Whit Babcock briefs BOV on Name, Image and likeness.

https://www.roanoke.com/sports/college/va_tech/tech-ad-whit-babcock-stre...

"We are all for student athletes being treated like general students because they are general students," Tech athletic director Whit Babcock said during the meeting on Wednesday. "They happened to have the ability to play athletics at an incredibly high level. So if there is a store downtown and somebody wants to model clothes for them, great. We think that's fair.

I think this article brings up good points for P5 teams and potential pitfalls for NIL payments, recruiting and broad rules.

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He's not wrong, the problem is that most blue blood schools will certainly have more of those "little shops downtown" with deeper pockets, so the rich will still get richer. I like the idea but would not be opposed to a cap on the amount each kid could get to make things at least a little fair. I know I am naive for thinking that would ever happen but it would be nice...

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Here are the schools that can capitalize from NIL: Oregon and Maryland with their alums in sports gear and schools in large metro areas: GT, anOSU, Houston, USCw and UCLA, UNLV ( depending on rules of allowed business type), UCF, Miami for examples among others.

Wet stuff on the red stuff.

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Alumni and supporters aren't limited by geography. Unless I'm missing something... Nothing says businesses in the DMV can't sponsor hokie athletes. Just like atlanta businesses can sponsor SEC athletes. Or an NYC business owned by an Alabama booster can sponsor Alabama athletes... etc...

Because moat businesses (not an individual) is going to find it hard to spend money for advertising that doesn't actually bring in a return on investment. If I won a car dealership in NYC what good would it do me to put an Alabama player in one of my ads?

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I'm not sure you fully grasp the cult of SEC football. You think an Alabama alumn wouldn't jump at the chance to be at least partially responsible for bringing in even higher classes more consistently? I don't think they'd hesitate at all. It's almost like a tithe for them and return on investment, to a certain extent, wouldn't be at the top of their list. Maybe I'm wrong, but I feel pretty strongly that NIL won't help level the playing field at all and in fact will create a deeper divide between the haves and the have nots.

Bingo.
Placing a player who has 1st round/Heisman potential in their ad...they'd do it in a heartbeat.

Put it this way, if rules were in place, Atlanta (pre draft, but you get the idea) based VT alum owner of a car dealership definitely puts MV7 in an ad. Because he's Michael Vick, and the potential to have him play there when he turns pro.

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And I don't think many people understand how share holders, IRS and other financial implications of businesses just throwing money at players is much much different than an individual doing it.

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Publicly traded company is very different. A sole proprietor business is not that different. Spend business money on a player, whether there is return or a loss, or take the profit from the company and give it to the school for a tax write personally rather than less income from the business. Only question is i the individual business owner (likely with school imputes at some schools) is helping more by "hiring" the kid or donating to the school.

Sometimes we live no particular way but our own

But not every business has those restrictions. If the Smlltwnsthrnlwyr Law Office, LLC, solely owned and operated by me, Smlltwnsthrnlwyr, wants to blow 10k a year on advertising using Hokie athletes, there's a couple ways I can go about doing that. Off the top of my head, I could run spots with Hokie athletes in my small mountain west town to an audience that has no idea who they are, or I could run radio spots in Blacksburg for my business that doesn't do business in Blacksburg. Would either one be 'effective' (or is it efficient) or produce any 'return on investment' for the law firm?

Probably not at all. BUT, if me the 'marketing director' only has to account to myself, owner and operator of the law firm, and also rabid Hokie fan, there's nothing at all wrong with that.

Sure IBM or Tesla or whatever publicly held company can't just plow cash into whatever school as a veiled 'marketing campaign' but that's because they have a fiduciary duty to their stockholders. I don't.

I don't know what the corporate structure of Shelor (was that the car dealership in Christiansburg?) is, but I know the Ford dealer in my town has a similar enough structure to my law firm that if he wanted to plow cash into a school for 'marketing' he'd be totally fine.

How many car dealers or landscaping companies or plumbers or electricians or law firms do you think are in Tuscaloosa who would be willing to plow some cash into Roll Tide football? It's probably a lot of the same guys who fund the bagmen already. If they could go legit a) they'd be able to spend more because they'd be able to write it off as pretax business expenses, and b) they'd probably get some return on investment just from being associated with Alabama and be publicly visible helping Alabama recruiting.

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I spent too long thinking it out and Kville beat me to the punch, so I'll go get me a beer.

Old sigline: I've been cutting back on the drinking.

New Sigline: lol it's football season.

As a sole proprietor business I would be shocked at how few have 10k extra a year to throw away on no ROI advertisements. Yes there will be some but the bigger "threats" will be teams with marketable businesses and enough of them (large metro areas) to make an impact based on sheer number. Now it would be different for upperclassmen with a national brand like Vick or Burrow u it that doesn't help you when they are in high school and a school is recruiting them.

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HF, we hear ya. We do. However, you are barking down the ROI argument. $EC don't care. Pay the players, get better players, win moar!. That's their ROI.

To you from failing hands we throw
The torch; be yours to hold it high.
@BuryHokie #ThanksFrank

I could definitely see someone like Alexander Shunnarah figuring out how to work SEC players into his advertising budget.

The dude's slogan is literally "Call me Alabama!"

A sole proprietor business isn't the issue. Booster's could easily fund advertising for any local business no matter that business's size of profitability. Boosters now stay one step removed, the sole proprietor would get paid some money and the player will make money.

It's dead simple now and every booster in the nation knows it

That was my exact concern. Boosters funnel money to businesses that use it for athlete advertising. But now it's legal (in an NCAA sense, unsure about how it would be accounted for in a legal sense). The teams that had the bagmen before still have the bagmen, now operating without worry of sanctions, and I seriously doubt that the now-legitimacy would attract new bagmen that were previously on the sidelines.

The rich stay richer.

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

It will be interesting to see as places like Bama really doesn't need help getting recruits. You want to play for a championship you go to one of 4-5 schools.

Other schools will keep throwing bad money after bad to get wins. How much money is FSU on the hook for to pay Taggart? Texas is another that will have more money to spend, but it's not going to change their team drastically, they cant justbuy a championship, if they could energy would have.

The rich have bagman already. So it'll will be interesting to see how this plays out. What I wonder about is with xfers, what if Justin Fields had a contract with a Georgia business and then left, that business gets screwed. So businesses will have to be smarter too.

Sure IBM or Tesla or whatever publicly held company can't just plow cash into whatever school as a veiled 'marketing campaign' but that's because they have a fiduciary duty to their stockholders. I don't.

of course they can. overall this money is a blip on the radar that almost all shareholders would never get details on. And those at the level that do will not care so long as the corp is growing and making money.

It's a lot easier than you think to be honest.

Example 1
Public Companies over a certain scale give C-Suite execs, specifically the CEO, CFO and COO a discretionary budget to allocate CSR money. Let's say that CEO is a booster who routes money to a school related CSR causes normally, can now start routing money to supporting players. For example, lets say that CEO of Chevron is a Texas booster and starts giving local auto dealerships marketing budget to hire football players for local commercials. With their level of budget they could offer every starter on the team an opportunity at a yearly wage via those commercials.

Example 2
Public Companies as part of CSR also often allocate money to be managed by a foundation run by the CEO or their wife etc. This foundation can do the same.

Example 3
CEO can simply mandate that local commercials run by affiliates start to hire players for marketing and simply increase internal budgets for those. 100% under their control and all within tax code for public company. Can easily just say it is in support of their CSR mandate.

Example 4
CEO booster can setup a sports endowment within the company, like scholarships, that do this very thing. Simple.

Example 5
CEO of public company can himself now simply pay for these advertisements using their own money.

Those are off the top of my head. In this case there are a million ways to skin this cat.

I'm just a lowly criminal defense attorney with a passing memory of corporations who recently discovered the joys of Schedule C. Apparently it's even easier then I would have thought.

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bingo

here's an excellent read on how perhaps one of the most high profile booster relationships has been done and should open eyes on just how easy it's going to be going forward:

https://psmag.com/education/the-secret-betrayal-that-sealed-nikes-specia...

When giving the school money for a building or athletic facility, Knight circumvented many of the processes public universities are expected to go through with such undertakings. Instead of handing over the money to the school, for instance, Knight often took charge himself. He opened limited-liability corporations controlled by himself and his wife, Penny Knight, using names like "Penny and I, LLC" or "PHIGHT, LLC." Through the relevant LLC, Knight would pay for the design of the building, lease the land it would go on from the university, and then proceed with construction on his own. Once completed, the facility would be handed back to the school as a finished product, having relieved it of responsibilities like a public bidding process with construction firms, negotiations with union laborers, and an open dialogue with the campus community and other Eugene stakeholders.

If you think that Knight was gifting his own money then I have a Ice Company in the arctic I want to talk to you about.

Why does everyone insist on capping money for the kids and not the coaching staffs. You can't call a sport amateur with 20 million dollar staffs

I saw this before and was too busy to comment then. But .... of course you can

You can't cap the coaching staff, they tried in the 80s and a bunch of millionaires sued. So under the law you cannot cap coaches pay.

So I've always been of the thought that certain schools are doing 90 in a 60mph zone while "most" schools are doing 70. I wonder if this will make it more transparent who those schools are since they can basically say "Hey we no longer have to hide the dealership that leases cars to players for pennies since they can put em on a billboard now and say they are paying for the car from the money earned from that." Really curious to see how this all works out. I totally understand paying the players for their likeness, especially since it requires their time to do so. I certainly wasn't asked to show up or post about events and what not when I was a student to attract others to it.

I think the article link in this one is more interesting personally:

https://www.roanoke.com/sports/college/school/sport/virginia-tech-athlet...

According to senior associate athletic director for external operations Brad Wurthman's presentation, it would require a $5 million investment to "achieve (the desired) results" in the 65,632-seat stadium.

"This is a revenue generator for us," Babcock said.

The athletic department estimates that each email address collected if fans had to sign-in for wireless access would be worth three dollars, and could potentially generate $400,000 in additional revenue each season.

Hold on . . . who gets $3 off my email?

"If you don't have time to do it right, when will you have time to do it over?"

I think you are in the wrong thread

Edit: maybe not, I just assumed there was a separate one for expanding wireless in Lane

Whatever. It was one bad year.

Seasonal Brew means High ABV for football season and standard the rest of the year.

there is an older one covering this topic. I just don't have time to look it up.

Interesting to note with all of this, Zion Williamson, just a year out of college, has made $20M in endorsement deals (according to forbes list of highest paid athletes). I would imagine Zion would have signed a handful of those deals last year just as easily. Obviously he's an extreme example, but the amount of cash some players will receive from this, especially in basketball, is significant.

Read an article from CBSSports.com today about the Power 5 breaking away. The writer broached the subject in the article. It says that if TLawrence were able to leverage his NIL, he'd be worth $400k in endorsements. It also says that Zion would have been worth $4M for his one year at Duke.

Sharing in case anyone wants to read it

Here's the meeting these quotes, both about NIL and WiFi improvements, came from for those interested. Someone posted the link on 247 (non-paywall).

So when it comes to talking NIL for football, I'll play devil's advocate here... I think this could be fine, if not better, for a school like VT in the long term.

First of all, recruiting classes can only get so good. At the end of the day, most 5-star players go to one of 10-15 schools anyways. It's not like Bama can buy ALL of the 5-stars. There's only a handful each year.

Secondly, I could see this potentially bringing more parity to the sport - think about it from the perspective of a 4-star - is it better to go to Virginia Tech and be THE MAN, or is it better to go to Alabama and be buried on the depth chart? Being a 4-star at VT might have less financial benefits during recruiting, but could easily offer more once you hit the field.

Finally, you have to remember that 99% of recruits are far from a 'sure thing.' Boosters aren't going to invest a ton of money in a high school athlete who could just not pan out for a variety of reasons. OR they will at first, and eventually learn their lesson.

Twitter me

The problem with this idea is that recruits with NFL aspirations (and especially 4 and 5 star recruits) want to practice against, play with, and compete against the other "best" players. That level of competition better prepares them in practice and in games. It also protects them from getting thrown into situations before they're ready (either by injury or development) because their is depth on the chart. Finally, it means they are less likely to be shut down once they do see the field because the opposing team won't be able to focus in on their position and ignore their team mates.

And recruits seem to care more about maximizing their NFL potential than being "The Man."

I think you will both be right in the long run. It will come down to each individual's thought process. I do know one thing though, competitors at the highest level want to play. While there may be logic to limiting the wear and tear, most athletes are not wired to think that way. And, most athletes will never play significant professional ball, so why would you risk not playing as much as possible at college.

"If you don't have time to do it right, when will you have time to do it over?"

Hot take: this might not help teams in big cities. At all.

A team like Georgia Tech might have a little success "fundraising" & going door to door around Atlanta. But college football remains an afterthought in most major cities.

Programs currently their area's geographical focal point will now open the floodgates to all of the sponsors who proactively work to get their name all over that glorious football program.

Would a company drop or minimize a Falcons sponsorship to pick up a GT connection?

On the contrary, a business in Atlanta that might not be able to afford a Falcons sponsorship/marketing opportunity might be able to afford a GT one. And there's a lot more in Atlanta than in Blacksburg.

Plus my guess is that a lot of places will likely see it as a both-and instead of an either-or 🤷‍♂️

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

Good point. I think lots of companies would feel obligated to have some sort of goodwill connection to the university in the city; which they probably already do.

I think the college athletes are probably all small potatoes in a city with a bunch of professional teams. But if there's a market for B-list celebrities, I'm sure a city is where you'll find it.

Your nOt connecting to the schools because you can't use the schools image likeness or name in your ads.

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But a coach can say "our local companies have agreed to X sponsorships with our athletes to the tune of Y thousand dollars"

Just because you can't use the school's logo doesn't mean you aren't building a relationship with the school

"Why gobble gobble chumps asks such good questions, I will never know." - TheFifthFuller

The first paragraph addresses team sponsorships (Current system).

Good point. I think lots of companies would feel obligated to have some sort of goodwill connection to the university in the city; which they probably already do.

The second paragraph addresses athlete sponsorships (new system).

I think the college athletes are probably all small potatoes in a city with a bunch of professional teams. But if there's a market for B-list celebrities, I'm sure a city is where you'll find it.

Like hell. A GT athlete wearing white and gold is easily connect to GT, even without any logos or the school's name. Same with VT. An athletic-looking kid, even if you don't recognize him, wearing orange and maroon colors is easily associated with VT.

If you're not sure if my comment warrants a "/s", it probably does.

Really curious to see how many players this even ends up applying to. Have to think businesses aren't going to care about endorsing your average O-line or D-line player. Unless this situation just results in boosters providing payroll to entire teams, which seems to be the most likely outcome.

As much as I love our team how many of them do you all think would be able to make significant money from endorsement deals? Maybe 10-15?

Also wonder if it'll have an impact on locker rooms with players being mad about other players making more than them or freshman coming in with huge paychecks since they were 4/5 stars etc.