it. I'll just be frustrated if we continue to fall behind out-of-state schools in our own commonwealth.
A lot of schools have recruiters that can't coach (UVA) and others have coaches that can't recruit. I'm not saying Bud can't recruit, but lets say I like how VT fares against UVA. Not blaming Bud. There is more to football than landing elite talent, and we are pretty good at those other things.
What is it, exactly, that is "on him"? Failing to sign a recruit that every single program in the nation was after?
Honestly this felt like we just lost a close game as the clock expired that we coulda shoulda won. It has that sick stomach feeling. Am I the only one that feels this way???
You mean like the 2007 BC game in Blacksburg? I'm still bitter and hate Matt Ryan and Boston College to this day because of it. I didn't even notice it was raining until BC scored that touchdown...
On the plus side, at least we know now instead of later. 2 of those last 3 are going to be left standing with their pants down in the end. At least we can go after other kids on our list now...
I'm not going to worry about it too much, a lot can happen by the time signing day rolls around. Hand will have plenty of time to change his mind after we #BEATBAMA!
This is a valid point...it actually makes me feel a little better to think that we can focus our efforts on Brown/Nnadi/Street I have a really good feeling about Nnadi, that guy whether he comes to Tech or not looks like a mean mean dude he will be a stud. Plus if Hand is gonna eliminate Tech then good riddance don't want you no how!
Also another point to make is that our defense has never ever been a problem during the last 15-20 years except maybe the first half of this past season/2003 season. Bud has proven he can take guys from all over the board and churn out a top ten defense nearly every season. I think we should be more focused on what kind of Offensive talent we can bring in specifically Oline and athletes...with all that being said it would be a complete disaster if we did not land a single one of these high 4/5 star VA recruits make no mistake about it...complete disaster
2010 D was pretty poo. good riddance to hand? let's not get silly.
Well I suppose we won't have to worry about the NCAA sniffing in our direction anytime soon; we won't make outrageous concessions.
As much as losing out on Hand stinks royally, I have to concur that our D's greater need is to land 2 DT's out of the 3 great ones in VA for 2014. If we can land any combo of Brown, Nnadi and Walker, that would be more important to me than Hand, though he will most likely be a beast wherever he plays. Hate losing the national exposure and program validation that signing Hand would have produced, but it will always be tough stealing 5-stars away from the SEC programs until they are not longer "THE CONFERENCE" in NCAA football. (unless your school is located next door to Hollywood)
This was too good to be true in my opinion. He'll go to Alabama, Fla or USC like everyone else and shine and be a star (like all the other 5* recruits), but he would have been a legend at VT. No so much at the other schools. I'd love for us to land Brown, but we'll see. I'm sick and tired of losing out to these in state 5* recruits, too.
If VT can land some of the other top talent in the state, I'll call it wash. If VT can't, it seems to me that it doesn't matter who they bring in to recruit, VT is just not capable of bringing in the elite talent. Shane, Loeffler, and Grimes were extremely successful at other schools. If they can't reproduce that success, they need to try and figure out what is different about VT and then correct it. VT needs to get away from always being the bridesmaid, never the bride.
And this is just about the elite talent in VA and nearby. It seems VT is still lightyears away from bringing in the #1 or 2 recruit in any other state. The Florida schools can do it, any SEC school can do it, Michigan, Clemson and ND are doing it. What do these schools have that VT doesn't currently offer? Each have something, but none (except for Alabama) have all aspects better than VT.
Light years away? Seriously?
We didn't make his top 3. That means that of all the schools in Division 1 football (and there's what, 124 or so?) Tech finished way ahead of most of them. Tech needs another trip to a BCS bowl and another ACC championship season before it will start seeing top-notch recruiting talent come it's way.
But Tech definitely isn't "light years" away from these elite (number 1 in the country) recruits.
I don't think you can just say its winning that does it. We've won more ACC titles and ACC games than Clemson and they consistently bring in better classes. Recruiting is an art and Dabo, Saban, Fisher, etc., are great at it. There is a fine line that they all play on, but outside of Saban, I don't think anyone else can pull the play for a National Championship card and I think that is even just another arrow in Saban's quiver.
Name a number 1 recruit from another state that VT has pulled in. Off the top of my head, I can think of two. KJ and Kendall. KJ was an amazing get, and has to be repeated. Kendall was well connected with VT community, so I'm not considering him. VT is having a hard time pulling in the #1 recruit in VA. It's not getting close to pulling in #1 recruits in any other state.
Darren Evans was a close 2nd in Indiana.
Oh, nice. Didn't realize he was that high in Indiana, but good call.
Well it's going to come down to your definition of "light years away" I guess. If Tech is "light years" away from signing these top recruits, how far away are programs like JMU's? Or Richmond's? Or Wake Forest?
Tech isn't an elite recruiting school, but it certainly is a top 30 school. Tech isn't that far off from landing top recruits out of VA, it just needs the offense to be as effective as the defense has been. If Loeffler can turn that around, expect Tech to start making more noise on the recruiting ground.
My counterpoint would be to juxtapose the FSU record and the VT record along side the their rival recruiting rankings, and # of top recruits in the past 10 years. But, I don't have the time to put this together. Anyways, I think you would see success on the field is correlative, but does not make a directly relate to recruiting success.
And yes, light years is an exaggeration, but VT has not been close to getting top out-of-state prospects on a consistent basis. And why even bother comparing VT to JMU, Richmond, or Wake Forest? If you think VT should be satisfied being better then them, then I guess their recruiting is good enough. But, I'd like to compare VT to USCeast, Clemson, FSU, Ole Miss, Auburn, Michigan, ND. I think VT football is in this caliber on the field. However, in terms of recruiting, VT is not very close.
Yeah let's not compare our program to that of jmu, wf, and richmond. That's just rude.
What about Kevin Jones?
Kevin Jones was 13 years ago...Shane Beamer had just graduated.
I feel so old right now.
Think it's a situation that sucks of course and would've generated a lot of buzz for the program but not catastrophic. At least VT knows now and can focus attention to others.
A few points:
He seems like a good kid but I find the "not having his major" thing to be a bit of an excuse to eliminate us. I think he was woo'd by the allure of top national programs more than anything. As others have said, VT has marketing/management which I'm sure would be applicable to the sports world. I am extremely confident that his experience/connections as a an athlete and first-hand experience from internships and that type of thing would be far, FAR more important to achieving success in that field rather than if you have specifically a sports marketing/management degree or a normal marketing/management degree. So yeah, nothing against Hand as he should make the decision he wants to make and his intentions may be pure at this time, but you're going to have trouble convincing me that at the very least it's not a misguided reason for eliminating VT from contention.
Good level-headed take, and I agree.
It's frustrating because it is a measure, to some degree, of our program at a national level, but it is what it is.
Again, let's get the kids that want to be Hokies and develop them-(Beamer is pretty good at that, by the way).
I'll wish the others good luck, until they face the Hokies on the field.......
This may seem bad now, but when we win the commonwealth cup to complete a decade of domination we'll all feel better. So recruits think, on a national level, we are not all that. Ehh, we might get there someday. What it all boils down to is that LOLUVA sux, and we are better than them, and thinking about that always makes me smile.
i was really starting to look forward to the idea of Hand smashing QBs on a weekly basis...oh well, nobodys bigger than the program we'll find someone just as good!
FYI, Hand is going to be talked about on Bill King in the next hour...and King is interested in getting to the bottom of his elimination of Tech and what it means to us.
I'd rather the rest of the recruits not know that Beamer thought Michael Jackson was still alive.
Full Article: http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/recruiting-insider/wp/2013/06/12/das...
Hand said “I did not have that gut feeling that I was going to go there.”
To get these top guys we need to figure this part out. I don't have an answer but I feel like this is the art of it that we seem to be missing.
I think seeing a crystal ball in the trophy case gives them that gut feeling. We literally have everything that all of the other schools have besides that.
-Conference powerhouse: check
-National powerhouse: see "crystal ball" below
-Strong fan base: check
-Successful coach: check (we have the advantage in some cases here)
-Great defense: check
-NFL factory: check
-Top notch facilities: check (not sure if all of the others have indoor practice facilities)
-Crystal ball:
If anybody wants to argue location, I'm not buying it (Michigan is freezing). If we win a MNC or two then the cold mountains won't matter to most.
Agreed but we really need that IPF soon, lots of ACC schools have them now too.
Good point, the dagger is that to get there we need the talent that wants us to already have it. It's a nasty circle. However, Beamer and Foster have proven to be GREAT at developing the talent they have. I think if we can upgrade the base level of talent and then have that development on top of that we may very well get there sooner rather than later.
Yea, there is something about VT that isn't resonating. I don't know what it is, maybe it is the lack of crystal ball. Pretty much every successful (perennial top-10) recruiting team has a crystal ball or a very close connection (i.e. USCeast has Spurrier). VT currently has no connection. In the Hokie's defense, they do have very strong connections to superbowl rings. Lefty mentored Tom Brady and is very close to him. Moorehead has one himself.
Maybe we need to just win every game this year and rectify that crystal ball problem.
Grimey was the O-Line coach for the 2010 Auburn team & Loeffler was a GA for the 1997 Michigan team.
Yes, we have all that.....
But I truly think the one thing that we are missing is $$$$$$$.
I live near the shadow of Clemson and South Carolina and the amount of money that their alumni throw at their program is daunting. (And they're not even in the ballpark with a Texas or Alabama.)
I don't think that we, as Hokies send the money to the program like some of these other schools.
Both Clemson and South Carolina just spent BIG money on coaching staff and their facilities are impressive.
I think it comes down to deciding we want to win the big one and then start sending large $ across the range of the alumni. And it's not a quick process........
I like your style, "win a MNC OR TWO"
+ turkey for u
I don't totally buy that. Clemson last won a title in the early 80s and they still pull recruits. They haven't really been all that close to a title either lately. They went 6-7 in 2010 and landed a top 10 class in spite of that. Michigan won half a title in 1997. How old were the current high school recruits- 3? Ole Miss hasn't won anything in 50 years. Kentucky's pulling in recruits this year under Stoops. I tend to think the problem is with the staff and what they're doing.
Well I was speaking in terms of Virginia Tech. I think our current staff could pull these top recruits if we had national championships because everything else is in place. Maybe there's a problem with our current staff that is restricting us from winning the crystal??? Nahhh I'm not going to go down that road again; damn near got exiled from the site last time I spoke my mind on that subject. I'm all in for Scot & Grimes - hopefully they're the start to getting our problems fixed.
I do believe some of our problems are the location of our campus. We are in the mountains not close to any real city. Roanoke is nearby but that is no draw. Blacksburg is a very small town and that might turn off some of these players...
I've always seen this as a double edged sword...our location isn't the most appealing to most recruits so it hurts us but at the same time the guys that do come really want to be there to play ball. They aren't there for the beach or the clubs or the bright lights. Look at all the talent some of these schools (Tennessee, Miami etc) bring in that doesn't always translate to wins. There are other factors of course and we'll struggle to bring in elite talent until we consistently win big games but I think it's just a matter of time
Good point, I like the optimism! A turkey leg for you!
If we can get Street, people will forget about Hand when Street, Teller, Mihota, Nicolas, and Nnadi are destroying OLs.
+1 because you made me happy
Edit: add Brown to the list, please?
I've heard that Brown and Nnadi likely won't end up in the same place because they don't get along that well. I have no idea if it is true but I have heard it. I just have a feeling we get 1 but not the other. I would love to get both though.
There is a lack of shame for VA athletes that go to out of state schools. I bet almost every top recruit in AL went to Bama or Auburn. Not so in VA.
So you are telling me that we lose the #1 recruit who just so happens to be from Virginia because we don't offer Underwater Basket Weaving as a major like the SEC does... WHO KNEW!?
WE NEED UNDERWATER BASKET WEAVING
Every Major is terrible anyway:
http://xkcd.com/1052/
Bravo good sir, BRAVO!
Found it best to play this in the background while looking over the strip
I SOOOO wanna buy you a drink for posting this.
So architecture is fine?
Yes, just ask Costanza
just listened to a radio broadcast, it is believed that VT might still be in the HAND running; but that he might have just been trying to dispel the rumor that we were his favorites. However, with this said we need to have best visits possible with him when and if he comes to blacksburg
That sounds like whoever is on the radio is in the denial stage of grief.
it's possible, but not likely. ohherro commented earlier a WaPo article and tweet that basically spelled out that Hand talked to Foster to let him how he's no longer considering VT. Sure, he could be planning to pull a complete 180 when he announces his college choice, but I don't think playing with Hokie Nation's heartstrings like that is in his mind right now. I know my mood immediately plummeted upon reading the headline; I can only imagine what that Hand-Foster phone conversation was like.
Well said.
Though awkward, the phone conversation between Hand and Foster was probably less awkward than the conversation between Jawand Blue and Coach Wiles. Then again, I don't think I could ever say "No" to Coach Foster without peeing myself. But that's why he's the #1 recruit in the nation and I'm sitting behind a desk at 7 AM on a Friday.