Let me preface this by saying I dont really follow recruiting. About 95% of the recruiting knowledge I have comes from these boards. All I really know about Bucky Hodges and Andrew Ford is that they are both talented quarterbacks and one of them will likely be the future face of VT football.
It seems to me that in this recruiting cycle it's considered to be a foregone conclusion amongst fans that Bucky isnt gonna be the guy, whoever we land from the class of 2014 will. Why is this? He was a four star guy right? Is it because Lefty didnt recruit Hodges? Does he not fit into the system we're transitioning to? Seemed like folks were pretty pumped when we landed him and now it feels like he's an afterthought to whoever the new staff brings in. Or am I just interpreting the chatter all wrong?
Comments
Recruits don't always pan out...maybe Ford won't maybe Hodges won't maybe both won't and maybe both will during but in different seasons....the point is you want to get as many of the best players you can every year...Bucky was a 2013 commit we are relatively thin at the QB position especially after LT leaves...So I think were just excited to be bringing in a top level player...Also look at where Ford could have ended up...Pitt...that would have been a disaster..its just good to bring in a top flight QB... I wouldn't look at it too much as "This is our guy for the future"
Recruiting is one of those things that, especially in the off season, people get very fanatical about. Add in the fact that we had one of the shittiest recruiting weeks in recent memory and people might tend to get overly excited and forget that Bucky is a talented kid too.
Lack of depth at the QB position has been a problem in our program since Marcus Vick was kicked off the team. If he plays in 2006, maybe Glennon is a little more polished in 2007 and we can red-shirt Tyrod. If Tyrod red-shirts, he is our starting QB in 2011 and we make a run at the national title.
Obviously thats a lot of speculation, but the main bulletted point is this: Layer your depth at important positions so that if somebody gets hurt or dismissed or transfers, you have capable back-ups.
I don't put much stock in the "Bucky isn't Loeffler's Guy" Theory. Bucky is a talented kid. I went to several of his games last season and, while he is raw, I have every confidence that he has all the tools to become a great QB under Loeffler. He'll red-shirt and compete with Leal for the starting spot in 2014.
Bucky Hodges is going to get his. If he comes in willing to work hard and he picks up the offense quickly, there is no reason the starting job can't be his in 2015 (or 2014, depending on how Loeffler and Leal get along).
With that being said, a coach who has a reputation for being a QB guy like Loeffler is, the first recruit he brings in will get a lot of attention. I think Ford is a more refined prospect (his footwork in the pocket is really, really good) but is slightly less gifted athletically. It'll be fun to see how the QB battle plays out over the next couple of years.
I agree, it's still an open competition, nothing is gauranteed. For all we know McMillan steals the show, or some other guy.
I don't even think Leal is near a lock for next season, he has a head start, but still has to work for it.
I've always just figured that if Bucky doesn't work out at QB maybe he'll be doomed to be the next Kam Chancellor.
I'm not sure you understand what "doomed" means.
Hah I tend to be sarcastic
*edit - Bucky is athletic enough that whether he plays QB or not, he'll be just fine.
That's what I was hoping. Sometimes it's hard for me to pick up on internet sarcasm though.
Anyways, +1 for the optimism.
If he's doomed to an NFL career as a safety, I think he'll take it.
I think the fans kind of forgot about Bucky because of the two guys we were going after and were predicted to get.
Bucky's a great athlete, good quarterback and I'm sure we're all happy to have him, but we were going after two top 5 pro style quarterbacks and were thought to get one. That's just something we're not used to; we all got really excited and anxious at the thought of having a highly touted pro style quarterback in Blacksburg to make up for years of having mobile quarterbacks having to bail out poor coaching. Plus we wanted to land one of those top guys to really validate Scot as the change we needed. Think it's just natural, as VTCEE said above, for fans to go a little overboard in the off season with recruiting, especially with all the factors that were at play (new staff, respected OC, top qb prospects, pro style qbs). Bucky will get his chance and if he makes strides in his passing game, he can be the guy for us.
I think the apprehension over the Park and Cornwell decisions comes from the lack of playmaker depth at the position. Keep in mind, at one time we were a rolled ankle away from Ju Ju Clayton and a bunch of walk on's playing QB, and that was unacceptable. At any given time, a good college football program needs to have three scholarship QB's on the roster who the coaching staff feels is talented enough to win a conference game. Bucky Hodges is a very talented player (although my concerns about his arm strength are well documented on this site), but in 2015, I don't want every egg in that basket if he ends up not panning out ala a Kevin Newsome at Penn State. You must have depth at the position. If Bucky beats out Leal and then Ford, TERRIFIC! But, if he doesn't, I want someone who can play the position. I still think they take another QB next year.
And as much as he may want to, I don't think there is any chance that McMillan plays QB.
I've gotten this feeling from our fans too, and I have no idea why. Many are using the following logic to predetermine the quarterback of the future: if the QB was recruited last, then he's the quarterback of the future. I doubt that's how things will actually work.
Loeffler wants as many talented QBs as he can get on the roster, meaning he'll continue to recruit highly touted QBs to create as much depth on the roster as possible. Injuries, transfers, all do happen.
Next season it'll be Bucky or Leal battling for the starting job (upside will probably be a factor), the following year it'll be a three-man race between Bucky, Ford, and Travon McMillian.
and god willing some silly 5 star 2015 QB recruit...the more the merrier Blue Collar Hokie
I don't think the excitement about Ford's commitment is a knock on Hodges, I just think Hokie fans are happy and relieved to see we will have some legit D1 depth at the position. Not getting a prospect like Ford would mean our coaches would have to look further for a non-committed diamond in the rough prospect.
Consider the QB talent that VT has been blessed with over the last decade...
Top Tier
Bryan Randall - #1 Va, #15 nation - SuperPrep ****
Marcus Vick - #1 Va, #8 nation - Rivals *****
Tyrod Taylor - #1 Va, #27 nation - Rivals *****
Second Tier
Sean Glennon - #3 Va - Rivals ****
Logan Thomas - #4 Va, #71 nation - Rivals ****
We have been successful on the field despite a clear identity on offense and questionable QB development. This is due to the fact that the men running our offense have been gifted with the tools to overcome these deficiencies.
Our best QB play has come from the guys in the Top tier - top 50 players in the country, #1 in the state.
Consider the next in line...
Mark Leal - unranked Fl - Rivals ***
Bucky Hodges - #10 Va - Rivals ****
Andrew Ford - #11 Pa - Rivals ***
Based on their prep resumes, there isn't a QB in this group that would be placed in the top 2 tiers of starting VT QBs over the past decade.
I think there is a fear amongst many seasoned Hokie fans that we could be in for in significant drop in production from the QB position unless we are able to right the ship on offense with our new coaching staff.
I'm not saying we can't be successful with one of the guys listed above, I just think that our coaches will have to work much harder to get the results we have been accustomed to - ie: ACC championships.
Thoughts?
I think Ford is more highly rated than you give him credit for. Elite 11 QB = top 20 QB nationally.
Eh, well... not exactly top 11 yet. He is one of 25 (I believe) quarterbacks who have been invited to the Elite 11 camp/competition late in June (around the 28th, iirc), where they go through some set of drills and are graded, and the top 11 then become the "Elite 11 Quarterbacks".
Still rated higher than the #11 QB in PA. I thought he was the #1 QB in PA?
Rivals currently lists him as the number 11 prospect in the state of Pennsylvania for 2014. He is the third QB listed behind JJ Cosentino (FSU) and Chandler Kincade (Akron).
It's still early and the rankings will most likely change between now and signing day.
Recruiting sites also base their part of their evaluations on how many scholarships a kid has, ford only had VT Temple and UMass listed when in reality he had more, I think he is a bit underrated by some recruiting sites.
For example I played with a kid in high school who was NR or a 2 star recruit, PSU offered and OSU followed (in an attempt to not miss out) and he quickly shot up to a 3(4* by scouts but scouts kind of sucks). These sites follow closely what colleges think of them and what kind of scholarships they are offered.
18 QBs were invited to the finals this year (past couple years it's been 24). That's why I said top 20.
Gotcha. Do all the top QBs attend this camp? I had figured that you meant top 20 as in, "if you attend the Elite 11 competition chances are you're a top 20 QB".
Sorry, I guess I just haven't followed recruiting enough in the past.
Ford and Hodges are both good prospects. We will need both to push one another to get better in hopes that one will become a BCS conference QB.
What I was trying to say is we have not landed the blue chip QB we have become accustomed to. While we have never had the top 10 recruiting classes of FSU, Clemson, Miami - we have still been able to land a nationally ranked 4-5 star QB.
Taylor, Randall, and MV2 were all #1 dual threat QBs the years they came out - and for many seasons we have been able to rely on their talents to carry our offense. They are the type of talent you could play immediately and not have to wait till their R-Jr seasons to fully develop.
There is just less certainty of All ACC level success with Ford and Hodges.
I'm sorry but that last point is wrong.
#ParkandHodges4Heisman
Do you mean #fordandhodges4Heisman ?
So fail.....
*Face palm*
I guess I'm still in the denial stage, but I really really like all I'm hearing about Ford.
yeah, I can see the denial. I was upset at first, because he seemed like a lock. But for him to switch like that, and for Ford to be so VT (he changed his twitter background and everything) makes me like Ford more. I want kids to want to be a part of the program. Nothing like having a top rated player not play as well because he settled for the school or doesn't want to be there. Like that recruit that is going to honor his commitment to FSU eventhough he doesn't want to be there. Good luck with that.
It's just like Cal said, "Getting QBs is kind of like when I was growing pot, I realized that the more seeds I planted, the more pot I could ultimately smoke."
I am excited to see Bucky play. Ford's commitment was big because if Bucky doesn't pan out, we need more depth. We need depth in case of injuries. We need depth for competition. Ford will be here in December meaning Bucky will only have a summer camp on him. Getting Ford for next spring is huge and that is what I am excited about. He essentially gets 1.5 redshirt years or possibly a spring and summer camp will be enough and we have a 4 year starter on our hands...
Bucky will only have a summer camp on him... and a complete season. That kind of matters.
If Bucky redshirts, then He and Ford will have the same amount of in-game experience come decision time in 2014.
Honestly, I think Leal is not a guarantee to play. If I were coach, I would want Bucky to play, so that he will pick the system up and run with it the next couple of years, rather than putting a lot of investment into Leal to play a season and start over at QB.
I see your point and I'd lean the same way as well, but I'm sure that by Fall camp next year, they will start whomever they are confident that can win games at that point. That's what (unfortunately) burned Tyrod's redshirt his sophomore year. Even if Bucky has more upside long-term, Leal will be under center if they trust him over Bucky. But if Bucky is ready and set by that time, then yes, Leal may not get a collegiate start.
If Leal is the better quarterback, he'll get the starting job. If Bucky is better, he'll get the starting job. If it's really close, it'll probably go to Bucky to help build for the future, but depends on how close.
exactly you start the better option but because of his youth I'm really hoping that Bucky is the better option week 1 of 2014
They will play whichever gives them a better chance to win now.
*edit for typo.
I think you meant "play" and not "pay". Interesting slip-up though, if indeed it WAS? a mistake...
Haha, it was a typo. That's what happens when you open up this website to mobile platforms.
Summer camp he might get some reps, come the season he will not be getting anything meaningful. He will be in the meetings and film study which is good but as far as actually doing the offense he will be holding a clipboard. It is widely known that springs are more important for the development of young players than falls. They get the coaches attention while during the season the coaches focus more on the 1's.
I have wondered why some folks seem to have forgotten Tech have several quarterbacks already on the roster, including two walk-ons, Jessop and Roddy. I am high on Roddy myself. He is tall and seem to have a fairly good grasp on the offense. I can't wait to see Bucky in action this summer. He seem to be one of the hidden gems that Tech may have unearthed. In fact, wasn't Bucky the first player to commit to Tech during the rained out spring game? That tells me all I need to know about him. Plus, he got a cool name...Bucky.
It is true that good name QBs do well. I mean c'mon, Drunkenmiller? Maurice DeShazo? Tyrod Taylor?
You forgot Grant Throckmorton.
let throck throw the rock!
I lived next to Throckmorton on Progress st, he was an awesome neighbor. Great at Madden too haha.
If any of our walk-on QB's start a game, we have huge problems.
Won't happen. We'd just slide a wide receiver over to cover QB. Most of them played QB in high school anyway.
Nice thing about QB's playing WR is they know all the routes and plays very well. Just have to have the athleticism.
I did not get the feeling that either Rody or Jessop had a grasp on the offense watching them in the spring game. The two of them went through *maybe* one progression on their reads and then often threw up a rainbow jump ball to a guy on the sidelines. Most of the time, when I saw them throwing, they were leaning back and just tossing it. I realize they had a fair amount of pressure from the 1st team defense, but they didn't have the confidence to stand tall in the pocket and take a hit if it came to that. There were I believe 2, maybe 3, plays where they threw it with strength to a receiver. Those two are going to be backups who we hopefully won't see on the field in any capacity other than holder on special teams.
Yes, it's because Loeffler didn't recruit him. He had a chance when he was at Auburn and chose not to. Bucky has a chance, but if its close, Loeffler will pick his guy.
.....if Loeffler is still here. I think there is a very good chance Loeffler will only be here two years. If he succeeds, some SEC or NFL team will offer him considerably more than we will. If he doesn't succeed, I doubt VT steps up and replaces that $200k subsidy from Auburn when it runs out.
I disagree - I think Beamer values consistency enough to shell out a bit to keep him around!
I would LOVE for Loeffler to do so well that he gets promoted in two years. Think about what he would have to accomplish to do that though. Winning 10 games with our schedule isn't impressive enough to leverage a job at a more prestigous program. Tech would have to win back-to-back BCS bowls for this to happen, IMO.
I'm going to disagree that Leoffler will pick "his guy" over Bucky if it is close. he will pick whoever he feels gives the team the best chance to win.
If VT is going to want to compete with the big boys, they will have to be willing to spend money like the big boys.
I feel like a lot of people are forgetting about Carlis Parker?
Didn't Loeffler say he was going to get as much of a chance at the starting job as anyone else?
My understanding, and somebody correct me if I'm wrong, was he got his shot this spring and it didn't work out. He ended up spending most of his time with the WRs by the end of it.
I'm not sure about it not working out at QB, but I do know he was working with the receivers by the end of spring
One thing that works in Parker's favor is that he and Ford are both left handed. If Ford ends up starting, I could see them giving Parker an extra look at QB, simply because it the line responsibilities, primary run side, routes that receivers run (especially on bootlegs), etc. change with a left handed QB, so having a left handed back up for a left handed QB would simplify the adjustments that would need to be made for an injury.
Ford is the #1 rated qb in pa, according to 247. He took the DC elite mvp over Park and nearly 80 others ... And he plans on early enrolling in spring
I'd almost bet money that he moves up the charts after the elite11 thing...sounds like he's been pretty under the radar till recently.
Despite Loeffler's history of coaching pocket-passer QBs, all his future QB options (Bucky, Parker, and Ford) are throw-first dual-threat QBs. The exception on Loeffler's resume was Tim Tebow, a Logan-Thomasesque wrecking-ball that dominated the SEC for several years. A power running game with a dual-threat QB seems to be what Loeffler wants to develop at VT and Bucky, Parker and Ford all fit the system.
Food for thought or for perspective. Johnny Manziel, reigning Heismann winner, was a 3 star recruit, ranked #14 QB.